X-Men from the Beginning

[Daniel Mengsk]

Guilty as charged(of total nerdness!)


My God man, and you admit it too?

LOL lim, it's safe to say that all of us who post here are in one way or another. ;)


The thongkini---Is that Psylocke's outfit???---I think it's hot as drawn by Lee(but completely impractical)

Yes, and do you want to know something funny? We are making the Marvel editors calling the outfit as such (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=22961).

I agree, the costume is hot when drawn by Lee but I would have prefered if she had kept the Lady Mandarin armor instead.

[AstonishingXMan]

What was up with the print run for Uncanny X-Men #248? Printing error?

I've got the original and the gold backgrounded 2nd printing. This came to be a valuable issue during the 1990's (anywhere from $20 to $40...and still goes for $14-20) because Marvel only printed a little over 400,000 copies of the pink background cover.

A strange oddity for Jim Lee's first issue.

[worstblogever]

#259 & #260-

Some of the weirdest Uncanny X-Men issues.



Genosha making its second feature, with characters still viewed as property.
Banshee and Forge encountering a random appearance by the Fenris Twins.
Jenny Ransome is made into the perfect "slave" via her skintight body suit.
Dazzler in a gimp mask, trying to sooth her tormentor.
Masque getting off on making Callisto "de-ugly", and Colossus just getting off on Callisto.


You know, these last three...kinda fetishy, to say the least.

[Goshin]

Like I said last week, 1990 was a shitty time for all the X-titles except Excalibur.

Well, Uncanny picked up after the Captain America Issue, but:


X-Factor- gay vampires and shitty art

New Mutants- shitty X-Terminator replacements, Liefeld

Uncanny- shitty post-Silvestri artist, tentacle Jean, shitty morlocks story and wtf Dazzler and Psylocke stories

[MartinRedmond]

Nothing to say about 259 except I liked it. I remember this was the same week as some Leonardi / Sienkiewicz Excalibur, was it Megan against Jamie? I hated all super hero comics except those two. Jenny's boyfriend (I forget his name because he is just a flatscan) seems pretty happy to have Collossus around, I wonder if they did sandwiches. It's nice to see what happened to them.

I enjoyed Dazzler's pacifist approach to her problems. It fits well with how much crap she would put up with in her own series, without ever defending herself that much. The few issues I could stomach reading, anyway.

Can't wait for the tentacles to come out and play~ btw you might want to read X-Factor 54 along with UXM 261 since uncanny and that book had some sort of cross over that month.

[Goshin]

Why do I suddenly want to play Bonk on TurboGraphx-16 and eat green cream-filled ninja turtle pies while sippin' ecto cooler?

[NickFury90]

As much as I don't like Claremont's writing, looking through this blog made me realize just how good John Byrne is. If there was a way to get his work in black and white, that would be cool.

[Joey]

now we are entering a REALLY BORING era in the UXM book

I LOVED the cover to issue 260 but it's a shame the interior art looked so rushed (though it was a million times better than the set of artists coming up in the run)

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-men # 260:

--The title 'Star 90' is a play on the movie 'Star 80'.....This was a movie from 1983 which told the true story of Playmate of the Year,Dorothy Stratten,who was murdered by her estranged husband,Paul Snider in 1980......'Star 80' was Snider's licence plate.....It was abig video hit around the time video players first came on the scene.....It would still have been a pretty well known movie in 1990 but I think it's probably slipped under the radar a bit since then.

http://www.franksreelreviews.com/shorttakes/stratten/star80.jpg

--There is a certain similarity to Dazzler in the movie poster above and the issue definitely explores a similar topic.

--As AstonishingXman says the lighthearted tone of this issue seems very much in contrast to the content---He is trying to kill her after all.....The sequence where he's dressed in a comedy cowboy outfit and where he gets his makeover seem like outtakes from the 'Boy's' and 'Girls' issues from about 15 issues ago.....The comedy effort just doesn't suit the plot.

--Dazzler hasn't looked better since she joined the X-men.....I love the sequence where they doll her up in various looks and then decide on her original one....All pointless of course since she can't be photographed anyway!

--Why doesn't Callisto put up a better fight against those thugs.....She might have a different face but she's still got all her experience...She should be kicking ass!.....Also Peter proves himself to be very superficial.....He spent a lot of time wiith Callisto while recovering on Muir Isle.....He wasn't in any way attracted to her then.....He seems to be a guy who judges a book by it's cover...Saying that she is dramatically improved,lookswise!!

--As WBE states,there is an unexpected return from Fenris who spend a lot of time hanging around on boats drinking champagne.....Wasn't that what they were doing the last time we saw them......Am I the only one who thinks there's a hint of something incestuous between them??:eek:

--I'm assuming it was The Shadow King in the guise of David Haller who tipped them off,BTW?

--Great seeing Dazz back in her roller-disco outfit at the end.....She kung-fu kicks him while wearing the skates....very impressive for a girl out of practice(she fell on her ass a few panels before that!)

--I enjoyed this issue.....I've always liked Dazzler but where does she go from here?.....The Banshee/Forge plot about finding the X-men is quite gripping ....According to this they should b heading to California to look for Dazzler next....(Eyes up to heaven smilie!)

[NickFury90]

Screw it, I'm getting these X-men Essentials >_>

[limerick]

My God man, and you admit it too?

LOL lim, it's safe to say that all of us who post here are in one way or another. ;)



Yes, and do you want to know something funny? We are making the Marvel editors calling the outfit as such (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=22961).

I agree, the costume is hot when drawn by Lee but I would have prefered if she had kept the Lady Mandarin armor instead.

It looks kinda clunky,though....I thought she might have gone back to the previous armour she had.....It really seemed to be the business,providing huge protection while not hindering movement......Wolvie used to get them made up in Madripoor

What was up with the print run for Uncanny X-Men #248? Printing error?

I've got the original and the gold backgrounded 2nd printing. This came to be a valuable issue during the 1990's (anywhere from $20 to $40...and still goes for $14-20) because Marvel only printed a little over 400,000 copies of the pink background cover.

A strange oddity for Jim Lee's first issue.

It does sound like a very low print run for Uncanny at the time??:confused:

#259 & #260-

Some of the weirdest Uncanny X-Men issues.



Genosha making its second feature, with characters still viewed as property.
Banshee and Forge encountering a random appearance by the Fenris Twins.
Jenny Ransome is made into the perfect "slave" via her skintight body suit.
Dazzler in a gimp mask, trying to sooth her tormentor.
Masque getting off on making Callisto "de-ugly", and Colossus just getting off on Callisto.


You know, these last three...kinda fetishy, to say the least.

You're turning into Imraith with all the fetish talk!:biggrin:

Like I said last week, 1990 was a shitty time for all the X-titles except Excalibur.

Well, Uncanny picked up after the Captain America Issue, but:


X-Factor- gay vampires and shitty art

New Mutants- shitty X-Terminator replacements, Liefeld

Uncanny- shitty post-Silvestri artist, tentacle Jean, shitty morlocks story and wtf Dazzler and Psylocke stories

The vibe I'm getting here is you thought the X-books were pretty 'shitty' at the time---I would tend to agree with you about New Mutants and X-factor....they're not exactly on fire right now.:frown:

Nothing to say about 259 except I liked it. I remember this was the same week as some Leonardi / Sienkiewicz Excalibur, was it Megan against Jamie? I hated all super hero comics except those two. Jenny's boyfriend (I forget his name because he is just a flatscan) seems pretty happy to have Collossus around, I wonder if they did sandwiches. It's nice to see what happened to them.

I enjoyed Dazzler's pacifist approach to her problems. It fits well with how much crap she would put up with in her own series, without ever defending herself that much. The few issues I could stomach reading, anyway.

Can't wait for the tentacles to come out and play~ btw you might want to read X-Factor 54 along with UXM 261 since uncanny and that book had some sort of cross over that month.


I've just finished that Excalibur summary on the Excaliber From the Beginning thread.....It was Leonardi pencilling another X-book--only Wolverine and X-factor to go and he's got the set!


As much as I don't like Claremont's writing, looking through this blog made me realize just how good John Byrne is. If there was a way to get his work in black and white, that would be cool.

Go for it!!

now we are entering a REALLY BORING era in the UXM book

I LOVED the cover to issue 260 but it's a shame the interior art looked so rushed (though it was a million times better than the set of artists coming up in the run)

I thought the art was better than last issue which did look particularly rushed....The cover is great...He looks mental!

[limerick]

One thing that's been bothering me...How did Betsy become a Kung-Fu master in about 5 minutes??....Not much time passes between her emerging from the Seige to her kicking everyone's ass.....How the f**k did that happen??

[Goshin]

One thing that's been bothering me...How did Betsy become a Kung-Fu master in about 5 minutes??....Not much time passes between her emerging from the Seige to her kicking everyone's ass.....How the f**k did that happen??


Had Storm gone thru Siege Perlious, would she have come back as a white woman, or a man...?

[Category1Games]

One thing that's been bothering me...How did Betsy become a Kung-Fu master in about 5 minutes??....Not much time passes between her emerging from the Seige to her kicking everyone's ass.....How the f**k did that happen??

Good point here Limerick. I'd guess because she took over a Ninja's body that she had instant knowledge of Ninja skills? Just throwing it out there but it doesn't really make sense either unless she also gained the memories of the woman which she didn't. So you would think she would just act like the person she was before.

Maybe there was a lot of mind control or something along those lines that they use as an excuse for it?

[AstonishingXMan]

http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/261.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #261

"Harriers Hunt!"
by Chris Claremont & Marc Silvestri (cover by Jim Lee)

In Madripoor, former S.H.I.E.L.D. employees-turned mercenaries Hardcase & The Harriers (Longbow, Ranger, Shotgun, 'Axe, Warhawk, Lifeline, Blindside, Piston, & Timebomb) prepare to capture Wolverine, Psylocke, and Jubilee.

Elsewhere in town, Jubilee throws a tantrum at a restaurant until she's brought "McBurgers" on a platter. Wolverine & Psylocke engage in a psychic "conversation" with Logan's projected memories of Carol Danvers & Nick Fury, who make a point that technically, the X-Men are just as much "ghosts" as they are. Just then, 'Axe pulls Wolverine through the wall and Shotgun shoots Jubilee in the chest.

Beneath the ruins of the X-Mansion, Forge & Banshee search for clues on who is trying to stop them from finding the X-Men. Sean suspects Moira MacTaggart, who has been acting much differently than the woman he loves. Banshee challenges Forge to find some way to track down the X-Men, despite knowing they're invisible to detection. Jean Grey arrives on the grounds of the devastated mansion, pondering Cyclops' proposal to her. She is attacked by grotesque lifeforms who have taken on faces of the X-Men. Jean fends them off but is caught offguard by her own duplicate, who bites her in the neck! The unconscious Jean is teleported away.

At a hospital, Cylla Markham, her body badly burned and ravaged, accepts Donald Pierce's offer to become his latest cyborg mercenary.

Jubilee is woken out of bed by Psylocke, which scares Jubilation into tears. She was shot with a weapon designed to knock her out, not kill her. Rose Wu appears in their room and is told to gather allies for his rescue.

At the Harriers' base of operations, Jubilee yells at Psylocke to stay out of her head. Jubilee, mistaken as a pizza delivery boy, enters their base right through the front door. She pops her fireworks all over, springing the captive Wolverine loose in the process. Comedy alert as Jubilee throws one of her fireworks down the back of 'Axe's pants. The numbers game catches up to Jubilee and Psylocke, but Wolverine appears and the truth of this whole operation is revealed.

Wolverine hired Hardcase to have the Harriers capture him. He wanted to test Psylocke & Jubilee's ability to work together and trust one another. Just then, Rose Wu and a group of Wolverine's Madripoor allies bust in to the warehouse, unaware of the false alarm. Wolverine is happy his two mutant friends worked together because next time it won't be a test.

END.

Thoughts: This was not very good. Aside from some fun Jubilee moments, this would have been a "filler" issue of Wolverine, much less the flagship X-Men book. Banshee & Forge, abandoned on a Greek island last issue, sure got to New York in a hurry. The art was very pedestrian. Jubilee's means of enterting the Harriers' base was very nonsensical and silly. The entire "Wolverine tests Jubilee & Psylocke's teamwork" could have been a back-up that lasted 2-3 pages, not dominating an entire issue. The best thing about this issue was Pierce & Deathstrike recruiting a new Reaver, which was limited to a single page.

A special note in the credits reads "Hardcase & The Harriers created by Chris Claremont & Marc Silvestri" for some reason. Right under the credits for the issue. A bit much? Were Claremont & Silvestri expecting fan reaction to this dollar store G.I. Joe group to be that strong?

Shotgun reads an issue of Marvel's "WHAT THE--?!" comic and has a collection of books stashed away, which Jubilee destroys during Wolverine's rescue. She apologizes later and he does the same for ruining her favorite outfit.

Although Jubilee distrusts Psylocke, there seems to be a "big sister/little sister" tension building with Jubilee growing increasingly jealous of her.

Strange. Last issue Forge & Banshee decided to go find Dazzler instead of searching for the X-Men. This issue, they decide to resume the X-Men search (and find out who wants to stop them) instead of going to California to find Dazzler. Perhaps editorial decided they wanted Dazzler gone from the book altogether and changed things up.

Reprinted In: Cover is reprinted on page 239 of the X-Men Visionaries: Jim Lee TPB.

[worstblogever]

The sub-plot with the disfigured X-Men is really, really bad. Most of Masque's appearances in the 90s were just grotesque, and it's no wonder he ends up like he did.

The best plot from this issue may have been the "deal with the devil" between Cylla Markham and Donald Pierce, though.

[Valjean999]

They were probably hoping that "Hardcase and the Harriers" would be such a hit that they would get their own spin-off title, a la Alpha Flight. As far as I know, they were never seen after this issue?

[AstonishingXMan]

I like that Chinese girl Jubilee is actually drawn as looking like a Chinese girl, which disappeared as she became more mainstream and popular.

[Harold Sotomayor]

I rather liked the Masque adventure. It was a great spotlight on the characters of Forge, Banshee, and Marvel Girl (especially the latter since it's not by Louise Simonson). My only complaint about the writing was that Forge's backstory dominated too many pages.

Were Hardcase and the Harriers never seen again? Obviously they must have been planned for use in other titles or possibly their own. Their concept doesn't seem like anything special but as we all should know, it's the writers that make characters popular or not, as Claremont did with the X-Men.

[AstonishingXMan]

They likely weren't used because Claremont & Silvestri had creative control of them, hence the notation in the credits for #261.

However, Blindside is noted as a "potential recruit" for the Initiative program in 2007's Civil War: Battle Damage one-shot.

[limerick]

Interestingly,Hardcase and the Harriers have appeared before in Wolverine # 5 over a year before this.....Shotgun,'Axe(going by his full title,Battleaxe)and Hardcase featured.....Silvestri wasn't involved in that issue so I'm guessing Claremont came up with those three and Claremont/Silvestri put the rest of the team together for this issue of Uncanny.(see page 7 of the Wolverine thread for a lowdown of issue # 5...Use the link at the bottom of the post to connect)

EDIT:Actually,this appearance is referenced in the issue on page 4.

[Daniel Mengsk]

One thing that's been bothering me...How did Betsy become a Kung-Fu master in about 5 minutes??....Not much time passes between her emerging from the Seige to her kicking everyone's ass.....How the f**k did that happen??

Will be (sort of) explained when yes, Revanche comes into the picture in X-Men.

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-men # 261:

--Is this Silvestri's last issue?...He can't have too many left now.

--It's not the strongest issue by any manner of means.....The Harriers are weak enough opponents without the turning out to be a Wolverine set-up....It all falls a bit flat at the end(Jessica and Lindsey look pretty hot on the 'Wolverine Rescue Squad',though!).....As AstonishingXman says,this issue could have been a passable issue on Wolverine's own title but seems a little strange in the current Uncanny athmosphere....I really don't know what to expect with each issue at the moment.

--AstonishingXman,you asked a question regarding distribution a few days ago......This issue gives some distribution figures......Interestingly of approx 600,000 issues printed per(roughly),175,000 are returned from the newsagents.....That seems like a huge number of returns?!......What happens to those issues.....Do large Comic dealers end up getting them at cut-price rates or were they pulped?

--Timebomb is the lamest Marvel character of all time.....He tries to prdict where they'll be battling someone,plants loads of explosives around that area and then prays the enemy walks nearby----I need 'An Eyes up to Heaven Smilie',now!

--Psylocke has some interesting Butt-floss moments with her new costume....Why would she carry on using a costume given to her by a group who brain-washedher into becoming an assassin?

--I had been wondering why Banshee and Forge didn't head after Dazzler as they planned.....But it is explained to an extent.....They change their plans after just missing the bomb meant for them in the last issue and head to the X-mansion instead.....Is this Forge's first time in Westchester?

--Another appearance by strangely familiar franchise--McBurgers....Reminds me of Birdbrain!

[limerick]

Will be (sort of) explained when yes, Revanche comes into the picture in X-Men.
Hi,G-man Yeah,but prior to Ret-cons,this makes no sense.....Not that the ret-con makes much either!

[Daniel Mengsk]

Hi,G-man Yeah,but prior to Ret-cons,this makes no sense.....Not that the ret-con makes much either!

Hi l-man. ;)

CC tried to explain it in Contest of Champions II - apparently, Betsy was trained by the Hand - don't ask me how they managed to do that in what, a few days?

[limerick]

What do you think of my new signature??....it's got all the links any classic X-fan could need!

[Daniel Mengsk]

What do you think of my new signature??....it's got all the links any classic X-fan could need!

Does it come in blue and gold too? lol

Looks very nice - makes it easier to find them.

lim, I have to ask: this issues that you're currently reviewing - are they "old issues" to you, or are they the ones that you haven't read yet?

[limerick]

Does it come in blue and gold too? lol

Looks very nice - makes it easier to find them.

lim, I have to ask: this issues that you're currently reviewing - are they "old issues" to you, or are they the ones that you haven't read yet?
No,these are old issues,although I wouldn't be as familiar with them as the issues from 1989 and before that....I would think most of the issues I'm reviewing now,I've read twice....Once on trips home from university in 1990(I had subscriptions to these titles for a year and they were delivered to my parents address....I started reading the entire X-book run again in approx late 2006.....That was when I read these for the second time.......So this is my third reading......Whereas something like the Claremont/Byrne run from the late seventies/early eighties--I've probably read that 10 times during the eighties.

So basically, as things are going on the books are becoming less familiar.....I'll be entering uncharted territory from about 1993-1994,roughly--I'll let you know when!

[Daniel Mengsk]

So basically, as things are going on the books are becoming less familiar.....I'll be entering uncharted territory from about 1993-1994,roughly--I'll let you know when!

Don't worry lim - I'll notice when you start crying and post "why God, why" after every issue that you review. The mid-90's lim.....you'll see for yourself....

[limerick]

Don't worry lim - I'll notice when you start crying and post "why God, why" after every issue that you review. The mid-90's lim.....you'll see for yourself....
I'm preparing myself mentally for the shock,already!

[AstonishingXMan]

I bought Uncanny monthly from #297 to #403, that was my "run" as a kid/teen with comic books.

During that time I accumulated an impressive run of Uncanny comprised of issues #8, 13-14, 17, 20-21, 25, 27-28, and 37-403. All in NM condition! The X-Titles were my baby, I have everything. And now I'm stockpiling all the trades and Omnibuses as well. I'll admit, though, for back issues during the 90's boom, I was more interested in "OMG! I have the rare 1st Gambit!" than "Wow, I get to read Gambit's first appearance!" So a lot of these issues are new to me, even though I know the general plot of them.

Back to Jubilee. I remember as a kid I had no idea Jubilee was supposed to be Chinese until reading her origin in Wolverine (issue #70 or so) where it's shown how her parents were killed. Silvestri drew her well in these books!

[limerick]

Yeah,there's no real indication of Jubilee's origins at this stage.....Why did Gambit's first issue became so valuable??..Beat's me!

[CallMeGeoff]

LOL, SLOW DOWN!!!!! Astonishing, you're burning through these things! I was having a hard enough time keeping up before! :biggrin:

Seriously, though, you're doing a great job with these, Astonishing. Keep up the good work!

And Limerick, I love the sig! Makes it a lot easier to jump around from thread to thread. Plus, you're advertising the coolest threads on the interwebs. Good work all!

Since I'm so far behind, I'll speak more about this era of X-Men in general than any specific issue. Hopefully, I can catch up soon and provide thoughts on the individual issues.

This is an odd era for me. The settings are all over the place, and the stories often unfocused. I personally was sad to see the Outback era end. I know a lot of people weren't big fans of that era, and I totally understand why. I think the biggest problem with that period is that it ended too soon. If Claremont had taken more time to develop the characters and setting, it could have been a really amazing team. I loved the issues leading up to Inferno, and while I love Inferno as an event, it really derailed the series. After Inferno, it just struggled to find its footing again (I do love the Wolvie crucifixion issue, though).

Some of the characters were underdeveloped, particularly Longshot and Psylocke. I don't so much mind Longshot's character not being developed because he's such an oddball, and I think he kind of works as a mystery (his exit from the series was handled quite poorly, though...did ANYONE miss him???). Psylocke, however, really didn't get a chance to shine. She had the great moment with Sabretooth when she first joined, and we just started to see her develop a little after Inferno. Aaaaaaand now she's a Japanese ninja assassin. Pretty random, but I guess it's an interesting development. I did think Havok and Dazzler were portrayed very well, and I really grew to like their characters.

I'm curious what Claremont's thoughts were behind the Siege Perilous and why the X-Men ended up where they did. The Siege is supposed to judge people who go through it, and give them new lives according to their judgment. So it dumps Psylocke on the doorstep of the most dangerous ninja villains in the Marvel Universe? Pretty harsh! Is that her punishment for tricking her teammates into going through the Siege in the first place? She was just trying to save them, for cryin' out loud!

Dazzler more-or-less gets her old life back from before the X-Men, so I guess that's good for her. But it seems like any character development she received during her time with the X-Men is now suddenly washed away, and she's back to her former status quo. That's a little disappointing.

Colossus is a starving artist in New York, which is perfectly appropriate in my opinion.

Have we seen Havok yet? I know where he ends up, but I can't remember if we've seen him there yet.

Anyway, I'm just curious what Claremont's specific reasons were for these developments. Is this where the characters were destined to end up? Maybe it was less judgment on the Siege's part, and more choosing the paths where they'll do the most good. For example, would Wolverine and Jubilee have lasted much longer on their own? Wolvie's not in the best shape these days, and Jubilee is competent, but still very young. Is Psylocke the extra help they needed to keep them alive and safe?

Okay, sorry for the rambling post. It's been too long since I've posted my thoughts, so they're kind of all over the place. I'm off to read comics now.

[Goshin]

Funny how people on the forums say nobody missed Longshot but after he left the letters pages were full of fans begging him and Rogue to come back. Even all thru the 90s fans on the letters pages asked for Dazzler and Longshot to come back. Yes, I'm a Longshot fan and I know of other Longshot fans and the only time I run into Longshot-bashers is online.

[CallMeGeoff]

Funny how people on the forums say nobody missed Longshot but after he left the letters pages were full of fans begging him and Rogue to come back. Even all thru the 90s fans on the letters pages asked for Dazzler and Longshot to come back. Yes, I'm a Longshot fan and I know of other Longshot fans and the only time I run into Longshot-bashers is online.

I was referring to the characters in the story not missing him rather than we the readers. Dazzler (his supposed girlfriend!!) only mentioned him in passing, and didn't really seem all that upset that he was gone. Nobody else even gave him a second thought.

I personally like Longshot. I'm a big fan of his original mini-series, and I love a good Mojoverse story. It's great satire of showbiz mentality. Power comes from ratings so society is ruled by the media, the people in charge are spineless and evil, they engineer slaves to work for the cameras... Good stuff.

It's clear that the powers-that-be had big plans for Longshot, and it's a shame that they never came to fruition, because the way he left the series was poorly conceived and executed.

[Anodyne]

Can anyone recall the details of, and the creative teams involved in, the conflicting accounts of Betsy's Caucasion to Asian transformation? All I recall is that one writer unknowingly tried to explain what another writer had already explained. Kwannon was either part of the solution or part of the problem; I forget which.

Will be (sort of) explained when yes, Revanche comes into the picture in X-Men.
Ooops! :redface: Maybe I should have said "Revanche" in my previous post. Betsy, Kwannon, Lady Mandarin, Revanche--was anyone else involved in the body/power switcheroo?

I liked Dazzler's discovery that she can soothe an angry mind with her light. It's good that she can use her powers for something other than fighting or special effects.

Someone asked about Wolverine's control of his claws. He once used the not-popping-the-middle-claw trick on Rogue during a practice exercise. IIRC it was during or just after the Fall of the Mutants story arc.

[Goshin]

People forget Longshot had ties to Spiderman, Dr Strange and She-Hulk before joining the X-Men. As a matter of fact, he should interact with the MU more often. A Spiderman/Longshot team-up would be a fun read.

[AstonishingXMan]

Be on vacation 'til Monday!

Can't forget Uncanny X-Men Annual #14 which comes up after #265. It's the real first time Gambit ever appears in a comic book! #266 gets all the praise for his cover appearances, full introduction, and lead story, but fans get a first look at him in the Annual, which came out first.

And I wonder if we'll ever see those Genoshans again...

[limerick]

Great to have you back posting Geoff--We missed you!

You make some interesting points about the last 20 issues or so

--That's a good call on the reason for Betsyending up with The Hand---she did betray her team-mates even if her intentions were good....Personally,although the Ninja transformation is outrageous,something needed to be done with Betsy.....Her development has been zero over the last while......If this change is what Claremont needed to jump-start her then fair enough.

--IMO,the Seige Perilous was a disaster.....It doesn't do what it claims to......I thought going through the Seige would mean a re-birth....i.e. a complete new start.....But that's not the case at all......Peter's gone through 5 minutes and he's having flashbacks to his previous life.....The Siege sucks and was,for me,one of Claremonts weakest moments while writing Uncanny.....It really bugs me to this day:mad:

--Havok had a good period in the Outback,Dazzler less so ,I thought....But poor Longshot and Psylocke--Why did he bring them on board to then just ignore them as he did.....I'm wondering was he forced into making Longshot an X-men??

[limerick]

I was referring to the characters in the story not missing him rather than we the readers. Dazzler (his supposed girlfriend!!) only mentioned him in passing, and didn't really seem all that upset that he was gone. Nobody else even gave him a second thought.

I personally like Longshot. I'm a big fan of his original mini-series, and I love a good Mojoverse story. It's great satire of showbiz mentality. Power comes from ratings so society is ruled by the media, the people in charge are spineless and evil, they engineer slaves to work for the cameras... Good stuff.

It's clear that the powers-that-be had big plans for Longshot, and it's a shame that they never came to fruition, because the way he left the series was poorly conceived and executed.

Another good point about Dazzler forgetting him so easily--She had been really possessive of him for a while beforehand but she doesn't give him a secong thought.....Of course,I still don't have a clue where he went......Claremont seemed pushed into getting rid of him quickly for some reason....It didn't seem like a natural departure for the character.

People forget Longshot had ties to Spiderman, Dr Strange and She-Hulk before joining the X-Men. As a matter of fact, he should interact with the MU more often. A Spiderman/Longshot team-up would be a fun read.

Yeah,that's true...Longshot certainly didn't begin life as an X-book character...As I was saying I'm rally curious how Claremont ended up putting him into Uncanny.

Be on vacation 'til Monday!

Can't forget Uncanny X-Men Annual #14 which comes up after #265. It's the real first time Gambit ever appears in a comic book! #266 gets all the praise for his cover appearances, full introduction, and lead story, but fans get a first look at him in the Annual, which came out first.

And I wonder if we'll ever see those Genoshans again...

Have a good vacation,dude--You deserve it!

[adamthered]

I really think we're beginning to see the period were Bob Harris was starting to get more and more involved with the books. Maybe Claremont was slipping a bit but I have a feeling that's got to be more to it than that. The late 240s through late two 260s are just so disjointed after fifteen solid years. We've gotta be about to the point were Harras was telling Claremont, "we need to bring the O5 back to the main fold here."

[Goshin]

Longshot was originally supposed to be in Excalibur from what I heard. He would have fit perfectly, especially all the Mojo confrontations being told early on...

[jarrod]

Longshot was originally supposed to be in Excalibur from what I heard. He would have fit perfectly, especially all the Mojo confrontations being told early on...
Longshot and Colossus were both originally, Rachel wasn't, and Kitty Pryde was going to have a crush on Captain Britain. Excalibur was originally going to stay on Muir too, not move to the lighthouse.

[chrissstopher]

People forget Longshot had ties to Spiderman, Dr Strange and She-Hulk before joining the X-Men. As a matter of fact, he should interact with the MU more often. A Spiderman/Longshot team-up would be a fun read.

Might happen more often now given that X-Factor will be working more closely with the rest of the MU

[jlmoor]

Alright so I would like to play if that is alright.:smile: It is my understanding that you all are discussing Uncanny X-Men, and started with #1 (1963) and are now on #261? If that is correct I will be back in 4 issues where my die hard collection begins. I actually just re-read all of these and it would be fun to get everyone's reaction to them. If I have this wrong please let me know and I will go away post-haste.

[adamthered]

Alright so I would like to play if that is alright.:smile: It is my understanding that you all are discussing Uncanny X-Men, and started with #1 (1963) and are now on #261? If that is correct I will be back in 4 issues where my die hard collection begins. I actually just re-read all of these and it would be fun to get everyone's reaction to them. If I have this wrong please let me know and I will go away post-haste.

You're right on the money, jlmoor. Stick around!

[jarrod]

Might happen more often now given that X-Factor will be working more closely with the rest of the MU
I was sad there wasn't any acknowledgement during the Secret Invasion crossover. Then again, that Shot was a Skrull.

[noizu]

Hi l-man. ;)

CC tried to explain it in Contest of Champions II - apparently, Betsy was trained by the Hand - don't ask me how they managed to do that in what, a few days?

I always figured Psylocke learned her new ninja skills telepathically, it's something Jean Grey and a few other telepaths have been shown to do occasionally isn't it? Lifting the knowledge out of other people's minds.... doesn't really explain how she's physically able to do that stuff, but you have to presume the x-men training regime keeps one pretty fit!

[limerick]

I really think we're beginning to see the period were Bob Harris was starting to get more and more involved with the books. Maybe Claremont was slipping a bit but I have a feeling that's got to be more to it than that. The late 240s through late two 260s are just so disjointed after fifteen solid years. We've gotta be about to the point were Harras was telling Claremont, "we need to bring the O5 back to the main fold here."

The whole run you're talking about would seem to have a definitive purpose--These seemingly random events all seem to be leading somwhere--[SPOIL]That somewhere is the O5 rejoining the X-men.

Longshot was originally supposed to be in Excalibur from what I heard. He would have fit perfectly, especially all the Mojo confrontations being told early on...

Longshot and Colossus were both originally, Rachel wasn't, and Kitty Pryde was going to have a crush on Captain Britain. Excalibur was originally going to stay on Muir too, not move to the lighthouse.

Thanks,I love those interesting details---I knew about Colossus before and that Claremont had a last minute re-think......Muir Isle would have been a great location for Excalibur.

[limerick]

Alright so I would like to play if that is alright.:smile: It is my understanding that you all are discussing Uncanny X-Men, and started with #1 (1963) and are now on #261? If that is correct I will be back in 4 issues where my die hard collection begins. I actually just re-read all of these and it would be fun to get everyone's reaction to them. If I have this wrong please let me know and I will go away post-haste.

Thanks for posting---Hope you'll join in the thread!

I always figured Psylocke learned her new ninja skills telepathically, it's something Jean Grey and a few other telepaths have been shown to do occasionally isn't it? Lifting the knowledge out of other people's minds.... doesn't really explain how she's physically able to do that stuff, but you have to presume the x-men training regime keeps one pretty fit!

I suppose it's possible,A little like Keanu Reeves learning 'kung-fu' in the Matrix-----"I know Kung-Fu!"

And BTW,I can confirm from where I'm standing Psylocke looks very fit!:biggrin:

[Daniel Mengsk]

I suppose it's possible,A little like Keanu Reeves learning 'kung-fu' in the Matrix-----"I know Kung-Fu!"

And BTW,I can confirm from where I'm standing Psylocke looks very fit!:biggrin:

But if Revanche was the retcon, then I would think that CC's original intentions was to have Spiral/Mojo involved somehow (and not just as figments of Betsy's imagination).

[limerick]

Hi Giles...Definitely,Claremont's idea was that Betsy was changed by Mojo and Spiral......For the sake of the thread I'm just going with what we know to here.....But it was poorly explained,IMO,as previously discussed.

[Daniel Mengsk]

Hi Giles...Definitely,Claremont's idea was that Betsy was changed by Mojo and Spiral......For the sake of the thread I'm just going with what we know to here.....But it was poorly explained,IMO,as previously discussed.

Hello lim.

Yes, but was that sequence with Spiral/Mojo (in UXM 256) just a dream sequence, or was that supposed to be part of the explanation for Betsy's transformation? I think that that was part of CC's writing style back then; he left a few clues here and there and some of his stories open-ended for the future. The problem was though that he, for the most part, never went back to solve these little storylines of his.

[limerick]

MartinRedmond posted that she's casting aside her memories as the psychics try to re-wire her mind to be loyal to Mandarin.....Her 'dream' is probably refective of what really happened to her......As you say, 'dream' sequences were popular with Claremont at the time--too popular,IMO!

[Daniel Mengsk]

I always figured Psylocke learned her new ninja skills telepathically, it's something Jean Grey and a few other telepaths have been shown to do occasionally isn't it?

Yes, but I've always thought that knowledge aquired like that was temporary.

[limerick]

1990----An editorial crisis for the X-Books?

As I've read the X-book issues from late 1989 and early 1990 it has become clear there's something of a creative crisis at this time,especially artistically.Bob Harras seems unable to hold down artists for any sort of run on most of the X-books and some are suffering from a change in writer as well,taking away from any sort of consistency.

During the last couple of Summers Marvel have trie to push sales of their most profitable X-series by publishing fortnightly during the Summer months.....But it's leaving the artists stretched and the readers are paying the price eventually with sub-standard issues.

--Uncanny Men....Rotating artists with the ,admittedly,highly talented Jim Lee and Marc Silvestri alternating....But # 262 brings the arrival of some of the worst art seen on Uncanny in decades.

--New Mutants....A constantly changing artist on the New Mutants during the second Asgard story......Brett Blevins was unable to stand the pace of the extra issues......They even had to dig up an old Chris Claremont scripted New Mutant story for issue # 81 to plug a gap......Rob Liefeld has just started his run which is at least relatively uninterrupted.

--Excalibur....Has drifted away from the rest of the X-books and is now edited by a different editor(Terry Kavanagh).....Alan Davis is struggling to keep to the monthly schedule and there have been many fill-in artists including Rick Leonardi and Marshall Rogers.....# 20 has the first non-Claremont scripted issue as well as another artist(Ron Lim).....The feel of the comic book is seriously affected by Davis' abscence.

--X-Factor....After Walt Simonson's departure this book has seen several artist changes.....Art Adams,Rob Liefeld,Paul Smith(on a poor run by his standards)and now Terry Shoemaker have all filled in.....Smith's run was interrupted by an artistically average Archangel filler story and he wasn't able to draw the final issue of the Judgement War so another artist was drafted in to complete that.

--Wolverine....The title with probably the most changes......After only 24 issues we've got the fourth writer on the title.....After the Claremont/Buscema debut team,there has been a few Peter David stories before Goodwin/Byrne took over.....But they've only lasted one story arc before they've departed and from the editor's notes on the letter's page,I don't think Harras knows what's happening creatively.

Has Marvels attempt to wring money out of the franchise started to affect the quality of the books ??.....Or has Harras just been dreadfully unlucky?.....Either way the days of long Writer/Artist runs are well and truely gone for now.....Remember Claremont/Byrne,Claremont/Romita Jr......By allowing an artist to dig i for long periods a creative consistency was produced

[Goshin]

I'm almost caught up with you guys, by the way as I read the entire run myself. Started with Giant-Sized #1 around labor day, and just finished Inferno yesterday. The Australian period is waaaaay shorter than I remember.

[CallMeGeoff]

1990----An editorial crisis for the X-Books?

As I've read the X-book issues from late 1989 and early 1990 it has become clear there's something of a creative crisis at this time,especially artistically.Bob Harras seems unable to hold down artists for any sort of run on most of the X-books and some are suffering from a change in writer as well,taking away from any sort of consistency.

During the last couple of Summers Marvel have trie to push sales of their most profitable X-series by publishing fortnightly during the Summer months.....But it's leaving the artists stretched and the readers are paying the price eventually with sub-standard issues.

--Uncanny Men....Rotating artists with the ,admittedly,highly talented Jim Lee and Marc Silvestri alternating....But # 262 brings the arrival of some of the worst art seen on Uncanny in decades.

--New Mutants....A constantly changing artist on the New Mutants during the second Asgard story......Brett Blevins was unable to stand the pace of the extra issues......They even had to dig up an old Chris Claremont scripted New Mutant story for issue # 81 to plug a gap......Rob Liefeld has just started his run which is at least relatively uninterrupted.

--Excalibur....Has drifted away from the rest of the X-books and is now edited by a different editor(Terry Kavanagh).....Alan Davis is struggling to keep to the monthly schedule and there have been many fill-in artists including Rick Leonardi and Marshall Rogers.....# 20 has the first non-Claremont scripted issue as well as another artist(Ron Lim).....The feel of the comic book is seriously affected by Davis' abscence.

--X-Factor....After Walt Simonson's departure this book has seen several artist changes.....Art Adams,Rob Liefeld,Paul Smith(on a poor run by his standards)and now Terry Shoemaker have all filled in.....Smith's run was interrupted by an artistically average Archangel filler story and he wasn't able to draw the final issue of the Judgement War so another artist was drafted in to complete that.

--Wolverine....The title with probably the most changes......After only 24 issues we've got the fourth writer on the title.....After the Claremont/Buscema debut team,there has been a few Peter David stories before Goodwin/Byrne took over.....But they've only lasted one story arc before they've departed and from the editor's notes on the letter's page,I don't think Harras knows what's happening creatively.

Has Marvels attempt to wring money out of the franchise started to affect the quality of the books ??.....Or has Harras just been dreadfully unlucky?.....Either way the days of long Writer/Artist runs are well and truely gone for now.....Remember Claremont/Byrne,Claremont/Romita Jr......By allowing an artist to dig i for long periods a creative consistency was produced

I definitely think that the bi-weekly schedule has been a detriment, and to more than just the artists. If you look at the stories lately, they've been drawn out way too long. I feel like the writers couldn't come up with enough material fast enough to fill all these issues, so they just expanded the stories they already had planned.

X-Men has the breakup of the X-Men being drawn out. New Mutants had the Asgard story that lasted way too long. X-Factor had the 50-part Judgment War (it seemed like 50, anyway). Excalibur has the Cross-Time Caper.

The stories in X-Men and Excalibur started strong, in my opinion, but have since lost their direction. I have a feeling Claremont had his stories planned out farther in advance than Simonson, which helped him keep things going longer. But now the deadlines are taking their toll.

Simonson seems to have recovered somewhat, though. I'm enjoying X-Factor a lot more now that they've come back to Earth, and New Mutants seems to be finding itself again with Liefeld on board.

Mind you, all of this is speculation/opinion on my part. But it is kind of upsetting that things are so below par. These books used to be some of the best comics out there. I think editorial decided that sales are more important than a quality product. Reminds me of my own job!

[CallMeGeoff]

Yes, but I've always thought that knowledge aquired like that was temporary.

Off topic, but I just wanted to let you know that the owls are not what they seem. :wink:

[AstonishingXMan]

I'll be tackling some more issues soon, starting tonight with our favorite poorly drawn, wacky, Morlock garbage issue - #262! I hope the build-up has been worth it!

Coming soon...nah, that's a secret, mon ami!

[Joey]

yay for this thread picking back up (if only to get through this crap phase sooner and get to the better upcoming stories)

[jlmoor]

mispost.....

[Goshin]

Just finished #250, ill be caught up with you guys in a day or two FINALLY! I've been reading 4 issues or so a day since labor day.....

[limerick]

Just finished #250, ill be caught up with you guys in a day or two FINALLY! I've been reading 4 issues or so a day since labor day.....
almost there,Dude!

[Parch]

I figured I might as well jump on board too. Since the Alpha Flight and Wolverine threads don't get a lot of traffic, I can start to re-read Uncanny at this point and join in. I first read these a couple of years ago.

[Goshin]

I bought the entire aussie period for 50 cents each at half price books as a kid around the AoA/Onslaught era, as well as the drama/soap opera Rachel/Mohawk Storm JrJr period $3 back issues at the comic book store. Didn't read the John Byrne/Dave Cockrum era until those black and white essentials came out 10 years ago. Now I have Uncanny 1-300 on CD and are perfect to read during rainy days on my laptop while bumping Notorious BIG, Juvenile or some Eightball/MJG. Claremont's original run is the best cuz its one big 15 year soap opera. Scot Lobdell is second place. After that everything fell to pieces when Maggot and Joseph etc. I miss my X-family that cared for each other and had feelings, these books helped me thru some hard times as a kid. I don't get that feeling with Fraction, so I read Forever and X-Factor for that. I think K/Y, Carey or PAD should take over Uncanny and actually use all the Wallpaper characters like Dazzler, Iceman, etc. Longshot gets more action than 80% of the core line-up lol

And what the hell is he doing with Xavier and Magneto? Someone never read Legacy....

Magneto has always been in my top five favorite characters but HE DON'T BOW DOWN TO NOBODY!!!

I would rather Grand Morisson come back, turn Nightcrawler into a dog and bodyswap Jean with a stereotypical red-weave black chick than to read anymore Fraction penned work. And I hate Morisson...

Let K&Y take over writing and let the X-Force art team take over after second coming. For the first time in x-history the 2nd rate books are all better than the core x-men book.

Where is Scott Lobdell these days? When he took Claremont's place I barely noticed any change at all except for Bishop and Cannonball joining. All these new writers wanna change everybody's costume, kill for shock value and do something dramatic when they come along instead of going with the flow. Had Claremont not have a six month time-gap and continued a week or so after they fought Sinister in space it would have been much better than that revolution crap Marvel shitted out on all the x-books. Ever since then its been a big unstable mess. I think the first half of X-Treme and early Astonishing were the best out of this decade. I'm glad there are only two months left in this shitty decade, it's felt like 89-90 stretched out. 00-09 has been rough industrial TP wiping Joe Q's sweaty ass cheeks after eating cheap mexican food. This decade for X-Men is akin to what's going on in hip hop music right now, washed up and exploited for cash and sacrificing quality in favor of flash and gaudiness. This decade is to the X-Men what the 80s was for Camaros, flashy and pretty but nothing under the hood. Fans bashing Claremont is like mustang fans bashing Carol Shelby for ressurecting the GT500. The Dark Phoenix Saga is 2Pac, Utopia/Nation X is Lil Wayne. Days of Future Past is Mad Magazine to Here Comes Tomorrow's Cracked Magazine. If X-Men #1 was Thriller, Uncanny #500 is Blood On The Dancefloor.

Bring back my X-Men, please.....

[AstonishingXMan]

If you're in the mood for a bad Uncanny story, you've come to the right place at the right time!

[Goshin]

The next seven issues of Uncanny read like something Chucl Austen or Fraction would write. I think ill skip these and go straight to #268...

[AstonishingXMan]

The Uncanny X-Men #262

http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/262.jpg

"Scary Monsters" by Chris Claremont & Kieron Dwyer

Deep in the Morlock tunnels, Forge & Banshee observe six hostiles, including a Marvel Girl lookalike, standing over a fallen Jean Grey. Forge considers killing them. The grotesque Jean lookalike has a tongue with another demonic Jean head on it! The duo attacks and is able to rescue Jean, but her captors quickly teleport away.

Jean suits up in the new X-Men uniform at the mansion. On the subject of Moira MacTaggert's odd behavior, she mentions knowing Moira long before the X-Men ever formed. Jean confirms to Sean & Forge that the X-Men are alive. They explain to her that Donald Pierce & The Reavers are out to find (and kill!) the X-Men themselves.

In California, the Reavers send a message to the White Queen by destroying her Frost Technotics labs. Lady Deathstrike explains that Pierce is looking forward to sending a deadlier message to her in person.

At the Mansion, Banshee & Forge catch Jean up to speed on the Reavers/Freedom Force battle on Muir Island. Also, the whereabouts of Callisto are unknown. The rest of X-Factor are away and unable to help the trio. When talking about their future on the two X-teams, Banshee and Jean are suddenly teleported away!

In Washington, D.C., Valerie Cooper and Senator Steward greet the Genoshan named Pipeline, who teleports Chief Magistrate Anderson into the White House. He has a Genoshan slave boy with him. A discussion of civil rights ensues when Anderson unable to be convinced that Genoshan mutant captives are nothing more than property, more specifically Genoshan machines used for work. The Genoshans, who the United States is in debt of 35 million dollars to, want full authority to pursue Jenny Ransome, Phil Moreau, and the X-Men. They're coming for them, like it or not. It's up to the United States to decide if they want a war they might not win.

Forge searches the Morlock tunnels for Banshee & Jean Grey. He recalls his younger days, leaving the reservation at 18 to fight in Vietnam, much to the elder Naze's objections. He spots a creature with the face of Storm, and refuses to pull the trigger, unlike 'Nam where he pulled the trigger on a young boy.

At an art gala in Manhattan, the amnesic Colossus (as Peter Nicholas) is revered for his amazing paintings. He spots the beautiful woman that has been haunting him and chases her into a car. Jenny Ransome helps him, but draws attention to herself by tearing the car apart. It's empty inside! Later, Peter is thinking about her in the apartment when she suddenly appears! Peter is shocked, and even more surprised to see the morlock Masque behind her! They teleport away!

Forge continues to search the tunnels, and regrets turning down a job with S.H.I.E.L.D. to stay in 'Nam. He is attacked by monsters who wear the faces of the X-Men, X-Factor, and New Mutants! Banshee leaps to Forge's rescue and the monsters are driven away for now. However, Jean and Banshee appear before Forge...with some alterations. Banshee has no mouth and Jean's arms have been replaced with hundreds of purple tentacles!

END.

THOUGHTS:

This felt like one of Chris Claremont's plots for Excalibur tagged with the "Uncanny X-Men" name. This silly stuff really has no place in the main X-book.

A lot of convenient teleporting in this issue. I counted four different teleporting moments! BAMF!

The impending threat of the Genoshans is coming...hmmm....

The art, by the "guest" (used loosely) penciller wasn't THAT horrible, but it was very plain and some panels looked bad. I thought the Washington and Forge flashback scenes were his best efforts. This artwork simply isn't good enough for the book.

This "tentacle Jean Grey and mouthless Banshee" plot is just silly. And seriously, Jean Grey is captured TWICE by the Morlocks in two issues? C'mon now. I suppose the Princess Zelda rescues were hot in 1990 with the Nintendo Comics out.

[Goshin]

I prefer Princess Toadstool, she coul kick sme as on her own from time to time...

[AstonishingXMan]

You know, compared to the trainwreck art of #263, this issue isn't that bad. Some of it (the shot of Jean and Banshee at the end) is actually GOOD, if not silly. Jean has about 100 crazy looking tentacles coming out of her arms. In #263, the new artist draws her with like 4 skinny tentacles on each arm. LOL.

[limerick]

I figured I might as well jump on board too. Since the Alpha Flight and Wolverine threads don't get a lot of traffic, I can start to re-read Uncanny at this point and join in. I first read these a couple of years ago.

Parch....great to have you on X-men from the beginning.....You've kept the Wolverine and Alpha Flight threads going.....I probably would have packed in from lack of onterest without you!

I bought the entire aussie period for 50 cents each at half price books as a kid around the AoA/Onslaught era, as well as the drama/soap opera Rachel/Mohawk Storm JrJr period $3 back issues at the comic book store. Didn't read the John Byrne/Dave Cockrum era until those black and white essentials came out 10 years ago. Now I have Uncanny 1-300 on CD and are perfect to read during rainy days on my laptop while bumping Notorious BIG, Juvenile or some Eightball/MJG. Claremont's original run is the best cuz its one big 15 year soap opera. Scot Lobdell is second place. After that everything fell to pieces when Maggot and Joseph etc. I miss my X-family that cared for each other and had feelings, these books helped me thru some hard times as a kid. I don't get that feeling with Fraction, so I read Forever and X-Factor for that. I think K/Y, Carey or PAD should take over Uncanny and actually use all the Wallpaper characters like Dazzler, Iceman, etc. Longshot gets more action than 80% of the core line-up lol

And what the hell is he doing with Xavier and Magneto? Someone never read Legacy....

Magneto has always been in my top five favorite characters but HE DON'T BOW DOWN TO NOBODY!!!

I would rather Grand Morisson come back, turn Nightcrawler into a dog and bodyswap Jean with a stereotypical red-weave black chick than to read anymore Fraction penned work. And I hate Morisson...

Let K&Y take over writing and let the X-Force art team take over after second coming. For the first time in x-history the 2nd rate books are all better than the core x-men book.

Where is Scott Lobdell these days? When he took Claremont's place I barely noticed any change at all except for Bishop and Cannonball joining. All these new writers wanna change everybody's costume, kill for shock value and do something dramatic when they come along instead of going with the flow. Had Claremont not have a six month time-gap and continued a week or so after they fought Sinister in space it would have been much better than that revolution crap Marvel shitted out on all the x-books. Ever since then its been a big unstable mess. I think the first half of X-Treme and early Astonishing were the best out of this decade. I'm glad there are only two months left in this shitty decade, it's felt like 89-90 stretched out. 00-09 has been rough industrial TP wiping Joe Q's sweaty ass cheeks after eating cheap mexican food. This decade for X-Men is akin to what's going on in hip hop music right now, washed up and exploited for cash and sacrificing quality in favor of flash and gaudiness. This decade is to the X-Men what the 80s was for Camaros, flashy and pretty but nothing under the hood. Fans bashing Claremont is like mustang fans bashing Carol Shelby for ressurecting the GT500. The Dark Phoenix Saga is 2Pac, Utopia/Nation X is Lil Wayne. Days of Future Past is Mad Magazine to Here Comes Tomorrow's Cracked Magazine. If X-Men #1 was Thriller, Uncanny #500 is Blood On The Dancefloor.

Bring back my X-Men, please.....

Goshin,you've got a way with words.....although I'll try not to think about that Joe Q. comment too much!

You know, compared to the trainwreck art of #263, this issue isn't that bad. Some of it (the shot of Jean and Banshee at the end) is actually GOOD, if not silly. Jean has about 100 crazy looking tentacles coming out of her arms. In #263, the new artist draws her with like 4 skinny tentacles on each arm. LOL.

You're right....this issue is a bit better than I remember.....But I still don't think this art was good enough for the best selling comic book of it's time.

[jlmoor]

Three more issues and I can totally have an opinion:smile:

[limerick]

Three more issues and I can totally have an opinion:smile:
jlmoor.....I've been enjoying your posts on other threads so I'm looking foward to your input.

[jlmoor]

jlmoor.....I've been enjoying your posts on other threads so I'm looking foward to your input.
Unfortunately when it comes to comic matter it is generally fangirl crap like ‘gambit is seksi w/his shirt off.’ I’ll try and maintain some dignity on your thread though. :wink:

[alf_to_the_rescue]

*sniffs pages* It has been some time since I took this issue out. Not only Tentacle Jean but "Alien head on tongue" Jean as well!

[MartinRedmond]

THis storyline is awesome. I feel I have to post to defend how much it rocked ass. Chris brings back the Morlocks in grand style after what? 5 years?

[Midnightblue]

[QUOTE=jlmoor;9930067]Unfortunately when it comes to comic matter it is generally fangirl crap like ‘gambit is seksi w/his shirt off.’ QUOTE]

it is never wrong to state the truth:biggrin:

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-men # 262:

--Forge and Banshee make a good team.....I suppose their ages are closer than some of the other X-men.....Forge is open to the new X-men 'way'....i.e.kill if nessecary but old-school Banshee keeps him from picking the Morlocks off with his rifle.

--Jean confirms that she knew Moira MacTaggert from way back before the X-men were formed.....I think this was referred to in a Classic X-men backstory but this might be the first mention in Uncanny.

--Moira designed the new uniforms(I thought it was Forge).....That explains why they're a little bit kinky.

--Forge and Banshee have let Moira believe that they died in that plane crash in Greece---What is it with the X-men and fake deaths?!.....And when he finds out from Jean that the X-men are definitely still alive he angrily asks "How could they?".....ahem...pot...kettle....

--The sequence where the Genoshans meet Val Cooper in Washington is scary.....the chief Magistrate doesn't even think of mutants as people...more like machines.

--The Morlock tunnels are very similar to the tunnels in the movie ,'Aliens'.....and Forge is like Ripley moving through the tunnels heavily armed.

--Is it just me or does Peter seem a bit pretentious in his tortured artist phase.....he even swigs back champagne while sporting a ponytail(how'd he grow that so quick?),for crying out loud!(Shouldn't it be vodka?).....He's ebven got designer stubble!.....when did he make the jump from building caretaker to professional artist?

--The last page is a shock!....(How's Banshee gonna have Irish stew with no mouth!.....Begorrah!)

[limerick]

THis storyline is awesome. I feel I have to post to defend how much it rocked ass. Chris brings back the Morlocks in grand style after what? 5 years?
The one thing I don't like about the Masque altered Morlocks is that they have no personality----they are like mindless robots......I preferred the old Morlocks who represented all ages/physiques/personalities....They seemed like a real community

But I am enjoying this ongoing story to track down the X-men(although this issue isn't a highlight).....You never know what's coming next....The art's not awesome but it's passable

[Joey]

"Alien head on tongue" Jean

one of the WORST things in the story

[Imraith Nimphais]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-men # 262

vomitous!

[Parch]

thoughts on #262

I'm really not a fan of this art style. Too busy, too old school, and it ends up making these "monsters" look silly. What's supposed to be scary ends up looking ridiculous. If they were trying to be creepy, they failed, and I agree that this is a lame way to represent the Morlocks.

Peter's art show looked interesting. Pretty boy definately has a rather "erotic" collection that could have been Rated R. Seems to be a completely different character though.

The story itself isn't a bad idea. There's some good Forge moments and I think that's what the title is trying to be, but maybe they could have made it a little more focused on Forge if that's what they were going for. A little less Jean and Banshee would have made it a proper Forge story, but perhaps they're trying to keep up with the "lost team" story.

But this whole "scary monster" theme with the bad art really brings down this issue. The big finale is Jean and Banshee joining these goofy looking mutated mutants? Doesn't work for me. It's a lame and forgetable issue.

[AstonishingXMan]

http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/uncanny-x-men/263-1.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #263

"The Lower Depths" by Chris Claremont & Bill Jaaska

Forge daydreams of his time in Vietnam as the tentacle-armed Jean Grey startles him. They have a heart-to-heart about the ongoing attempt to bring peace to mutantkind, a goal that humankind itself has yet to realize. Suddenly, one of Forge's spy cameras finds Masque holding the amnesic Colossus (Peter Nicholas) and the now-beautiful Callisto hostage in the tunnels.

Masque, noticing the resemblance, changes Peter's outer appearance to that of Colssus' armored form. However, it's just his appearance and he's vulnerable to attacks. Which Masque turns into a sick game! Masque temporarily restores Callisto's true Morlock appearance and gives her one hour before the Morlocks hunt Peter down. Jean and Forge intend to help them.

Val Cooper covertly meets KGB Col. Vazhin in a night club. They discuss the attempts of global domination by super-powered mutants. The impending Genoshan invasion is a big concern to him, with humankind losing no matter what the result.

Forge flashes back to a no-win situation his troop was involved in during Vietnam, facing unbeatable odds. This is the theme of the whole story: Forge in a similar situation given a shot at redemption.

Jean swings around the tunnels using her tentacles. Callisto and Peter are on the run, and the former still resents her beautiful appearance. Peter convinces her that her life shouldn't end because she's given a new type of life. Ironic, considering Peter himself is basically in Callisto's role, but doesn't know it.

Masque, Bliss, and Masque's Xavier Student imposters battle Peter and Callisto. Peter is stabbed in the chest as Jean, Banshee, and Forge arrive. Forge flashes back to his troop all being killed, with Forge using a Shaman spell to survive. Peter's mutant abilities kick in, to his surprise, and he armors up into Colossus! Masque, Bliss, and their forces are ultimately defeated. Masque and company teleport away, but Jean and Banshee remained transformed!

Back at Peter's apartment, Jean and Banshee are back to normal! It seems that Forge purposely didn't tell them he could restore them without knowing for sure. Forge is on the roof, saying his "goodbyes" to the spirits of his troop, having now redeemed himself.

THOUGHTS:

The art was awful at some times and passable at others. Unacceptable. I like that cover, though. Almost looks like a different artist, huh?

The Colonel's name is "Vazhin" which sounds like Borat saying "Vagene" in his movie. The slow build to X-Tinction Agenda continues.

Kind of a flat ending. Best part of the issue was the drawing of parallels to Forge's first and latest attempt to get his friends out of a no-win situation.

The tentacles on Jean were drawn with either "4 or 5" per arm or TONS of them, depending on the artist's mood. Eh.

Mr. Sinister is still believed to be dead by Col. Vazhin. The big villains on the forefront now are the Mutant Liberation Front, Apocalypse, Sinister, and a FOURTH super villain, who has yet to be named. Hmmm...wonder who he meant.

I couldn't wait for this issue to end, honestly.

Reprinted In: None!

[Parch]

thoughts on #263

Better than the last one. They wrap up this story fairly well and it was a nice finish. I thought the nam flashbacks worked. Forge is a good character and hasn't been given a lot of decent stories, so at least this one tried. Love the boots. If Forge has a signature characteristic, it's gotta be the boots.

Masque really could be a nasty villian if they wanted him to be. I like the mexican standoff aspect of the story. He has control of these mutations and only he can fix them. That's a pretty strong poker hand and only some fancy work by Forge and Colossus got 'em out of it.

You know, if I had my mouth glued shut I'd be a little more freaked out about it. Banshee seemed so calm. Even Jean with her slimy tentacles was so casual about it. Even though they couldn't do anything and Masque was in control, they should of at least had a hissy fit about it. When you get mutilated, it requires more fuss, less mellow.

They salvage the story alright, but it's still a below average title. Not a lot of action and the pages devoted to the mutant political situation always drag down an issue. It's been done better. And the art just isn't up to par for me. It's a 90's title stuck with 70's art. At least we know it gets better.

[Goshin]

This is actually worse than I remember.... What the HELL IS THIS!?!

[AstonishingXMan]

So who's the fourth super power?

Vezhin name drops Magneto as a former threat, then says as of late the MLF (who appeared for the first time about 5 months ago in New Mutants), Apocalypse (who's doin' his thing in X-Factor), Mr. Sinister ("killed" in Inferno), and ????? are the new big threats.

Kind of a subtle first X-Cutioner's song tease, if you consider that the big players are the MLF, Apocalypse, Sinister, and Stryfe. Maybe that answers the question. I know Claremont had nothing to do with the development of the Song, but let's imagine this flows seamlessly!

This is actually worse than I remember.... What the HELL IS THIS!?!

Hold on tight. The art sucks next month when the book becomes a bootleg "X-Factor" issue.

[MartinRedmond]

I'm relieved mostly X-Force fans hate this. I'd start questioning my sanity otherwise.

[Anodyne]

The Uncanny X-Men #262


In Washington, D.C., Valerie Cooper and Senator Steward greet the Genoshan named Pipeline, who teleports Chief Magistrate Anderson into the White House. He has a Genoshan slave boy with him. A discussion of civil rights ensues when Anderson unable to be convinced that Genoshan mutant captives are nothing more than property, more specifically Genoshan machines used for work.
:confused: If Anderson can't be convinced the Genoshan mutants are "nothing more than property," then he must believe they're something more than property. That's not how I remember it. Did you intend to say he couldn't be convinced they were anything more than property?

Wasn't it Aristotle who defined a slave as "a tool endowed with senses"?

[Joey]

#263

the only part I like is the cover :cool:

It is amazing how Banshee and Jean get dramatic changes and it doesn't seem to bother them that much. (and it's funny that Callisto would end up with the tentacles years later)

[MartinRedmond]

#263

the only part I like is the cover :cool:

It is amazing how Banshee and Jean get dramatic changes and it doesn't seem to bother them that much. (and it's funny that Callisto would end up with the tentacles years later)

They had faith in Forge and they're both seasoned pros. This isn't a team of dramaqueens, now that Havok & Dazzler are m.i.a.

[Joey]

Well I didn't expect them to QUEEN OUT but at least some hint at "OH SHIT!" before Jean braided her hair and swung through the sewer like Tarzan.

Oh and it has to be said again... the Siege Perilous was a pretty wasted plot device. Everyone just snapped back to their regular characters with very little effort. Of course at this point we haven't gotten the story on Alex or Rogue so we'll see.

[MartinRedmond]

Btw I loved the whine and cheeze Havok and Dazz brought to the team. I'm just pointing out the obvious to me. I think Jean and Sean could take it. Some people are made of sterner stuff.

[AstonishingXMan]

:confused: If Anderson can't be convinced the Genoshan mutants are "nothing more than property," then he must believe they're something more than property. That's not how I remember it. Did you intend to say he couldn't be convinced they were anything more than property?

Wasn't it Aristotle who defined a slave as "a tool endowed with senses"?

I should have said "Anderson is convinced that the Genoshan mutants are nothing more than property." I do these reviews at night time, gimme a break. :)

Also, personally I enjoyed Dazzler & Havok's Australian run as X-Men much more than Forge & Banshee at this time. Havok nailing Madelyene Pryor (wearing a blue dress) as freakin' "DEVIL IN A BLUE DRESS" blasts in the background is one of my favorite moments from the Inferno era.

Oh, Banshee hits on Jean when she's wearing the skin-tight X-Men uniform and she's like "Uh, go away" during this issue or last. What a creep. You put THIS guy in charge of the Generation X teens in similar outfits?

[Goshin]

Havok was a bitch until he grew some hair on his balls during inferno.

If he had his mouth shut 'deadpool-style' he woulda been freaking out trying to scream but all you would hear is "MMMMMHHH! MMMMMMMMMMMMMHHH!!"

At least Banshee didn't have a cold or a stuffy nose, he woulda been dead in less than a minute

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-men # 263:

--The art is very similar to the last issue,despite it being done by a different penciller(262-Kieron Dwyer,263-Bill Jaaska).......Both are inked by Josef Rubinstein so that may explain the similarity......Uncanny was never afraid to let relatively unknown artists have a go......John Byrne,Paul Smith and Silvestri were all relativey unknown before their X-Book runs......They weren't brand new to the scene but often this was their first huge job(In Byrne's case Uncanny was still relatively on the periphery of the Marvel Universe when he took over from Cockrum.

--Jean does seem to take her transformation in her stride.....On page 4 she takes to Forge like everything's okay.....As someone said ,maybe years in the X-men has prepared her for anything.

--Callisto's hair is mis-coloured White on the first panel of page 13.....Glynis Oliver very rarely makes any errors.

--Val Cooper is becoming quite a recurring character--(The beginning of her rehabilitation to a 'good' character---One of many Claremont characters to convert to the good side after beginning life in the X-books as 'bad ' guys---Forge,Callisto,Magneto....even Juggernaught wasn't all bad in his last appearance!

--This story does bring about some closure for Forge.....The events of Saigon and 'The Fall of The Mutants' were hard on him but he brings his team 'home' this time and in doing so resolves some of his demons......Vietnam was popular culturely around the time of this comic book being published......There were several movies about the U.S. forces experiences in Vietnam so this story would have felt more in synch with the late '80's/Early '90's.

--I was a bit confused about how Callisto's form keeps reverting and what exactll happened to Peter at the end.....Did he lose his memory of what just happened?.....He's really got the hots for Callisto,he says what's inside is all that matters but I didn't see him showing any interest in Callisto when she waswearing her old look!

--A return of fortnightly publication for Uncanny--Not Claremont's high point,that's for sure...The X-men are really all over the place at the moment with no proper team or base.

[limerick]

Havok was a bitch until he grew some hair on his balls during inferno.

If he had his mouth shut 'deadpool-style' he woulda been freaking out trying to scream but all you would hear is "MMMMMHHH! MMMMMMMMMMMMMHHH!!"

At least Banshee didn't have a cold or a stuffy nose, he woulda been dead in less than a minute

I've always loved Havok,especially his awesome costume....But I must admit he's been pretty much a whiner since his first appearance.....He spends a lot of time in Australia moaning about stuff(in a safari outfit,for some reason!)......He doesn't quit moanin' until X-Factor.

[AstonishingXMan]

Havok is a whiny baby without Polaris around.

I was a bit confused about how Callisto's form keeps reverting

She tells Peter that Masque "torments" her all the time by reverting her to "bad-ass" Callisto and making it so the effect slowly wears off and she reverts back to "beautiful" Callisto. Masque tricked her and she reverted to beautiful Callisto much quicker this time, which had her at a disadvantage in trying to protect Peter Nicholas.

[limerick]

Havok is a whiny baby without Polaris around.



She tells Peter that Masque "torments" her all the time by reverting her to "bad-ass" Callisto and making it so the effect slowly wears off and she reverts back to "beautiful" Callisto. Masque tricked her and she reverted to beautiful Callisto much quicker this time, which had her at a disadvantage in trying to protect Peter Nicholas.
But I thought he could only control his power 'hands-on' if you know what I mean.....I didn't realise he could set a time limit for a transformations.

His power really seems to have been upped this issue......He doesn't just alter peoples faces...he gives Jean completely new functional organs.....Theoretically he could cure cancer or correct spinal injuries...pity he's not on the X-men's side and he could do a lot of good.....As he is he's a scumbag!

[AstonishingXMan]

Masque likes screwing around with bionic X-Men, huh...wonder what would happen if he pulled this crap with Cable... :)

[Parch]

New functional organs, eh? The possible sexual implications are intriguing. Does adding tentacles involve any holes?

[AstonishingXMan]

http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/uncanny-x-men/264-1.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #264

"Hot Pursuit" by Chris Claremont & Mike Collins (cover by Jim Lee)

In Manhattan, Forge lands on the windshield of a police car. Genoshan Magistrates are after him. The Genoshans blow up the police car and Officer Murphy, partner of Detective Charlotte Jones, is killed in the process. Forge and Jones escape into the sewer system, with Forge explaining that being a mutant is a crime to a Genoshan. Forge gives Jones a dry X-Men costume from his bag, which Jones thinks looks rather silly.

In Washington, KGB operative Alexij Vazhin again covertly meets up with Val Cooper. He mentions that he now knows the identity of the fourth mysterious major mutant villain - someone known as The Shadow King. He is able to operate from any place in the world, and nearly impossible to track. Vazhin warns Cooper of the impending threat that The Shadow King poses.

High above the city in X-Factor's Ship, Jean Grey and Beast discuss Charles Xavier's dream and how following it means ultimately sacrificing a chance to be normal, despite the dream itself focusing on uniting man & mutant. Hints of Jean returning to the X-Men are given once again, as Beast noticed she still wears the torn-up X-Men uniform from last issue.

Back to the sewer, as Forge and Jones fight for their lives again the Genoshans. The "silly" X-Men uniform protects Jones from a gun shot as the duo defeat the Magistrates and head above ground to find Forge's allies at Ship.

Meanwhile, the Genoshan Magistrates orchestrate an attack on Ship. Wipeout uses his powers to deactivate Ship's defenses (as it is more alive that machine) and Pipeline transports both Magistrate soldiers and the strong mutant Punchout into the living room. They are there to arrest Phil Moreau and take back Jenny Ransome. Punchout nails Beast with a punch and Jean Grey is dropped with a tranquelizer dart. These Genoshans came prepared. Banshee lets out a scream but is cracked in the back of the head with a rifle. Callisto is restrained and Peter Nicholas gets a tranquilizer dart for his efforts. It's worth noting that Peter is back in his human form and now out of his "armored" Colossus mode. Apparently, his mind remembered how to transform back.

The Genoshans notice that Beast has disappeared and go after him. Big mistake. He takes out several Magistrated, nails Punchout with a flying kick and comes to Jean's aid. Beast's offense (a "double noggin' knocker and flying dropkick" are straight out of the WWF! Outside, Forge and Det. Jones free Ship from Wipeout's power-nullifying powers. Ship is now free to detain the invaders inside and the police are called to arrest them. However, to Jones' outrage, a federal order is called in demanding that the Genoshans are to be released and are free to return home. Those who murdered her partner will face no penalty. Beast says that he has contacted several news outlets, including Trish Tilby, with what the Genoshans did tonight.

Colossus still has no idea of his true history. He's an artist, and appreciates the help of these "X-Folks" but wants to return to his normal life with Callisto. Banshee and Jean Grey discuss whether Peter should know the truth of his past. They agreed that when he is needed, they'll know where to find him. He deserves to be happy in the meantime. Peter and Colossus share a kiss as the story come to a close.

End.

THOUGHTS:

This was the second Uncanny X-Men issue to come out in the month.

Can we all take a second and look at BEAST DRAWN BY JIM LEE on the cover? Damn. Compared to what's inside the issue...ugh. The art wasn't horrendous in the issue, but this is Uncanny X-Men and "average" means "disappointment." Can we get a regular, please? And one who is really good?

The Genoshans are starting to come off like Cobra in their failure to deal with the X-teams. When will they ever get it right? If only they had a real leader...

When listing the X-teams, Jean Grey mentions "...even Excalibur" in a moment that made me chuckle a bit.

Forge makes a joke about "the turtles" possibly attacking the defeated Magistrates in the sewer. Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles was set to come out in theatres shortly. More pop culture drops from CC. He's cool, he can get "jiggy with it," kids.

REPRINTED IN:

Cover is reprinted in the X-Men Visionaries: Jim Lee TPB.

[jlmoor]

Forge makes a joke about "the turtles" possibly attacking the defeated Magistrates in the sewer. [I]Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles was set to come out in theatres shortly. More pop culture drops from CC. He's cool, he can get "jiggy with it," kids.
I] TPB.

I don't think would have caught the TMNT ref:smile:
Okay so I'll re-read 265 tonight, you guys are flyign throught these issues.

[limerick]

Colossus still has no idea of his true history. He's an artist, and appreciates the help of these "X-Folks" but wants to return to his normal life with Callisto. Banshee and Jean Grey discuss whether Peter should know the truth of his past. They agreed that when he is needed, they'll know where to find him. He deserves to be happy in the meantime. Peter and Colossus share a kiss as the story come to a close.

.

Nice Summary,AstonishingXMan.....I know the work that goes into these things!.....(BTW.I always knew Peter loved himself!:biggrin:)

[Imraith Nimphais]

I don't give him wrong...If I looked like that, I'd be loving myself too...wink wink, nudge nudge.

[limerick]

I don't give him wrong...If I looked like that, I'd be loving myself too...wink wink, nudge nudge.
You like his new troubled artist,ponytailed angst look?!(Where'd the ponytail spring from---it's gotta be extensions...that's a big leap for a Siberian Farmboy

[Imraith Nimphais]

You like his new troubled artist,ponytailed angst look?!(Where'd the ponytail spring from---it's gotta be extensions...that's a big leap for a Siberian Farmboy

He's big, buff, beauty-full and sensitive...wot's not to like? :redface: but, yes...that ponytail would indeed have to die a tragic death first by guillotine then fire.:biggrin:

[Goshin]

I'm almost caught up, just got finished with the whole Psylocke mess (#256 what the fuck?)

Be reading the Colossus and Dazzler solo stories tonight, I'm dreading what comes next :/

[AstonishingXMan]

Colossus and Callisto sittin' a tree. Kitty Pryde's gonna catch an STD.

[limerick]

He's big, buff, beauty-full and sensitive...wot's not to like? :redface: but, yes...that ponytail would indeed have to die a tragic death first by guillotine then fire.:biggrin:
Actually,you can rest easy,Imraith.....Peter's found time to cut the ponytail somewhere before this issue but is sticking with the designer stubble!

[Morlock50]

After reviewing most of Claremonts original run, I'd have to say that the Outback X-men saga was really as bad as I remember it. Post-Australia issues are actually an improvement, even with the lousy art and wandering plot lines like this last one. And, only a handful of issues until Jim Lee is the regular artist.

[limerick]

Hi,Morlock50!Welcome to the X-Boards......I love that Magneto Avatar.....I used to use it a while back---he looks ready to boil in it!......I wasn't a huge fan of the Outback X-men but enjoyed the Silvestri issues immediately after that......But the last 2 or 3 have been fairly poor,IMO....I am looking foward to the next 12 issues or so and the big changes that come about after that.

Hope you'll post regularly--the more the merrier.

[Goshin]

The Australian era? Awful?

What?!?

The outback era was badass! Waaaay better than the fraction-penned garbage now. Uncanny from #500 on up is toilet paper to me.

[aenirin]

Hi everyone! I'm new to this forum, but by no means new to comics. I saw this thread and was glad to see that I am not the only insane person who is trying to read over fifty years of Marvel's mightiest mutants. I actually started three years ago and included the other X-titles as they were originally released. I am into August of 1997 now with 11 different titles. I have recently been reading one of each title every day. It is pretty tiring, but very rewarding as well. It has been great watching the characters grow from the very beginning. Good luck to all. I'll check in from time to time.

[limerick]

Looking foward to hearing your views,aenirin......Welcome to the X-Boards!

[limerick]

Why are the double posts always on Sunday mornings!

[Morlock50]

Hi,Morlock50!Welcome to the X-Boards......I love that Magneto Avatar.....I used to use it a while back---he looks ready to boil in it!......I wasn't a huge fan of the Outback X-men but enjoyed the Silvestri issues immediately after that......But the last 2 or 3 have been fairly poor,IMO....I am looking foward to the next 12 issues or so and the big changes that come about after that.

Hope you'll post regularly--the more the merrier.

Thanks Limerick. You guys are doing a great job with this thread.

RE: Goshin

I realize I'm in the minority with my distaste for the Australia period. When I first read the issues back in the day, I was still pissed that Nightcrawler and Shadowcat weren't in the stories, so I might be biased. But I still think the characterizations of Rogue, Storm, and Wolverine were awful during that period, and the new members did nothing for me.

But you're right, it wasn't as bad as Fraction (which is why I only read Legacy nowadays):smile:

[limerick]

Thanks Limerick. You guys are doing a great job with this thread.

RE: Goshin

I realize I'm in the minority with my distaste for the Australia period. When I first read the issues back in the day, I was still pissed that Nightcrawler and Shadowcat weren't in the stories, so I might be biased. But I still think the characterizations of Rogue, Storm, and Wolverine were awful during that period, and the new members did nothing for me.

But you're right, it wasn't as bad as Fraction (which is why I only read Legacy nowadays):smile:
I think the main problem with the Outback period was there was no time for development of the characters.....Claremont was coming up with great stories and scenarios such as Genosha and Inferno.....But there was little time left to develop the existing and particularly the new characters.....Pyslocke,after some great stories about her while based in Xavier's,became one-dimensional in the Outback--we never knew what she was thinking.....I'm pretty sure there was practically zero 'thought bubbles during this run from her so we didn't get any idea about what she was about.....Rogue suffered a little bit as well during that run......She seemed to be constantly bickering with Dazzler about Longshot and I thought she had moved beyond that kind of behaviour......I felt Australia was a real step backwards for her as a character.......Wolverine didn't progress much in Uncanny which is understandable since he had his own title.....The problem was his own title wasn't moving him foward either.

I know I knock Claremont sometimes but the guy was a genius in his day......At his peak his average work was better than most writer's best......But I really think he was getting tired of the X-Books at this stage......He'd dropped New Mutants a while ago and hadn't bothered returning to it as promised......He'd just dropped Wolverine and was almost finished with Excalibur as well.....I know he had a huge row which caused him to leave Uncanny and Adjectiveless X-men in a while but I wonder was he really that pushed at that stage.....I feel he may just have been burnt out of 'Xavier's Dream'

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-men # 264:

--You're right about that cover,AstonishingXMan.......Beast is awesome(and minus a toe!).....Jean looks incredible as well.....(I'm looking foward to Jim Lee's debut as permanant artist!)

--I do think the interior art is better in this issue than the previous 2......Josef Rubinstein inks again with yet another new artist(Mike Collins)....There had to be a problem in the transition between Silvestri and Lee for the book to end up with so many different unknowns.....I'd like to know a little about what happened there??....Interestingly,there'sca change of colourist and letterer here too.....Glynis Oriver is replaced by Nel Yomtov(temporarily,I'm sure)and it shows.....There's a fair few colouring errors--Jean's hair should never be brown,no matter what the lighting(see page 15)--She looks more like Kitty there!....On page 30 Jean's 'G-string' portion of her X-costume is red rather than yellow(don't ask!).....There are plenty of other small little errors like that .....Glynis Oliver is generally very careful and there are very few mistakes under her(She is a woman,right!I've never been certain with that name!).....Tom O. also takes a break from lettering.....But the change is barely noticable......But is this the first break from Uncanny for Tom and Glynis in ages--I think it might be but I'm not certain

--I like the forge/Officer Jones sequence at the start of the story but I don't think it really makes sense that it happens......The Genoshans are after Jenny Ransom and her boyfriend......They know they're in the X-Factor Base......So what are they doing wasting time tackling Forge who they've never encountered before--It just doesn't work for me even though it is a great scene.

--I'm not sure why Claremont introduces Officer Jones from the pages of X-Factor.....He's got enough characters to sort out without bringing another one in!

--Philip Moreau shouldn't be able to enter the X-Factor base----he's not a mutant....And what exactly is Callisto's mutant power,BTW... was that ever confirmed??

--Wipeout is able to effect Ship using his powers because Ship's 'more alive than not'---sounds like a load of bulls**t to me.

--Jean's easily overcome by the Magistrates....She's really on a bad run at the moment after the Judgement War,Her episode with Attuma in the X-Factor Annual,her encounter with the Morlocks in the last 2 issues and now this.....She doesn't seem very formidible right now.

--But the real annoying bit for me is the bit at the end where Colossus kisses Callisto and they're suddenly in love.....what the hell is that all about??!.....Callisto never showed any sign of feelings towards him before and she did spend plenty of time with him in Muir Isle while he was recuperating from The MMutant Massacre.....Also,she knows who he really is so any relationship is built on a lie......I don't think she's the kind of person who would enter a relationship like that.....Fair enough ,Peter thinks she's stunning physically now but I can't see the change in priority for her----And how come she's crap at fighting when she's got a pretty face.....It shouldn't effect her fighting skills at all!

--Saying that,I quite enjoyed this issue......It was good seeing Jean and Beast back in the pages of the X-men(Where was the rest of X-Factor??)

[Goshin]

Yea the outback team coulda used more of those "personal" stories like Lifedeath or somethin to flesh them out, it was mainly all action

[AstonishingXMan]

Any time period which introduces a cyborg with a mohawk who rolls around in a miniature tank is free from any criticism.

Damn, Uncanny is about to be insanely good.

[limerick]

Hi everyone! I'm new to this forum, but by no means new to comics. I saw this thread and was glad to see that I am not the only insane person who is trying to read over fifty years of Marvel's mightiest mutants. I actually started three years ago and included the other X-titles as they were originally released. I am into August of 1997 now with 11 different titles. I have recently been reading one of each title every day. It is pretty tiring, but very rewarding as well. It has been great watching the characters grow from the very beginning. Good luck to all. I'll check in from time to time.
I was curious as to which titles you're reading...Is it all the X-Books or just selected ones??

BTW,there's a post missing above...it jumps from 3120 to 3122??

[Midnightblue]

and one of the best issues ever (# 266) is closer and closer:biggrin:

[aenirin]

I was curious as to which titles you're reading...Is it all the X-Books or just selected ones??


I have read all the X-titles through Aug of 1997. I have gone through:

Uncanny X-Men 1-346
Cable 1-45
Generation X 1-29
Wolverine 1-115
X-Factor 1-136
Excalibur 1-111
X-Men 1-66
New Mutants 1-100
X-Force 1-68
X-Man 1-29
X-Men Unlimited 1-15
Deadpool 1-7

.....plus whatever limited series were thrown into the mix at the time. I stopped reading annuals in 1990 due to the tiring and redundant storylines. I have read a couple that have been relevant, but most of them might as well be in a seperate universe entirely. I am somewhat of an insomniac so reading these comics fills the time nicely.

It has been a while since I read the issues you guys are currently on, but that era was always somewhat confusing to me. The Siege Perilous was, in my opinion, a big mistake. I'm not entirely certain at which point in the story you are, so I don't want to go into my reasons. I'm going to go back into my issues and check the story to brush up, then I'll be back.

[aenirin]

Yeah, I still can't go into it, but reading through that era was like pulling out finger nails. In fact the era I am in is pretty much the same. I stopped reading comics in 1996 because the stories were a little goofy in my opinion. I got over that year and stories have just gotten worse. So, I've got my head down and I'm powering through, hoping that the stories get better again soon. I've gotta' say that I'm looking forward to the end of Excalibur and X-Factor. Just wait. I have to say my favorite character used to be Wolverine, but now I'm kind of leaning towards Cable. He is a very interesting history and great story potential.

[limerick]

I have read all the X-titles through Aug of 1997. I have gone through:

Uncanny X-Men 1-346
Cable 1-45
Generation X 1-29
Wolverine 1-115
X-Factor 1-136
Excalibur 1-111
X-Men 1-66
New Mutants 1-100
X-Force 1-68
X-Man 1-29
X-Men Unlimited 1-15
Deadpool 1-7

.....plus whatever limited series were thrown into the mix at the time. I stopped reading annuals in 1990 due to the tiring and redundant storylines. I have read a couple that have been relevant, but most of them might as well be in a seperate universe entirely. I am somewhat of an insomniac so reading these comics fills the time nicely.

It has been a while since I read the issues you guys are currently on, but that era was always somewhat confusing to me. The Siege Perilous was, in my opinion, a big mistake. I'm not entirely certain at which point in the story you are, so I don't want to go into my reasons. I'm going to go back into my issues and check the story to brush up, then I'll be back.
That is a fairly comprehensive collection,to say the least(I don't have Deadpool....I can't decide whether to try and get those issues or not).....We're still a bit behind of course and may never catch up......I started reading my X-men collection in a very similar way to you(about 1 issue a night)around the same time(approx 3 years ago).....But I've slowed down and backtracked a bit to stay in touch with the threads......I know this time around I'm taking in the full stories as I do the summaries.....I think I'm seeing things I missed the first couple of times around,which is great.

The Seige Perilous is just daft because Claremont chickened out on it in the end and brought them all back...I don't think Rogue even loses her memories if I recall correctly?

[Parch]

thoughts on #264

That really is a great cover for Beast fans.

Big X-Factor influence this issue. When the Uncanny team is in disrepair, no harm in taking advantage of another team for a story or two.

Nothing wrong with Forge earning a few brownie points with the cops. He should give 'em all bulletproof uniforms.

I didn't know Dazzler made grenades.

[aenirin]

How do I do the spoiler bar? I want to say some things but I don't want to ruin it for everybody.

[aenirin]

That is a fairly comprehensive collection,to say the least(I don't have Deadpool....I can't decide whether to try and get those issues or not)

If you like Deadpool then I would definitely recommend trying to get the issues. I am not a big fan and I am actually liking his series so far. It doesn't really tie in to the rest of the mutant titles, but at this point that is actually refreshing.


this is just a test

[limerick]

If you like Deadpool then I would definitely recommend trying to get the issues. I am not a big fan and I am actually liking his series so far. It doesn't really tie in to the rest of the mutant titles, but at this point that is actually refreshing.


this is just a test
Test Successful!!

The reason I didn't collect Deadpoll was that I'd stopped collecting comics for a while and when I got back in and needed to update my collection I had kind of missed the Deadpool thing.....I didn't really consider him a proper X-Book character...A little like Alpha Flight,his title was just on the periphery.....But I think over the years he's become more into the X-Book fold.

[aenirin]

Okay, I figured out the spoiler thing.

I wasn't a fan of the X-Men losing their memories. The stories were too disparate. I was very relieved when they got their memories back and came together again, after the Muir Island Saga, which was also somewhat confusing.

But I've slowed down and backtracked a bit to stay in touch with the threads......I know this time around I'm taking in the full stories as I do the summaries.....I think I'm seeing things I missed the first couple of times around,which is great.

That is pretty cool. I don't think I can slow down though. I'm reading the X-titles to get up to speed on current events in the MU. I am getting used to the changes now that I have read so much of the history. I don't resent the writers anymore, at any rate. I will come here to comment on the issues once you reach some of my favorite storylines, which mostly include Cable.

[aenirin]

Test Successful!!

The reason I didn't collect Deadpoll was that I'd stopped collecting comics for a while and when I got back in and needed to update my collection I had kind of missed the Deadpool thing.....I didn't really consider him a proper X-Book character...A little like Alpha Flight,his title was just on the periphery.....But I think over the years he's become more into the X-Book fold.

I was pretty much in the same boat. I didn't really like Deadpool much, but his levity is a good compliment to the seriousness of the X-titles. It is almost like recharging the batteries. Yeah, I guess he has been pulled more into the mainstream X-books. What with the Cable & Deadpool series and everything. In fact, that book along with all the current changes with the X-Men are the reasons I started all this backtracking in the first place. I don't like reading things out of order. I had thought about reading Alpha Flight and the New Warriors as well (in fact I started reading the New Warriors but for some reason stopped), since they both have mutants in their ranks, but decided they wouldn't have too much relevance with the other titles. Is Alpha Flight any good? I have only read the few issues that do tie-in with Wolverine or the X-Men.

[Parch]

I think Alpha Flight is good. It's actually kinda oddball and very unpredictable, but never knowing what is going to happen next is what makes it interesting. There is no lack of surprises in Alpha Flight. The cast of characters suffers a lot of change and inner turmoil, but it's an interesting group.

I can also understand why some people dislike Alpha Flight. There's a fine line between quirky and stupid, and the title endured a variety of writers and artists so there are good and bad runs, but I think it's worked and is mostly well written. It's a unique title for Marvel.

[aenirin]

I think Alpha Flight is good. It's actually kinda oddball and very unpredictable, but never knowing what is going to happen next is what makes it interesting. There is no lack of surprises in Alpha Flight. The cast of characters suffers a lot of change and inner turmoil, but it's an interesting group.

I can also understand why some people dislike Alpha Flight. There's a fine line between quirky and stupid, and the title endured a variety of writers and artists so there are good and bad runs, but I think it's worked and is mostly well written. It's a unique title for Marvel.

It kind of sounds like Excalibur. Is it anything like that?

[Parch]

Don't know. I haven't read any Excalibur...yet.

[Cub]

This era is kinda my guilty pleasure. Not that I necessarily consider it a creative highpoint or anything, but it certainly has its charm. I appreciate how it is such a departure from tone than anything in the series thus far. Like: there were no x-men. Whaaa....?

General thoughts:

One of those rare eras where I generally, without reservation, enjoy Wolverine.

I have personally always found Jubilee to be extraordinarily entertaining. Her interactions with Psylocke especially are hilarious.

Really enjoyed this trio as a team. Thought they all complemented each others abilities and personalities very well. Psylocke's transformation, while more than a bit confusing, was needed. She was still rather one-dimensional, but at least that dimension was of a hot asian bitch, rather than a stuffy english maid. And I'm sorry, I do not get behind the retcon of her always being a badass as a member of STRIKE, and a huge fashion model. Rogue and Storm were both clearly more attractive than how Betsy appeared, and her sense of style was atrocious. That pink frock she wears when Sabretooth attacked her was unacceptably fugly. Not to mention she needed that weird armor to fight alongside the x-men, because she was too frail otherwise. Though I did like her cape, which reminded me of that girl's from the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon. But I digress.

I completely agree with the notion of Alex being a whiny bitch until Inferno. Still, his competitive, almost flirtatious friendship with Ali was fun. And his relationship with Maddie was downright scandalous.

Good riddance to Longshot.

Still miss Kitty and Kurt, but then remember they are busy awesomeing up the pages of Excalibur, and it turns that frown upside down.

Outback era was Rogue at her best: sassy, southern, strong, exy. Still a total headcase, but a good time, and a hell of a contributor to the team. Went from being the outcast to the teammainstay. What a great example of how Xavier's dream can change people for the better. She turns it out in her next story arc, too...

Really liked Lorna during this time, though the explanation of how she received those other powers waqs handled poorly. And wasn't a huge fan of Muir Island. Felt too many potentially cool characters (see: Jamie Madrox, Siryn, etc.) did not get fleshed out enough. And while I love Mystique and Destiny (Irene's death was a shocker), I'm kind of indifferent to Forge when he's Stormless. Banshee kinda kicks ass though.

I love how Peter is such a total player, and other than the infamous Juggernaut bar fight from back in the day, totally gets away with it because of his, "by the white wolf, i'm only a simple russian farmer who is sensitive and paints" schtick. Not that I think his innocence isn't genuine, but it needs to be said that Piotr Rasputin is a Scott Summers level slut. Am I complaining? No, Colossus is fucking hot. I totally buy his trashy affair with Callisto. Why wouldn't she want to hit that?

"Alien head on tongue" Jean. Awesome.

Very, very excited for the X-Tinction Agenda. One of my faves.

Jim Lee's Beast and Jean cover: gorgeous.

[JohnSD]

I've just been reading the run from this era recently, so it seems like a good place to jump on this thread. It's really useful following it and getting more context to the stories and other people's thoughts on them, so thanks all!

I've read from Giant Size #1 up to the end of the Brood Saga, and then I've got a big jump to Inferno onwards. In the last few weeks I've gone through roughly #246 - #265, and I've got to say for the most part I have absolutely loved it. Particularly the late 240s - 260ish -- what you might call the Uncanny X-Men Disassembled era -- has really impressed me. Claremont did a great job weaving loads of different characters, plot threads and locations together - though it might have been frustrating to read "live" back in 1989-90 compared to rushing through a year's worth of stories in a few sittings....

Great stuff, it seems a real golden age to me!

[limerick]

I think Alpha Flight is good. It's actually kinda oddball and very unpredictable, but never knowing what is going to happen next is what makes it interesting. There is no lack of surprises in Alpha Flight. The cast of characters suffers a lot of change and inner turmoil, but it's an interesting group.

I can also understand why some people dislike Alpha Flight. There's a fine line between quirky and stupid, and the title endured a variety of writers and artists so there are good and bad runs, but I think it's worked and is mostly well written. It's a unique title for Marvel.

aenirin,Parch completely sums up Alpha beautifully there......It's main strength is it's unpredictability and ability to surprise.....Add in a sometimes shocking level of violence and numerous ressurections and you've go a comic that will either delight you or frustrate you but never bore you......I would articularly reccommend the first 25 issues or so which with John Byrne scripts and art are a joy

This era is kinda my guilty pleasure. Not that I necessarily consider it a creative highpoint or anything, but it certainly has its charm. I appreciate how it is such a departure from tone than anything in the series thus far. Like: there were no x-men. Whaaa....?

General thoughts:

One of those rare eras where I generally, without reservation, enjoy Wolverine.

I have personally always found Jubilee to be extraordinarily entertaining. Her interactions with Psylocke especially are hilarious.

Really enjoyed this trio as a team. Thought they all complemented each others abilities and personalities very well. Psylocke's transformation, while more than a bit confusing, was needed. She was still rather one-dimensional, but at least that dimension was of a hot asian bitch, rather than a stuffy english maid. And I'm sorry, I do not get behind the retcon of her always being a badass as a member of STRIKE, and a huge fashion model. Rogue and Storm were both clearly more attractive than how Betsy appeared, and her sense of style was atrocious. That pink frock she wears when Sabretooth attacked her was unacceptably fugly. Not to mention she needed that weird armor to fight alongside the x-men, because she was too frail otherwise. Though I did like her cape, which reminded me of that girl's from the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon. But I digress.

I completely agree with the notion of Alex being a whiny bitch until Inferno. Still, his competitive, almost flirtatious friendship with Ali was fun. And his relationship with Maddie was downright scandalous.

Good riddance to Longshot.

Still miss Kitty and Kurt, but then remember they are busy awesomeing up the pages of Excalibur, and it turns that frown upside down.

Outback era was Rogue at her best: sassy, southern, strong, exy. Still a total headcase, but a good time, and a hell of a contributor to the team. Went from being the outcast to the teammainstay. What a great example of how Xavier's dream can change people for the better. She turns it out in her next story arc, too...

Really liked Lorna during this time, though the explanation of how she received those other powers waqs handled poorly. And wasn't a huge fan of Muir Island. Felt too many potentially cool characters (see: Jamie Madrox, Siryn, etc.) did not get fleshed out enough. And while I love Mystique and Destiny (Irene's death was a shocker), I'm kind of indifferent to Forge when he's Stormless. Banshee kinda kicks ass though.

I love how Peter is such a total player, and other than the infamous Juggernaut bar fight from back in the day, totally gets away with it because of his, "by the white wolf, i'm only a simple russian farmer who is sensitive and paints" schtick. Not that I think his innocence isn't genuine, but it needs to be said that Piotr Rasputin is a Scott Summers level slut. Am I complaining? No, Colossus is fucking hot. I totally buy his trashy affair with Callisto. Why wouldn't she want to hit that?

"Alien head on tongue" Jean. Awesome.

Very, very excited for the X-Tinction Agenda. One of my faves.

Jim Lee's Beast and Jean cover: gorgeous.

Magic post,Cub......You're right with so many of your obsevartions!......But I don't agree with you about Rogue in this era.......I thought by # 190 or so she was well incorporated into the team but here she suffers a crisis with her Genosha experience and the resultant dual personality problems which result....Great to have you posting again,dude!


I've just been reading the run from this era recently, so it seems like a good place to jump on this thread. It's really useful following it and getting more context to the stories and other people's thoughts on them, so thanks all!

I've read from Giant Size #1 up to the end of the Brood Saga, and then I've got a big jump to Inferno onwards. In the last few weeks I've gone through roughly #246 - #265, and I've got to say for the most part I have absolutely loved it. Particularly the late 240s - 260ish -- what you might call the Uncanny X-Men Disassembled era -- has really impressed me. Claremont did a great job weaving loads of different characters, plot threads and locations together - though it might have been frustrating to read "live" back in 1989-90 compared to rushing through a year's worth of stories in a few sittings....

Great stuff, it seems a real golden age to me!

Hi,JohnSD...thanks for posting.....You make a great point about reading a years worth of issues in a short time......For some eras it reads better,for some worse.....I do remember Uncanny was so unpredictable that you found yourself looking foward to the next issue to see what Claremont might throw at you.....I'll never forget the time I saw that Muir Isle X-men cover for the first time----Magic!!

[CallMeGeoff]

This era is kinda my guilty pleasure. Not that I necessarily consider it a creative highpoint or anything, but it certainly has its charm. I appreciate how it is such a departure from tone than anything in the series thus far. Like: there were no x-men. Whaaa....?

General thoughts:

One of those rare eras where I generally, without reservation, enjoy Wolverine.

I have personally always found Jubilee to be extraordinarily entertaining. Her interactions with Psylocke especially are hilarious.

Really enjoyed this trio as a team. Thought they all complemented each others abilities and personalities very well. Psylocke's transformation, while more than a bit confusing, was needed. She was still rather one-dimensional, but at least that dimension was of a hot asian bitch, rather than a stuffy english maid. And I'm sorry, I do not get behind the retcon of her always being a badass as a member of STRIKE, and a huge fashion model. Rogue and Storm were both clearly more attractive than how Betsy appeared, and her sense of style was atrocious. That pink frock she wears when Sabretooth attacked her was unacceptably fugly. Not to mention she needed that weird armor to fight alongside the x-men, because she was too frail otherwise. Though I did like her cape, which reminded me of that girl's from the Dungeons and Dragons cartoon. But I digress.

I completely agree with the notion of Alex being a whiny bitch until Inferno. Still, his competitive, almost flirtatious friendship with Ali was fun. And his relationship with Maddie was downright scandalous.

Good riddance to Longshot.

Still miss Kitty and Kurt, but then remember they are busy awesomeing up the pages of Excalibur, and it turns that frown upside down.

Outback era was Rogue at her best: sassy, southern, strong, exy. Still a total headcase, but a good time, and a hell of a contributor to the team. Went from being the outcast to the teammainstay. What a great example of how Xavier's dream can change people for the better. She turns it out in her next story arc, too...

Really liked Lorna during this time, though the explanation of how she received those other powers waqs handled poorly. And wasn't a huge fan of Muir Island. Felt too many potentially cool characters (see: Jamie Madrox, Siryn, etc.) did not get fleshed out enough. And while I love Mystique and Destiny (Irene's death was a shocker), I'm kind of indifferent to Forge when he's Stormless. Banshee kinda kicks ass though.

I love how Peter is such a total player, and other than the infamous Juggernaut bar fight from back in the day, totally gets away with it because of his, "by the white wolf, i'm only a simple russian farmer who is sensitive and paints" schtick. Not that I think his innocence isn't genuine, but it needs to be said that Piotr Rasputin is a Scott Summers level slut. Am I complaining? No, Colossus is fucking hot. I totally buy his trashy affair with Callisto. Why wouldn't she want to hit that?

"Alien head on tongue" Jean. Awesome.

Very, very excited for the X-Tinction Agenda. One of my faves.

Jim Lee's Beast and Jean cover: gorgeous.

As Limerick said, "Magic post, Cub!" Excellent points, and it made me laugh. I also appreciate this era despite its obvious problems. It's just interesting to read more than a dozen issues of a comic about a team that no longer exists. I like the way Forge and Banshee are repeatedly referred to as X-Men throughout this period, and that they're basically it.

Still, there are PLENTY of problems. One thing that really bugs me is that Forge and Banshee are headed to L.A. to contact Dazzler. In one issue, it's basically, "Next issue, we're going to find Dazzler!" Then next issue comes, and it's "Last issue we said we'd find Dazzler, but we're going to do just about everything except find Dazzler, and THEN we're going to go find Dazzler. And also, we're never going to go find Dazzler."

But anyway, it's still a unique time for the series, and it's a time that I don't mind going back to read again.

As controversial as the art has been, I have to say I don't think it's that bad (admittedly, I always say that about the art...call me an art apologist). Of the three fill-in artists we've seen (Kieron Dwyer, Bill Jaaska, and Mike Collins), I think Bill Jaaska is my personal favorite. While not as good as Marc Silvestri or Jim Lee, I think his layouts are very strong. His composition impresses me. I love the opening shot of Forge in issue 262, as well as the splash of Jean with all her tentacles and the rat. If I recall, he's also the artist on issue 265, and I like his work there too.

Mike Collins' work is passable; it doesn't really do much for me either way.

Kieron Dwyer's work here is fair, but this is pretty early in his career. You can see where he shows potential, but he has a lot of growing to do as an artist. Much later, he had a run on Avengers toward the end of Kurt Busiek's run and the beginning of Geoff Johns', which I remember liking pretty well.

http://image2.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/fullsize/05819410642.53.GIF

[Goshin]

I finally caight up and finished 264 an hour ago. Dazzler grenades what the hell? I skipped thru half the issue this shit is garbage.

I've been under the impression that issues 251-278 or so happened over a few weeks time, and all the Dazzler, Colossus, Psylocke/Jube/Wolvie and Banshee/Forge stories happened simultaneously as they all emerged from the Siege. Essentially, let's say the beginning or August the team is in the savage land and three weeks later the team all manages to reunite in Genosha and run off to grab Xavier and fight the shadow king afterwards. The team was only in Australia for a month and a half if u pay attention, and Fall of the Mutants was A few weeks after the Massacre. From Uncanny 200-281 everything happens within six months or so. 86-91 seemed to go by at a much faster pace. At least 3-4 years had passed from Uncanny 100-200 as characters have grown up. But during the blue/gold era they say certain events such as x-tinction agenda and the massace happened 'months ago' instead of 'years ago'. Even in Forever #1 Kitty says she and Kurt have been away for a few months with Excalibur. Also, Kitty jumps from age 13-15 from 129-200, but around 300 or so it states she is 16. This is when continuity starts moving at a different pace so characters didn't age as much.

[worstblogever]

I finally caight up and finished 264 an hour ago. Dazzler grenades what the hell? I skipped thru half the issue this shit is garbage.

I've been under the impression that issues 251-278 or so happened over a few weeks time, and all the Dazzler, Colossus, Psylocke/Jube/Wolvie and Banshee/Forge stories happened simultaneously as they all emerged from the Siege. Essentially, let's say the beginning or August the team is in the savage land and three weeks later the team all manages to reunite in Genosha and run off to grab Xavier and fight the shadow king afterwards. The team was only in Australia for a month and a half if u pay attention, and Fall of the Mutants was A few weeks after the Massacre. From Uncanny 200-281 everything happens within six months or so. 86-91 seemed to go by at a much faster pace. At least 3-4 years had passed from Uncanny 100-200 as characters have grown up. But during the blue/gold era they say certain events such as x-tinction agenda and the massace happened 'months ago' instead of 'years ago'. Even in Forever #1 Kitty says she and Kurt have been away for a few months with Excalibur. Also, Kitty jumps from age 13-15 from 129-200, but around 300 or so it states she is 16. This is when continuity starts moving at a different pace so characters didn't age as much.

Kitty is revealed to not yet 15 when the X-Men think her dead (wedding to Caliban issue) in #179. She'll be approaching her 16th during the issues of Excalibur where she's a cheerleader coming up soon. Then when Pete Wisdom came along, she was suddenly over 18 somehow.

Age and death are both so mercurial in comics.

[Cub]

IIRC, Kitty is 14 during the Fantastic 4/X-Men mini series, turns 15 in Excalibur (I believe it happens fairly soon in the Excalibur From the Beginning thread. By the end of Excalibur's run, I think it's generally accepted that Kitty is around 18 or 19. Unfortunately, I also remember an issue after she returned to the x-men, i think during the high evolutionary arc right before the 6 month gap, where she says that she is only 16. I chalk it up to an error, as opposed to Claremont trying to keep kitty an eternal child and never allowing her to grow as a character (it helps me sleep at night, ok?). He kinda redeems himself when she shows up in the Mekanix series. I'm assuming that, considering her night job as a bartender, that she had to have been 21.

[AstonishingXMan]

I've always viewed Kitty as:

Debut - 14

Joins Excalibur - 17

With Pete Wisdom - 21

Returns to X-Men with Pete & Kurt in late 90's - 23

Whedon's Run - 26
___________________

At this point in Uncanny (#264), to me (could care less about Marvel's silly time), the featured characters ages are approximately:

Wolverine - Unknown
Jubilee - 14
Psylocke - 23
Forge - 41
Banshee - 34
Colossus - 25
Jean Grey - 28
Beast - 30

I'd put Gambit at about age 22 when he debuts.

[AstonishingXMan]

Can someone do Uncanny #265? My issue is at home many states away, it's not reprinted in a TPB, every Uncanny is scanned online at the place I go EXCEPT that one for some reason, and I'll be away Friday to Monday. I actually WROTE a summary for it but I based that off of the summary on UncannyXMen.net and I don't want to post a summary without actually reading the issue. That's the whole point!!!

Also, although Uncanny Annual #14 came out before #266, gonna hold off and do the Annual until after Storm & Gambit's adventure is over, it makes more sense.

And WOW is Annual #14 a mind-blowing acid trip. With awesome Art Adams supplying the drugs.

I've got #266 ready and as a huge Gambit fan I was really excited to re-read it.

[MartinRedmond]

I've always viewed Kitty as:
With Pete Wisdom - 21

Warren Ellis said she was 16. Or something like "I hope she's 18 cause she'll be in bed with Wisdom by the end of my run" and "I wouldn't mind giving it to a young teen" or something like that. That was on his old Delphi boards.

[Cub]

I would love to do the review. Recently pulled all of my comic books out of my storage locker. Don't have a scanner, though...

[Havok83]

I've always viewed Kitty as:

Debut - 14

Joins Excalibur - 17

With Pete Wisdom - 21

Returns to X-Men with Pete & Kurt in late 90's - 23

Whedon's Run - 26
___________________

At this point in Uncanny (#264), to me (could care less about Marvel's silly time), the featured characters ages are approximately:

Wolverine - Unknown
Jubilee - 14
Psylocke - 23
Forge - 41
Banshee - 34
Colossus - 25
Jean Grey - 28
Beast - 30

I'd put Gambit at about age 22 when he debuts.
I dont think Gambit was that young. He always came across as in the same age range as the Original X-men. Banshee most definetly has never been portrayed to be that young. He was in his 40s when he first debuted in the 60s and since then was revealed to have a grown daughter

[jlmoor]

Can someone do Uncanny #265? My issue is at home many states away, it's not reprinted in a TPB, every Uncanny is scanned online at the place I go EXCEPT that one for some reason, and I'll be away Friday to Monday. I actually WROTE a summary for it but I based that off of the summary on UncannyXMen.net and I don't want to post a summary without actually reading the issue. That's the whole point!!!

Also, although Uncanny Annual #14 came out before #266, gonna hold off and do the Annual until after Storm & Gambit's adventure is over, it makes more sense.

And WOW is Annual #14 a mind-blowing acid trip. With awesome Art Adams supplying the drugs.

I've got #266 ready and as a huge Gambit fan I was really excited to re-read it.
YES!!! mememmememe. I would love to give it a shot. However, I am pretty new to the boards, so I'm not sure if I'll do it right. Also, #265 is where I started and I have not read from like 120-264, so the summary may include things like 'have we ever even seen this guy before?" But I do have it. I also have it in a PDF file I could email to you if you would rather do it since I am kind of fumbling through it. Let me know what the board thinks. I totally understand if people would rather not have a sum from someone so new.

[jlmoor]

I would love to do the review. Recently pulled all of my comic books out of my storage locker. Don't have a scanner, though...

Ooops, missed this. You go. cool.

[jlmoor]

I dont think Gambit was that young. He always came across as in the same age range as the Original X-men. Banshee most definetly has never been portrayed to be that young. He was in his 40s when he first debuted in the 60s and since then was revealed to have a grown daughter

I agree with the sillines of Marvel's time line. I also got the feeling Banshee was older but 34 is not totally out of the question (maybe?). When they first met up with the O5 were teens he was an ex-interpol agent right, I don't remember if there was an age or anything? So I'd say ten or so years older at least? I did get the feeling Gambit was in his late 20's, but growing up as he did he could really be any age. I don't think Beast is quite at 30, but it is all such a mess, I try not to think about it. :wink: They are as old as they need to be for the story:biggrin:

[Cub]

Thanks, bud. Aiight, let me go reread this beast. I'll start the summary in an hour or so. Whoo hoo, I'm excited!

[jlmoor]

Thanks, bud. Aiight, let me go reread this beast. I'll start the summary in an hour or so. Whoo hoo, I'm excited!

BTW you get 10,000 cool points for quoting Golden Girls in your sig <333

I've got to go home and re-read it as well.

[Goshin]

We're getting close to X-Men #1, will that series get a thread too?

[Cub]

Uncanny X-Men #265
Early August, 1990

Story: Chris Claremont
Pencils: Bill Jaaska
Inks: Joe Rubenstein

The cover depicts a de-aged Storm holding a staff of some sort surrounded by scary green demon people. A bubble in the bottom right corner reads, "STORM- at the mercy of the HOUNDS!" They must be those scary green people.

Enter on a landscape in the far reaches of space (a spacescape?). Claremont describes an alien race that are surprisingly similar to us: proud, passionate, independent. What's not like us? The fact that they use exclamation points as letters, calling themselves the P!ndyr. They also look like green dragons. With hair. According to Claremont, they are "the best natural warriors in known space." Ah, that must explain why we have never heard of them before and never will again after this issue. Way to hyperbolize, CC.

Anyway, as the tale goes, the Shi'ar offered an alliance. The P!ndyr chose a duel instead, setting their best fighter against the Shi'ar's best. If P!ndyr won, the Shi-ar would leave them alone. Cut to the P!ndyr fighter getting a biiig smackdown from the unseen Shi-ar opponent, who is, according to the fallen warrior, unstoppable. Also, he is just a man, with incredible mental powers, who "cracked my psi-shields... as though they were the brittlest of eggshells." Who could this possibly be? A story for another day...

And now, the star of this issue, tween Storm! We find her (rocking a short pixie cut) robin-hooding across the rooftop of some rich, corrupt, cokehead business mogul. She doesn't explain the reason of her actions, but I'm sure it's a combo of a) needing to survive), b) being heroic and giving to those less fortunate, and c) teaching this asshole a lesson and pissing him off. Because Storm can be sassy, even in miniature.

Storm, while pulling off the "splendid caper" (her words, not mine. I love how formal and articulate her speech is, even as a kid. Storm rocks.), gets frustrated by her lack of control over her abilities.Girlfriend isn't scared of her dangerous abilities, but is determined to learn more about them and master them. Again, Storm rocks. After falling into a tree when her winds give out, and then falling out of that same tree while attempting lightning, Storm decides enough for one day, and leaves the scene.

But not before she's picked up on a scanner monitored by Nanny and the Orphan-Maker!!!! In a short scene, we learn that Nanny (who I still refuse to take at all seriously in that get-up) regressed her to childhood (though who the Storm corpse was remains a mystery), in order to make her helpless and join Nanny's cause. Exactly what Nanny's cause is, by the way, has something to do with "helping" mutant children. Apparently, it also involves dressing Storm in a helmet with red pigtails. The orphan-maker, by the way, is not really having ANY of it.

Cut back to Storm, who is at a local mall enjoying the haute cuisine of the food court. In the background, a cop confides to a journalist about a burglary the night before. Turns out that the douche Storm stole from met a rather gory death later that evening. The cop is also helping creepy Jacob Reisz with his case, hunting the "deadly killer kid mutant." When he begins to describe Storm to a t at the same time the camerawoman begins to film the area, Ororo splits.

Over in D.C., the Shadow King, in the guise of Reisz, is having coffee with Val Cooper, and that asian doctor, Lian. They are both under his thrall. It is worth mentioning that Lian apparently dyes her hair in the middle of this business luncheon, going from jet black to a reddish brown. She also does not look asian in any way, shape, or form. Somehow, in between Shadow King bragging about how awesome he is, Val manages to mention that Destiny was killed in Muir Island. "How careless of her," Shadow King responds. OK, maybe he is kind of awesome. Anyway, he thinks this is nothing but good news, as this means Mystique can now be defeated more easily. Why is he interested in Mystique? And is this a storyline that continues? I don't really remember this being followed up on...

Back to Storm, who is camping out in an airplane cemetery and daydreaming about her parents. She has also begun thinking in English again, as opposed to the translated Egyptian earlier in the issue. Suddenly, her daydreams turn nightmarish when her mom and dad turn into Nanny and Jacob Reisz, respectively. Ororo's fear kickstarts her mutant abilities, and winds begin to lift the plane she is in. Once she calms herself down, Ororo muses how her memories don't seem to jibe. She remembers being a kid in Cairo, Egypt, but here she is in Cairo, Illinois. She also sees a vision of the X-Men (herself included), but can't put her finger on who they are. Storm concludes that the best remedy for her troubles is some action. I'm pretty sure she means super-heroing, and not getting a piece of tail. I mean, she's only like, 12. Who does she think she is, Kitty Pryde?

The Shadow King, meanwhile, is hanging out at a gorgeous riverfront home, sampling the owner's wine. While chatting with Lian, whose outfit can only be described as ridiculous, he reveals that he has turned the owner, his wife and their staff, into his hounds. devoid of restraint or morality. I thought that the Shadow King's powers were solely mental, but there definitely seems to be a physiological change to these humans as well. They appear to have both claws and fangs. Luckily, this has not affected the wife's ability to apply mascara. The Shadow King claims that this house will undoubtedly be the next scene of Storm's escapades, considering the owner is a greedy art collector. While fondling the increasingly disgusting Lian, the Shadow King eagerly anticipates taking revenge on his nemesis, Xavier, by capturing Ororo, "the one who got away."

He doesn't have to wait long, as Storm predictably arrives at the mansion, ready for some do-gooding. In good news, she seems to have gotten a handle on flying. In bad news, she gets attacked by the ladyhound. The fight is vicious. I almost want to say that this lady might just be the best natural warrior in known space. But then I remembered the P!ndyr. Anyway, Li'l Ororo handily takes out her attacker using a lamp and a bedsheet, though she does get her arm a bit cut up in the process. Just as she is about to leave, however, who appears but the Shadow King and the rest of his hounds!!! Things do NOT look good for miss thing.

Next issue: GAMBIT.

[jlmoor]

Ha!! I forgot about this lead in to the later arc!

[limerick]

Hi fellow X-Dudes and Dudesses....I'm away for a few days in London so I won't be posting until next week.....I'll catch up with you all then....Cheers!

[AstonishingXMan]

We're getting close to X-Men #1, will that series get a thread too?

Hell yeah! We should keep Uncanny and X-Men in here. Do an issue of each a week and compare & contrast them. Fun times ahead.

Good job, Cub!

[limerick]

Yeah,best to keep both in this thread ,I think.

[limerick]

Great summary by the way,Cub.......If anyone's interested in summarising an issue for the other threads as well just P.M. me---The more the merrier(and quicker too!)

[jlmoor]

Nanny-have we even seen her since Mags used her to screw with the X-Men years ago? I think Magneto programmed her to care for mutants (and imprison them), but I know nothing about her since then. Soooo(?)
Very fun summary cub. :biggrin:
This is where I started reading the x-books and always felt like I had missed something, apparently not. So we never see Storm get turned into a kid? Also, Lian is supposed to be Asian?? Never would have guessed.

[Cub]

I'm pretty sure this Nanny is a different one than Magneto's robotic nursemaid. Right?

And Lian, I believe, was the doctor or the nurse taking care of Storm when she first appeared as a child in the hospital bed.

[jlmoor]

I'm pretty sure this Nanny is a different one than Magneto's robotic nursemaid. Right?

And Lian, I believe, was the doctor or the nurse taking care of Storm when she first appeared as a child in the hospital bed.

This is why forums are helpful!:smile: I have no idea, on either. I just thought it was funny when I went back and read some of the old stuff and found Mag's nanny. I assumed they were the same.:redface:

[Parch]

thoughts on #265

The dragon warrior was cool.

This nanny was the one in Australia, right? I don't know what Marvel see's in these stupid, goofy looking characters. This egghead is just silly and ridiculous and doesn't fit in at all. Forgetable IMO.

Good flashback story for kid Ororo. That is by far the best part of this title. Back to her thieving past and struggling with her powers. Very well done and nicely drawn, all leading up to the matchup with Shadowking's hounds.

Good book. Best Uncanny in awhile.

[CallMeGeoff]

I'm pretty sure this Nanny is a different one than Magneto's robotic nursemaid. Right?

And Lian, I believe, was the doctor or the nurse taking care of Storm when she first appeared as a child in the hospital bed.

Howdy! Correct on both points.

For clarification, this Nanny is a mutant who worked for The Right in cyborg technology. When she learned that The Right anti-mutant plans, she rebelled, and they had her imprisoned in one of her own designs (the egg suit). She eventually escaped The Right, but not before she went insane.

Magneto's Nanny was just a robot.

[Cub]

JUST a robot?!?! Magneto's Nanny was awesome.

By the way, CallMeGeoff, love the Champion of the Sun reference. I myself am a master of karate and friendship for everyone.

[jlmoor]

Howdy! Correct on both points.

For clarification, this Nanny is a mutant who worked for The Right in cyborg technology. When she learned that The Right anti-mutant plans, she rebelled, and they had her imprisoned in one of her own designs (the egg suit). She eventually escaped The Right, but not before she went insane.

Magneto's Nanny was just a robot.

Thanks for the update!! I have a huge gap in my reading from issue #125-265, so a lot of stuff at this point is totally over my head!:redface:

[Goshin]

I wonder when the real Lil' Ro gets switched with fake/evil Storm?

[jlmoor]

I wonder when the real Lil' Ro gets switched with fake/evil Storm?

BLASPHEMY!!!!!


:wink:

[Goshin]

Was Nanny an agent of the consortium? Storm was obviously swapped sometime in #267 before her memories came back, cuz she knew Gambit...

[limerick]

http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/uncanny-x-men/265-2.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #265

Thoughts on Uncanny X-Men # 265:

--As I said ,Cub,nice summary!

--What an unexpected opening!This title is really jumping around the place......It doesn't affect things too much when you're reading back at a reasonably quick rate......But when the book was originally published I had to keep the last issue handy to remind me where I was!......There's a hint at Xavier's return here....It can only be him that dragon warrior is talking about,can't it?(4 pages is probably too much for this intro,though!)

--Interestingly,this story is titled 'Storm--Leader of The Uncanny X-men'----Should that still be in the present tense?....Or possibly a hint at her return?....Anyway,she sort of gets her powers back this issue so a full return can't be too far away.......And her memories are returning gradually as well--By the end of the issue,she's thinking in English(IIRC not too long ago she couldn't remember any English)...But she really steps into trouble at the end of the issue.....How's she gonna resist the Shadow King's awesome psychic power?

--I hate being too critical but the art really sucks!.....Lian is completely unrecognisible from her first appearance(Storm's Doctor) drawn by Silvestri.....This is the first time I've made the link between the two.....Before this I thought they were different people and it kinda confused me in the past because I felt I should know who she was when I read this issue......But she really does not look at all Oriental as Silvestri drew her.

--Nanny returns.....She is quite well drawn actually--the only reasonable art in this issue.....But she really sucks!.....On re-reading these issues I'm surprised how Claremont has taken quite a few things from Louise Simonson's and run with them(Ship,Nanny,Officer Jones).....He relly does seem to respect her as a writer......Has it been explained how Storm managed to escape from Nanny afterbeing age-regressed?

--When The Shadow King changes the houses owners and bodyguards to feral humans.how does he manage to create the claws and the fangs??......I can understand how he can manipulate their thoughts to make them feral but I can't see how he can alter them physically.

--Overall another strange issue.....Maybe Claremont will draw all the strings together soon but at the moment they seem unrelated and a bit of a mixed bag.

[CallMeGeoff]

JUST a robot?!?! Magneto's Nanny was awesome.

By the way, CallMeGeoff, love the Champion of the Sun reference. I myself am a master of karate and friendship for everyone.

ah-AH-ahhhhhhhh!

Thanks! Always a pleasure to meet a Dayman fan.

And since one good turn deserves another, let me just say that you're a pal and a confidant!

Thanks for the update!! I have a huge gap in my reading from issue #125-265, so a lot of stuff at this point is totally over my head!:redface:

My pleasure! And don't feel too bad. Nanny's origin is told in X-Factor, so even if you filled in all those issues, she would still be a mystery! You're probably better off not knowing too much about Nanny anyway! :wink:

[Cub]

Thanks for the update!! I have a huge gap in my reading from issue #125-265, so a lot of stuff at this point is totally over my head!:redface:

Oh my god. You have yet to read all of those issues. You have so much good stuff ahead of you!!! I am incredibly jealous.

[AstonishingXMan]

"Us Thieves -- We Have To Stick Together."

http://images.comiccollectorlive.com/covers/3b1/3b17ba8f-80ad-45de-91b2-1524473249dc.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #266

"Gambit: Into The Fire" by Chris Claremont & Mike Collins (cover by Andy Kubert)

The wounded, child-like Storm battles three Hounds as The Shadow King taunts her. In a scene out of Night of the Living Dead, Storm flees to a bathroom and uses her elemental problems to battle the Hounds. Shadow King attempts to possess Storm, but she is able to flee through a window and lands outside in a pool. A figure approaches her...

Close by, Nanny scolds Orphan-Maker for not paying attention to the sensors that have alerted them of Storm's location, since she has been using her mutant powers. Nanny is horrified at the prospect of Shadow King gaining control of Storm, and plans on coming to her "aid" before he captures her.

Back at the Illinois' mansion, Storm observes the man who pulled her out of the pool. He is Gambit, a thief stocking up on paintings and smoking a cigarette. He saves Storm from a surprise Hound attack by charging a throwing spike with energy and throwing it at the servant. Confronted by Shen and the Hounds, Gambit seems to "charm" them into a peaceful state with his persuasive words. Shadow King, however, unleashes a psychic blast on both Gambit & Storm. He responds by tossing a charged-up plate at him. Storm creates a soot cloud, which allows them to escape, as Gambit annoys her with the nickname of "Stormy" for the first time.

Gambit alerts the police to all the stolen loot held up in the mansion, and takes off with Storm across the skies in a parachute. The dynamic between the two is very good, as Gambit won't keep quiet and Storm, the child, is the mature one.

At an airplane junkyard, Storm tells Gambit of the Shadow King's evil nature and his desire to take her under his control. Storm seemingly wants this partnership to come to an end as she figures out a way to survive on her own.

In Washington, the possessed Val Cooper enters the rural town home of Freedom Force. Mystique is aware of her intentions, having been forwarned by the late Destiny. Mystique is prepared to let Cooper kill her, just as Destiny was prepared for her on fate. A gunshot is heard as the issue ends.

END.

THOUGHTS:

- Gambit is drawn with "tiger stripe" pants on the cover and it's clear that Andy Kubert had a little different idea of what he looked like. Thankfully, the "NFL Zubas" pants look wouldn't continue inside the issue.

- Gambit's powers to the reader are: charge objects with energy and "seduce" people into believing his words.

- Gambit smokes cigarettes which you wouldn't see today.

- The death of Mystique? Nah, can't be...right? She seems rather depressed without Destiny, though.

- Nanny and Orphan Maker are just...lame. They come off as Power Rangers villains more than serious X-Men foes.

- This is the second issue of the book to come out this month, as Marvel pumps out their flagship books out twice a month during the summer.

Milestone: First full appearance of Gambit (cameo in Uncanny X-Men Annual #14)

Reprinted In: Gambit Classic Vol.1

NEXT ISSUE: JIM LEE IS BACK! GAMBIT AND STORM! and Nanny.

[jlmoor]

Yay!!!!!! When I picked up comics in the 90’s I decided to pick one point to go back and collect from, Gambit was it. He was my absolute favorite when I first started. (until X-Men #1 and UXM #274). This was before TAS so everything was new to me. I love this issue.
I always wondered why they never played up the whole mutant charm power thing. I don’t remember seeing it much outside of these first stories.
I miss smoking heroes. Some people smoke, yes it’s bad for you. You can even have people complain about it. What’s the big? So Wolverine is now kid friendly because he gave up the Camels? He still butchers people. Gambit is a thief, and for awhile was death, not to mention the questionable sexual morals. Smoking is really the biggest issue?:wink:
I like the Power Rangers comment.:smile: I cold see them played by giant puppets or people in plastic costumes.

[jlmoor]

Oh my god. You have yet to read all of those issues. You have so much good stuff ahead of you!!! I am incredibly jealous.

That's what my LCS guy said when I first picked it back up. I had been out for 15 years so I had all of Morrison, all of Whedon, HoM, the new X-Factor and Messiah Complex to cover. Not to mention a ton of other stuff. I'm slowly working my way through the older stuff and am soooooooo excited. I read 1-12whatever over the summer. So entertaining:smile:

[Parch]

The lameness of Nanny and her robot can't be emphasized enough. Totally out of place in this book, and next issue we get even more of the lamerrific. oh goody.

But of course the complete significance of this book is Gambit. With some classic frames plus putting him on the cover, it's quite obvious that he is not going to be a temporary character. His first significant appearance is well done. The look. The attitude. They got it right. This issue is a definate must have for Gambit fans.

[WWWD]

I am still trying very desperately to catch up. And I am still nowhere close. I'm on Uncanny 194.....

I'm a little slow. But I'm also doing New Mutants and any limited series in between. Soon to start X-Factor.

[limerick]

I am still trying very desperately to catch up. And I am still nowhere close. I'm on Uncanny 194.....

I'm a little slow. But I'm also doing New Mutants and any limited series in between. Soon to start X-Factor.
I know the feeling....plenty of dedication required!

[limerick]

That's what my LCS guy said when I first picked it back up. I had been out for 15 years so I had all of Morrison, all of Whedon, HoM, the new X-Factor and Messiah Complex to cover. Not to mention a ton of other stuff. I'm slowly working my way through the older stuff and am soooooooo excited. I read 1-12whatever over the summer. So entertaining:smile:
jlmoor.....I'm in a very similar position to you having been away from comics for years.....I gotback into the X-men a few years ago and have back-dated almost everything I missed.....But I haven't read much after about about 1994.....So I'm looking foward to all the new(for me!) stuff coming up.

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-Men # 266

--Gotta be careful with this issue.....It's become very valuable over the years!......One of the big second hand comic stores currently has it listed at $144.00 for a NM copy.....So keep those hands clean.....I'm not so sure why this issue has rocketed so much in value.....I know it has Gambit's first appearance in the ongoing but the art is really poor by Uncanny's standards......Even worse than the last few issues,IMO......For example Jubilee's first appearance in the Silvestri drawn # 244 is priced at $31.50 for a NMint copy--So how come Gambit's first outing is such a draw?!:confused:

--Storm shows great resourcefulness taking care of The Shadow King and his posse.....She seems to be resistant to his psychic attacks which she wasn't before......I'm not sure why that is??

--The Shadow King has the ability to repair his body's physical wounds.....That definitely is a new ability for him.....It seems unexplained how he does that(page 9)but it does explain how he can physically alter his hounds......Interestingly,in Excalibur recently,The Shadow King was shown to be a member of The Hellfire Club in her reality.....Was he responsible for her 'Hound' transformation as her appearance is very similar to his slaves in this issue(NOTE:I haven't read Annual # 14 yet--I know there may be something about that in it).

--I like the way Dr Shen can resist Farouk enough to be sarcastic towards him....She's quite fiesty!

--Gambit takes a bow and he's far from the finished article....There's no sign of his trademark cards and he uses little harpoons instead or whatever comes to hand.....As others have said he seems to have some sort of hypnotic power as well......I must say I've never been a huge fanespecially when he tries to get his dirty paws on Rogue!......His Cajun speech patterns always bugged me a little.......There was some speculation at the time that he may be Longshot re-born after going through the Seige Perilous but after re-reading the issue it's pretty clear that's not the case.

EDIT---Time to get this expensive little comic back in storage for safe-keeping!

[limerick]

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/2532/147610-170600-gambit_super.jpg

Gambit takes a bow----He's obviously got history but we don't learn much about him for quite a while.......

[jlmoor]

Gambit takes a bow----He's obviously got history but we don't learn much about him for quite a while.......[/SIZE]

Okay, sorry I know I said I wouldn't go all fangirl but he's hot. :smile:
I'll try harder to be good for UXM #275:wink:

I'm interested to know how poeple who read this for the first time recently feel. These old issues seem to hold up pretty well and still be decent little stories. However I'm stuck in nostalgia!

[limerick]

Yeah,this story is pretty good(but a re-read for me)......But Claremont's Storm-can-do-no-wrong obsession does bug me a little at times!

[Yogaflame]

--The Shadow King has the ability to repair his body's physical wounds.....That definitely is a new ability for him.....It seems unexplained how he does that(page 9)but it does explain how he can physically alter his hounds......Interestingly,in Excalibur recently,The Shadow King was shown to be a member of The Hellfire Club in her reality.....Was he responsible for her 'Hound' transformation as her appearance is very similar to his slaves in this issue(NOTE:I haven't read Annual # 14 yet--I know there may be something about that in it).


I just reread these issues and noticed this as well. I really think it is an interesting and powerful display of telepathic might. A psi of this magnitude can completely manipulate the mind. The mind is what creates the body, hence chronic thought patterns can create changes in the body, examples being someone who thinks they are sick can make themselves sick (psychosomatic disease), and someone who thinks they are well can make themselves well (placebo effect). Its a not often used aspect of telepathy, but upon consideration I find it very appropriate and sensible.

[limerick]

Hi,Yogaflame.....I thought it was more than him being able to mask the effects of illness or injury...for example a telepath could have his brain erase the pain of a headache he/she is experiencing......But I felt this was more than that.....Dr Shen tells him he needs a hospital after being hit by lightning....But then he is surrounded by a slightly glowing effect and on the next frame a kind of starry effect and then he is completely restored to normal......So a normal telepath could remove symptoms of pain or mask them but he actually heals physical inuries(in this case Lightning burns)......So to all intents he has a healing factor and I'm puzzled as to how that is.....(unless his host body was a mutant with healing powers??)

It's a bit of a mystery to me to be honest and it just came outta nowhere.......Anyway thanks for the input......I can see where your coming from if he's moving onto more serious power levels...(like Phoenix,for example who is never normally sick)....But I feel he would need highly refined telekinetic powers to make this feat seem reasonably possible to a mutant not possessing a healing factor.

[coveredinbees]

Are you doing a seperate thread for X-Men v2?

[limerick]

Are you doing a seperate thread for X-Men v2?
I think it's best just to keep the issues in this thread and alternate every second issue

[Yogaflame]

Hi,Yogaflame.....I thought it was more than him being able to mask the effects of illness or injury...for example a telepath could have his brain erase the pain of a headache he/she is experiencing......But I felt this was more than that.....Dr Shen tells him he needs a hospital after being hit by lightning....But then he is surrounded by a slightly glowing effect and on the next frame a kind of starry effect and then he is completely restored to normal......So a normal telepath could remove symptoms of pain or mask them but he actually heals physical inuries(in this case Lightning burns)......So to all intents he has a healing factor and I'm puzzled as to how that is.....(unless his host body was a mutant with healing powers??)

It's a bit of a mystery to me to be honest and it just came outta nowhere.......Anyway thanks for the input......I can see where your coming from if he's moving onto more serious power levels...(like Phoenix,for example who is never normally sick)....But I feel he would need highly refined telekinetic powers to make this feat seem reasonably possible to a mutant not possessing a healing factor.

I understand your point in telepathy as being limited to thoughts/feelings whereas telekinesis is needed for physical manipulation of matter, but ultimately I don't think they are as separate as they may seem(hence Jean Grey's position as an ultimate psi, as she easily manifests both).

Think of it this way: when a telepath controls someone's mind, if you were to hook them up to a MRI or something, you would see physical changes in their brains; neurochemicals would be moving and released in different parts of the brain and body. Is the telepath actually moving these neurotransmittors to initiate the effect of an altered thought, or does the though create the attendant chemicals? Either way it shows that thoughts can affect the body physically.

There's a film called Altered States that deals with this concept very specifically, with the character using psychotropic mushrooms in a sensory deprivation tank, and ultimately manifesting his thoughts physically, to the extent of metamorphosis through a bestial state, and even through elemental states(water, fire, stone, etc), before destabilizing in his usual human form.

I think Shadow King remolding the body by molding the mind makes sense, even if it does seem to fly in the face of the usual definition of telepathy.

[AstonishingXMan]

http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/267.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #267

"Nanny: Into The Fire"

by Chris Claremont, Jim Lee, and Whilce Portacio

A quite-provacatively drawn Lian Shen unleashes the Hounds on the airplane junkyard where Gambit and Storm are hiding out. Shadow King has wiped the minds of the police who investigated the happenings of last issue. Storm is attempting to use her winds to fly a plane out of the junkyard...when a Hound bursts through the glass!

Gambit charges up a playing card for the first time and blasts the Hound out of the plane and to the ground. Shen is impressed. Gambit then goes on top of the moving plane, spins a broom like a staff, and kicks the second Hound off! The third Hound is flown off the plane by Storm's piloting skills. Gambit tells Storm to follow the Mississippi River home and off they go.

Gambit & Storm's airplane is intercepted by Nanny & Orphan-Maker. Nanny's presence frightens Ororo to the point where she remembers what really happened back in Uncanny X-Men #248. Nanny switched her out with a Life Model Decoy (LMD), with the X-Men finding the "dead" artificial Storm once Havok blew up Nanny's ship! Gambit drills Orphan-Maker with a charged card, sending Nanny to his rescue. "He's only a baby!" Good riddance. Gambit then motivates Storm to take on Nanny the same way she fought back against the Shadow King.

Later on, Storm awakens from a nightmare in which she saw herself becoming Orphan-Maker and a slave to Nanny. Gambit takes her out for food, as they are in his New Orleans homeland. Days pass as Gambit gets Ororo familiar with The Big Easy. They work together on a "Robin Hood" quest to steal from the bad and give back to those in need. An absolutely iconic image of Gambit is drawn unleashing his kinetically-charged cards with Storm right by his side. Storm is having the time of her life and forgets about the Shadow King and her nightmares.

Until one night, Nanny & Orphan-Maker capture Gambit. He actually "charms" Nanny but Orphan Maker takes him out. Ororo enters Nanny's ship and sees the device used to change her into a child. Ororo dons a "female" version of the Orphan-Maker armor, slugs the male version, and Gambit delivers a kinetic card to Nanny, ending the battle and sending Nanny's ship crashing into a swamp. It as a brief fight, but very hard to take seriously due to the "child-like" dialogue of Orphan-Maker.

Gambit & Storm emerge from the swamp. Gambit doesn't want to see their team break up and notices Storm sounds different...older. Storm says she isn't the same little girl he met and asks him if he's heard of the X-Men...

END.

MILESTONES:

- First time Gambit charges a playing card.
- First Uncanny X-Men issue featuring Whilce Portacio art.

THOUGHTS:

First rule of Jim Lee? Sexy women sell. Note the front and center "villain" depicted on the cover! The Shadow King? Nanny? Orphan Maker? Nah...it's hench-woman LIAN SHEN who could easily be mistaken for Psylocke. Shen is hardly in this issue and does nothing but say "Hmmmm...impressive" when Storm and Gambit escape in the beginning. That and she wears a skimpy outfit into a wind storm that's hitting the airplane junkyard.

"Homage Studios" is given credit for the art, with Lee, Portacio, and Thibert listed. Was this the first public mention of Homage Studios?

Nanny and Orphan-Maker are just awful. There's no redeeming qualities about them and they come off as inept, horrible, and terribly out of place here. Perhaps they'd work in a Power Pack story, but good riddance.

Jim Lee is back!

Odd that the near omnipotent Shadow King just leaves Storm and Gambit alone as they do their thing in New Orleans.

Gambit shows he's good with a staff as he spins a mop around and delivers a swift kick to the jaw of the second Hound he encountered this issue.

This issue really did a lot for the Gambit character, I think.

REPRINTED IN:

Gambit Classic Volume 1 TPB

[AstonishingXMan]

A DOUBLE DOSE FOR ALL OF YOU! HAVE A GREAT THANKSGIVING! THIS REVIEW COULD BE "SECONDS" AT THE DINNER TABLE! SEEYA NEXT WEEK SOMETIME!

This is an important Annual! For a change!

http://grandcentralcomics.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/uncanny-x-men-annual_14.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men Annual #14

Main Story:

"You Must Remember This: Days of Future Present Part 4" by Chris Claremont & Art Adams

"Days of Future Past" resident Rachel Summers, now in our time, eats a burger and prevents a robbery at the diner. She sees the version of Franklin Richards from her future time and chases him down. Rachel isn't convinced that this is her Franklin. He asks her to trust him and they kiss, as Rachel emits a large Phoenix firebird in the sky.

On the rooftops in New York, Franklin & Rachel say their goodbyes to the Fantastic Four and X-Factor. Reed & Sue Richards want to question Franklin but suddenly their mood changes into one of happiness for the future version of their son. Future Franklin has altered reality to get his way. Jean Grey is not happy to learn of her being a mother to Future Rachel Summers and especially unhappy of what happens to the world in the future. She runs away upset.

At the ruins of the X-Mansion, Storm and Gambit arrives and drop down through a secret hatch...and stare down the barrel of Cable's gun. The New Mutants, Forge, Banshee, and Cable are reunited with Storm...although she's a bit younger than the Storm they know of! Forge is shocked to see Storm in the body of a child, or as Boom-Boom describes her - "Jailbait!" Storm now resembles a teenager and less of a "child" like in Uncanny #265-267. Cable explains the situation with Future Franklin Richards and his "X-Men" team arriving, Future Franklin neutralizing young Franklin's powers, and the battle with Ahab, who was after Future Franklin. Storm tells how this Future Franklin was killed...so this version is an imposter!

Meanwhile, at Four Freedoms Plaza, Cyclops & Invisible Woman are taken out by Ahab & his henchmen. Storm tells the events of Days of Future Past (from Uncanny X-Men #141-142) to the FF, New Mutants, X-Factor, Forge, Cable, Gambit and Banshee. Ahab, the guardian of the "Days of Future Past" timeline and hunter of mutants, transforms Cyclops & Invisible Woman into Hound slaves.

At Prospect Park in Brooklyn, Future Franklin and Future Rachel are lakeside with Cyclops' son Nathan Summers. Ahab, Hound Cyclops, and Hound Invisible Woman get the jump on them and are too powerful. Rachel and Franklin are taken back to Ahab's tomb to be transformed into Hounds. But the FF/New Mutants/X-Factor/X-Men team has arrived and a big brawl begins!

The good guys struggle to take down Cyclops and Invisible Woman, along with the rest of Ahab's hounds. An interesting moment happens as Ahab and Cable struggle...scarred-face to scarred-face. Cable is shocked to see Ahab's face up close and is asked "WHAT'S WRONG, CABLE? SEE SOMEONE YOU KNOW? HA HAHA HAHA HA!"

Ahab uses a rather lame "tissue energy draining field" that just happens to take everyone out in every part of the tomb except where he is standing (of course) and then fires his harpoons towards Franklin and Rachel. Jean Grey saves Rachel from the harpoon and Rachel uses her own powers to heal her "mother" from the past.

Ahab has lost the battle, but he knows how the war ends. He'll be back. He teleports away. There is big trouble right now -- Cyclops & Invisible Woman are stuck as Hounds, Future Rachel has fainted, and child Franklin Richards, thought to be sleeping, is in a coma! As the teams try everything to help their friends, the reality of the situation becomes clear. "Future Franklin" isn't real. As Storm said, he was incinerated by a Sentinel during Days of Future Past. He is just a memory of Rachel's, a shadow that is causing child Franklin's coma by existing here by using his reality-warping powers . But child Franklin can't function while his future self also fuctions. Future Franklin knows he can't exist and destroy his past self.

Future Franklin "holds" child Franklin as Future Rachel taps into the full blunt of her Phoenix powers, as Reed activates a machine to disincorporate Future Franklin and return his energy to child Franklin, who awakens. Rachel, however, reappears in her "Hound" form. Jean Grey is surprised to see this and Rachel, emotional at the loss of Future Franklin and Jean's continued disappointment at her future "child" and life, flies off. Jean continues to be emotionally distant from Cyclops and is unsure of her own feelings.

The different grounds say their goodbyes. Boom-Boom has the hots for the Human Torch, but Cannonball points out that he's married.

X-Factor offers the makeshift X-Men team (Storm, Banshee, Forge, and Gambit) their assistance in finding the remaining missing X-Men, but Storm, speaking more like her old natural leader self, asks them to protect the home front as they go on their search. Goodbyes are said and the friendship between the X-teams and the FF is strong.

Later, at her parents' home Jean Grey looks at the holo-crystal containing images of Phoenix (Jean's double) and Rachel Summers and ponders her own destiny in life.

END.

Back-Up Story:

"The Fundamental Things" by Chris Claremont & Mark Heike

This is a tale of Wolverine, Jubilee, and Psylocke in Madripoor.

Jubilee entertains a crowd using her fireworks and plasmoid powers. Wolverine tells her the show's over, then gets scolded for smoking a cigar. Jubilee hates them.

Jubilee asks why Wolverine keeps pushing himself so hard when he needs time to heal. She also wants to know of the X-Men and what makes them so special. Wolverine says "us," not "them," because Jubilee is one of them now.

A history of the problems that mutants face with being accepted, as well as Charles Xavier's dream and his founding of the X-Men is explained by Wolverine to Jubilee. In a half-comedic/half-WTF? moment, Future Franklin Richards and Future Rachel Summers, from the main story, appears, and Jubilee basically tells them to buzz off and let Wolverine finish the story.

Wolverine continues to explain the history of the X-Men, and most recent history, when an emotional Rachel confronts him about what has gone down with the Phoenix, Selene, and Wolverine's treatment of her. Jubilee and Rachel are at each other's throats until Future Franklin makes Psylocke and Jubilee suddenly disappear.

Wolverine explains the mission of the X-Men to Rachel further, and she accepts his words, going so far as to say Wolverine has become the "conscious" of the X-Men! Franklin brings back Psylocke and Jubilee, and Nathan Summrs materializes within his arms. This is clearly taking place right before Ahab and his Hounds capture Rachel and Franklin in Brooklyn during the first story.

The group says its goodbyes as Rachel and Franklin plan to find Cyclops and Jean.

MILESTONES:

Main Story:

- Storm rejoins the X-Men. Last seen as a member in Uncanny X-Men #248.
- Gambit joins the X-Men.
- First appearance of Cable in Uncanny X-Men.

Second Story:

- Wolverine names Jubilee as a member of the X-Men.

THOUGHTS:

This is a long story and can get very confusing. However, a few re-reads of certain pages and I really enjoyed it. It felt like it actually was part of the bigger picture at times, as Storm & Gambit came back, reunited with the X-teams, got their uniforms, and explained how this X-team would set out to find the other members. Also, Jean Grey continues to be unsure of herself and her own emotions.

ART ADAMS delivers some amazing artwork! I love his style and it really made this rather complicated story work.

So, wanna try to "No Prize" the whole Ahab/Cable thing given what we know now? Obviously, with the matching scars and the tease, they wanted fans to think Cable would become the murderous Ahab. Moments before, Ahab appears in Brooklyn to surprise Future Rachel, Future Franklin, and baby Nathan Summers at a lake. Obviously, the shock of such a scary man like Ahab was burned into baby Nathan's head as a child, and all those years later confronted by him in the tomb made Cable shout "HIS FACE!" because he remembered the scariest image from...nah, not even gonna try that one. Haha, let's just say I'm glad Cable didn't become Ahab.

[limerick]

A double shot.....Quite simply astonishing,Astonishing!!!

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-Men # 267:

--Nice work,Astonishing.....I really enjoyed this issue even though Storm and Gambit aren't my favourite X-Men......Gambit really comes across a lot better than the last issue and we get more of a sense of fun from him here......It was cool to see him using those playing cards for the first time.

--I noticed that reference to HOMAGE STUDIOS---although in the original comic the art team is listed as Lee,Portacio andWilliams,not Thiebert......Are you reading a reprint.....Maybe there was a mistake in the original which was corrected in the reprint......It's interesting to see the artists refering to themselves as a Studio......There is a sense of them seizing a little bit of power there and of course it wasn't long before the artists wrestled power completely from the writers in the 1990's.......It's unusual the way three artists are working on the comic rather than the usual penciller/inker duo......I'm interested in how they shared the work??

--You're so right about Lian Shen.....She looks totally hot and I can see why she's on the cover as well as the splash page.....I must say I enjoyed her sarcastic banter with The Shadow King during her appearances.....She's a little more than the usual Shadow King pawn.....(But looks hot in fishnets!)

[limerick]

More Thoughts on Uncanny # 267:

--Gambit's eyes are weird...very dark with red pupils.....His friendship with Ororo does seem a bit strange??

--Nanny and Orphan-maker are such lame villains.....I hate seeing top class art like this wasted on 'D'-list villains..

--Havok's actions (i.e. shooting down Nanny's ship and taking 'Storm' with it)are explained by Nanny---She somehow mentally influenced him.....Was Psylocke there.....Wouldn't she have sensed Havoks and Storm's thoughts......I can't remember exactly what happened.....Maybe she was out of it at the time?

--Gambit shows that 'Charm' power again.....Does it get mentioned again or is that it??

--A Question.....How do Nanny's age-reversal system and the Life-Model-Decoy work on Storm when she is invisible to all computer systems after Roma's intervention at the end of 'Fall of The Mutants'??

[Imraith Nimphais]

I think I may have been the only reader to really not like Gambit...then...and now...not for any specific reason, mind you...I just find him completely uninteresting.

[limerick]

Thoughts on Uncanny X-Men # 267:

--Nice work,Astonishing.....I really enjoyed this issue even though Storm and Gambit aren't my favourite X-Men......Gambit really comes across a lot better than the last issue and we get more of a sense of fun from him here......It was cool to see him using those playing cards for the first time.




No,Imraith....You're not the only one!!!......(Sorry about Storm!--I know she's a fave of yours).

[Imraith Nimphais]

Re-reading these issues...one can't help but notice how CC re-hashes his own plots from time to time...(i'm not criticising, just saying...) I felt like I read this one too many times...the de-aging thing, the loss of powers thing etc etc...at this point it ceased to thrill me...wot did thrill me was the art...:0

[limerick]

Re-reading these issues...one can't help but notice how CC re-hashes his own plots from time to time...(i'm not criticising, just saying...) I felt like I read this one too many times...the de-aging thing, the loss of powers thing etc etc...at this point it ceased to thrill me...wot did thrill me was the art...:0
Yeah,de-aging and de-powering are recurring themes for him.....Storm seems to be particularly vunerable!!

[Imraith Nimphais]

LOL...for real, Limerick...:-))..truth to tell...i did not care at all for her seeming "death" and de-aging at he hands of Nanny, no less...of all villains, Nanny?...puh-frakkin please. Everything was just so over done...and you echo my thoughts exactly on the whole Havoc shooting her and no one realising it was a LMD....it was just a lame-ass set up...but there is noted improvement just around the corner to the storylines...so I can leave the past in the past, happily.

[Parch]

thoughts on #265

I'd rather just forget about this nanny nonsense. There's some interesting stuff with the plane and some good interaction between our heroes, but this is still about the the character development of Gambit IMO. That's what I find interesting.

It seems strange that the card thing didn't appear in the first issue. Was it just something added on the fly? And the charm thing never stuck. Keep some stuff, drop some stuff, it's an evolution. It would be interesting to know what the writing team was thinking as they come up with these "new" characters. We all know how iconic these characters are now, but this is the birth of Gambit. So much is established in the first few appearances.

[limerick]

Yeah,I think the card thing was something they thought of after the first issue......It's probably an artistic call by Portacio and Lee......It was strange seeing Gambit energising random objects in # 266.

You makea good point about Gambit being a new character......The last batch of 'new recruits' to the X-men(Psylocke,Havok,Dazzler & Longshot)all had extensive histories already......Jubilee,and now,Gambit are the first real new X-men in a while.

[CallMeGeoff]

I think I may have been the only reader to really not like Gambit...then...and now...not for any specific reason, mind you...I just find him completely uninteresting.

I have a feeling a lot of Gambit fans were first exposed to him by the 1990s X-Men Animated Series. He worked pretty well in the context of that show, especially if that was your first exposure to the X-Men.

[limerick]

From reading what other posters say,the animated series and movies have often been their first introduction to the X-men.....So every movie or animated series probablybrings a new wave of readers on board

[AstonishingXMan]

My first X-Men issue was...

Uncanny X-Men #299. I went back and got nearly every X-issue but at that time Gambit was the MAN. So yeah, I really got into him because of the cartoon. Gambit was my favorite character from when I started reading X-books until he was phased out (briefly) during the "Trial of Gambit" in #350 I lost interest. Didn't really get into his solo book.

[limerick]

My first X-Men issue was...

Uncanny X-Men #299. I went back and got nearly every X-issue but at that time Gambit was the MAN. So yeah, I really got into him because of the cartoon. Gambit was my favorite character from when I started reading X-books until he was phased out (briefly) during the "Trial of Gambit" in #350 I lost interest. Didn't really get into his solo book.
I'll be honest,I'm not overly familiar with him.....I have the issues but haven't read much past about # 315......So as the threads go onI'm looking foward to seeing what all the fuss is about!

[AstonishingXMan]

Check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-0VtA7XRlI

[limerick]

Check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-0VtA7XRlI
Yeah...that edits him to look like THE man.....But Wolverine makes a good point...what do they know about this guy???!

[limerick]

Yeah...that edits him to look like THE man.....But Wolverine makes a good point...what do they know about this guy???!
Gotta try and get some sleep.....Catch you again,Astonishing and Geoff!

[worstblogever]

Ah, the legendary "Rachel eats a burger" annual #14. I have a good friend that did a whole online rant about this issue as his problem with Claremont's writing at times. It's pages of someone with the power of the Phoenix chowing down on fast food, and introspection.

Now, in small doses, yes. But here... it does get a bit ridiculous.

[jlmoor]

I have a feeling a lot of Gambit fans were first exposed to him by the 1990s X-Men Animated Series. He worked pretty well in the context of that show, especially if that was your first exposure to the X-Men.

I started up right before the series hit. For me the Gambit thing was the fact I was a 13-year-old girl, and the Rogue/Gambit chemistry with Lee/Kubert art was HOT!! He was a fun character, but got less interesting as time went on. I don't mind him so much now, there seems to be a hell of a lot of Cajun hate on the boards:wink: , but I still think he is an alright character.

[jlmoor]

I'll be honest,I'm not overly familiar with him.....I have the issues but haven't read much past about # 315......So as the threads go onI'm looking foward to seeing what all the fuss is about!

This is about where I trailed off oh so long ago. I have spent the past couple of months playing catch up. I'll be perfectly honest, there was some stuff between the early 300's and now that were damn painful to read through. I'm looking forward to doing it again with support this time:wink:

[The Blinkmeister]

Didn't really get into his solo book.

Shame, at it was an excellent solo book. It also explained a part of Mr. Sinister's powerset (with the help of a friend).

[limerick]

This is about where I trailed off oh so long ago. I have spent the past couple of months playing catch up. I'll be perfectly honest, there was some stuff between the early 300's and now that were damn painful to read through. I'm looking forward to doing it again with support this time:wink:
We can get through this......together....lolol!

[AstonishingXMan]

http://www.richiebits.com/comics/covers/UncannyX-men268.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #268

"Madripoor Knights" by Chris Claremont & Jim Lee

Wolverine. Captain America. Black Widow. Together Again -- FOR THE FIRST TIME!

Madripoor. 1941.

In Lowtown, Captain America leaps into battle against the Hand! Their fighting style is new to him. Suddenly, Logan appears and joins in the melee. Cap & Wolverine defeat the ninjas and save a Russian man from them.

Madripoor. 1990.

Black Widow is overwhelmed by Hand ninjas. Jubilee, Psylocke, and Wolverine appear and come to her aid. They defeat the ninjas but Widow collapses into Wolverine's arms.

Madripoor. 1941.

At Seraph's (the bar that will become Princess Bar), Logan bumps into & spills a drink on Baron Von Strucker. He's ready for a fight with the Nazis when the tiny owner, Seraph breaks it up. At Logan's table sit Steve Rogers & Major Petrovitch, the man they saved earlier. Logan "bumped into" Strucker so he could follow his scent later. Cap is after Strucker, and Petrovitch wants the young girl Strucker has abducted - Natasha Romanoff, who will become Black Widow!

Madripoor. 1990.

Black Widow awakens in bed and hugs Wolverine, her "Little Uncle." Jubilee spies and has yet another "gorgeous babe" friend of Wolverine's to be jealous of. Widow is in Madripoor to locate the Fenris Twins (they're meeting with Matsuo) while the X-trio want to take down the Hand.

Madripoor. 1941.

Wolverine dropkicks through the windshield of a Nazi automobile with Natasha inside. Cap and the Major join the fight as shields Natsha from bullets. They take her to an American embassy, but are double crossed and surrounded by Strucker and his troops. Strucker plans to mold young Natasha into the Hand's ultimate assassin.

Madripoor. 1990.

The X-trio and Black Widow assault Matsuo's boat, where the Fenris twins are meeting with him. Jubilee unleashes a ridiculous fireworks explosion to disable the engines and the ladies take out the guards.

Madripoor. 1941.

Wolverine, now fully healed to Cap's shock, leaps into battle and they are able to save Natasha from the Hand influence and get her to safety. As Cap, the Major, and Natasha board a plane, Cap and Wolverine exchange goodbyes. Cap wonders if one day he and Wolverine would team-up regularly? Wolverine says he doesn't need a sidekick! Ha!

Madripoor. 1990.

Whoops. Turns out that the "Mastuo and Fenris twins" on the boat weren't the real deal. Just decoys. The foursome of heroes feel like fools. On shore, the real deals are clinking wine glasses together, having avoided a run-in with their enemies.

THOUGHTS:

- Amazing art and some iconic images of both Captain America and Wolverine.

- Jubilee really busts out a HUGE fireworks display!

- DEMONIC looking shot of Wolverine as he prepares to carve up Nazis and Hand ninjas during the final 1941 battle.

- Please sign Jim Lee to a lifetime contract!

- Jubilee seems rather amazed and skeptical of Black Widow. Poor Jubilation. Not only is Wolverine's newest super model friend a perfect 10, but she's also 49 years old?

- Claremont pretty much ignores "Marvel Time" to set the story, huh?

- Awwwwwwwesome comic book. Ending is a little flat, though.

MILESTONES:

First (chronological) meeting of Wolverine, Captain America, and Black Widow.

REPRINTED IN:

X-Men Visionaries: Jim Lee TPB

[Witchfan]

This is the first issue of X-Men I ever bought. I think it's a great issue. I think Marvel.com listed it as one of the top 70 Marvel comics of all time.

[jlmoor]

YAY!!!!! I love this issue (until Origins ruined it:mad: :mad: ) I just bought this over the summer to fill in the gap in my collection. Favorite part (or course) is when Wolverine he tells Cap he does not need Cap as his side-kick. Such a fun story.
I thought the bit with Widow's age was funny, but hell, it's Marvel. Who cares, tons of fun and amazing art!!

[adamthered]

Ah, 268. You're are a blast. Love that issue.

[Imraith Nimphais]

Ahhhhh...268...I liken you to one day's rain after a yearly drought. A cool draught that slakes my fevered thirst...A flower-scented zephyr, in love's ravaged garden.
A radiance that...well...suffice it to say, everything (the majority, at least) prior (and post Inferno) was just poorly-digestible, unflavoured filler.

LET THE GOOD TIMES BEGIN! (again)...for however short a period.

[kk1]

My favorite Jim Lee issue, and one of my favorite X-men issues ever. This is the type of story I was hoping to get about Wolverine when he lost his adamantium since it shows what a badass Wolverine can still be even w/o claws and unbreakable bones.

[jedichris]

Hope you guys don't mind me joining in,these from the beginning threads are great!
When this originally came out I was still very new to the X-Men,and was completely blown away by Jim Lee's art.
The interaction between Logan and Cap was great too,you'd think that with their different style/philosophy that they would be enemies,but I definitely sensed a mutual respect between the two.
Overall a really good issue.I look forward to throwing my two cents in on each issue!

[Imraith Nimphais]

You are most welcome here, Jedi-C...the more the merrier...as the saying goes. And just so you know, in this thread, your two cents are worth more than gold and diamonds put together...:-))

[limerick]

http://www.richiebits.com/comics/covers/UncannyX-men268.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #268


THOUGHTS:

- Amazing art and some iconic images of both Captain America and Wolverine.

- Jubilee really busts out a HUGE fireworks display!

- DEMONIC looking shot of Wolverine as he prepares to carve up Nazis and Hand ninjas during the final 1941 battle.

- Please sign Jim Lee to a lifetime contract!

- Jubilee seems rather amazed and skeptical of Black Widow. Poor Jubilation. Not only is Wolverine's newest super model friend a perfect 10, but she's also 49 years old?

- Claremont pretty much ignores "Marvel Time" to set the story, huh?

- Awwwwwwwesome comic book. Ending is a little flat, though.

MILESTONES:

First (chronological) meeting of Wolverine, Captain America, and Black Widow.



Great summary,Dude.....And a nice cover...gotta pull it out tomorrow......Astonishing's doing such a good job with the summaries I'm concentrating on the other threads a lot.....I really gotta keep my eye on Uncanny!!

This is the first issue of X-Men I ever bought. I think it's a great issue. I think Marvel.com listed it as one of the top 70 Marvel comics of all time.

It did kinda become iconic,didn't it?......I think this cover may be the one people associate with Jim Lee's run the most

YAY!!!!! I love this issue (until Origins ruined it:mad: :mad: ) I just bought this over the summer to fill in the gap in my collection. Favorite part (or course) is when Wolverine he tells Cap he does not need Cap as his side-kick. Such a fun story.
I thought the bit with Widow's age was funny, but hell, it's Marvel. Who cares, tons of fun and amazing art!!

Was she really named as aged 49??!.....She's got the bod of a 21-year-old!(Jim Lee is very flattering)




Ahhhhh...268...I liken you to one day's rain after a yearly drought. A cool draught that slakes my fevered thirst...A flower-scented zephyr, in love's ravaged garden.
A radiance that...well...suffice it to say, everything (the majority, at least) prior (and post Inferno) was just poorly-digestible, unflavoured filler.

LET THE GOOD TIMES BEGIN! (again)...for however short a period.

With prose like that I alwaysfeel a little bit better about the world....You have a wonderful way with words,my friend!


Hope you guys don't mind me joining in,these from the beginning threads are great!
When this originally came out I was still very new to the X-Men,and was completely blown away by Jim Lee's art.
The interaction between Logan and Cap was great too,you'd think that with their different style/philosophy that they would be enemies,but I definitely sensed a mutual respect between the two.
Overall a really good issue.I look forward to throwing my two cents in on each issue!

Don't mind at all....everyone push down a seat....New Guy on board!.....Keep the posts coming,Dude!......Pity I can't phrase it like Imraith but the sentiments the same!

[worstblogever]

#268 was really the greatest issue of Uncanny that Claremont and Lee collaborated on, for me. What makes it even better is that it's a stand-alone tale that incorporates the past of Wolverine, to that of two of the Avengers, as well as the Von Struckers, past & present.

Great stuff.

[AstonishingXMan]

http://onceuponageek.com/images/shirt_x-men.JPG

Some military dudes have been posting these all over my town.

No idea what they mean but the soldiers looks PISSED.

Also, limerick, I've been checking out your other X-threads @ work, great stuff, I'll be ready to comment on them soon because you're just about at where I started reading 'em!

[jlmoor]

http://onceuponageek.com/images/shirt_x-men.JPG

Some military dudes have been posting these all over my town.

No idea what they mean but the soldiers looks PISSED.

Also, limerick, I've been checking out your other X-threads @ work, great stuff, I'll be ready to comment on them soon because you're just about at where I started reading 'em!

Who is posting this and why now? I want one

[Parch]

thoughts on 268

Gotta agree. This is a very well written issue. Sufficient ninja and nazi flashback content, and a classic interaction between 2 icons. Cap and Wolverine's assumptions about being a sidekick was perfect.

This was a very good issue for Wolverine. In fact it felt very much like an issue of Wolverine. (WARNING: cheap plug for a Limerick thread)...Seriously, it's a real shame more people aren't reading those older issues and participating in the Wolverine/beginning thread. It's a quality title.

[kk1]

It did kinda become iconic,didn't it?......I think this cover may be the one people associate with Jim Lee's run the most



Unfortunately I think the cover is has the worst art in the book. The coloring is poor and the backgrounds are weak.

[jlmoor]

Unfortunately I think the cover is has the worst art in the book. The coloring is poor and the backgrounds are weak.

It is replicated a lot. I'm not the best perosn to comment on art, but I think that limerick is right, I've seen this cover a lot. Many people commission it's reproductino and I've seen a lot of artitst on a few different sites play with it for practice. I think it may have a bit to do with who is on it however:wink:

[AstonishingXMan]

http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/uncanny-x-men/269-11.jpg

The Uncanny X-Men #269

"Rogue Redux" by Chris Claremont & Jim Lee

Rogue's body (and memories of her Siege Perilous entry, interestingly) is reborn and she lands buck naked back at the X-Men's former Australia base. She sees a newx report on the television - the possessed Valerie Cooper was successful in killing Mystique! Cooper tells the media that she plans to find the person responsible as the Shadow King's presence looms. Rogue, in tears, flies out the window. Or at least she tries to...her flight powers are gone! And she lands at the feet of the Reavers, who have overtaken the town.

At the Reavers base, Lady Deathstrike continues her transformation of Cylla Markham into the new Bonebreaker. Donald Pierce sends orders to the Reavers: kill Rogue! Suddenly, a rather human looking Carol Danvers appears in her modern Ms. Marvel costume! As she battles the Reavers, Rogue is able to run away, locate Gateway, "borrow" his teleportation powers via a kiss on the lips, and transport herself far away...but it looks like Carol followed her into the jump!

What an opening!

Meanwhile, in deep space, a powerful Shi'ar Strike Lord has boarded with his troops and they're after Lila Cheney! She's didn't die in New Mutants #70 (check out Limerick's review!) after all. Cheney is able to escape the strike team and teleports herself away!

Rogue lands in the Savage Land! She's pretty happy with her new prehistorical tropical settings.

Ms. Marvel ends up on Muir Island, where Moira MacTaggart, Amanda Sefton, Legion, and the possessed inhabitants have Polaris held captive. As astral projection of Legion is ripped apart to reveal The Shadow King, who rules Muir Island! Carol's separation from Rogue has cut her strength powers in half. Carol defeats Sefton and is able to resist the Shadow King's attempts to possess her, which impresses him. Later, we learn, she wasn't able to resist for long...

Rogue comes upon the destroyed United Tribes village (from Uncanny X-Men Annual #12) and wonders who fought such a war here. However, she is being spyed on by a familiar looking man. Suddenly, a decayed Ms. Marvel comes flying at her with an uppercut! Rogue responds but throwing a huge log at her! It seems their powers are "shared" the closer they get to each other. Indeed, the "corpse" like Carol starts to have normal blotches of skin when Rogue gets close, and Rogue gets "decayed" areas of hers!

Rogue has the chance to finish Carol off but she won't let herself be a killer. Carol strikes! It turns out she's been possessed by the Shadow King and not only has she come for Rogue's life essence, but to take her powers to serve her new king. Carol drains Rogue to the point of near-death and Rogue's body becomes rotten. And at that moment, Carol is struck from behind by a powerful blast.

At the Citadel which was once Sauron's, Rogue awakens, having been restored to full powers & health by the machines of...MAGNETO! Only one could survive. And he chose Rogue.

THOUGHTS:

The beginning of a major transformation in the way Rogue is presented. Almost from from "bad attitude outcast" to "super hot babe" with the way Jim Lee draws her and a more innocent inner monologue written by Claremont.

How about that naked two-page spread of Rogue right off the bat? Heh, bet the kids hid this issue from their parents!

I wonder what Lila is in trouble for...

More "hot babe" Rogue in the Savage Land. Showering under a waterfall...and creating the tiniest outfit ever worn! Lee was practicing for Gen 13 with this issue. A simply gust of wind would tear Rogue's outfit apart!

HO-LEE CRAP is that an iconic shot of Magneto drawn by Lee on the last page!

Good issue. Rogue's back! We've got tabs on Dazzlier, Storm, Psylocke, Colossus...waitasec, I wonder where Havok is...

IMPORTANT HAPPENINGS:

- Rogue is permanently freed of the "Carol Danvers persona" that was in her mind.

- Return of Magneto, who was believed to have perished during "Acts of Vengeance" after a battle with the West Coast Avengers

- Lila Cheney revealed to be alive.

- Mystique is reported to be dead by Val Cooper.

- Hey...check out the "heads" on the cover above the issue number! Gambit! Jubilee! Asian Psylocke! Truly a new era of Uncanny is underway...

REPRINTED IN:

X-Men Visionaries: Jim Lee TPB

NEXT: THE X-TINCTION AGENDA

[AstonishingXMan]

An uncanny double post!

[AstonishingXMan]

It's coming...

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/229/92551-151565-x-tinction-agenda_large.jpg

NOVEMBER 1990...

http://wolverine.x-knights.com/fullsize/wolverine195.jpg

Who will survive and what will be left of them?

http://img1.fantasticfiction.co.uk/images/n6/n31363.jpg

JIM LEE.
CHRIS CLAREMONT.
ROB LIEFELD.
LOUISE SIMONSON.
And some awful X-Factor art.

[jlmoor]

Best last page of a comic ever!!:redface:
I seriuosly need to re-read it because I don't remember anything but that. :wink:Well I do remember Rogue's outfit. Rogue didn't really interest me a the time, but I think the reason I started to like her and find her interesting was this issue. I had no idea what was going on, where she was or who anybody was, so this whole time period was my intro to the x-men.

I was pretty new to comics when I read this and remembered thinking WTF? Isn't he like a bad guy? But damn he's cool. And he just saved hottie half naked Rogue, so how bad could he be:wink:

[Imraith Nimphais]

YAY!!!! ROGUE IS BACK, WANKERS!!!!!
...just my thought on 269...(the last time I was this excited by/for an x-character was when Storm got her powers back in FOTM.)

[jedichris]

The fight between Rogue/Ms. Marvel reminded me of Superman 3 where the "evil" Superman fought Clark Kent.
The ending was a nice surprise with the excellent art of Jim Lee.I'll give it a B.

[limerick]

http://www.richiebits.com/comics/covers/UncannyX-men268.jpg




YAY!!!!! I love this issue (until Origins ruined it:mad: :mad: ) I just bought this over the summer to fill in the gap in my collection. Favorite part (or course) is when Wolverine he tells Cap he does not need Cap as his side-kick. Such a fun story.
I thought the bit with Widow's age was funny, but hell, it's Marvel. Who cares, tons of fun and amazing art!!

:biggrin: That was funny!

Unfortunately I think the cover is has the worst art in the book. The coloring is poor and the backgrounds are weak.

Although this cover was way better than some of the stuff we'd been given over the last few issues,I agree with you that it doesn't do justice to the awesome interior art.....Often it's the other way around with a cover flattering the interiors.

Thoughts on Uncanny X-Men # 268:

--Oh joy!The art is beyond belief......So good,in fact,that it actually distracts from the story a little.....I found myself just looking at the beautiful images and almost forgetting to read the story......Lee's versions of Wolverine,Captain America and Psylocke are all knockout and his action scenes are superb which can sometimes be a problem for an artist who draws 'pretty' images......But his Black Widow is the highlight......Has a character,who always looks good,ever looked hotter.....Wow!......And she's gotta be at least 55.........Scott Williams has to take some credit for his finishes....This art is on another level to what Lee was turning out for 'Alpha Flight' not too long ago.

--The story is by no means perfect......I enjoyed the 1941 section but the modern day part was a bit too contrived and there probably wasn't quite enough room in one issues to do both stories justice......The ending with the fake Fenris and Tsurayaba was especially lame.....But there were plenty of nice little touches......I enjoyed Jubilee comparing her boobs to Widow's and Psylocke's on page 18 and looking suitibly pissed!

--Black Widow wakes up from her battle induced sleep to find herself bandaged and dressed in some skimpy lingerie----All provided by Wolverine.....Has the little guy got a secret he hasn't revealed yet!

--Wolverine shouldn't be in costume on the cover,shouldn't he?......He should be in civvies in the 1941/Captain America section.

--Why does Captain America's costume work?....It looks so cheesy but it just seems right somehow......He is a great character who I'm not overly familiar with......I only have one issue of his own title---A John Byrne pencilled issue(i think)where people try to persuade Cap. to run for president.....But anytime I've read him in any other title he seems to be someone who really epitomises pure values.

--Does Psylocke look pissed because Black Widow looks consistently hotter than her or because she's just plain freezing in that outfit!

[markdienekes]

It's amusing that it says, together again for the first time. So, technically it should read 'together for the first time' surely?

[limerick]

Yeah,it doesn't really make sense.......'Together Again and For the First Time' might have made more sense--Only Captain America doesn't appear in the modern story.

[limerick]

http://image2.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/fullsize/97792366288.269.GIF

Thoughts on Uncanny X-Men # 269:

--What a great cover.....Even if I was a casual X-fan I'd be wondering how the hell Rogue can be fighting Ms. Marvel(Binary now,surely?!)......All will be explained in the pages within......And even better looks who's back.....That helmet....It can only mean Magneto!! *limerick turns cover hurriedly!*

--Rogue returns,looking hotter than ever.....And in an amazing twist,Ms. Marvel has been seperated from her......I thought Rogue's personality after she absorbed Carol Danvers memories was a combination of both of their personalities......She was a bad-ass before that so why isn't she a bad-ass again now she's liberated from Ms Marvel?......Like back in her Brotherhood of Evil Mutant days?......Also,as somebody mentioned,it just isn't fitting in with the Seige Perilous scenario that Rogue retains her memories?

--How does Carol end up on Muir Isle?

--That last page is awesome,isn't it----Magneto back and not afraid to use his powers......(He looks like he's been workin out!Mind you with Jim Lee they all do!)

--This was a great issue with Rogue finally burying her demons......But why did it take her so long to re-emerge from the Seige Perilous.??.....She went through it ages ago and the others went through long after her and emerged instantly.

--There are some pretty gratuitious pictures of Rogue here......Her outfit just covers the vital areas---Some things are uneffected by the Seige,it seems:wink:

[MagnetoIzRight]

Mimic is a great character

[Cub]

Great couple of issues. I'm usually not one for guest stars in a book. Like, if I wanted to see Daredevil, I would read Daredevil. But 268 was really well done. Haven't reread it myself yet, but is this the issue where Jubilee takes a look at the racks on Natasha and Elisabeth and then peeks down her own shirt? Hilarious. Love me some Jubes. Gotta disagree with Limerick on this being Jim Lee's most iconic X-Cover. I think that's definitely the 5-page spread for Adjectiveless #1. As for #269, I adore it. This is the Rogue I know and love. Also, this issue helped me come to terms with my sexuality. I remember reading the issue, looking at Rogue in (almost) all her glory, and feeling... nothing.

[jlmoor]

Also, this issue helped me come to terms with my sexuality. I remember reading the issue, looking at Rogue in (almost) all her glory, and feeling... nothing.

I really almost want to sig you for this one:wink: This is priceless.

[limerick]

Great couple of issues. I'm usually not one for guest stars in a book. Like, if I wanted to see Daredevil, I would read Daredevil. But 268 was really well done. Haven't reread it myself yet, but is this the issue where Jubilee takes a look at the racks on Natasha and Elisabeth and then peeks down her own shirt? Hilarious. Love me some Jubes. Gotta disagree with Limerick on this being Jim Lee's most iconic X-Cover. I think that's definitely the 5-page spread for Adjectiveless #1. As for #269, I adore it. This is the Rogue I know and love. Also, this issue helped me come to terms with my sexuality. I remember reading the issue, looking at Rogue in (almost) all her glory, and feeling... nothing.
You're right--Adjectiveless # 1 is his best known!.....BTW,if you felt nothing looking at Rogue(who I must say has been treated more and more as a sex object artisticly as time goes on--almost to the point of it becoming slightly distasteful),something must have stirred for you looking at awesome Magneto on that final page---Although 100% hetro myself,he looks pretty buff physically(The movie '300' comes to mind).....If I were tht way inclined I'm sure he would provoke a response!......I remember looking at the Rogue pictures and feeling.....frustration at incidental smoke and a gravity-defying T-shirt....Rogue continues her constant ability to flirt with nudity but just avoid showing those vital bits(Thankfully for the people at the Comics Code!)

[limerick]

.....The Return of The King!!.....Magneto's Back!.....

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/3/31499/639984-magneto_00_super.jpg

Uncanny # 269 sees Magneto return to the pages of the X-men(after a brief cameo in Uncanny # 253 on Muir Isle) where he belongs!.....But what has he been up to since his departure from the New Mutants??......Unfortunately,Chris Claremont's departure from NM affected the Master of Magnetism more than most.......After handling him superbly for years,Claremont handed him over to Louise Simonson in the pages of the NMs......From the off she seemed to misunderstand him and he deteriorated into a grumpy old sod---a travesty of the multi-layered character Claremont had produced.......Now Claremont has him back so we can expect great things........But what has he been up to since leaving the New Mutants to go and lead the Hellfire Club and how did he end up backin the Savage Land(a former haunt of his):


--New Mutants # 75....Parts ways with the New Mutants and becomes the new leader of the Hellfire Club.

--Uncanny X-men # 253....Visits Muir Ilse to put Moira McTaggert straight on his change of opinions.

--Wolverine # 19....Makes a blink and you'll miss it cameo with the rest of the 'Acts of Vengence' mentalists!

--Appears across various titles during 'Acts of Vengence',including Amazing Spiderman,Web of Spiderman,Captain America,Avengers but primarliy Avengers West Coast where he links up with the newly nuts Scarlet Witch and The Vision.......With the help of Quicksilver he is eventually overcome.

--Wolverine # 23....Returns to the pages of Wolverine to 'chat' with Nazi war criminal and cyborg,Geist---One of his best ever Marvel appearances---Short but oh-so-menacing!

--Uncanny # 269....Rogue is rescued by the great man.....oh-er.....Mutant.....I can see why he picked her!.....And he's back in the safe hands of Claremont!

[limerick]

They never did explain the Hellfire Club or The Savage Land......maybe in the next few issues??

[Goshin]

They never explained why he left the hellfire club or the whole grey king thing; an they just brought that back up in Necrosha...

[AstonishingXMan]

Apparently that "energy power" machine in Magneto's Savage Land Citadel that gets Rogue back to full speed used to be Sauron's and was depicted in the first issues of MARVEL FANFARE with the X-Men and Sauron tussling.

That machine appears in the second season finale of Fox's X-Men animated series, with Mr. Sinister and friends capturing Magneto and the X-Men and using the machine to power up Sinister's army. Magneto even references the Savage Land Citadel as his old base, so the 2 issues of Magneto in the Savage Land (269, 274) get some play later!

The upcoming X-Tinction Agenda issues will sell for $9-20 (the Uncanny issues being the most expensive) on the back issue front just a few months afterwards and remain that way until around 2000.

Good lord are the X-Factor issues FUGLY. I've seen better art in "Cracked Magazine" (seriously) and it really hurt the crossover.

[AstonishingXMan]

And hey, since we're into the Jim Lee era (and the 1990's "Hey, I'll put my kids through college by buying comics!" era) I thought I'd take at look at what some of these recent issues we've looked at are worth now and what I remember them selling for. I worked at a pretty hip lil' story at the mall during the 90's!

All prices gathered via ComicsPriceGuide.com, which is one of if not the most professional grading/non-grade price guides around!

Near-mint condition:

Uncanny X-Men #244 - $30

This was as high as $40 during the 1990's. First Jubilee jacked it up? OR do we really want to read more "M Squad" stories?

Uncanny X-Men #248 - $24

This was as high as $48 during the 1990's. Jim Lee's first issue. Print run was low and "only" 410,000 (sound crazy today!!). A 2nd print quickly came out with a different, gold cover.

Uncanny X-Men #251 - $20

A great cover, but this comic was never that expensive during the 1990's. I recall this being fairly easy to get for $2 during the "back issue boom" where everything was expensive.

Uncanny X-Men #256-258 - $6 each

Acts of Vengeance. These were $10-12 during the 90's and not super hard, but not easy, to acquire. Jim Lee art and a Wolverine battle = high mark-up.

Uncanny X-Men #266 - $60

Despite the Annual now being regarded more (and rightfully so) as the "true" first appearance of Gambit, THIS was THE first appearance of Gambit for all of the 90's. Price has been $40-50 forever on this book, so it stayed at the 90's cost and gained some more value.

Uncanny X-Men #267 - $20

This always was well below Gambit's first appearance, but had gotten up to $27 during the 1990's. I think $20 is as high as it'll get.

Uncanny X-Men #268 - $16

Sold for up to $30 during the mid-90's due to the story's popularity and Jim Lee.

And then...

We'll get into lots of "gimmicky" covers and first appearance post-Jim Lee that were hot and now are fairly common. But that's for another day.

[jlmoor]

You're right--Adjectiveless # 1 is his best known!.....BTW,if you felt nothing looking at Rogue(who I must say has been treated more and more as a sex object artisticly as time goes on--almost to the point of it becoming slightly distasteful),something must have stirred for you looking at awesome Magneto on that final page---Although 100% hetro myself,he looks pretty buff physically(The movie '300' comes to mind).....If I were tht way inclined I'm sure he would provoke a response!......I remember looking at the Rogue pictures and feeling.....frustration at incidental smoke and a gravity-defying T-shirt....Rogue continues her constant ability to flirt with nudity but just avoid showing those vital bits(Thankfully for the people at the Comics Code!)

Yes. He did:wink: Made things quite strange as a 13-year-old girl to think 'ooooooooo, he's hot." That and the whole 'I chose you' thing was pretty hot as well.

[tHE HITPACK]

Not long till Claremont leaves now then i'tll get really intresting. Can't wait to read the adjectiveless thread. God i pray for an Essential edition of that.

[limerick]

http://image2.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/fullsize/97792366288.270.GIF

Uncanny X-Men #270 ..............November 1990

"First Strike"

Claremont/Lee

The American and Genoshan media report on the deteriorating diplomatic relations between the two countries over the 'X-Men's' interference in the recapture of Jenny Ransome by Genoshan agents.

The Danger Room,Xavier's School for Gifted Youngsters(Remains!):Storm and Jean Grey carry out a combative training sequence to establish the exact nature of Storm's abilities at this time......Closely watched in the Control Booth by Stevie Hunter,Banshee and Forge Storm demonstrates some control of her mutant powers but although her skill and intelligence remain intact,she does not yet possess full control of her powers......Stevie warns against continuing to strain her and calls a halt to the session just as Storm is failing.

As they finish the session and Storm is recovering,Cable bursts in,insisting that the New Mutants are due their turn in the Danger Room......Banshee says they have no session scheduled but Cable says they don't need 'Mickey Mouse' schedules......After a bit of a face-off over whose claim is greater on the facilities,Storm tells the others they need to respect Cable's position as NM leader,even if they don't agree with his methods.

Lila Cheney's Residence,Malibu,California:Freddy Stanachek calls to Lila's looking for Dazzler.......But Strong Guy says he doesn't know where she is and,very insistently,tells him to leave.....He advises him to stop trying to make her his 'trophy babe'......There is a sudden flash of light and Strong Guy is shocked to see Lila Cheney has materialised......Looking somewhat dazed,she mumbles something about terrible danger involving Professor Xavier and that she needs the X-MEN!!

Harry's Hideaway,Salem Centre:Storm and Jean catch up on old times......Jean explains that the events of Starcore and the Sentinels seem like yesterday as she can remember nothing from the shuttle crash to her re-awakening years later in the Baxter Building.......Storm tells Jean that she seems to be stuck in the body of a teenager---Her body has shown no sign of maturing since she reappeared.

Unknown to them they are being closely watched by a group of Genoshan Magistrates who decide that all of Xavier's students are fair game!

Storm and Jean walk back to the grounds of Xavier's......Jean says goodbye and leaves in her transport.......Wolfsbane suddenly approaches Storm and taunts her reunion with Jean......She's pissed at what happened to Doug Ramsey and blames herself and the X-men for not watching out for him......Storm tries to calm her down but Rahne storms off,telling Storm she hates her......Stevie Hunter,Warlock,Boom-Boom and Rictor are out swimming......Stevie tries to reassure Storm.

Suddenly,the Magistrates attack,using high-powered attack vehicles to try and take the NMs and Storm down......The NMs seem to be holding their own but Storm urgescthem to follow her and Stevie into the underground base......The NMs feel they have the situation under control---Until the main attack force suddenly teleports in courtesy of Pipeline......Storm dumps Stevie through the hatch and scrambles the lock,sealing it shut.......She tries to help the others but is shocked to see one of the Magistrates using a familiar energy signature......Havok is fighting alongside them!!

Below ground the rest of the NMs,Banshee,Forge and Cable are mobilising.......But they can't get out of the fused hatch and have to try another exit......The delay is vital and by the time they emerge Pipeline has already transported Storm,Wolfsbane,Rictor,Warlock and Boom-Boom away......The Magistrates have gone......Cable swears whoever did this is gonna wish they were never born!!

FIN

[limerick]

Next up----New Mutants # 95!!(In 'New Mutants From the Beginning' over the next few days)

P.S.--Sorry,AstonishingXman....I waited and waited so I decided to go ahead with this issue...Hope you don't mind!