Big City Comics

[darkartpoet]

Big City Comics has come out with 5 titles in the last 4 months and has started a campaign to resurge the comic industry. Surely this is a huge step for a new independant and to have thier books selling out. Seems pretty impressive. Maybe they as a whole are alot better then we expected!!!

[chrissama200]

Maybe they as a whole are alot better then we expected!!!
The preview pages I saw of "Ant" back in October left me with a very different feeling. The dialogue was terrible and there were numerous typos.
I'll admit that the cover art for "Dragon Cross" looks decent, but, based on "Ant" and some bitter comments I've seen posted publicly by members of Big City Comics, I'm going to pass on their work in favor of companies with better reputations.

[darkartpoet]

All new publishers have some glitches during the beginning. However the art is getting better and the stories are as well overall. I don't think you can hold accountable everything said by every person as bible. Maybe throwing away the grudge and look at it as entertainment. I have an appriciation for art and regaurdless of what goes on behind the scenes doesn't matter. Anyway I do understand and feel your view is important and I appriciate you responding with your opinion.

[TomStillwell]

Fast starts usually lead to quicker exits.

[Mario Gully]

Hey Darkartpoet,

Thanks for the post. I just want to get on here and say that it's very hard
for any Indy company to do anything in this crazy biz. I just know that
guys like Jeff Kaufman (BIG CITY) is actually trying to do things that help
promote and sell comics from all publishers. I've worked with more then my
share of publishers and to have a company that actually cares about the
industry as a whole is a rare find. I just wish you guys will give us a shot.

Chrissama200- Yeah I might have deserved your feelings about my book.
But, there were no typos in the actual comic that came out last month.
sometimes, we just send the preview pages off before the final edit can be done. Truth be told--I am a bad speller and I simply have to live with that. But please don't let your feelings about Ant make a judgment about the company as a whole. And about the comments--hey, people are very passionate about this stuff. Sometimes no matter how much of a professional we try to be, arguments still happens. I'm sorry that popped off the way it has but--we are human and we make mistakes.

[chrissama200]

@darkartpoet: I'm just a comic reader with an opinion. In the sake of full disclosure, if you have some affiliation with Big City Comics (or any publisher, for that matter), and you want to hype something, I would hope that you would say so. I hope you're another fan like myself, because I'm a little leery of people in the industry posting with shill accounts to hype their own works. If that's not the case then I apologize, but if it is the case, that speaks volumes to the reputation I was talking about earlier.

@Mario: I have no intention of telling you how to do your book, but if I were submitting preview pages to potential buyers, I would have double and triple checked them first. If the previews look sloppy, then my mind is already made up. Getting into it with message board members after the fact didn't improve my opinion either.

[Brandon Hanvey]

@darkartpoet: I'm just a comic reader with an opinion. In the sake of full disclosure, if you have some affiliation with Big City Comics (or any publisher, for that matter), and you want to hype something, I would hope that you would say so. I hope you're another fan like myself, because I'm a little leery of people in the industry posting with shill accounts to hype their own works. If that's not the case then I apologize, but if it is the case, that speaks volumes to the reputation I was talking about earlier.

It's quite obvious that he is part of Big City. I could out him, but I'll leave it up to him to do it himself.

There is nothing wrong with hyping your company's work. I just think if you want to hype your books, you should state who you are.

[chrissama200]

There is nothing wrong with hyping your company's work. I just think if you want to hype your books, you should state who you are.
My point exactly. It's cool when creators are accessible as long as they say who they are, but I lose a little respect for people who anonymously hype their own work.

[Mario Gully]

My point exactly. It's cool when creators are accessible as long as they say who they are, but I lose a little respect for people who anonymously hype their own work.

I don't get it. I can understand where you guys are coming from but
if you think about it, When new publishers come in here sometimes--
new people get on board and try to help. I'm not saying that a
company member should use a mask and try to anonymously hype
there own titles---but who is to say that this person isn't a real fan?

-Brandon: I guess you can track this persons IP info or something, but
in my humble opinion is this person doing such a terrible thing to be
"out" for? Do everyone have to "state who they are" or do that
only applies to comic professionals? That's not fair in my opinion.
I don't know who Chrissama200 is either. She or he is obviously
not for Big City but, that person has only posted on here like 5 times or so.
For all we know that can be anybody also or they both can be the same person.

I don't want to make waves. It seems like when I voice my opinion that
people seem to get offended. That's ok. If I was gunpo500 or somebody
then everything will be cool. But since I choose to let people know who
I am I'm always in danger of offending people because I have a book people
can have an option on--and take their frustration out by posting bad comments or sending hate mail. It's situations like this that
discourages new readers, new publishers, and even comic professionals from
posting on message boards in the first place. It's the crabs in the bucket
mentality in my humble opinion. Doe's it really matter who is saying what?
If I'm out of line Brandon then I apologize. I just don't see what the
big deal is. There have been a few Big City post on here by guys that
have been here a while. Is that cool?

Chrissama- I just tried to help clarify things from my perspective. It looks
like you have already made up your mind about the company and that's
cool. I honestly don't believe that you will ever like anything Big City puts
out. That's fine. It's your hard earned money and opinions and you have
the right to spend it on whatever tickles your fancy. I just hope you
continue to support comics in general.

[Brandon Hanvey]

-Brandon: I guess you can track this persons IP info or something, but
in my humble opinion is this person doing such a terrible thing to be
"out" for? Do everyone have to "state who they are" or do that
only applies to comic professionals? That's not fair in my opinion.
I don't know who Chrissama200 is either. She or he is obviously
not for Big City but, that person has only posted on here like 5 times or so.
For all we know that can be anybody also or they both can be the same person.


I just feel that it is less than professional for a person who works for a publisher to act like they are just a fan and hype their work.

[Mario Gully]

I just feel that it is less than professional for a person who works for a publisher to act like they are just a fan and hype their work.

I guess the only people who know that is you and him. I'm a feel
real dumb if it is a Big City person. I got better things to do then
to entertain people that I'm already working with.:confused:

[chrissama200]

I don't get it. I can understand where you guys are coming from but
if you think about it, When new publishers come in here sometimes--
new people get on board and try to help. I'm not saying that a
company member should use a mask and try to anonymously hype
there own titles---but who is to say that this person isn't a real fan?

Company members can also be fans, but if you work for the company, don't refer to the company as "they/them," refer to them as "we/us." Anything else is deceptive.

I posted on the Newsarama site back in October under this same screen name. I've lurked here for quite a while and decided the other day to register and chime in on a topic. I don't work in the comics industry. I work in real estate, and when I'm doing any business that has to do with that, I am required to disclose my license status and my full name and the company I represent. I don't think it's asking too much for professionals in the comics industry to disclose who they are when they are hyping their own company on a message board either.

And you're right, I've made up my mind about Big City Comics, and I think I gave a few very valid reasons why I feel the way I do.

[Teacher_123]

I guess the only people who know that is you and him. I'm a feel real dumb if it is a Big City person. I got better things to do then
to entertain people that I'm already working with.:confused:

Yeah, like returning to third grade. Remediation, my friend, remediation.

"I guess the only people who know that are you and he. I would feel really dumb if it's a Big City employee. I have better things to do (like read a dick-shee-nar-ee) than to entertain (three syllable word, spelled correctly! yay!) people that I'm already working with."

[jeffbcc]

I went to the Magic game with Mario Gully tonight. For your info, Magic beat Detroit with a last second buzzer beater but getting back on to the topic, Go Magic. This business is a tough one. In the last three months we put out twelve issues, three of Tempest, Totem and Dragon Cross, two of Ant Unleashed and one of Omega One. I can’t possibly tell you the effort that goes into that.

In September and October we had a public spat with our old company and are still paying for it today. I publicly apologized, deleted everything from our website and even communicated with the other publisher directly. As a publisher, I should have handled things differently but I didn’t.

When Mario told me about this issue on this forum, I kind of thought it was funny because when I first took over writing Ant on issue 9 I tried to post anonymously and B. Clay Moore busted me. I don’t know if the person who posted is a fan or an employee. I kind of hope they are a fan but if they’re an artist at Big City, I hope they learned their lesson and that is “people aren’t stupid”. If it is a fan, thanks.

As far as choosing not to read a book because of something you read on a forum, I can appreciate that. Not giving “dime one” to a company you don’t respect is understandable. I’m sorry that public exchange between our companies cost the artists, writers and staff at Big City potential readers. I will not make that mistake again.

jeff

[PamGrierOverdrive]

Hey, guys, with tons of quality indy books hitting the market each month, and with the cover prices of comics soaring, I've decided to shuffle my pull list to make room for poor quality comics with amateur art and first grade grammar by snake oil salesmen who seek to insult my intelligence with deceptive threads on message boards! I can't wait for all that fun entertainment, and to see the resurgence of the comic industry! Maybe you on a whole are a lot better than we expected! :)

[Ravengregory]

Looking forward to checking out the new Ant series and some other BIg City Comics. Jeff and Mario are good people and I've known Mario for quite some time.

Wasn't a big fan of the IMAGE ANT but I remember ANT at Arcana and that story had a really good heart. Hope ANT at BCC lives up to it's name.

Well done with everything BCC.

[Brandon Hanvey]

I think it would be best to pull back on the snarkiness.

[PamGrierOverdrive]

Then delete this sheister's thinly veiled attempt to promote his company. This thread is both deceptive and an insult to the collective intelligence here.

[Brandon Hanvey]

The thread is what it is. Deleting it would just to sweep it under the carpet and not show people what happened.

Plus I'm still waiting to see if darkartpoet will speak for himself.

[darkartpoet]

“Time to pay the piper”



I went into Jeff’s office yesterday and explained to him that I made a little mistake over at CBR. The first thing he did was laugh at me and said welcome to comic books. He told me how when he first started dealing with promotions he did the same thing over on an Image thread and took a beating.



I was hired here to do promotions about a week ago. I’ve been a comic book reader my whole life but. I used to do this kind of work in New York where there are no rules except don’t get caught and if you do deny...deny.. deny. After and hour in Jeff’s office, I get it.



The problem with being an independent is that most stores don’t stock independent books unless customers directly request them. The only way that happens is if people on boards like these go directly to their retailers and ask. I get that I should have posted this differently and just said that I was in charge of promotions here.



Jeff told me on top of the apology I can send the three thread contributors free variant copies of the first two issues of our first four books as a way of saying we’re sorry. He made sure to make it clear that I said “we’re” since I am a representative of the company. I’m going to p.m. all three of you for you address so we can send you the books and again I should have done things differently.



If you don’t think the books and apology is enough, trust me, I’ve been the brunt of every joke here all morning and from what Josh tells me, I’ll be a panel story for the rest of eternity.



Frank "Darkartpoet"

[chrissama200]

Just wanted to follow up and say that I did receive a message from jeffbcc and darkartpoet, so as far as I'm concerned, apology accepted.

[jeffbcc]

Well, the great forum thread mystery has been solved. “Mistakes were made and in the end I’m responsible” but at least it was fun reading what people had to say. What else can you ask for in a thread?

Just another behind the scenes look at the nonsense that happens in comics. Between the story, the pencils, the inks, the colors, the lettering, the solicitations, the previews, Diamond Distributors, Transcontinental printing, shipping, retailers, forums, other publishers, other artists, conventions schedules, advertising, banner ads, consultants, travel, hotels, food, displays, the money, the money, the money, and basically every possible scenario and issue you can imagine, for this I get to hold a book that I am responsible for in my hands and say, “You know this isn’t so bad”. Then back to everything else mention above.

Thanks to Brandon Hanvey, PamGrier, Tom Stillwell, Teacher 123 and Chrissama for chiming in. Believe it or not as they said in Ground Hog’s Day, “different is good”. With FX on Friday and five books going to the printer, a little conflict is a nice distraction and clearly a learning experience for some, “right, Frank”.

[Teacher_123]

I was a thread contributor, but haven't had any offer made. :-(

Jeff told me on top of the apology I can send the three thread contributors free variant copies of the first two issues of our first four books as a way of saying we’re sorry.

[delgado]

As an artist my self I can tell you that it's hard to start and finish a comic book. Readers such as those here will constantly have their opinions being that they dont know the hard work that goes into developing a comic book. Mario is a busy guy but yet he is humble to his fans and offers great advice at time, dont hate for he's success appreciate the great example that he is for the up and coming artist. In him I see hope, and in big city comics I see a great potential for success. company that are small like image have change the industry for the better why not them. When you work on a book for so long all you want is success, true that you have to let your work speak for itself but in the end you have to hype your work it's the exposure that brings you more work!

[jeffbcc]

Teacher,

I tried to e-mail you and p.m you to get your address. Try p.m.ing me if that doesn't work just e-mail me at form the website.

jeff

[TomStillwell]

Well, the great forum thread mystery has been solved. “Mistakes were made and in the end I’m responsible” but at least it was fun reading what people had to say. What else can you ask for in a thread?

Just another behind the scenes look at the nonsense that happens in comics. Between the story, the pencils, the inks, the colors, the lettering, the solicitations, the previews, Diamond Distributors, Transcontinental printing, shipping, retailers, forums, other publishers, other artists, conventions schedules, advertising, banner ads, consultants, travel, hotels, food, displays, the money, the money, the money, and basically every possible scenario and issue you can imagine, for this I get to hold a book that I am responsible for in my hands and say, “You know this isn’t so bad”. Then back to everything else mention above.

Thanks to Brandon Hanvey, PamGrier, Tom Stillwell, Teacher 123 and Chrissama for chiming in. Believe it or not as they said in Ground Hog’s Day, “different is good”. With FX on Friday and five books going to the printer, a little conflict is a nice distraction and clearly a learning experience for some, “right, Frank”.

I don't know if I'm ready to give a pass here.

Yeah, making & selling comics is hard and there's a lot involved at every step of the process. Running my own small publishing company over the last few years I've learned a ton. I've made my own fair share of mistakes too and learned from them.

Deception wasn't one of those mistakes. Honesty wasn't something I had to learn while making comics. That's something we should all learn as kids.

Jeff was caught using a sock puppet, now his staff member, and the excuse is "well, now we know, we're sorry"? You didn't know it was wrong to lie? Are you sorry because you got caught or sorry because it was wrong to lie?

You can't start off from a position of dishonesty and have any kind of credibility.

And then there's the matter of Mario Gully threatening to end my friend's career a while ago. This is the same Mario Gully who owed a lot of people a lot of money and still would if Jeff, yes the same Jeff over at Big City, hadn't bailed him out. Elsewhere Mario said that he didn't make the kind of money he hoped off Ant and that's why he didn't pay. I'm sorry, I don't see how that relieves you from paying what is owed.

So you can see this is the type of behavior that seems the norm over at Big City. Dishonesty and bullying. But I guess that's all part of making comics, right?

Jeff & Mario, you want everyone to give you a break about this kind of stuff? Earn it. Free comics are not the going rate for a good reputation.

Good will, like a good name, is got by many actions, and lost by one.
- Lord Jeffrey

[jeffbcc]

It’s 2am and Josh and Frank are still at the office adjusting the books and getting ready for FX. I left the office at about 11:30 after a fifteen hour day and still have six pages to write. I happen to get a Google alert about the previous post and normally would shake it off but knowing how hard Frank is working, I guess I just felt a need to say something.

What I love about these forums is that I sometimes get really constructive feedback from readers and comic book fans. What I hate about these forums is the way people feel a need to tear others apart. Frank made a mistake. I called him out. The thread members called him out. He apologized. I apologized because he’s a member of my company and even offered up some variants where an apology was certainly enough.

I have been blessed with the opportunity to work with some great people in this industry. I’ve also had to forgive some other people who weren’t so great. Reading the things you had to say about people who are struggling everyday just to survive in this industry and in life, is hard. I’ve learned though that these are things I can’t comment on because the truth is never what is being sought, just the fight.

Some of the people at Big City normally put in nineteen hour days just to make sure the 22 pages are in the can. I am proud of the artists and the staff who in just three month have published five monthly titles. I am also proud and humbled by the ridiculous hours and the sacrifices these people have put in to go after their dreams.

Like I said, I’m not going to comment on the allegations made. I made that mistake once before and will not make it again. I would like to thanks those on this thread who e-mailed me back with positive and helpful ideas.

jeff

[TomStillwell]

It’s 2am and Josh and Frank are still at the office adjusting the books and getting ready for FX. I left the office at about 11:30 after a fifteen hour day and still have six pages to write. I happen to get a Google alert about the previous post and normally would shake it off but knowing how hard Frank is working, I guess I just felt a need to say something.

What I love about these forums is that I sometimes get really constructive feedback from readers and comic book fans. What I hate about these forums is the way people feel a need to tear others apart. Frank made a mistake. I called him out. The thread members called him out. He apologized. I apologized because he’s a member of my company and even offered up some variants where an apology was certainly enough.

I have been blessed with the opportunity to work with some great people in this industry. I’ve also had to forgive some other people who weren’t so great. Reading the things you had to say about people who are struggling everyday just to survive in this industry and in life, is hard. I’ve learned though that these are things I can’t comment on because the truth is never what is being sought, just the fight.

Some of the people at Big City normally put in nineteen hour days just to make sure the 22 pages are in the can. I am proud of the artists and the staff who in just three month have published five monthly titles. I am also proud and humbled by the ridiculous hours and the sacrifices these people have put in to go after their dreams.

Like I said, I’m not going to comment on the allegations made. I made that mistake once before and will not make it again. I would like to thanks those on this thread who e-mailed me back with positive and helpful ideas.

jeff

Jeff, I'm not looking for a fight. You personally messaged me about maybe providing some insight into the comic industry and ways to improve it. Well, improving comics starts with improving the accountability of publishers.

Again, we get that making comics is hard work. I work a full time job and come home to work another 5-6 hours every weekday. When not doing family stuff on the weekend I'm working on comics. My vacations are spent working conventions.

But working hard on comics doesn't give anyone a pass on being accountable. The non-payment, the bullying, the deception...those aren't allegations. Those are documented facts. You don't have to offer up answers to those misdeeds or defend them. We're not in a position to judge. BUT you should learn from those mistakes if you want BCC to have a decent reputation. Show us that you have instead of making excuses.

As I said, credibility is earned with action, not trying to paint yourself as a martyr when getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar and someone calls you on it.

[Kid Kyoto]

I wouldn't mind the original post if it had useful info, like a list of the titles, a link or some reason to check the stuff out.

Though in the interests of full disclosure I'm a few thousand miles from the nearest comic shop and highly unlikely to buy anything that isn't a TPB.

Let me know when you've got one coming out.

[jeffbcc]

We're on issue three of Tempest, Totem and Dragon Cross, Issue 2 of Ant Unleashed and Issue 1 of Omega One. Since I want to give retailers enough time to sell the issues they have on the shelves, I guess the first ones will come out in July.

jeff

[darthdad]

I wouldn't mind the original post if it had useful info, like a list of the titles, a link or some reason to check the stuff out.

Though in the interests of full disclosure I'm a few thousand miles from the nearest comic shop and highly unlikely to buy anything that isn't a TPB.

Let me know when you've got one coming out.


if you're interested in hearing what big city comics is all about you can check out an interview that we did with jeff kaufman on my podcast a few months back as well as reviews of the first couple of books that we did.

http://fanboyfaceoff.libsyn.com/index.php?post_id=291154


http://fanboyfaceoff.libsyn.com/index.php?post_id=257723