Emma dying, betraying, or leaving Cyclops?

[40yearoldnovafan]

Over at Comicscontinuum, there is a preview of Uncanny X-men #495 where Scott Summers reminiscing about the loves/important people in his life he recently lost. The previews show him thinking about his father, Jean Grey, and then Emma. The X-men no longer exists (again). Cyclops seems to be all alone.

Something has to have happened to Emma. I don't think she died, because he does not appear to be that sad. But he does appear to be sad. And with the reminiscing thing, Emma's gone. There goes another Marvel relationship.

Jimmy

[Monty_Cristo]

i hope she goes back to the Inner Circle but not some cliche version of villainy.

[Pro]

Emma and Scott will travel together. So no she's not gone.

[Brian M.]

You should look closer at the previews. Scott is just daydreaming. It shows Emma snapping her fingers at Scott to get his attention. After that he...*gags* kisses her and they appear later in bed...*vomits* naked.

She doesn't die. Doesn't leave. But you can sure as hell bet if she does Joe Q gets a big basket of chocolate iced donuts from me.

[Pach!]

It' more like he' thinking about what he lost and Emma tells him to snap out of it.

Then they have sex in what looks like Las Vegas with the mini statue of liberty and other mini stuff.

[DeniseXfrost]

Nope. Scott just being a douche bag to her as usual.

[Christopher O]

No, no, and no.

[Brian M.]

Nope. Scott just being a douche bag to her as usual.

She deserves it.

[Monty_Cristo]

Nope. Scott just being a douche bag to her as usual.

but isn't that what attracted her to him in the first place?

[frog]

Then they have sex in what looks like Las Vegas with the mini statue of liberty and other mini stuff.

That just reads so wrong.

[Pach!]

That just reads so wrong.

LOL! That's not what I meant. The statue of liberty is not involved in the sex.

[Beast]

Nope. Scott just being a douche bag to her as usual.
She deserves it.

[Beast]

LOL! That's not what I meant. The statue of liberty is not involved in the sex.
Maybe it's Mystique from X1. Then it could be. :D

[Pach!]

She deserves it.

Why?

1010

[frog]

She deserves it.

She deserves it.

What? You're such a team now you speak as one? :D

[DeniseXfrost]

She deserves it.
About 5 years ago, yes.
but isn't that what attracted her to him in the first place?
Na, Emma attracted to Scott when he was more like stoic geek.

[Monty_Cristo]

About 5 years ago, yes.

Na, Emma attracted to Scott when he was more like stoic geek.

i liked him better when he was a stoic geek, as well.

[Beast]

About 5 years ago, yes.
Given the sliding time scale, 5 years hasn't passed yet. So she still deserves it.

[Beast]

What? You're such a team now you speak as one? :D
It's our Cyberpathy Shades. :D

[DeniseXfrost]

Given the sliding time scale, 5 years hasn't passed yet. So she still deserves it.
Beast is going to die :evilsmile

[frog]

Beast is going to die :evilsmile

In the year 2090 after an extraordinarily long and eventful life.

[Beast]

Beast is going to die :evilsmile
I can assure you that he's not. :D

[Beast]

In the year 2090 after an extraordinarily long and eventful life.
After having kids with the returned Cecelia Reyes. Yay! :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Banner.jpg

[claimtosubclaim]

After having kids with the returned Cecelia Reyes. Yay! :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v97/MasterSplinter/Banner.jpg

Shouldn't those kids be half white (or at least blue)?

I hope Sam and Lila never see each other again. Bad spring fling.

[Pach!]

Shouldn't those kids be half white (or at least blue)?

I hope Sam and Lila never see each other again. Bad spring fling.

Booth those relationships bring vomit to the mouth. Specially the terrible names. I'm looking at you, Thomas Jefferson Guthrie who looks like Sage+Lila baby.

[Kage Kisaragi]

Shouldn't those kids be half white (or at least blue)?

I hope Sam and Lila never see each other again. Bad spring fling.

They don't look white enough to you?

The oldest male son has blue hair and yellow eyes.. clearly he isn't 100% Black. The daughters hair is brown, she has yellow eyes as well and all 3 children hair perfectly straight hair. Mutants indeed.

[Beast]

Booth those relationships bring vomit to the mouth. Specially the terrible names. I'm looking at you, Thomas Jefferson Guthrie who looks like Sage+Lila baby.
There's no joy in your soul. :(

[dellicious]

Over at Comicscontinuum, there is a preview of Uncanny X-men #495 where Scott Summers reminiscing about the loves/important people in his life he recently lost. The previews show him thinking about his father, Jean Grey, and then Emma. The X-men no longer exists (again). Cyclops seems to be all alone.

Something has to have happened to Emma. I don't think she died, because he does not appear to be that sad. But he does appear to be sad. And with the reminiscing thing, Emma's gone. There goes another Marvel relationship.

Jimmy

she's not gone till Joe Q decides to quit shoving her down our throats. really...

he probably feels it's only fair since i'm sure she gets so much shoved down hers

[claimtosubclaim]

i'm sure she gets so much shoved down hers

Less than Ororo has taken.

[DeniseXfrost]

In the year 2090 after an extraordinarily long and eventful life.
as a dog lol (that's his evolution.)

[frog]

as a dog lol (that's his evolution.)

Wrong. He isn't one of the lupine avengers.

[DeniseXfrost]

Well lots of things can happen in 2090.

[Omega Alpha]

Well lots of things can happen in 2090.

Not according to Al Gore, since the planet will be dead because we're evil and don't take care of the enviroment.

[lockerogue]

she's not gone till Joe Q decides to quit shoving her down our throats. really...

he probably feels it's only fair since i'm sure she gets so much shoved down hers

LOLLL now that's funny.

[Brian M.]

Not according to Al Gore, since the planet will be dead because we're evil and don't take care of the enviroment.

When he chagnes his lifestyle, I'll change mine. Till then...I spray hairspray directly into the air.

[Beast]

When he chagnes his lifestyle, I'll change mine. Till then...I spray hairspray directly into the air.
Makes sense, given you have no hair. :D

[ClanAskani]

I'm bummed. I got my hopes up that the Emma and Scott freakshow was over seeing the title of the thread. But, alas, no. :(

Well, if Scott and Emma are in Vegas, here's what I hope happens:

Scott and Emma end up completely hammered and in a quickie marriage chapel. As they return to their hotel room and begin to sober up, Emma realizes what she's done and freaks out. She tries to summon Mephisto for a mind erase, forget-you-were-ever-married style divorce, but he's no where to be found. So Emma, still intoxicated, tries to erase the marriage from Scott and her memories. But it backfires! Scott completely forgets Emma, and Emma completely forgets who she is. Scott goes back to New York, wondering what the blazes he was doing in Vegas. Meanwhile, Emma, with no memory of who she is, becomes a low rent Vegas call girl.

[DeniseXfrost]

^lol that's funny.

[claimtosubclaim]

I'm bummed. I got my hopes up that the Emma and Scott freakshow was over seeing the title of the thread. But, alas, no. :(

Well, if Scott and Emma are in Vegas, here's what I hope happens:

Scott and Emma end up completely hammered and in a quickie marriage chapel. As they return to their hotel room and begin to sober up, Emma realizes what she's done and freaks out. She tries to summon Mephisto for a mind erase, forget-you-were-ever-married style divorce, but he's no where to be found. So Emma, still intoxicated, tries to erase the marriage from Scott and her memories. But it backfires! Scott completely forgets Emma, and Emma completely forgets who she is. Scott goes back to New York, wondering what the blazes he was doing in Vegas. Meanwhile, Emma, with no memory of who she is, becomes a low rent Vegas call girl.

Meanwhile, Korvus plunges his sword into Rachel while she yells "no!" (which of course means "yes").

[ZNOP]

Meanwhile, Korvus plunges his sword into Rachel while she yells "no!" (which of course means "yes").


Errrr... BOOO!!!:rolleyes: A penitently point for a lack luster comment.

[Jake V]

When he chagnes his lifestyle, I'll change mine. Till then...I spray hairspray directly into the air.

It's supposed to go ON your head, not INSIDE it.

[claimtosubclaim]

Errrr... BOOO!!!:rolleyes: A penitently point for a lack luster comment.

It's called give-and-take. I've never actually defended Emma's character before, but in a thread where she's been relegated to slut and bj comments, I thought I would dish back. :evilsmile:

[DeniseXfrost]

^And what a great comeback it was :D

[rZi]

This thread had me worried for a second..

[steve2275]

You should look closer at the previews. Scott is just daydreaming. It shows Emma snapping her fingers at Scott to get his attention. After that he...*gags* kisses her and they appear later in bed...*vomits* naked.

She doesn't die. Doesn't leave. But you can sure as hell bet if she does Joe Q gets a big basket of chocolate iced donuts from me.
sounds enticeing

[Kage Kisaragi]

Meanwhile, Korvus plunges his sword into Rachel while she yells "no!" (which of course means "yes").

by sword I take it you mean Alien Man Thing?

[boshobosho]

Something will happen eventually whether you find it good or bad.
It's comics, Emma Frost could end up becoming a demi-god and Scott could have been Amelia Earhart in a former life, so he'll need to go off and do some soul searching. And it will all be because Joe Q, was sitting in his office, fapping to pictures of Jubilee mumbling "Asian teens, Asian teens!" OVER and OVER again instead of making intelligible decisions.

[Rachel Grey]

Honestly? I dont think it's Jubes that Joey Q's fapping over...

[Kage Kisaragi]

Honestly? I dont think it's Jubes that Joey Q's fapping over...

Agreed. But who then? Emma?

[Rachel Grey]

It'd explain why she's constantly shoved down our throats for one thing. I think he likes the blonde and busty thing.

[claimtosubclaim]

I honestly don't think Joe Q really gives a crap about the X-Universe. He never talks about it, and his mainstay has been pushing The Avengers and Avengers-related stuff.

[Charybdis4]

I honestly don't think Joe Q really gives a crap about the X-Universe. He never talks about it, and his mainstay has been pushing The Avengers and Avengers-related stuff.

Come on! Emma, Spider Woman & Ms Marvel are Joe Q's hotties for the last couple of years. It wouldn't suprise me if he has an Emma Frost duvet cover with matching curtains in his boudouir.

And I don't want to think about what he might get up to with their action figures. I'm getting images of Dark Helmet in "Space Balls" playing with the princess Vespa toy "....I have you now Princess Vespa."

Anyway, those images looks like there is more tension in the train wreck that is the Scott/Emma-love in. Keep her on the team if necessary, but lets just end that freak show of a union.

[claimtosubclaim]

Come on! Emma, Spider Woman & Ms Marvel are Joe Q's hotties for the last couple of years. It wouldn't suprise me if he has an Emma Frost duvet cover with matching curtains in his boudouir.

And I don't want to think about what he might get up to with their action figures. I'm getting images of Dark Helmet in "Space Balls" playing with the princess Vespa toy "....I have you now Princess Vespa."

Anyway, those images looks like there is more tension in the train wreck that is the Scott/Emma-love in. Keep her on the team if necessary, but lets just end that freak show of a union.

Spider Woman is Bendis' obsession. Brian Reed is Ms. Marvel's. Most if not all of the recent the X-writers enjoy writing Emma (which was likely brought on by fan favorites Morrison and Whedon making her a mainstay), and I'm pretty sure character pushes in the X-Universe today are more dictated by the X-editors & writers in collaboration than anything (hence the rise of characters like Rogue, Iceman, Madrox, Warpath, X-23 and Cable...all pet favorites of the current X-staff). Aside from House of M, Joe Q has pretty much left the X-office to its own devices. His obsession is with Spider-Man and The Avengers.

[Le Drake]

Not too much silicone, not too much flesh. Emma's balance of both is juuuuuust right.

[darksaint124]

Face it people, after being on the side of angels for over a decade, Emma Frost is here to stay. And Cyclops only leaves women who have his children.

[Accroître]

I don't think she will die or anything crazy like that, but I would to see her go back to the HFC.

[Phil Hunn]

Aside from House of M, Joe Q has pretty much left the X-office to its own devices. His obsession is with Spider-Man and The Avengers.

Joe Q has stated how much more interesting Emma is than Jean (if tiresome, tedious, perpetual bitchery is what you like, Joe, you go right ahead and enjoy it. Just don't drag us into it).

I almost wish, though, that Joe Q had spent the entirety of his tenure as EiC wittering about Emma instead of whining that the Spider-Marriage was a bad thing. At least then he wouldn't have foisted the bucket of horse-poop that was OMD on us...

[Fire_And_Light]

Emma is only more interesting because Jean was never allowed off the pedestal except for bathroom breaks.

That being said, I think if I have to watch Scemma (or whatever the shorthand is) I want it turbulent. Isn't that its raison d'etre? Romantic tension? I hate, hate, hate "Headmistress White is so fantastic stories." They negate the point of her usage.

[Fatguy]

I honestly don't think Joe Q really gives a crap about the X-Universe. He never talks about it, and his mainstay has been pushing The Avengers and Avengers-related stuff.

I think it's more that he's been trying really hard to boost the other Marvel franchises. Before he came along, the MU was "The X-Books, featuring some other Marvel Heroes!".

The X-Franchise just didnt need the focus like the other books did.

[Brian M.]

I think it's stupid to say that "Joe Q doesn't care about __________".

[Red Lotus]

You should look closer at the previews. Scott is just daydreaming. It shows Emma snapping her fingers at Scott to get his attention. After that he...*gags* kisses her and they appear later in bed...*vomits* naked.

She doesn't die. Doesn't leave. But you can sure as hell bet if she does Joe Q gets a big basket of chocolate iced donuts from me.

You do know that Joe Q is the reason why Jean isn't back yet.

[darkness85]

You do know that Joe Q is the reason why Jean isn't back yet.

Maybe it has something to do with women who have red hair and green eyes?

[Brian M.]

You do know that Joe Q is the reason why Jean isn't back yet.

Yea I know.

I disagree with his decision.

Should I sit there and bash a man I don't know or make statements like "Joe Q doesn't care about ______"?

[darksaint124]

Maybe it has something to do with women who have red hair and green eyes?

I think I'm starting to see the pattern.
OOOOOOOOOoHHHHHHHHHHHH NNNNOOOOOOOOO
Syren is next. DUM,DUM,DUM.*cue dramatic music*

[Divalykeprincess]

Maybe it has something to do with women who have red hair and green eyes?

I think that someone else in the Jean/Phoenix appreciation thread had a theory about Joe Quesada getting jilted by a red headed woman with green eyes in his eariler years, so he's taking it out now on Jean and Mary Jane. (I'm sure other red heads will be next)

[Kage Kisaragi]

I think I'm starting to see the pattern.
OOOOOOOOOoHHHHHHHHHHHH NNNNOOOOOOOOO
Syren is next. DUM,DUM,DUM.*cue dramatic music*

Follow by Black Widow, then Medusa.

Except Black Widow might be spared as I just read that her eyes are blue not green.

http://image.comicvine.com/uploads/item/4000/3200/59543-black-widow_400.jpg
except in this image here where she is obviously a Skrull.

[otipep_90]

Well the Scarlet Witch is kinda of a redhead and look at the mess they turned her into so Joe could have is no more mutants and make the Avengers the it team of marvel. The man is pure evil, he is .............Mephisto!!! Or better yet Skrullphisto!!!!:eek:

[Red Lotus]

Yea I know.

I disagree with his decision.

Should I sit there and bash a man I don't know or make statements like "Joe Q doesn't care about ______"?


No but its kind of odd that you said you would send him chocolate iced donuts for killing Emma when its his dislike for Jean that is keeping her dead and keeping Emma with Scott. If Emma did die there is a good chance that Joe still wouldn't let them bring Jean back.

[claimtosubclaim]

In all fairness, the X-writers have stated that it's not a good idea to bring Jean back unless they can come up with a good-enough story, but that either way it's almost improbable to bring her back now because she's already died so many times. They also credit Morrison as being the one who came up with the idea for Jean's death. Specifically, one of Carey's wishes was to "go back in time and talk Grant Morrison out of killing Jean."

[Brent1974]

Yea I know.

I disagree with his decision.

Should I sit there and bash a man I don't know or make statements like "Joe Q doesn't care about ______"?

No but its kind of odd that you said you would send him chocolate iced donuts for killing Emma when its his dislike for Jean that is keeping her dead and keeping Emma with Scott. If Emma did die there is a good chance that Joe still wouldn't let them bring Jean back.

So why does Joe Q hate Jean so much??

[Brian M.]

In all fairness, the X-writers have stated that it's not a good idea to bring Jean back unless they can come up with a good-enough story, but that either way it's almost improbable to bring her back now because she's already died so many times. They also credit Morrison as being the one who came up with the idea for Jean's death. Specifically, one of Carey's wishes was to "go back in time and talk Grant Morrison out of killing Jean."

I agree that unless you can figure out a good way to bring Jean back w/o the Phoenix, don't do it.

[Phil Hunn]

Should I sit there and bash a man I don't know or make statements like "Joe Q doesn't care about ______"?

Clearly you misunderstand the point of teh internets ;)

In all fairness, the X-writers have stated that it's not a good idea to bring Jean back unless they can come up with a good-enough story, but that either way it's almost improbable to bring her back now because she's already died so many times.

Before she got killed and resurrected about ten times in Phoenix: Endsong, Wonder Man had died about as many times as Jean. And nobody complains about him repeatedly coming back to life, despite the fact that he's a pig-brained waste of space.

So why does Joe Q hate Jean so much??

I think he's one of the creators who is of the opinion that she should never have been brought back to life in the first place, basically.

Either that, or she reminds him of a girl who treated him like crap before he got married... ;)

[Brent1974]

I agree that unless you can figure out a good way to bring Jean back w/o the Phoenix, don't do it.

True, we already of Rachel with the Phoenix Echo. We do not need both the near omnimpotent (SP?) characters on the same, or remotely the same teams. I think that was originally one of the reasons to remove Rachel from Excalibur was 'Why have a character that can end a battle, or a entire universe in the blink of a eye.' Or something very close to that, I remember reading in a interview somewhere.

[Daithi]

I think that was originally one of the reasons to remove Rachel from Excalibur was 'Why have a character that can end a battle, or a entire universe in the blink of a eye.' Or something very close to that, I remember reading in a interview somewhere.

No nothing to do with it. Rachel was removed from Excalibur to make it more like X-Men Europe and to be sent to the future to add backstory to Cable.

Robert Weinberg brought Rachel back without the Phoenix and basically said what you said. The Phoenix worked great for Jean as once off, worked great for Rachel when Excalibur wasn't the X-Men lite but it hasn't worked since.

[Michael Sean]

The Phoenix worked for Jean during Revolution where it was mostly defined as her iconic imagery and powers honed to their sharpest edge.

And the Phoenix worked for Jean in New X-Men too. Well until she died but she only died to do her disinfection in the future.

She was suppose to return.

Endsong and Warsong were stupid. Nobody should let these mini's which could be rather easily ignored cause them to dislike Jean Grey, Jean Grey as Phoenix, or even the Phoenix Force itself.

Those minis were just a way of cashing in on Jean Grey and the Phoenix while we wait for Jean's official return.

Jean should stay the Phoenix because we don't need any more retcons convoluting her. She has fully merged with the Phoenix now and as others have stated before its now an aspect of her mutation and consciousness. She literally is a Phoenix.

They just need to tone down her power and not have her go insane or die anymore.

Scott needs to sacrifice Emma to Mephisto to bring Jean back. :D

[kate-pryde]

True, we already of Rachel with the Phoenix Echo. We do not need both the near omnimpotent (SP?) characters on the same, or remotely the same teams. I think that was originally one of the reasons to remove Rachel from Excalibur was 'Why have a character that can end a battle, or a entire universe in the blink of a eye.' Or something very close to that, I remember reading in a interview somewhere.

Claremont said that initially Rachel was written out of Uncanny (along with eventually Kitty, Kurt and Peter) because of Mutant Massacre and not wanting it to seem too similar to the Days of Future Past future. Claremont planned on a Phoenix Limited Series that would reveal more of her past, but that was eventually shelved. During that time, the idea for Excalibur came up and it seemed natural to put Rachel, Kitty and Kurt in that.

[Madama Butterfly]

Some people have to live with the new facts: Emma Frost is the new Jean. She's here to stay.

[Beast]

Some people have to live with the new facts: Emma Frost is the new Jean. She's here to stay.
If she's the new Jean Grey, then she'll be dying soon.

[frog]

Some people have to live with the new facts: Emma Frost is the new Jean. She's here to stay.

Gee, it must be time for Cyclops to have an affair with someone else now!

[Lukecage]

Gee, it must be time for Cyclops to have an affair with someone else now!

As long as Jean stays dead I don't mind.

[Beast]

As long as Jean stays dead I don't mind.
She's not even currently dead. She's alive in the WHR, regathering her Phoenix fragments.

[Madama Butterfly]

If she's the new Jean Grey, then she'll be dying soon.
Well, she did "connect" with the Phoenix lately...! So you never know...

[kate-pryde]

Gee, it must be time for Cyclops to have an affair with someone else now!

Scott can only be in a relationship so long before his eyes start wandering.

Let's see, who's Scott's next affair with - Psylocke? Dazzler? Hepzibah? He likes redheads, so maybe Rahne?

[Brent1974]

What is the White Hot Room anyways. I have heard about it here, but don't know what it is?

[Brian M.]

Scott can only be in a relationship so long before his eyes start wandering.

Let's see, who's Scott's next affair with - Psylocke? Dazzler? Hepzibah? He likes redheads, so maybe Rahne?

Don't be bitter becuase Kitty is dead.

[Beast]

What is the White Hot Room anyways. I have heard about it here, but don't know what it is?
Basically, it's the nexus of all realities. It touches every point of space and time at once.

Think of it as the 'Cosmic Waiting Room' for Phoenix. :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%27Kraan_Crystal

[Brent1974]

Don't be bitter becuase Kitty is dead.

We dont know that for sure, Astonishing X-men 24 is out in a week :) And if it isnt in there, there's the Giant Sized issue in Feb.

She might still live, its looking grim unless she is elsewhere right now :D

[Phil Hunn]

Some people have to live with the new facts: Emma Frost is the new Jean. She's here to stay.

You know what? I agree with you.

I mean, Marvel has been trying to metaphorically shoe-horn her into Jean's old dresses ever since Jean popped her clogs, making her into Jean Grey with a dye job, plastic boobs, and a penchant for snide remarks...

[GeneralSpecific]

You know what? I agree with you.

I mean, Marvel has been trying to metaphorically shoe-horn her into Jean's old dresses ever since Jean popped her clogs, making her into Jean Grey with a dye job, plastic boobs, and a penchant for snide remarks...

So what's not to like? :D
Except maybe, instead of a replacement, can we just have both?

[Slung]

In all fairness, the X-writers have stated that it's not a good idea to bring Jean back unless they can come up with a good-enough story, but that either way it's almost improbable to bring her back now because she's already died so many times. They also credit Morrison as being the one who came up with the idea for Jean's death. Specifically, one of Carey's wishes was to "go back in time and talk Grant Morrison out of killing Jean."
In all fairness, each of the X-Writers have said they want to write Jean (well, Carey said he was Morrison should never have killed her, Brubaker said if he could resurrect one person it'd be Jean and Yost said Jean was his third favorite character). The only thing stopping Jean's return IS Joe Q. She has died effectively twice (not counting issue cliffhangers - which EVERYONE has dealt with). Once after Dark Phoenix. And once after Morrison's run. She has "died" in issues and come back - but so have many other characters. We've also thought Emma Frost was dead twice before. And Cable. And Wolverine has died many more times than that.

[claimtosubclaim]

In all fairness, each of the X-Writers have said they want to write Jean (well, Carey said he was Morrison should never have killed her, Brubaker said if he could resurrect one person it'd be Jean and Yost said Jean was his third favorite character). The only thing stopping Jean's return IS Joe Q. She has died effectively twice (not counting issue cliffhangers - which EVERYONE has dealt with). Once after Dark Phoenix. And once after Morrison's run. She has "died" in issues and come back - but so have many other characters. We've also thought Emma Frost was dead twice before. And Cable. And Wolverine has died many more times than that.

*Of course* they want to write Jean. That's a given. But the fact remains that these same writers have also said it's not a good idea to bring her back unless they can come up with the right story, and that she's almost a character you can't resurrect now. You can take that statement for what you will. I don't care. You can ignore it or try to argue around it, but it was written nonetheless. If X-editorial came up with a great story that they all agreed on, they would bring her back. Joe Q doesn't give a crap about the X-Universe anymore (if he ever really did to begin with). He's not even looking over their shoulders at this point. Hell, if you asked him about Messiah Complex, he'd probably respond, "Messiah what? No. No. Secret Invasion and Brand New Day! The Avengers! I haven't heard of any Messiah Complex."

[Slung]

*Of course* they want to write Jean. That's a given. But the fact remains that these same writers have also said it's not a good idea to bring her back unless they can come up with the right story, and that she's almost a character you can't resurrect now. You can take that statement for what you will. I don't care. You can ignore it or try to argue around it, but it was written nonetheless. If X-editorial came up with a great story that they all agreed on, they would bring her back. Joe Q doesn't give a crap about the X-Universe anymore (if he ever really did to begin with). He's not even looking over their shoulders at this point. Hell, if you asked him about Messiah Complex, he'd probably respond, "Messiah what? No. No. Secret Invasion and Brand New Day! The Avengers! I haven't heard of any Messiah Complex."
I don't remember them ever saying it wasn't a good idea to bring her back, just that to do it they would have to have a great story. There is a difference. And yeah, with all the moaning from the editors and Morrison about "all the times she's died" (ummm...twice), sure - it's difficult to backpedal from that. Its poor marketing to complain about your own property to boost a different one (Emma).

[claimtosubclaim]

I don't remember them ever saying it wasn't a good idea to bring her back, just that to do it they would have to have a great story. There is a difference. And yeah, with all the moaning from the editors and Morrison about "all the times she's died" (ummm...twice), sure - it's difficult to backpedal from that. Its poor marketing to complain about your own property to boost a different one (Emma).

I meant to write that she's almost a character you can't bring back. Sorry. Either way, "It's not a good idea to bring her back unless they can come up with the right story" is different from "wasn't a good idea to bring her back". When you leave out words from my post it changes the context. Anyhoo, this is from an uncannyxmen.net interview w/ Mike Carey.

"MC -- I’d love to write her, yeah, but I think any resurrection for Jean would have to be handled with spectacular amounts of caution. She’s almost a character that you CAN’T resurrect now."

[kate-pryde]

Don't be bitter becuase Kitty is dead.

Joss Whedon says Kitty isn't dead.

Who should I believe, you or Joss? :confused:.... I think I'll go with Joss.

[Slung]

I meant that to write that she's almost a character you can't bring back. Sorry. From an uncannyxmen.net interview w/ Mike Carey.

"MC -- I’d love to write her, yeah, but I think any resurrection for Jean would have to be handled with spectacular amounts of caution. She’s almost a character that you CAN’T resurrect now."

Its just the only pressure of "almost a character you can't resurrect" is coming from higher up. Jean's measly two deaths wouldn't be a big deal if they weren't always being promoted as the 57th time she's died by the editor's - and thats mostly Quesada.

[claimtosubclaim]

Its just the only pressure of "almost a character you can't resurrect" is coming from higher up. Jean's measly two deaths wouldn't be a big deal if they weren't always being promoted as the 57th time she's died by the editor's - and thats mostly Quesada.

Believe me, I would love it if Jean came back. And while we know Quesada has pushed for Emma in the past, I just can't imagine that he would say 'not on my watch' if all the X-writers and X-editors got together and hashed out a great story for Jean's return, especially since he's been distracted and obsessed with all this Avengers/Initiative/Secret War/Spider-Man stuff. In fact, who's to say that this story isn't already on the horizon.

[Brent1974]

Joss Whedon says Kitty isn't dead.

Who should I believe, you or Joss? :confused:.... I think I'll go with Joss.

Hope you and Joss are right Kate :D

[Christopher O]

Joss Whedon says Kitty isn't dead.

Who should I believe, you or Joss? :confused:.... I think I'll go with Joss.
Maybe Joss lied, dear. It happens.

[Jake V]

Joss Whedon says Kitty isn't dead.

Not yet. The comic that she dies in hasn't shipped yet.

[darksaint124]

Believe me, I would love it if Jean came back. And while we know Quesada has pushed for Emma in the past, I just can't imagine that he would say 'not on my watch' if all the X-writers and X-editors got together and hashed out a great story for Jean's return, especially since he's been distracted and obsessed with all this Avengers/Initiative/Secret War/Spider-Man stuff. In fact, who's to say that this story isn't already on the horizon.

The funny thing is that Jean isn't even dead right now. Technically she's already "back"

[40yearoldnovafan]

Well, I read an article in the recent Wizard and it talks about what happened with the X-men. They're all kind of going their separate way after Messiah. Scott and Emma are taking a trip somewhere else. So I guess I jumped the gun.

Jimmy

[kate-pryde]

Maybe Joss lied, dear. It happens.

He hasn't before. (And after what happened to poor Steve DeKnight when he lied about Tara's death, I don't think he would considering how nasty that got.)

It's very unlikely that Joss would say on the record, that he never kills strong female characters in response to being begged not to kill Kitty. Nor that Joss would like in a something he said he didn't want posted on the internet. Nor that he would lie to people who had traveled across the country to walk the picket lines with the writers. I've never seen Joss that happy before.

On the other hand, if you remember last summer, the report that a Cable fan read Mike Carey the riot act about killing off Cable at Comic Con, and Mike quietly and off-the-record replied that Cable wasn't dead. It could be a similar situation.

[Brian M.]

Maybe Kitty isn't a strong female character?

[MuhollandDriver]

Actually....he has.

Before the sixth season of Buffy began....during a Q&A session....one question was if Tara dies. He assured us that, despite horrible things happening to Willow and Tara, she was not going anywhere. Nineteen episodes later? Need i even put in a spoiler space?

[Brent1974]

Well I just finished reading Astonishing 1-23 these past few days and the ending to #23 with Kitty as weakened as she was along with her little speach after having fornicated heh with Colossus about taking advantage of what time they have together even in such dire circumstances, because you never know what may happen next, or something like that might have been a little bit of foreshadowing.

But on the other hand the write up for Giant Sized says 'one will not return', does it say the same for #24 as well?? So she might die in either #25 or Giant Sized. So Joss might not be lying when he says she won't die in #24?? But she dies in Giant Sized. I hope she doesnt die, but it is getting grim.

[kate-pryde]

Maybe Kitty isn't a strong female character?

Joss has said countless times that without Kitty, there would be no Buffy. So yes, Joss does consider Kitty a strong female character. Otherwise, he's saying Buffy isn't.

It that does piss me off that Joss is saying Tara's not a strong female character, but this isn't the place for me to rant about Tara's death.


Getting slightly back on topic, during Tom Brevoort's Marvel simulation game on his blog, where fans got the chance to pretend they were running Marvel, the group running the X-books proposed having Emma and Scott get married. Tom's response was:


Emma and Scott's wedding needs to be run by Marvel Studios, to make sure that it doesn't conflict with anything that's being planned out there. Fortunately, with Cyclops having been killed in X3, and Emma not having been in the films yet, they see no difficulty with it.

http://www.marvel.com/blogs/Tom_Brevoort/entry/744


This was just a fantasy game, but this topic came up rather frequently that major events in comics would need to be run by studios.

It makes me wonder how much of what happens is dictated by making the comics, movies and cartoons fit together, since there never seemed to be much of a correlation. But that could be changing, since now there are things like Emma essentially replacing Jean in the Wolverine and the X-Men cartoon.

While there aren't any plans for an actual X4 movie, Ellen Page has said she is under contract to play Kitty in two more movies, and she has become a breakout star following her leading role in the Fox film, Juno. Kitty is in several non-continuity books (like the new Wolvie First Class, New Exiles, Ultimate, etc), but it does seem like she is getting a push to be an A-List level Marvel character. There's always been speculation that Joss would do an X-Movie, Kitty Pryde and Wolverine the Movie wouldn't be a bad idea (Hugh Jackman, Ellen Page starring, Fox would greenlight that). Assuming that character deaths need to be run by the studio, then would Kitty's even be allowed, with a nearly A-List actress still under contract to play her?

[darksaint124]

Well I just finished reading Astonishing 1-23 these past few days and the ending to #23 with Kitty as weakened as she was along with her little speach after having fornicated heh with Colossus about taking advantage of what time they have together even in such dire circumstances, because you never know what may happen next, or something like that might have been a little bit of foreshadowing.

But on the other hand the write up for Giant Sized says 'one will not return', does it say the same for #24 as well?? So she might die in either #25 or Giant Sized. So Joss might not be lying when he says she won't die in #24?? But she dies in Giant Sized. I hope she doesnt die, but it is getting grim.

Anyone else notice that it's taking 4 years for Astonishing to finally wrap up. If it comes out on time.

[Brent1974]

While there aren't any plans for an actual X4 movie, Ellen Page has said she is under contract to play Kitty in two more movies, and she has become a breakout star following her leading role in the Fox film, Juno. Kitty is in several non-continuity books (like the new Wolvie First Class, New Exiles, Ultimate, etc), but it does seem like she is getting a push to be an A-List level Marvel character. There's always been speculation that Joss would do an X-Movie, Kitty Pryde and Wolverine the Movie wouldn't be a bad idea (Hugh Jackman, Ellen Page starring, Fox would greenlight that). Assuming that character deaths need to be run by the studio, then would Kitty's even be allowed, with a nearly A-List actress still under contract to play her?

Also, not to mention the new cartoon coming out Wolverine and the X-Men, kitty is in that as well. It just seems so weird for them to be killing her in the mainstream comics if she is in other areas.

Anyone else notice that it's taking 4 years for Astonishing to finally wrap up. If it comes out on time.

And even if #24 comes out on time we still have what was originally going to be the 25th and final issue Giant Sized #1 with no date, I just checked Marvel.com and unless I missed it. It isn't due in Feb or March :(

[kate-pryde]

Actually....he has.

Before the sixth season of Buffy began....during a Q&A session....one question was if Tara dies. He assured us that, despite horrible things happening to Willow and Tara, she was not going anywhere. Nineteen episodes later? Need i even put in a spoiler space?

Yes, but Tara wasn't going anywhere. Joss never said she wasn't going to die. (Although, Steven DeKnight directly said she wasn't, and he seems to really regrets that. I've seen him getting absolutely flayed alive by angry, angry Kittens at fan events)

In the Jossverse, there's a saying that actors work more after their characters die. Take Fred or Darla as an example. Fred died, and Amy returned as Illyria. Darla's role became bigger after she died. It's not always true, but most of the time that has to do with the actors.

Exactly what Joss said was, "...one post from a gay or questioning teen saying the show helped them is worth six hundred hate letters...Here's the word: Tara's not gonna disappear. She's part of the show, part of Willow's life."

The plan wasn't for Tara to disappear. But Amber Benson refused to come back. The writers (not necessarily Joss, BtVS had a large writing staff and at this point Marti Noxon was the showrunner) wanted Tara to haunt Willow (starting with the episode, Conversations with Dead People). And Amber wasn't going to do that. It all has to do with the reaction to Tara's death, and how many saw it as another example of the Dead Lesbian Cliché, and that if Tara returned as an evil spirit, that some would take that to mean that there was something evil about her and her relationship with Willow.

Joss also said that there were also plans to bring Tara back to life (after Buffy got one life-altering wish) at the end of Season 7, but again, they couldn't get Amber.

This should all probably go on the Kitty thread, but for the non-Buffy fans on here, during Season 6 of Buffy, the hype during the whole season was this "Big Scooby Death" aka the BSD, and the potential that one of the core Scoobies was going to get killed off. It ended up to be Tara, who really wasn't even a Scooby, which was the easiest out for Joss and got him to do horrible things to Willow (his favorite character) which gave Aly Hannigan fun things to do (It's pretty obvious that Aly's Joss' favorite member of the Buffy cast, btw). And the intention wasn't to write out Amber, but bring her back in a big way in Season 7. So, equating this to X-books, it's like hyping one of the Astonishing team is going to die, then killing Brand and immediately bringing her back since actors aren't involved and they can't decide not to come back.

[Omega Alpha]

Also, not to mention the new cartoon coming out Wolverine and the X-Men, kitty is in that as well. It just seems so weird for them to be killing her in the mainstream comics if she is in other areas.


Jean Grey appeared in The Last Stand and is still dead...

[Christopher O]

He hasn't before. (And after what happened to poor Steve DeKnight when he lied about Tara's death, I don't think he would considering how nasty that got.)

It's very unlikely that Joss would say on the record, that he never kills strong female characters in response to being begged not to kill Kitty. Nor that Joss would like in a something he said he didn't want posted on the internet. Nor that he would lie to people who had traveled across the country to walk the picket lines with the writers. I've never seen Joss that happy before.
I imagine Joss would be willing to lie to maintain the integrity of his story. In fact, I would expect it. Who gives away the big ending???

It could be a similar situation.
Don't hold your breath.

[Fire_And_Light]

Okay, they're putting Emma in a children's television show? How, pray tell, are they going to explain that? I absolutely would not want my kid to watch something with a character like that. :eek:

I just have to say that.

[Omega Alpha]

Okay, they're putting Emma in a children's television show? How, pray tell, are they going to explain that? I absolutely would not want my kid to watch something with a character like that. :eek:

I just have to say that.

So, if she didn't appeared, you would have no problem on your kid watching the show of a guy that has killed hundreds or thousands and defeats all his enemies by stabbing them to death, more often than not in a slow and painful way, while they scream in pain?

[Brent1974]

Okay, they're putting Emma in a children's television show? How, pray tell, are they going to explain that? I absolutely would not want my kid to watch something with a character like that. :eek:

I just have to say that.


She is going to be in Wolverine and the X-Men? More than likely her outfit will be changed drasticly.

[CaptainCanada]

She is going to be in Wolverine and the X-Men? More than likely her outfit will be changed drasticly.
No, we've seen it in previews, and it's basically her AXM costume.

[Fire_And_Light]

Mmm, it pains me to say it, but I probably wouldn't allow them to watch it, fullstop, if it was about Wolverine being a killing machine. Past cartoons side-stepped that issue, but if it was featured prominently, I would give it a pass for the halfpints.

I pretty much don't think the current X-books are kid-friend (which is okay), and don't think they would make an appropriate cartoon that was genuinely aimed at children, vs. teens/young adults.

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Oh, great, the Kitty crusade reborn? :D

[creaky]

No, we've seen it in previews, and it's basically her AXM costume.

Her AXM costume isn't very controversial - female characters have worn much more daring outfits than that in children's cartoons before and if they can tone Wolverine's killing tendencies down - which is basically what Wolverine is about in the first place - keeping Emma G-rated shouldn't be much of a problem.

[flapjaxx]

Anyone else notice that it's taking 4 years for Astonishing to finally wrap up. If it comes out on time.

Hadn't noticed. But I have noticed how good of a series it is.

[Phil Hunn]

Jean Grey appeared in The Last Stand and is still dead...

So by that logic, Blockbuster could crush Emma's head to paste in the comics and she'd still end up on screen anyway? Meaning that since I have no intention of watching that toon, I'd be free of the cackling harpy?

W00t! :D

Hadn't noticed. But I have noticed how good of a series it is.

If it came out on time, it would be merely competent. With the scheduling as it is, it looks inept and pointless. And drowning in syrupy nostalgia.

[rZi]

So, if she didn't appeared, you would have no problem on your kid watching the show of a guy that has killed hundreds or thousands and defeats all his enemies by stabbing them to death, more often than not in a slow and painful way, while they scream in pain?

Quoted for truth.

[icareenuffforII]

Okay, they're putting Emma in a children's television show? How, pray tell, are they going to explain that? I absolutely would not want my kid to watch something with a character like that. :eek:

I just have to say that.

Like what exactly? Since when are cartoon versions of the Xmen ever exactly like the comic books?

There's no way that she's going to be as sexual as she is in the comics. If anything she'll fullfill Jean and Xavier's roles as the telepath and Headmistress of the school (if the school even plays into the show).

Children are exposed to things like Lindsay Lohan, Britney Spears, Jaime Lynn Spears, and Paris Hilton....Emma Frost by comparison is the least of your worries.

It's like that SouthPark "stupid spoiled whore video play kit"

[claimtosubclaim]

Like what exactly? Since when are cartoon versions of the Xmen ever exactly like the comic books?

There's no way that she's going to be as sexual as she is in the comics. If anything she'll fullfill Jean and Xavier's roles as the telepath and Headmistress of the school (if the school even plays into the show).

Children are exposed to things like Lindsay Lohan, Britney Spears, Jaime Lynn Spears, and Paris Hilton....Emma Frost by comparison is the least of your worries.

It's like that SouthPark "stupid spoiled whore video play kit"

Not to mention, Emma's been faithful in a monogamous relationship for years now. Iceman is the one sleeping with one of his closest female friend's MILF who also happens to be a murderous psychopathic villain. For Rachel, 'no' means 'yes'. And so on.

[rZi]

Not to mention, Emma's been faithful in a monogamous relationship for years now. Iceman is the one sleeping with one of his closest female friend's MILF who also happens to be a murderous psychopathic villain. For Rachel, 'no' means 'yes'. And so on.

You know in all my years ive been reading X-men ive never heard anyone refer to mystique as a milf

[claimtosubclaim]

You know in all my years ive been reading X-men ive never heard anyone refer to mystique as a milf

I don't think anyone has. It just seemed relevant to the situation. There's a first time for everything (and hopefully last. I don't particularly relish that term.)

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

I don't think anyone has. It just seemed relevant to the situation. There's a first time for everything (and hopefully last. I don't particularly relish that term.)

Well, folks most likely refer to her as a Mother I'd Like to KILL, but, yeah, one might guess why it wouldn't be such a glorious acronym... :eek:

[icareenuffforII]

I think she's more like a LILTT

Lesbian I'd like to turn :D

[Phil Hunn]

I think she's more like a LILTT

Lesbian I'd like to turn :D

You sure about that? She'd probably castrate you if you weren't up to scratch, after all ;)

[Mwahaha]

I think she's more like a LILTT

Lesbian I'd like to turn :D

Yum.
:evilsmile

[worstblogever]

I don't think anyone has. It just seemed relevant to the situation. There's a first time for everything (and hopefully last. I don't particularly relish that term.)

Actually, I gotta admit my reaction to "Bizarre Love Triangle" was...

"Huh. I never thought about it before, but technichally, Mystique would be a MILF, wouldn't she?"

[claimtosubclaim]

Actually, I gotta admit my reaction to "Bizarre Love Triangle" was...

"Huh. I never thought about it before, but technichally, Mystique would be a MILF, wouldn't she?"

She's supposed to look *much* younger than she is, like late 20s or 30s. I'm not exactly sure though.

[Phil Hunn]

Actually, I gotta admit my reaction to "Bizarre Love Triangle" was...

"Huh. I never thought about it before, but technichally, Mystique would be a MILF, wouldn't she?"

More like a GILF, considering she actually said (during Milligan's run) that she was in her 80s...