Official All-Star Batman & Robin #6 Thread (Spoilers)

[Captain Jim]

This will be the only thread on which we will discuss this book. Any other competing threads will be merged with this one. You are encouraged to direct your comments to this particular issue, if possible. If you just want to bash or defend the series, save your breath. Been there, done that.

Also, it's not particularly helpful (or interesting) to read, "I loved this" or "I hated this" with no explanation. What is it in particular that you liked or didn't like? And most importantly, insults and flames will not be tolerated, whether they're directed at other posters or at creators. Inappropriate posts will be deleted and may result in disciplinary action. Also, please keep in mind the other Rules of the Road (http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?t=175567). Sorry to sound so strict, but two months ago we had a lot of problems with the thread on this book.

[Kid Kyoto]

How come this comic isn't available in Red China darn it?!?!

[spidervenom]

I liked this issue I also wasnt expecting to see jimmy guess hes no supermans pal in this continuity.

[Chachi]

flipped thru it at the LCS - art looked pretty and they said the goddamn batman alot.

[Sabrinaset]

The first thing I noted was that it was there in the first place. I was like "Whoa! It was only last month that the last issue came out!" And I read it and yeah, Miller did use the term "G*ddamn Batman" a lot. A LOT. It's almost as if he's trying to make this be in one of those 52 Earths. There's New Earth, Earth-2, Earth-4, and G*ddamn Earth. It's really annoying.

I'm also ... I don't like how Batman ... sorry, G*ddamn Batman ... is becoming more and more like Rorshach. It would be so easy to satirize this issue, but I'm just not into it atm.

[Karl J Barnes]

The first thing I noted was that it was there in the first place. I was like "Whoa! It was only last month that the last issue came out!" And I read it and yeah, Miller did use the term "G*ddamn Batman" a lot. A LOT. It's almost as if he's trying to make this be in one of those 52 Earths. There's New Earth, Earth-2, Earth-4, and G*ddamn Earth. It's really annoying.

I'm also ... I don't like how Batman ... sorry, G*ddamn Batman ... is becoming more and more like Rorshach. It would be so easy to satirize this issue, but I'm just not into it atm.

How do you satirize a satire? Read the issue(or parts of it in the store) and am glad that I stopped buying it. I might,if I have the money, get the trade.

[Captain Jim]

The first thing I noted was that it was there in the first place. I was like "Whoa! It was only last month that the last issue came out!" .

Well, it's actually been two months, but still...

[jerrymcl89]

This was the first issue of the series to ship on schedule, so that represents some progress, even if it was two months since the prior issue. I expect issue seven will also be on time, but I'll be somewhat impressed if Miller and Lee manage to finish issue 8 this year.

There's not a whole lot of plot here, but there is great energy and gorgeous art. And the addition of the Millerverse's Batgirl is a positive development, since she's refreshingly upbeat and non-psychopathic. The portrayal of Jim Gordon also kind of cements the idea that this story does flow logically out of Miller's Year One.

By this point in the series, I would think people who just can't accept Miller's over-the-top take on Batman ought to have stopped reading. For those who are willing to go with the flow, I'd say this is an excellent issue.

[ultramandingo]

.........whats with the god dam jimmy olsen hanging out in god dam gotham? and god dam black canarys gotta off on the god dam irish spring god dam shtick , god dam

[the goddamn batman]

Wow... this issue was just boring.

The first few issues were interesting because it could have been going somehwere... but now it seems the only place it's going is 'HEy Jim, draw lots of hot chicks being really hot!'.

Boring.

I guess the trade might be interesting, but I'd sure love to read about Batman and ROBIN. Don't really care about Black Canary, or Batgirl. Even though I love Babs, it's just that, you know, Batman and ROBIN THE BOY WONDER... is well, supposed to be a ROBIN ORIGIN STORY.:confused:

[paulski]

After checking out the preview, I'm seriously tempted to go back and pick up #5 & 6 (I dropped the book after #4). Awesome covers on #6 to boot! :)

[Bradpinder]

I really enjoyed the book, the splash pages were fantastic, the side kick throught the cop car window is one I hope to see online soon so I can make it my wallpaper lol.

I liked the annoyance in Batmans mood with the copy cat heros, pissed at Canary, and yet he calls Canary ma'am, sort of you only see what I show you not what I really think, which i really like.

Babs outfit was awesome, love the stitch lines, makes it look home made or altered from a fetish store babs walked in.

The tri-chucks Canary used are too cool and a very under utilized weapon all around. Damn she looked good in this book.

Jocko boy with his snake venom poision causing him to halusinate.

Jims wife... sad and creepy, but very in tune and cool, oh also loved talking with sarah on the phone about takeing a baseball bat to Flass.

I dont care about the shipping shedual, never have, and I never really noticed all the 'god damns' till i read them on the boards here lol, I bet there wouldnt be so many if after the first few issues the fans exploded about the term... which is a line i think is hilarious when Batman said it.

[IamtheRock3]

yea whats up with Jims wife

Story need o mve a bit faster

[Bradpinder]

ok good im not the only one who noticed Jim on the phone with sarah who he must prefer talking with and ignoring his wife getting s#it faced straight off what looks like a hangover. Gothams cop wife gotta do what she's gotta do I suppose.

[Paul Dee]

It's a shame this title isn't monthly as the pacing of the story wouldn't be an issue then. Perhaps it's one that's better suited to a trade paperback.


I enjoyed this issue a lot. It really validated Black Canary's appearance in issue 3 and it was nice to see Miller's All-Star Gordon family. The line about giving criminals " a good crippling" (or whatever it was) really made me laugh as well. Good fun. I love his portrayal of Batgirl in contrast to Batman - the youthful mischevious teenager with a love of superheroes vs the more intense and violent grim avenger.

Forget whatever I said about this title when it was only up to issue 4 or whatever - once you get past the fact that this isn't really what the All-Star line is meant to be about and the fact that the books seem to be on a regular schedule now I think it's an interesting take on the Batman mythos which doesn't hurt the current books or damage the continuity at all.


Oh and, looks like the focus is going to be on Dick Grayson next issue so the plot should progress there.

[stamen]

Great art... pathetic story.

I absolutely love Frank Miller, but I honestly can't stick around this story any longer. It's a woman-hating, testosterone driven heap of goddamn profanity. He used the phrase enough to make it clear that he was trying to shake off readers that didn't care for his take. I am more than willing to turn the beautifully drawn shit heap loose.

If you like watching absolutely nothing unfold, check out the first six issues of this story. Lots of driving around, punching in teeth, and a load of bloody laundry to -- at least he didn't get any on his whites.

But if you want a story, I'd read something else, because so far, I've yet to see one. I mean is there a plot at all?

I've stuck with it long enough, because it's Frank Goddamn Miller. But, $20 later, I'd say I've more than overstayed my welcome with the title.

[Mia]

By this point in the series, I would think people who just can't accept Miller's over-the-top take on Batman ought to have stopped reading. For those who are willing to go with the flow,


I agree.

I think that not only is Miller spoofing himself. But he's also spoofing the 'writers' who were trying to mimmick his DKR. The book would have had greater resonance if it had come out pre-OYL.

That being said, I did not like this issue, primarily because I don't like or care about Canary or Batgirl (I) and there was way too much focus on both of them. I almost got the impression that that the whole issue was an excuse for Lee to draw hot women and for Miller to write about them. I wonder when Catwoman will be showing up?

I also liked the inner monolgue on the first page where Batman runs down the men he beat up who hurt women. I was very touched by that.



I still say that Frank Miller should have gotten the Wonder Woman book. Man knows how to write tough broads. :D

[pendragon]

This storyline is really going nowhere fast.
I think people are just buying this book for Miller's name & Lee's artwork.
Just not impressed.

[Captain Jim]

Truth to tell, I'm not reading it. :o

But I was interested in my retailer's take on it. He said you really can't consider this a Batman title; that it's essentially Sin City in disguise.

Now, I've never read Sin City, but I found that an interesting comment and wonder if anyone else agrees?

[ultramandingo]

Truth to tell, I'm not reading it. :o


........so you have no take on that spash page of the penguin ( nude , xcept for his top hat and spats ) and that bucket of half dead squid ?

[Sabrinaset]

But I was interested in my retailer's take on it. He said you really can't consider this a Batman title; that it's essentially Sin City in disguise.

Now, I've never read Sin City, but I found that an interesting comment and wonder if anyone else agrees?

Well, that WAS why my satire of ASB&R was called DOOM CITY, Captain Jim ... :)

[Captain Jim]

........so you have no take on that spash page of the penguin ( nude , xcept for his top hat and spats ) and that bucket of half dead squid ?

Heh, I did read the first several pages online last week, and I flipped through the book at the store.

[xarathos]

Truth to tell, I'm not reading it. :o

But I was interested in my retailer's take on it. He said you really can't consider this a Batman title; that it's essentially Sin City in disguise.

Now, I've never read Sin City, but I found that an interesting comment and wonder if anyone else agrees?

I never read Sin City. But does that mean Jimmy Olsen is going to die? Because that would be neat!:evilsmile

[Paul Dee]

Truth to tell, I'm not reading it. :o

But I was interested in my retailer's take on it. He said you really can't consider this a Batman title; that it's essentially Sin City in disguise.

Now, I've never read Sin City, but I found that an interesting comment and wonder if anyone else agrees?

Yeah, a lot of people refer to this Batman as 'Bat-Marv' too in the way his internal monologues and attitude seems to reflect the Sin City character. The portrayal of the Black Canary saloon was right out of Sin City too.

[the goddamn batman]

I think that most of Millers work has been SIn City in disguise. Consider that he took a 'Sin City' pitch to Marvel or DC before he even did Daredevil... and they told him to learn to draw guys in tights punching each other.

The Noir thing is what Miller ahs always wanted to do. Sin City is exactly that. Just over the top. I see it in most of his work. Only difference is that Frank has gotten more and more excessive over the years.

That said, this book is just boring. Nothing is happening. It's ROBIN's origin, and I'm not really getting any of that. He even ditched out on the Graysons killer to help Black canary. Not what I thought this book was about.

[Valen]

Before this books long break, I hated it and just couldn't get over the odd portrayal by MIller. For some reason, issues 5 and 6 have just clicked with me. Maybe it is because I am finally taking this story for the satire and parody that Miller is writing it as. I think part of the problem with this book is that fans have a certain idea of what they want Batman to be, and are unable or unwilling to accept the character written any other way. For better or worse, this is NOT the Batman that we have read for the past 80 years. Once I stopped trying to force this Batman into the previous mold for the character, the book became a better read.

Also, someone earlier in this thread said they don't like the book for it's woman-hating material. This book is quite the opposite. We are presented with three very strong and yet very different feamle characters. Wonder Woman is the achetype for the Man-hater. Black Canary is super-hero/robin hood of the world. Batgirl is the energetic and positive youth. All three contain strength of character. In addition, the Vicky Vale character is pure sex appeal, but she is in control of her sexuality and uses it for her own advantage. Batman himself punishes those who abuse women with a ferocity that I have never scene in a portrayal of the character before. Rapists and abusers get their teeth knocked in and many of their bones broken. In it's own way, this book is actually very pro-women.

[trickster]

Rapists and abusers get their teeth knocked in and many of their bones broken. In it's own way, this book is actually very pro-women.

Yes, because "kill the extremists" is such a sane reaction. :rolleyes: And people complain about violence and raped childhood. Holy hipocrisy Batman.

[IamtheRock3]

I agree.

I think that not only is Miller spoofing himself. But he's also spoofing the 'writers' who were trying to mimmick his DKR. The book would have had greater resonance if it had come out pre-OYL.
That being said, I did not like this issue, primarily because I don't like or care about Canary or Batgirl (I) and there was way too much focus on both of them. I almost got the impression that that the whole issue was an excuse for Lee to draw hot women and for Miller to write about them. I wonder when Catwoman will be showing up?

I also liked the inner monolgue on the first page where Batman runs down the men he beat up who hurt women. I was very touched by that.



I still say that Frank Miller should have gotten the Wonder Woman book. Man knows how to write tough broads. :D


Yea you run into promblem like this when your this late

[IamtheRock3]

Before this books long break, I hated it and just couldn't get over the odd portrayal by MIller. For some reason, issues 5 and 6 have just clicked with me. Maybe it is because I am finally taking this story for the satire and parody that Miller is writing it as. I think part of the problem with this book is that fans have a certain idea of what they want Batman to be, and are unable or unwilling to accept the character written any other way. For better or worse, this is NOT the Batman that we have read for the past 80 years. Once I stopped trying to force this Batman into the previous mold for the character, the book became a better read.

Also, someone earlier in this thread said they don't like the book for it's woman-hating material. This book is quite the opposite. We are presented with three very strong and yet very different feamle characters. Wonder Woman is the achetype for the Man-hater. Black Canary is super-hero/robin hood of the world. Batgirl is the energetic and positive youth. All three contain strength of character. In addition, the Vicky Vale character is pure sex appeal, but she is in control of her sexuality and uses it for her own advantage. Batman himself punishes those who abuse women with a ferocity that I have never scene in a portrayal of the character before. Rapists and abusers get their teeth knocked in and many of their bones broken. In it's own way, this book is actually very pro-women.


Listen I love this story

But it aint exactly a femnist stance. nothing wrong with that. Reading about insane nympho women, and kung FU hookers is what make miller great

But let us not make it more then that

[matt levin]

Hey,

Just want to reiterate that after that four--was six?--page view of the Batcave, I became a staunch fan of this title -- oh, this the Over-the..WAY-Over-the-Top Batman, and, in that frame of mind, have really enjoyed this occassionally published book (that's my big gripe now, the publication... uh, "schedule"). And I enjoyed this latest issue, too. Thanks Valen, for the cogent explication of the women depicted so far -- I like that, and agree!

Matt

[Valen]

Listen I love this story

But it aint exactly a femnist stance. nothing wrong with that. Reading about insane nympho women, and kung FU hookers is what make miller great

But let us not make it more then that

I'm not saying it is a femnist book. What I am stating is that it isn't an anti-women book as one poster referred to it as. Within the world Miller is creating, women exist on the same level as men, in both levels of violence and variety of character. Everything in this book is taken to extremes. We see hyperviolence mixed with satire with an ample helping of tongue-n-cheek parody of the Batman mythos.

My point is that this book just shouldn't be dismissed as an S&M medley filled with nothing but sex appeal and violence. There is much more going on within this book.

[Valen]

Thanks Valen, for the cogent explication of the women depicted so far -- I like that, and agree!
Matt

Your welcome!
:)

[IamtheRock3]

I'm not saying it is a femnist book. What I am stating is that it isn't an anti-women book as one poster referred to it as. Within the world Miller is creating, women exist on the same level as men, in both levels of violence and variety of character. Everything in this book is taken to extremes. We see hyperviolence mixed with satire with an ample helping of tongue-n-cheek parody of the Batman mythos.

My point is that this book just shouldn't be dismissed as an S&M medley filled with nothing but sex appeal and violence. There is much more going on within this book.


Well thing miller gets that wrapped due the fact very few women he writer that arent hookers. He made Typhoid mary a hooker when it nothing in her pass to suggest she was. Catwoman to a Think

Think the women in this story a bit tongue and Cheeks. You know the "MOVE OVER SPERMBANK" comment got to be taking as satire

But also just cause he want to see hot Crazy nympho babes. A book by guys and FOR guys, with mostly the dudes in mind.

And really who can blame him. Nothing wrong with that. Man write what he likes.

Although I admit

Vicky not as insane as the other though. She seem somewhat normal

Do agree most of these are charcter taking to extreme. It just with the women and (To be fair) when you look at the source material miller working with there a lot of sexual stuff miller can make fun off

The main guy batman taking to the EXTREM MACHO adolescent boy level, and the guys are whipped, or craze perves

[Young Avenger]

I didn't like this issue. I never liked any issues of this book but previous issues had lulz. None was found in this issue. The thing that really killed it for me is how self-aware the book has gotten. It's like Frank Miller knows that the book sucks and wants to join in on the fun.

[RangerNec]

I'd never even heard of this series before today. I read #6 and immedietly went back out and got 1-5. I guess I'm in the minority because It's among the best Batman stories I've ever read. I only wish I had heard about it later so I had more issues to read right now.

[shaxper]

I agree with others' sentiments that this issue lacked plot. It felt like a "bridge" issue, connecting #5 and the upcoming #7 without much substance, itself. Still, Lee's art keeps me happy, and I agree with Paul Dee that it did justify Black Canary's starring role in #3.

I'm very curious to see how Miller plans to balance all of these characters in one arc. After all this build-up, Dick deserves a little more than to share the secondary spotlight with two other vigilantees.

Also, for those of you expecting Batgirl to be non-psychopathic, I don't think it's safe to assume anything in this storyline. Miller could easily choose to make her even more sadistic than the goddamn bat.

[pendragon]

A lot of people are saying this is satire.

Are there any articles that support this?

These are what I could find & nothing imply this is satire, but Miller's serious take on Batman, which is pathetic.

http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Batman/AllStar/MillerBatmanRobin.html

http://www.newsarama.com/DC/AS/AS_Batman.htm

I don't think I'm missing anything here.

[colossus34]

All Star Batman and Robin and Wonder Woman and Black Canary and Batgirl and Super man and blah blah blah...is so beyond being a joke its tireing just mentioning its name.

Regardless, its obvious this title is NOTHING like what DC promised from Lee and Miller when it was announced(last decade) Lee said in interview it would be about Dick Grayson's origin story and follow his evolution into Robin in a very iconic but new and updated story.

So far we've had one issue and 3 panels with Grayson while the plot has gone on to introduce 19 other characters and sway into the realm of absurdity and farce on the heighest order. I stopped buying this I suggest anyone else do the same. It's WORSE than Miller's worst stuff---which is saying ALOT!

[Captain Jim]

Um, we've been doing real good on this thread so far; let's not quit now. No bashing for the sake of bashing. The last two posts are a bit borderline, but I'm going to leave them alone, because they do make a point.

[Captain Jim]

I guess I'm in the minority because It's among the best Batman stories I've ever read.

I'm not so sure you're in the minority, since it's one of DC's best selling titles.

[shaxper]

I definitely agree that this is in my top twenty best Batman stories of all time. I'm not even sure "satire" has been the correct way to define this story -- more a guilty exploration of an underside to the Batman mythos. It's not that the Batman of this story is a parody, but more that he's an exaggeration, which leaves the story feeling genuine even when it's being played for laughs. Miller and Lee are working together to take Batman to an extreme that I think we've all secretly longed for, even while making us feel really stupid for wanting it. This is the dark and sadistic side that the regular continuity Batman is a hero for fighting. Yet it's this dark and sadistic side that makes him attractive as a character in the first place.

I think, once this arc is concluded, Miller and Lee should work together to do an Ultimate Wolverine where he just runs around killing everything...

The goddamn Batman lives.

[Mia]

I'm not so sure you're in the minority, since it's one of DC's best selling titles.

I'm positive this book is doing welll for more reasons that it's writing quality.

Jim's Lee's art---and more to the point Jim Lee drawing Batman.
'Batjunkies' who will buy any book with Batman in it.
Frank Miller fans
The plain or silly story.

I really can't explain people's personal tastes. But I wouldn't call this a 'quality' read. And I like Chuck Dixon.

[pendragon]

more a guilty exploration of an underside to the Batman mythos. It's not that the Batman of this story is a parody, but more that he's an exaggeration, which leaves the story feeling genuine even when it's being played for laughs. Miller and Lee are working together to take Batman to an extreme that I think we've all secretly longed for, even while making us feel really stupid for wanting it. This is the dark and sadistic side that the regular continuity Batman is a hero for fighting. Yet it's this dark and sadistic side that makes him attractive as a character in the first place.

But again, where is this state by Miller that that was his intent?

According to previous interviews, this is a "serious" take on Batman. An "extention" of Batman Year One.

But that's not how it's coming across.

I could accept the fact this was an exaggeration of the Batman myths, if Miller stated that in interviews, but he didn't.

[Punch]

^

It'll be a romp. It'll be a lot of fun.

http://www.silverbulletcomicbooks.com/news/110495685967096.htm

[Captain Jim]

I'm positive this book is doing welll for more reasons that it's writing quality.

Jim's Lee's art---and more to the point Jim Lee drawing Batman.
'Batjunkies' who will buy any book with Batman in it.
Frank Miller fans
The plain or silly story.

I really can't explain people's personal tastes. But I wouldn't call this a 'quality' read. And I like Chuck Dixon.

The poster simply said it's one of the best Batman stories he's ever read. He didn't say whether or not it was the writing that appealed to him, just that he liked the product. And I stated that given the sales, he is obviously not alone in that regard.

[shaxper]

But again, where is this state by Miller that that was his intent?

According to previous interviews, this is a "serious" take on Batman. An "extention" of Batman Year One.

But that's not how it's coming across.

I could accept the fact this was an exaggeration of the Batman myths, if Miller stated that in interviews, but he didn't.

What would be the point of comics, literature, and art in general if you weren't free to make your own interpretation without the author's statement being on record? Regardless of whether Miller intentionally misled folks, changed his mind right before deadline, or was truly going for a serious Batman piece and we've all gotten something entirely different out of it, most people that are enjoying this title seem to be making the same interpretation. It just doesn't make sense to me to view it any other way. That's the best argument I can give you without knocking on Frank Miller's door and asking him.

Regardless of what Miller did or did not intend, I am thoroughly enjoying this story without needing to justify it to myself or make excuses for it in any way. I get it, and in the highly unlikely circumstances that I'm misinterpreting Miller's work, should that lessen the enjoyment that I'm getting from it?


^

It'll be a romp. It'll be a lot of fun.

http://www.silverbulletcomicbooks.com/news/110495685967096.htm

Nice find! Thanks for dredging up the link :)

[Mia]

The poster simply said it's one of the best Batman stories he's ever read. He didn't say whether or not it was the writing that appealed to him, just that he liked the product. And I stated that given the sales, he is obviously not alone in that regard.


But when someone states that a story is the ‘best that they have read’, it would be a logical conclusion that they enjoyed the writing.

And while I am sure the writing appeals to a great deal of people. I am positive that it is not the only factor why sales are so high.You would also have to factor in Jim Lee’s art, the fact that it’s a Batman book.

Do you really think that if Frank Miller was writing a similar story with a lesser known or famous character, say Booster Gold or the artwork was done by a less famous artist with less appeal (ie. Javier Pulido) the book would be selling half as well?

[pendragon]

What would be the point of comics, literature, and art in general if you weren't free to make your own interpretation without the author's statement being on record? Regardless of whether Miller intentionally misled folks, changed his mind right before deadline, or was truly going for a serious Batman piece and we've all gotten something entirely different out of it, most people that are enjoying this title seem to be making the same interpretation. It just doesn't make sense to me to view it any other way. That's the best argument I can give you without knocking on Frank Miller's door and asking him.

But you're trying to get into the writers head, when everything says differently.

[Captain Jim]

But you're trying to get into the writers head, when everything says differently.

Absolutely not. Did you even read what he said? He said, who cares what Miller's intent was, as long as people are enjoying it. If anybody's trying to get into Miller's head, it's you. You're the one who keeps insisting on an actual statement from Miller stating his intent.

Frankly, your repeated questioning on this is beginning to come across like you're looking for a fight, so I'm going to ask you to drop this whole line of discussion.

[shaxper]

Absolutely not. Did you even read what he said? He said, who cares what Miller's intent was, as long as people are enjoying it. If anybody's trying to get into Miller's head, it's you. You're the one who keeps insisting on an actual statement from Miller stating his intent.


Thank you.

[Captain Jim]

I'm positive this book is doing welll for more reasons that it's writing quality.

Jim's Lee's art---and more to the point Jim Lee drawing Batman.
'Batjunkies' who will buy any book with Batman in it.
Frank Miller fans
The plain or silly story.

I agree with you completely on the above. But I still think you were reading too much into that post when you conclude it was specifically praising the writing.

[Punch]

This issue was OK, some great moments like the "Eat glass, Lawman" kick(love the rear-view mirror) but I don't really care for Black Canary, and so far all she has done is beat up some people and ride a motorcycle. I like the idea behind her character here, though, and love her last line (though it was slightly overused in the rest of the book, hopefully this is the last we'll hear of it.) Batman being an influence, and not necessarily a good one, is something that was obviously a major theme of DKR, and it's cool to see it pop here.

Also if there are still people here who don't "get" the tone of the book, there's a clue in Barbara's room, which interpretations of Batman are on her wall? DKR and Adam West.

[sabongero]

Alright how come they didn't use the T & A shot on Black Canary. I mean that's what she's really there for right ?

[Rattlehead]

My girlfriend is really enjoying the book, mainly for the ass-kicking women being protrayed within, so I really don't think Miller is going for mysoginism or sexism. The women seem to be a wee bit more sane than the men so far, although everyone in this book is gloriously nuts. I'm loving it since it's friggin hilarious, and when you think about it is pretty realistic. A guy who watched his parents gunned down in front of him as a child and then decides to dress up as a giant Bat to fight crime has got to be unhinged mentally. That's one of the most traumatic things a human being could witness. Gordon is being portrayed as the hardened ex-military man he was shown to be in Year One, and I've always found Miller's Gordon to be far more interesting than anyone elses, his has far more dimensions to him than just doing the right thing in a dirty town. Miller's Gordon isn't afraid to get his hands dirty. This book is just pure fun, and full of crazy people doing what they need to do to get by a town gone mad.

[karaokefanboy]

By way of character development, Gordon's scene was the best of the series thus far, establishing in just a one-side phone conversation his dedication to the law, his dichotomy of thoughts about Batman, his keen detective skills (when Babs came in), that he's slightly a braggart (I beat up Flass with a bat myself once!), and ultimately in a heart-wrenching situation as perhaps one of the most politically powerful men in Gotham living in a run-down dive with a wife he doesn't love and with kids too vulnerable to the dark world they live in. Regarding Babs' "new" costume (Jim Lee really is just redrafted Miller's designs? Really? The guy's got nothing of his own to put on the table?), how many of us can just jump out of a window and swing around the city? It's one of those things that we've always embraced in comics, a gravity-defying law of unbelievable human strength that makes comics so cool in the first place, but contrasted with that very human and realistic Jim Gordon monologue, I found myself aback by the concept for the first time.

I might've missed it, but is the implication that Batman and Gordon have met yet or not? Also, while my temptation is to dub this issue as another non-story, in which nothing really happens (and the time line seems odd, what with Clark seeing Dick on a milk carton while Vicki is STILL in the hospital? That's either a long stay or a fast dairy!), if you look at this series as literally an "all star" phenomenon, exploring how Gotham would react to a "celebrity" Batman (urban myth cannot describe someone everyone knows exists!), then it's a bit more interesting, especially by way of that whole youth culture vibe thing Miller went for in DKSA.

[shaxper]

I was initially bothered by Babs' ability to swing out of her apartment window, too. But I think it was also a symbolic escape from gritty reality into superhero fantasy in a way. Besides, if 8 and 15 year olds couldn't swing from cables across the Gotham skyline with a small bit of training, you simply couldn't have a Batman comic book.

[Trey]

Love the first page : "oh, Hell..... Damn"

Last page: "oh, Sweet jesus....Its the Goddamn Batman!"

But nothing will ever beat issue #5. Comic Gold.

As another poster stated, I can't wait for the villains to appear.
Great art, not just pencil work, but Lee's panel choice, camera angle, etc. is spot on.

[zebop]

Truth to tell, I'm not reading it. :o

But I was interested in my retailer's take on it. He said you really can't consider this a Batman title; that it's essentially Sin City in disguise.

Now, I've never read Sin City, but I found that an interesting comment and wonder if anyone else agrees?

That's a fair assessment. If there were superheroes in Sin City, they'd act a lot like this.

Which is why given a choice between Frank Miller on ALL-STAR BATMAN and a new SIN CITY story, I'd go with the latter over the former.

While Miller may be having a lot of fun I don't think he's pushing himself as a writer here. He's graduated from the conventions of the super hero genre and it just seems like he doesn't take it very seriously anymore.

So if it's a goof to him, why should it be any different for me. I'm willing now to wait for the trade paperback. Maybe it'll hold together better when I can take it all in over one long afternoon. :rolleyes:

[Punch]

Sin City got really stale for me after That Yellow Bastard, so I'm much happier with Miller's Batman

[filthysize]

So who else is enjoying this title and don't care much for Jim Lee's art at all?

*raises hand enthusiastically*

Anybody? No? All right then...

[Punch]

So who else is enjoying this title and don't care much for Jim Lee's art at all?

*raises hand enthusiastically*

Anybody? No? All right then...
While I can't say that I don't care for Jim Lee's art at all, the only reason I'm reading this is Miller.

[ultramandingo]

......id rather miller was drawing it too . lees stuff is all style no substance

[kalorama]

So who else is enjoying this title and don't care much for Jim Lee's art at all?

*raises hand enthusiastically*

Anybody? No? All right then...

I'm waiting for the inevitable oversized hard cover addition, and Lee's art is the only reason why. The stuff he's doing here kicks the ass of anything he did in Hush or For Tomorrow. Miller's, shall we say, less-than-dense plotting style allows Lee plenty of room to indulge in big panels filled with kinetic figure drawings. Best stuff he's done in ages.

[Paul Dee]

I'm waiting for the inevitable oversized hard cover addition, and Lee's art is the only reason why. The stuff he's doing here kicks the ass of anything he did in Hush or For Tomorrow. Miller's, shall we say, less-than-dense plotting style allows Lee plenty of room to indulge in big panels filled with kinetic figure drawings. Best stuff he's done in ages.


Other than the last issue which I thought looked a bit sloppy at times I do agree with you. It's much more dynamic art because of the nature of the story. The only thing is that the contrast between Lee's more bulked-up superhero/sexy-gals-in-stockings art against Miller's more gritty story doesn't work for me (well, the bulked-up superhero stuff anyway). I think it'd look more suited if Miller was pencilling it himself.