View Full Version : Southland Tales - Huh?!
For those of you who have been paying attention, there's been a banner add going around on CBR for Southland Tales. It's up right now as I type this. So anyway I took a look at the trailer. I'm usually fast on the uptake but this one's got me sratching my head and going, huh what is this thing about? Who's the Rock suppose to be? Whats this about the end of the world and the future, and writing about the future that is the end of the world? Is there anyone out there that has explored this deeper that can explain this whole thing to me?
It's the guy who did Donnie Darko.
so it's gonna be about time-travel, weird shit, and all that really matters is that it has Buffy in it :)
TCJohnson
11-08-2007, 08:05 PM
It is not one story, but a bunch of stories set in LA just before and ecological and economic disaster.
It is not one story, but a bunch of stories set in LA just before and ecological and economic disaster.
So this is basically a bunch of movies on high speed? No wonder I couldn't figure out what was going on. :p
TCJohnson
11-08-2007, 09:23 PM
Think of Pulp Fiction with a Science Fiction bent.
Think of Pulp Fiction with a Science Fiction bent.
So its like Pulp Fiction at high speed? :p
Crowley
11-09-2007, 12:51 AM
This movie should really be renamed "Clusterfuck."
It's been through several different cuts and versions, and it was supposed to be out about two years ago. For all I know this could very well be Kelly's "Brazil" but I'm not entirely certain of that most reviews have been fairly scathing.
Whether it succeeds or fails... it should be fascinating to watch.
Alan Lynch
11-09-2007, 03:41 AM
This movie should really be renamed "Clusterfuck."
It's been through several different cuts and versions, and it was supposed to be out about two years ago. For all I know this could very well be Kelly's "Brazil" but I'm not entirely certain of that most reviews have been fairly scathing.
Whether it succeeds or fails... it should be fascinating to watch.
I've seen a lot of mixed reviews. Some love it, some hate it. But everyone agrees it's worth seeing for some reason, even if just out of car-crash fascination. Hell, I still don't know if I even like Donnie Darko but I'm still in line for this thing.
Cayman
11-09-2007, 09:13 AM
I'll probably wait for DVD but I am very curious to see it. Donnie Darko was gorgeous.
Kid Omega
11-09-2007, 09:27 AM
As Crowley said, it's been pretty harshly reviewed.
Apparently it got booed at Cannes, and some of the reactions were BRUTAL.
From wiki: "Salon.com critic Andrew O'Hehir, for example, called the Cannes cut "about the biggest, ugliest mess I've ever seen."[13] Jason Solomons in The Observer said that "Southland Tales was so bad it made me wonder if [Kelly] had ever met a human being" and that ten minutes of the "sprawling, plotless, post-apocalyptic farrago" gave him the "sinking feeling that this may be one of the worst films ever presented in [Cannes] competition.""
Cayman
11-09-2007, 09:35 AM
The film has been changed considerably since Cannes. Have they screened the new cut yet?
Alan Lynch
11-09-2007, 09:42 AM
The film has been changed considerably since Cannes. Have they screened the new cut yet?
A couple of times, far as I know. There's been reviews from a cut which isn't the Cannes one anyway, but I'm not sure how close to the final version they were.
Cayman
11-09-2007, 09:52 AM
Is Timberlake's character the narrator?
Alan Lynch
11-09-2007, 09:53 AM
I think he is, yeah. Don't think he's actually meant to be on screen all that much which - if true - I find immensely reassuring.
Cayman
11-09-2007, 09:58 AM
Well, it's nice to have a film with some ambition I guess.
I think he is, yeah. Don't think he's actually meant to be on screen all that much which - if true - I find immensely reassuring.
I disagree, Narration, the unseen voice, is important, when used in monologue it gives us insight into a character, when used in observer mode it is a major ingredient in the glue that holds the plot together.
Therefore a good voice is needed, it has to get your attention, it has to get you listen, nay command you to do so. “Saying, alright now pay attention, because what I’m telling you is important, and if you’re not listening you’ll miss what’s important.”
It has to be given to men and women that can do that job. Such as the likes of Rod Serling, Orson Wells, Keith David, Kevin Spacey, Patrick Stewart, those with radio experience, and those with voice acting experience. When you give the job to a boy band teeny crush, it doesn’t make me want to take the film seriously.
On the other hand Kurt Russel managed to break the teen hearthrob mold he was in growing up, so did both Wahlbergs, so I'm willing to give Justin Timberlake a chance.
Kid Omega
11-09-2007, 02:17 PM
On the other hand Kurt Russel managed to break the teen hearthrob mold he was in growing up,
Well, to be fair, he came from a time when Disney groomed young actors with POTENTIAL, and acting chops... not just good hair.
On the other hand Kurt Russel managed to break the teen hearthrob mold he was in growing up, so did both Wahlbergs,
Or at least one of them. And he worked his ass off to get that respectability...
Well, to be fair, he came from a time when Disney groomed young actors with POTENTIAL, and acting chops... not just good hair.
Or at least one of them. And he worked his ass off to get that respectability...
I think both of them. Donny Walhberg really had to shake his New Kids on the Block teeny bopper image. He even got arrested on an assault charge, during his New Kid days, and he wasstill the subject of ridicule amongst stand up commedians. It didnt help when Dennis Miller was making fun of you everynight on Satarday Night Live. But, he made it and managed to get serious rolls in movies like the Sixth Sense and especially the series Band of Brothers.
Mark Walhberg had both an embarrasing New Kids and rap career to shake, The rap career might have helped him land the roles he did in his acting career. But, I couldn't pick up or watch a movie with him in it early in his acting career cause I was all to reminded of his rapping career. Now I have the Big Hit sitting in my collection, which is far from his best film but I liked it and it cost only 3 bucks.
Kid Omega
11-09-2007, 02:30 PM
I think both of them. Donny Walhberg really had to shake his New Kids on the Block teeny bopper image. He even got arrested on an assault charge, during his New Kid days, and he wasstill the subject of ridicule amongst stand up commedians. It didnt help when Dennis Miller was making fun of you everynight on Satarday Night Live. But, he made it and managed to get serious rolls in movies like the Sixth Sense and in the especially the series Band of Brothers.
Oh yes. I forgot about that one.
good call.
Oh yes. I forgot about that one.
good call.
Yeah Donny had it rougher then his brother, but you can't really think of him as a New Kid in that one can you? Course I think the 10 some years has helped.
Cayman
11-09-2007, 02:42 PM
Timberlake got some good notices for Alpha Dog.
Somebody probably liked Sean William Scott in something.
I just saw this movie last week, and I thought rather since I had this old thread setting here, I'd post a review of what I saw, since the movie was for a professional festival, I thought I'd do a professional review and stuff...anyway.
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Southland Tales is the apocalyptic brainchild of Richard Kelly maker of the cult classic Donny Darko. In many ways it emulates the apocalyptic cold war classic, Dr Stranlove. It be next to impossible not to compare this film to the Stanley Kubrick masterpiece, which strangely enough also did poor at screenings during its debut. The major difference is while Dr Strangelove is considered a controversial comedy classic; Southland Tales will probably be regarded by future generations as an abstract mess, if future generations will even remember the film.
The plot of Southland Tales revolves around the events preceding a nuclear attack on Texas, were the government proceeds to step up security measures to the point of martial law. It revolves around the kidnapping of a well known action film star with ties to the Republican Party, Boxer Santaros, played by Dwayne Johnson (AKA the Rock of wrestling fame.) Santaros is abducted by a neo Marxist terrorist organization in an attempt to sabotage the enactment of a new government bill, the ramifications of which are never fully explained. If that wasn’t enough, the whole thing also revolves around some new energy source called fluid karma developed by a perverted scientist with delusions of world domination. From there, the movie dives into a 3 hour traffic accident, complete with the soon to follow traffic jam.
To make matters worse Kelly tries a crude attempt at crude humor. Although the humor is funny at times, for the most part it’s poorly done. If ever you wanted to show folks what not to do with comedy then you should show them this film.
First Mr. Kelly, if people are having a hard enough time following your convoluted plot, then its safe to assume they’ll have a hard time following your jokes. And you can’t expect people to think abstract if you keep throwing bad jokes involving short people, porn stars, and blow jobs at them. Either make something abstract or do bathroom humor, but don’t try to do both in one film.
Furthermore humor even of Howard Stern’s or the level of “Jackass” still requires a sense of timing, and Kelly never seems to bother checking his watch. The humor isn’t so much off its tempo as seems to have been forced into the plot with a sledge hammer, being used in moments where it’s inappropriate and just doesn’t fit.
A perfect example of this is during a scene we’re a government swat hit squad moves in to take out a neo Marxist safe house. Kelly apparently thinks this is a good time for a joke. He does so by throwing a midget swat officer into the carnage. Apparently a midget swat officer is supposed to be funny, well if it is; it certainly wasn’t in this situation.
If the visual gags were poorly executed the dialog was even worse, with such lines as, “I am a pimp, and pimps don’t commit suicide.”
If this movie has one saving grace it’s the performances of the actors involved were great, even if their characters weren’t. Sara Michelle Geller does an admirable job playing ditzy but ambitious porn star Krysta Now. Dwayne Johnson’s portrayal of a neurotic action hero is just as convincing. Even former ‘N Sync member Justin Timberlake does a fantastic job as Private Pilot Abilene, who narrates the film spilling verses from revelations. It’s just a shame that the film couldn’t live up to their performances. In the end Southland Tales was an ambitious title whose reach fell short its grasp, and is 3 hours better spent elsewhere.
Charles RB
08-23-2009, 09:59 AM
If the visual gags were poorly executed the dialog was even worse, with such lines as, “I am a pimp, and pimps don’t commit suicide.”
Oh god, I heard that was the last line of the film too.
A lot of what I've heard about the film is depressing, because Donnie Darko showed that Kelly can write "normal"; even if you didn't understand all the time travel and hallucination stuff, you could get what was going on with all the cast, the school, "Sparkle Vision" etc. What changed?
Night Swordsman
08-23-2009, 10:05 AM
one word: Excess.
Sadly i wanted to watch this, but tooooo many negative reviews(not ONE positive one) about it to make me try to watch it.
one word: Excess.
Sadly i wanted to watch this, but tooooo many negative reviews(not ONE positive one) about it to make me try to watch it.
Do yourself a favor, don't, waste three hours of your life doing something else, I only watched it cause I got it for free from Comcast On Demand.
bfrank
08-23-2009, 10:52 AM
"if you wanna fuck me, you can fuck me now"....
Buffy and the SNL ladies made this movie for me......
Night Swordsman
08-23-2009, 11:04 AM
See...the people involved are what MAKE me want to see it.
Sigh. Torn.
See...the people involved are what MAKE me want to see it.
Sigh. Torn.
Oh don't get me wrong the actors that were in it were great, but trust me when I say this, its just not worth it.
JamesRitcheyIII
08-23-2009, 01:37 PM
A lot of Philip K. Dick in-jokes in that movie--the whole third act seems to be ganked right out of the showdown in The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch, with even Jack Black made-up to look like PKD--it's a visual/thematic homage to his writing, IMO. It also has a metatextual/magic realist feel to it along the lines of the movie versions of Catch-22 and Slaughterhouse 5. I've seen it twice, and I love it.
It disturbs me to no end that it got booed at Cannes, because I personally TRY to write like that.
Tobias March
08-23-2009, 02:49 PM
A lot of Philip K. Dick in-jokes in that movie--the whole third act seems to be ganked right out of the showdown in The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch, with even Jack Black made-up to look like PKD--it's a visual/thematic homage to his writing, IMO. It also has a metatextual/magic realist feel to it along the lines of the movie versions of Catch-22 and Slaughterhouse 5. I've seen it twice, and I love it.
It disturbs me to no end that it got booed at Cannes, because I personally TRY to write like that.
Yes but Philip K. Dick delivers his cosmic mysticism payload within a sturdy and reliable pulp fiction construct.
Mr Kelly blew his wad very early in the proceedings, with cod-mysteries and and lacunae meant to string us, the audience, along.
It was all very pretty and the hints of a superior film were frustrating, but to be honest it just didn't succeed.
Hurricane
08-23-2009, 04:03 PM
I've seen it. It's very confusing and requires at least 2 viewings to fully understand everything that's going on. It's not the best movie I've ever seen, but I thought it was pretty good.
JamesRitcheyIII
08-23-2009, 06:42 PM
Yes but Philip K. Dick delivers his cosmic mysticism payload within a sturdy and reliable pulp fiction construct.
Mr Kelly blew his wad very early in the proceedings, with cod-mysteries and and lacunae meant to string us, the audience, along.
It was all very pretty and the hints of a superior film were frustrating, but to be honest it just didn't succeed.
I break PKD into three periods--'50's, '60's and '70's. The first was fairly standard science fiction, with hint of Bradbury--gradually getting weirder, and more examinative of the nature of reality.. The last two periods have more in common with William S. Burroughs than Edgar Rice Burroughs, the last four novels going full-blown Gnostic Exegesis. If you could provide an example of 'pulp fiction' sensibility outside of realistic dialogue that perhaps Tarantino and PKD share a fondness, I'd be most appreciative--but that's not what 'pulp fiction' means.
I'm with Hurricane--it's not the best movie I've ever seen--although I loved it. I don't feel ripped off by it, and some stuff in there was a PKD fanboy's wet-dream.
Linkara
08-23-2009, 09:20 PM
...It has cars having sex in it. Any credibility I may have given to this idiot of a writer is very quickly dismissed.
It's a confusing, irritating, jumbled, nauseating, overblown piece of pretentiousness.
Buuuuut, that's just me. XD
Tages
08-23-2009, 10:08 PM
If you took any random film, fed the stock into a fan and then spliced the pieces back together at random it would make more sense than Southland Tales.
Crowley
08-23-2009, 10:18 PM
I think it's terrible movie. I don't think Kelly has the maturity to make a political satire without being obvious and heavy handed.
JamesRitcheyIII
08-23-2009, 10:47 PM
Y'all will hate Gigantic, then. It's all 'metatext'-y and symbolist, rather like Kafka. I find it as absurd that some of the brighter who've commented here don't like it--as absurd as some apparently find a deliberately absurd movie--but I'm a pretentious bastard who only pretends he understands things others don't.
It's like bitching about how unrealistic 'The Monkees' TV Show was.
Crowley
08-23-2009, 11:50 PM
Y'all will hate Gigantic, then. It's all 'metatext'-y and symbolist, rather like Kafka. I find it as absurd that some of the brighter who've commented here don't like it--as absurd as some apparently find a deliberately absurd movie--but I'm a pretentious bastard who only pretends he understands things others don't.
It's like bitching about how unrealistic 'The Monkees' TV Show was.
With respect James... I don't feel that Kelly's absurdity worked, because it wasn't absurd.
His political forecasting was all a little too on the nose. The whole double twins thing and his attempts at the book of revelations didn't really work...
It's kinda the whole "if you have to explain a joke thing..."
Just to give you a sense of reference to my tastes... Brazil sit on my DVD shelf sandwiched next to Bocaccio 70 and Buckaroo Banzai. I love the absurd, I love movies that demand you rewatch and go explore deeper into the mythology. That said... all of those movies tell a clear story. They're not maybe conventionally linear and yet not out of sequence like Puple fiction or Rashomon and they take some figuring out to place the pieces of the puzzle into place... but they're understandable.
Donnie Darko managed that brilliantly... I don't feel Southland Tales does. Southland Tales is a film packed with some really amazing visuals, but no coherent story or believable characters... I never believe any of the character's motivations, it seems like a very juvenile film that needed a solid coherent direction to the story that a good editor can provide.
But I'm truly glad you enjoyed the movie... maybe in a few years I'll give it a second look and come to agree with your point of view.
PatrickG
08-24-2009, 02:51 AM
James,
Glad you enjoyed SLT. I enjoyed it quite a bit and it's been on my mind lately as I piece together a very strange project that I don't know what to do with.
Actually, I'll be passing through Jasper sometime this week. Be interested in meeting up for a bit?
Charles RB
08-24-2009, 04:24 AM
...It has cars having sex in it.
Where did you think the little cars in Cars came from?
Brazil sit on my DVD shelf
I actually prefer Brazil to 1984, and I'm sure that makes me wrong in some way. :frown:
JamesRitcheyIII
08-24-2009, 04:40 AM
James,
Glad you enjoyed SLT. I enjoyed it quite a bit and it's been on my mind lately as I piece together a very strange project that I don't know what to do with.
It's definitely not a movie someone can watch just once and get everything. I don't think it's the great cinematic masterpiece in human history or anything, but I got the joke, and loved it quite a bit. I think it's up there with Ex1stenz, The Thirteen Floor, and generally 'seventies-style science fiction movies--and comes close to the movie version of A Scanner Darkly (but not the book). Not insanely brilliant, but more worthy than Independence Day to be in my movie collection, less than Inglourious Basterds, which rawked.
I think the thing that's really bugging me is that i wrote a pretty good comic done deliberately in a non-linear style--then gradually converging into linear (so that both issues made sense), and the main argument against it is either 'it sucks'--by people who haven't read them, or 'It's too confusing' by the loudest few who did. In other words--I heard exactly the same criticism from my now former publisher. I take this whole thread personally. I just love fucking writing 'I try to write like this' in my first post, then reading, 'it's stoopit', 'it's unrealistic', and 'it sucks' right after that. I got a little miffed earlier because I'm ill, and I have even less patience than normal for people unwilling to participate in art by using their brains.
Actually, I'll be passing through Jasper sometime this week. Be interested in meeting up for a bit?
Like I hinted, I caught a bug or something two days ago--can't hold anything down, and non-stop migraine. Still not even 60%, but I'm sure I'll be done with it by later in the week. IM me.
PatrickG
08-24-2009, 06:10 AM
Thirteenth Floor.
Also a great film. Unfairly overshadowed by The Matrix, IMHO, but I think it holds up better provided The Matrix wasn't anything new for you when you saw it.
Red Jack
08-24-2009, 08:36 AM
If you took any random film, fed the stock into a fan and then spliced the pieces back together at random it would make more sense than Southland Tales.
Gold, baby.
king mob
08-24-2009, 12:35 PM
This is the last film I turned off & asked for my money back as it utter shite. I still love Donnie Darko though.
...It has cars having sex in it. Any credibility I may have given to this idiot of a writer is very quickly dismissed.
It's a confusing, irritating, jumbled, nauseating, overblown piece of pretentiousness.
Buuuuut, that's just me. XD
Link you need to do a video review of this movie, with the same venomous hatred you brought to bear on Amazons Attack! :biggrin:
Linkara
08-25-2009, 10:43 AM
Link you need to do a video review of this movie, with the same venomous hatred you brought to bear on Amazons Attack! :biggrin:
I've considered reviewing the graphic novel prequels to the thing, but I've heard they're semi-coherent. XD
Paxaddo
08-28-2009, 12:53 PM
Given that I already had trouble understanding what the hell was going on in "Countdown", I don't want to risk permanently losing my mind by trying to figure out what goes on inside Richard Kelly's brain.:eek:
Tobias March
08-28-2009, 03:05 PM
I've considered reviewing the graphic novel prequels to the thing, but I've heard they're semi-coherent. XD
The graphic novels make it into the movie! There is no escape from comicbook Justin Timberlake!!!
Charles RB
08-28-2009, 03:10 PM
The graphic novels make it into the movie!
...wait, what? It's not trying to do a Morrison Animal Man, is it?
If it did a Beano, that'd be even better. I still fondly remember a scene of Dennis yelling "there's no way I'm going back, not for £500!" - at which point the jewel-adorned hand of The Editor descends with a sack of cash: "Okay, how about £1000?".
Tobias March
08-28-2009, 03:21 PM
...wait, what? It's not trying to do a Morrison Animal Man, is it?
If it did a Beano, that'd be even better. I still fondly remember a scene of Dennis yelling "there's no way I'm going back, not for £500!" - at which point the jewel-adorned hand of The Editor descends with a sack of cash: "Okay, how about £1000?".
Timberlake's soldier has a flashback to Falluja and we witness his experience as comic book panels....from the actual book.
All that was missing was a disclaimer reading 'copies of Southland Tales the comic are available at your local store!'
Charles RB
08-28-2009, 04:28 PM
All that was missing was a disclaimer reading 'copies of Southland Tales the comic are available at your local store!'
Preferably done as a word balloon with an arrow pointing to it as "Greedy Editor".
Wait I'm confused now, are we mocking Justin Timberlake? His performance was one of the few things I tolerated int the film, including the musical number. Which is something I never thought I'd say, but hey if the Walbergs did it, and Timberlake actually shows some promise as an actor.
With respect James... I don't feel that Kelly's absurdity worked, because it wasn't absurd.
His political forecasting was all a little too on the nose. The whole double twins thing and his attempts at the book of revelations didn't really work...
It's kinda the whole "if you have to explain a joke thing..."
Just to give you a sense of reference to my tastes... Brazil sit on my DVD shelf sandwiched next to Bocaccio 70 and Buckaroo Banzai. I love the absurd, I love movies that demand you rewatch and go explore deeper into the mythology. That said... all of those movies tell a clear story. They're not maybe conventionally linear and yet not out of sequence like Puple fiction or Rashomon and they take some figuring out to place the pieces of the puzzle into place... but they're understandable.
Donnie Darko managed that brilliantly... I don't feel Southland Tales does. Southland Tales is a film packed with some really amazing visuals, but no coherent story or believable characters... I never believe any of the character's motivations, it seems like a very juvenile film that needed a solid coherent direction to the story that a good editor can provide.
But I'm truly glad you enjoyed the movie... maybe in a few years I'll give it a second look and come to agree with your point of view.
As I mentioned before Dr Stranglove didn't do so well at the time of its release, it was only years later that it got appreciated for what it was. That said I don't think this movie well have the same appeal.
Kubrick was able to satire the Cold War because the whole idea of MAD was to him absurd. In fact he wanted to do a serious movie but he couldn't without the concept becoming ludicrous so he scrapped it for a comedy. He did what came naturally.
Kelly on the other hand tries to make the movie absurd, and he tries to force that absurdity on abstract concepts. As you pointed out, even a movie like Brazil has a clear plot, even if its threw the eyes of a schizophrenic bureaucrat.
dupont2005
09-05-2009, 01:05 PM
i liked the movie. it didn't blow me away or anything (which is pretty obviously what they were going for) but i thought it was good. i thought it was cool that the rock played a character that showed so much fear and nervousness. when i rented it i thought it was going to be a typical sci-fi action flick like 5th element.
Rollerblader
10-11-2009, 02:39 AM
I saw it on cinimax i think it was. or showtime. i get all the movie channels and it was on at like 3AM so i dont remember.
anyway, i didn't like it. i felt compelled to finish it just because i was like, "this has to be going somewhere". but i wasnt left w/ much after it ended. it's hard to imagine the guy who wrote Donnie Darko also wrote this. at least in DD at the end you're left intrigued & trying to put the puzzle together. I'm still trying to figure out how DD fits together even after watching the directors cut. The shared dreams part at the end is what really threw me for a loop. I'm thinking about renting S. Darko in the hopes it will help, but i read it wasn't very good. :\
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