Why is Coipel leaving Thor?

[cutchemist42]

I just read this in the Thor #3 thread and can't beleive it. One of the main reasons I bought issue one is becuse I was missing Coipel since Civil War and the Avengers Annual. Now I love the series/character and was thinking this was some of Coipel's best from what I've seen. WHY OH WHY!!!!

[Shellhead]

I just read this in the Thor #3 thread and can't beleive it. One of the main reasons I bought issue one is becuse I was missing Coipel since Civil War and the Avengers Annual. Now I love the series/character and was thinking this was some of Coipel's best from what I've seen. WHY OH WHY!!!!

Thor complained that Coipel was making him look fat.

[Kevinroc]

He's not leaving Thor. At least not at the moment. He won't draw an issue here and there to catch up on his deadlines.

[Bulky Brent]

Pulling him off this title at this time would be a big mistake his work is not like typical american art it has a unique Europoen likeness to it(Just look at his Stony Stark and his Spider-Woman). Which is probably why he was picked for this title in the first place. I think he should stay for the long run(If him leaving the title is true).

[Erik Lehnsherr]

Any title losing Coipel is blatant insanity.

[Dusty.]

He's not leaving Thor. At least not at the moment. He won't draw an issue here and there to catch up on his deadlines.

With the lead time this series had, that would be inexcusable.

[a-spidey]

With the lead time this series had, that would be inexcusable.

i agree. If he can't handle the deadlines. They should have get another one. After 3 issues looking for a fill in is embarrassing.

[Billy Parker]

With the lead time this series had, that would be inexcusable.

Yah I know. Let's not excuse him. Let's condemn him. BEAT HIM UP!!!

Nah jk the complaining bothers me after a while. Lame.

[Red Orion]

From what I understand after the current arc there will be a two-issue fill-in arc with a differnet artist but after that Coipel will be back.

[Elegance Liberty]

From what I understand after the current arc there will be a two-issue fill-in arc with a differnet artist but after that Coipel will be back.

... That's news to me.

What I don't get is them having to get a fill in artist even 6 issues in. It doesn't make much sense, but then again, we don't know what's going on. (Ever notice that Coipel rarely does interviews? It's probably a language barrier thing, but it just strikes me as odd)

[Dark Ben]

NOOO leave mon cher compatriote alone he's one of the few thing France has done good for US Comics.
He surely doesn't do that much interview even in France I read since his debut only 3 interviews I honestly that wasn't that intresting:(
Olivier Rules

[Elegance Liberty]

Well, I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what shows up in the January solicits in a couple weeks.

I hope Coipel stays on the book for a little longer though, I thoroughly enjoy his style. It's a nice blend of realism with stylization, something you don't really see enough of in Western mainstream comics often.

I suppose if they have to get a fill-in artist, I'd rather they go with Andrea DiVito or Ed McGuinness. They'd pretty much be good fill ins without a jarring transition (invoking 'Avengers: The Initiative' #6 against Stefano Caselli's artwork as an example), however brief it might be.

[van_line]

before an artist becomes a superstar or at least a huge fan favorite, they are able to maintain a monthly schedule but once they cross that threshold they aren't able to do 7 issues in a row.

How much lead time between the end of the civil war and the beginning of thor? 14 months?

[Red Orion]

before an artist becomes a superstar or at least a huge fan favorite, they are able to maintain a monthly schedule but once they cross that threshold they aren't able to do 7 issues in a row.

How much lead time between the end of the civil war and the beginning of thor? 14 months?

Four months. Civil War #7 came out in Feburary of this year.

[Camron Amaya]

Well, I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what shows up in the January solicits in a couple weeks.

I hope Coipel stays on the book for a little longer though, I thoroughly enjoy his style. It's a nice blend of realism with stylization, something you don't really see enough of in Western mainstream comics often.

I suppose if they have to get a fill-in artist, I'd rather they go with Andrea DiVito or Ed McGuinness. They'd pretty much be good fill ins without a jarring transition (invoking 'Avengers: The Initiative' #6 against Stefano Caselli's artwork as an example), however brief it might be.

So I guess I'm the only one that doesn't see what's so great about Ed McGuinness's art? Kind of lame and cartoony to me.

[Elegance Liberty]

So I guess I'm the only one that doesn't see what's so great about Ed McGuinness's art? Kind of lame and cartoony to me.

Eh, art's subjective. I myself like his art because it's cartoony, but again, just my personal taste. But I can see why someone wouldn't really like his stuff.

[StoneGold]

Eh, art's subjective. I myself like his art because it's cartoony, but again, just my personal taste. But I can see why someone wouldn't really like his stuff.

Basically. For his style of work, he's the tops. But if you don't like that style...



Actually, I'm wrong. Olivetti is better. But he's kind of cartoony/photorealistic. It's scary.

[Expletive Deleted]

before an artist becomes a superstar or at least a huge fan favorite, they are able to maintain a monthly schedule but once they cross that threshold they aren't able to do 7 issues in a rowCoipel was never all that fast to begin with.

As for the lead time . . . do we know how much he actually had on this project? Comics companies have been known to announce projects long before anyone has started working on anything.

[Dusty.]

Coipel was never all that fast to begin with.

As for the lead time . . . do we know how much he actually had on this project? Comics companies have been known to announce projects long before anyone has started working on anything.


Coipel wasn't working on any other comics, they long before knew the outcome of CW, so nobody was waiting on that, and they had over a year to take advantage of all that and get lots of issues ahead of schedule. Doing smart business like that would be especially rewarding to all of Thor's fans who have waited patiently through the broken promises and senseless cancellation. Not quite the payoff we deserve. Fill-in artists are what killed the last volume's sales. Good job, Marvel!

[Zero Hunter]

Even when Copiel first started in American comics with his Legion of Super Heroes run he was never able to do a continuos run. He has always only been good for 8 or 9 issues a year tops. The thing with him is that everyone knows this and makes sure they have fill in artists to give him the lead time he needs to keep ahead. The trick with Copiel is to get fill in artists that are a good fit with his own style. It worked on Legion for close to 3 years.

[Bulky Brent]

I heard he got a huge head start on the book which explains why issues 1,2 3 and the upcoming issue(#4) have came out so steadily what really did happen?

[CaptainCanada]

Doing smart business like that would be especially rewarding to all of Thor's fans who have waited patiently through the broken promises and senseless cancellation.
JMS has to script before Coipel can draw.

Thor was meant to be part of the AD reboot, but it kept getting pushed back because of the creators involved.

Fill-in artists are what killed the last volume's sales.
Every series has fill-in artists. Giving him two issues off will presumably allow the next major story arc to come out on time.

[Kyle_Ion]

So if Coipel is leaving who is going to replace him and another question is why is Coipel leaving?

[CaptainCanada]

He's not leaving, as I understand it; someone is filling in for #7-8, although we don't know who yet.

[Kyle_Ion]

ah okay, that is good. I like coipels art. Now that I think about it maybe Coipel is doing the art for the next story arc for thor? Now if he is doing the art for the next story arc I wonder what it will be about, maybe the next story arc is where Tony Stark and his lackeys finally attack Asgard and Thor and the other Asgardian gods are forced to defend themselves and after they win Thor removes Asgard from earth and put it back in its own dimension.

[CaptainCanada]

JMS didn't go to the trouble of setting up this "Asgard in Oklahoma" thing just to get rid of it a couple of issues later. I expect us to stay here for his run, at least.

[Kyle_Ion]

JMS didn't go to the trouble of setting up this "Asgard in Oklahoma" thing just to get rid of it a couple of issues later. I expect us to stay here for his run, at least.

I would like to see a major confrontation between the Asgardians and Tony Stark and shield, which would slowly build up thru the single issue stories which finally explodes into a confrontation in the next story arc.

[StoneGold]

I would like to see a major confrontation between the Asgardians and Tony Stark and shield, which would slowly build up thru the single issue stories which finally explodes into a confrontation in the next story arc.

You probably aren't going to get that. The whole point of #3 seemed to be "OK, we touched on the whole SHIELD thing, but now we're going to do our own thing."

[Kyle_Ion]

You probably aren't going to get that. The whole point of #3 seemed to be "OK, we touched on the whole SHIELD thing, but now we're going to do our own thing."

yeah I know it probably won't happen, but I can wish can't I? See in my mind Shield would attack Asgard and all of the Asgards would just demolish Shield and Tony Stark.

[Will.S]

He's not leaving, as I understand it; someone is filling in for #7-8, although we don't know who yet.
Exactly.

I believe we're still getting Coipel's art for a few more issues, then a fill in and then he's back. I'm really wondering who the fill-in will be and if the issue is going to be as good (or important) without Olivier's art.

[Kyle_Ion]

Exactly.

I believe we're still getting Coipel's art for a few more issues, then a fill in and then he's back. I'm really wondering who the fill-in will be and if the issue is going to be as good (or important) without Olivier's art.

I don't know who the fill in artist is or will be but I hope they're good.

[Harold of the Rocks]

I just read this in the Thor #3 thread and can't beleive it. One of the main reasons I bought issue one is becuse I was missing Coipel since Civil War and the Avengers Annual. Now I love the series/character and was thinking this was some of Coipel's best from what I've seen. WHY OH WHY!!!!

before an artist becomes a superstar or at least a huge fan favorite, they are able to maintain a monthly schedule but once they cross that threshold they aren't able to do 7 issues in a row.

How much lead time between the end of the civil war and the beginning of thor? 14 months?Maybe I'm forgetting something... but what does Civil War have to do with this at all? Steve McNiven pencilled Civil War. Was there a tie-in by Coipel or something?

[Will.S]

Maybe I'm forgetting something... but what does Civil War have to do with this at all? Steve McNiven pencilled Civil War. Was there a tie-in by Coipel or something?
We're all sorta using Civil War as a time measuring device.

When Clor appeared in that book we all knew that he wasn't the real deal but even that appearance had everyone anticipating his return. Then the official Thor book was announced not too long after CW was over and since the creative team was announced shortly after, we knew Coipel had a big chunk of lead time.

[Harold of the Rocks]

Okay, I understand. I still don't see that as entirely relevant, as the discussion was how much lead time Coipel had, and I would think that has everything to do with when editorial decisions to place talent on an upcoming Thor book and when JMS had completed scripts, and so forth. When 'the public' is exposed to Clor seems to have minimal impact on that in my eyes. Also, I interpreted cutchemist's comment that he missed Coipel's work since Civil War (which he did not work on) -- meaning Coipel's artwork was 'available' during Civil War; and van_line's talk of lead in time also implying that Coipel was 'working on ' Civil War and couldn't be doing Thor during that time... neither of which seems accurate to me. I just wanted to clarify those points as it seemed to be skewing the discussion based on what I see as a fallacy.

I have to say that a fair amount of my favorite artists are not exactly the quickest, but to me their work is usually worth the wait. I'd rather have the artwork done well in a style I love and a slow release pace rather than 'timely' and in a style that doesn't do it for me. If Coipel is a little slow, I could deal with it. I consider myself a 'low end' consumer, when I see a lot of you characters' pull lists... and I have plenty of books to entertain me and keep a good rotation going.

I was under the impression originally that Coipel was off after issue 6, but if this is wrong and we have it established as fact that he is remaining the regular artist after a 2 issue fill-in 'hiatus', that is excellent news (can anyone here verify this? I've seen several 'hearsay' style comments here, but nothing definitive). His style works really nicely with this book so far, and I would love to see the rest of the Asgardians and their 'rogues gallery' done by Coipel. Sif, Odin, Amora, Loki, Karnilla, Malekith, Pluto, Seth, Surtur, even Sedna... I would love to see what Coipel can do with these characters!

[The Shadow]

As long as the fill in artist is good...

[David Atkins]

So I guess I'm the only one that doesn't see what's so great about Ed McGuinness's art? Kind of lame and cartoony to me.

I dislike him too. Not because he's too cartoony, but because he's cartoony in an ugly sort of way.

I would hate for him to fill-in on this series, as it'd break my heart to have to own more of his work. :(

[van_line]

and van_line's talk of lead in time also implying that Coipel was 'working on ' Civil War and couldn't be doing Thor during that time... neither of which seems accurate to me. I just wanted to clarify those points as it seemed to be skewing the discussion based on what I see as a fallacy.


I think my issue was the whole idea that Coipel had a tremendous amount of lead time and he was only able to pencil a couple of issues.

I will be the first to admit that I don't remember the timeline (ie. release schedule) of Civil War, but he had to have had at least 6-7 months of lead time. If that is true, and he isn't working on anything else, I would hope that he would have a lot more in the can at this point.

also I think the other idea I was trying to express was that Coipel was able to maintain a monthly schedule during his run on LSH, but now that he is successful he can't.

[Zero Hunter]

also I think the other idea I was trying to express was that Coipel was able to maintain a monthly schedule during his run on LSH, but now that he is successful he can't.

But he could NOT do a monthly schedule when he was on Legion of Super Heroes. Not even from the start. He did the Legion of the Dammned story then did not do the Widening Rifts story. He started up Legion Lost but needed a fill at least 3 times to keep it a monthly book. He never had more than 6 issue straight in his run on the Legion book either. But the people at DC know this going in and had fill in guys from the start to keep the books going. So I will say it again Copiel has not EVER been able to do a monthly book without fill ins to keep the book on track.

[Christopher O]

I think my issue was the whole idea that Coipel had a tremendous amount of lead time and he was only able to pencil a couple of issues.

I will be the first to admit that I don't remember the timeline (ie. release schedule) of Civil War, but he had to have had at least 6-7 months of lead time. If that is true, and he isn't working on anything else, I would hope that he would have a lot more in the can at this point.
You don't actually know how much lead time he had because you don't know when he got the scripts or when Marvel expected him to start on them or anything like that. Yes, he's slow. We all know that. However, we dont know the circumstances of the situation, so why bother with these assumptions?

[Shonuff]

Eh, art's subjective. I myself like his art because it's cartoony, but again, just my personal taste. But I can see why someone wouldn't really like his stuff.

Which is why I will never understand those "___ is the worst artist ever" or "___ art makes my eyes bleed" comments. Art is very subjective, one mans trash is another mans gold.

As for the topic at hand I'd be sad to see Coipel leave if this is true. He's become one of my favorite artists. Untill the creative team was annouced I was hoping he'd be the new Artist on Astonishing X-Men. :(

[Shellhead]

Which is why I will never understand those "___ is the worst artist ever" or "___ art makes my eyes bleed" comments. Art is very subjective, one mans trash is another mans gold.


Actually, that isn't true. There really are standards for assessing artwork, and you can learn them by taking an art history class. People who insist that there are no standards tend to people with lousy taste in art, and they embarrass themselves whenever they talk with people who know better. You can still like your Liefeld or Turner artwork or whatever, but just understand that it's the equivalent of enjoying White Castle hamburgers.

[Camron Amaya]

Actually, that isn't true. There really are standards for assessing artwork, and you can learn them by taking an art history class. People who insist that there are no standards tend to people with lousy taste in art, and they embarrass themselves whenever they talk with people who know better. You can still like your Liefeld or Turner artwork or whatever, but just understand that it's the equivalent of enjoying White Castle hamburgers.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e399/RaulRigel/THORED12.jpg

[Will.S]

As long as the fill in artist is good...That's really all that matters to me at this point.

[Deep_Sleeper]

Coipel puts in a lot of details in his art. He's fantastic. If he wants to take a year to do a 3 issue story, I'll wait a year.

Although, I'd prefer if a story was completed by one artist prior to the first issue being released.

[Joe Franklin]

I wish Coipel would leave Thor, so I could buy a book drawn by him from Marvel.

Between JMS and Thor himself as a boring character, I can't bring myself to buy Thor, even though my current favorite Marvel artist Olivier Coipel is drawing it. I find both JMS's scripting and Thor that boring.:(

[Sean Walsh]

Yah I know. Let's not excuse him. Let's condemn him. BEAT HIM UP!!!

Nah jk the complaining bothers me after a while. Lame.

Imagine if you had a job and, 3 or 4 days in, you had to take a few days off.

I would think people would have every right to complain.

[Will.S]

Imagine if you had a job and, 3 or 4 days in, you had to take a few days off.

I would think people would have every right to complain.
Does anyone have an accurate timeline of at least when the announcements were made regarding Olivier Coipel's placement on Thor? I think I might need to check Immortal Thor.net then I'll try to make some sort of vague guesses.

For me if he did get a huge amount of lead time it does become weird to see a fill in this early into the game but perhaps Olivier is doing an opening arc, a fill in does like 2 issues that are probably good but are stand alone and then Olivier follows through with a longer 2nd arc. Really, all I hope for is that the fill in artist draws the book well even if it's not going to be consistent with Coipel's art.

[Elegance Liberty]

I seriously hope Warren Simons -the editor of this series- says SOMETHING about why the delays are happening.

Because now I'm just starting to get really torked. It's bad enough I've never really been fond of Thor himself as a character -as all know, I'm VERY much a Beta Ray Bill person-, but the delay between #3 and 4 is killing my interest hard.

[Will.S]

I seriously hope Warren Simons -the editor of this series- says SOMETHING about why the delays are happening.

Because now I'm just starting to get really torked. It's bad enough I've never really been fond of Thor himself as a character -as all know, I'm VERY much a Beta Ray Bill person-, but the delay between #3 and 4 is killing my interest hard.
When is #4 due out anyway?

[Elegance Liberty]

When is #4 due out anyway?

Last I checked? November 17th.

For all we know, it could have moved to the 21st or the 28th now.

[Will.S]

Last I checked? November 17th.

For all we know, it could have moved to the 21st or the 28th now.
Jeez, thats weird.

That's not too far ahead at this point but that's still extremely odd. I'm guessing that this delay is basically tailor made for the fill-in artist to do his or her issues so that the book can come out on time.