Tracking the 52 Earths *SPOILERS*

[Paul Newell]

So bits and pieces are slowly being revealed as to the state of the new multiverse. Earths have been revealed, but not all and not all named. It's time to keep a list of the Earths to help keep everyone up to speed. :)

If I miss anything, please let me know and I'll add to the list.

NOTE: Most worlds contain parallel Earth versions of characters appearing in the current DCU. The labelling doesn't denote those particular characters, however.

Earth-0: New Earth. Created in Infinite Crisis #6
Earth-1: Home of the Silver Age DCU. First revealed in Trinity #52
Earth-2: Home of the Justice Society Infinity. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-3: Home of the Crime Society of America. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-4: Home of the former Charlton Heroes. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-5: Home of the Marvel Family. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-6: Unknown. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-7: Unknown Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-8: Home of the Extremists. Revealed in Countdown #29
Earth-9: Home of the Tangent characters. Revealed in Countdown #41
Earth-10: Home of the Freedom Fighters. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-11: Home of Superwoman, Batwoman and Wonder Man. Revealed in Countdown Presents The Search For Ray Palmer: Superwoman/Batwoman #1
Earth-12: Home of Batman Beyond and, presumably, DC's animated characters. Revealed in Countdown to Final Crisis #21
Earth-13: Home of some the Vertigo characters. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-14: ?
Earth-15: An Earth where the heroes have retired and been replaced by their proteges. Revealed in Countdown #30 *DESTROYED*
Earth-16: Home of the Super-Sons. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-17: Home of the Atomic Knights. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-18: Home of the Justice Riders. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-19: Home of the Victorian era Batman. Revealed in Countdown #40
Earth-20: An Earth where pulp magazine versions of DC heroes live. Revealed in Superman Beyond #1
Earth-21: Home of the New Frontier characters. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-22: Home of the Kingdom Come characters. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-23: ?
Earth-24: ?
Earth-25: ?
Earth-26: Home of Captain Carrot and the Zoo Crew. Revealed in Captain Carrot & His Amazing Zoo Crew: The Final Ark #1
Earth-27: ?
Earth-28: ?
Earth-29: ?
Earth-30: Home of the Russian Superman. Revealed in Countdown #40
Earth-31: Home of the characters from Dark Knight Returns. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-32: Home of Bruce Wayne/Green Lantern. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-33: The Conjurer's World. Home of magical versions of DC characters, including Bat-Mage, Kal-El & Lady Flash. Revealed in Countdown to Adventure #3
Earth-34: Home of a 19th Century Wonder Woman and a Britain run by Jack The Ripper. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-35: ?
Earth-36: ?
Earth-37: Home of the Thrillkiller characters. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-38: Unknown. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-39: Unknown. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-40: Home of WWII Covert Agents, The Unholy Three. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-41: ?
Earth-42: ?
Earth-43: Home of the Vampire Batman. Revealed in Countdown #40
Earth-44: Home of a robotic Justice League, "The Metal Men". Revealed in Final Crisis #7
Earth-45: ?
Earth-46: ?
Earth-47: ?
Earth-48: Home of the Forerunners. Revealed in Countdown #46 *DESTROYED (?)*
Earth-49: ?
Earth-50: Home of the Wildstorm characters. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-51: An Earth where it appears that crime has been eradicated and all super-heroes have retired. This Earth was destroyed and recreated as a new home for the New Gods. Revealed in Countdown #19.Unknown at this time:

Earth-?: Home of the JLA appearing in JLA: The Nail. Mentioned, but not yet shown.
Earth-?: Home of "Super Deformed/Manga" DC Heroes. Revealed in Superman/Batman #51.
Earth-?: Home to African American versions of DC Heroes. Revealed in Final Crisis #7.
Earth-?: Earth-Prime. Home of Superboy & the Threeboot Legion of Super-Heroes Revealed in Legion of 3 Worlds #5.

[Pink Bat Max]

Earth-52: New Earth. Created in Infinite Crisis #6[/LIST]Unknown at this time:

Has it been labeled as such?

[Matthew E]

This blog post (http://absorbascon.blogspot.com/2007/07/shape-of-things-to-come.html) may be of some interest here...

[gorosaurus]

I dont understand why "Elseworlds" stories each get their own universe.
I seems like DC will run out of Earths before they run out of Elseworld stories to tell. And some of the stories that have been told are certainly not worthy of being one of the 52.

[Paul Newell]

Has it been labeled as such?
It was stated in 52, by Rip Hunter that we had New Earth, plus Earth's 1 to 51. And it's been made very clear, in interviews and at conventions that New Earth isn't Earth-1...So "Earth-52" is all that's left.

[Paul Newell]

This blog post (http://absorbascon.blogspot.com/2007/07/shape-of-things-to-come.html) may be of some interest here...
Thanks Matthew, that's great. Only change I'd personally make is that it was recently stated that Earth-3 is the home of the "Golden Age Crime Society", so I'd be more inclined to have it feed off Earth-2....Though I don't know if DC has things planned so meticulously. :)

[Paul Newell]

I dont understand why "Elseworlds" stories each get their own universe.
I seems like DC will run out of Earths before they run out of Elseworld stories to tell. And some of the stories that have been told are certainly not worthy of being one of the 52.
I don't think they will, just the major Elseworld books. You do get some doubling up, however. I'll have to check through it, but the Companion volume that came with Absolute Crisis had some Elseworld stories doubling up with others.

[glennsim]

I dont understand why "Elseworlds" stories each get their own universe.
I seems like DC will run out of Earths before they run out of Elseworld stories to tell. And some of the stories that have been told are certainly not worthy of being one of the 52.

I don't think every Elseworlds gets an Earth, they just have decided to let some Earths be particular Elseworlds.

Hey Paul - I don't know if DC will be helping us out any further, but I like that they told us which Monitors went with some of the Earths. Should we start tracking that as well?

Unless you upload photos, you'd have to call them "mutton chops-no chinhair", "pointy-ears" etc.

[Paul Newell]

I don't think every Elseworlds gets an Earth, they just have decided to let some Earths be particular Elseworlds.

Hey Paul - I don't know if DC will be helping us out any further, but I like that they told us which Monitors went with some of the Earths. Should we start tracking that as well?

Unless you upload photos, you'd have to call them "mutton chops-no chinhair", "pointy-ears" etc.
Heh, I thought about it, but it's very difficult to find all of 'em. :)

[Buried Alien]

Hazarding a guess: "Earth-1" will be the new mainstream DC Earth after FINAL CRISIS is over.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[lonewolf23k]

It was stated in 52, by Rip Hunter that we had New Earth, plus Earth's 1 to 51. And it's been made very clear, in interviews and at conventions that New Earth isn't Earth-1...So "Earth-52" is all that's left.

So, essentially, New Earth is Earth-0.

[Paul Newell]

So, essentially, New Earth is Earth-0.
You're right. Earth-0 would make much more sense.

[4thHorseman]

In the recent DC panel on Newsarama:

Does anyone at DC know what all the 52 Universes are? We have more than half mapped out. Earth 26 is the Captain Carrot Universe.

[Paul Newell]

In the recent DC panel on Newsarama:

Does anyone at DC know what all the 52 Universes are? We have more than half mapped out. Earth 26 is the Captain Carrot Universe.
Well spotted. Thanks Horseman. :)

[Scott Shaw!]

Does that mean that Earth-C-Minus, the world of Super-Squirrel and the Just'a Lotta Animals, is now Earth-25?

I oughtta know, but I don't!

Aloha,

Scott!

[Paul Newell]

Does that mean that Earth-C-Minus, the world of Super-Squirrel and the Just'a Lotta Animals, is now Earth-25?

I oughtta know, but I don't!

Aloha,

Scott!
I'd love it if it was! :)

[4thHorseman]

from Newsrama, though I'm not sure if it should be added:

NRAMA: Quick. What's Earth-13?

KC: Vertigo. Sort of.

NRAMA: Earth-8?

KC: Batman Beyond... maybe? I'd have look them up to be sure.

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=126009

[Dr. Simian]

Say, which Earth IS the Dini/Timm animated universe, anyway?

[Paul Newell]

from Newsrama, though I'm not sure if it should be added:

NRAMA: Quick. What's Earth-13?

KC: Vertigo. Sort of.

NRAMA: Earth-8?

KC: Batman Beyond... maybe? I'd have look them up to be sure.

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=126009
Thanks, Horseman. I guess I'll go ahaed and put the Vertigo one in....But Earth-8 is already taken.

[Paul Newell]

Couple more Earths added. We now have 22.

[Interro]

Countdown to Adventure #1 states that Forerunner's Earth is the "forty-eighth such incarnation in the multiverse". Probably conflicts with what Countdown states if you take it literally.

[Bubba Love]

I realize that this may be out of place here since I'm just speculating on a hypothesis, but I think that Earth-51 may turn out to be Earth Prime, ie, our Earth, where all the characters exist only in comic books...

[Rollo_Tomasi]

Countdown to Adventure #1 states that Forerunner's Earth is the "forty-eighth such incarnation in the multiverse". Probably conflicts with what Countdown states if you take it literally.

Wow. Somebody goofed up.

[Buried Alien]

I realize that this may be out of place here since I'm just speculating on a hypothesis, but I think that Earth-51 may turn out to be Earth Prime, ie, our Earth, where all the characters exist only in comic books...

Of course, that will be nixed as soon as a single character from any of the fictional worlds shows up, or if anything that occurs on said world begins to affect this new "Earth-Prime" in any way.

I prefer to think of "Earth-Prime" and "Earth-Reality" as two distinct places. :)

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[hangmanjury]

This blog post (http://absorbascon.blogspot.com/2007/07/shape-of-things-to-come.html) may be of some interest here...
I think there's definitely something to the theory that the further you go from New Earth in terms of the numbering, the less it resembles New Earth. For that reason I'm of the camp that the Forerunners are on Earth 48 and not 34, and that Earth 51 is probably Earth prime.

[Suzanne]

From what I saw in 52, it looks like this new Earth 1 will resemble the previous one (hey, it rhymed!).

[Calybos]

Still keeping my fingers crossed for Earth-12....

[hangmanjury]

From what I saw in 52, it looks like this new Earth 1 will resemble the previous one (hey, it rhymed!).
It BETTER. I want to see the Earth-1 elements again, like Kandor, the Fortress with the big giant key (yeah, I know I see them in All-Star Superman, but STILL.), the Legion of Superpets, Barbara Gordon as Batgirl, etc. etc.

[hangmanjury]

Also, am I the only one who wants to see the Speeding Bullets Elseworlds in its own earth? The reason I say this is because it was a GREAT concept that was badly done, and this might be the chance to do the concept justice.

[Buried Alien]

It BETTER. I want to see the Earth-1 elements again, like Kandor, the Fortress with the big giant key (yeah, I know I see them in All-Star Superman, but STILL.), the Legion of Superpets, Barbara Gordon as Batgirl, etc. etc.

With any luck, the new Earth-1 will be a near clone of the old Pre-COIE Earth-One: a classic Silver/Bronze Age configuration mainstream DC Earth.

But I hope Earth-52 (New Earth) sticks around too.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[hangmanjury]

With any luck, the new Earth-1 will be a near clone of the old Pre-COIE Earth-One: a classic Silver/Bronze Age configuration mainstream DC Earth.

But I hope Earth-52 (New Earth) sticks around too.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
Well, as Kara Zor-El is only now recently surfaced in New Earth, then most likely the new Earth-1 was retrofitted so that its Supergirl still died in the Crisis. But what about their Barry?

[Buried Alien]

Well, as Kara Zor-El is only now recently surfaced in New Earth, then most likely the new Earth-1 was retrofitted so that its Supergirl still died in the Crisis. But what about their Barry?

Perhaps the Barry Allen we saw inside the Speed Force with that other Jay Garrick, Bart Allen, and Wally West is the Earth-One Barry. Ideally, I suppose, on New Earth (Earth-52), Barry's sacrifice stands and Wally continues to be the Flash, satisfying fans of that scenario. On Earth-1, however, Barry defies death in the Crisis and returns as the Flash, satisfying those who want to see Barry alive and fighting the good fight as the Flash again.

Other queries arise if the new Earth-1 essentially continues where the old Earth-One left off: should Dick Grayson be Nightwing, or Robin? If Dick is Nightwing, is Jason Todd the new Robin...a Jason Todd that *never* dies at the hands of the Joker? What of Barbara Gordon? On Earth-1, is she never crippled and continues her Batgirl career to the present day?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[hangmanjury]

Perhaps the Barry Allen we saw inside the Speed Force with that other Jay Garrick, Bart Allen, and Wally West is the Earth-One Barry. Ideally, I suppose, on New Earth (Earth-52), Barry's sacrifice stands and Wally continues to be the Flash, satisfying fans of that scenario. On Earth-1, however, Barry defies death in the Crisis and returns as the Flash, satisfying those who want to see Barry alive and fighting the good fight as the Flash again.

Other queries arise if the new Earth-1 essentially continues where the old Earth-One left off: should Dick Grayson be Nightwing, or Robin? If Dick is Nightwing, is Jason Todd the new Robin...a Jason Todd that *never* dies at the hands of the Joker? What of Barbara Gordon? On Earth-1, is she never crippled and continues her Batgirl career to the present day?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
I personally think it should be where Earth-1 left off, since I'd really rather see Dick as old school Nightwing than leggy Robin. But really, I can find no other reason it has to be there and can't go back a few years more.

[captain_unimpressive]

Wouldn't it be interesting if the worlds weren't just alternate continuities where characters didn't change as much or changed in different ways, but worlds actually displaced in time--the Golden Age Earth is actually in the Golden Age, the Silver Age Earth is in the Silver Age, et cetera. This would mean that in the DC Multiverse, all the big landmarks would be happening in groups, and would even have impacts on the other universes. So, to the 'verse-hoppers of the DCU Supergirl dies, Mister Mind begins his first defarious scheme, and a certain Kryptonian is discovering that he can fly, all at once.

[joint venture]

Wouldn't it be interesting if the worlds weren't just alternate continuities where characters didn't change as much or changed in different ways, but worlds actually displaced in time--the Golden Age Earth is actually in the Golden Age, the Silver Age Earth is in the Silver Age, et cetera. This would mean that in the DC Multiverse, all the big landmarks would be happening in groups, and would even have impacts on the other universes. So, to the 'verse-hoppers of the DCU Supergirl dies, Mister Mind begins his first defarious scheme, and a certain Kryptonian is discovering that he can fly, all at once.

And then, perhaps in some really intelligent argument and script; collide them all into one coherent and "swiss watch precission" working universe.

Final Crisis.

[SNW21]

In Countdown#43, Monarch tells Forerunner that the Monitors sent someone to exterminate all life on Earth-34, which is the world the Forerunners are from. In Countdown to Adventure#1, Forerunner mentions in her purple "thought/narration box" which is used throughout most of the backup story, the following:

"The Monitor stated that eons ago our planet was called earth...the forty-eighth such incarnation in the multiverse. This earth waged many brutal wars. The humans fought among themselves and eventually their neighboring planets. It was the destruction of life on my earth that brought about the planetary combat treaty."

So in Countdown#43, Earth-34 is the Forerunners home world and now in Countdown to Adventure#1 their home world is Earth-48? Is this a continuity error? Am I missing something here?

[4thHorseman]

I think it may have just been a mistake

[Interro]

New Earths, from DC Nation: Earth-18 (Justice Riders), Earth-21 (New Frontier), and Earth-34 (Wonder Woman: Amazonia).

[Buried Alien]

I personally think it should be where Earth-1 left off, since I'd really rather see Dick as old school Nightwing than leggy Robin. But really, I can find no other reason it has to be there and can't go back a few years more.

Looking back historically, I have long believed that Dick Grayson's transition from Robin to Nightwing was the first evolutionary step away from the classic Silver/Bronze Age configuration of the DCU to the Modern Age DCU that we recognize today. Up until Dick became Nightwing, the DCU had been fairly static for years. Very few permanent, major changes occurred to the DCU characters and their circumstances. For the most part, things were predictable and unchanging, year in, decade out.

Dick's becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd's becoming Robin triggered the tidal wave of change. Within a year, CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS would kill the Multiverse, the Barry Allen Flash, the classic Supergirl, and Silver/Bronze Age DC continuity and history. The new Modern Age DCU would be built, one brick at a time, over the next twenty years.

If a new Earth-1 emerges, it should reflect the classic, unchanged Silver/Bronze Age DCU...meaning Dick Grayson as Robin, Barry Allen as Flash, the classic Supergirl, Barbara Gordon as Batgirl, etc. Meanwhile, on New Earth, the changes of the past quarter century can remain and continue.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[captain_unimpressive]

And then, perhaps in some really intelligent argument and script; collide them all into one coherent and "swiss watch precission" working universe.

Final Crisis.

Well, you had me up to "one universe".
Didn't we already have just one universe a few years ago?
Remember how poorly that worked out?

[hangmanjury]

Looking back historically, I have long believed that Dick Grayson's transition from Robin to Nightwing was the first evolutionary step away from the classic Silver/Bronze Age configuration of the DCU to the Modern Age DCU that we recognize today. Up until Dick became Nightwing, the DCU had been fairly static for years. Very few permanent, major changes occurred to the DCU characters and their circumstances. For the most part, things were predictable and unchanging, year in, decade out.

Dick's becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd's becoming Robin triggered the tidal wave of change. Within a year, CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS would kill the Multiverse, the Barry Allen Flash, the classic Supergirl, and Silver/Bronze Age DC continuity and history. The new Modern Age DCU would be built, one brick at a time, over the next twenty years.

If a new Earth-1 emerges, it should reflect the classic, unchanged Silver/Bronze Age DCU...meaning Dick Grayson as Robin, Barry Allen as Flash, the classic Supergirl, Barbara Gordon as Batgirl, etc. Meanwhile, on New Earth, the changes of the past quarter century can remain and continue.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)
On principle, I tend to agree with you. On principle.

Except it's just that leggy Robin is so lame!

[hangmanjury]

New Earths, from DC Nation: Earth-18 (Justice Riders), Earth-21 (New Frontier), and Earth-34 (Wonder Woman: Amazonia).
Okay, they're making an Earth out of Kingdom Come, so I can forgive them for making an Earth out of New Frontier, even though I don't want anyone but Darwyn touching New Frontier. But is an Amazonia world really necessary? How much mileage can they really get out of that?

[Interro]

Keep in mind that the last multiverse had only ten or so notable Earths. I wouldn't expect every Earth to be revisited often.

[hangmanjury]

Yeah, but the more earths they can get mileage out of, the better, right? Since now there's a clear limit on the number of earths, shouldn't they attempt to make every earth utilitarian and usable? So do we really need an Amazonia earth, or can we just have that consolidated into the Gotham by Gaslight world since they don't really contradict each other? Did the Forerunners really need their own universe? Why couldn't they have just been an alien race?

[Buried Alien]

Keep in mind that the last multiverse had only ten or so notable Earths.

Yeah, which is why when people raised concerns that the new Multiverse is too limited with only 52 universes, I was compelled to remind them that despite all the talk of "infinite Earths" in the old Multiverse, we really only saw around a dozen or so of those parallel universes during the Silver/Bronze Ages.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Paul Newell]

In Countdown#43, Monarch tells Forerunner that the Monitors sent someone to exterminate all life on Earth-34, which is the world the Forerunners are from. In Countdown to Adventure#1, Forerunner mentions in her purple "thought/narration box" which is used throughout most of the backup story, the following:

"The Monitor stated that eons ago our planet was called earth...the forty-eighth such incarnation in the multiverse. This earth waged many brutal wars. The humans fought among themselves and eventually their neighboring planets. It was the destruction of life on my earth that brought about the planetary combat treaty."

So in Countdown#43, Earth-34 is the Forerunners home world and now in Countdown to Adventure#1 their home world is Earth-48? Is this a continuity error? Am I missing something here?

I think it may have just been a mistake

New Earths, from DC Nation: Earth-18 (Justice Riders), Earth-21 (New Frontier), and Earth-34 (Wonder Woman: Amazonia).
Looks like the mistake has been corrected.

[hangmanjury]

See, it seems the higher up in the numbering you go, as a genral rule, the less that earth resembles New Earth. At this rate I'm fairly certain Earth-51 is Earth-Prime.

[Paul Newell]

Yeah, but the more earths they can get mileage out of, the better, right? Since now there's a clear limit on the number of earths, shouldn't they attempt to make every earth utilitarian and usable? So do we really need an Amazonia earth, or can we just have that consolidated into the Gotham by Gaslight world since they don't really contradict each other? Did the Forerunners really need their own universe? Why couldn't they have just been an alien race?
They have two different versions of Jack the Ripper. I think that's where the contradiction lies.

[hangmanjury]

They have two different versions of Jack the Ripper. I think that's where the contradiction lies.
Can we just say that these earths RESEMBLE these Elseworlds and aren't exactly them? We can ignore Jack the Ripper altogether. Yay.

[Paul Newell]

Can we just say that these earths RESEMBLE these Elseworlds and aren't exactly them? We can ignore Jack the Ripper altogether. Yay.
A bit hard to when the main plot of Amazonia is based around Jack the Ripper being King of Britain. :)

[hangmanjury]

A bit hard to when the main plot of Amazonia is based around Jack the Ripper being King of Britain. :)
But isn't the necessary part of Amazonia for the Multiverse just the Victorian Diana?

Ah well, I think I just want economy when it comes to this multiverse.

[Paul Newell]

But isn't the necessary part of Amazonia for the Multiverse just the Victorian Diana?

Ah well, I think I just want economy when it comes to this multiverse.
Sort of. But she only becomes a hero to battle the mysoginistic tyranny of King Jack.

[hangmanjury]

Sort of. But she only becomes a hero to battle the mysoginistic tyranny of King Jack.
....Maybe there were TWO jack the rippers.....
.....yeeeeeeahhhhhhh.....

Still, you get my point though, right? As much as possible I'd like each earth to be completely usable and something they'd get quite a bit of mileage out of.

[Paul Newell]

So we're up to 24 Earths being revealed, so how about we have some guesses on what'll be some of the other Earths. :)

Here's a couple of definites, I think:

JLA: The Nail/Another Nail/Superboy's Legion
Superman's Metropolis/Batman: Nosferatu/Wonder Woman: The Blue Amazon.
Generations
Dark Knight Returns/Strikes Again
Thrillkiller
Batman: Brotherhood of the Bat/League of Batmen
Superman: Last Son of Earth/Last Stand on KryptonThese were all popular enough to receive "sequels", so I think we can safely assume they all made it onto the list.

Any other suggestions?

[Paul Newell]

....Maybe there were TWO jack the rippers.....
.....yeeeeeeahhhhhhh.....

Still, you get my point though, right? As much as possible I'd like each earth to be completely usable and something they'd get quite a bit of mileage out of.
I do see you're point, but I think, this time, they're trying to make sure, unlike The Kingdom mini, that the previous works don't get invalidated or retconned in any way. In some cases, that just means that it has to happen on a separate Earth, unfortunately.

[hangmanjury]

I agree with all those, except for DKR. I don't think anything should touch DKR, not even DKSA.

There was a sequel to Another Nail?

Again, I think the Speeding Bullets Elseworlds should get its own earth, just because execution didn't live up to the concept, and this might be their chance to get it right. Bruce would still be Batman on the multiverse earth though.

[Paul Newell]

There was a sequel to Another Nail?
Not really, but Superboy's Legion is by the same creative team and some of the characters from it appeared in Another Nail, so it's considered by many to be happening in the same universe.

[LordEd1976]

So we're up to 24 Earths being revealed, so how about we have some guesses on what'll be some of the other Earths. :)

Here's a couple of definites, I think:

JLA: The Nail/Another Nail/Superboy's Legion
Superman's Metropolis/Batman: Nosferatu/Wonder Woman: The Blue Amazon.
Generations
Dark Knight Returns/Strikes Again
Thrillkiller
Batman: Brotherhood of the Bat/League of Batmen
Superman: Last Son of Earth/Last Stand on KryptonThese were all popular enough to receive "sequels", so I think we can safely assume they all made it onto the list.

Any other suggestions?


Superman's Metropolis had a sequel? When did this happen and what's it called?

[Paul Newell]

Superman's Metropolis had a sequel? When did this happen and what's it called?
Batman: Nosferatu and Wonder Woman: The Blue Amazon were both sequels to Superman's Metropolis and the whole thing is a trilogy.

Nosferatu was published in 1999 and happens during the rule of Clarc and Lois. The Blue Amazon in 2003 and explores the origins of Metropolis and it's world.

[David Atkins]

I do see you're point, but I think, this time, they're trying to make sure, unlike The Kingdom mini, that the previous works don't get invalidated or retconned in any way. In some cases, that just means that it has to happen on a separate Earth, unfortunately.

I remember reading in an interview (I don't recall with who) that knowledge of a particular Earth's source material doesn't necessarily mean that you know very much about that Earth in it's present incarnation. Hence, it's possible that the two Jack the Rippers you mentioned have been consolidated into a singular being.

After all, while (according to your list) we apparently know what Earth the Victorian-era Wonder Woman lives on, you still have the one for the Victorian-era Batman listed as 'Mentioned but not yet shown.'

[hangmanjury]

Hey, what about the Son of Superman Universe, the Secret Society of Superheroes Universe, and the Secret Identity Universe? Wouldn't that be fun?

[Paul Newell]

Hey, what about the Son of Superman Universe, the Secret Society of Superheroes Universe, and the Secret Identity Universe? Wouldn't that be fun?
I think they're a good bet. It's just hard to say. Who knows which ones just don't make the cut? :(

[Paul Newell]

I remember reading in an interview (I don't recall with who) that knowledge of a particular Earth's source material doesn't necessarily mean that you know very much about that Earth in it's present incarnation. Hence, it's possible that the two Jack the Rippers you mentioned have been consolidated into a singular being.

After all, while (according to your list) we apparently know what Earth the Victorian-era Wonder Woman lives on, you still have the one for the Victorian-era Batman listed as 'Mentioned but not yet shown.'
I remember what you're refering to and that was a comment about the new Earths 2, 4, 5 and 10. But I think one thing that'll negate that somewhat is that they appear to be repackaging Elseworlds stories as a series of trades under the title "Tales of the Multiverse". I have a feeling that might make a difference to some stories keeping the continuity shown in those trades.

[hangmanjury]

I think they're a good bet. It's just hard to say. Who knows which ones just don't make the cut? :(
Offhand I am betting that Superman: True Brit does not make the cut.

Heeheehee.

[captain_unimpressive]

Someone mentioned that they disagreed with DKR being a world?
Well, I believe that Booster Gold is planning on visiting Carrie Kelley in one of the next few issues (remember the promo image?) and since it's not going to be New Earth's future...

Offhand I am betting that Superman: True Brit does not make the cut.

Heeheehee.

Aw.
But I was hoping for a BBC-Earth-2.

[hangmanjury]

Someone mentioned that they disagreed with DKR being a world?
Well, I believe that Booster Gold is planning on visiting Carrie Kelley in one of the next few issues (remember the promo image?) and since it's not going to be New Earth's future...



Aw.
But I was hoping for a BBC-Earth-2.
Carrie Kelly, huh? Well I guess some mileage can be taken out of DKR.

Sure hope they don't touch Watchmen beyond Earth-4 though.

[Paul Newell]

Carrie Kelly, huh? Well I guess some mileage can be taken out of DKR.

Sure hope they don't touch Watchmen beyond Earth-4 though.
You'll be glad to know that they can never add Watchmen into the DC multiverse due to the original agreement.

The deal was struck before trades became such big business and part of it was that, 12 months after DC no longer produced anything to do with Watchmen, then the rights would revert back to Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons.

Unfortunately for them the trade has been printed continuosly for 20 years.

[Bo-Man]

With any luck, the new Earth-1 will be a near clone of the old Pre-COIE Earth-One: a classic Silver/Bronze Age configuration mainstream DC Earth.

But I hope Earth-52 (New Earth) sticks around too.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Oh, how I would love that! Seeing characters such as The Flash/Barry Allen, Batgirl/ Barbara Gordon, The Atom/Ray Palmer,etc. would be great!

[Bo-Man]

Looking back historically, I have long believed that Dick Grayson's transition from Robin to Nightwing was the first evolutionary step away from the classic Silver/Bronze Age configuration of the DCU to the Modern Age DCU that we recognize today. Up until Dick became Nightwing, the DCU had been fairly static for years. Very few permanent, major changes occurred to the DCU characters and their circumstances. For the most part, things were predictable and unchanging, year in, decade out.

Dick's becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd's becoming Robin triggered the tidal wave of change. Within a year, CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS would kill the Multiverse, the Barry Allen Flash, the classic Supergirl, and Silver/Bronze Age DC continuity and history. The new Modern Age DCU would be built, one brick at a time, over the next twenty years.

If a new Earth-1 emerges, it should reflect the classic, unchanged Silver/Bronze Age DCU...meaning Dick Grayson as Robin, Barry Allen as Flash, the classic Supergirl, Barbara Gordon as Batgirl, etc. Meanwhile, on New Earth, the changes of the past quarter century can remain and continue.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I totally agree! Although seeing Dick in an updated Robin outfit would be rather nice. Kind of like they did Dick in BTAS. Seasons 1,2, and 3.

[Bo-Man]

You know we probably will not see this Earth again, but I would love to see from Infinite Crisis Earth-462 that had the Cathy Lee Crosby Wonder Woman and Debra Winger Wonder Girl fighting Per Degaton. I know that the Cathy Lee version was not the real WW, but her character being in a comic and being a different " Multiverse" version would be interesing to see and how they would approach it.

I'd also like to see the "Justice" universe be added, unless Earth 1 became the Silver Age/ Bronze Age with Captain Marvel added. Since the Marvel Family is basically Earth-5, and a original Silver Age/ Bronze Age might be considered seperate.

[David Atkins]

I remember what you're refering to and that was a comment about the new Earths 2, 4, 5 and 10. But I think one thing that'll negate that somewhat is that they appear to be repackaging Elseworlds stories as a series of trades under the title "Tales of the Multiverse". I have a feeling that might make a difference to some stories keeping the continuity shown in those trades.

You could be right. But the 'Tales of the Multiverse' trades could also turn out to be little more than a somewhat confusing (for some fans) marketing technique.

Personally, I'm cool with it either way. :cool:

[Nessor Sille]

Not really, but Superboy's Legion is by the same creative team and some of the characters from it appeared in Another Nail, so it's considered by many to be happening in the same universe.

How do they reconcile that baby Kal-El wasn't discovered until 1,000 years later (by R.J. Brande himself) in Superboy's Legion? That wouldn't jibe with the Nail books, where he did land as scheduled, he was just found by an Amish couple instead of the Kents.

[Paul Newell]

Heh. By copping to the fact that I screwed up. Serves me right for operating on memory alone. :)

[Nessor Sille]

I would like to see the Superboy's Legion Earth again, either as one of the 52...or in the "Megaverse" we'll possibly see after Final Crisis.

I'd also like to see the Supergirl/Batgirl World's Finest Earth.

[hangmanjury]

How about a universe where Superman is the GL of Krypton, Batman is the GL of Earth, Diana is in her Emma Peel version, Flash is Walter West, and... uh...

Well, I'm sure something would be done with Hal Jordan.

So, Earth-22. The Kingdom Come Earth. Did history happen on that Earth so that the events of Kingdom Come already happened, and superheroes just debuted there earlier than they did on New Earth, or is Kingdom Come still in their future? Similar questions could be asked on any earth based on an alternate future or past.

[Paul Newell]

How about a universe where Superman is the GL of Krypton, Batman is the GL of Earth, Diana is in her Emma Peel version, Flash is Walter West, and... uh...

Well, I'm sure something would be done with Hal Jordan.

So, Earth-22. The Kingdom Come Earth. Did history happen on that Earth so that the events of Kingdom Come already happened, and superheroes just debuted there earlier than they did on New Earth, or is Kingdom Come still in their future? Similar questions could be asked on any earth based on an alternate future or past.
I've been thinking about that and I think we've come across one aspect of this multiverse that is different to the original.

In the original Pre-Crisis multiverse, time was exactly the same, no matter which Earth you visited. If it was 20th December 1975, 3.00pm on Earth-1, then, no matter which Earth you visited, it would be that exact same time and date.

But when Mr. Mind chased Booster, Rip and Danial throughout the 52 universe, they mention that he's not only "eating reality" which caused changes in that Earth's history, but that he was also "eating" time. I think that's caused a change and the 52 Earths don't necessarily operate at the the exact same time or date as New Earth does. So when you travel to Earth-22, then you appear in the "future", even though it's still New Earth's present.

I mean, say it's 20th December 2005, 3.00pm on New Earth, when you travel to Earth-22, You are still in the present, but Earth-22's present is 20th December 2025. You travel to Earth-21 and their present day is 20th December 1965. Maybe the present on Earth 2 and Earth 5 is 1940....Or the 19th Century characters present day is 1890....Does that make any sense?

[Mr.50]

Yup it makes sense and it is a damn good and interesting thought that DC can do tons of different stories with. I like it a lot and sure hope you are correct Paul.

Mr.50

[Jeff O.]

I've been thinking about that and I think we've come across one aspect of this multiverse that is different to the original.

In the original Pre-Crisis multiverse, time was exactly the same, no matter which Earth you visited. If it was 20th December 1975, 3.00pm on Earth-1, then, no matter which Earth you visited, it would be that exact same time and date.

But when Mr. Mind chased Booster, Rip and Danial throughout the 52 universe, they mention that he's not only "eating reality" which caused changes in that Earth's history, but that he was also "eating" time. I think that's caused a change and the 52 Earths don't necessarily operate at the the exact same time or date as New Earth does. So when you travel to Earth-22, then you appear in the "future", even though it's still New Earth's present.

I mean, say it's 20th December 2005, 3.00pm on New Earth, when you travel to Earth-22, You are still in the present, but Earth-22's present is 20th December 2025. You travel to Earth-21 and their present day is 20th December 1965. Maybe the present on Earth 2 and Earth 5 is 1940....Or the 19th Century characters present day is 1890....Does that make any sense?

Your comments, Paul, make me think back to a couple different ways that time was shown to run on pre-Crisis Earth-One. Yes, when Barry Allen first met Jay Garrick, it was 1961 on both Earth-One and Earth-Two. But then when AMERICA VS. THE JUSTICE SOCIETY in the eighties retold the history of the JSA, there was a comment that time may have moved differently or been different on Earth-One. In other words, while it was still 1961 on Earth-Two when the two Flashes met, it might not have literally been 1961 on Earth-One when Barry crossed over. Though not confirmed, it might have been a later date on Earth-One. This is of course because Earth-Two characters aged more or less in real time, and Earth-One characters not so much. In 1985, had it really been 24 years earlier in Barry's life when he first met Jay? It basically still was 24 years earlier in Jay's life when Jay first met Barry. That's why Roy Thomas posited that time may have moved differently on one earth than the other. I'm sorry I can't provide a direct quote from AMERICA VS. THE JUSTICE SOCIETY right now, but that series is currently packed away. This might have been a part of Earth-One's sliding scale, where Superboy's time period was moved from the thirties to the fifties and then sixties to keep the adult Superman young, meaning on some level that the Justice League could no longer have been formed when 1961 came around.

Another way of looking at it was that an Earth-One character like Barry Allen did still debut in the fifties and went on to operate for about thirty years, but that he did so only in some sort of comic-book time. JUSTICE LEAGUE OF AMERICA (first series) No. 144 had Leaguers in the seventies referring back to the late fifties, even though the heroes didn't look to be almost twenty years older, and on one level Superman was still supposed to be just 29. Likewise, in SUPERMAN'S PAL, JIMMY OLSEN No. 70 (1963), Superman was honored in a story for having been in Metropolis for 25 years at that point. :)

[Paul Newell]

I'm sorry I can't provide a direct quote from AMERICA VS. THE JUSTICE SOCIETY right now, but that series is currently packed away.
I have 'em in a box right here beside. I'll take a look. :)

Another way of looking at it was that an Earth-One character like Barry Allen did still debut in the fifties and went on to operate for about thirty years, but that he did so only in some sort of comic-book time. JUSTICE LEAGUE OF AMERICA (first series) No. 144 had Leaguers in the seventies referring back to the late fifties, even though the heroes didn't look to be almost twenty years older, and on one level Superman was still supposed to be just 29.
Heh. That issue is in the same box and it was always something I found weird about the issue. :)

[Bo-Man]

I'd like to see a modified version of the added Pre- Crisis Earth-D that Marv Wolfman created that had the Justice Alliance of America that had a lot ethenicity to the characters be brought back.

[Dark Ben]

I'd like to see a modified version of the added Pre- Crisis Earth-D that Marv Wolfman created that had the Justice Alliance of America that had a lot ethenicity to the characters be brought back.

Basically that's what DC's trying to do in new earth just take a look
Atom= Asian, Question= Latino (isn't it ?), Blue Beetle=Latino,
Green Arrow Jr.= huh...Human melting pot ^^, J'onn J'onzz= more alien form Firestorm=Black

more seriously wolfman's perfect earth wish seems to have been heard if you refers to the ethnicity, my just complain would be that it's too much in the same time but that's a start

[Bo-Man]

Yeah I had thought about New Earth too with its more ethical look .I just thought how DC could do some type of reimagining with this earth as they are doing with the others.

[Mon-el]

This is posted from this site here according to that Countdown arena arc coming out from Dc.

http://www.dccomics.com/sites/arena/

also seen in this thread here.

http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=190409

A) Earth-21

Wonder Woman of Earth-21 exists in a time where the Cold War has just ended and a new era of heroism is dawning

B) Earth-34

First seen in Wonder Woman: Amazonia, this Wonder Woman was kidnapped from Paradise Island by Captain Steven Trevor and the Royal Marines before becoming a hero in 19th century London.

C) Earth-18

On Earth-18 Wonder Woman and the JLA are lawmen protecting the Old West. This group of heroes was first seen in Justice Riders.

A) Earth-32

On Earth-32 Bruce Wayne becomes Green Lantern instead of Hal Jordan. This Green Lantern was first seen in Batman: In Darkest Night.

B) Earth-5

First appearing in the pages of Countdown: Arena, this Hal Jordan is the Green Lantern of Shazam's world.

C) Earth-12

Earth-12 is a future world inhabited by a version of Batman beyond anything ever seen. The Green Lantern of this Earth is making his first appearance in Countdown: Arena.

A) Earth-40

This Batman was first seen in JSA: The Liberty Files and hails from a world where it's still 1942 and costumed characters have joined WWII.

B) Earth-19

Originally seen in Batman: Gotham By Gaslight, this Batman hails from the 1880's where his nemesis was Jack The Ripper.

C) Earth-43

From Batman & Dracula: Red Rain this Earth's Batman is no longer human, having been transformed into a vampire.

A) Earth-30

As seen in Superman: Red Son. On this Earth, the ship carrying the infant who would be Superman lands in the midst of the Cold War-era Soviet Union in the 1950s

B) Earth-31

Superman of Earth-31 hails from a darker version of the future as seen in the Superman/Batman series.


C) Earth-15

The heroes of Earth-15 have evolved to become nearly perfect beings. The Superman of this Earth is making his first appearance in the pages of Countdown: Arena

[mistervimes]

A) Earth-21

Wonder Woman of Earth-21 exists in a time where the Cold War has just ended and a new era of heroism is dawning


This appears to be the world of the New Frontier series.

[Mon-el]

This appears to be the world of the New Frontier series.

Yeah, Paul has that one already listed.

Paul also has listed Earth 34, Earth 18, Earth 5


The ones that Paul doesn't have listed are Earth 32, Earth 12. Earth 40, Earth 19, Earth 43, Earth 30, Earth 31, Earth 15,

[mistervimes]

Yeah, Paul has that one already listed.

Paul also has listed Earth 34, Earth 18, Earth 5


The ones that Paul doesn't have listed are Earth 32, Earth 12. Earth 40, Earth 19, Earth 43, Earth 30, Earth 31, Earth 15,

I have failed to be relevant :(

[Mon-el]

I have failed to be relevant :(

Don't worry about it, Mistervines. :)

I'm just kinda shocked that they named 8 Earth's at once through this Countdown Arena(Something I'm not too particurally excited about). I don't even think 52 #52 had that many.

I just checked they only told of 8 of those in that issue.

[Paul Dee]

I know it's early days and everything but why did they get a child to draw those pictures on the Arena pages?

[Paul Newell]

Yeah, Paul has that one already listed.

Paul also has listed Earth 34, Earth 18, Earth 5


The ones that Paul doesn't have listed are Earth 32, Earth 12. Earth 40, Earth 19, Earth 43, Earth 30, Earth 31, Earth 15,
Aded Now and we're past the half way mark! :)

[Paul Newell]

Anyone know who the Superman from Superman/Batman series is? What issues he appeared in? Is it the one where Superman and Batman ruled the world, thanks to the Legion of Super-Villains?

It looks suspiciously like the Superman from Dark Knight Returns...

[Mon-el]

Anyone know who the Superman from Superman/Batman series is? What issues he appeared in? Is it the one where Superman and Batman ruled the world, thanks to the Legion of Super-Villains?

It looks suspiciously like the Superman from Dark Knight Returns...

I don't have an answer for this. I was scratching my head at that one too.

I liked the first 3 arcs, but due to the lateness of the last Loeb arc(understandable because of what he went through with Sam). I kinda quit caring about it. I really stopped reading the next arc after that.

I wanna know why does that Superman have a cellphone on his ear?

[Paul Newell]

I don't have an answer for this. I was scratching my head at that one too.

I liked the first 3 arcs, but due to the lateness of the last Loeb arc(understandable because of what he went through with Sam). I kinda quit caring about it. I really stopped reading the next arc after that.

I wanna know why does that Superman have a cellphone on his ear?
I had a look through the Superman/Batman arc...No dice....The only future I could find mentioned is in Loeb's final arc where Superman and Batman fight various Elseworld versions of themselves, including the DKR Batman.

Looking at the Superman pic, it looks a bit like the DKR Superman, especially the hair. It also has a stockier, rougher look to his body. I don't have a copy of DKR with me, but I'm wracking my brains trying to think if he was shown at any time with a communicator attached to his ear. In the final battle when he's co-ordinating with the government's troops, perhaps?

[Mon-el]

I had a look through the Superman/Batman arc...No dice....The only future I could find mentioned is in Loeb's final arc where Superman and Batman fight various Elseworld versions of themselves, including the DKR Batman.

Looking at the Superman pic, it looks a bit like the DKR Superman, especially the hair. It also has a stockier, rougher look to his body. I don't have a copy of DKR with me, but I'm wracking my brains trying to think if he was shown at any time with a communicator attached to his ear. In the final battle when he's co-ordinating with the government's troops, perhaps?

It looks a bit like DKR Superman especially the jaw and the look away.

I just checked DKR page by page, No dice on that one.........maybe it's DKSA Superman(I don't have any copies of that to check it by, though)?

[Paul Newell]

http://www.fanboyplanet.com/interviews/mc-countdownarena.php
Keith Champagne: I think Superman (Kingdom Come) would have been a nice fit but that version of the character is going to be busy in Justice Society. I always would have liked to get to play with The Dark Knight Returns but no one wanted to disrespect Frank Miller by using his character. Which isn't to say that maybe another character or two from the Miller-verse didn't make the cut.

EDIT:

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=126009
NRAMA: OK, that's your favorite character. Which world is your favorite world that you get to play around with?

KC: You know, I'm not going to name it but there's one world in particular where, since it debuted, the characters have become so iconic that playing with one of them was something I never expected to get to do.

Let's see if you can figure out what I mean when the book ships.

[Paul Newell]

It looks a bit like DKR Superman especially the jaw and the look away.

I just checked DKR page by page, No dice on that one.........maybe it's DKSA Superman(I don't have any copies of that to check it by, though)?
Also the shoulder and muscles on the right arm have a very "Miller-ish" look.

It could be DKSA, but from what I remember, he drew Superman more lean and younger.

[Mon-el]

http://www.fanboyplanet.com/interviews/mc-countdownarena.php


Nice Catch! :)

[Paul Newell]

Nice Catch! :)
Check what I edited in as well.

I think it's him.

[Bo-Man]

On the Earth 5 with the Marvel Family, is there also a Green Lantern on this world as well? Am I correct on this?

[Paul Newell]

On the Earth 5 with the Marvel Family, is there also a Green Lantern on this world as well? Am I correct on this?
Yep. He appears on the website.

[Nessor Sille]

IIRC, the Green Lantern of Earth in the Batman Beyond era was this serene little Asian kid. Wonder why he's been replaced?

[Dark Ben]

I swiftly reread DKSA and no sign of the device

[hangmanjury]

Check out the cover for Countdown 30 when you get the chance... (I just read Countdown 31 and it's on the DC Nation page)

Is that EARTH ONE???

[Paul Newell]

Check out the cover for Countdown 30 when you get the chance... (I just read Countdown 31 and it's on the DC Nation page)

Is that EARTH ONE???
No-one knows, though Dan Didio stated at a convention, recently, that we wouldn't see Earth-One for another 12 months.

[Buried Alien]

No-one knows, though Dan Didio stated at a convention, recently, that we wouldn't see Earth-One for another 12 months.

Which is around the time FINAL CRISIS reaches its crescendo, correct?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[hangmanjury]

No-one knows, though Dan Didio stated at a convention, recently, that we wouldn't see Earth-One for another 12 months.
I have this habit of not believing a thing Didio says...

[Paul Newell]

I swiftly reread DKSA and no sign of the device
I didn't think it would be. Plus the Superman that appears in DKSA has a completely different build than his appearances in DKR. I'm still thinking that it's him, though...The attempts to make him look "Miller-ish" is too much. :)

[Xero]

First Earth 34 was Forerunner's Earth, then it became the home of Wonder Woman Amazonia, and Forerunner moved to Earth 48, then it became Forerunner's Earth again in a recent Countdown tie-in.
First Earth 15 was the home of evolved superheroes (2 days ago i nan interview with Keith Champagne), then in the Countdown preview currently on Newsarama it became home to the Mirror Universe versions of Donna Troy, Jason Todd, and Kyle Rayner.

It's a numbers game ladies and germs.

[Paul Newell]

First Earth 34 was Forerunner's Earth, then it became the home of Wonder Woman Amazonia, and Forerunner moved to Earth 48, then it became Forerunner's Earth again in a recent Countdown tie-in.
Which tie-in had it as 34 again? I missed that.
First Earth 15 was the home of evolved superheroes (2 days ago i nan interview with Keith Champagne), then in the Countdown preview currently on Newsarama it became home to the Mirror Universe versions of Donna Troy, Jason Todd, and Kyle Rayner.
Well it still is. From recent comments in the last two issues, it still appears to be a "perfect" version of the DCU.

[TotalWorldDomination]

Well it still is. From recent comments in the last two issues, it still appears to be a "perfect" version of the DCU.

Strange, Seems for the DCU to be perfect Diana, Bruce Wayne and Kal-El all have to be dead or non-existant...

But seriously if you go to the Website for countdown arena, click on the Superman link and let your mouse hover over the Superman Earth-15 option, you'll see that SuperZod is not the option given, rather it is some sort of younger bald superman with a black long sleeved outfit, neo-stylized s, white trim and jeans.

[TotalWorldDomination]

First Earth 34 was Forerunner's Earth, then it became the home of Wonder Woman Amazonia, and Forerunner moved to Earth 48, then it became Forerunner's Earth again in a recent Countdown tie-in.

Who said Forerunner was from earth? She could very well be from the same UNIVERSE as Amazonia wonder woman, just a different planet.

[hangmanjury]

Strange, Seems for the DCU to be perfect Diana, Bruce Wayne and Kal-El all have to be dead or non-existant...

But seriously if you go to the Website for countdown arena, click on the Superman link and let your mouse hover over the Superman Earth-15 option, you'll see that SuperZod is not the option given, rather it is some sort of younger bald superman with a black long sleeved outfit, neo-stylized s, white trim and jeans.
And that may be their Kal-El.

[TotalWorldDomination]

And that may be their Kal-El.

Point and Set, Hangmanjury. Perhaps that IS Kal-El... Ooooo... It would be pretty damn weird if Zod was Superman and Clark was Superboy... Perhaps in this timeline Jor-El worked with Zod and begged him to escape earth with his only child while he had the chance?

[Paul Newell]

Who said Forerunner was from earth? She could very well be from the same UNIVERSE as Amazonia wonder woman, just a different planet.
The back up story in Countdown to Adventure started with Forerunner's origin. She's from Earth-48 and her race is a genetic mix of all the Solar Systems races, including Martians and Saturnians.

[hangmanjury]

Point and Set, Hangmanjury. Perhaps that IS Kal-El... Ooooo... It would be pretty damn weird if Zod was Superman and Clark was Superboy... Perhaps in this timeline Jor-El worked with Zod and begged him to escape earth with his only child while he had the chance?
Think about it. If Zod and Kal-El were both on earth, and one of them were to become Superman, who would it be? The general or the scientist's son?

[Paul Newell]

Think about it. If Zod and Kal-El were both on earth, and one of them were to become Superman, who would it be? The general or the scientist's son?
Something was nagging at me and I suddenly remembered! In a recent interview, at Newsarama, Keith Champagne mentioned that the Superman in Arena is Christopher Kent, Zod's son.

My guess is that both came to Earth-15 and Zod was the initial Superman....In his appearance he mentions he's been retired for awhile.... And Christopher takes up the mantle, much like that Earth's Donna Troy, Jason Todd and Kyle Rayner have done.

[hangmanjury]

I wonder what happened to Kal-El in that universe then.

How I love the Multiverse.

[Dark Ben]

I think here is the good place to ask the question, I was wondering where does the 1,000,000 stuff take place ? is this still New Earth official future ? One of the 52? Or simply wipped-out ?

[Paul Newell]

I think here is the good place to ask the question, I was wondering where does the 1,000,000 stuff take place ? is this still New Earth official future ? One of the 52? Or simply wipped-out ?
Unless we see otherwise, presumably it's still New Earth's future.

[eternalkhaos]

Something about Kingdom Come I should know, since JSA currently has "Thy Kingdom Come" storyline and is an direct sequel to KC itself. Does this 52 multiverse wiped out the events of The Kingdom, Gog and other mumbo jumbo that Mark Waid has overdone Alex's work back then.

BTW, Since Keith mentioned the "Arena" version of Earth-15 Superman could be Chris Kent. I just wonder if Clark Kent is also/was Superman and how does Ursa and Non fit in this universe...Superwoman and Steel!!! Can't wait for what happened to Earth-15 next :)

[Foxy]

So, JSA and JLA don't interact with each other, because they're on seperate earths?

[Paul Newell]

So, JSA and JLA don't interact with each other, because they're on seperate earths?
There's a JLA and a JSA on New Earth. Earth-2 has a JSA only.

[katerek]

I alluded to this event in another thread, but I cannot help but wonder if Jenny Quark's actions in Armageddon: Mid nighter might bring another universe/new earth into the mix.

[NeonZ]

BTW, Since Keith mentioned the "Arena" version of Earth-15 Superman could be Chris Kent. I just wonder if Clark Kent is also/was Superman and how does Ursa and Non fit in this universe...

The black costumed Superman from the Countdown teaser seems to be from that Earth too, considering the newest Countdown, so that's probably the Kal-El of that Earth.

[DMike]

NRAMA: OK, that's your favorite character. Which world is your favorite world that you get to play around with?

KC: You know, I'm not going to name it but there's one world in particular where, since it debuted, the characters have become so iconic that playing with one of them was something I never expected to get to do.

Let's see if you can figure out what I mean when the book ships.

EDIT:

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=126009


Oh, that last bit gave me bad Watchmen omens (there were alleged rumors of Rorshach showing up in Arena after all), but maybe he was talking about Dark Knight after all.

[David O Burcham]

Oh, that last bit gave me bad Watchmen omens (there were alleged rumors of Rorshach showing up in Arena after all), but maybe he was talking about Dark Knight after all.

According to the latest issue of Wizard (in other words, it might be best to take it with a grain of salt), will feature characters "From Batman:Red Rain to Watchmen...".

Then they have a two-page spread of wish-list fights drawn by Art Adams.

Although the actual series may or may not have the characters in the Wizard article, I'd sure like to see them!

I don't have a problem with Watchmen being part of the Multiverse if DC does decide to make it so... the charcters are basically the Charlton heroes from another reality.

[Mon-el]

Looks like you was right, Paul.

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/9666/cntdwnpreviewfinal00032wq3.th.jpg (http://img261.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cntdwnpreviewfinal00032wq3.jpg)

Jellybeans referring to Reagan

I wonder how many more are going to be labeled from Areana

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/5205/cntdwnpreviewfinal00052xr2.th.jpg (http://img152.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cntdwnpreviewfinal00052xr2.jpg)

[Paul Newell]

Oh that has just GOTTA Be DKR Supes. Second panel homage definitely! :)

[lawman]

The back up story in Countdown to Adventure started with Forerunner's origin. She's from Earth-48 and her race is a genetic mix of all the Solar Systems races, including Martians and Saturnians.
But that was just her recollection, in dialogue, of something Monarch had told her... whereas in Countdown to Adventure #3, another flashback to her youth has a caption reading "Earth-34," with the little dual-globe logo and everything.

[Paul Newell]

But that was just her recollection, in dialogue, of something Monarch had told her... whereas in Countdown to Adventure #3, another flashback to her youth has a caption reading "Earth-34," with the little dual-globe logo and everything.
I wish they'd make up their mind. :)

[lawman]

I wish they'd make up their mind. :)
Yeah, you'd think they'd have charted out these things in advance, wouldn't you? (And heck, we're talking here about a contradiction in the same book, by the same writer, two issues apart!)

But then again, you might think the four writers and two editors working on 52 last year would have taken the trouble to mark the weeks out on an actual calendar... but evidently they didn't. (Otherwise they could have avoided things like, say, having Halloween a week early, or Christmas too many days before New Year's Eve.)

Ah, well. What I find really interesting, actually, is how quickly and decisively the PTB turned 180 degrees away from what Grant Morrison had said was the whole underlying concept of the new Multiverse -- that these would be independent universes capable of supporting their own stories (even series!), not just fodder for complicated cross-over stories. Would've been nice...

[Angelo2113]

Newsarama came out with an updated list of every Earth that'll be mentioned this year I believe

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=137526

[Paul Newell]

Thanks Angelo. Added 'em all. Interestingly they still haven't said which Earth is JL: The Nail...Though we get a couple of extra ones added, like the Super-Sons. :)

[Mon-el]

Earth-12: Home of Batman Beyond and, presumably, DC's animated characters. Will be revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1


Countdown to Final Crisis #21 preview

http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/415/ctdwn21101315d85qn4.th.jpg (http://img503.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ctdwn21101315d85qn4.jpg)

[Paul Newell]

And now we have some Earth's which I have no idea about! Anybody got any idea where the Ray Palmer/The Ray, adult Courtney Whitmore and Captain Atom are from?

Blue Beetle is much too similar to the New Earth version for decent guessing...

[Cthulhudrew]

Where does Earth C- fit in this? We know that it still exists now, via CC and the Final Ark #3.

[jadehorde]

And now we have some Earth's which I have no idea about! Anybody got any idea where the Ray Palmer/The Ray, adult Courtney Whitmore and Captain Atom are from?

Blue Beetle is much too similar to the New Earth version for decent guessing...

Yeah I actually thought it was him at first...

I liked that Ray...pretty cool power boost, but I still think Apollo got the shaft. I mean getting beaten in a fight of Supermen would be one thing...but come on.

[Pinnacle]

Earth-51 appeared in Countdown to Final Crisis #19 very briefly.

Liberty Belle (Libby Lawrence-Chambers) is president and everyone knows that Clark Kent is Superman. Seems to be another near-perfect world is remarked by either Jason or Kyle (couldn't tell as he was not in costume). Sounds like another Earth for Prime to destroy.

[hYPE]

So bits and pieces are slowly being revealed as to the state of the new multiverse. Earths have been revealed, but not all and not all named. It's time to keep a list of the Earths to help keep everyone up to speed. :)

If I miss anything, please let me know and I'll add to the list.

NOTE: Most worlds contain parallel Earth versions of characters appearing in the current DCU. The labelling doesn't denote those particular characters, however.
Earth-0: New Earth. Created in Infinite Crisis #6
Earth-1: Unknown at this time. Mentioned by Rip Hunter 52 #52
Earth-2: Home of the Justice Society of America. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-3: Home of the Crime Society of America. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-4: Home of the former Charlton Heroes. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-5: Home of the Marvel Family. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-6: Unknown. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-7: Unknown Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-8: Home of the Extremists. Revealed in Countdown #29
Earth-9: Home of the Tangent characters. Revealed in Countdown #41
Earth-10: Home of the Freedom Fighters. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-11: Home of Superwoman, Batwoman and Wonder Man. Will appear in Countdown Presents The Search For Ray Palmer: Superwoman/Batwoman #1
Earth-12: Home of Batman Beyond and, presumably, DC's animated characters. Revealed in Countdown to Final Crisis #21
Earth-13: Home of some the Vertigo characters. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-14: ?
Earth-15: An Earth where society has become nearly perfect. Revealed in Countdown #30 *DESTROYED*

Earth-16: Home of the Super-Sons. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-17: Home of the Atomic Knights and Kamandi. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-18: Home of the Justice Riders. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-19: Home of the Victorian era Batman. Revealed in Countdown #40
Earth-20: ?
Earth-21: Home of the New Frontier characters. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-22: Home of the Kingdom Come characters. Revealed in 52 #52 *DESTROYED (?)*
Earth-23: ?
Earth-24: ?
Earth-25: ?
Earth-26: Home of Captain Carrot and the Zoo Crew. Revealed in Captain Carrot & His Amazing Zoo Crew: The Final Ark #1

Earth-27: ?
Earth-28: ?
Earth-29: ?
Earth-30: Home of the Russian Superman. Revealed in Countdown #40
Earth-31: Home of the characters from Dark Knight Returns. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-32: Home of Bruce Wayne/Green Lantern. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-33: The Conjurer's World. Home of magical versions of DC characters, including Bat-Mage, Kal-El & Lady Flash. Revealed in Countdown to Adventure #3
Earth-34: Home of a 19th Century Wonder Woman and a Britain run by Jack The Ripper. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-35: ?
Earth-36: ?
Earth-37: Home of the Thrillkiller characters. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-38: Unknown. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-39: Unknown. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #2
Earth-40: Home of WWII Covert Agents, The Unholy Three. Revealed in COUNTDOWN: Arena #1
Earth-41: ?
Earth-42: ?
Earth-43: Home of the Vampire Batman. Revealed in Countdown #40
Earth-44: ?
Earth-45: ?
Earth-46: ?
Earth-47: ?
Earth-48: Home of the Forerunners. Revealed in Countdown #46
Earth-49: ?
Earth-50: Home of the Wildstorm characters. Revealed in 52 #52
Earth-51: Unknown. Will appear in Countdown.Unknown at this time:

Earth-?: Home of the JLA appearing in JLA: The Nail. Mentioned, but not yet shown.

Wow, that is crazy!!! Thanks!

[lazlo_toth]

I don't think they will, just the major Elseworld books. You do get some doubling up, however. I'll have to check through it, but the Companion volume that came with Absolute Crisis had some Elseworld stories doubling up with others.

Really? Which ones?

And when are they going to start showing some of these earth's versions of the Legion? At this point, I'm going to assume (until DC inevitably comes up with a confusing and counter-intuitive explanation) that the Legion currently starring in the comic named "Legion of Super-Heroes" and the one running for its life in Action Comics are from different earths and that both are "real" in the respect, but didn't somebody mention some battle or crisis of "3 Legions" during the Lightning Saga? I'm never at home when I post these so I don't have the actual comics in front of me to check this...

[lazlo_toth]

There's a JLA and a JSA on New Earth. Earth-2 has a JSA only.

So would Earth-1 have a Justice League but no Justice Society?

[Mon-el]

Really? Which ones?

And when are they going to start showing some of these earth's versions of the Legion? At this point, I'm going to assume (until DC inevitably comes up with a confusing and counter-intuitive explanation) that the Legion currently starring in the comic named "Legion of Super-Heroes" and the one running for its life in Action Comics are from different earths and that both are "real" in the respect, but didn't somebody mention some battle or crisis of "3 Legions" during the Lightning Saga? I'm never at home when I post these so I don't have the actual comics in front of me to check this...

It was in JSA #6.

Superman is talking about the Legion to the JLA and JSA and says, "The time travel was never easy on us. Once in a while, memories would be altered or even erased. One of the Legion's most historical adventures remains undocumented because none of us could recall the exact circumstance behind it. The archives called it 'The Legion of Three Worlds'."

Personally, as it hasn't been documented as of yet, but I and a few others around here believe that it's going to boil down to this:

Current Legion - future of the current DCU Earth (New Earth)
reboot Legion - Earth 2 (maybe)
Action/Lightning Saga Legion - Earth 1 (maybe)

[Paul Newell]

So would Earth-1 have a Justice League but no Justice Society?
I presume so.

[Paul Newell]

Really? Which ones?

And when are they going to start showing some of these earth's versions of the Legion? At this point, I'm going to assume (until DC inevitably comes up with a confusing and counter-intuitive explanation) that the Legion currently starring in the comic named "Legion of Super-Heroes" and the one running for its life in Action Comics are from different earths and that both are "real" in the respect, but didn't somebody mention some battle or crisis of "3 Legions" during the Lightning Saga? I'm never at home when I post these so I don't have the actual comics in front of me to check this...
I'll check when I can. I know that many of the strories that were published between the end of COIE and Man of Steel, that no longer fitted into Post-Crisis history, were given their own Earth.

[Cthulhudrew]

Does anyone know if Earth C- (C Minus) has its own designation? The Just'a Lotta Animals appeared in CC and the Final Ark #3 and there was some kind of interdimensional transit going on, so I don't think they are located in the same "universe" as Earth C (Zoo Crew) is.

[Joe Acro]

Does anyone know if Earth C- (C Minus) has its own designation? The Just'a Lotta Animals appeared in CC and the Final Ark #3 and there was some kind of interdimensional transit going on, so I don't think they are located in the same "universe" as Earth C (Zoo Crew) is.
There was some confusion regarding this earlier. In Countdown: Arena, there was a Blue Beetle included who was supposedly from Earth-26 (though he seemed a bit horrific for a cartoon). Scott Shaw!, artist of Captain Carrot and the Final Ark, brought this up when the information was released, stating that such a character would be from Earth C-, not the new Earth-26. The thread's around here somewhere. Anyway, in one of his promotional threads for the Captain Carrot mini, he discussed the possibility of Earth C- being Earth-25 and said he'd discuss it with someone. This was after 52, so the Earths may already have been set in stone.

Earth-25, though, has not been assigned elsewhere as of yet. So, maybe that's Earth C-.

[Cthulhudrew]

Earth-25, though, has not been assigned elsewhere as of yet. So, maybe that's Earth C-.

That would work, in more ways than one (26 minus 1).

[Joe Acro]

That would work, in more ways than one (26 minus 1).That was Scott's intent, yeah. Someone asked if Earth C-minus would be seen in the mini, Scott said that it plays a part, and that led to a few posts discussing what Earth it would be, the suggestion being 25 for that reason.

In one of those threads, we also discussed what Earth-26's Monitor should look like. That was fun.

Anyway, I hope it'll be clarified soon.

[Denny Colt]

Yeah, which is why when people raised concerns that the new Multiverse is too limited with only 52 universes, I was compelled to remind them that despite all the talk of "infinite Earths" in the old Multiverse, we really only saw around a dozen or so of those parallel universes during the Silver/Bronze Ages.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I had been thinking about this point, too, Buried. I never had much trouble keeping the old Multi-verse sorted out because there really weren't that many. And keep in mind that they were often significantly different, conceived to deal with similar but different heroes from different eras (1 & 2), Evil version (3), other companies (X,S,4), and funny animals (c & c-minus). There were the occasional one shot earths from time-to-time, that never appeared again, but I never found it that difficult to keep straight. The problem that I have been having now is with 52 to sort out, I'm losing sight of some of the stories. First, I only got back into reading comics about a year & 1/2 ago after a 15 hiatus, so I missed most of the Elseworlds stuff (although I have been trying to catch up on what I missed). Secondly, we're getting a bunch of new Earths popping up and sometimes I'm a bit confused about whether these are all-new, or refering back to Elseworlds or something else. Finally, in my estimation, Countdown Arena was incredibly difficult to read because (a) the art was so lousy I often couldn't tell one version of a character from another (I know this is a subjective point and someone will challenge me, rightly that the art was the best thing going since Neal Adams burst on the scene, and that's their right, but I found it very difficult to follow) and (b) while it was nice of them to give us little globes saying which earth the characters came from, unless I have a damned scorecard handy, I have to put the book down, turn on my computer, come to this (very excellent) message board, or try to the look up the DC Nation column that sorts them all (or some of them) out.

Anyway, I loved the old multiverse, I'm prepared to love the new one, but sheesh, Rome wasn't built in a day!

[Denny Colt]

That was Scott's intent, yeah. Someone asked if Earth C-minus would be seen in the mini, Scott said that it plays a part, and that led to a few posts discussing what Earth it would be, the suggestion being 25 for that reason.

In one of those threads, we also discussed what Earth-26's Monitor should look like. That was fun.

Anyway, I hope it'll be clarified soon.

In one of the recent countdown issues there's a full page spread of the monitors (it might be the first issued titled "... to Final Crisis" (#26? I don't have it in front of me) and there is a monitor with bunny ears. I assume this is the one who monitors the Capt Carrot earth.

[blackphoenix]

Is there a list of the 52 Earths that have been revealed so far? I saw it listed in some DC issues, but I didn't buy those. All I remember is the basic ones(E-2, THE JSA Earth, E-3, the Justice Society, etc.)

Also, if E-3 is the home to the Injustice Society, where does that leave the iNJUSTICE League formerly from E-3?

[DonC]

Like this? (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=184772)

[Laughing Mask]

"Earth-37: Home of the Thrillkiller characters."

aw man, thrillkiller was lame!

[Zahir]

There was some confusion regarding this earlier. In Countdown: Arena, there was a Blue Beetle included who was supposedly from Earth-26 (though he seemed a bit horrific for a cartoon). Scott Shaw!, artist of Captain Carrot and the Final Ark, brought this up when the information was released, stating that such a character would be from Earth C-, not the new Earth-26. The thread's around here somewhere. Anyway, in one of his promotional threads for the Captain Carrot mini, he discussed the possibility of Earth C- being Earth-25 and said he'd discuss it with someone. This was after 52, so the Earths may already have been set in stone.

Earth-25, though, has not been assigned elsewhere as of yet. So, maybe that's Earth C-.

According to Wikipedia, each of the 52 is a complete universe, with its own variety of different timelines, its own Phantom Zones and Antimatter versions of itself, its own everything:

A new Multiverse was revealed at the end of the 52 weekly limited series.[4] Unlike the original Multiverse, which was composed of an infinite number of alternate universes, this Multiverse is composed of only fifty-two alternate universes, which are referred to as New Earth and Earths 1 through 51. The alternate universes were originally identical to New Earth and contained the same history and people until Mister Mind "devoured" portions of each Earth’s history, creating new, distinct Earths with their own histories and people, such as the Nazi-themed version of the Justice League that exists in Earth-10.[5] Each of the alternate universes have their own parallel dimensions, divergent timelines, microverses, etc, branching off them.[6]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_DC_Multiverse_worlds#The_52

So actually, the canvas with the writers get to play isn't really much smaller than before.

[The Valeyard]

Is it me or did DC just call out New Earth as Earth 1 in Tangent: Superman's Reign #1?

[Mr.50]

Is it me or did DC just call out New Earth as Earth 1 in Tangent: Superman's Reign #1?



You beat me to it! I was just going to ask about this too??? I have to believe it is just a total major screw up. There is no way New Earth can be Earth 1 based on past comments. If it turn out that way it will be a total disappointment.


Mr.50

[Emperor Time]

I wonder which Earth has the Morticoccus Virus that was seen in Countdown #6? :confused:

[Mr.50]

I wonder which Earth has the Morticoccus Virus that was seen in Countdown #6? :confused:

Good question too! but I get the feeling that whatever Earth that is will be the one where the "Kamandi" future takes place.

Mr.50

[NotSuper]

I hope the "New Earth is Earth-1" thing is just an error. Otherwise it's an unnecessary and annoying retcon made worst by the fact that the new multiverse wasn't introduced that long ago.

I hope someone asks DiDio this question again. We need a definitive answer here.

[Bicycle-Repairman]

How about an Earth that is home to the super-hero parodies from the 1950s "Mad" comics: Superduperman, Captain Marbles, Bat Boy and Rubin, Woman Wonder, Plastic Sam, and the Black and Blue Hawks? DC and Mad Magazine are now both owned by Time Warner. Time Warner also owns Hanna-Barbera, so maybe the Super Friends have their own Earth.

[Paul Dee]

I wonder which Earth has the Morticoccus Virus that was seen in Countdown #6? :confused:

That's Earth -51 now

[kamandi63]

Does anyone know if there's been any mention of the earth the Watchmen come from?

[Paul Newell]

Does anyone know if there's been any mention of the earth the Watchmen come from?
No and there's all likelihood there never will be.

The deal is that 12 months after DC no longer produces any Watchmen material, the copyright reverts back to Alan Moore & Dave Gibbons.

That's never likely to happen now, but it is still a possibility, so you'll never see DC incorporate Watchmen into their universe.

[fred10]

So, are there to be no more Marvel/DC crossovers, or does is Marvel U one of the 52?

[lazlo_toth]

So, are there to be no more Marvel/DC crossovers, or does is Marvel U one of the 52?


I always thought that depended on how cordial things were between the two companies. Right now I get the impression that there's some genuine hard feelings on JQ's part towards DC, more so than a few years ago when JLA/Avengers came out.

[Sijo]

So, are there to be no more Marvel/DC crossovers, or does is Marvel U one of the 52? Officially, no- unless you count Lord Havoc's Earth, which is a blatant Marvel rip-off (but then, Marvel's Squadron Supreme Earth is a blatant DCU rip off, so it's only fair.)

Of course, according to some theories, each Multiverse is part of a larger, infinite Omniverse- sort of the way our Galaxy is just one among millions, but without the proper means, we would never get to explore anything but local space, so it might as well be the only one as far as we are concerned.

So yeah, if they wanted to make more DC/Marvel crossovers, it would be easy to explain by saying that the DC Universe is limited to 52 Earths but only within its own boundaries, but beyond those there is another (with, apparently, thousands of Earths): Marvel's, and perhaps others.

Though of course, this will only happen when things cool again between both companies...

[Emperor Time]

That's Earth -51 now

Thank you and that means that Kamandi is on both Earth-17 and Earth-51 now? :confused:

[Paul Dee]

Thank you and that means that Kamandi is on both Earth-17 and Earth-51 now? :confused:

When was Kamandi Earth-17?

[Emperor Time]

When was Kamandi Earth-17?

It was in 52 issue #52. Also was the very first Earth that Rip and Booster saw altered by Mister Mind. :smile:

[Paul Dee]

It was in 52 issue #52. Also was the very first Earth that Rip and Booster saw altered by Mister Mind. :smile:

Ah yes. When Karate Kid et al met the Atomic Knights and Buddy Blank in Countdown was this on New Earth or had they Earth-jumped by this point? It was in a bunker in Bludhaven wasn't it, so it'd be New Earth I guess. Seems odd that this seems to fit with 52 #52 as Earth-51 is the Great Disaster Earth, I'm sure

[Emperor Time]

I understand. :biggrin:

[Paul Newell]

It was in 52 issue #52. Also was the very first Earth that Rip and Booster saw altered by Mister Mind. :smile:
Technically it wasn't. They just showed the Atomic Knights on Earth-17...Pre-Crisis they were considered to be around in Kamandi's past...Unofficially at least.

Kamandi was mentioned as being on Earth-17 in Countdown: Arena by Star-ape.

[Mr.50]

What is with the monitors blaming the one monitor from Earth-51 for the "death of two earths"??? What other earth did he let die besides his own Earth-51?

[Paul Newell]

What is with the monitors blaming the one monitor from Earth-51 for the "death of two earths"??? What other earth did he let die besides his own Earth-51?
He let it die twice.

[Mr.50]

So we are talking about the twice death off Earth-51? Ok what am I forgetting? So it died at the end of the big war with Monarch and SBOYPRIME, but when was the second time? Or is this the explanation that this is supposed to be where we saw Morto break out??? How the hell did a full society of Earth like beings regrow so quick..... I know I am forgetting something here can you refresh please?

Mr.50

[4thHorseman]

So we are talking about the twice death off Earth-51? Ok what am I forgetting? So it died at the end of the big war with Monarch and SBOYPRIME, but when was the second time? Or is this the explanation that this is supposed to be where we saw Morto break out??? How the hell did a full society of Earth like beings regrow so quick..... I know I am forgetting something here can you refresh please?

Mr.50

Yeah, after the battle on Earth-51, you see a plant regrowing which is supposed to represent a new Earth being created. Although they didn't talk about a time difference, it was assumed. But the second time it was destroyed was when the Great Disaster occurred turning everyone into animals.

[Mr.50]

Yeah, after the battle on Earth-51, you see a plant regrowing which is supposed to represent a new Earth being created. Although they didn't talk about a time difference, it was assumed. But the second time it was destroyed was when the Great Disaster occurred turning everyone into animals.

Oh yes I remember now. Wow Countdown was really Craptastic!

Mr.50

[Emperor Time]

I been hearing that New Earth and Earth-1 are the same Earth and that there a Earth-52 as well, is this true?

[Paul Newell]

I been hearing that New Earth and Earth-1 are the same Earth and that there a Earth-52 as well, is this true?
We don't know as yet. In Tangent: Superman's Reign, New Earth was labelled Earth-1. No-one has said that was a mistake as yet, as it goes against what was being said in the comics and by DC creators and editorial before the mini came out.

[blackphoenix]

Earth 8 is also apparently home to the new heroes: Kyle Rayner's GL, Artemis as Wonder Woman, Jean Paul Valley as Batman, Conner Kent as Superman, etc. This was shown in a panel of Countdown: Arena.

Oh yeah...Countdown did suck.

[Paul Newell]

We don't know as yet. In Tangent: Superman's Reign, New Earth was labelled Earth-1. No-one has said that was a mistake as yet, as it goes against what was being said in the comics and by DC creators and editorial before the mini came out.
Looks like it was a mistake. The latest issue has the label changed to "New Earth" rather than Earth-1.

[tracedog]

Batman R.I.P. is bringing lots of Earth-1 continuity back... which knowing Morrison, probably means something.

[tracedog]

Looks like it was a mistake. The latest issue has the label changed to "New Earth" rather than Earth-1.

Jamal Igle and Matt Idelson confirmed that New Earth is indeed Earth-1... that's a pretty big frickin' deal then. It definitely explains all of the Silver Age continuity brought back to Superman (Superboy, LoSH, Mon-El, Phantom Zone vaillains), and sheds some light on what's going on in Batman R.I.P... And have already been told that Earth-2 is coming back as well.

Morrison and Co. did warn us that the 52 parallel earths don't necessarily correspond to the Pre-Crisis worlds...

Now the trick is figuring out how all of this ties into FC. :eek:

[Paul Newell]

Jamal Igle and Matt Idelson confirmed that New Earth is indeed Earth-1... that's a pretty big frickin' deal then. It definitely explains all of the Silver Age continuity brought back to Superman (Superboy, LoSH, Mon-El, Phantom Zone vaillains), and sheds some light on what's going on in Batman R.I.P... And have already been told that Earth-2 is coming back as well.

Morrison and Co. did warn us that the 52 parallel earths don't necessarily correspond to the Pre-Crisis worlds...

Now the trick is figuring out how all of this ties into FC. :eek:
They did? Okeydoke then. Where was this then? Did they give any reasons?

[tracedog]

They did? Okeydoke then. Where was this then? Did they give any reasons?

http://www.supermanhomepage.com/inter-action/inter-action.php?topic=ask-editor/ask-matt

http://dcboards.warnerbros.com/web/thread.jspa?threadID=2000153712&start=45&tstart=0

no explanations given though :confused:

[Mr.50]

I really hope this turns out to be some sort of plot point because if all along what we thought is "New Earth" turns out to be Earth-1 of this Mltiverse then that seems like yet another area where DC changed horses mid race and then wants us to believe this was the plan all along.

Mr.50

[lawman]

Wow, Matt Idelson just lost an absolute ton of respect from me in that "Ask Matt" column just linked, when he begs off a question about doing politically relevant stories with this "example":
There are those that believe global warming is a very real and serious dillema. There are those that utterly dispute the notion. Who's right? There's no way to be certain.
Umm, yes there is, Matt. It's called "science." Or are you going to have your comics avoid stories mentioning evolution now, too, since there's also a political faction of idiots who consider that "controversial"?

***
(His answer about running roughshod over past continuity wasn't any better, BTW. He says, "one of my primary goals is to ensure that when the day comes where someone else is editing the character, we'll leave them with stories so strong that they'll have no choice but to work off what's been done and treat it as canon," which is apparently somehow supposed to justify him doing just the opposite to the last 20 years' worth of stories.)

And he makes total hash of current continuity with a reply that mentions using "Action #877" :confused: as a reference point.

And how about this godawful answer to a very clear, thoughtful question about the continuity problems re: Chris Kent and Action Annual #11?
Ugh. Clearly, Ryan, the theme of today's column is "Mea Culpa." Yeah, if you read "Last Son" in one sitting, there's no time for all of Chris' adventures in Kurt's SUPERMAN run to have occurred. Then again, we couldn't have not had Chris show up in SUPES while "Last Son" was not coming out and just dance around Chris' fate. Plus, we didn't want people to forget about the "Last Son" story. Soooooooo... after the last panel of Issue #846, Page 9, Clark, Lois and Chris stepped out for lunch. Several weeks passed by, during which Clark and Lois struggled with raising Chris, Chris went to school, met Robin, helped the 3rd Kryptonian, etc., and then, on an off-day from school, Chris, Clark and Lois happened to all wear the same outfits they were wearing on Page 9 of #846 (they're extremely organized, methodical people, and Chris imitated his "parents") and took another trip to mom and dad's office, wherein Zod attacked.
You're not buying this, are you?
(Nope. It doesn't even work if you try to take it at face value, since the attack actually starts on the next-to-last panel of page 9.)

Seriously, what the heck is an editor for, if not to catch these sorts of things before they see print and elicit embarrassing questions? A few minor story tweaks could have headed off every single problem he was asked about.

So given all of that, I'm going to take his "assurances" about Earth-1 with about a ton of salt.

[Phaedrusnyc]

Wow, Matt Idelson just lost an absolute ton of respect from me in that "Ask Matt" column just linked, when he begs off a question about doing politically relevant stories with this "example":

Umm, yes there is, Matt. It's called "science." Or are you going to have your comics avoid stories mentioning evolution now, too, since there's also a political faction of idiots who consider that "controversial"?



Based on the remainder of his answer (in which he discusses Gitmo and uses the word "remotely" for emphasis), I think it's safe to assume that Idelson falls along a specific point of the political spectrum (let's call it Chuck Dixonism) and, knowing how his views would be torn apart by the greater comic book-reading public, can't push his agenda through Superman and thus would prefer not to deal with real-world issues at all. (Interesting, considering the original Siegel/Shuster stories and the fact that Superman was conceived as a sci-fi character). Based on that, and the other points you made about basic editorial incompetence, I'm not terribly sorry that I've been sitting out the Superman reset.

[Kissyboots]

Hazarding a guess: "Earth-1" will be the new mainstream DC Earth after FINAL CRISIS is over.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I believe it will be the DCU up until 1985 ( which would include the death of Superman as told by Alan Moore). Perhaps one of the Legion's are from this Earth.

[Paul Newell]

http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=17827
Didio later said, “Our Earth, New Earth is not Earth-1. We’ve pretty well explained that as much as possible. As of right now, I can tell you there is no Earth-1.”

[LordEd1976]

http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=17827

Now I am really confused.

So what is he saying here? That there's New Earth and then the next Earth down the line is Earth-2?

[lawman]

Didio later said, “Our Earth, New Earth is not Earth-1. We’ve pretty well explained that as much as possible. As of right now, I can tell you there is no Earth-1.”
Left hand, meet right hand. Talk amongst yourselves... :rolleyes:

[lawman]

And (pardon the tangent) how about this other quote from the same story:The executive editor also said the recent “Hawkman” Special by Jim Starlin was an effort to test the waters for the character. “It was to create an air of mystery around the character and to create questions around the character. With the chance that people might get interested and discuss the character and want to read about him further down the line.”
Yeah, because drowning his origin in a pool of confusion worked so well to drive readers to the character last time around... :rolleyes:

[NotSuper]

Now I am really confused.

So what is he saying here? That there's New Earth and then the next Earth down the line is Earth-2?
No, he's saying that Earth-1 is not New Earth and that Earth-1 hasn't been revealed yet.

[IvCNuB4]

I'm hoping/guessing Didio means there is still an Earth-1 out there to be explored later :tongue:

[the_simurgh]

the problem with tracking the worlds of the fifty two is that somehow the monitors seem to be able to replace people who have been fetched from a world, change the world on what it's based on, or in fact recreate the world to the temporal point that an intruder never showed up on it. nix uton did this with earth 51 after it's destruction by the monarch captain atom fight. and most likely the reason that earth 51 is a graveyard now is because solomon seems bound and determined that the "peaceful tranquil earth 51 be taken out of the equation. to that effect he has turned earth 51's monitor into a amnesiac human and cast him to earth. i believe that nix uton is the key somehow to the temporal and reality fluctuations of the multiverse and that solomon is the dark being mentioned in superman beyond or a servant of the dark being in superman beyond. time seems inconsistent at least in the tangent world.

[THEDOC]

I noticed no mention of the Stan Lee DC heroes. Wouldn't they have an Earth? Is there an agrement never to use these heroes again?

[THEDOC]

double post

[THEDOC]

Triple Post

[fly on the wall]

And (pardon the tangent) how about this other quote from the same story:
Yeah, because drowning his origin in a pool of confusion worked so well to drive readers to the character last time around... :rolleyes:

Har har har!

I agree. After Geoff Johns ( I think it was Johns) worked so hard to come up with a consistent origin for Hawkman, they had to have Starlin ruin it all.

So what was Hawkman's connection with Thanagar, that is before Starlin came along?

And would Superman be more interesting if they started hinting he was really from Daxam and his family was visiting Krypton during the time that planet blew up?

[Sean Walsh]

And would Superman be more interesting if they started hinting he was really from Daxam and his family was visiting Krypton during the time that planet blew up?

SHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! Don't give them any ideas!

Thank cripes Johns is writing this Superman: Secret Origin mini and not Starlin..... :eek:

[cheshire42]

The preview for Final Crisis #7 shows us a glimpse of a new alternate Earth. If that Earth's U.S. President has a last name that doesn't start with an "O", I'll be mighty surprised. :biggrin:

I wonder if the Jeff Pierce of this new Earth goes by "White Lightning"? It would be funny if he had moonshiner ancestors...

[Seraku]

I noticed no mention of the Stan Lee DC heroes. Wouldn't they have an Earth? Is there an agrement never to use these heroes again?

SL Superman was shown in Infinite Crisis when Superman "split" into all those multiple versions.

[Buried Alien]

FINAL CRISIS has come and gone, and we still have no real indication of what this current Multiverse's Earth-1 universe is like, although we seem to have established that the current, main DCU is not Earth-1 (being instead Earth-Zero).

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Alpinemaps]

FINAL CRISIS has come and gone, and we still have no real indication of what this current Multiverse's Earth-1 universe is like, although we seem to have established that the current, main DCU is not Earth-1 (being instead Earth-Zero).

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I'm thinking that's pretty significant. I think DC doesn't want to touch Earth-1 until it absolutely has to. It's probably something they want to treat very carefully.

[DCKar2nist]

without the moniters aren't there now unlimited earths?

[Seraku]

there should be yes.

the Monitors were feeding on the multiverse which stunted it's growth

[Seraku]

I'm thinking that's pretty significant. I think DC doesn't want to touch Earth-1 until it absolutely has to. It's probably something they want to treat very carefully.

my personal theory:

Earth-1 is us. only reason I can see for keeping it so secret

[DCKar2nist]

That would make earth 1 earth prime, interesting theory

[lawman]

Checking back to the updated first post, I find it interesting to note that at this point, out of 52 universes, only sixteen remain undesignated, and (since two have been shown but not named) only fourteen unused. Who thought DC would go through them so quickly?

Let's hope the multiverse will be left alone for a while now...

[IvCNuB4]

I noticed no mention of the Stan Lee DC heroes. Wouldn't they have an Earth? Is there an agrement never to use these heroes again?

Maybe Earth-6 as seen in Superman Beyond #1 ? They appeared to be Marvel analogues involved in a Civil War. Also seemed like they were being invaded by Durlans (Skrulls) ....

[Seraku]

Let's hope the multiverse will be left alone for a while now...DiDio flat out said they're leaving it be since Countdown beat it to death with readers. only multiversal plans is for some sort of special one-shot by Morrison sometime in the next few years

[Buried Alien]

DiDio flat out said they're leaving it be since Countdown beat it to death with readers. only multiversal plans is for some sort of special one-shot by Morrison sometime in the next few years

As long as it remains there for use when appropriate, that's fine. Just because there's a Multiverse is no reason it has to come into play in *every* story, but we also shouldn't revert to the Post-COIE model of, "What Multiverse? There never was a Multiverse."

I'd *still* like to see what Earth-1 is about, though.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Seraku]

Stan Lee heroes refers to the "Just Imagine" line where he created his own versions of Superman, Flash, etc.

[Alpinemaps]

As long as it remains there for use when appropriate, that's fine. Just because there's a Multiverse is no reason it has to come into play in *every* story, but we also shouldn't revert to the Post-COIE model of, "What Multiverse? There never was a Multiverse."

I'd *still* like to see what Earth-1 is about, though.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

QFT.

I'm still curious about Earth-2, as well. Did we ever get an official answer as to what was up with that? Do we know whether that's the same Earth-2 as the Pre-COIE Earth-2? Was there ever an explanation given?

I'm not necessarily convinced that the multiverse ceased to be after COIE, based on this story. Why should it have? It almost seems like the Source Wall went up, and while we were stuck looking at one universe, the others were still out there (at least 52 of them anyway). I know Rip Hunter had his version of what happened (end of 52), but, isn't that open to interpretation?

[Buried Alien]

QFT.

I'm still curious about Earth-2, as well. Did we ever get an official answer as to what was up with that? Do we know whether that's the same Earth-2 as the Pre-COIE Earth-2? Was there ever an explanation given?

Earth-2 was seen some months ago in JUSTICE SOCIETY OF AMERICA, when New Earth's Power Girl traveled there and found, among other things, an alternate version of herself (more similar to the old Pre-COIE Earth-Two version of herself than her current incarnation). This world is *similar* to the old Earth-Two, but there are some subtle, but significant differences. For starters, this Earth-2's Justice Society of America has renamed itself the Justice Society Infinity, combining classic surviving JSA members (which includes a Jay Garrick Flash very similar to the more familiar one) with members of Infinity, Inc. This world's Kal-L, however, is MIA. Overall, this new Earth-2 resembles what the old Earth-Two might have evolved into had the COIE never occured.

I'm not necessarily convinced that the multiverse ceased to be after COIE, based on this story. Why should it have?

The last five universes of the Pre-COIE Multiverse managed to survive the antimatter wave, but when the DCU was rebooted in COIE # 11, the implication was that they had been fused into the Post-COIE DCU.

But now, perhaps it's been revealed that that wasn't the case at all. Perhaps the Pre-COIE Multiverse worlds exist in addition to the singular Post-COIE Universe.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Munkiman]

Wait, Earth-22 was destroyed?

And Earth-Prime still exists?

[Hullababy]

The last five universes of the Pre-COIE Multiverse managed to survive the antimatter wave, but when the DCU was rebooted in COIE # 11, the implication was that they had been fused into the Post-COIE DCU.

But now, perhaps it's been revealed that that wasn't the case at all. Perhaps the Pre-COIE Multiverse worlds exist in addition to the singular Post-COIE Universe.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Wait towards the end of COIE it was still Earth 1 supes and Earth 2 jay garrick on the newly fused earth right ?

I thought they were later reformatted to fit the history of New Earth or post COIE earth.

If the pre COIE multiverse wasn't destroyed then shouldn't they have been on their respective earths rather than New Earth ?

[THEDOC]

So wher does Earth-Prime fit as it was indicated being re-established after Final Crisis so it must be one of the 52. I don't think the Multiverse as we knew it before COIE is back.