Worst Comics Or Comics-related Stuff In 2007? [Archive]

Agent Helix

12-19-2007, 05:35 AM

World War Hulk.

This could've been a return to just big, fun crossovers, but no. It's a miserable, incoherent collection of action scenes and horrible characterization, fairly indicative of the direction main-title superhero comics are taking as a whole right now, unfortunately.

Also, I'd like to hear the rationalization for Tony having some anti-Hulk satellite laser, but waiting until issue 5 to use it.

"Listen pal, do you have any idea how many fuckin' satellites I've got up there? You're lucky I don't nuke Omaha by accident every time I turn on my TV."

Alan Lynch

12-19-2007, 06:06 AM

One More Day. Billed as groundbreaking, but all it appears to be is Joe Quesada's attempt to piss off anyone who ever enjoyed Spider-Man. So bad JMS wanted his name taken off the books; take the fucking hint Joe. Please.

The difficulty us Brits have in getting hold of The Black Dossier is a real tragedy though. I've been given one link, but it came the week before payday so I missed out. Bastards.

Pink Bat Max

12-19-2007, 06:16 AM

Did Civil War conclude this year? 'Cause then, that.

Also, 'He was a skrull all along!'

Agent Helix

12-19-2007, 06:19 AM

No way, Skrulls are awesome. I think everyone in the Marvel Universe should turn out to be a Skrull, and then Bob Newhart wakes up.

Pink Bat Max

12-19-2007, 06:24 AM

The continued degredation of the Marvel Family, specifically Trials of Shazam, and also the Black Mary Marvel.

KevinTBrown

12-19-2007, 06:25 AM

1) It's pretty much everything Marvel did and is doing. They may be making money hand over fist, but that doesn't make it good, IMO.

2) DC's tendency for using death as "shock value". WAY too much of it. Not only in killing off characters "just 'cause", but in how they're doing it. It's no longer shocking or even a useful "tool" to move the story in a different direction. It's old and tired. The reaction they get from me now is not "OMG!", instead it's "sheesh, again?!?". Time for it to stop. Period.

Cam63

12-19-2007, 06:28 AM

Yup. Stupid " deaths " get my goat too.

Marvel's fucked up pretty bad this year.

Agent Helix

12-19-2007, 06:29 AM

I'd say both the Big Two's main superhero lines are more or less equally shit this past year.

TCJohnson

12-19-2007, 06:29 AM

The first six months of DC. They are trying to tie everything together and doing a really miserable job with it.

Top of the list is Countdown and Amazon's Attack, with Meltzer's Justice League. With Booster Gold, Gail's Wonder Woman and McDuffie's JLA, things are finally beginning to shape up...but man, took them long enough.

the4thpip

12-19-2007, 06:47 AM

Yeah, I would go with many issues of Countdown (one of the writers, who I shall not name here, seems to be worse than the others). And Amashlocks Ashlock, obviously.

JeffreyWKramer

12-19-2007, 06:53 AM

I've tried to avoid the most obviously awful stuff whenever possible, and since I've not seen some of the things already listed - "One More Day", for example - I seem to have succeeded to some degree. That being said, a lot of what I have seen has been pretty horrid.

Meltzer's JLA - It was sort of like a train wreck - you knew it was going to be awful, but you couldn't help looking anyhow, and then immediately wished you'd been able to resist.

As others have noted, the constant death/apparent death ploy, especially as used by DC, and particularly by Winnick. And really, everything I've seen from Winnick of late has been ludicrously bad.

What little I saw of COUNTDOWN was mostly either stupid or incomprehensible.

WW HULK wasn't so much awful as just disappointing. A big slugfest could have been sort of fun, if the pacing wasn't tedious and much of what happened didn't make the least bit of sense. Plus once again a bunch of tedious tie-ins, including yet another dreadful FRONTLINE book.

AMAZONS ATTACK has perhaps set a new low as far as dreadfully bad "event" comics. That one can best be filed as "What were they using?"

DavidAllred

12-19-2007, 06:58 AM

Biggest screw-ups in order of travesty:

1. Amazon Attacks
2. Green Arrow #75 and the rape of Dinah's mouth
3. The schizophrenia that was everything Flash & Flash FMA related in 2007

jerrymcl89

12-19-2007, 07:07 AM

Amazons Attack really was awful (Bees... my god).

Winick's Titans East snuff-fest was also pretty dreadful.

AllisterH

12-19-2007, 07:46 AM

Amazon Attacks

Why oh why did this get greenlighted? From start to finish, this was just plain BAD and the effects are STILL happening.

Civil War and World War Hulk
I lumped these two together as they suffered from the same problem. Great ideas, shows scenes of brilliance but the actual conclusion? So disappointing (Hulk being lasered while Cap being pulled off by the citizens. Talk about "Why the hell didn't this happen earlier?" scene)

One More Day
Just say NO.

The relaunce clusterfucks with Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Flash
What a way to screw the pooch. The perfect time to get new readers interested in these characters and DC just blew it.

The Beast Of Yucca Flats

12-19-2007, 07:50 AM

The needless death of Bart Allen.

MacQuarrie

12-19-2007, 07:51 AM

At DC, pretty much everything Gail didn't write goes on this list, with only a few exceptions.

At Marvel, everything but Power Pack and Spider-Girl.

More specifically, all the big events and crossover stories at both companies are absolute garbage.

But the single worst thing about comics in 2007? Not enough Astro City.

AllisterH

12-19-2007, 08:03 AM

Alan Lynch

12-19-2007, 08:06 AM

But the single worst thing about comics in 2007? Not enough Astro City.
I keep forgetting about this, what with the schedule being like it is. I'm fairly new to the series, but what I've read has been excellent.

DarkCrisis

12-19-2007, 08:25 AM

Black Mary Marvel (and pretty much all of CD)

Amazons Attack

One More Day

As for WWHulk and the anti-hulk laser. They couldn't use it until the spaceship was taken out. In one of the issues it mentions the ship controls or blacks out all of earths sattelites.

Infra-Man

12-19-2007, 08:33 AM

Gosh... I guess Countdown takes it for being subpar a lot of the time and being nowhere near as engrossing or good as 52. All those promises of the book being the spine of the DC has led me to believe that Countdown has a bad case of scoliosis.

I'll put in another vote for The Flash books, given that the post-IC stories have featured some really bad ideas and seemingly haphazard execution. I kept hearing that the stuff with The Flash was planned out since the beginning, but it just doesn't read like that.

Sad to say it, but I'll add JLA to the mix since we're 15 issues in and it still feels pretty bland. I guess it's one of the worst of 2007 since--regardless whether Meltzer or McDuffie is at the helm--the exploits of DC's premier superteam have been merely adequate at best.

And the biggie, delayed books. You got them at any company, but the gripe is against delays that throw everything off.

Infra-Man

12-19-2007, 08:34 AM

At Marvel, everything but Power Pack and Spider-Girl.

The Immortal Iron Fist and Omega the Unknown would like a word with you :)

Johnny_Luck

12-19-2007, 08:43 AM

I have to say I really liked Meltzer building up the JLA rather then just throwing them together and saying hey you know who they are screw build up lets toss you right into the action, which seems what a lot of people wanted.

However it was Hampered in the end by a horrid lightning saga which brought back a flash not needed on the JLA. I mean we say Dawnstar and all but still.

The Horrid downward Spiral supergirl has taken since Churchill left followed by Kelly. Issues 19-24 have just screwed up the character when rogues, clear stories, and a good origin were the problem, none of which have been ever addressed though people keep bringing down the character trying to make her superman in a skirt.

Sensational Spider-man gearing up to be canceled it was easily the best spider book and when Chen was on art the art was awesome as well.)

The Horrid Use of Wildcat and Stargirl in the JSA, Thunder in the B&TO, Supergirl getting bangs over straight hair, etc.

Rattlehead

12-19-2007, 08:47 AM

Amazon's Attack

What did this even accomplish? This damn thing destroyed half of Washington DC, and yet the rest of the DCU hasn't even acknowledged it. Even groups like the JLA, and JSA, who played a big part in it, act like nothing ever happened. I had no problems with the idea of the Amazon's being controlled by an evil force, but copping out and saying Granny Goodness achieved this by beating the entire pantheon of Gods? Sheesh, what were they thinking?

One More Day/Weekly Amazing Spider-Man

We lose the two good quality Spider-Man books in favor of a weekly title that's already being cut down at the knees by editorially-mandated crap. Note to Marvel: You can't use dying Aunt May as a plot device to springboard a supposed major event anymore. She would want Peter to let her pass along peacefully, she's had a full life. Doing anything otherwise is making everyone involved act out of character.

The Lightning Saga

I don't even know what this was supposed to be. I'm a comic book nerd through and through, and this damn thing even lost me with it's obsure, and I mean obscure, continuity wanking. Which leads me to...

The Flash relaunch

What a massive, massive letdown. Mark Waid's return fell flat on it's face. I don't have a problem with Wally having a family, but yuck, yuck, yuck. He was marginalized in his own book so we could get a closer look at two children that are walking cliches. They have no real sense of personality, just tired sit-com kid personalities we've all seen a million times before.

Wildstorm

Great titles got ignored and cancelled because everyone was too busy whining about The Authority and the WildCATS being MIA to give anything else a chance.

Rattlehead

12-19-2007, 08:52 AM

I have to say I really liked Meltzer building up the JLA rather then just throwing them together and saying hey you know who they are screw build up lets toss you right into the action, which seems what a lot of people wanted.

Buildning up the team was fine. The problem was he never stopped building them up and he never got on with the damn story. Plus, the team literally put itself together while The Trinity sat around a table talking about old times. Nothing happened in his book. Moniter Duty was the worst offender, as everyone talked and talked, Roy and Hawkgirl screwed, and then an alarm goes off to end the issue. What was the damn point?

Johnny_Luck

12-19-2007, 09:07 AM

Buildning up the team was fine. The problem was he never stopped building them up and he never got on with the damn story. Plus, the team literally put itself together while The Trinity sat around a table talking about old times. Nothing happened in his book. Moniter Duty was the worst offender, as everyone talked and talked, Roy and Hawkgirl screwed, and then an alarm goes off to end the issue. What was the damn point?

I disagree. I think that issue #4 was when the story started to become clear and the action picked up pretty well for the rest of the arc. Just because he spent 3 1/2 issues building up who these people were, why they were there and such doesn't mean he never went on. I thought it was well done.

Also Monitor duty might not be a heavy action packed story but it was also a really enjoyable issue IMHO, probably one of the top 20 or 25 issues of 2007). I liked the characterization and it also came after a heavy action packed with little character build Lightning Saga as well as an action survival red arrow story. Its not like it followed right after the 6 issue arc that split up character and the ction issues around 50/50.

Rattlehead

12-19-2007, 09:15 AM

I disagree. I think that issue #4 was when the story started to become clear and the action picked up pretty well for the rest of the arc. Just because he spent 3 1/2 issues building up who these people were, why they were there and such doesn't mean he never went on. I thought it was well done.

Also Monitor duty might not be a heavy action packed story but it was also a really enjoyable issue IMHO, probably one of the top 20 or 25 issues of 2007). I liked the characterization and it also came after a heavy action packed with little character build Lightning Saga as well as an action survival red arrow story. Its not like it followed right after the 6 issue arc that split up character and the ction issues around 50/50.

It's the Justice League. People expect action-packed stories with that name being on the banner. I liked the way Brad made the characters talk and relate to one another sure. People that have been working together and saving each other's skin as many times as the JLA have would be good friends. I agree with his thoughts on the League. But he could have easily had the team firmly put together by Issue #2, as he also had a #0 issue to work with. Smart Grundy was kind of cool, but his motivations for being in the story was a little hackneyed. Meltzer had some good ideas, but you can't have people just sitting around talking and doing training exercises in a book like Justice League.

KevinTBrown

12-19-2007, 09:20 AM

Annnnnd... getting back to what everybody else didn't like now. ;)

DarkCrisis

12-19-2007, 10:26 AM

Oh yea, Supergirl has been crap. I think only a hand fullof issues out of the whole series have been worth anything.

Gave up Linda for THIS. Sigh.

I wanted Kara back, but not like this!

ducklord

12-19-2007, 11:26 AM

Amazon Attacks
At least War of the Gods had some weirdly entertaining crossovers.

One More Day*
Potentially as franchise-hobbling as "You've Been Reading About a Clone for the last 15 Years."

*I will GLADLY retract this if it turns out that Joey Q is pulling a MASSIVE bait-n-switch on the whole "retconning the marriage" thing.

Countdown Creep
I could probably tolerate Countdown's mediocrity a little better if it wasn't spreading into umpteen mini-series, crossovers, and specials. DC's spine is weaker than (spins the wheel of "spine" jokes)... a congressional Democrat's.

OYL Relaunch Fusterclucks
The fact that Aquaman's relaunch didn't take was somewhat expected (it's HARD to get him to sell), but how do you mess up Flash? Or Wonder Woman?

Egregiously Late Books
It's not the end of the world, but seriously, what the hell?

The DC Death Factory
You know one of the reasons that the Sinestro War rocked? 'Cause there were virtually no "shocking" violent deaths of established can(n)on fodder characters. Okay, Risk's other arm got ripped off, but hey, that's just funny.

Sorry for the retreads,
Mike

LewisH

12-19-2007, 11:52 AM

It comics so hate just doesn't even apply.

There were some stories and titles that failed to entertain me and some
fictional incidents I didn't care for as a reader but these things change and
theres' new books every week. Ok, disclaimer over.

1) Spiderman - One More Day - It's not so much the direction they chose
or the method they chose to get there but the fact that they thought
I should buy a 5 issue, decompressed poorly written static crossover
to get there. I don't care if Spiderman is married, single, rich, or poor
I've been through stories of his aunt dying, his baby dying, his clones
dying, the woman he loves dying, his best friend betraying him and
dying etc, etc, I just don't want to be bored and One More Day was
a boring story.

2) The attack on Tigra in New Avengers - It's not so much that it's another
assault on a superheroine but that it's one more incident of ANYONE
in any fiction not saying fuck you when they try to pull the hostage
crap and ripping their spleen out or just getting a hold of
Punisher and telling him to clean up the mess once and for all.
Here's the answer to that kind of bas, if my family is your hostage then
you are my hostage anything happens to them and you'll
experience things
that make Hostel look like an old ladies tea party. You had better kill
me right now or they'll be finding pieces of you in orbit for the next
50 years. We'll never see that scene though. At least Keyser Soze
pulled it off in the movies (although he had to kill his own family first)

3) Marvel Illuminati - The Beyonder is a mutant Inhuman? Give me a break.
When something is FUBAR already don't jump in and make it worse.
The Beyonder was a plot device that turned into a bad character that
had happily floated into comic book limbo. Why bring it back?

4) Cankles - Yes the average teen has a weight problem these days. That
doesn't mean we want to see Supergirl having one, esp when there
are so many artists that can draw her so attractively. And it doesn't
matter what length the skirt is or whether the midriff is bare or covered. I just don't want to see cankles.

5) Skrulls - Somehow they think that blaming a bunch of out of character
writing on Skrulls is going to bring back fans who bailed out over some
of the more objectionable results of Civil War. It's like I said about.
When something is FUBAR don't make it worse. Of course these are
writers and artists not engineers. I guess they think Murphy's Laws
don't apply to them. If they did, maybe they wouldn't have so many
late books.

king mob

12-19-2007, 12:31 PM

I'd say both the Big Two's main superhero lines are more or less equally shit this past year.

Yup, I'm agreeing with that in a big way. I'd like to single DC out for the ongoing Identity/Infinite/Countdown/Final Crisis bollocks, as it's a perfect example why most superhero comics are a big bag of shite these days.

Hodge

12-19-2007, 02:49 PM

You guys know I prefer to keep things positive here, but this one time (please avoid excessive creator bashing. We're really not that kind of board), let's hear your votes for the worst books, and the worst things about comics, to happen in 2007.

Beware all ye who enter here. Someone will doubtlessly hate the stuff you love most, so please try to respect the opinions of others and not be douchenozzles.

Thank you!

Gail

Worse thing sbout comics? Easy the delays.

Certain books almost 6 months late. The piss has definately been taken

I'm not picking on just creators, editoral need to shoulder a lot for either throwing creative teams in the deep end or not cracking the whip.

And not once have I actually heard or read the word "Sorry".

MartinRedmond

12-19-2007, 03:54 PM

I feel that comic writers are way too similar. I have a hard time telling writers apart.

Evan Waters

12-19-2007, 03:55 PM

Barda's death. In a year of pointless shocks, this was the most banal of them all.

Michael P

12-19-2007, 05:48 PM

The Green Arrow/Black Canary Wedding. What ought to have been a decent, self-contained semi-event instead spawned not one, but two, completely botched stories. And one of them in DC's top-selling book.

Cam63

12-19-2007, 05:51 PM

Thank beer for Amanda Connor's art.

DaeJi

12-19-2007, 06:02 PM

Just about everything DC is doing. It's the good stuff they are doing that seem to be the expection.

World War Hulk. When a story can't even make up it's own damn mind about the characters, there's a problem.

Amadeus Cho. 'Nuff said.

The vast inconsistency in Tony Stark's protrayals. Everytime JMS or Slott or Jerkins writes him I die a little inside.

DC taking too long to put Gail on Wonder Woman. Love ya girl!

Marvel waiting too long to put Gage on anything.

Moondragon turning into an actual dragon. Lesbain bestality relationships are just way too weird.

The way they are going about ruining Spider-Man.

Black Panther. There's bad writing, there's horrid writing, and then's there's Black Panther quality writing.

The Hood beatdown of Tigra.

I would list more, but my blood pressure can't handle it.

DungeonmasterJim

12-19-2007, 06:14 PM

The promotion of big name writers coming to comics and then something happens to delay the book incessantly.

I no longer regularly buy into the 'take our time to get it right' or whatever excuse the company uses to cover whichever creator's mucking everything up in the creation process.

DM Jim

BnL

12-19-2007, 06:30 PM

Amazons Attack.

Do I even need to elaborate?

Corrina

12-19-2007, 06:36 PM

Taking Black Canary out of Birds of Prey to shoehorn into an insipid marriage issue with a really dumb cliffhanger, only to stay in another series that is setting up yet another really dumb cliffhanger.

I love Black Canary & Green Arrow together but this...? I've changed my mind. Dinah should declare her true love for Babs and vice versa and they should go back to crime fighting together because they have more chemistry and are more fun as a couple than anything written between BC & GA in the last two years.

And, plus, booooo!!!!!!!!!!!! DC for putting Cliff Chiang on a book that I don't like. Stop that! And put him on a book where I can enjoy the pretty, pretty pictures.

wishlish

12-19-2007, 09:03 PM

Amazing how most of these terrible comics sold like crazy.

And you bought them all.

Shame on you! Stop buying sucky comics. Then everything will be better.

And how do no one name Ultimates 3? Seriously?

Evan Waters

12-19-2007, 09:06 PM

=
4) Cankles - Yes the average teen has a weight problem these days. That
doesn't mean we want to see Supergirl having one, esp when there
are so many artists that can draw her so attractively. And it doesn't
matter what length the skirt is or whether the midriff is bare or covered. I just don't want to see cankles.

Right, because teenage girls should be told that they should always be thin. And God forbid we have a variety of body types in our female superheroes. :mad:

d newton

12-19-2007, 09:20 PM

Amazons Attack really was awful (Bees... my god).
I can think of worse lines & events than this one - "Do you have MySpace?" & Death of the New Gods, anyone. ;)

The Beast Of Yucca Flats

12-19-2007, 09:23 PM

And how do no one name Ultimates 3? Seriously?

Looked through that one in the store (just as I did Ultimates 1 & 2), as well as again on Scans_Daily.

Why won't the gentleman who did Superman For All Seasons come back to us?

Johnny_Luck

12-19-2007, 09:55 PM

Barda's death. In a year of pointless shocks, this was the most banal of them all.

Ehh.Maybe, but I say Knockouts death was just as ridiculous if not more so.

Oh and the total destruction of the Secret Six has to be up there with worst things to happen to DC.

Thank beer for Amanda Connor's art.

Amanda Conner is probably one of the only few cartoony as hell artists that are really good and enjoyable out there. That being said shes good in doses one issue every 4 to 6 months I definately would grow tired or it sooner rather than later.

Right, because teenage girls should be told that they should always be thin. And God forbid we have a variety of body types in our female superheroes. :mad:

Thats not what was said at all and is not the point either. Renato supergirl was ridiculous because he tried so hard to make her older and wider/thicker looking compared to Churchill just to be the complete opposite rather than whats good on the page.

Sure Teenage girls shouldn't be forced to be pressured into looking super skinny, but superheros should have muscles in their arms and have at least a stomach that is muscled to the point it makes them look like they work out or are fit to be a hero. There not normal teenage girls its ridiculous to compare them to super-heroines. Theres a huge difference between what looks good on page/what should be on the page and whats normal/healthy for teenage girls who are real people and not heroes.

Thus I have to say Churchill leaving supergirl and Renato's supergirl were two of the worst things to happen to her in 07. Garza's was passable but still not that enjoyable.

Evan Waters

12-19-2007, 09:59 PM

Thats not what was said at all and is not the point either. Renato supergirl was ridiculous because he tried so hard to make her older and wider/thicker looking compared to Churchill just to be the complete opposite rather than whats good on the page.

It is the point- comic fanboys have a narrow view of what female superheroines are allowed to look like, and that the Guedes Supergirl gets tagged as "fat" is proof.

glue

12-19-2007, 10:07 PM

I didn't realize it until I saw that All-New Atom is up to 18, but I haven't read a "new" book all year. I guess I'll go with the death of Bart Allen. I don't know how or why he did, but I liked him.

Johnny_Luck

12-19-2007, 10:13 PM

It is the point- comic fanboys have a narrow view of what female superheroines are allowed to look like, and that the Guedes Supergirl gets tagged as "fat" is proof.

Its Because she was Fatter. She wasn't fat in the sense of the word, but she she went from trim with lots of stomach muscle to thick and without any muscle in the stomach area whatsoever. She was so different from what we had been getting, even from Garza who at least had lines showing flatness in the area that people reacted to how much bigger she was compared to previous artists on the book. It didn't help he made her bellyshirt super long and baggy adding the the look that she might have more meat on her than she did.

Not to mention that the way her twisted her sides it made her look thicker than she should have looked.

Renato's supergirl would have been fine design wise if he changed the angles, and let her keep her stomach muscle rather than removing it and didn't screw with the length of the skirt and bellyshirt so much.

There are plenty of different body types for female superheros out there saying there isn;t is silly. You go from Stargirl, to Supergirl, to WW to Huntress to Starfire and theres five pretty decent differences in the way they look.

All in all though his style was a horrid thing for the book. Its probably one of the worst fill in artists of 07 easily.

LewisH

12-20-2007, 07:03 AM

I'm 46 years old. My gf of 23 years is hardly aa thin as a supermodel anymore and I really don't care how teens dress and look in the reall world because I don't look at them. That's not the point.

Superheroes and heroines should be modeled after the aesthetic standards
used by the Greeks for their artwork when portraying gods, goddesses, and
classic heroes. They should be portrayed as at the peak of human physical perfection. Yes most Americans are out of shape and overweight. THAT IS NOT A GOOD THING. All of us should aspire to be as physically fit as possible
Telling kids (or anyone really) it's ok to be fat is bad as it just leads to health problems later in life.

If you have to hurt someone's feelings to get them to be healthy then do it.
I'd rather have an ex-friend who lives to be 100 then a dead friend who died of a heart attack or complications from diabetes before they reached 50. (I've got enough of those already.)

Karen El

12-20-2007, 07:26 AM

And this is why they should let me do Supergirl.

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w62/karen_ellis/supergirl.jpg

Agent Helix

12-20-2007, 07:33 AM

Jared H.

12-20-2007, 07:35 AM

Amazons Attack really was awful (Bees... my god).

Winick's Titans East snuff-fest was also pretty dreadful.

Exactly what I was going to say.

MartinRedmond

12-20-2007, 08:18 AM

Barda's death. In a year of pointless shocks, this was the most banal of them all.

I think people taking a crap on Kirby's work is indeed one of the worst things. Kirby worked hard to create original ideas. He didn't dream of one day working on the Fantastic Four, he created them. And his work wasn't derivative, it was original. He really put of his own into it. 4th World is my favorite work out of him so I always do my best to ignore revivals on purpose.

I read some of the Simonson Orion and liked it but I feel those characters should be left alone altogether if a creator really respects Kirby's work don't revive it. Just reprint Jack's work as is, that's it. I mean, pretty much all his creations have been dug out and crapped on recently: Eternals (shat on twice!), OMAC, 4th World. Yuck. To top it all off none of those creators even have 1% of Jack's sense of grandeur, making it the "best value" version of Mount Everest in the sewers.

Kid Omega

12-20-2007, 08:45 AM

KevinTBrown

12-20-2007, 08:59 AM

Evan Waters

12-20-2007, 10:18 AM

I'm 46 years old. My gf of 23 years is hardly aa thin as a supermodel anymore and I really don't care how teens dress and look in the reall world because I don't look at them. That's not the point.

Superheroes and heroines should be modeled after the aesthetic standards
used by the Greeks for their artwork when portraying gods, goddesses, and
classic heroes. They should be portrayed as at the peak of human physical perfection. Yes most Americans are out of shape and overweight. THAT IS NOT A GOOD THING. All of us should aspire to be as physically fit as possible
Telling kids (or anyone really) it's ok to be fat is bad as it just leads to health problems later in life.

The Guedes Supergirl is not obese, though. She's not the sort of person who will have health problems.

Some people are just naturally stocky, and I don't see why superheroines should be any different. That doesn't mean they're not physically fit, they just have a different body type.

Gail Simone

12-20-2007, 12:00 PM

And this is why they should let me do Supergirl.

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w62/karen_ellis/supergirl.jpg

YES.

Karen, I need to talk to you about sumpin...but I'm not sure I have your email. Can you drop a note to gailcbr@yahoo.com when you get a moment?

Gail

TCJohnson

12-20-2007, 02:06 PM

Pretty much everything that Dan Didio has touched! I can't wait for that man to be kicked out of comicbooks.

Michael P

12-20-2007, 02:17 PM

Superheroes and heroines should be modeled after the aesthetic standards
used by the Greeks for their artwork when portraying gods, goddesses, and
classic heroes.
You ever actually see some Greek art? Their women were hardly stick figures. They had meat on their bones.

Jade_GL

12-20-2007, 02:21 PM

My main complaint this year was not about one particular title, but about a trend that I didn't like. I absolutely hated how every crossover had to seep into almost every title. This is why I liked Sinestro Corps so much. It was pretty much contained in the Green Lantern comics and the one shots. That made it easy to read and it was well put together.

Other crossovers (Countdown, Amazons Attack, WWH) seemed to get into everything and mess everything up. I just got tired of someone telling me I needed to read X to understand the miniseries. Amazons Attack was telling me to read Teen Titans which I have never been a fan of and don't really want me to start reading (I liked Young Justice...) So that wore on my nerves after a while.

Anyway, that's my big gripe with this year.

JKCarrier

12-20-2007, 02:54 PM

Superheroes and heroines should be modeled after the aesthetic standards
used by the Greeks for their artwork when portraying gods, goddesses, and
classic heroes.

Excellent idea:

http://cache.eb.com/eb/image?id=38017&rendTypeId=4
http://gallery.plogmann.net/images/1m6577ba064f7bd5fa4d99a01f738ea470.jpg
http://www.theoi.com/image/S21.1Kharites.jpg

Tyr

12-20-2007, 03:00 PM

Just about everything DC is doing. I love the DC universe, but Wonder Woman is the only DC book that is currently on my pull list, and I just got back on with Simone's run. I have thought about picking up JSA and Batman but I'm still on the fence about those too.

Marvel isn't much better, I don't like the New Avengers, I'm not looking forward to the Skrull invasion at all, I don't like what they've done to She-hulk, but I still have Thor and Captain America on my pull list, and loving every minute of them. Also, Bendis some how managed to suck me into Mighty Avengers. Although these three books have a habit of being late.

Edit Add on:

Oh yeah, all that and Gail using Bendis and Wolverine as examples of asexual behavior, when did you stop loving me Gail? :(

Pink Bat Max

12-20-2007, 03:03 PM

And this is why they should let me do Supergirl.

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w62/karen_ellis/supergirl.jpg

I'd buy that book.

Tyr

12-20-2007, 03:09 PM

I'd buy that book.

I'd be tempted but I would have to see Karen's Powergirl first. :)

Michael P

12-20-2007, 04:11 PM

Excellent idea:

http://cache.eb.com/eb/image?id=38017&rendTypeId=4
http://gallery.plogmann.net/images/1m6577ba064f7bd5fa4d99a01f738ea470.jpg
http://www.theoi.com/image/S21.1Kharites.jpg

Thank you. I was going to do this when I got home from work.

For comparison purposes, here is Renato's Supergirl:
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/3041/supergirlguedes3wh2.jpg

Your homework, class: 500 words on the differences and similarities here.

For extra credit, compare and contrast this image:

http://hqmaniacs.uol.com.br/img/noticia/SupergirlGuedes4.jpg

With the Leaning Aphrodite:

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Leaning_Aphrodite_Louvre_Ma414.jpg

Paying particular attention to the use of drapery folds.

Erik Burnham

12-20-2007, 05:49 PM

I was in the bookstore.

Two little kids were going to look at the comics.

Their (grandmother?) stopped them, nearly swatting the books out of their hands.

"Those aren't for children," she said.

More than anything else, the fact that she said that and the fact that, for the most part, she wasn't far wrong... well, it sucked.

I think superhero comics, dammit, should be all ages. (The good kind of all ages.)

Paging Tom Stillwell.

Michael P

12-20-2007, 05:51 PM

Erik Burnham

12-20-2007, 05:55 PM

You'll forgive me if my memory is hazy, but the little girl was going for "Supergirl" for sure.

The boy I can't recall. I'm going to guess an X-Men title, but do concede it may have been something else.

Supergirl, though, I'm sure of.

Jade_GL

12-20-2007, 06:00 PM

Excellent idea:

http://cache.eb.com/eb/image?id=38017&rendTypeId=4
http://gallery.plogmann.net/images/1m6577ba064f7bd5fa4d99a01f738ea470.jpg
http://www.theoi.com/image/S21.1Kharites.jpg

That was exactly what I thought of. :)

I like how Supergirl has been drawn recently. She looks *shock* real but also attractive.

Cam63

12-20-2007, 07:01 PM

I'd buy that book.

So would I.

Karen's becoming one of my favourite artists.

Cam63

12-20-2007, 07:04 PM

Thank you. I was going to do this when I got home from work.

For comparison purposes, here is Renato's Supergirl:
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/3041/supergirlguedes3wh2.jpg

Your homework, class: 500 words on the differences and similarities here.

For extra credit, compare and contrast this image:

http://hqmaniacs.uol.com.br/img/noticia/SupergirlGuedes4.jpg

Nice work. Me like !

With the Leaning Aphrodite:

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Leaning_Aphrodite_Louvre_Ma414.jpg

Did they ever catch the killer ?

GRANT!

12-20-2007, 09:11 PM

There was so much good stuff this year, across the board, that the bad stuff was easy to ignore.

I can't even think of something I care enough to type about. Most of the bad stuff was pretty inconsequential.

Seems kind of petty to bitch about Ultimates 3 when I read something so awesome like Shortcomings the same day.

jerrymcl89

12-20-2007, 09:57 PM

MacQuarrie

12-20-2007, 11:10 PM

The Immortal Iron Fist and Omega the Unknown would like a word with you :)
If Gerber's not writing it, it's not Omega.

MacQuarrie

12-20-2007, 11:14 PM

Superheroes and heroines should be modeled after the aesthetic standards
used by the Greeks for their artwork when portraying gods, goddesses, and
classic heroes. They should be portrayed as at the peak of human physical perfection. Yes most Americans are out of shape and overweight. THAT IS NOT A GOOD THING. All of us should aspire to be as physically fit as possible
Telling kids (or anyone really) it's ok to be fat is bad as it just leads to health problems later in life.
The greco-roman examples look as if they have internal organs. The scarecrow-with-boobs that the comics keep portrayi8ng does not.

Michael P

12-21-2007, 04:47 AM

If Gerber's not writing it, it's not Omega.

Well, Not Omega The Unknown is a pretty darn good comic.

Kid Omega

12-21-2007, 05:44 AM

Well, Not Omega The Unknown is a pretty darn good comic.

Yes it is.

I guess he didn't win that MacArthur genius Grant for nuthin.

(By the by, Mike- have you read GUN WITH OCCASIONAL MUSIC?)

Kid Omega

12-21-2007, 05:56 AM

Seems kind of petty to bitch about Ultimates 3 when I read something so awesome like Shortcomings the same day.

No kidding.

All the Countdown nonsense is pretty inconsequential when an oversized book of POPEYE reprints, or the FOURTH WORLD OMNIBUS, or ALL STAR SUPERMAN or APOCOLYPSE NERD or BPRD or NEW TALES OF OLD PALOMAR is out...

Hell, even CAPTAIN AMERICA get me giddy. When was the last time Marvel had such a kick-ass spy book? Duncan Fegredo drew HELLBOY, and it was amazing! There was that Brereton painted IRON FIST annual, that was like a thirties pulp book.... GREEN ARROW YEAR ONE... ROBOT DREAMS... Dan Clowes' story in the NYT Magazine... DRIFTING CLASSROOM translations... THE ARRIVAL... SARDINE IN OUTER SPACE 4 ftw!

I could go on all day with the good stuff... I can't even remember a bad thing that got me irritated enough to complain.

Erik Burnham

12-21-2007, 06:01 AM

The greco-roman examples look as if they have internal organs. The scarecrow-with-boobs that the comics keep portrayi8ng does not.

So that's why the Human Torch is still single.

Michael P

12-21-2007, 09:32 AM

Yes it is.

I guess he didn't win that MacArthur genius Grant for nuthin.

(By the by, Mike- have you read GUN WITH OCCASIONAL MUSIC?)

Nope. What's that?

Kid Omega

12-21-2007, 09:37 AM

Nope. What's that?

It's one of Lethem's early novels... a Philip K. Dick/Raymond Chandler pastiche... it's really excellent. I think you'd like it.

Also great? A short story called "THE VISION", from his collection "Men and Cartoons". I will not spoil it, but suffice it to say, it involves a someone who is a serious fan of a certain synthetic human.

Violently Apathetic

12-21-2007, 09:50 AM

The greco-roman examples look as if they have internal organs. The scarecrow-with-boobs that the comics keep portrayi8ng does not.

Indeed. The 'ideal' Greek woman was generally supposed to have smallish breasts and a substantial backside. 'Pear shaped' as my Ancient Greek and Roman Sexuality Professor put it. Take a look at the Aphrodite Kallipygos (Aphrodite of of the Beautiful Buttocks) or the 'Crouching Venus' (stomach rolls and all) and explain to me how that meshes with the current standards of female beauty. Even athletic Goddess like Artemis were depicted as thick and fairly 'soft' looking.

I can get behind the idea that comic heroines should look athletic and strong, but (as was pointed out) that does not translate to 'stick thin' as Supergirl was often depicted. There's also no reason why their shouldn't be variations in body type, for both males and females.

MacQuarrie

12-22-2007, 12:39 AM

Well, Not Omega The Unknown is a pretty darn good comic.

It probably is. But Marvel has done such a good job of driving me away from them that I don't even look at that section of the store anymore, so I haven't even seen an issue of the thing.

Besides which, I think it sucks that Gerber never got to finish his version of the story. The compelling thing about the original series wasn't the fairly-generic title character, it was the mystery. I'm not interested in starting over with somebody else's version of it.

So all told, I just haven't bothered to look for it.

bodie_3_7_ci5

12-22-2007, 01:52 AM

Amazons Attack - Awful stuff.

Stormwatch PHD ending - This book was awesome and they ended it.

Countdown

AaronJ

12-22-2007, 02:21 AM

Without a doubt, coming across the finish line in first by a MILE, making Secretariat's win at the Belmont look like small potatoes ...

Amazons Attack!

I love Pfeifer's Catwoman, and Pete Woods is a really good artist. But this was ... wrong on SO many levels. It was truly horrific, missing on all points. I don't know what sort of terrible something has to be to unite 99% of WW fans, but this did it.

Also, for worst single issue, I would nominate Civil War Frontline #11, where Steve Rogers is screamed at by a hysterical Sally Floyd, accused of not really being relevant anymore because he doesn't use MySpace or know who Paris Hilton is.

And he does ... nothing. Not. A. Thing. Painful.

Oh, and Jodi Picoult's first WW issue is right up there, too. "Pump?" "Credit card?" etc. That one I *actually* threw across the room when I was done with it.

d newton

12-22-2007, 03:48 AM

Without a doubt, coming across the finish line in first by a MILE, making Secretariat's win at the Belmont look like small potatoes

Amazons Attack!

I love Pfeifer's Catwoman, and Pete Woods is a really good artist. But this was ... wrong on SO many levels. It was truly horrific, missing on all points. I don't know what sort of terrible something has to be to unite 99% of WW fans, but this did it.

Do not get me started again on trying to explain how this was one of the best DC minis for 2007!

AaronJ

12-22-2007, 03:53 AM

Do not get me started again on trying to explain how this was one of the best DC minis for 2007!

You've got your opinion. Now, respect mine.

d newton

12-22-2007, 04:39 AM

Now, respect mine.
Ok, I will.

Tobias March

12-22-2007, 09:52 AM

(By the by, Mike- have you read GUN WITH OCCASIONAL MUSIC?)

Love that book...kangaroo hitmen...beautiful.

Flying Saucers Over Oz

12-22-2007, 11:26 AM

AMAZONS ATTACK, a misogynistic hatefest masquerading as a political commentary which screwed up a character who'd already been screwed up way too much LAST year.

And I finally just gave up on POWER PACK. Finally realized Sumerak was less interested in following in the footsteps of Louise Simonson than Larry Leiber: "Okay, what's the least amount of effort I can put into this thing and still get paid?"

AaronJ

12-22-2007, 11:30 AM

AMAZONS ATTACK, a misogynistic hatefest masquerading as a political commentary which screwed up a character who'd already been screwed up way too much LAST year.

As I said in my post, I despised AA with an unbridled passion. God, I hated it.

But I don't think it's misogynistic at all. Just idiotic.

Melbourne Mew Mew

12-22-2007, 12:17 PM

Is anyone tallying these?

For mine...

- Amazons Attack
- Civil War
- Pointless "shocking" deaths in DC

4thHorseman

12-22-2007, 12:41 PM

AaronJ

12-22-2007, 12:46 PM

In no order:

1. Amazons Attack
2. Civil War
3. One More Day
4. Many issues of Countdown and the Tie ins (ex: Search for Palmer)
5. JLA (pretty much every issue so far)
6. Confidential titles
7. Flash (pretty much everything)
8. Judd Winnick

I always find it interest that Winick's most vehement critics are also the ones most likely to misspell his name. ;)

I'm just messing around with you. No offense meant. :)

Jake1823

12-22-2007, 01:26 PM

I'm in the group that says that the good stuff outweighed the bad. I read mostly stuff I liked/was interested in. I think reading All-Star Superman or Iron Fist alone makes me forget the bad stuff.

Although, I'll say this, the one bad thing I'll remember the most from this past year is comic book fandom...

4thHorseman

12-22-2007, 02:02 PM

I always find it interest that Winick's most vehement critics are also the ones most likely to misspell his name. ;)

I'm just messing around with you. No offense meant. :)

None taken, I've always been a terrible speller, especially since I'm not used to seeing his name on the books I pick up:D

AaronJ

12-22-2007, 02:23 PM

None taken, I've always been a terrible speller, especially since I'm not used to seeing his name on the books I pick up:D

HAHA! Touche! :)

It's an old joke I used a lot over at the 'Rama. But it actually is true!

TCJohnson

12-22-2007, 03:39 PM

You've got your opinion. Now, respect mine.

Heh, now that is funny! Or is this not the same Diana_fan who told a bunch of people here that "No one makes this place less pleasant than you do" just because they didn't like the Sinestro Corps Special?

ForkedTongue

12-22-2007, 08:39 PM

Seems like a good place to start.

Way, Loeb and Guggenheim's Wolverine stuff. I think Jason Aaron has written the only good Wolvie solo story this year and that was just a fill-in. He's a really easy character to mess up (even Millar's take involved him being mind controlled for about half the run) and all of this over-thinking his backstory just complicates things even more.

Ultimates 3. Man, that first issue was a train wreck.

I'm staying far, far away from One More Day. I'm looking forward to seeing what Dan Slott does, though.

...and there's STILL no Ted Kord... just cruel, evil teases. Et tu, Mr. Johns? Et tu? :|

And in the interests of balancing out my karma:
Waid's Brave And The Bold surprised the Hell out of me... it's great straight-up superhero stuff. PAD is doing really good work on X-Factor and now on She-Hulk... and I'm officially psyched about Wonder Woman for the first time in my life.

Tyr

12-23-2007, 03:17 AM

Heh, now that is funny! Or is this not the same Diana_fan who told a bunch of people here that "No one makes this place less pleasant than you do" just because they didn't like the Sinestro Corps Special?

It's the same guy.

Kevinroc

12-23-2007, 11:02 AM

The needless death of Bart Allen.

Ugh, the most pointless mishandling of a character all year. And the actual timing of it (just awhile before 'Ringo's death) made it all the worse.

Joshua Pantalleresco

12-23-2007, 03:02 PM

Countdown.

I really think they should have waited until Keith started doing breakdowns. All due respect to the people involved, this was a train wreck and has made me resolve never to buy an event comic again.

JP

The Beast Of Yucca Flats

12-23-2007, 06:38 PM

Ugh, the most pointless mishandling of a character all year. And the actual timing of it (just awhile before 'Ringo's death) made it all the worse.

But at least this came out of it:

http://pics.livejournal.com/icon_uk/pic/0002173q

Thanks, Mr. Rousseau.

thehod

12-23-2007, 10:44 PM

The fact that this thread is larger than the one about what was best in 2007.

Was 2007 really that bad, or do people just prefer to bitch rather than praise?

Erik Burnham

12-23-2007, 10:55 PM

Was 2007 really that bad, or do people just prefer to bitch rather than praise?

Well duh.

And you'd know that, too, if you'd used the internet a little bit longer. Or talked to more comics readers.

:D

Seriously, people are more easily motivated to share what they don't like and keep what they do like to themselves. (Most of the time, anyways.)

Alan Lynch

12-24-2007, 01:26 AM

I find it easier to list the crap because there's generally speaking less of it; it stands out more. I could list books I enjoyed all day and still miss stuff out.

Plus, it's far too easy to tear down One More Day.

the4thpip

12-24-2007, 01:31 AM

Germany's most influential book critic published two books of his reviews, one with just the positive ones and one dedicated to the books he trashed. Guess which ones he said is the one always going first at his book signings.

EdContradictory

12-31-2007, 09:03 AM

YMB's Gary Walters returns to tell us what in 2007 did and did not measure up. All Star Superman made his list. As did Venture Bros. Where did your favorites end up?

The Tricks of Turning Pro: The Best Awesomest of 2007! (http://www.yourmomsbasement.com/archives/2007/12/the_tricks_of_t_14.html)

jadrax

12-31-2007, 11:57 AM

There is only one true crime in entertainment, and that is being unbearably dull. Fortunately that doesn't happen much, and I think in general 2007 was a very good year, like it or hate it, most stuff was pretty engaging.

That being said.

#1: OMD - couldn't even be bothered to read it, everybody predicted what this would be around a year ago and it was. Managed to utterly damage the franchise and be bland at the same time, way to go Marvel.

#2: Green Lantern/Black Canary relaunch - Bear in mind, I actually liked both Birds of Prey and Green Arrow prior to the wedding, and I thought the wedding was a good idea. But god the title itself seems to be aimed as a cure for insomnia. Green Arrows die and get better every issue, really, who cares?

#3: Teen Titans East Special - A group of d-list Heros get slaughtered in a predictable manner with an utter lack of any emotional resonance, utter waste of cash.

#4: Ultimates v2 #13 - Utter cop out ending, we waited a year for this bland predictable waste of an issue?

#5: Deadman - I feel bad about this one, because vertigo should have a licence to try new things out, but there is no way that the story here required the Deadman Character, this did damage to a franchise for no good reason.