Countdown #13 Spoilers

[Will.S]

Newsarama has the preview (http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=144477):

http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Countdown/Marts/14/CTDWCv13.jpg


So far:

- "I'll kill you to death!"? Oy, and I thought Loeb's Ultimates #2 had dialogue problems....

- Looking forward to this fight, Monarch might get whooped here but I'm kind of rooting for him for some reason.

- Argh! An all Tom Derenick issue? More Pete Woods!!!

- This issue has, quite possibly, the fastest wardrobe change ever (looking at Donna Troy).

- And yet despite some of this stuff, Countdown continues to improve.

Nice cover too btw, looks almost like Carlos Pacheco meets Frank Cho. I'd like to see this person's art more although it does look familiar for some reason.

[genesis]

I knew sticking with this title would have some benefits at the end but holy crap these past few issues have been great and I can't wait to see what is going to happen next.

[Choppa]

"I'll kill you to death" is the fuck!ng quote of the year.

[Will.S]

I knew sticking with this title would have some benefits at the end but holy crap these past few issues have been great and I can't wait to see what is going to happen next.
Agreed.

I think Countdown works better by itself anyway although Countdown to Adventure and Countdown to Mystery have been enjoyable reads and I find those to be all you need alongside Countdown. Haven't read Salvation Run yet though but there are some good recent reveals from what I've seen.

[Choppa]

So DOnna just changed clothes in like 5 seconds and in plain sight of everyone?

[Will.S]

So DOnna just changed clothes in like 5 seconds and in plain sight of everyone?
Yeah, that was really....off looking.

[Slyfer]

Superman Prime Versus Monarch nuff' said

[Tumbido]

Hope the fight is good at least. That's the only thing that I liked about Prime to begin with: the all-out rampaging. Sucks to have favorites rampaged by the whiner, but I had no favorites back then. :D

[Samuraixsithlord]

I'm thinking "damn Monarch can take Superman-Prime" but i said that about Ion so i'm placing money on Prime for the win. He sends Monarch packing. Lets not forget him being Silver-Age Superman strong

[Xero]

Monarch is way powerful than Prime his only limitation is that he needs to wear the armor to keep from killing his own troops.

[raul the cat]

Pre-Crisis Kryptonian. Period.

[Jack Tango]

Well...

Superman Prime reached into the 5th dimension, and then accosting Mr. Mxyzptlk...so that puts him in a pretty high power-category. Thanks, now-dead Guardian of the Universe.

So, either that's to show us that he's tough enough to take Monarch...or, just to make us think he can. Dun dun DUNNN...

I'm going with Prime on this one. :-)

[4thHorseman]

- "I'll kill you to death!"? Oy, and I thought Loeb's Ultimates #2 had dialogue problems....

Reminds me of "Kung Pow: Enter the Fist"

"I'll kill him. I'll kill him dead."

[bfrank]

So DOnna just changed clothes in like 5 seconds and in plain sight of everyone?

duh, she just spun around real fast.....

[Ha1fdime]

or just found a nearby phone booth

[Buried Alien]

Recent Superman Prime victims include the Anti-Monitor, so Monarch is in for one hell of a fight.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Conner_Kent]

Recent Superman Prime victims include the Anti-Monitor, so Monarch is in for one hell of a fight.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Anit-Monitor's not dead, got his ass handed to him and his suit ripped apart but still didnt die......with out that suit of his he's pretty small........

[wes_rk]

Recent Superman Prime victims include the Anti-Monitor, so Monarch is in for one hell of a fight.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

yup, and either they will both live after this or it's bye bye Monarch. I just can't see DC building Prime so much for quite some time now and then just killing him.

Or maybe all of that extra juice he has that is making him look like a much older Superman, will be used in this fight and he'll return to "normal boy-ish" looking prime... though I don't think that will happen.

[Slaughter]

Recent Superman Prime victims include the Anti-Monitor, so Monarch is in for one hell of a fight.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Not only the Anti-Monitor was NOT fully reborn, but he also fought Guardians and survived a Galaxy-destroying explosion contained inside a green forcefield. Prime just finished what the Green Lanterns started.

[Will.S]

yup, and either they will both live after this or it's bye bye Monarch. I just can't see DC building Prime so much for quite some time now and then just killing him.I can't see that either.

Most likely their fight will build up to some sort of crescendo, Monarch blows up but turns back into Captain Atom somewhere down the line, and Superman Prime continues on his merry way.

[Samuraixsithlord]

yup, and either they will both live after this or it's bye bye Monarch. I just can't see DC building Prime so much for quite some time now and then just killing him.

Or maybe all of that extra juice he has that is making him look like a much older Superman, will be used in this fight and he'll return to "normal boy-ish" looking prime... though I don't think that will happen.


Even normal boy-ish Prime was moving around planets and taking on the entire JSA, Titans, Doom Patrol plus all the reserves and old members

[wes_rk]

Even normal boy-ish Prime was moving around planets and taking on the entire JSA, Titans, Doom Patrol plus all the reserves and old members

yup you're right about that. I also meant how Prime is in center stage now and an important part of what seems to be going on. Countdown is just getting so much better I just can't wait for 13, and then 12 and so on.

[Samuraixsithlord]

yup you're right about that. I also meant how Prime is in center stage now and an important part of what seems to be going on. Countdown is just getting so much better I just can't wait for 13, and then 12 and so on.


I don't really see Prime surviving past Final Crisis but i kinda don't want him to stay dead forever.

I'm hoping that Superman sends him to the end of time like he did with Doomsday or he becomes Catatonic after finally cracking under the crazy

[Samuraixsithlord]

yup you're right about that. I also meant how Prime is in center stage now and an important part of what seems to be going on. Countdown is just getting so much better I just can't wait for 13, and then 12 and so on.


I don't really see Prime surviving past Final Crisis but i kinda don't want him to stay dead forever.

I'm hoping that Superman sends him to the end of time like he did with Doomsday or he becomes Catatonic after finally cracking under the crazy

[ShaggyB]

Prime FTW.

I know Arena put Monarch up to be this great cant be beat guy, but hes done.

[Sean Walsh]

- Argh! An all Tom Derenick issue? More Pete Woods!!!

Denerick has gotten a lot better over the last couple years. Could be worse (coughcoughCarlosMagnocoughcough)

And IIRC Tom's the only interior artist to work on both 52 and COUNTDOWN.

And I think this is still Pete Woods' month of covers, so that should be Pete's art on the cover, right?

[bjtrdff]

Prime will rape Monarch. R-A-P-E.

[Will.S]

Denerick has gotten a lot better over the last couple years. Could be worse (coughcoughCarlosMagnocoughcough)
True.

And I think this is still Pete Woods' month of covers, so that should be Pete's art on the cover, right?
Nah, that's some other dude named Stephane Roux from what I see.

[Angelo2113]

Prime FTW.

I know Arena put Monarch up to be this great cant be beat guy, but hes done.

I think in the last issue of Countdown or later in Final Crisis it's going to be Monarch and his elite team from Arena against Prime and the other survivors from Arena who got away.

[Choppa]

Well...

Superman Prime reached into the 5th dimension, and then accosting Mr. Mxyzptlk...so that puts him in a pretty high power-category. Thanks, now-dead Guardian of the Universe.

So, either that's to show us that he's tough enough to take Monarch...or, just to make us think he can. Dun dun DUNNN...

I'm going with Prime on this one. :-)

Mxy was messing with Prime, he can't really take him.

yup, and either they will both live after this or it's bye bye Monarch. I just can't see DC building Prime so much for quite some time now and then just killing him.

Or maybe all of that extra juice he has that is making him look like a much older Superman, will be used in this fight and he'll return to "normal boy-ish" looking prime... though I don't think that will happen.

Prime is older, he was aged during IC when the flashes kept him trapped in the speed force.

[Mr. Jason]

Sooner or later, someone has to get the upper hand on Prime. In the past year he has been trapped in the Speed Force, flown through a red star, held prisoner by the Green Lantern Corps, and blown up by a Guardian of the Universe. I think DC is running out of ways to get rid of the guy. If Monarch gets ripped apart by Prime then it will be hard to take Monarch seriously. Personally, though. I'd love to see Prime take on Red Son Superman. After all, he took out an entire group of Green Lanterns in his universe.

[NotSuper]

Mxy was messing with Prime, he can't really take him.
Actually, he can. It was stated by the writers on Newsarama that Mxy was only ACTING tough with Prime. And his fear of Prime is shown when he seals up his dimension and calls him "the end."

The reason Prime can take Mxy is probably due to his magic invulnerability.

[wes_rk]

Mxy was messing with Prime, he can't really take him.



Prime is older, he was aged during IC when the flashes kept him trapped in the speed force.

yeah but he's still a kid right? I mean, he's not as old as our Superman, is he?

[Archguru]

Ok, so Prime seems to be more reliant on constant energy absorbtion to power him that NE Supes, and it seems that he can absorb other forms of energy other than yellow sun radiation, as evidenced by the dying guardian giving him a power boost.

So, what happens when Prime absorbs the energy of Monarch's explosion?

I give you the villian of the Crisis... Monarch Prime.

[ShaggyB]

Actually, he can. It was stated by the writers on Newsarama that Mxy was only ACTING tough with Prime. And his fear of Prime is shown when he seals up his dimension and calls him "the end."

The reason Prime can take Mxy is probably due to his magic invulnerability.

Very true. and remember Mxy got an S scar. It went away right before he left the dimension and then it came back and he sealed up the 5th dimension.

My question is Bat-Mite is in Batman right now but i thought Mxy sealed the 5th Dimension.

Continuity is soooo gone right now

[Shellhead]

yeah but he's still a kid right? I mean, he's not as old as our Superman, is he?

Technically, he should be known as Superyoungman Prime, but that's kind of awkward.

[Choppa]

Actually, he can. It was stated by the writers on Newsarama that Mxy was only ACTING tough with Prime. And his fear of Prime is shown when he seals up his dimension and calls him "the end."

The reason Prime can take Mxy is probably due to his magic invulnerability.

I gotta re-read it. I got the impression that he was messing with him the whole time.

yeah but he's still a kid right? I mean, he's not as old as our Superman, is he?

I dunno and it's not really clear. I mean Bart was a full fledged adult no? So shouldn't Prime have aged the smae?

[NotSuper]

I gotta re-read it. I got the impression that he was messing with him the whole time.
It did kind of come off that way, but apparently he was just acting tough (as shown by his fear in #22).

Here's the article I was talking about: http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=138094&highlight=Countdown

From the article:

MC: If he was more up to it he’d have fought back... He ran away... He wasn’t up to it... and wants nothing to do with what Prime’s up to and capable of. Smartest move the Mx-ster’s ever made!

[Phoney Bone]

I've been reading comics for over thirty years. "I'll kill you to death!" may very well be the single greatest thing EVER to appear in a super-hero funny-book.

[NotSuper]

Sooner or later, someone has to get the upper hand on Prime. In the past year he has been trapped in the Speed Force, flown through a red star, held prisoner by the Green Lantern Corps, and blown up by a Guardian of the Universe. I think DC is running out of ways to get rid of the guy. If Monarch gets ripped apart by Prime then it will be hard to take Monarch seriously. Personally, though. I'd love to see Prime take on Red Son Superman. After all, he took out an entire group of Green Lanterns in his universe.
I don't think Red Son Superman has gained his Silver Age-esque powers yet. He still seems to be age 30 and he got the great power increase later down the line.

[Captain Jim]

My question is Bat-Mite is in Batman right now but i thought Mxy sealed the 5th Dimension.

Continuity is soooo gone right now

Bat-Mite isn't from the 5th dimension. At least he never was in the old days. Mxy was said to be from the 5th dimension and Bat-mite was said to be from "another" dimension.

[worstblogever]

Prime will rape Monarch. R-A-P-E.

So this begs the question... would it have been funnier/scarier, if SMP said, "I'll KILL YOU TO DEATH!!!" or the alternate, "I'll RAPE YOU TO DEATH!!!"

I'm going with the latter for both funnier, and scarier. Being cornholed by a guy who as a teen, forgot to pull a punch and took Pantha's head off is a terrifying prospect.

[steve2275]

So far:

- Argh! An all Tom Derenick issue? More Pete Woods!!!
u make that sound like bad thing
all in due time

[General Grievous]

hope prime wins

[Samuraixsithlord]

Ok, so Prime seems to be more reliant on constant energy absorbtion to power him that NE Supes, and it seems that he can absorb other forms of energy other than yellow sun radiation, as evidenced by the dying guardian giving him a power boost.

So, what happens when Prime absorbs the energy of Monarch's explosion?

I give you the villian of the Crisis... Monarch Prime.


I think he got the Guardians enegy when he was atomized and the re-atomized in the new dimension. If he keeps the Guardians power for awhile and he has a re-match with Ion then that could be how Ion wins the second fight. he absorbs the Guardians energy

[Samuraixsithlord]

the issue begins with Superman-Prime fighting Monarch. Monarch releases a portion of his power which annihilates the city they are in. Green Lantern shields Ray and Donna from the blast.

Monarch is contacted by his army. He gloats about how powerful he is while Superman-Prime attacks again without a mark on him.

Batman and Red Robin meet up with the others when Donna sees a vision from the source telling them to go to Apokalips. We cut to Solomon as he has just defeated Forerunner and is about to kill her when Darkseid appears. It looks like Solomon has been allied with Darkseid the whole time.

The Monitor of Earth-51 senses the source and leaves to find the Challangers. The Batman is bickering with Donna over what she saw when he notices a group of Monarchs followers being led by a Joker. He goes crazy with rage and attacks. He fails to see Ultraman come up behind him and is punched through the skull. Green Lantern grabs Ultraman with his ring and throws him into the city. Jason asks to be alone and kills the Joker when no one is looking by crushing his head with a large rock. The Monitor of Earth-51 then transports the heroes to Apokalips while he stays on his earth

We cut to Monarch fighting Prime. Monarch can't seem to hurt Prime so he begins taunting him about him being a little boy throwing a temper tantrum and that he's using up all the Guardians energy and shrinking. Prime gets super mad and rips Monarchs armor open which destroys all of Monarchs forces including the whole Milky Way Galaxy of Earth-51. The only survivor seems to be that earths monitor who notices a single plant has survived the destruction

[General Grievous]

who survives? prime flung to the future?


http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/1292/countdown002bm9.jpg[/QUOTE]

[Samuraixsithlord]

The Monitors survive.

[Sean Walsh]

The Monitors survive.

It's weird: while all the other Monitors "beam out just in time" (leaving Monarch's armies, and all of that Earth's population, to die horribly) the Monitor of that Earth......oh, and a little plant.....survives without a scratch. :confused:

[bjtrdff]

That might tie in to the Death of the new Gods issue 5....

[drwho]

I'm slightly curious where the current GL storyline fits in with this because it is revealed that one of the GLS is a 4th world character. Now you would think she would know about everyone dieing and all the stuff going on there.

[TheCrisisKid]

my questions is what happened to monarch? I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't be happy if I never saw his over-powered butt again.

[Angelo2113]

Can Prime absorb Monarchs power?

Because I thought the Big Bang was the spectrum of light from all the galaxies. Prime said that it hurt when Monarch hit him the first time, but he didnt have a scratch on him. Just like when he was screaming for help when the Guardian was sacrificing himself to rid Prime of that universe.

[Zeal]

The last remaining tree sprout was more metaphorical than physical, showing that life will always find a way to carry on. Or it could be interpreted as representing the difficulty or downright impossibility of destroying all hope, at least in my opinion.

Also, I'd just like to say that I absolutely love Superman Prime in this series. He is more like a force of nature than a super villain, akin to Galactus...only completely insane.

Easily the character with the most potential for future growth.

EDIT- I also think it's entirely possibly that Prime could have literally absorbed all the quantum energies of Monarch. If so.....ohh snap..lol.

[titanfan]

So all of Monarch's armies are wiped out just like that? After all that buildup?

[Angelo2113]

So all of Monarch's armies are wiped out just like that? After all that buildup?

None of the heroes from Arena were on Earth-51, I think it was Monarchs weaker army. His army from Arena will probably come in towards the end of Countdown as his elite army. This was just a battle, I dont think the war is gonig to be over that quick.

[Choppa]

So this begs the question... would it have been funnier/scarier, if SMP said, "I'll KILL YOU TO DEATH!!!" or the alternate, "I'll RAPE YOU TO DEATH!!!"

I'm going with the latter for both funnier, and scarier. Being cornholed by a guy who as a teen, forgot to pull a punch and took Pantha's head off is a terrifying prospect.

He should have just said "I'll Dr. Light you to death!!"

[garin]

None of the heroes from Arena were on Earth-51, I think it was Monarchs weaker army. His army from Arena will probably come in towards the end of Countdown as his elite army. This was just a battle, I dont think the war is gonig to be over that quick.Looks like the Extremists bought it, though.

[Captain Jim]

I was a little confused at where this left Monarch and Prime??????

[ZNOP]

Hurray! Prime finally gets his ass kicked:D

[NotSuper]

Hurray! Prime finally gets his ass kicked:D
No, he didn't.

Prime caused the explosion, not Monarch.

[NotSuper]

who survives? prime flung to the future?
I think they both survived. Monarch wasn't able to really damage Prime (although he did hurt him), so I don't think the explosion finished him. Plus, Geoff has already mentioned getting him back after Countdown. As for Monarch, he's Captain Atom and will likely reform himself. I'm guessing he won't be crazy when he comes back.

I also think Prime was sent into the future--the threeboot Legion's future. And I think that Legion actually exists on a future--gasp--Earth-Prime. Just look at all the photo-realistic comics showing up in that title.

Prime will probably look like a teenager again in the future and lose his memory. This would lead the Legion to believe that he's the legendary Superboy.

[Slaughter]

I hope Monarch is not dead yet. I want to see Dark Knight's Superman fighting him again, he said it was not over. Not by a long shot.

So... where are Monarch and Prime going?

I think that they are going to either the Legion times (Brainiac 5 mentioned the "Crisis of the 31 Century" in the last issue of Action Comics. Maybe it's how the Final Crisis is going to play out in the future) or to jump to another universe.

So, what got killed with that explosion? Just the Milky way, or the whole Universe-51 is gone, too?

[NotSuper]

I think Monarch will reform somewhere different than Prime. Maybe even on Earth-4.

[big al]

Looks like the Extremists bought it, though.

I gotta say I've been pushing for these guys to come back for years on a few different boards, I loved them in the old JLE series. thier comeback has been one fo the biggest letdowns I've ever experienced in my 25 years of reading comics...I understand that they were trying to build a universe and everything with the extrimist mini series but I just think it's totally boring and the characters-the extrimists-are not even close to what they used to be in any respect, not just physically but they're trying to add depth to them that just is not working...they were cool when they were so arrogant and over the top back in the day..I honestly could care less about that series right now plus I hate the way the hero's of that world have been portrayed. Just a terrible revamp if I've ever seen one.

[brundlefly]

Looks like the Extremists bought it, though.

As well as the recently-introduced "Crime Society." I'll reiterate from another thread that I am, in hindsight, pleased that these goofs were introduced in Countdown if their ultimate purpose was only to become cannon fodder in Monarch's army and then to get atomized in this issue's big boom. At the time that they debuted, I was quite irritated that the vastly-superior Crime Syndicate of Amerika from Morrison's Earth 2 weren't getting any playing time because of the usage of this team of redundant knockoffs, but if this would have been their ultimate fate, then it was for the best. And maybe with Morrison helming Final Crisis, the real CSA will get to make an appearance? *fingers crossed* :D

And like big al, I was a fan of the JLE-era Extremists, but didn't love this new revamped incarnation. Not really broken up about them taking dirt naps, if that is the case.

[ShaggyB]

I was overall disappointed in the lack of frames for there fight. I really wanted to see Monarch throw all he had at Prime before he nuked. Then i figured prime would destroy his suit.

[Will.S]

I was overall disappointed in the lack of frames for there fight. I really wanted to see Monarch throw all he had at Prime before he nuked. Then i figured prime would destroy his suit.
Yeah I was hoping for a little more "oomph" in that regard myself but the fight looked more or less even. Hopefully Monarch reconstitutes himself or comes back as Captain Atom but there's no reason to believe that Superman Prime is dead.

All in all I enjoyed this issue, although I can't say I'm surprised that Earth-51 was destroyed and same for Earth-51 Batman who got himself owned by a "Superman". The Monitor of that earth received some good development with an interesting ending so I'm cool with that. Plus we finally see more of Darkseid and Solomon which is an interesting pairing but doesn't make sense to me yet (guess I'll have to re-read it). I've said this before but I think Darkseid has been using Monarch to destroy Earth 51, he even wrote out that message that only Donna was able to catch.

Otherwise why would the Earth 51 scenario play out this way? Why would Monarch goad Superman Prime so much that he walked right into getting his armor breached?

[Choppa]

I love how this Monarch is nothing like the Arena Monarch. At the end of last issue he's freaking out that something unexpected happened (Superman Prime showing up), while in Arena he has "every possible scenario already thought out." :D

[JCAll]

Actually, he can. It was stated by the writers on Newsarama that Mxy was only ACTING tough with Prime. And his fear of Prime is shown when he seals up his dimension and calls him "the end."

The reason Prime can take Mxy is probably due to his magic invulnerability.

If Prime was so immune to magic, why did he have Earth 3 Zatanna take away Mxy's powers before he even dared to face him? The only reason Mxy didn' just waste Prime on the spot once he got free was that he had been tortured, probably for weeks, and didn't anything left in him except to get home.

Why he sealed off the 5th Dimension I'm not so sure about. Nor do I understand how Earth 3 Zatanna seal off Mxy's power when everyone there admitted that she wasn't Mxy's peer.

[NotSuper]

If Prime was so immune to magic, why did he have Earth 3 Zatanna take away Mxy's powers before he even dared to face him? The only reason Mxy didn' just waste Prime on the spot once he got free was that he had been tortured, probably for weeks, and didn't anything left in him except to get home.
Mxy didn't waste Prime because he COULDN'T. This was said directly by Bedard and Carlin themselves in the link I provided. And he is immune to magic. No magic user could affect him in Infinite Crisis.

Why he sealed off the 5th Dimension I'm not so sure about. Nor do I understand how Earth 3 Zatanna seal off Mxy's power when everyone there admitted that she wasn't Mxy's peer.
He sealed off the dimension because he was scared of Prime. He called Prime "the end." He didn't want Prime entering his dimension to mess it up.

As for the Earth-3 Zatanna, she took away his powers so Mxy couldn't just disappear. He's not able to effect Prime at all, but he could escape with his full powers--just like he did when he got them back.

[JCAll]

Mxy didn't waste Prime because he COULDN'T. This was said directly by Bedard and Carlin themselves in the link I provided. And he is immune to magic. No magic user could affect him in Infinite Crisis.


He sealed off the dimension because he was scared of Prime. He called Prime "the end." He didn't want Prime entering his dimension to mess it up.

As for the Earth-3 Zatanna, she took away his powers so Mxy couldn't just disappear. He's not able to effect Prime at all, but he could escape with his full powers--just like he did when he got them back.

He couldn't because he was to weak at the time. Mxy wasn't boasting to anyone when he said that, he was alone in the space between the 3rd and 5th Dimensions. And he had no reason to say it if it wasn't true.

And in the interview, they never said it was Prime Mxy was scared of. Mxy has shown multiple time that he knows what's going to happen in the various DC Crisises beforehand and might just be reacting the the 52 being completely screwed, which is the prevailing theory at this point.

Hell, what am I saying, Prime can't take Mxy. He just can't, and didn't even have the guts to try. He grabbed Mxy from behind and shut off his powers before he could do anything. He even tried to get Mxy to give him his powers because he admitted Mxy was more powerful. And considering the shit 5D Imps have done, especially in the past decade, he has every right to think that.

I know Mxy was probably just talking tough at that point in Countdown, who wouldn't be scared to death, but if Prime had faced Mxy fair he would have been turned into a pizza and fed to the Teen Titans or whooped by the dozen or so more powerful Supermen that Mxy could pull out of Hypertime. "Immune" to magic or not.

[NotSuper]

He couldn't because he was to weak at the time. Mxy wasn't boasting to anyone when he said that, he was alone in the space between the 3rd and 5th Dimensions. And he had no reason to say it if it wasn't true.
Actually he was boosting. I posted full quotes about it.

And in the interview, they never said it was Prime Mxy was scared of. Mxy has shown multiple time that he knows what's going to happen in the various DC Crisises beforehand and might just be reacting the the 52 being completely screwed, which is the prevailing theory at this point.
They DID say Mxy was scared of Prime.

NR: Mxy's mad dash back to the 5th dimension, saying, "He's there, he's the end!" Is he talking about Prime? He didn't seem so terrified of him at the end of last ish, saying that if he was more up to it, he'd go back and fight him. Did he meet someone else on his way our of the DCU dimension?

TB: Maybe Mxy was talking tough as he ran for his life. Sort of like declaring victory while you pull your troops home?

MC: If he was more up to it he’d have fought back... He ran away... He wasn’t up to it... and wants nothing to do with what Prime’s up to and capable of. Smartest move the Mx-ster’s ever made!

Hell, what am I saying, Prime can't take Mxy. He just can't, and didn't even have the guts to try. He grabbed Mxy from behind and shut off his powers before he could do anything. He even tried to get Mxy to give him his powers because he admitted Mxy was more powerful. And considering the shit 5D Imps have done, especially in the past decade, he has every right to think that.
You're missing the point. Mxy can do things Prime can't, but can't hurt Prime directly. Omnipotent magical power is useless against someone immune to magic. Also, we don't know the details of how Prime captured Mxy.

I know Mxy was probably just talking tough at that point in Countdown, who wouldn't be scared to death, but if Prime had faced Mxy fair he would have been turned into a pizza and fed to the Teen Titans or whooped by the dozen or so more powerful Supermen that Mxy could pull out of Hypertime. "Immune" to magic or not.
First of all, no one except a 5th dimension imp can fight Mxy "fair." A hero or villain trying to defeat them with their own abilities would be an incredibly stupid idea.

And if Prime's immune to magic (which he is--read Infinite Crisis), Mxy's power can't affect, no matter what level it's on. Magic is magic. Mxy could've used his magic to create a red sun to de-power Prime, but he can't DIRECTLY hurt Prime. Likewise, he can use his magic to disappear or hide as well.

Prime needed Mxy because Mxy can create anything out of nothing and cross barriers Prime can't. Mxy is technically more powerful, but can't affect Prime. Prime probably has this immunity because he's from Earth-Prime--the "real" world. (That's also probably why he was able to create all those retcons. After all, all retcons come from Earth-Prime writers.) Magic doesn't work in the real-world, so it wouldn't work on someone. It's been shown that the universe bends for Prime, not the other way around. For example, the pre-Crisis Kara Zor-El was not able to move planets when she came to the post-Crisis Earth. Prime, on the other hand, can. Again, it's probably because of where he's from.

Incidentally, here's what I think happened: Prime goes to Earth-3, "saves" some children Evil Zatanna is torturing (in an attempt to prove he's a hero), then decides to use her. When he finds out she can't help him find his Earth, he makes her use her sensing abilities to find someone who can. She locates Mxy and Prime ambushes him. After Prime has physically weakened him (if Mxy wasn't weakened first then a human magic user couldn't remove his abilities), Evil Zatanna removes his abilities so he can't escape. Then the story plays out as we know it. Simple.

[storm_willing_slave]

He couldn't because he was to weak at the time. Mxy wasn't boasting to anyone when he said that, he was alone in the space between the 3rd and 5th Dimensions. And he had no reason to say it if it wasn't true.

And in the interview, they never said it was Prime Mxy was scared of. Mxy has shown multiple time that he knows what's going to happen in the various DC Crisises beforehand and might just be reacting the the 52 being completely screwed, which is the prevailing theory at this point.

Hell, what am I saying, Prime can't take Mxy. He just can't, and didn't even have the guts to try. He grabbed Mxy from behind and shut off his powers before he could do anything. He even tried to get Mxy to give him his powers because he admitted Mxy was more powerful. And considering the shit 5D Imps have done, especially in the past decade, he has every right to think that.

I know Mxy was probably just talking tough at that point in Countdown, who wouldn't be scared to death, but if Prime had faced Mxy fair he would have been turned into a pizza and fed to the Teen Titans or whooped by the dozen or so more powerful Supermen that Mxy could pull out of Hypertime. "Immune" to magic or not.
Yeah I have to agree! In Countdown it was obvious that Myx was too weak and thats why he decided not to fight! Prime did tried to kill Myx to get his powers, but Myx only fake death and then laugh in Prime face! And adding insult to injury, Earth3 Zantanna told him off, hardcore style!:D

[NotSuper]

Yeah I have to agree! In Countdown it was obvious that Myx was too weak and thats why he decided not to fight! Prime did tried to kill Myx to get his powers, but Myx only fake death and then laugh in Prime face! And adding insult to injury, Earth3 Zantanna told him off, hardcore style!:D
Prime was the one who weakened him in the first place. A human magic user couldn't do it by herself. If you recall, ALL the human magic users couldn't stop the Spectre in Day of Vengeance. There's NO WAY in hell a single one could rob Mxy of his powers without a lot of help. It doesn't add up at all.

Also, Prime didn't want to kill Mxy to get his powers--you don't get an imp's powers if you kill them. Otherwise he would've snuffed Mxy out when he first caught him. He wanted to use Mxy to locate where his universe was, that's all. Think of him as a metal detector, except for alternate universes.

[DeadXMan]

EDIT- I also think it's entirely possibly that Prime could have literally absorbed all the quantum energies of Monarch. If so.....ohh snap..lol.

oh snap indeed

I was hoping to see 51 bats join th team though
Damn DC quite making intersting Alts and then kill them off:mad:

[NotSuper]

I think Prime will eventually grow so powerful that he becomes his own universe (ala Tetsuo)--Earth-Prime. And in this universe, there will be another Kryptonian boy living on an Earth without heroes.

[botch]

Monarch is way powerful than Prime his only limitation is that he needs to wear the armor to keep from killing his own troops.

Like he said. pre Crisis Kryptonian, even DC acknowledges Prime as the most powerful villain in the DCU.

[botch]

yup, and either they will both live after this or it's bye bye Monarch. I just can't see DC building Prime so much for quite some time now and then just killing him.

Or maybe all of that extra juice he has that is making him look like a much older Superman, will be used in this fight and he'll return to "normal boy-ish" looking prime... though I don't think that will happen.

It will be 3 years of Prime when Final Crisis rolls around.

[botch]

Just like when he was screaming for help when the Guardian was sacrificing himself to rid Prime of that universe.

That's because he was worried more than anything.

[botch]

I think they both survived. Monarch wasn't able to really damage Prime (although he did hurt him), so I don't think the explosion finished him. Plus, Geoff has already mentioned getting him back after Countdown. As for Monarch, he's Captain Atom and will likely reform himself. I'm guessing he won't be crazy when he comes back.

I also think Prime was sent into the future--the threeboot Legion's future. And I think that Legion actually exists on a future--gasp--Earth-Prime. Just look at all the photo-realistic comics showing up in that title.

Prime will probably look like a teenager again in the future and lose his memory. This would lead the Legion to believe that he's the legendary Superboy.

The Threeboot legion has already been confirmed to be the future of New Earth.

[botch]

I hope Monarch is not dead yet. I want to see Dark Knight's Superman fighting him again, he said it was not over. Not by a long shot.

So... where are Monarch and Prime going?

I think that they are going to either the Legion times (Brainiac 5 mentioned the "Crisis of the 31 Century" in the last issue of Action Comics. Maybe it's how the Final Crisis is going to play out in the future) or to jump to another universe.

So, what got killed with that explosion? Just the Milky way, or the whole Universe-51 is gone, too?

That wasn't Dark Knight Superman, but a similar one.

[botch]

I love how this Monarch is nothing like the Arena Monarch. At the end of last issue he's freaking out that something unexpected happened (Superman Prime showing up), while in Arena he has "every possible scenario already thought out." :D

Well I don't think "Plan for possible appearance of basically a God" comes into any Supervillains evil plans.

[DonC]

So DOnna just changed clothes in like 5 seconds and in plain sight of everyone?


Instert "Bat-pole" joke here.

[NotSuper]

The Threeboot legion has already been confirmed to be the future of New Earth.
I don't remember that being said by anyone. There's going to be a "Legion of Three Worlds" story coming up which will explain where each Legion exists.

I stand by my belief that the threeboot Legion is on Earth-Prime.

[botch]

I don't remember that being said by anyone. There's going to be a "Legion of Three Worlds" story coming up which will explain where each Legion exists.

I stand by my belief that the threeboot Legion is on Earth-Prime.

well mark waid said at the end of infinite crisis that the threeboot legion was the first look at New Earth post Infinite crisis.

you know that just because you haven't heard it doesn't mean it isn't true.

I stand by my belief that Mr T is a one eyed blind parrot. Doesn't mean it's true.

[NotSuper]

well mark waid said at the end of infinite crisis that the threeboot legion was the first look at New Earth post Infinite crisis.
Things change. The Lightning Saga Legion could just as easily be the New Earth version. I like both versions, so it doesn't really matter to me. However, based on what's been shown in the comic, I'm saying that the threeboot Legion is on Earth-Prime. Why else would there be photo-realistic DC comic books in that future? Where else would they have come from?

[TheDrizzt]

Back to the Myx thoughts... I believe the imp powers used to be very advanced science, not actual magic. Has that been changed?

[botch]

Things change. The Lightning Saga Legion could just as easily be the New Earth version. I like both versions, so it doesn't really matter to me. However, based on what's been shown in the comic, I'm saying that the threeboot Legion is on Earth-Prime. Why else would there be photo-realistic DC comic books in that future? Where else would they have come from?

Uhhh historical. it is in the future. Geoff Johns, Mark Waid and Didio have said the Threeboot Legion is the first glimpse of the main DC Earth post infinite crisis. i think I am to believe them if they say it's so.

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

There's a chain restaurant in the mid-Atlantic called Red Robin, which is kind of like Dennys, and has a red robin mascot. I don't like the Red Robin Jason. He looks like he should be serving burgers.

http://www.myfolsom.com/images/redrobin.gif

[HotRod_Tim]

I love how Monarch displays his power..."This suit doesn't make me anymore powerful...it protects YOU!"

Can't wait to see how this plays out.

And Darkseid in cahoots with Solomon...definitely did NOT see that one coming.