Brand New Day - Amazing Spider-man #550 - SPOILERS!!!

[ShaggyB]

Ok its Wednesday, Nearing Noon. Thats when my store gets its books out on the table. Whos read this and can post detailed spoilers?

[DeadXMan]

jack pot dosn't know jack about new york
Meniace isn't messing around with Spidey
and The cops look like they are gonna kick some spider-ass
good book:D

[ShaggyB]

lol a bit more detailed would be cool. From what ive seen alot of peeps label Menace as a cheap hobgoblin.

Hows jackpot doing after trying to help dude take spideys mask off. Thats all ive seen so far. Store run at 5pm Eastern

[DeadXMan]

lol a bit more detailed would be cool. From what ive seen alot of peeps label Menace as a cheap hobgoblin.

Hows jackpot doing after trying to help dude take spideys mask off. Thats all ive seen so far. Store run at 5pm Eastern

no Goblin and electro ;)

you have a novice superherine and z lister that was last seen in Dazzler's Solo
against the Amazing Spider-ma, one guess what happens ( and it envols one liners)
and she brought Pete coffee after Menace cuts him open and drop him in the Hudson.

[Shade 20x6]

I'm officially fed up with Marvel's crap.

Jackpot is apparently not MJ, but someone named...Sarah Ehret...or something like that (can't remember, I just scanned the book and put it back like I do every week).

This makes NO SENSE whatsoever. It's like Marvel said "it's obvious it's MJ, and everyone knows it's MJ, so let's just throw them a curveball for the hell of it."

Look, I have no problem with misleading people, as long as the mislead makes sense in the end. This one doesn't. The "suspension of disbelief" factor is taking a beating from Marvel these days.

I hated Jackpot when I thought she was just MJ in a lame costume with a lame name, but at least it made sense...sorta. This makes Jackpot about 1000 times more lame now.

Brand New Day is such a load of nonsensical crap, and it just keeps getting worse. I'm soooo glad I'm not wasting my money on this crap.

*takes deep breath*

Anyway...

Menace, I think, has some ties to a former Goblin, as he compares himself to "the Goblin" (he doesn't specify which one), but basically says that he won't screw around like the other Goblin did, and if Spider-Man screws with him again, he'll "put him into the ground." Of course, if Menace REALLY weren't screwing around, he'd have killed Spidey when he had him at his mercy in this issue. This also tells me that Menace's primary goal is not to kill Spider-Man, so he obviously has another main agenda.

[JDanknich]

Actually, I think the name "Sara Ehret" is an in-joke by Marc Guggenheim. I ran a Google search on the name and it showed that there was a character named "Sara Ehret" on the old WB show "Jack & Bobby." Marc Guggenheim was a writer for that show, so I'm guessing that's where he got the name from. So Jackpot could still be MJ.

[DeadXMan]

so you missed the part were they retcon Flash thompson being spider-man?

:rolleyes:

and note the "...." before she saids Sara Erhret

she's making it up. ( i Think that was Marrow's alias she used EDIT see Jack and Bobby easter egg)


how about you read the book to get the facts on what you hate right.
( Please DL it cause people who read the new books in the shop and put them back are worse to LCS owner then the Pirates)

[timbox]

Guggenheim writes great Spider-Man dialog. Good issue.

[Monty_Cristo]

Menace, I think, has some ties to a former Goblin, as he compares himself to "the Goblin" (he doesn't specify which one), but basically says that he won't screw around like the other Goblin did, and if Spider-Man screws with him again, he'll "put him into the ground." Of course, if Menace REALLY weren't screwing around, he'd have killed Spidey when he had him at his mercy in this issue. This also tells me that Menace's primary goal is not to kill Spider-Man, so he obviously has another main agenda.

that means it's not Harry. he hates Spider-man and would have, likely, killed him.

[stillanerd]

Actually, I think the name "Sara Ehret" is an in-joke by Marc Guggenheim. I ran a Google search on the name and it showed that there was a character named "Sara Ehret" on the old WB show "Jack & Bobby." Marc Guggenheim was a writer for that show, so I'm guessing that's where he got the name from. So Jackpot could still be MJ.

Also, there was a reporter character named "Sarah Ehret" (rather than "Sara") on the ABC show, "The Practice," which was another TV series Guggenheim worked on as a writer. So you could very well be correct in saying that it is an in-joke by Guggenheim and another moment where Jackpot is teasing Spider-Man. However, like most inside jokes, if you don't get the reference, then it really flies over people's head, especially since it making reference to an obscure supporting character reference from TV shows Guggenheim worked on. And if it IS Jackpot's real name, then Shade 20x6 is absolutely right--it does comes out of nowhere and does make Jackpot even less interesting than she already was. After all, the only reason why anyone was paying any attention to her at all was because there's the belief she's Mary Jane, which of course opens up all kinds of questions. But if she's not Mary Jane, why should readers even care?

EDIT: of course, Jackpot looks clearly annoyed when Spidey "reveals" his name to be "Flash Thompson" and her giving him the name "Sara Ehret" can suggest:

1. That if she is Mary Jane and also knows Spider-Man is Peter--meaning of course, knows Flash Thompson is not Spider-Man--then it proves to her the double standard Spidey is applying with regards to revealing their identities.
2. Her answer of "Not so much, no," implies sarcastically that, while she may in fact be Mary Jane, she doesn't actually have time herself because she's so busy being "Jackpot." It's like when the Joker in the first Batman movie asks if Bruce Wayne is who he says he is and he responds with "Most of the time." Same difference.

[Shade 20x6]

that means it's not Harry. he hates Spider-man and would have, likely, killed him.

Maybe Menace is also Sara Ehret. :p

[JDanknich]

Good catch on the "other" Sarah Ehret, stillanerd.

I dunno... I'm still thinking Jackpot has to be MJ. If she's not, then, well it's hard to make people any more angry then they are, so maybe the powers that be will do just that. :)

But I do agree with both points you made. If MJ is Jackpot, then I think MJ is spending most of her time as Jackpot, possibly to be closer to Peter, possibly to experience what a hero's life is like. Or neither. I guess we'll find out next ish. (I hope.)

[TheAmazingSpidey]

Well, not too bad an issue.

For some reason, when I was reading the conversation between Peter and Lily, I thought, "Holy shit. I think Menace is...Lily!"*


And no way is that Jackpot's real name.

And...yeah, not too bad an issue. Not the best thus far, but not bad.





*Hey, it's possible!

[Shade 20x6]

Good catch on the "other" Sarah Ehret, stillanerd.

I dunno... I'm still thinking Jackpot has to be MJ. If she's not, then, well it's hard to make people any more angry then they are, so maybe the powers that be will do just that. :)

But I do agree with both points you made. If MJ is Jackpot, then I think MJ is spending most of her time as Jackpot, possibly to be closer to Peter, possibly to experience what a hero's life is like. Or neither. I guess we'll find out next ish. (I hope.)

And if MJ is Jackpot, Peter pretty much gave away his secret identity by interrogating her (assuming she didn't already know).

[Chiasm]

The best BND issue thus far by a wide margin. Although when everything before it was in the crapper pile its not like it was hard to do.

Beyond all the other insanity going on, does anyone really think Peter would have any doubts whether Jackpot is MJ or not? Its not like the mask covers much of her face. Even in this revamped continuity she was still his fiance for hecks sake. He would know if it was her or not by what he can see and wouldn't need to ask. I know this is the comic book world where we are supposed to accept that no one knows Clark Kent is Superman because he wears glasses but c'mon that was a lame 1930's plot device that modern day creators are still saddled with. This is the 21st century, lets act like it and lets demand it in our comics.

Personally I think Jackpot is MJ. And I think she remembers everything.

[Xplicit Content]

I'm sticking to my guns. MJ and Carlie.

[Teitr Styrr]

All Jackpot did is throw Peter's answer back at him. He said he was Flash Thompson, and Jackpot probably knows he's not, so she lied to. She gave the requisit "..." before responding.

However, if he thought she was Mary Jane, why on earth wouls he say Flash Thompson? Doesn't Mary Jane know Flash Thompson?

[sherlockbones]

I hope Sarah Ehret is somehow related to our local football club´s midfielder Fabrice Ehret :)

http://weltfussball.freenet.de/freenet/spieler.php?Liga=2&id=11405

no news on the gray goblin? spidey still webless?

[Expendable]

I'm officially fed up with Marvel's crap.

Jackpot is apparently not MJ, but someone named...Sarah Ehret...or something like that (can't remember, I just scanned the book and put it back like I do every week).

This makes NO SENSE whatsoever. It's like Marvel said "it's obvious it's MJ, and everyone knows it's MJ, so let's just throw them a curveball for the hell of it."

Look, I have no problem with misleading people, as long as the mislead makes sense in the end. This one doesn't. The "suspension of disbelief" factor is taking a beating from Marvel these days.

I hated Jackpot when I thought she was just MJ in a lame costume with a lame name, but at least it made sense...sorta. This makes Jackpot about 1000 times more lame now.

Brand New Day is such a load of nonsensical crap, and it just keeps getting worse. I'm soooo glad I'm not wasting my money on this crap.

*takes deep breath*

Anyway...

Menace, I think, has some ties to a former Goblin, as he compares himself to "the Goblin" (he doesn't specify which one), but basically says that he won't screw around like the other Goblin did, and if Spider-Man screws with him again, he'll "put him into the ground." Of course, if Menace REALLY weren't screwing around, he'd have killed Spidey when he had him at his mercy in this issue. This also tells me that Menace's primary goal is not to kill Spider-Man, so he obviously has another main agenda.

That must of been one hell of a scan on a comic. You remembered the false alias Jackpot gave hell i read the book twice and I couldnt remember how to spell the last name. So kudos for your "scanning". And not only that you knew everything that Menace said.

Sorry if it seems like Im calling you out on your little Spiderman ban but that is what I am doing. You either A. BOught the book as you have with everyother BND book. Or B. You didnt just scan the book you actually read the book.

Cause if I am too believe what you said that means you picked the book up flipped through the pages and set it back down. Dont worry your secret is safe with me you are not the only person eating the cake ;)

Ok that is out of the way. I have enjoyed BND since it started and imo this was the weaker of the books. So SPidey falls in the Hudson and The Blue Shield just gave up cause he had paperwork too fill out? But Jackpot who was so willing to help The Blue Shield when he appeared all of a sudden didnt tell The Blue Shield where Spidey is? Then the whole name game, Flash Thompson, Sarah Ehret(props too Shade for the help on the spelling of the last name) was funny but seemed too forced. I dunno still a good book just imo the weakest one yet.

[RabidWolfe]

Sarah Ehret is also an anagram for:

Share Heart
Hear Hearts
Share Earth
Hears Heart
Heater Rash
Reheat Rash
A Hearts Her
Heart As Her
Earth As Her
A Rash Three

Though I doubt that means anything

[Shade 20x6]

That must of been one hell of a scan on a comic. You remembered the false alias Jackpot gave hell i read the book twice and I couldnt remember how to spell the last name. So kudos for your "scanning". And not only that you knew everything that Menace said.

Sorry if it seems like Im calling you out on your little Spiderman ban but that is what I am doing. You either A. BOught the book as you have with everyother BND book. Or B. You didnt just scan the book you actually read the book.

Cause if I am too believe what you said that means you picked the book up flipped through the pages and set it back down. Dont worry your secret is safe with me you are not the only person eating the cake ;)

Ok that is out of the way. I have enjoyed BND since it started and imo this was the weaker of the books. So SPidey falls in the Hudson and The Blue Shield just gave up cause he had paperwork too fill out? But Jackpot who was so willing to help The Blue Shield when he appeared all of a sudden didnt tell The Blue Shield where Spidey is? Then the whole name game, Flash Thompson, Sarah Ehret(props too Shade for the help on the spelling of the last name) was funny but seemed too forced. I dunno still a good book just imo the weakest one yet.

I'm a very fast reader; always have been. I looked at it for about a minute, tops. I'm good at being able to pick out key parts.

Trust me, I haven't bought a single issue of BND and I won't.

[Matt Linton]

Lots of things I liked, a couple that I didn't. At this point the theory that two people are Jackpot kind of fits, but it'd be a hell of a coincidence if it were Carlie and MJ. Plus, Jackpot seems to be sort of new to New York, which would probably eliminate either one of them. I liked Peter using his brain to try and figure out what Menace is up to, and trying to work with the cops. Bennet is a nice twist on JJ, and JJ's subplot gets advanced.

I didn't like Larocca's art as much this issue. Casting celebs as pre-existing characters drives me nuts, and Jake Gyllenhall as Peter is no exception. I can buy Peter not having more web-fluid at the moment, but his apparently not having a spare costume doesn't really make sense.

Overall I'd probably give this issue a B or a B-, but I'm still liking the arc itself.

[Alan2099]

I dunno... I'm still thinking Jackpot has to be MJ. If she's not, then, well it's hard to make people any more angry then they are, so maybe the powers that be will do just that.
Oh come on, this is the internet. People would be making posts about how angry they were if somebody showed up to their doors and gave them a million tax free dollars.

:p


I'm a very fast reader; always have been. I looked at it for about a minute, tops. I'm good at being able to pick out key parts.

Trust me, I haven't bought a single issue of BND and I won't.
Sorry, I've seen enough people go, "I'm not doing _______ EVER again!" and then somhow manage to keep 100% up to date and accurate on it.

Right now, I trust you about as far as I can throw a moose, and I don't even have a moose. ;)

But, hey, if claiming you aren't doing something that you are pretty obviously doing makes you feel better, more power to ya'.

[wolp]

Hating OMD + Buying BND = Shame on you for being a sell-out

Money saved by not buying BND: $19.94

R.I.P. Spider-Man (1962-2007)

Current Pull List: Amazing Spider-Girl, Freddy vs. Jason vs. Ash, Marvel Zombies 2, Ultimate Spider-Man

LOL Dude you're so funny.

Money saved by not going to China everyday: $1500

[Shade 20x6]

LOL Dude you're so funny.

Money saved by not going to China everyday: $1500

Except, I was one of those buying all 3 Spider-Man titles before BND, so I would have actually been purchasing the books. Unlike you going to China. :p

[Alan2099]

And peop,e might belive that you've given the stuff up if you didn't know every little bit about it.

If you've giving it up, give it up. Don't read it and then show up to complain about something you're not buying anyway. You're no longer the customer, why should writers try to please you?

[ANewHope]

Seriously, actually read the comic book, I agree with DeadxMan here...

Don't just flip through it and comment on some random panel.

If you didnt read it, hell you shouldn't be commenting at all. Thats just my opinion though.

[Dr. Chaos]

Yet another good issue, BND continues to kick copious amounts of ass.

Two tiny complaints though:

-Marc, I wish I could say this in a nicer way but keep your ****ty D-list character cameos out of Amazing, this isn't She-Hulk and you're not Dan Slott, next time just use one of the Mighty Avengers.

-After Salvador's solid Spidey cover last week, I'm surprised he turned in such a stinker, the covers for the issues between this one are great, don't know why he went for something so hokey looking here.

[Will.S]

how about you read the book to get the facts on what you hate right.
( Please DL it cause people who read the new books in the shop and put them back are worse to LCS owner then the Pirates)
Eh, I wouldn't go that far.

I went to a new comic shop today that just opened and is closer to my home now and the owner actually encouraged in store reading but he's also a cool guy. I flipped thorough the issue and it has nice art but I didn't have enough time to read it (not sure if I even care to at this point) but from what I've seen Menace looked pretty cool from a design sense.

[Dr. Chaos]

And on a sidenote, I'm going to go ahead and declare my love for Jackpot, costume and all.

Sorry, guys.

[DeadXMan]

Eh, I wouldn't go that far.

I went to a new comic shop today that just opened and is closer to my home now and the owner actually encouraged in store reading but he's also a cool guy. I flipped thorough the issue and it has nice art but I didn't have enough time to read it (not sure if I even care to at this point) but from what I've seen Menace looked pretty cool from a design sense.

yes he is.

My LCs has display copies aswell

but I'm referring to the guys that go to the new piles and damage up the products. I had some problems with those guys when I worked at a shop
(not even gonna tell ya what we had to clean up in the Manga section.):eek:

[Nick MB]

No you suck. :mad:

How dare you say that to the only Spider-title that is left and is worthy of being read. :evilangry

Ultimate Spider-Man?

[Mitsaso]

LOL WTF?
I wouldn't have noticed normally, but I happened to read this issue right after watching an episode of "Brothers and Sisters"... Salvador Larocca is totally using Sally Field to draw JJJ's wife!

http://www.yourlifemagazine.com/image/Sally%20Field2.gifhttp://img257.imageshack.us/img257/4729/sallyfieldyk6.jpg

What's funny is that Marc Guggenheim is one of the writers/producers of "Brothers and Sisters", where Sally Field is starring in.:eek:

[Brian M.]

Somebody else brought it up, but the name Jackpot gave Spidey is also a character from his Jack and Bobby WB/CW series a while back.

[timbox]

-Marc, I wish I could say this in a nicer way but keep your ****ty D-list character cameos out of Amazing, this isn't She-Hulk and you're not Dan Slott, next time just use one of the Mighty Avengers.

This wouldn't make much sense really, seeing as how the MA has been letting the NA walk free lately.

[jefseg77]

Truth be told, you dont have to buy it or scan through the issues at you LCS to know whats going on, just come here and read through the thread. So all of you who post "spoilers" or recapping the whole issue, is that really different from flipping through it at you LCS? Yeah, you might miss a point here and there, but someone eventually will bring it up.

I keep trying to tell myself to give it a try, but everything seems so forced from what I have read here through the weeks.

[JDanknich]

All Jackpot did is throw Peter's answer back at him. He said he was Flash Thompson, and Jackpot probably knows he's not, so she lied to. She gave the requisite "..." before responding.

However, if he thought she was Mary Jane, why on earth would he say Flash Thompson? Doesn't Mary Jane know Flash Thompson?

I'll play devil's advocate and say that maybe Peter said that to see if he'd get some kind of reaction from Jackpot.

[Shade 20x6]

And peop,e might belive that you've given the stuff up if you didn't know every little bit about it.

If you've giving it up, give it up. Don't read it and then show up to complain about something you're not buying anyway. You're no longer the customer, why should writers try to please you?

Considering I WAS buying it before Quesada screwed it all up, and had been buying it for several years, I absolutely have the right to complain about it.

And I'll read it if I feel like it, as long as I'm not putting money in Marvel's pockets to do so. This way, I can state an informed opinion on the subject while still holding my position against it.

I really am trying to give BND a try, but it just isn't very good. That's why I get confused over all the fanboys who drool over it on here. It's like they've never read a Spider-Man comic before. There are many, many, MANY better Spidey books that have been produced out there without crapping all over continuity.

[Shade 20x6]

Seriously, actually read the comic book, I agree with DeadxMan here...

Don't just flip through it and comment on some random panel.

If you didnt read it, hell you shouldn't be commenting at all. Thats just my opinion though.

I read enough of it to understand the story. It's a freakin' comic book, not a novel. It shouldn't take more than a few minutes to read in-depth anyway.

[Shade 20x6]

yes he is.

My LCs has display copies aswell

but I'm referring to the guys that go to the new piles and damage up the products. I had some problems with those guys when I worked at a shop
(not even gonna tell ya what we had to clean up in the Manga section.):eek:

I'm not one of those people. I take great care in every issue I handle, even if I have no intention of purchasing it. So stop making sweeping generalizations.

[Mister Mets]

Truth be told, you dont have to buy it or scan through the issues at you LCS to know whats going on, just come here and read through the thread. So all of you who post "spoilers" or recapping the whole issue, is that really different from flipping through it at you LCS? Yeah, you might miss a point here and there, but someone eventually will bring it up.

I keep trying to tell myself to give it a try, but everything seems so forced from what I have read here through the weeks.

You probably don't get a sense of the execution (storytelling, art) by reading the reviews, or descriptions of the plot.

[vitruvian]

So, if that was the Blue Shield from Dazzler #5, where's his blue force field these days? Might have made it a little more difficult for Spidey to knock him away.

[DeadXMan]

I'm not one of those people. I take great care in every issue I handle, even if I have no intention of purchasing it. So stop making sweeping generalizations.

no, it not generalizations when you have first hand experience.

[Mister Mets]

no, it not generalizations when you have first hand experience.You have firsthand experience that some people mishandle the comic books they read in stores. That does not indicate that shade2-x6 is one of those people.

[StoneGold]

Jeebus, there are like 15 threads devoted to why you're never going to read Spider-Man again, and how JoeQ raped your mother. Can we leave the thread devoted to talking about the issue devoted to talking about the issue?



In any case, me likey. I wasn't sure about Menace at first, but this issue, the character really came across.

[tv horror]

I've read this issue and have found it to be a bit baffling, why has Spidey no spider-sense? Also Menace is always shown bent over could he be a she?

[MongoSlade]

1) I liked the issue, as I have all of the BND issues.

2) Jackpot...
a) is Mary Jane
b) knows Spider-Man is Peter Parker

This is what she asked for in that last panel of OMD where we couldn't read the way-too-fine print. Plus, asked to be a registered hero. And finally...

c) knows her and Peter were once married.


3) I have no idea who Menace is. If it turns out to be Lily, I'm speechless.

4) The cover was fantastic.

5) The writers have made an excellent point of emphasizing the SHRA.

[stillanerd]

1) I liked the issue, as I have all of the BND issues.

2) Jackpot...
a) is Mary Jane
b) knows Spider-Man is Peter Parker

This is what she asked for in that last panel of OMD where we couldn't read the way-too-fine print. Plus, asked to be a registered hero. And finally...

c) knows her and Peter were once married.

Well, somebody recently edited the wikipedia article for Jackpot and is making the claim that she could be Carlie Cooper--and even lists her as Jackpot's alter ego--based solely on this:


But in recent issues of Amazing it is probably likely that she is Carlie Cooper a friend of Harry Osborn's girlfriend Lily Holister. Cooper is a NYPD Forensics expert. Who is seen making a discrete exit to possibly change into her costume while Peter shares the same idea....

Parker himself suspects Jackpot may be Mary Jane, though she strictly denies it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackpot_%28comics%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackpot_%28comics%29)

Of course, considering how anybody can edit any article, even if it's based upon mere conjecture and theory, it certainly calls into question the validity of this article. If Jackpot is Carlie, then while it's good that MJ is not a superhero, the character loses any degree of interest she might have generated is completely gone, since the only reason folks even paid any attention to her was because she was too much like MJ. And if it does turn out to be MJ, as everyone suspects she is, then whoever edited that wiki entry is going to look like a fool.

BTW, I agree that MJ is Jackpot and with your other points about her unless its proven otherwise.


3) I have no idea who Menace is. If it turns out to be Lily, I'm speechless.

Well, even though Lily gave Harry an alibi by telling Peter the old "I was with him all night" defense, it doesn't necessarily hold up, especially if Peter asks Harry where he was and gives a completely different story. But even if both Harry and Lily confirm each others whereabouts, then it still doesn't discount them because whose to say the two of them aren't working in cahoots? So both Harry and Lily certainly aren't discounted as suspects by any means.

[Tobias Drake]

I still want to know why Spidey is completely 100% convinced that Jackpot is MJ from the very first time he meets her, despite having nothing to convince him of such other than her being a woman with red hair and green eyes. One can make an argument for her emphatically crappy mask, but I've seen crappier masks successfully hide identities in comics. I can just think of no plausible reason why he knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that this superhero he's never seen nor ever heard from before is MJ.

[bjtrdff]

I was just confused by the issue.

How come there wasn't a reference to webshooters or how Peter is poor? Is he still poor? Does he still have webshooters? How will I know?

[stillanerd]

I still want to know why Spidey is completely 100% convinced that Jackpot is MJ from the very first time he meets her, despite having nothing to convince him of such other than her being a woman with red hair and green eyes. One can make an argument for her emphatically crappy mask, but I've seen crappier masks successfully hide identities in comics. I can just think of no plausible reason why he knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that this superhero he's never seen nor ever heard from before is MJ.

Well, she also calls him "Tiger" numerous times, her moniker is taken from the time they first met ("Face it Tiger, you just hit the jackpot!") Heck, she even mentions his "hitting the jackpot" when he accidentally hit her last issue. Plus, if Jackpot is MJ, then Spidey would naturally want to know how she got powers, why she's in New York when last he heard she was living in L.A., and was this the real reason why she broke up with him. Course the fact that Spidey has broken up with MJ in BND after a long-term relationship and clearly hasn't gotten over her and now meets someone who bears more than a passing resemblance probably has a lot to do with it.

[Cody H]

I still want to know why Spidey is completely 100% convinced that Jackpot is MJ from the very first time he meets her, despite having nothing to convince him of such other than her being a woman with red hair and green eyes.For the same reason we were all convinced Jackpot had to be MJ the moment we saw her. Obviously the resemblence is one reason, but her name is Jackpot so that counts for something.

Errrr, umm, what stillanerd said...

[Tobias Drake]

True. Still, might help for Peter to start by verifying if she's still in LA or not. If she is, it's one hell of a commute. :p I'm actually starting to wonder if Jackpot really isn't MJ. With all Pete's "You're MJ, arent'cha? Aren'tcha? Yeah, you're MJ, huh. You are so totally MJ.", it's just starting to make me think that probably the best Reveal they could do with this is that no, she's not.

[Dr. Chaos]

This wouldn't make much sense really, seeing as how the MA has been letting the NA walk free lately.
It would make alot of sense really.

Read NA#38.

Not all of them feel the same way as Carol by a longshot.

Either Ares or Widow would have tore Peter a new one here if they saw him, Natasha has no respect for Spider-Man, doesn't believe hes a real Avenger and just ask Ares' brother how seriously he takes his job.

The NA and MA are still on extremely shaky ground and it takes unique circumstances to get them to work together at this point.

Letting the NA go once or twice (twice due to Danvers' quick thinking) does not speak for the two teams entire relationship, that would be oversimplifying it, they are still very much at odds with each other.

[PastePotPete]

Hey, I like the idea of Brand New Day - classic spidey unemcumbered by a lot of his bullshit continuity

but this last issue failed me in a couple ways!

1) I can't get into Larroca's art. I really hate it when artists are so photorealistic you can pick out their celebrity character models. Oh look, Sally Field. Oh, look Jason Robards. You can't create your own faces, Larroca? Learn to draw, buddy!

2) The whole Jackpot identity thing is really irritating. That mask should not confuse Peter that much. Either she's MJ or she's not, Pete. The only two explanations are: a) we're actually supposed to buy that the mask hides this Jackpot's identity ala Superman OR b) Mephisto's magic makes Peter's memory of MJ cloudy. Either way, screw you, Marvel!

3) Menace - we need another Goblin-style foe? Goblins have been done and then done again. I though this was a Brand New Day? Menace better get really specific and unique in the finale of this arc.

I like the new status quo in theory, but so far not in execution!!

[Nate Palm]

Also Menace is always shown bent over could he be a she?

My very first thought upon seeing Menace was that he was a she. Also the panel where Pete thanks Lily and then immediately ponders on who Menace really is leads me to believe Menace is Lily.

Another good issue of BND. Er...I mean...Grrrrr I hates Marvel and Joey Q!!!1 Alls my Spidey-Man issues is now worthyless. Marvels comics owes me all the moneys I spend on them back! I opened up my long boxes and they had all turned teh dust and the polybags became bats and the UV lites burns my eyes!!!1 :rolleyes:

[Alan2099]

2) The whole Jackpot identity thing is really irritating. That mask should not confuse Peter that much.
Keep in mind for the longest time Black Cat's "Mask" hid her identity, and there are far less white haired 20 somethings out there than there are redheads.

[Monty_Cristo]

Keep in mind for the longest time Black Cat's "Mask" hid her identity, and there are far less white haired 20 somethings out there than there are redheads.

to his credit, Felicia was blonde in the animated series. :D


I've read this issue and have found it to be a bit baffling, why has Spidey no spider-sense? Also Menace is always shown bent over could he be a she?

maybe it's Mr. Burns. excellent.

[becominAfanAgain]

This issue was as bad as the first two to me. Other than the Flash Thompson bit the issue was very bland to me. Seem like Spidey is getting weaker. The contrast between Spiderman and Peter is gone. Not only is he a loser as Peter Park but also as Spiderman.

I am loss in a sea of misery with no positive out come.

One good thing is I do like the new Goblin.

[Matt Linton]

This issue was as bad as the first two to me. Other than the Flash Thompson bit the issue was very bland to me. Seem like Spidey is getting weaker. The contrast between Spiderman and Peter is gone. Not only is he a loser as Peter Park but also as Spiderman.

I am loss in a sea of misery with no positive out come.

One good thing is I do like the new Goblin.

Peter's always gone back and forth between having bad luck as Peter and as Spidey. And as Peter, things aren't going to badly for him at the moment. He's got a decent freelance gig where his boss likes him (even if he can't remember his name), he's about to get an apartment, he's hanging out with his friends, etc.

[DanU]

The story was entertaining. I agree with a few posts about the art. Larroca's pencils are not as clean as McNivens's but he still does a very good job. So far I like both new villians. Mr. Negative was ruthless with the brutal murders and Menace is pretty bad ass himself. I hope they build with the mystery about his identity like they did with the Green Goblin and Hobgoblin. Curious to see where the plot will go with the murders and the "old type" of Spidey tracers found.

[tv horror]

Here's a point to ponder, MJ and Harry both shared a dwelling with Peter at some point in the past and as the tracers are of an old design anyone of them could have collected a few for their own use. I still think that they should have made aunt May into Madam Web especially after the blood transfusions that she has had from peter though-out the years, this way she can still die and become a higher being in the Marvel universe.

[Mister Mets]

In case anyone's wondering why this thread suddenly became smaller, I had to delete about ten posts that had noting to do with Brand New Day or this issue.

Try to keep things on-topic guys.

[Venom]

Much better part than last issue. I think Jackpot was so hard on Spidey last issue because she probably knew she was eventually going to have to take him in. Things moved at a reasonably good pace. I think next issue is when things will start to get real action packed.

[unkiedev]

Hey, I like the idea of Brand New Day - classic spidey unemcumbered by a lot of his bullshit continuity

but this last issue failed me in a couple ways!

1) I can't get into Larroca's art. I really hate it when artists are so photorealistic you can pick out their celebrity character models. Oh look, Sally Field. Oh, look Jason Robards. You can't create your own faces, Larroca? Learn to draw, buddy!

2) The whole Jackpot identity thing is really irritating. That mask should not confuse Peter that much. Either she's MJ or she's not, Pete. The only two explanations are: a) we're actually supposed to buy that the mask hides this Jackpot's identity ala Superman OR b) Mephisto's magic makes Peter's memory of MJ cloudy. Either way, screw you, Marvel!Yeah, I've been championing BND for a while, but this was just a bad comic book. Boring art is the BIGGEST problem. Everything either looks traced or bad...although the Gray Goblin was pretty damn cool. I like the name "Gray Goblin" better than "Menace," so I'm sticking with it.

My three gripes are:

A) The Flash Thompson thing: It would be alright if Spidey's motivation was to poke Jackpot into letting her guard down. Sort of like: "Oh, you're not MJ (which I know you are)? Then I'M Flash Thompson (Which YOU KNOW that I know that YOU know I"m not.)" Still, Either Peter wants to tell MJ he's Spidey or not...who knows what Peter wants...Only Joey Q.

B) Even if Jackpot had augmented strength, I don't think she could pin Spidy down. He's 10X strong as a person and has EXPERIENCE. She's a green hero, he could use her or his weight to flip or drop out of the hold.

C) This is such a comic book thing, but if you have Spidey in your clutches like The Gray goblin did, JUST KILL HIM! Don't threaten to kill him and cut him and fly off! Gobby already killed/tried to kill a bunch of people, so it better be someone who actively doesn't want to kill spider-man.

I like BND, but didn't like this one. C-, maybe even a D.

[CyberCoyote]

I waited a couple weeks, read 549 and 550 back to back and honestly didn't REALIZE it was Larrocca! I miss the old style! That's to say although good I'm used to something very different.

MJackpot: I still think it's her. She doesn't KNOW she's MJ.. MJ's fallen off the face of the earth, part of her deal was probably to be close to Peter but never remember anything about them. Otherwise all the Tiger references are just too much considering the resemblance.

Menace: Keeewl. Is that his real face?

Spidey's lack of web fluid.. err.. they must've raised the price on materials. He used to run out in the day, but it wasn't ever as scarce as black pearls.

And it's about time someone said that pics from an automatic camera weren't newspaper worthy :p It was a good grade B, although I expected more from a #550 issue. On the flip side Spider-Man Family was a hoot and three quarters.

[rZi]

Only just got my copy this afternoon...

Guggenheim delivered for me again. Larroca's art is so plain it's not bad, but it's far from good. He just can't draw the action shots nessecary for spider-man, the pages have no life in them or dynamic.

Either way Menace is too much of a goblin for my liking, but maybe there is more to the character like Slott says about Mr.Negative.

[Rahul]

Pros: A dangerous smartass Spidey villain. Nice to see one. but please,please change his name sometime later. Menace is not good as a name at all.Negative is actually a better name than that. The dialogue is again 10X better than Slott's.

Cons: The writing feels a bit short. DB's forgetting of our pal's name can get real old fast. I'm not feeling excited by the mystery revolving Jackpot and Menace, I want it to get over quick.The art is now just tolerable(but still better than Chaykin's, God, I hope he's not doing an arc!).

So above average issue for me.

[midnightman2001]

The best BND issue thus far by a wide margin. Although when everything before it was in the crapper pile its not like it was hard to do.

Beyond all the other insanity going on, does anyone really think Peter would have any doubts whether Jackpot is MJ or not? Its not like the mask covers much of her face. Even in this revamped continuity she was still his fiance for hecks sake. He would know if it was her or not by what he can see and wouldn't need to ask. I know this is the comic book world where we are supposed to accept that no one knows Clark Kent is Superman because he wears glasses but c'mon that was a lame 1930's plot device that modern day creators are still saddled with. This is the 21st century, lets act like it and lets demand it in our comics.

Personally I think Jackpot is MJ. And I think she remembers everything.


It was explained in the 1980s ( by John Byrne I think) that the glasses/Clark Kent thing works because people assume that Superman is Superman 24/7. He does not have a secret ID. Hence no one would suspect Clark Kent of being Superman.


And by the way, I am lovin this new Spidey direction. Its in my top 5 Marvel books now. And I read over 26 Marvels a month!

[CyberHubbs]

In all, I've liked BND. The art is clean, nothing too shabby. And honestly, pre-BND/OMD art was fairly atrocious. So this is a vast improvement.

[vitruvian]

I'll play devil's advocate and say that maybe Peter said that to see if he'd get some kind of reaction from Jackpot.

Considering that they had a conversation *at all*, shouldn't he know for sure whether she's MJ or not?

Unless, you know, Marvel wants us to think that he wouldn't have recognized his ex-girlfriend's voice if she were to, I don't know, call him up on the phone?

Or maybe it was part of MJ's side deal with Mephisto, but then one would expect Spidey to not be making the connection at all.

[CyberHubbs]

Considering that they had a conversation *at all*, shouldn't he know for sure whether she's MJ or not?

Unless, you know, Marvel wants us to think that he wouldn't have recognized his ex-girlfriend's voice if she were to, I don't know, call him up on the phone?

Or maybe it was part of MJ's side deal with Mephisto, but then one would expect Spidey to not be making the connection at all.

Maybe she has a voice-box modulator?

Could be that it isn't MJ, after all. Man, if Menace turns out to be MJ...

[JohnnyC]

I have to agree with most people here; Dexter better learn Peter's name quickly, Menace is awesome, and Guggenheim's a good writer for Spidey.

[Croaker]

Considering that they had a conversation *at all*, shouldn't he know for sure whether she's MJ or not?

Unless, you know, Marvel wants us to think that he wouldn't have recognized his ex-girlfriend's voice if she were to, I don't know, call him up on the phone?

Or maybe it was part of MJ's side deal with Mephisto, but then one would expect Spidey to not be making the connection at all.

Lois Lane and Clark Kent worked together and she apparently could not place his voice nor picture his face without glasses and make the connection. In fact, all throughout comic book history characters who were unaware of one anothers' secret identities have teamed up in costume and out and still not placed each others' voices. It's one of those suspension of disbelief issues you sort of accept when you sign up to read super hero comic books.

[richjb77]

Personally I think Jackpot is MJ. And I think she remembers everything.

I think that Jackpot is really a stupid idea; however if it is MJ and she remembers everything that would be a great move for Marvel. Having a character in the stories that is the living embodiment of why we are all pissed is a great move. Reader who have drifted will return hoping this "MJ" figures out a way to fix this mess ( though I doubt it will happen).

[Shade 20x6]

Maybe she has a voice-box modulator?

Could be that it isn't MJ, after all. Man, if Menace turns out to be MJ...

There's absolutely no logical reason for Jackpot to be anyone other than MJ, which is why I'll go off the deep end if they try to claim otherwise (even though I'm not buying BND).

As for Menace...if Quesada has his way, Menace will end up being Gwen.

[Croaker]

As for Menace...if Quesada has his way, Menace will end up being Gwen.

Did he mention this in an interview or something? I am totally not getting any hints that Menace is Gwen.

[Matt Linton]

There's absolutely no logical reason for Jackpot to be anyone other than MJ, which is why I'll go off the deep end if they try to claim otherwise (even though I'm not buying BND).

And Marvel won't care because, as you say, you're not buying BND. It's like someone complaining about politics and never voting.


As for Menace...if Quesada has his way, Menace will end up being Gwen.

Quesada, the writers, and editors have all said that Gwen coming back was on the table, and that they decided against it. There would have been no reason for them to be so public about it if they were just going to turn around and bring her back.

[rZi]

Did he mention this in an interview or something? I am totally not getting any hints that Menace is Gwen.

I think it was ment as sarcasm

[MrPalen]

I want to chime in on the conversation about masks and identities.

Historically it's been a comic book convention that it's easy to hide one's identity by having a little mask a-la Green Lantern or even just wearing glasses like Superman. This was fine for a long time, and everyone kinda went along with it. So why aren't people going along with it now in Jackpot's case? What's changed?

What's changed is the realism of comic book art.

Look at the art in Action Comics #1. It's cartoony. Putting glasses on Superman and getting a shirt and tie on him makes him unrecognizable, because in that art style, all that distinguishes people from each other are superficial attributes like hair colour, costumes, and accessories. If Spider-Man were being drawn in a simple cartoony style, Jackpot's little mask would be more than enough to conceal her identity.

But as comics have gone more and more towards photorealism that kind of gimmick has become untenable. You can't both draw people in a very detailed and realistic way and pretend that a piece of fabric around the eyes will make someone's girlfriend unrecognizable. It's something the reader has a very difficult time accepting on a gut level, even if on an intellectual level they are willing to try and get past it because "it's comics".

Unfortunately, Superman is forever stuck with the glasses-as-disguise premise. Readers know it's ridiculous but are willing to let it go because it's been that way forever. It's a legacy issue. But to introduce that same concept now, in a book that seems to use photo-referencing for character illustrations, and in a situation where a guy is supposed to be incapable of recognizing his ex-multi-year-girlfriend is simply asking far too much of the reader.

The Jackpot "mystery" is just a horrible idea in my view, and is being handled horribly on top of that. It's a horrible idea because it is so groin-grabbingly obvious that the character's design is supposed to make us go "IS IT MJ? OR ISN'T IT?!" by virtue of her looking like MJ, being called Jackpot, and using MJ catch-phrases like "tiger". The trouble with this is that it's a losing proposition no matter her identity. If it really is MJ, well, obviously, I mean who else could it be? If it isn't her, then it makes no sense why she has that name, looks like that, or talks like that, except that some writer or editor wanted to make us think it was MJ. In other words, either way it's all too "meta".

And of course it is simply impossible to buy the idea that Spider-Man wouldn't immediately know whether or not he was looking at the woman he was and probably still is in love with. It's being handled horribly with all this "Are you sure your name isn't Mary Jane" stuff, because again, that doesn't make any sense at all. Either little masks are enough to hide someone's identity or they aren't. This sort of in-between "hmmm I can't quite tell" is even less believable than complete identity protection. It means Spider-Man is aware of the obvious "resemblance" but somehow has really really bad eyesight or something and is unable to decide when he's standing 4 inches from her? You can't ask the reader to suspend disbelief about masks and at the same time have characters in the story casting doubts about how reasonable that suspension is.

Anyway, I really enjoyed last issue despite all this because it was a lot of fun. This issue I didn't find so fun, and I'm just not invested at all in these big mysteries I'm evidently supposed to care about. Who is Menace? The answer is yet another knockoff of Green Goblin we didn't need. Who is Jackpot? The answer is an incredibly terrible story idea.

[Croaker]

I think it was ment as sarcasm

I know my comment was sarcasm in response to his sarcasm. It was meant to demonstrate that assigning stupid motives and blaming every perceived ill of Marvel Comics to Joe Quesada is getting not only old, but quite absurd.

[rZi]

I know my comment was sarcasm in response to his sarcasm. It was meant to demonstrate that assigning stupid motives and blaming every perceived ill of Marvel Comics to Joe Quesada is getting not only old, but quite absurd.

sarcasm to sarcasm...curse the internet!

[tv horror]

What if Peter is still in a coma and he never died, that would put the cat amongst the pigeons. That would leave the way open for any of the supporting characters to return even if they had died or moved on.

[midnightman2001]

I am really enjoying BND. Its great so far. But I am wondering how the hell Marvel is going to explain this Spidey & the Spidey that is running around in New Avengers.

[Matt Linton]

New Avengers hasn't caught up to Brand New Day yet. Although, in the most recent issue Peter is back in his red and blues and no one refers to him by name, so it might have caught up now.

[JohnnyC]

It seems like April is when BND Spidey will be synched up with New Avengers, judging by Wells' story.

[Crimson]

There's absolutely no logical reason for Jackpot to be anyone other than MJ, which is why I'll go off the deep end if they try to claim otherwise (even though I'm not buying BND).

As for Menace...if Quesada has his way, Menace will end up being Gwen.

Why isn't there any reason for it to be someone else?

They could just be using the MJ thing to get attention and create chatter (If the first few issues hadn't been recieved well either cause no one liked the new world, or because of the OMD fallout).

I mean look at Speedball. Everyone thought he was going to die because it seemed so obvious by the time we got to Civil War #1.

We should be used to Marvel making us watch one hand, while the other one slaps up side the head.

[Endless Flight]

And Marvel won't care because, as you say, you're not buying BND. It's like someone complaining about politics and never voting.

Actually, they probably care more about what he says than what you say, because you are still reading.

[Mister Mets]

Actually, they probably care more about what he says than what you say, because you are still reading.But from the posts I've read, Matt Linton is a satisfied customer, so I'd assume Marvel would care a little bit about his opinion.

[DarKye]

But from the posts I've read, Matt Linton is a satisfied customer, so I'd assume Marvel would care a little bit about his opinion.

And as far as I know, Shade is a dissatisfied former customer.
Since one of them is already reading, they only need to tweak around so they can win the other one over.

So saying "Marvel won't care" in either case won't lead us anywhere. Marvel will care as long as they get more readers.

[Brian M.]

I was gonna drop the book after this arc, but man it's really good so I'm gonna keep going. If Wells is doing an arc centered around the NA, I'm definetly staying for that.

[MrPalen]

Why isn't there any reason for it to be someone else?

They could just be using the MJ thing to get attention and create chatter.

Undoubtedly, that is what they're doing whether it turns out to be MJ or not. But that is not a logical reason (i.e. one that makes sense within the world of the story), it is an editorial/writerly stunt.

[Mister Mets]

Undoubtedly, that is what they're doing whether it turns out to be MJ or not. But that is not a logical reason (i.e. one that makes sense within the world of the story), it is an editorial/writerly stunt.Marvel has yet to provide Jackpot's identity, so for all we know there's a logical in-story reason why someone who isn't Mary Jane would be so influenced by her when developing a superhero identity. In which people saying it's guaranteed to suck are jumping the gun.

[MrPalen]

Marvel has yet to provide Jackpot's identity, so for all we know there's a logical in-story reason why someone who isn't Mary Jane would be so influenced by her when wearing a superhero costume.

'Tis possible.

[CapnCaveman]

I want to chime in on the conversation about masks and identities.

Historically it's been a comic book convention that it's easy to hide one's identity by having a little mask a-la Green Lantern or even just wearing glasses like Superman. This was fine for a long time, and everyone kinda went along with it. So why aren't people going along with it now in Jackpot's case? What's changed?

What's changed is the realism of comic book art.

Look at the art in Action Comics #1. It's cartoony. Putting glasses on Superman and getting a shirt and tie on him makes him unrecognizable, because in that art style, all that distinguishes people from each other are superficial attributes like hair colour, costumes, and accessories. If Spider-Man were being drawn in a simple cartoony style, Jackpot's little mask would be more than enough to conceal her identity.

But as comics have gone more and more towards photorealism that kind of gimmick has become untenable. You can't both draw people in a very detailed and realistic way and pretend that a piece of fabric around the eyes will make someone's girlfriend unrecognizable. It's something the reader has a very difficult time accepting on a gut level, even if on an intellectual level they are willing to try and get past it because "it's comics".

Unfortunately, Superman is forever stuck with the glasses-as-disguise premise. Readers know it's ridiculous but are willing to let it go because it's been that way forever. It's a legacy issue. But to introduce that same concept now, in a book that seems to use photo-referencing for character illustrations, and in a situation where a guy is supposed to be incapable of recognizing his ex-multi-year-girlfriend is simply asking far too much of the reader.

The Jackpot "mystery" is just a horrible idea in my view, and is being handled horribly on top of that. It's a horrible idea because it is so groin-grabbingly obvious that the character's design is supposed to make us go "IS IT MJ? OR ISN'T IT?!" by virtue of her looking like MJ, being called Jackpot, and using MJ catch-phrases like "tiger". The trouble with this is that it's a losing proposition no matter her identity. If it really is MJ, well, obviously, I mean who else could it be? If it isn't her, then it makes no sense why she has that name, looks like that, or talks like that, except that some writer or editor wanted to make us think it was MJ. In other words, either way it's all too "meta".

And of course it is simply impossible to buy the idea that Spider-Man wouldn't immediately know whether or not he was looking at the woman he was and probably still is in love with. It's being handled horribly with all this "Are you sure your name isn't Mary Jane" stuff, because again, that doesn't make any sense at all. Either little masks are enough to hide someone's identity or they aren't. This sort of in-between "hmmm I can't quite tell" is even less believable than complete identity protection. It means Spider-Man is aware of the obvious "resemblance" but somehow has really really bad eyesight or something and is unable to decide when he's standing 4 inches from her? You can't ask the reader to suspend disbelief about masks and at the same time have characters in the story casting doubts about how reasonable that suspension is.

Anyway, I really enjoyed last issue despite all this because it was a lot of fun. This issue I didn't find so fun, and I'm just not invested at all in these big mysteries I'm evidently supposed to care about. Who is Menace? The answer is yet another knockoff of Green Goblin we didn't need. Who is Jackpot? The answer is an incredibly terrible story idea.


Very well said. Tiny masks can't conceal an identity and it is become more difficult to suspend disbelief. This storyline is starting to stink.

[Shade 20x6]

I know my comment was sarcasm in response to his sarcasm. It was meant to demonstrate that assigning stupid motives and blaming every perceived ill of Marvel Comics to Joe Quesada is getting not only old, but quite absurd.

Except, my sarcasm is valid, because it is on record that Quesada wanted to bring Gwen back, and only decided against it because everyone else was so vehemently against it.

There's nothing sarcastic about your reply at all.

[Shade 20x6]

But from the posts I've read, Matt Linton is a satisfied customer, so I'd assume Marvel would care a little bit about his opinion.

Until recently, I was buying pretty much every Spider-Man book released each month.

Alienating existing customers is extremely bad business.