Three Boys 8 & 9 Rape 11 year old Girl [Archive]

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Titan76

11-20-2007, 07:13 AM

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-11-20-georgia-rape_N.htm

ACWORTH, Ga. (AP) — Three boys, ages 8 and 9, were being held Monday in a detention center on charges of kidnapping and raping an 11-year-old girl near a suburban apartment complex, officials said. The alleged attack happened Thursday and the girl's mother reported it to authorities Sunday, Acworth police Capt. Wayne Dennard said.
"The victim said they were playing outdoors and the girl was forced into a wooded area where she was sexually assaulted, where one of the boys raped her," Dennard told the Associated Press.

The three boys — an 8-year-old and two 9-year-olds — appeared in juvenile court Monday afternoon, dwarfed by the courtroom chairs and wearing navy blue jump suits and shackles. Their names were withheld because of their age.

Acworth Police Chief Mike Wilkie said one of the boys was accused of threatening to hit the girl with a rock before the alleged assault. Wilkie also said the investigation is "far from over," and investigators are looking into claims that after the alleged attack, the girl talked about it with her friends at a slumber party.

The girl's mother told WGCL-TV in Atlanta, "They do need to be taught a lesson because if they do it to her, they could do it to somebody else. And who knows when they become teenagers what they can do to other girls."

The case involves children from a working class apartment complex. Acworth, 30 miles northwest of Atlanta along the shores of Lake Allatoona, is a town of about 17,000.
Awful, awful crime. Makes me wonder what the boy's patents are like.

Beast Boy Modified

11-20-2007, 07:17 AM

What in the hell is our society turning into? What's next?! Toddler murdering their parents?! Child robbing a bank?! WTF is this, man?! I am personally shocked and appalled by this.

Kid Omega

11-20-2007, 07:19 AM

What in the hell is our society turning into? What's next?! Toddler murdering their parents?! Child robbing a bank?! WTF is this, man?! I am personally shocked and appalled by this.

Just be glad you aren't living prior to the 1700's, where horrors like this (and far, far, far worse) were just a day in the serfdom.

hamboy

11-20-2007, 08:47 AM

The hell? How is it even phisically posible for kids that age? this is sikening.

dingo

11-20-2007, 08:51 AM

The hell? How is it even phisically posible for kids that age? this is sikening.

rape doesn't require an errect penis. It is about power.

rick

11-20-2007, 09:23 AM

hitokiri_

11-20-2007, 09:27 AM

if this is true, then fuck. what the hell's the matter with the kids these days?

Beast Boy Modified

11-20-2007, 09:41 AM

and about the level of participation of the girl.FFS. It just pisses me off that the victim will always receive at least a tiny portion of the blame either because she's too naive to understand or because the authorities THINK that she participated because of one reason or the other.

SUPERECWFAN1

11-20-2007, 09:44 AM

This is just horrid. Wow... I can not believe this. But its USA Today so it makes me sick.

Gary_B

11-20-2007, 09:44 AM

rick

11-20-2007, 09:54 AM

The 11 year old girl was asking for it or some such nonsense.

I didn’t say that, I only said that what actually happened is in question.

I also take issue with the suggestion that these 8 year olds were vicious predators, when there really isn’t enough information out to tell any of us what the story actually is.

At least one of the boys has stated to Police that the girl was their voluntary, but had changed her story to keep from getting in trouble.

I have no idea what happened here, but I do think that before everyone starts building the fire to pitch these boys on that it might not be a bad idea to figure out what the truth actually is.

Or is that just too much nonsense?

mambo66

11-20-2007, 10:01 AM

While it may be shocking and appalling and it's even good for ratcheting in up the shock value of news headlines... I'm not entirely sure it's as rare as people are making it out.

These days we have access to more 'news' than ever before. It's information overload. Just flip through and news website and you can easily spend several hours reading about mothers killing their own children, children being kidnapped, sexually abused, murdered, tortured etc. If you consider the cases that actually make the news are just a small fraction... then sadly these sorts of incidents are very common indeed. Probably even more common than that if we suspect that there are many cases that simply go unreported.

Speak with anyone who works in public health or the prison system. Or both (eg. prison/county jail nurse/psych worker) and they'll no doubt tell you that the darker side of humanity is as prevalent as it ever was. They often have more insight into the grim side than do most others. Christ... talk with anyone who's worked as an EMT I, II or a paramedic and they'll tell you how a large amount of time is spent transporting abused and injured children to and from hospitals and clinics. It's common with a capital C. There's a reason why there is a high rate of alcoholism amongst paramedics and the like. I've seen it first hand and seen it effect the lives of many a medic - and never in a positive way.

People don't like to hear about humans being inclined to violence towards their own kind. People like to think we live in a world where everyone is basically good at heart. Well sorry to be the bearer of bad news but that ain't exactly the case. Not then, not now, not ever. There are any number of people out there who would rape/murder/molest/abuse/torture and lose not one iota of sleep over it. In fact they'd sleep like an absolute baby.

It's not being pessimistic... it's being realistic.

*quickly zips up flame proof suit

mambo

Asa

11-20-2007, 10:04 AM

rick

11-20-2007, 10:09 AM

Regardles if she was willing, it was still three against one,and it doesn't look good.
Being a parent my self, needing to talk to my children earlly in life, I still think there is to much sex on tv,and kids know all to well what to do.

I have three daughters and couldn't agree with you more about the need to talk to your kids early and often about sex, and also to control the levels of sex and violence that they see on tv.

So please don't think I'm siding with these boys. I just suspect that the truth is probably more complicated then the media would make it to seem.

Gary_B

11-20-2007, 10:12 AM

FFS. It just pisses me off that the victim will always receive at least a tiny portion of the blame either because she's too naive to understand or because the authorities THINK that she participated because of one reason or the other.

I didn’t say that, I only said that what actually happened is in question.

I also take issue with the suggestion that these 8 year olds were vicious predators, when there really isn’t enough information out to tell any of us what the story actually is.

At least one of the boys has stated to Police that the girl was their voluntary, but had changed her story to keep from getting in trouble.

I have no idea what happened here, but I do think that before everyone starts building the fire to pitch these boys on that it might not be a bad idea to figure out what the truth actually is.

Or is that just too much nonsense?

I was replying to Beast Boy's statement about girls/women always getting a portion of the blame in sexual assault cases. Whatever happened in this case the girl will carry a stigma from this experience. Nonsense I tell you.

rick

11-20-2007, 10:13 AM

I was replying to Beast Boy's statement about girls/women always getting a portion of the blame in sexual assault cases. Whatever happened in this case the girl will carry a stigma from this experience. Nonsense I tell you.

Oh gotcha.

I completly misunderstood that.

Sorry.

Gary_B

11-20-2007, 10:16 AM

Oh gotcha.

I completly misunderstood that.

Sorry.

No worries. You are right, of course, that we don't have a clue what actually happened.

Charles RB

11-20-2007, 10:35 AM

rape doesn't require an errect penis. It is about power.

But often it's done with an erect penis, which (unless they're early developers) I don't think is biological possible at age 8 or 9. So unless one of them had developed early, I have no idea how'd he be able to do it. (Other forms of sexual assault are a different matter)

Corrina

11-20-2007, 10:38 AM

I would guess that these boys were re-enacting something that they'd seen or was done to them.

If I had to guess, I'd say it was the latter. While kids that age are curious about sex, a sexual assault is not something that would usually cross their minds.

Just a guess.

Corrina

11-20-2007, 10:39 AM

So please don't think I'm siding with these boys. I just suspect that the truth is probably more complicated then the media would make it to seem.

Yes, I'd agree on that. Media reports, particularly national media reporting on a very local story, can be very misleading.

StoneGold

11-20-2007, 10:47 AM

But often it's done with an erect penis, which (unless they're early developers) I don't think is biological possible at age 8 or 9. So unless one of them had developed early, I have no idea how'd he be able to do it. (Other forms of sexual assault are a different matter)

It can also be done with other appendages, physical objects, etc. However, I think what Rick was getting at was, given the ages, there is a pretty damn good chance that this was a case of playing doctor that got out of hand.

Charles RB

11-20-2007, 10:54 AM

It can also be done with other appendages, physical objects, etc.

I did think about that but wasn't sure if that counts as rape (rather than another type of sexual assault) under US law.

Something getting out of hand rather than a pre-planned attack would definately make more sense.

StoneGold

11-20-2007, 10:56 AM

I did think about that but wasn't sure if that counts as rape (rather than another type of sexual assault) under US law.

For the record, it would be Georgia law, not US. There are no federal rape laws. Unless you rape the president or something. And even then, they'd probably chalk it up to an assassination attempt. Kill him with your penis.

mambo66

11-20-2007, 11:41 AM

For the record, it would be Georgia law, not US. There are no federal rape laws. Unless you rape the president or something. And even then, they'd probably chalk it up to an assassination attempt. Kill him with your penis.

ROTFLMAO!!! :p

and even that you're gonna have people lining up for miles.

When cases like this pop up in the national media... one of the first things that springs to mind is over zealous district attorneys wanting to make a name for themselves by leaking this the story to the media and garnering the attention the media will undoubtedly provide.

Nitmo

11-20-2007, 09:44 PM

J. Robb

11-20-2007, 09:50 PM

The three boys — an 8-year-old and two 9-year-olds — appeared in juvenile court Monday afternoon, dwarfed by the courtroom chairs and wearing navy blue jump suits and shackles. Their names were withheld because of their age.
...Shackles?

saintsaucey

11-20-2007, 09:55 PM

...Shackles?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetters

Fetters, shackles, footcuffs or leg irons are a kind of physical restraint used on the feet or ankles to allow walking but prevent running and kicking. The term "fetter" shares a root with the word "foot".

In humans, typically only prisoners or bondage fetishists will wear shackles. A shackled animal is typically either a dangerous animal or one prone to escape.

Metaphorically, a fetter may be anything that restricts or restrains in any way, hence the word "unfettered".

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a3/Fetters_-_leg_irons_-_photomodel_Ina.jpg/240px-Fetters_-_leg_irons_-_photomodel_Ina.jpg

J. Robb

11-20-2007, 10:08 PM

Sorry, I know what shackles are, I just meant- were they really necessary? I don't see how treating young kids like hardened criminals can be helpful, no matter what they did.

saintsaucey

11-20-2007, 10:13 PM

figured you knew was an attempt at humor

Sean Whitmore

11-20-2007, 10:25 PM

Because it's inconcievable that someone would lie about a sex crime?

Certainly not to the lads from Duke University.

SEAN

Kevin M.

11-20-2007, 11:22 PM

Are we certain that these children actually did commit rape?

Other press reports have suggested that there seems to be some question about what actually happened, and about the level of participation of the girl.

I hope that she was lying, or made this thing up. This is just horrific on so many levels.

Nikita

11-21-2007, 12:47 AM

This really isn't very shocking. This is the world (many) girls live in. (and no, I'm not "manbashing" in this thread, I promise. I'm just making a point from my personal experiences growing up as a girl in school.)

I remember (some) boys bullying, harassing and doing all kinds of nasty things to girls at a very young age growing up in school.
I knew of female friends who were ganged up on by boys at early ages.

It happens all the time. Girls are threatened, even at a young age, because (some) boys learn at a very young age, how to intimidate girls. After all, (some) boys bully each other, so why not girls? Sometimes, the harassing/abuse can turn sexual in nature.

Notice how I put the word "some" in ( ) to make clear that I know not all boys harass girls. And not all girls have been harassed in school growing up. But for those of us who have witnessed it, or experienced it first hand, (some) boys can be quite vicious, even at very young ages. (And yes, girls harass other girls too. I'm aware of that as well. I witnessed that as well growing up)

I had a boy harass me constantly on the bus when I was in elementary school. He made lewd comments about me having periods, sexual comments, things of that nature. I was very intimidated by him. He eventually started threatening to do physical harm to me. I finally complained to my parents and he was removed from the bus. Again, this was in elementary school...

If this story turns out to be true, it is very sad, but in the world that (many) girls grow up in, it's really not that shocking to some of us. Some of us, used to see it all the time in school. I never saw an actual rape, but I saw physical abuse of girls by (some) boys at very young ages from time to time in school. I witnessed (some) boys make lewd, sexual comments, or inappropriate physical contact with girls. And of course, there was plenty of verbal bullying if nothing else.

Clearly, the boys in this story are bullies. And rape is taking the bullying to another (and much more serious) level. Once bullying crosses the line into actual physical attacks or sexual assault, you've got some miniature possible sociopaths on your hands. I also witnessed early sociopath behavior in some kids at a young age. (not just boys, but in some girls too) I worry about future victims with these boys if they don't get help now.

I guess I've just gotten so jaded with these stories, because I saw things growing up, these stories don't shock me anymore. Very sad story indeed.

Just my two cents.

Asa

11-21-2007, 07:18 AM

This stuff happened all the time. We had a neighberhood kid he followed the girls. When I was 6 he started. All the girls were afraid then. There was noone you could go to, his parents just said he was a curious boy. I learned at that age how to kick then, I was good with the kicks. When I was in the 4th grade one of the boys challenged me after school, and I never heard from him again after that.

rick

11-21-2007, 07:23 AM

Clearly, the boys in this story are bullies. And rape is taking the bullying to another (and much more serious) level. Once bullying crosses the line into actual physical attacks or sexual assault, you've got some miniature possible sociopaths on your hands. I also witnessed early sociopath behavior in some kids at a young age. (not just boys, but in some girls too) I worry about future victims with these boys if they don't get help now.

Clearly?

I’m not so sure that anything in this case is clear at all.

Don’t misunderstand me here because I do believe that what you are describing could certainly be exactly what the situation is in this case, and these boys did do something monstrous that goes well beyond bullying.

Or, and this is also possible, the boys are telling the truth and the girl was there of her own free will and didn’t call it rape until she was looking at getting in trouble from her parents.

I am bothered by the fact that this “rape” only came to light after the girl told several other girls about the incident at a slumber party. It is fair to ask why if she was raped that she didn’t go to her parents or the authorities to report the incident.

There is also the statement from authorities that even “if” the girl was there of her own free will that she is not old enough to give consent. Which while certainly true, does seem to indicate that there is more to the story then some girl getting dragged off to the woods by little rape happy animals.

I am bothered that this case was leaked to the press by someone in the juvenile court system in the first place, and have to wonder about the motive for that.

I also have to admit though that one of the reasons this story has got my attention is that as a small boy there were numerous times when I was in a situation where I was playing doctor with some little girl out back of the house and I know that in those incidents, right or wrong, those little girls were there of their own free will.

Yes, as an adult I recognize that this kind of exploring is not really the best way for kids to learn about the opposite sex, but I also recognize that this kind of thing is, or at least used to be pretty normal and fairly common behavior.

And honestly, I don’t want to see these boys’ lives shaken up because they were paying doctor and the girl didn’t want her parents mad at her.

Now, like I have said before, none of us actually know the truth about what was going on, and because of the way this kind of case is handled in the courts, we probably never will.

And these guys just might be rapists and monsters.

But there are some things, even in the tidbit of an article that just raise some red flags with me.

saintsaucey

11-21-2007, 08:23 AM

fallowed? word deffinition please

Puma

11-21-2007, 08:26 AM

fallowed? word deffinition please

"followed" poor spelling abounds.

saintsaucey

11-21-2007, 08:34 AM

okay well then the story makes no sence to me the boy followed girls so they were scared

Puma

11-21-2007, 08:37 AM

okay well then the story makes no sence to me the boy followed girls so they were scared

this is the internet, it doesn't have to make sense.

we post to confirm we are alive.

Spike-X

11-21-2007, 08:41 AM

But often it's done with an erect penis, which (unless they're early developers) I don't think is biological possible at age 8 or 9.

As a parent of a young boy, I can tell you that you're definitely wrong there.

saintsaucey

11-21-2007, 08:45 AM

As a parent of a young boy, I can tell you that you're definitely wrong there.

i don't remember if you are correct but i'll take your word for it. as a former young boy i'll tell you that all that stuff on tv about young boys not likeing girls and cooties and all that is complete and total bs. I was into girls as young as first grade and older girls were awesome as far as i was concerned

Asa

11-21-2007, 09:07 AM

fallowed? word deffinition please
Since I am the only one who made the mistake, I went back and corrected the spelling.

My sincere appologies.

And yes, the girls were scared of this boy. He was following them so he could catch up and touch their private parts. Talking about these things can be a little difficult after so many years. Given the oppertunity to make other parents aware that it does exist, even then, and maybe now people will listen. He was 6 when he started with me.

Toku King

11-21-2007, 01:38 PM

This is just sick. I mean, first 16 year olds, now 8 and 9 year olds. This is just terrible and distressing. I'm hoping that this is not true. I mean, really hoping it's not true. I hope that this turns out to be a fluke, or some bitch of a girl not wanting to get in trouble. Or else, I have lost faith in the future of mankind.

Paul McEnery

11-21-2007, 03:09 PM

A rough guess would be that the girl's parents are total freaks.

A second rough guess would be that someone's being hyper-vigilant to avoid a liability suit.

But I'm pretty sure that, Bulger case aside, very little between three 9 year old boys and an 11 year old girl is likely to call for the police to be involved.

Black Atom

11-21-2007, 03:20 PM

i don't remember if you are correct but i'll take your word for it. as a former young boy i'll tell you that all that stuff on tv about young boys not likeing girls and cooties and all that is complete and total bs. I was into girls as young as first grade and older girls were awesome as far as i was concerned

Yeah, but by "into girls" you mean fairly innocent stuff, right? Except for that one weird kid in every class who drew pictures of cocks all over his notebook and pulled his pants all the way down to his ankles to use the urinal, most of us weren't thinking about overtly sexual stuff at 8 or 9. I was content with holding hands and clumsy pecks on the mouth.

Shellhead

11-21-2007, 03:34 PM

Spike-X

11-21-2007, 03:37 PM

Just be glad you aren't living prior to the 1700's, where horrors like this (and far, far, far worse) were just a day in the serfdom.
What? That can't be right. They didn't even have TV or gangsta rap or the Internet back then!

pariah-1972

11-21-2007, 03:56 PM

I didn't know that kids were even interested in sex at that age? of course rape isn't really about sex, but i really can't get my head around this.
i don't want to take sides without hearing some more evidence, but its entirely possible that this girl wasn't actually raped
but maybe just harrased or bullied (which i understand is far more likely with young boys) than actual rape and there was some miscommunication?

i really can't believe these boys are being put into shackles and i really hope there is more proof than a "he said she said" type thing.

StoneGold

11-21-2007, 04:08 PM

I didn't know that kids were even interested in sex at that age? of course rape isn't really about sex, but i really can't get my head around this.

Yeah, but it is. If I wanted to exert power over you, I'd just beat the shit out of you. Rape involves a sexual component. If rape isn't about sex... well shit, there's no crime then, is there?

For that matter, even if you say rape is about power, what, every single rape falls into that category? How come there are a bazillion motivations for murder, but only one for rape?

And I'd lay odds on if this is rape, it being about curiosity more than power.

Charles RB

11-21-2007, 09:31 PM

As a parent of a young boy, I can tell you that you're definitely wrong there.

I stand corrected.

Nikita

11-22-2007, 12:28 AM

Clearly?

I’m not so sure that anything in this case is clear at all.

Don’t misunderstand me here because I do believe that what you are describing could certainly be exactly what the situation is in this case, and these boys did do something monstrous that goes well beyond bullying.

Or, and this is also possible, the boys are telling the truth and the girl was there of her own free will and didn’t call it rape until she was looking at getting in trouble from her parents.

I am bothered by the fact that this “rape” only came to light after the girl told several other girls about the incident at a slumber party. It is fair to ask why if she was raped that she didn’t go to her parents or the authorities to report the incident.

There is also the statement from authorities that even “if” the girl was there of her own free will that she is not old enough to give consent. Which while certainly true, does seem to indicate that there is more to the story then some girl getting dragged off to the woods by little rape happy animals.

I am bothered that this case was leaked to the press by someone in the juvenile court system in the first place, and have to wonder about the motive for that.

I also have to admit though that one of the reasons this story has got my attention is that as a small boy there were numerous times when I was in a situation where I was playing doctor with some little girl out back of the house and I know that in those incidents, right or wrong, those little girls were there of their own free will.

Yes, as an adult I recognize that this kind of exploring is not really the best way for kids to learn about the opposite sex, but I also recognize that this kind of thing is, or at least used to be pretty normal and fairly common behavior.

And honestly, I don’t want to see these boys’ lives shaken up because they were paying doctor and the girl didn’t want her parents mad at her.

Now, like I have said before, none of us actually know the truth about what was going on, and because of the way this kind of case is handled in the courts, we probably never will.

And these guys just might be rapists and monsters.

But there are some things, even in the tidbit of an article that just raise some red flags with me.

If she was raped, it's very common for girls (especially younger ones) not to go to parents or authorities right away after a rape. There's an initial feeing of shame, as if some how, it was your fault. So you tell friends first, because you feel safer telling them right away. But there's always a worry, that a parent, or authority figure might not believe you, or even blame you for what happened. So you go to friends first, instead of an adult.

The other reason is fear. If you're attackers threatened you not to tell anyone, you don't. Some victims don't tell anyone for years, and years. Or you only feel safe to tell a closer friend you feel you can trust won't tell anyone else.

Shame, and fear, are two main, and very common reasons that many rape victims don't always go to parents, or authority figures right away after the crime has been committed. Even some adult female rape victims, avoid telling someone right away sometimes out of shame, or fear.

Obviously, this all depends on what actually happened. Guess time will tell as the facts of this case come out.

Titan76

11-22-2007, 12:56 AM

What? That can't be right. They didn't even have TV or gangsta rap or the Internet back then!
I'm 90% sure that you are joking here right?

rick

11-22-2007, 12:59 AM

I'm 90% sure that you are joking here right?

No he's quite serious that they didn't have TV or gangsta rap or the Internet back then.

Spike-X

11-22-2007, 01:00 AM

Completely serious.

Titan76

11-22-2007, 01:12 AM

No he's quite serious that they didn't have TV or gangsta rap or the Internet back then.
But they did have musicals right? And if they were singing fast then they would be rapping wouldn't they?

Titan76

11-22-2007, 01:14 AM

Completely serious.
About the rapping and Internet or the horrors back in the 1700's? I'm a little buzz right now so not every thing is clear to me.

Sean Whitmore

11-22-2007, 01:16 AM

But they did have musicals right? And if they were singing fast then they would be rapping wouldn't they?

When The Merchant of Venice opened its curtains in 1752, it was like hell on earth. Kids running around slapping people, acting a fool. Madness.

SEAN

Spike-X

11-22-2007, 01:18 AM

When The Merchant of Venice opened its curtains in 1752, it was like hell on earth. Kids running around slapping people, acting a fool. Madness.

SEAN
It was all downhill from there, really.

Titan76

11-22-2007, 01:24 AM

When The Merchant of Venice opened its curtains in 1752, it was like hell on earth. Kids running around slapping people, acting a fool. Madness.

SEAN
I have this very funny image in my head about this and it also has the kids holding mugs with beer in them.