The all-purpose pen-and-paper RPG megathread

[Paladin]

I've only heard the initial buzz but they've pushed the timeline forward, the "new Matrix" overlays the real world so Deckers are now sort of technomages and the rules have been "streamlined". What is your take folks?


Me, I think it is shite that the Deckers have been boosted, I liked playing a Decker because they where inconspicuous, nobody but the Faceman or Covert Ops archetypes was better at blending in in SR3 and you ussually had enough points and nuyen left over from your essentials to make your matrix-monkey pretty cool in combat. Plus a good decker was damn scary because it did not matter where you went, a good decker would find your trail on the matrix and proceed to make life drek for you, too many old speeding tickets? suddenly the cops in your new 'hood are thinking you committed vehicular homicide, late on your taxes? suddenly some very nice people from the government are at your doorstep, null sheen...

[UncleBob]

I haven't played it in years... all I remember was Physical Adepts = OMGMAXIMUMPWNAGE!

[Paladin]

Only if you play them smart so you don't start getting hit with deadly damage alot, losing a power after the badass final battle with the massively pumped security forces sucks royally. I preffered running a combat decker because your team needed you, if you didn't watch their asses on the matrix chances are they died, and if stuff got too hairy off-line you just jumped back in your meat body and where almost as good as a street sammie.

[Perry Holley]

the "new Matrix" overlays the real world so Deckers are now sort of technomages and the rules have been "streamlined". What is your take folks?Without having read anything else regarding this, I suspect the change related to deckers is designed to avoid the problem of 'Bob the decker is trying to hack into the corp's security... everyone else gets to twiddle their thumbs for the next half hour while this gets played out'.

As for streamlinging the rules, anything that makes the SR rules more coherent... okay, makes them at all coherent, is fine by me.

[Shellhead]

Shadowrun = Cyberpunk for role-players who refuse to be weaned off of the Tolkien tit. And cheap bastards who won't buy more miniatures.

[Perry Holley]

And cheap bastards who won't buy more miniatures.Hey! I resemble that remark!

[GremlinClr]

I miss ShadowRun. Haven't played in about 3 years.

Without having read anything else regarding this, I suspect the change related to deckers is designed to avoid the problem of 'Bob the decker is trying to hack into the corp's security... everyone else gets to twiddle their thumbs for the next half hour while this gets played out'.

Yea, I gotta agree with that. When it was time for the decker to do their thing usually everybody got up for a piss break or made a sandwich. I enjoyed running one tho.

[Shellhead]

Yea, I gotta agree with that. When it was time for the decker to do their thing usually everybody got up for a piss break or made a sandwich. I enjoyed running one tho.

That was a real problem with Cyberpunk, too, though Cyberpunk 2020 found a lame rationalization for dragging the rest of the group along for the hack. Then they came up with an even better way, which involved a mechanism using cards from the Netrunner CCG to resolve the hacks. I've played that CCG and it was a good game, but I was done with the RPG by the time that the CCG came along. Maybe someday I will give Cyberpunk another try and attempt to use the cards.

[Chuckg]

*sigh* so, now deckers get reality-warping powers?

... you know, this may sound like heresy, but "The Matrix" appears to be reaching out from its grave to kill the entire cyberpunk RPG genre.

I much prefer Ex Machina's (Tri-Stat Cyberpunk) idea... which was, if netrunning was fuggin' up the game, get rid of netrunning and go back to Hacking skill rolls.

Voila.

... btw, have I said yet that I /really/ like Ex Machina? (Well, except for the 'Underworld' and 'Daedalus' setting chapters.)

[Perry Holley]

I much prefer Ex Machina's (Tri-Stat Cyberpunk) idea... which was, if netrunning was fuggin' up the game, get rid of netrunning and go back to Hacking skill rolls.The Spacetime RPG (I suspect I'm about the only person who actually played it) treated hacking in a similar way; one skill roll to see whether you succeeded or not, no extended 'dungeon crawl through the net' mechanics.

Actually, they did have 'extended netrunning rules' in one of the modules, but I always ignored those.

[Smokey]

i remember this game being on sega and me getting tired of it :\

[Perry Holley]

4th ed FAQ (http://www.gamingreport.com/article.php?sid=16500&mode=thread&order=0)

[Metal-Demon]

Based on the comic by Mark Smylie ... has anyone seen it or played it yet?

[Inkthinker]

A p&p RPG?

Smylie's series is one of the most intricately detailed and well-designed... it's a shame I don't see more of it, or that it doesn't recieve more attention.

[Metal-Demon]

Yes, a Pen & Paper RPG ... as far as I know it was supposed to be out last December, but I've not seen anything about it since.

(In fact I think is was even solicited in Previews last year ... )

[Shellhead]

I much prefer Ex Machina's (Tri-Stat Cyberpunk) idea... which was, if netrunning was fuggin' up the game, get rid of netrunning and go back to Hacking skill rolls.


That's probably the only practical way to handle it.

The hacking idea is fun enough to support a game on it's own. That Netrunner CCG was a little unbalanced but very fun. Steve Jackson Games published a multi-player boardgame (well, no board, just cards, but it worked like a boardgame) called Hacker, which actually got them some serious harassment from the Secret Service.

In the PC computer game Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines, there are many situations where you can try to hack the password on a computer. You can actually try two different methods... you can try to guess passwords, literally hacking in the old school sense, or you can hit ctrl-c and have the game compare your hacking ability with the difficulty level of the password. The guessing is not impossible, in some locations there are clues to what the password might be, which is not unrealistic. I have actually seen offices where the user taped the password on the wall, or pinned it to their bulletin board, or even taped it right on the keyboard. Sure, that's stupid, but not everybody who uses a computer these days is smart.

[Chuckg]

I don't see anything in that FAQ about deckers being 'technomages'.

[lonewolf23k]

*sigh* so, now deckers get reality-warping powers?

... you know, this may sound like heresy, but "The Matrix" appears to be reaching out from its grave to kill the entire cyberpunk RPG genre.

I much prefer Ex Machina's (Tri-Stat Cyberpunk) idea... which was, if netrunning was fuggin' up the game, get rid of netrunning and go back to Hacking skill rolls.

Voila.

... btw, have I said yet that I /really/ like Ex Machina? (Well, except for the 'Underworld' and 'Daedalus' setting chapters.)

Actually, from my understanding, it's more as if Deckers basically do what they always do, only with a wireless connection now. So the Decker basically comes along on the Run, to hack into the system as needed from inside the building, without having to sit down, plug in and pull off a matrix run while everyone is twiddling their thumbs.

In other words, the Matrix 2.0 sounds more like Virtuality in Talsorian's Cybergeneration game: a real-time computer network that permeates the real world, connecting electronics all over the place.

[lonewolf23k]

I don't see anything in that FAQ about deckers being 'technomages'.

*reads* ...Neither do I.

Q. Are deckers called hackers in SR4?
A. Yes. We’re eliminating the clunky old cyberdeck in SR4, and with no ‘deck, it doesn’t make much sense to call them deckers.

No more cyberdeck? ...Ok, now this has potential.

[Metaphysician]

Okay, ever heard of FATAL??

Its being put out in a print edition. A revised print edition.

Hastur!! Hastur!! Hastur!! Hastur!! Hastur. . . . . .

[Traveler the 1st]

...They found someone to print it?

[Daemon]

well if they're just printing it out that shouldn't neccessarilly make it a 2nd edition.

and if you have enough money you can get anything printed. :p

[Phrozen]

Normally, I don't endorse book burning but with this I will make an exception. Get your torches and pitchforks people.

[Tages]

Okay, ever heard of FATAL??

Its being put out in a print edition. A revised print edition.

Hastur!! Hastur!! Hastur!! Hastur!! Hastur. . . . . .
.................................................. ..........

The Death Spiral thread seems so...petty to me now...

[Scorpion13]

no.......no.....NNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!


*Leaps out a nearby window*

[Traveler the 1st]

(arms everyone with torches,pitchforks,swords,flamethrowers,morphers,F irst Age equipment made by the greatest smiths therein,and so on)

[Traveler the 1st]

no.......no.....NNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!


*Leaps out a nearby window*
(catches him and drags him back through the window)If the rest of us are marching to war against this thing,you're coming with us.Besides,it'll follow you through death probably.

[Scorpion13]

(catches him and drags him back through the window)If the rest of us are marching to war against this thing,you're coming with us.Besides,it'll follow you through death probably.


*sniff* Will....will there be action and adventure?

[Phrozen]

*sniff* Will....will there be action and adventure?

There will be lots of violence.

[Chuckg]

Thanks to this news, on top of everything else that's gone wrong recently, I now have a SAN score that's so low that *I* drive the *Mythos* crazy, not vice versa.

[Crinos]

*sniff* Will....will there be action and adventure?

People are going to be kicked in the balls. (At least if I have any say in it.) does that count?

But hey, I'll play devils advocate, maybe theyll fix what was wrong in the first edition with this new one.

(Which is to say that they'll burn it, wipe any evidence of its existance from the face of creation, then photocopy the 3 dnd core books and the BOVD and release it with the names crossed out and Fatal written over it.)

[Scorpion13]

When Cthulhu read FATAL, he moved to Newport Rhode Island and became a CPA.

[Crinos]

I bet the people who wrote "Identity Crisis" Play FATAL.

(For that Matter, I bet Dr. Light and Black Mask play FATAL in their downtime.)

[Scorpion13]

People are going to be kicked in the balls. (At least if I have any say in it.) does that count?

But hey, I'll play devils advocate, maybe theyll fix what was wrong in the first edition with this new one.

(Which is to say that they'll burn it, wipe any evidence of its existance from the face of creation, then photocopy the 3 dnd core books and the BOVD and release it with the names crossed out and Fatal written over it.)


Well, if theres too fisted action involved, Im in. I got all this Thermite just sitting here.

And you just know the nudnick who released the first ED hasnt learned a Goddamn thing. The rules are gonna be cleaned up, but I think the flavor text (Oh God, I just made myself gag. FATAL's flavor text? *vomits*) is gonna be worse.

And sweet Holy Mother, somebody wants to publish it!???

[Infinity Chameleon]

When Cthulhu read FATAL, he moved to Newport Rhode Island and became a CPA.

Comedy gold.

[Crinos]

Well, if theres too fisted action involved, Im in. I got all this Thermite just sitting here.

And you just know the nudnick who released the first ED hasnt learned a Goddamn thing. The rules are gonna be cleaned up, but I think the flavor text (Oh God, I just made myself gag. FATAL's flavor text? *vomits*) is gonna be worse.

And sweet Holy Mother, somebody wants to publish it!???

Why do I have a sudden premonition that the name of the publisher has the words "National socialist white peoples party" somewhere in it.?

[Scorpion13]

The Klan and most other orgs are Christian. They think most of what is on TV today is offensive, and not just from a racial standpoint. They would never publish FATAL.

So what Im saying is that Nazis and Klan members consider FATAL to be below them.

[BitVyper]

Okay, someone better tell me what this is. I usually like to know what I'm rallying against.

Oh, and if this (http://snerk.250free.com/nickytroll/story_01.htm) can get published, anything can.

[Phrozen]

Okay, someone better tell me what this is. I usually like to know what I'm rallying against.

Oh, and if this (http://snerk.250free.com/nickytroll/story_01.htm) can get published, anything can.

Think of every disturbing thing that humanity has ever done, roll in some dystopian alternate universes, and sprinkle liberally with extreme sexual perversion.

[Chuckg]

The original game review of FATAL:

http://atrocities.primaryerror.net/fatal.html

The rpg.net thread that mentions (offhand) that FATAL will see print, and contains (on page 4) a link to the updated PDF version of FATAL:

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?t=180687

[Crinos]

The Klan and most other orgs are Christian. They think most of what is on TV today is offensive, and not just from a racial standpoint. They would never publish FATAL.

So what Im saying is that Nazis and Klan members consider FATAL to be below them.

Hmmph, good point.

There's actually a form of life lower than racists. I'd consider this a important scientific discovery if I wasnt too busy weeping uncontrollably.

[JeffreyWKramer]

The world's worst idea....

FATAL LARP.

Now roll d100 SAN loss.

[Z-man]

Think of every disturbing thing that humanity has ever done, roll in some dystopian alternate universes, and sprinkle liberally with extreme sexual perversion.

Don't forget an unplayable game system

[Z-man]

Hmmph, good point.

There's actually a form of life lower than racists. I'd consider this a important scientific discovery if I wasnt too busy weeping uncontrollably.

Frankly, I've always thought that rapists were lower than racists.

[Scorpion13]

RPG.net had to remove the review for FATAL because even 8 months after it was originally posted, people where still fightng about it.

Thats right. People where actually defending this abomination.

[Scorpion13]

The world's worst idea....

FATAL LARP.

Now roll d100 SAN loss.

Yeah, its funny now, but youre gonna feel the same way Einstein did after they made the Atomic Bomb.

[Metaphysician]

Why do I have a sudden premonition that the name of the publisher has the words "National socialist white peoples party" somewhere in it.?

No, thats Racial Holy War. :(

[heretic]

Thanks to this news, on top of everything else that's gone wrong recently, I now have a SAN score that's so low that *I* drive the *Mythos* crazy, not vice versa.I am well aware that I shall suffer for asking... but what is the FATAL and why is it so bad?

HTG (wondering if you folks mean Dirty Pair: Fatal But Not Serious which I found amusing)

[Scorpion13]

No, no. Dirty Pair is decidedly clean compared to FATAL. Chuck posted a link to the site that explains it all.

[Radical]

Well, if theres too fisted action involved, Im in. I got all this Thermite just sitting here.\

And I'm ready to decapitate entire platoons with one sword-swing! (I swing really wide, so...just watch your distance, OK?)

[Yogi]

The worst part is, the RPG gets (http://www.gamewyrd.com/review/567) good (http://www.rpg-index.com/gamedetail.php?id=1418) reviews (http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_5754.html), as in three of thr first four googled searches are positive reviews.

[Peter]

Okay, ever heard of FATAL??

Its being put out in a print edition. A revised print edition.

You know, you take a vacation for a few days from the board, and this kind of thing happens. Honestly, people.

It is really quite staggering that somebody actually decided to publish it. That trees are being murdered to further this is a sin. That a publisher actually looked at this and thought, "hey, why not?" is a crime upon nature.

*sigh*

*reaches for Ultimate Nullifier*

Man, I'm gettin' some use out of this thing lately...

[Donald M.]

C'mon guys, how can you not love a game that has you roll the dice to determine areola hue?

Good lord, I don't know much about P&P RPGs, but I know complete and utter unmitigated crap when I see it.

[Metaphysician]

The worst part is, the RPG gets (http://www.gamewyrd.com/review/567) good (http://www.rpg-index.com/gamedetail.php?id=1418) reviews (http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_5754.html), as in three of thr first four googled searches are positive reviews.

. . .I hate humanity.

[Scorpion13]

What kind of ignorant ape would give that thing anything but a -7? I love how in that first review the reviewer said it was easy to ignore the sexual content. This man can also sleep whilst on fire too, apparently.

[Michael P]

they've got to be self-publishing. That's the only possible answer. Even PublishAmerica wouldn't print this.

[Gaz]

Odd thing is, it'll sell decently. The "car crash voyeur" effect, you know it's horrible and disturbing, but you have to look to see just HOW bad it is.

[Michael P]

OK, so because I'm stupid, I clicked on that .pdf link.

Damn thing’s 109 pages. The mind boggles. Let's have some fun, shall we?

I will give them credit: On the cover, there is a "Parental Advisory: Explicit Content" label. Right next to the naked woman with a chain around her neck. Also, the game apparently comes with a free CD-ROM. I do NOT want to know what is on this CD-ROM.

There's that phrase we all know and love: "The dice never lie."

Frontispiece: Naked woman bound by her arms, legs, and neck to an altar, but not too tightly, since she can still raise her left leg and tilt her head in what I assume is supposed to be a seductive pose. On the altar, we finally learn what FATAL stands for: "From Another Time, Another Land." Interactive fun: Come up with your own acronym using the same five letters.

The author is identified as Byron Hall. Finally, after all this time, a name has been put to the evil.

The Library of Congress page gives us an address as well. Reprinted here for your own amusement (In which I accept no legal culpability): 3100 MInnesota Ave., Suite 204W, Kansas City, KS, 66012. Please remember that all packages over one pound must be sent at Priority Mail rates.

FIRST TYPO! And it's in the credits, sadly. One of their artists, a Mr. "Steven MnMoorn."

"Garamond was accepted as the main font due to its historical accuracy." You can figure out for yourselves what that sentence means.

"FATAL paper burns exceptionally well." He's taunting us, dammit.

“email: fatalgames@excite.com” Aside from giving insight into how reputable a “publisher” FATAL Games is, this is another useful tool. Where’d I put that letter from Nigeria…

“Any similarity to actual people, organizations, places, or events is purely coincidental.” That disclaimer has never been more true.

And now we enter the meat of the game, and right away he tells a humongous whopper: “Welcome to a fantasy medieval role-playing game that focuses on realism and detailw henever possible without sacrificing fun.” There are numerous lies in this statement, as well as a rather slanderous assumption of what the average person considers “fun.”

“Fantasy and Historical Accuracy”

Pardon me while I laugh at this statement.

“Since the fantastic tenets above contradict historical accuracy, the relationship will be clarified. Since multiple gods exist in the game, Christianity has been extracted or minimized from historical references. Although the technology of the game represents 1335 AD, many elements of pagan cultures are included in this fantasy medieval game.”

It goes on, but the gist is, it’s historically accurate in that they read some history books, took out what they wanted, and left the rest. In other words, just like The Da Vinci Code! Also, if he really wanted to be historically accurate, he would have called it “1335 CE,” or at least put the AD in front of the year, as is proper among people who still use that date.

The explanation of role-playing games parrots the old line about maybe the knight wants to rescue the princess, or maybe he wants to rape or eat her. Or rather, “kill her, dismember her young cadaver, and feast on her warm innards.” It is at this point that the rational mind puts down the 900-page book in front of them and backs away. I, however, soldier on.

Necessary materials: He recommends having a copy of the book for each player, as “it will be used often.” No kidding. There’s also dice (no 100-sided ones, oddly enough), pencils, paper, etc. He also recommends a book called “Neveria” for those wishing to play priests & clerics; I googled this and was horrified to realize it is yet another FATAL publication, this one detailing the history and society of some fantasy world Hall has set up. That’s right: He made an FR-style expansion. Weep for humanity. “Calculators, while not required, are recommended.” Be afraid when your game tells you this. Be very afraid. He lists all this again at the end, with the books as “numerous copies of this book.” In your dreams, buddy.

Next he explains terminology and math. This consists of copping to using “they” in place of a gendered pronoun, which he doesn’t really need to apologize for or explain. He also defines d100 and d1000. That’s right, d1000. (You can just use 3 ten-sided die, with one digit for each position.) Math is an explanation of percentage multiplying, which any adult (remember, the game isn’t recommended for kids!) should be able to do anyway, and explaining that decimals will simply be deleted, so 53.96 = 53. Apparently, Byron feels rounding is too complex a concept for his players to grasp. Then again, given the estimated intelligence of anyone who actually wants to play FATAL, this may be a wise choice.

Roles: Here, Byron wanks over a history book. Instead of using something simple like “Game Master,” he pulls out an obscure Roman word for referee, “Aedile.” He then gives a pronunciation for the word. He does not pause to think about what the necessity of doing so says about the accessibility of his game.

Now we get to character creation. Stay calm and steady, friends. He mentions the character sheets available in Appendix 1; Appendix 1 is not included in the 109-page (yes, that’s right) pdf, so I can’t comment on it, but I believe the original rpg.net review said it was something like four pages.

“Each player must progress through this book, chapter by chapter, to create a character.” I record this because it will be important later.

“The fastest way to create a character is to use a computer program called the Fatal Character Generator, which is available free on-line.” Y’know, when Bioware created a program to speed through the D&D character creation process, they did so for fun, not because they had to.

Because I’m insane, I downloaded this generator, and directed it to randomly choose traits for me. It made me a male human (using the percentage tables found in Chapter 2, or so I’m told), then spat out some numbers I in no way comprehended as my sub-ability scores.

It was here that I made some sort of error. To which the generator responded, “Nice going, fuckhole! Try pressing the right button!” The insult doesn’t hurt, but the fact that this man considers himself a professional does.

After selecting not to reroll any of these abilites I don’t understand, the game tells me it’s going to determine my random mental illnesses. We have passed the point of anal attention to detail and wandered into the realm of psychosis. I am given the random phobia of “Cleptophobia” (sic), fear of stealing. I am told to refer to chapter 5 for an explanation. This implies that he explained every mental illness in chapter 5.

My random age: Young adult. Apparently, I could select to roleplay an infant, if I so desired.

Next, I am asked a question I never wanted to hear: “Would you like your character to have randomly generated sexual features?” For you, my readers, I clicked “Yes.”

Next I am shown my sub-ability scores again, this time with skill modifiers. My character is –10 on strength, -6 on bodily attractiveness, -21 on facial (yes, just facial; I dread to think what that means), -13 on Rhetorical, -6 on reaction speed but +3 on agility, -3 on language and math, -3 on intuition, -17 on reflection, and –25 on common sense. That last is apparent, since I’m using the FATAL Character Generator.

Overall ability scores and modifiers place me as a slightly strong, slightly ugly, averagely dextrous and intelligent, unwise person.

“Now to see your randomly generated bodily features.” I shudder at the thought.

My character is 5 feet tall, 102 pounds, male, 17 years old, 30 inches broad, has 9-inch feet, a 23-inch head, 21-inch long thick, curly brown hair, brown eyes, light skin, perfect natural vision, and is right-handed. His best feature is his waist (WTF), his worst his face. He has “big ears,” which for some reason means he is “perceived as being dumb.” Time to go adventuring!

And I finally get those randomly generated sexual features: My “manhood” is 5.35 inches long and 4.55 inches thick. Let’s stop and visualize that for a second.

Okay, you can stop screaming now. Other features are tongue length (1 inch), areola diameter (1 inch), areola hue (medium), nipple length (.25 inches), anal circumference (5 inches), sexuality (hetero), and debauchery score (only 6).

Random disposition, based on race: Ethically 47 (neutral), Morally 28 (neutral w/immoral tendencies), “Peity” (sic) 20 (has worshipped before, may worship again). This last is, if I recall, a new addition.

Too healthy for allergies; that’s good to know, if nonsensical.

Random temperament: Rolled a score for the four humour temperaments, came up with Melancholic Sanguine. I don’t care.

Randomly generated sociality: Born 2/24/5083 (so much for historical accuracy), legitimately (yay!), slave (boo), start with no money, illiterate, born in Hamlet, no brothers, four sisters, 4th out of my siblings, unhappily married (obviously, since I’m a fucking slave). I just rolled my damn backstory. Name: Stephen Barham.

And it’s over. The “fastest” method of creating a character took me about 20 minutes. Now, back to the PDF.

Hall’s math fetish is seen in this sentence: “For instance, when rolling a character’s sub-abilities, there are (199^22) combinations possible, before modifiers!” Um, yay.

Now we come upon the Mean System, the “realistic” method by which dice are rolled in FATAL. Make the obvious joke about the name yourself. Hall does: “A mean game needs a mean system.”

And the rest of page 7 is taken up by a disclaimer about the content. Violence and sex are included for “realism,” and so then must be rape, “the combination.” Here (and elsewhere) the “historical accuracy” is used as a shield, claiming that since rape happens so much in history and mythology, a “realistic” game must include it.

[Michael P]

The madness continues:

And now we come to the table of contents. (Apparently all that other stuff was superfluous.) Represented in all its glory:

Chapter 1: Race and Gender – 9
Chapter 2: Body – 40
Chapter 3: Abilities: 71
Chapter 4: Disposition - 104
Chapter 5: Mind – 127
Chapter 6: Sociality - 149
Chapter 7: Occupation – 205
Chapter 8: Skills – 320
Chapter 9: Equipment – 413
Chapter 10: Combat – 438
Chapter 11: Magic – 516
Chapter 12: Spells – 528
Chapter 13: Magical Items – 723
Chapter 14: Treasure – 782
Chapter 15: Conducting the Game – 791
Chapter 16: Advancement – 803
Chapter 17: Natural Substances – 807
Chapter 18: Warfare – 821
Appendix 1: Character Sheets – 838
Appendix 2: Spell Lists – 850
Appendix 3: Random Magical Effects – 865
Appendix 4: Phobias – 905
Appendix 5: Ingredients – 915
Appendix 6: Aedile Characters – 956
Appendix 7: Names – 965
Index – 982
References – 993
About Fatal Games – 995
Author – 996
Abettors – 996
Credits – 997

And remember, playing properly will require numerous copies!

Chapter one begins: “To begin creating a character, this chapter presents information on 2 of the 1st considerations: Race and gender.” “Race” and “gender” are footnoted. Yes, the book has footnotes. The footnotes tell us that the races have been selected from European mythology and folklore, and that gender is used in lieu of sex because “sex” might be mistaken with “sexual acts.” Well, in this game, that certainly is a consideration.

The Dung… I mean, Aedile gets to choose if races are determined by the players or randomly. Why? Because picking your race is so unrealistic! Random rolling is determined by a d100 and then consulting Table #1, the vanguard in a vast army. Using this realistic method, a player is most likely (50%) to be either a human or a kobold. Because, y’know, you can’t open a single European history book without reading about kobolds.

Pictured at the bottom are examples of all the races, naked. The human woman covers her crotch, and the ogre male is thankfully blocked from the chest down by the kobold, but everything else is showing.

The game recommends that beginners play all-human characters, and that even experienced parties avoid too much racial mixing, because it would “threaten group cohesion if role-played properly.” Yes, he’s telling players how to role-play their characters. And herein is the key fault of FATAL – it doesn’t let you do a damn thing yourself. All in the name of “realism,” of course.

Here come our first pictures, and they are despicable. In the midst of the four-page Anakim trait table comes a shot of an Anakim shoving a spear right through a guy, and another of an Anakim ripping the clothes from a struggling woman while a corpse with a knife through its heart occupies the foreground. All in the name of realism. This theme repeats itself throughout the chapter; the first clothed female (a human) shows up on page 26.

More fun: Elves get weaker and weaker the further they go from their home forest; he actually defines gruel in the kobold entry; dwarves turn to stone in the sun; common human last names include “Hall” and “Smith;” one subrace of ogres eats human children (“shoes are regurgitated 10% of the time, if applicable); racial hatreds are duly tabled and slurs catalogued.

Spersed throughout the book are little boxes of Latin words with translations beneath. These serve no purpose other than to make FATAL look scholarly. It doesn’t work.

And now we come to gender, which is also determined randomly if the GM… excuse me, Aedile chooses. And yes, there are tables that explain how gender affects ability scores. The math is drawn from… Aristotle, who apparently got everything right when he described me as stronger, more courageous, and less cunning, and women as more jealous, less hopeful, and more void of shame and self-respect. You can just feel the realism.

And then there’s a page about patriarchal culture, used as a cop-put to the sexism inherent in the system. A telling sentence is this: “It is unwise to deivate from cultural norms.”

And now we come to body. Much of this is covered in the rpg.net review, so I’ll include only some basic ridiculousness: You roll for age (and, if an elf, your lifespan). The modifiers and footnotes for extra weight and increased strength assume all gained or lost weight is muscle mass, not fat. Underweight women get Bodily Attractiveness bonuses. The modern upper class is thinner than the modern lower class because healthy food costs more. You have to roll a d1000000 to determine if your character is a freak of nature, and then roll a d100 to determine the deformity. The familiar 4d100/2-1 from the first version has apparently been changed to 10d100/5-1. He lists and details every damn disease he can think of. Under Tourette’s: “At the Aedile’s whim, an individual may be compelled to voice obscenities.”

We move on to abilities, and see that yes, the wacky roll has been changed. Wheee! That FCG comes up again, and again, we see that Hall never reflected on what the necessity of such a program says about his system.

After explaining each of the abilites, we come to the skill modifier tables. All 21 pages of them. It’s here that I learn, from the signature on one of the “illustrations,” that the artist’s name really is Steve MnMoorn. ‘Kay. (Said illustration, next to physical attractiveness, shows (surprise surprise) a naked woman with large breasts, small hips, and long legs.) There is a footnote to explain the term “Butterface,” insisting that the proper spelling is “but-her-face.” The “Reaction Speed” pic is funny, showing a man startled out of sleep grabbing his assailant’s wrist, causing a dagger to fall out of the assailant’s hand directly toward the man’s head.

Hall wanks over a textbook on the “Skill Modifiers for overall ability” with a long footnote detailing the equation he came up with for the table. Byron, we don’t care. The point of RPGs is not math.

The famous “Retard Strength” section is preserved, with a footnoted explanation: “Many retards have Down Syndrome, which is associated with a slower metabolism and a thicker build, which is likely to increase their strength.”

We end our short tour of FATAL at page 103, where Hall explains his optional ability re-roll system, which players can use if they’re not happy with the results. He admonishes against it, though, since it detracts from the realism. And you can only do it 4 times out of 20 sub-abilities.

The reference pages are included; anyone who wishes to see them can skip down to page 995. I’d be very interested as to how his sources measure up in the overall literature.

Perhaps most telling of all is the author photograph. What do you think?

Also, someone check Byron’s credentials.

After the long list of contributors (including a woman; did she know what she was helping with?), we get this final line, which sums it all up, “Most of all, I’d like to thank myself.”

The back jacket copy, all of which is completely true: “FATAL is a role-playing game like no other. The largest game-book ever printed, FATAL has over 150 occupations, 200 skills, and 500 spells. Fantasy gamers have never seen this degree of historical and mythological accuracy, nor detail and realism. Also included is a CDROM with a character generator program, the game in .pdf, and much more. This book contains everything you need to play FATAL. This game is explicit and for adults only. Be wary, play FATAL if you dare.”

Thoughts, gentlemen?

[Scorpion13]

Id like to respond, Michael, but Im terrified beyond the capacity for rational thought.


3 people, and possibly more gave this a good review.

[Michael P]

Reading those reviews, it's pretty easy to see why they liked the game: They're morons. They prefer to have every damn thing about the gaming world and their characters spelled out for them to using their imaginations. Which is the second, and ultimately more damning, flaw of FATAL: It takes all the fun out of creating and playing a character. "Do this. Your character has to be like this. Don't deviate in any way from my rules, even if they make the game less fun for you, because they detract from the realism."

It's a f***ing fantasy RPG, you twit. It's not supposed to be realistic.

[Chuckg]

My only thought is 'you read all 109 pages and you're still alive? and coherent enough to remember where the keyboard is?'

Dude, I gave up, gibbering, when I hit the illo of the naked dwarf. That was page 20-something, IIRC.

You are hardcore.

You're also quite probably dangerous and thoroughly mad, and I will now back away slowly and then turn to run away screaming. :)

[Michael P]

My only thought is 'you read all 109 pages and you're still alive? and coherent enough to remember where the keyboard is?'

Dude, I gave up, gibbering, when I hit the illo of the naked dwarf. That was page 20-something, IIRC.

You are hardcore.

You're also quite probably dangerous and thoroughly mad, and I will now back away slowly and then turn to run away screaming. :)
Honestly, by Chapter 2 I started skimming like a mofo.

[Metaphysician]

And the scary thing is, those 109 pages is the *preview*, not the actual work. There are full RPGs shorter than that.

[Chuckg]

Honestly, by Chapter 2 I started skimming like a mofo.

BTW, if you want help getting that... thing... off your hard drive, might I recommend a nice freeware 'secure overwrite' utility?

http://downloads-zdnet.com.com/Eraser/3000-2092_2-10231813.html

It's not quite as good as ritually burning your PC while chanting fell passages from the Necrowombicon (http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=1999-07-28&res=l), but it's less expensive. :)

[Celisasu]

The worst part is, the RPG gets (http://www.gamewyrd.com/review/567) good (http://www.rpg-index.com/gamedetail.php?id=1418) reviews (http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_5754.html), as in three of thr first four googled searches are positive reviews.


There is no God.

[AndyAnime]

This wouldn't be half as alarming if FATAL was actually some collossal joke, and the creators didn't actually take this game seriously.

Which they apparently do. :eek:

[JeffreyWKramer]

Michael, the fact that you read that crap even that closely is a testament to either your strength of will, or your insanity.

I can't get over some of the measurements. Why on earth should characters need to know foot length or head circumference?

Best reason I can come up with is to determine whether FATAL characters can put their own heads or feet up their asses.

And the idea of a game having a chart for areola size and hue...

[Dizzy D]

OK, so because I'm stupid, I clicked on that .pdf link.

Damn thing’s 109 pages. The mind boggles. Let's have some fun, shall we?

I will give them credit: On the cover, there is a "Parental Advisory: Explicit Content" label. Right next to the naked woman with a chain around her neck. Also, the game apparently comes with a free CD-ROM. I do NOT want to know what is on this CD-ROM.


I tried to read through your review, but my mind blanked out when you started on genital-size. (The word 'cube' comes to mind, a word I never connected to genitals before)

I'll just be in my corner singing Christmas songs and think of happy times.

[Traveler the 1st]

Once again,I think we should all suit up and go to war to destroy this thing before it can breed more.I'm not leading the charge though.I'm not crazy you guys.Well,okay,I am,crazy enough to yell obscenities at great Cthulhu,but i'm not crazy enough to go against this thing alone.I don't know.Maybe we should try and get Quantum 10 Divis Mal...?

[Crinos]

Once again,I think we should all suit up and go to war to destroy this thing before it can breed more.I'm not leading the charge though.I'm not crazy you guys.Well,okay,I am,crazy enough to yell obscenities at great Cthulhu,but i'm not crazy enough to go against this thing alone.I don't know.Maybe we should try and get Quantum 10 Divis Mal...?

I wouldnt worry about it breeding. FATAL and the people who play it are the reason Abortion clinics exist.

[Melchior]

I took a peak of those reviews. From what I can tell.....

Well, they throw out a vast amount of the book, and concentrate on play mechanics. The downside is that the thing seems to work best with a few programs doing your calculations for you (provided on the CD). The upside is that the numbers apparently make realistic sense, and it covers EVERYTHING. I would assume this means supplements are not needed. It also is apparently meant for experienced gamers who enjoy charts, and is not an entry-level-type game. Taken from that perspective, the positive scores almost make sense.

However....

*Gets in Jagd Mirage*

Time for too much firepower.

[Draconomicon]

Okey.... how can we bring about the end of the World again?
Cross the Streams?

Anyone have some proton packs lying around?

[Perry Holley]

http://www.herogames.com/5ERballistictest.wmv

This is not a small file - it runs about 6 minutes long, and takes almost a hour to download using dial-up.

Thjat said, this is something any HERO/Champions fan pretty much needs to see, or just any gamer interested in 'personal protection'...

[Crinos]

Frankly, I've always thought that rapists were lower than racists.

well rapists and FATAL players are more or less the same thing, so it balances out.

[Peter]

I tried to read through your review, but my mind blanked out when you started on genital-size. (The word 'cube' comes to mind, a word I never connected to genitals before)

I'll just be in my corner singing Christmas songs and think of happy times.

I know. I was just giggling up until that point. But when I hit that part of the review -- 5 inches long and 4 inches thick (!!!) -- I fell off my chair in hysterics.

Or maybe I'd finally succumbed to madness.

Whichever it was, Michael, I take my hat off to you.

[Jagatai_Khan]

Normally, I don't endorse book burning but with this I will make an exception. Get your torches and pitchforks people.

Yes. This heresy must be burned from existence, and all those involved subject to arco-flagellation, and Exterminatus declared on thier home towns.

It's the only way to be sure.

[Rabid Trekkie]

Dear lord this thing was published with good reviews? I think I just heard the Seventh Seal breaking. The end is nigh!

[Gaz]

I'd keepan eye on Michael for a while. He may have been possessed.
*shakes holy water towards Michael* The Power of Christ compels you!

[Donald M.]

And I finally get those randomly generated sexual features: My “manhood” is 5.35 inches long and 4.55 inches thick. Let’s stop and visualize that for a second.

The phrase, "Trying to stick a square peg in a round hole," comes to mind

[Crinos]

You actually read through this abortion of thought in order to warn us of the dangers of it. what Selflessness, what Altruism.

I think anybody who does what Micheal did should be eligible for Sainthood. Anyone who disagrees is a communist. :D

[Metaphysician]

Then what of Sartin and Maclerran, who read through the *entire* 900+ page text??

[Rabid Trekkie]

Then what of Sartin and Maclerran, who read through the *entire* 900+ page text??

Truly gods among men. I guess that makes Michael a demigod, like Hercules or something.

[Scorpion13]

I was just thinking about it, and I just gotta read that review those guys did on FATAL. Could somebody hook me up with a link for that?

[Metaphysician]

FATAL Review (http://atrocities.primaryerror.net/fatal.html)

[lonewolf23k]

Check out this latest bit of stupid news:NJ Man to Face Triple-Murder Charges in Montco (http://www.kyw1060.com/news_archives_detail.cfm?newsitemid=44981)

Quote the DA: "I mean, you have many, many stab wounds and those 'Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy games involve swords and knives and daggers and things of that nature. There may be a connection but I can’t say for sure.”


Gods, someone needs to mail that man a copy of "Dungeons and Dragons for Dummies", very, very badly.

[mgs]

un-freakin-believeable! :rolleyes: (rolleyes to the story, not you, lonewolf. ;) )

tho it would be interesting if the 'connection' was that they were all gamers in the same group.

[Draconomicon]

Check out this latest bit of stupid news:NJ Man to Face Triple-Murder Charges in Montco (http://www.kyw1060.com/news_archives_detail.cfm?newsitemid=44981)

Quote the DA: "I mean, you have many, many stab wounds and those 'Dungeons and Dragons' fantasy games involve swords and knives and daggers and things of that nature. There may be a connection but I can’t say for sure.”


Gods, someone needs to mail that man a copy of "Dungeons and Dragons for Dummies", very, very badly.

Is that guy dumb?
Seriously, did he get a kick to the head from a horse or something?
"There are daggers, swords and knives in DnD".

No shit sherlock, so are in ginzu commercials, knives you find in next to every TV show...

Honestly, is. that. guy. dumb?
How can someone like that get an job like that?
Inbreeding? His father/uncle is a big guy?

[saintjon]

Pff whatever, I saw on A and E once this dumb broad was trying to say FF7 was an influence onthese kids who were later cleared 100% by DNA evidence, since you "plan to beat enemies" or some bull****. Seriously, play the damn game for 10 minutes. it's a linear story line, at no point do you plan s*** in an ff game. Secondly, if anything ff7 would make an eco-terrorist out of you, not a murderer lol :D

and then you get the guys trotting out anime as a catch-all piece of kiddy porn evidence.

[Donald M.]

it's a linear story line, at no point do you plan s*** in an ff game.

Okay, that's the funniest thing I've read all day.

[saintjon]

I meant in the context of what your guys are actually going to do story-wise man. Okay tell me at what point in ff 6 could you decide to put off the emperor for a bit, maybe we should take out this kefka guy cuz he's more dangerous.

or ff7, Gee guys I'm pretty sure that since Sephiroth has had a one-up on us from the getgo maybe we should pursue other avenues here for a bit, I have a feeling we're being used.

[Perry Holley]

FAQ part 2 (http://www.shadowrunrpg.com/wordpress/?p=13)

part 3 (http://www.shadowrunrpg.com/wordpress/?p=19)

[Perry Holley]

FAQ part 4 (http://www.shadowrunrpg.com/wordpress/?p=23)

Honestly, the more I see of the changes, the more I like... but then, I was never that enamoured with the actual rules, playing the game in *spite* of the rule system, not because of it.

[Paladin]

I used to play a game produced by TSR at the start of their big campaign to make D20 games the end-all be-all, it was a far future game that I loved, unfortunately I never owned the books, my GM did. I can't remember the name of it so any search for the books is kind of useless, as is searching for files, anyone know the name of the sci fi game TSR made with the Mechalus race?

[Pendaran]

Alternity.

[Paladin]

Thanks, those games where damn fun, if a bit complex, I'm actually thinking of getting files containing the rules and reworking them a bit.

[Perry Holley]

A number of free downloads and resources for Alternity can be found here (http://alternityrpg.net/).

[MatthewC]

Okay, I'm trying to put together a one-shot to introduce my gaming group to the new World of Darkness rules system. Going to use only the core rulebook, so no Vampires or Werewolves or like that. (Or rather, I certainly could use those things, but it would purely be as monsters, not limiting myself by anything out of their game books.)

I've decided to go with a classic set-up. Four guys are out deer hunting in the woods, and spooky stuff starts to happen. The goal is to have all this play out in two or three hours of real time, so I don't want to make it too complex. Beyond that, I'm not sure exactly what to have happen.

So any ideas for a fun, short, spooky hunting horror scenario?

[Shellhead]

For it to be horrifying, the threat will need to be bullet-proof or otherwise not easily brought down by a hail of gunfire. Otherwise, you will find yourself running an action adventure, not a horror adventure.

Look for ways to slowly build up the horror while giving little hints that might help them survive later. Weird tracks would be very appropriate for your hunters to find. Maybe odd animal behavior... like a bear that is apparently on a rampage but is actually fleeing the true threat. Have them encounter another group of hunters who pass on some disturbing rumors that they heard in the nearest town, or maybe some sort of ranger types. Or a dead animal that's been killed in a strange manner. An abandoned cabin that contains a disturbing diary.

[Dizzy D]

Speaking from CoC experience:
Weird tracks always work well (especially if you make them misleading; lots of tracks that seem to indicate many small animals being one big monster with many legs or vice versa. Let them look at the ground when the thing uses tunnels, flies or moves through the top of trees.)

Bulet-proofness can be done in several ways: either too big, too tough, too small, too fast, regenerates or too many. All of them can be used to great effect. Keep in mind, the unseen thread is the greatest: let your player's imagination do the work for you. Allow the players small victories in fighting the thing off, then turn the tables on them: bringing down the big beast, brings out its pack of children, its mate or the man controlling the thing.

If you find an animal slaughtered make it something that shouldn't be killed easily: a bear, a cougar, many many small animals or the worst: an armed hunter.

Further thoughts later.

[Shellhead]

Another example of a cool clue... unfortunately based on a real world slaughter:

Some hunters in western Wisconsin got in a confrontation with another hunter who was trespassing on their land and using their treehouse-type platform without permission. They rode over on four-wheelers to confront him, bringing their rifles. Apparently Wisconsin hunters are required to prominently display their hunting license number on their vests, and during the confrontation, one of the hunters wrote the trespasser's license number into the dust on his four-wheeler. After the trespasser (a hmong vet from the war in Vietnam) shot and killed most of them, the police eventually captured him and matched up that license number.

[MatthewC]

I guess I've got several goals here.

1. I want to make things creepy, but I want to start it off at a low enough level that they just don't turn around, get in their SUV, and pull out their cell phones to call the cops. Possibly near the climax their phones might stop working and their vehicle should be sabotaged, but I think the longer we go without such measures, the better. If that kind of thing happens near the beginning of the game, then it becomes an exercise in them trying to leave. Save it until things go to hell all of a sudden, I'm thinking.

2. I actually don't mind them having at least one gun battle they can win. maybe a possessed animal that seems to be attacking recklessly.

3. Similarly, I'd like them to have at least one fist fight, so they can see the other side of the combat system. I'm thinking the best way to do this might just be to have a human being attacking them who is not using a deadly weapon, so they'll feel somewhat hesitant to, you know, shoot him.

4. Really, the most important thing is to have a lot of different kind of rolls required, to give them a feel for the system. There doesn't actually have to be a big monster lurking in the woods. Maybe a malevolent ghost, though....

[Perry Holley]

maybe a possessed animal that seems to be attacking recklessly.Possession is always fun. Maybe a malevolent spirit that possesses one of the PCs when they're asleep? Part of the horror could be to wake up and realize you have blood on your hands... it could get especially tricky if the spirit can jump back and forth between host bodies. Obviously, part of the trick here, once they realize what's going on, is to figure out how to capture/destroy the spirit.

[BlairH]

1. A crazy hunter that attacks the party. Is he insane? posessed? or has he merely confused you with the REAL THREAT?
2. A 3PM hunt turns into a midnight stalk in the space of 30 mins (time anomalies)
3. Hallucinations (a deer is shot, but when the party advances the corpse is nowhere to be found)
4. Electronic communication doesn't work. No cellular phones, no pager, no radio, no GPS, nothing.

[MatthewC]

1. A crazy hunter that attacks the party. Is he insane? posessed? or has he merely confused you with the REAL THREAT?
2. A 3PM hunt turns into a midnight stalk in the space of 30 mins (time anomalies)
3. Hallucinations (a deer is shot, but when the party advances the corpse is nowhere to be found)
4. Electronic communication doesn't work. No cellular phones, no pager, no radio, no GPS, nothing.

Ooooh, I like the time anomalies and the hallucinations. Good stuff. I definitely want to have a crazed someone attack them, but I'm not sure how to play it.

[Sanagi]

Zombie squirrels!

[Perry Holley]

Zombie squirrels!Well, sure, you can always go for the classics...

[Royal]

Skinwalkers.

Is your forrest near a lake? You can try Will O'Wisps if it is.

[Perry Holley]

Skinwalkers.Ooh, good choice.

[MatthewC]

Hey guys, we played out the hunting horror scenario Sunday, and I wanted to let you know how it went. I made up most of it as I went along, taking your suggestions into account.

The players made three PCs who were going on a deer hunting trip. As they were driving in Friday afternoon, a red truck passed them going in the other direction at insane speeds.

When they got to the gate to the state park, the park ranger signed them in. One of the PCs noted the park ranger seemed zoned out, like he was on drugs.

When they walked out to the camp-site, they were surprised to find that what should have taken them about 45 minutes had actually taken them two hours... though it didn't seem that long. (I never went anywhere with this, but I thought it added to the creepiness.)

At the campsite, the PCs found a backpack that had apparently been left behind by some bird watcher. They also found a deer carcass, butchered and hung up from a tree a few hundred feet away. It had apparently been left to rot.

That evening, a storm started brewing, putting an early end to their beer drinking around the campfire. While they were in their tent, a bear wandered into their camp. Then it was apparently attacked by a dog, which was very agressive, then suddenly turned very timid and fled. The bear walked off through their camp, pausing near their tent before leaving. (It was somewhat creepier, because they could see barely anything in the dark. Just heard some noises and had to interpret.)

The next day they walked out to find half of the deer carcass had been torn off. An old hunter with a dog popped out to tell them that he had set up the carcass as bait for a rabid dog of his (other than the one with him) he was trying to shoot. The PCs managed to make friends with him after some good social rolls, and he came back to the camp to drink some beers with them. While there, they asked him about the backpack, and he admitted that he remembered an elderly couple that tended to show up every year as birdwatchers, and that the backpack might have belonged to one of them.

The hunter decided to walk with the PCs for a while on their hunting trip, when they heard the sounds of a four wheeler driven along one of the trails that the park ranger used to get around. They follow it to find the ranger looking at an old woman who had apparently hung herself from a tree. It's one of the bird watchers, and she's been dead for a while.

The ranger is incredibly shaken. The PCs awesomely succeed in a roll to calm him down, and he babbles out an insane-sounding story. Acording to him, the local animals had been acting strangely for a while, coming out of the woods and 'looking at him'. Finally, the 'rabid dog' the hunter had been after had tried to attack him. He locked himself up in his ranger station to keep it out, but something 'inside the dog' had been trying to 'get inside his head'. he started dosing himself with drugs because that seemed to keep it from getting into him. That day, the male of the bird watchers (who drove a red truck, natch) had called him crying and told him about leaving his wife out in the woods, after some thing had seemed after them. Naturally, even the players are wondering if this guy is insane. It all sounds psychotic.

Then they hear a growl behind them. The bear lumbers out of the woods and attacks them. They have to make opposed rolls against a supernatural fear effect, which thanks to my sucky roll they easily do. I pause at this point to look up bear stats, only to realize that they aren't listed, so I make something up on the spot. (Curse you, WW!) The bear attacks the park ranger first, allowing them to get some rifle shots off before it attacks them.

One of the PCs get a bit mauled, but they kill the bear easily enough with rifle shots, especially once I remind them they can use willpower on their combat rolls. Then the old hunter screams that it's inside his head and starts to point his rifle at them, struggling all the way.

We're a bit pressed for time at this point, so after they tackle the hunter and take away his rifle, I have the dog that accompanied the hunter suddenly howl. The dog gives them a look they can only interpret as a grin, then lopes off into the woods. End session.

Overall. They seemed to enjoy it, and it gave a pretty good exposure to the system and the mood of thew WoD. Possibly not as many player choices to make as I would have liked, but we were a bit presed for game time at the end. I think it worked out okay. Thanks for all your suggestions.

PS. One of the players told me that he really liked that they never _saw_ any kind of monster. It was all strangely-acting animals and people and something horrifying that seemed to be controlling them.

[Melchior]

Reminds me a bit of a Dean Koontz novel I read once, except you skipped the reveal and monster defeat at the end. Sounds great.

*Evil Thought*
Have the dog cameo in one of your later sessions.

[lade]

what are the powers and abilities of Mystic OCC and Guardian OCC?

[Perry Holley]

When I get home from work this afternoon, I'll dig out my books.

Was there any specific info you were looking for in particular?

[lade]

the powers they have basicly and how they fare against nightlords and a few sword bearer artifacts and info on darkblades and maybe one Npc on a nightlord ,I've read about them on the net but don't know what they can do.

[Perry Holley]

the powers they have basicly and how they fare against nightlords and a few sword bearer artifacts and info on darkblades and maybe one Npc on a nightlord ,I've read about them on the net but don't know what they can do.Well, that's a helluva lot of typing you're asking for, so let's see if I can run over the basics first:

Mystic

Psychic Powers - Considered as a major psychic (ISP 1d4x10 + character's ME, gains 1d6+1 ISP per additional level), starts off with clairvoyance, exorcism sense evil and sixth sense, as well as 3 additional abilites form the Psychic Sensitive category, and 2 fromt he Healer category. Gains an additional power from either of those categories at levels 3, 5, 7, & 10.

Spells Gained intuitively, stats off with 6 spells, either 1st or 2nd level. And 2nd level, gains 3 spells of levels 1-3. 3rd level, gains 3 spells, levels 1-4. at 4th level and higher, gains 2 new spells up to corresponding character level (all gained intuitively).

PPE - 1d4x10 + PE, gains 1d6+1 PPE per additional level.

Bonuses - +1 save vs psychic attacks, +3 vs horror factor, +1 to save vs magic at 3rd, 6th, 9th, and 12th level, and +1 to spell strength at 4th, 8th, and 12th level.

More to come later... have to get offline for the moment.

[lade]

thanks it's appreciated, this would help my campiagn greatly , I need stats on the guardians and darkblades so that i can incorporate it into my campiagn.

[lade]

Amber,rifts, dnd, aberrant, exalted, WOD among others which system allows for the most powerful weapons and abilites?

[Perry Holley]

Well, in Star wars they have the Death Star... :)

[Scorpion13]

I thought Silver Age Sentinels was pretty powerful. Rank 10 Dynamic Powers anything and youre smacking teams around.

[Jagatai_Khan]

That new hardcover RPG that's out... the non-d20, non-WhiteWolf one. (!)

It's white, with a picture of a Dragon-ish thing on the cover, and "Fireborn" in big stylized letters. It's all about magic and dragons awakening in the modern world... and it's set in modern day London after all the mythic stuff comes back.

Anybody played it? Is it any good? I'm impressed just because it's not one of the big-two RPG companies, and it doesn't use the system for either company either. However, novelty does not quality make.

Anybody got any observations about this game?

[Perry Holley]

Haven't seen it (I've had to cut back significantly on my RPG purchases recently). Do you own a copy, and if so, what unique and interesting features does it have?

[Jagatai_Khan]

No, I dont own it. That's 30 bucks more than I've got right now.

I scanned through it in the store, and it looked pretty cool. You make two characters, one modern and one ancient dragon, and you roleplay both modern sequences and also "flashback" sequences about the ancient past, which actually have an effect on your modern self and can give you bonuses or penalties as you "remember" more about yourself.

[Perry Holley]

FAQ part 5 (magic) (http://www.shadowrunrpg.com/wordpress/?p=27)

[Perry Holley]

SAO PAULO, Brazil (AP) - A 21-year-old man and his parents were killed after the man agreed to be murdered along with his family if he lost a murder-mystery role-playing game, local media reported Saturday.

Three People Killed Over Role-Playing Game in Southeastern Brazil (http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGBM8X1CQ8E.html)

[Ender]

That is one of the most disturbing things I've ever read.

[Jagatai_Khan]

Yes, disturbing. However, this isn't the first time something like this has happened. THese people were disturbed. That doesn't mean everybody that roleplays is disturbed.

Anymore than the Heaven's Gate suicides or the Branch Davidians mean that all religious people are disturbed. Or anymore than English Soccer Hooligans meaning that all sports fans are violent drunken brawlers.

[Sheldon]

Yes, disturbing. However, this isn't the first time something like this has happened. THese people were disturbed. That doesn't mean everybody that roleplays is disturbed.

Anymore than the Heaven's Gate suicides or the Branch Davidians mean that all religious people are disturbed. Or anymore than English Soccer Hooligans meaning that all sports fans are violent drunken brawlers.

I don't believe you man....this story is conclusive evidence that RPGers are all gonna go kill each other.....

I hope no one reading this thread would actually make that conclusion.

[Paladin]

Find out what Cammie Clan you are! http://www.space.net.au/~dpwyrm/interactive/camarilla/camarilla.html


Me: You are a...


Brujah 68 %
Your violent and anti-establishment nature marks you out as a Brujah. This clan is often seen as nothing more than a psychotic rabble by other Kindred, but underneath their short tempers and rebelious actions often lie strongly held beliefs and ideology. Just don't get them mad.

[Draconomicon]

You are sort of a...


Tremere 46 %
Your scholarly and inquisitive (yet sneaky and treacherous) nature marks you out as a Tremere. This clan was originally a group of human sorcerers who wrested the secrets of 'immortal life' from unwilling Kindred. Their magical powers make them both powerful allies and deadly foes, and many Kindred would like to see them eliminated completely.

-----

Excellent. Everything goes according my plans :) http://www.cosgan.de/images/kao/boese/k025.gif

[LordKaos]

You are sort of a...


Nosferatu 39 %
Your dark outlook and dislike of society marks you out as a Nosferatu. Hideously deformed by the Embrace these Kindred hide in sewers and catacombs, away from humans and other vampires alike. They are eavesdropers and sneaks extraordinaire, and always know exactly what is going on.

[Dizzy D]

You are sort of a...


Tremere 46 %
Your scholarly and inquisitive (yet sneaky and treacherous) nature marks you out as a Tremere. This clan was originally a group of human sorcerers who wrested the secrets of 'immortal life' from unwilling Kindred. Their magical powers make them both powerful allies and deadly foes, and many Kindred would like to see them eliminated completely.

-----

Excellent. Everything goes according my plans :) http://www.cosgan.de/images/kao/boese/k025.gif

Tremere 50%

ha!

[Draconomicon]

Tremere 50%

ha!
Bah!
Only because I considered Loyality greater than knowledge!
I like to NOT have my servants try to take me out :p

[The Dog]

You are sort of a...

Brujah - 46%

Your violent and anti-establishment nature marks you out as a Brujah. This clan is often seen as nothing more than a psychotic rabble by other Kindred, but underneath their short tempers and rebelious actions often lie strongly held beliefs and ideology. Just don't get them mad.

[LordKaos]

Tremere 50%

ha!

I want to be a Tremere

[Paladin]

Lets go wreck some stuff up dog!

[The Dog]

Lets go wreck some stuff up dog!

I'm to anti-establishment, and with there being two of us, that sounds like we're establishing something.

Besides, if we went and wrecked stuff, there'd be two of us, and I'm a violent loner.

[Spider69]

You are sort of a...


Toreador 39 %
Your love of society and the finer things in life mark you out as a Toreador. This clan sees existance as something to be savoured, and live their unlives with flair, elegance and passion. Lovers of art and beauty they are at the center of whatever social scene they choose to grace.



Cool, i guess.......

[Spider69]

I'm to anti-establishment, and with there being two of us, that sounds like we're establishing something.

Besides, if we went and wrecked stuff, there'd be two of us, and I'm a violent loner.
Yeah right!, when you first started your story on SO, you made up lisa, now you got me, her, scott, and your succubs girlfreind, lillith.

[Paladin]

I'm to anti-establishment, and with there being two of us, that sounds like we're establishing something.

Besides, if we went and wrecked stuff, there'd be two of us, and I'm a violent loner.

See, it isn't an establishment if we don't have rules and a hierarchy, now let's go kick some nun-puppy hybrids or something, all the toreadors and tremeres here are making me antsy!

[Spider69]

See, it isn't an establishment if we don't have rules and a hierarchy, now let's go kick some nun-puppy hybrids or something, all the toreadors and tremeres here are making me antsy!
Hey, hey, hey, hey , hey, hey...i'am a toreador!

[The Dog]

Yeah right!, when you first started your story on SO, you made up lisa, now you got me, her, scott, and your succubs girlfreind, lillith.

But that's on SO. This isn't SO. BIIIIIG difference. Here I'm violent loner vampire, not overly-friendly, overly-heroic SO Knight.

[The Dog]

See, it isn't an establishment if we don't have rules and a hierarchy, now let's go kick some nun-puppy hybrids or something, all the toreadors and tremeres here are making me antsy!

Why didn't you say kick Nun-Puppy hybrids?

*Begins randomly kicking nun-puppies and small overly cute orphans*

[Draconomicon]

See, it isn't an establishment if we don't have rules and a hierarchy, now let's go kick some nun-puppy hybrids or something, all the toreadors and tremeres here are making me antsy!
Why that?
Don't like the family secrets of yours we recently found in an old library? *shows toothy grin*

[Radical]

You are sort of a...

* Gangrel * 32 *%
Your loner tendancies, and preference for the natural world mark you out as Grangrel. These nomadic shapeshifters avoid the cities and prowl the wilderness, how they avoid the wrath of the Lupines remains unknown.

[Spider69]

Why didn't you say kick Nun-Puppy hybrids?

*Begins randomly kicking nun-puppies and small overly cute orphans*
uh, that's so mean.......i like iiiiiiiiit :D :p .

[GozertheGozarian]

You are sort of a...


Gangrel 32 %
Your loner tendancies, and preference for the natural world mark you out as Grangrel. These nomadic shapeshifters avoid the cities and prowl the wilderness, how they avoid the wrath of the Lupines remains unknown.

Dammit, I hate dogs.

[heretic]

Find out what Cammie Clan you are! http://www.space.net.au/~dpwyrm/interactive/camarilla/camarilla.html

Your scholarly and inquisitive (yet sneaky and treacherous) nature marks you out as a Tremere. This clan was originally a group of human sorcerers who wrested the secrets of 'immortal life' from unwilling Kindred. Their magical powers make them both powerful allies and deadly foes, and many Kindred would like to see them eliminated completely.

Scholarly type. that about fits.

HTG

[saintjon]

I got tremere also, although a lot of them really had no answers that suited me. Maybe I'm a Sabat :evilsmile

[Perry Holley]

You are sort of a...

Gangrel 36 %

Your loner tendancies, and preference for the natural world mark you out as Grangrel. These nomadic shapeshifters avoid the cities and prowl the wilderness, how they avoid the wrath of the Lupines remains unknown.

[mdf2]

For all the gamers out there...

Of all the 1st edition AD&D modules you may have owned, played, or perhaps even read through, what or who is the nastiest final encounter you've ever seen? A final villain or situation created by the villain that made you sweat bullets?

I have a few suggestions, in no particular order:

The final two encounters of the Judges Guild adventure, 'Dark Tower'. This dungeon's old-school and hardcore. Huge, a lot of nasty, EVIL traps...and, after you've fought your way through it...

First, you fight a Greater Son Of Set -- this frickin' BEAST has 100 HP, an AC of -2, 60% magic resistance, needs +2 or better weapons to be hit, and regenerates 3 HP per round. A monster in all senses of the word.

He does HUGE damage: 3-36 constriction damage, two claws for 4-24, two bites for 3-24, and has 9th level (clerical) spell use.

(And for how it looks? Picture a giant man's torso with the body of a snake from the waist down, four arms, and two dragon heads with insect eyes).

This is the appetizer. Assuming you managed to kill his demonic ass, you then have to face his master -- a 21st level cleric lich, with all the fun stuff that comes with being a self-made undead monster.

THEN -- you have to run because in true, old-school fashion, the dungeon starts coming down on your head!

2) Count Strahd from the original Ravenloft -- the module that spawned a setting. Not only was the villain cool, tricky, and tough to beat, but the module had atmosphere in spades, and possibly one of the coolest damn maps ever made.

3) And last, but certainly not least, the demi-lich Acererak from Tomb of Horrors -- as I understand, the first official module ever published.

The grandaddy, and one of the toughest encounters of all time.

As far as situations that freaked you out go, the most memorable one for me was In The Dungeons Of The Slave Lords, the conclusion of the classic Slave Lords series, where you wake up in captivity.

You found out very quickly, that stripped of things like oh, armour and weapons, encounters you used to laugh at because of your level and stats ceased being amusing -- VERY quickly.

The picture of the violet fungus in that book STILL creeps me out to this day.

[Donald Stone]

I've can say I've played the original Tomb of Horrors once*, but can't say I survived it.



*a GM we had ran it to show us youngings what D&D used to be like.

[mdf2]

Very few can survive S1. (And no, I'm not one of them either.)

From the article in Dungeon Magazine 118, with their picks for the 30 Greatest D&D Adventures of All Time, Tomb of Horrors came in at #3 -- just behind Ravenloft, funnily enough.

Bill Slavicsek, one of the panel, had this to say: 'One player killed his character at the altar trap, then tried again with his next character (same result) and his next character (same result) before the rest of the party convinced him to stop touching the altar.'

And the last two comments sum it up quite well:

'The module was not constructed to be conquered, but merely survived.'
'Anyone who claims they made it through without losing a single PC from the party is a liar, a cheater, or both.'

For your sake, I hope you weren't attached to your character.

You could never run that module with newbies and people who'd played it before -- the temptation to try to warn people would be almost too great.

But you could still have fun with it.

I can see the newbies looking at the old hand, and wondering 'Why is the cleric administering last rites?'

[fuaak]

I like the way they used to list detailed stats and drops for every single civilian, peasant and fisherman in those old modules, like it was a given that the players would go out of their way to slaughter them all.

As far as bad mofos go, my vote goes to the thing you fight at the end of The Rod of Seven Parts.

[Shem the Penman]

The S series of modules was fairly murderous, IIRC, although of course none of 'em ever stacked up to the sheer arbitrary lethality of Tomb of Horrors. Demi-liches may be the single most unfair antagonist ever created for AD&D.

And although he never appeared in a module that I know of, he deserves a mention on the list of 1st Edition badasses: the tarrasque.

[Perry Holley]

mdf2, you pretty much read my mind when you listed Dark Tower and Ravenloft. Those are both truly excellent adventures (although I generally preferred the lower to mid-level adventures, such as the outstanding 'Saltmarsh' trilogy).

OTOH, I despise Tomb Of Horrors with an intensity that beggars description. Even back in the day, I thought it was Gygax at his worst ("Ooh, look at all the different ways I can kill off your characters, aren't I so clever?" Gah!), and time hasn't improved it any for me.

[Shellhead]

For all the gamers out there...

Of all the 1st edition AD&D modules you may have owned, played, or perhaps even read through, what or who is the nastiest final encounter you've ever seen? A final villain or situation created by the villain that made you sweat bullets?

I have a few suggestions, in no particular order:

The final two encounters of the Judges Guild adventure, 'Dark Tower'. This dungeon's old-school and hardcore. Huge, a lot of nasty, EVIL traps...and, after you've fought your way through it...

First, you fight a Greater Son Of Set -- this frickin' BEAST has 100 HP, an AC of -2, 60% magic resistance, needs +2 or better weapons to be hit, and regenerates 3 HP per round. A monster in all senses of the word.

He does HUGE damage: 3-36 constriction damage, two claws for 4-24, two bites for 3-24, and has 9th level (clerical) spell use.

(And for how it looks? Picture a giant man's torso with the body of a snake from the waist down, four arms, and two dragon heads with insect eyes).

This is the appetizer. Assuming you managed to kill his demonic ass, you then have to face his master -- a 21st level cleric lich, with all the fun stuff that comes with being a self-made undead monster.

THEN -- you have to run because in true, old-school fashion, the dungeon starts coming down on your head!

2) Count Strahd from the original Ravenloft -- the module that spawned a setting. Not only was the villain cool, tricky, and tough to beat, but the module had atmosphere in spades, and possibly one of the coolest damn maps ever made.

3) And last, but certainly not least, the demi-lich Acererak from Tomb of Horrors -- as I understand, the first official module ever published.

The grandaddy, and one of the toughest encounters of all time.

As far as situations that freaked you out go, the most memorable one for me was In The Dungeons Of The Slave Lords, the conclusion of the classic Slave Lords series, where you wake up in captivity.

You found out very quickly, that stripped of things like oh, armour and weapons, encounters you used to laugh at because of your level and stats ceased being amusing -- VERY quickly.

The picture of the violet fungus in that book STILL creeps me out to this day.

I have all three of these adventures, and the demi-lich was definitely one that my players never beat.

There were a few other tough ones... that modified iron golem from Mordenkainen's Fantastic Adventure was brutal, actually much harder than the demon in the final room. That was probably the toughest encounter that my players defeated.

Zuggtmoy, from Temple of Elemental Evil (T1-T4) was pretty harsh, much moreso than demoness Lolth from the Queen of the DemonWeb Pits (Q1).

I think the Froghemoth from Expedition to the Barrier Peaks (S3) gave my players some serious trouble... did it swallow somebody? Too many years have gone by.

[Chuckg]

Folks, nothing -- *nothing*, not even the Tomb -- can top H4, "Throne of Bloodstone"

OK, let me list some opposition:

*30th level lich-king, complete with totally fortified castle and undead minions galore

* great wyrm white dragon

* summoned and bound type VI demon

* castle defense system of doom that can see miles in every direction and will spot you coming unless you hug the ground and hide in ravines and, basically, keep the terrain between you and the castle at all times. oh, and you don't know about this thing ahead of time.

* and the castle is in the middle of a freaking glacier

Oh, the punchline?

This is not the final encounter of the module.

This isn't even the main part of the module.

The takedown of the lich-king Zhengyi is the *OPENING VIGNETTE* of the module.

After you finish this, presuming you survive, you then get to do the HARD stuff.

Which is go through the planar gate in the bottom of the lich-king's castle, find your way across the entire freakin' Abyss (with no map or directions), locate one specific layer (with no map or directions), jam your way across that layer, and enter the palace of Orcus.

While Orcus is home.

To steal the Wand.

*WHILE. ORCUS. IS. HOME.*

It is the one and only AD&D official module ever that I have seen stat encounters for a 100th-level party.

[Shellhead]

Chuck,

I kid you not, I was actually looking at H4 just last week, for the first time in over a decade. It's still sitting on my coffee table. I bought it back in the day, but when I saw how high-powered it was, I knew that my campaign was never going to last long enough for my players to get there.

The ideas about how to cope with 100th level characters were interesting. I don't remember all the details, but the basic gist was that 100th level characters are not five times more powerful than 20th level characters. Hit dice max out far below 10th level. Spells max out. Certain character classes, at least in 1st edition, had maximum levels, like druids and monks. Saving throws and to-hit rolls had a practical ceiling.

Then there were the nasty ideas for how to challenge such a party, including basic stuff like sending them to outer planes so all their magic weapons and armor would drop a couple of pluses. Magic resistance. Waves of goons to cause spell-casters to waste some spells. It didn't sound as insane as I expected, although it still sounded like too much hassle to DM.

[Metaphysician]

And once you kill Orcus and steal his wand, don't you *then* have to haul ass over to Baator, bust your way in to Tiamat's home, kill her, and douse it in her blood to destroy it??

[Chuckg]

Yes, yes you do.

[Royal]

One of one of my nitche habits is collecting all kinds & forms of dice. A friend of mine has given me a pyrimid die with three digits on each side. Now, I understand the d20 & the precentile die, but what does this die do?

[Shem the Penman]

One of one of my nitche habits is collecting all kinds & forms of dice. A friend of mine has given me a pyrimid die with three digits on each side. Now, I understand the d20 & the precentile die, but what does this die do?

Sounds like your generic d4. You roll (well, flip) it and the number that comes up on the base edge is the number you get.

[Sanagi]

Yup, four-sided die. Since no side ever lands facing up(except in miraculous circumstances), the bottom side is the result of the roll. And since you can't see the bottom side without picking the die up, which would invite cheating, D4s have the numbers along the edges to label the side beneath.

There are alternate designs. One is to have the numbers around the corners so that the corner that points up gives the result. Another is to use a cube with two of the sides rounded so that the die can't land on them.

[Perry Holley]

Also, you can use them as caltrops for any gamers foolish enough to walk around on game night with their shoes off.

[Puffy Treat]

Okay...way back in KotDT #6, the Knights did an "Intervention" for Brian.

I don't think that'll be enough, this time.

Jolly R. Blackburn confirmed on the KenzerCo boards that Brian wasn't merely pretending...and that yes, this was meant to be creepy instead of funny.

I'm not sure how I feel about KotDT getting so...dark.

Seriously, Brian needs help. He's losing all connection with reality when not at the game table.

[K'Nort]

Definitely creepy.

Jolly addressed that on the printed letters page too, and then kicked it up.

It wouldn't have been quite so dark if he was using another imaginary name.

The fact he stuck to his rehearsed script even when the players' actions didn't really fit was a bad sign too.

[Royal]

Tanks Guyz!

[Perry Holley]

Creepy, yet nonetheless entertaining. I can't wait to see how this turns out.

I'm also curious as to if we'll see any more of the call girl gamer.

[Valmore]

Poor Brian. Remember a few issues back when they were talking about Christmas plans? Sara offers to let Brian travel with her and some of the Felton family, and he declines by making up a story that his uncle is going to sweep in a take him off somewhere. Of course, he spends Christmas in his chair with a big bowl of popcorn, a bottle of X-Treme Caffine and the James Bond marathon on the telly.

Brian is a sad, sad character. He's only capable in the world of playing at the table as either a GM or player. His real life is spent making a fantasy world for himself. :(

[K'Nort]

The trouble is, it's harder to feel sorry for him when he starts to seem psycho rather than just sad.

[Valmore]

The trouble is, it's harder to feel sorry for him when he starts to seem psycho rather than just sad.

My guess is he lived a pretty sheltered life even before his parents died in that accident. He might not really know how to socialize outside the context of gaming. He wants to, but he's too afraid.

[Rockay]

I was wondering has anyone tried making any comic rpg's based on a online forum at all?

My friend and I were throwing some ideas around but where wondering if this already exists out there or not? Would people be interested in something like this?

[Xero Kaiser]

what, like city of heroes?

[Puffy Treat]

The thing is...Jolly himself said that Brian isn't pretending...he really believed that "Lexxy" called him.

If that's true, then Brian is more than just lonely and scared. He's mentally ill and emotionally disturbed.

Heck, we know from references in past strips that he's been on any number of medications in previous years, and that he literally believes he was abducted by aliens once.

If one reads the "Online Prelude" strips to issue #103 over at the website (http://www.kenzerco.com), we find out that Brian spent the college years of his life with almost no money (his uncle kept a tight hold on the trust fund) and no social life outside of in-depth Hackmaster sessions 6 nights a week.

It's possible he threw himself into fantasy gaming to avoid dealing with his parent's death...as well as use it as the only social/creative outlet he really had.

This takes all the implications of the tearful breakdown he had after the first "Lexxy" period as well as the hints of "The Incident" that lead to him give up GMing to paint a disturbing picture.

I'd suggest he give up gaming for a while to connect with more "real life" things if not for the thought the Knights just may be the only thing keeping him from completely losing it.

[Rockay]

More like based on a Forum where you select your characters and post roleplays. Perhaps using the Marvel RPG books or stats.

Similar to if you have seen some online Star Wars RPG's where you design a character, roleplay on a forum and the DM's put scenarios up for their characters.

[Perry Holley]

More like based on a Forum where you select your characters and post roleplays. Perhaps using the Marvel RPG books or stats.

Similar to if you have seen some online Star Wars RPG's where you design a character, roleplay on a forum and the DM's put scenarios up for their characters.You mean something like this (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=27641)?

[yeoman]

Also on Rumbles we had the half RP/half collaborative story telling "You vs." threads. Some of these did involve existing universes.

But htose didn't really use stats.

[UncleBob]

Also on Rumbles we had the half RP/half collaborative story telling "You vs." threads. Some of these did involve existing universes.

But htose didn't really use stats.

It mainly consists of the adventures of Cap'n Yeo and the unending rage of Munchie...

[nHammer]

I was wondering has anyone tried making any comic rpg's based on a online forum at all?

My friend and I were throwing some ideas around but where wondering if this already exists out there or not? Would people be interested in something like this?
I believe you are refering to a Play-by-Post game. Yes, they're out there.

[Saint_007]

Dude, we have a ton of these over on the Rumbles Board! Why not come and check for yourself?

[Perry Holley]

Dude, we have a ton of these over on the Rumbles Board! Why not come and check for yourself?

As opposed to here on the Games board, where such a thing would actually be on-topic...

[MatthewC]

The thing is...Jolly himself said that Brian isn't pretending...he really believed that "Lexxy" called him.

I read the message boards too, and I don't think Jolly said exactly that. What he said was that this was consistent with Brian's past actions and consistent with the "behind the scenes" stuff that he draws upon to decide how the characters will act. Then he said that readers were welcome to draw their own conclusions.

I don't recall any post where Jolly said outright that Brian "really believed" that Lexxy was on the line. There was a theory floating on the boards that Brian was just doing a practice run for possible social situations, just as he had practiced for game situations.

Myself, I think that we saw Brian deeply into a fantasy. And yes, probably not the best sign of mental health.

As for "The Incident", I am now convinced that it was in some way related to Brian confusing fantasy and reality. Whatever happened, it was so traumatic for Brian that not only did he give up GMing, but the other four people there took an oath of secrecy.

[Chuckg]

Great. Remember when KoDT was a /comedy/? This sounds like an after-school special on the dangers of gaming.

[Puffy Treat]

Bran's past actions were delusional...that's why the Knights did an intervention instead of just ignoring it or cutting him off from the group. So if Jolly says this is consistent with past actions...

[Draconomicon]

White Wolf Applying License to Indie Games



White Wolf Applying License to Indie Games

Posted by Zonk on Friday July 08, @07:42PM
from the goes-over-like-a-lead-balloon dept.
Enigma23 writes "White Wolf, Inc. has decided to enforce a licensing system upon those who run their games in their World of Darkness. Here is the full text of the license. The Licensing process will force those who have not already joined the Camarilla, White Wolf's official fan club, to pay a yearly $20 fee. They're not going to go after games that don't charge money for the event, but the wording is such that they can legally sue those who don't comply even if they only charge enough money to cover costs. The practical upshot is that technically the WW Stormtroopers could raid your house merely if everyone chips in a few quid for pizza. This is evidently doubly so if anyone in your gaming group is under the age of 18, which is against the membership policy of The Camarilla. There is a further discussion on RPG.net about the various issues involved." The BoingBoing discussion is interesting, as well.

MORE:
http://games.slashdot.org/games/05/07/08/1912245.shtml?tid=209&tid=155

[Metaphysician]

. . .are they stupid??

[BcAugust]

... Did someone check that isn't an old April Fools joke?

[Jagatai_Khan]

Even if it was real, it would be totally unenforcable. Such a lawsuit also wouldn't stand up in court.

[Dizzy D]

I agree with Bc, there is not a chance that this can be real. How could they ever enforce it? It would require a load of player cooperation.

[Jagatai_Khan]

Over at Nocturnis I'm getting strong indications that this isn't a joke, but that this is actually going to be a real policy. :confused:

Well, anyways, I haven't bought or played a White Wolf game in forever, so this really won't affect me one way or the other.

[Perry Holley]

WW's Justin Achilli posted the following over at RPG.net regarding this:

As always, topics like this bring out the armchair lawyers and the histrionics.

The purpose of this policy is to prevent larger, "unsanctioned" groups from trading on the White Wolf IP to generate profit for themselves. If you run a service for profit based on someone else's IP without a license, you have broken the law, just like selling bootleg CDs or DVDs without a license.

As a side benefit, it allows us to control a certain degree of quality and standards with regard to live-action groups. If we get a call from a convention organizer and she's all, "We'd like to have a Vampire LARP, but the last time we did, they sacrificed a goat and defiled all the minors in the building," we can say "They weren't officially sanctioned to run that game. Here's the contact info for your local Camarilla chapter, who will run this game professionally, safely and responsibly."

That's it. This isn't an attempt to invade your home game or generate another $20, nor is it an attempt to build a zombie world-conquest army populated by LARPers. It's quality control and trademark protection.

You may now return to the standard battery of hysteria.

Regards,
JustinAlso, Philippe Boulle, from White Wolf Marketing, posted this on the WW forums:


More on the Pay-to-Play Policy

Hello again,

Thanks to those who have posted their feelings or contacted me directly with them. I understand that this policy seems harsh and that many people are angry, upset or simply confused. Let me go into some details to help explain it all.

I understand that Storytellers regularly incur expenses during games (tabletop, LARP or what have you), and I understand the desire to recoup some of these expenses. I also realize that most of the people who have been charging for play in their games are doing so simply for that reason. We also have no intention of stopping a Storyteller from asking his or her players to chip in for pizza at a small game. This license does apply, however, when you are charging them a site fee or other standard fee and recruiting players far and wide.

The distinction is one of scale. Our intent is above all to be able to protect our rights and trademarks when dealing with large groups and commercial enterprises who are advertising, organizing large convention games, and setting up major events (like various “Gothic Cruises” or other enterprises I’ve seen pushed in various places). In order to be able to control such large systems, we have to have a consistent policy about people charging money in our name. That’s what this policy is meant for.

Ultimately, it would be ludicrous (and impossible) for us to track down every little game in which players help cover costs. In practice, if you and your friends decide to have a game and you ask everyone to chip in some cash, but don’t advertise it in any way or seek to find other players, we probably will never find out about it. We don’t endorse doing that and feel it does cross the line into commercialism, but there’s little we can do other than ask that you not do it.

In the end, the real test will be whether we can offer services through the Camarilla that help the promotion and running of large games with fees. I expect there’s a good amount of doubt as to whether we can, but only time will tell. In the case of those who are interested in recruiting more players, I hope that offering up the ability to promote your game in various White Wolf organs (mailing lists, newsletters, web-pages, etc.) will prove quite beneficial.

I do take the criticism and concerns of our fans very seriously and would like to ask a question. If the license had some sort of explicit exception for small groups (say 10 participants or less) in order to make clear that it doesn’t apply to small groups of players, would that address some of the concerns expressed here and elsewhere? I realize that many groups (especially LARP troupes) are larger than that and so won’t feel thi