Hyperion questions

[Ben Morgan]

OK I just started getting interested in the Squadron Supreme, and I found a bunch of different versions of Hyperion. Can someone explain these to me?

[StoneGold]

There are basically 3 versions. Although kind of three and three quarters. There was the original Hyperion, who was basically evil Superman in the Squadron Sinister, which was a fake Justice League, to battle the Avengers. Then it turns out the Squadron Sinister was based on an extra-dimensional counterpart, the Sqaudron Supreme, which basically looked the same, but with more members and less evil. And then there is the current Hyperion, who is basically Ultimate Hyperion.

And if that wasn't confusing enough, there was also the more recent evil Hyperion, who was basically the same as the old guy, but recreated, and King Hyperion, who was a completely separate other-dimensional counterpart who was a right bastard and tried to take over the multiverse.


But if you are talking about the recent Supreme Power/Sqaudron Supreme series, it's not really connected to the older characters, apart from being based on them.

[Samuraixsithlord]

well you have the first Hyperion who was a member of the squadren sinister and was a villian of the Avengers

the you have the the first heroic Hyperion who was the last surviving eternal of an alternate dimension who's and his evil protomatter doppleganger

The Hyperion of Supreme Power whos an unknown alien lifeform, and the evil Hyperion of the Exiles, also an unknown alien lifeform.

Finally ther was a new Hyperion in the new series of Thunderbolts but i don't know much of him

[Ben Morgan]

So the Hyperion in Supreme Power isn't related to the other Hyperions?

[CAPWOLF]

Vaguely...Hyperion was basically Marvel's Superman until Sentry rolled around.

I'll be honest though his history is so convoluted that it's going to take someone better than me to explain it all.

[Chiasm]

So the Hyperion in Supreme Power isn't related to the other Hyperions?

The Hyperion in Supreme Power is essentially the Ultimate version of the 616 Hyperion.

[Ben Morgan]

The Hyperion in Supreme Power is essentially the Ultimate version of the 616 Hyperion.
Is that the same Hyperion in the Hyperion mini and Hyperion vs Nighthawk?

[Cthulhudrew]

well you have the first Hyperion who was a member of the squadren sinister and was a villian of the Avengers

the you have the the first heroic Hyperion who was the last surviving eternal of an alternate dimension who's and his evil protomatter doppleganger

The Evil Protomatter Doppelganger and the Evil Squadron Sinister Hyperion are one and the same.

In any event, I think what the OP is looking for is something less complicated. There was an original Hyperion and Squadron Supreme in the MU. They came from an alternate universe though they had many adventures in the mainstream MU.

Much later, JMS started a storyline for the Marvel MAX line of comics, that was essentially a reworking of the original Squadron Supreme limited series by Mark Gruenwald. This storyline (entitled Supreme Power) was yet another alternate universe storyline, with characters similar in name and power to the original Squadron. As others have said, it was the "Ultimate" version of the Squadron Supreme (themselves the Marvel version, essentially, of the Justice League from DC.)

The Hyperion and related characters (Nighthawk, Squadron Supreme) that are currently appearing in comics are all the same characters from the JMS Max series.

[MaxofSteel]

Is that the same Hyperion in the Hyperion mini and Hyperion vs Nighthawk?

In my understanding of it, yes.

[Ben Morgan]

So Hyperion is just one character with a lot of versions like some characters have ultimate and 2099 versions?

[Cthulhudrew]

So Hyperion is just one character with a lot of versions like some characters have ultimate and 2099 versions?

More or less correct. (He's even got several iterations that have appeared in Exiles from what I understand.)

It's a combination of alternate versions (which is the case most of the time), and similar characters with the same name (as is the case with the recent 616 version from the Thunderbolts, who is actually a character with a similar appearance and powers from the Microverse, who was given the costume and name Hyperion by the Grandmaster).

[Expletive Deleted]

So Hyperion is just one character with a lot of versions like some characters have ultimate and 2099 versions?Yep. Same name, different characters. They're all broadly similar, in that they draw on the same archetype, but the details vary.

[Question_Authority]

I got a head ache reading all those Hyperion versions.:( :confused:

[Ben Morgan]

So the Supreme Power Hyperion is a totally different character, just based on the other one?

[Expletive Deleted]

So the Supreme Power Hyperion is a totally different character, just based on the other one?Yep.tenchar

[Ben Morgan]

I think I understand. There's the evil Squadron Sinister Hyperion, the hero from Squadron Supreme, the one from Supreme Power, and the Exiles one. Is that it?

[Jack-o-Lantern]

King Hyperion From The Exiles. He is said to have even killed Galactus in his Universe.
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l318/rave74/King_hyperion_.jpg
Mark Milton Good Hyperion From Earth 712 Based off of Superman and the Justice League.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l318/rave74/Hyperionmarvel.png


Zhib-Ran Evil of 616 actually killed Wonder-Man at one point
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l318/rave74/200px-Defender-13.jpg

Hyperion of Earth-31916 Supreme Power
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l318/rave74/0404SPOWER009_temp.jpg

There is another Hyperion that is blind in the Exiles, but i don't feel like scanning him. I dont even know what Earth he is from

[Cthulhudrew]

Zhib-Ran Evil of 616 actually killed Wonder-Man at one point

Almost. The Evil 616 Hyperion was a protomatter construct created by the Grandmaster that believed itself to be the Mark Milton Hyperion.

Zhib-Ran is the most recent 616 Hyperion. Introduced in the most recent volume of Thunderbolts, he is the last surviving member of his Microverse planet that was destroyed (inadvertently) by Genis-Vell, and was either given his powers and name by the Grandmaster, or perhaps just his name- I don't think it's established. Zhib-Ran is a member of the Squadron Sinister, but he doesn't seem to be evil; just committing some possibly criminal acts in the name of a larger good (which was keeping Baron Zemo from destroying the universe, though Zhib-Ran was somewhat misled as to the Grandmaster's true intentions.)

The protomatter Hyperion is currently deceased- he was killed in battle with the real Mark Milton Hyperion of Earth-Squadron. The whereabouts of the Zhib-Ran Hyperion are currently unknown.

[Ben Morgan]

So where's the Supremeverse Hyperion now?

[Expletive Deleted]

He's appearing in the ULTIMATE POWER mini-series.

[MaxofSteel]

Haven't been caught up on Hyperion vs. Nighthawk myself.

Is that still ongoing or is the arc over now?

[Expletive Deleted]

That particular mini-series is over, and I believe it's already collected in trade paperback form.

[MaxofSteel]

That particular mini-series is over, and I believe it's already collected in trade paperback form.

Cool. I think I'll pick it up then.

[Dorsai]

The Hyperion that appears in the Hyperion and Nighthawk trades (and also in Ultimate Power) is essentially the JMS creation of Squadron Supreme. It is probably not much of a stretch to say some of the groundwork laid in his work Rising Stars can be seen in this set of heroes. It is actually quite good.

For the JMS incarnation, you may want to look at the following trades:

Supreme Power Volume 1, 2, 3
This essentially shows the origins of the Squadron Supreme although this is really Mark Milton's story. It begins with him coming to Earth and follows him through childhood and his coming out so to speak. This series also introduces The Blur, Nighthawk, Dr. Spectrum and some other major players.

Hyperion
This trade picks up where Supreme Power leaves off. Although this focuses primarily on Hyperion, it does include other members of Squadron Supreme.

Nighthawk
This trade is a murder mystery of sorts and takes place after Supreme Power and Hyperion. Nighthawk investigates a series of murders and gets Hyperion to help out.

Squadron Supreme: The Pre-War Years
This takes place after the others and details the government's reaction to Hyperion's new status quo.

The non-JMS Hyperion vs. Nighthawk doesn't do a lot to advance JMS' storyline but is a decent mini. I don't think you will lose a lot if you skip this one.

Ultimate Power is an ongoing mini that features the JMS version of the Squadron Supreme (I think).

I found the JMS stuff to be quite good. I found I ended up liking characters like Hyperion but he was quite scary at the same time. The books take a more realistic look at what would happen if people with super powers showed up in the world. I simply can't heap enough praise on it. I found the Squadron Supreme JMS books to be some of the best I have read.

[Ben Morgan]

What should I read for the Earth 712 Hyperion?

[rwe1138]

What should I read for the Earth 712 Hyperion?

Mark Guenwald's original Squadron Supreme miniseries from the mid-eighties. One of the best series ever written, IMHO.

[Ben Morgan]

The Hyperion that appears in the Hyperion and Nighthawk trades (and also in Ultimate Power) is essentially the JMS creation of Squadron Supreme. It is probably not much of a stretch to say some of the groundwork laid in his work Rising Stars can be seen in this set of heroes. It is actually quite good.

For the JMS incarnation, you may want to look at the following trades:

Supreme Power Volume 1, 2, 3
This essentially shows the origins of the Squadron Supreme although this is really Mark Milton's story. It begins with him coming to Earth and follows him through childhood and his coming out so to speak. This series also introduces The Blur, Nighthawk, Dr. Spectrum and some other major players.

Hyperion
This trade picks up where Supreme Power leaves off. Although this focuses primarily on Hyperion, it does include other members of Squadron Supreme.

Nighthawk
This trade is a murder mystery of sorts and takes place after Supreme Power and Hyperion. Nighthawk investigates a series of murders and gets Hyperion to help out.

Squadron Supreme: The Pre-War Years
This takes place after the others and details the government's reaction to Hyperion's new status quo.

The non-JMS Hyperion vs. Nighthawk doesn't do a lot to advance JMS' storyline but is a decent mini. I don't think you will lose a lot if you skip this one.

Ultimate Power is an ongoing mini that features the JMS version of the Squadron Supreme (I think).

I found the JMS stuff to be quite good. I found I ended up liking characters like Hyperion but he was quite scary at the same time. The books take a more realistic look at what would happen if people with super powers showed up in the world. I simply can't heap enough praise on it. I found the Squadron Supreme JMS books to be some of the best I have read.
What about this one? (http://milehighcomics.com/cgi-bin/backissue.cgi?action=list&title=79056007912&snumber=1)

[Expletive Deleted]

What about this one? (http://milehighcomics.com/cgi-bin/backissue.cgi?action=list&title=79056007912&snumber=1)That's "The Pre-War Years," give or take an issue.

[Ben Morgan]

Gotcha http://www.ghostiesbungalow.com/files/ghostiesbungalow/smilies/sue.gif

[Shellhead]

There was another Hyperion that appeared in the Earth X trilogy. He seems to be based roughly on the Superman of Kingdom Come. This Hyperion is the guy wearing black and gold on this cover:

http://image.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/large/59950021355.11.gif

[Dorsai]

That's "The Pre-War Years," give or take an issue.

Just now getting back to this thread and glad you answered that one. I have the hardcover and didn't recognize the covers of the single issues off hand. I believe the hardcover has 6 issues so what is offered from the link seems to be about 3 issues beyond what I've been able to get.

[Chiasm]

I found the JMS stuff to be quite good. I found I ended up liking characters like Hyperion but he was quite scary at the same time. The books take a more realistic look at what would happen if people with super powers showed up in the world. I simply can't heap enough praise on it. I found the Squadron Supreme JMS books to be some of the best I have read.

Agreed. When it was actually coming out and it was still just Supreme Power it was far and away my favorite monthly book.

It lost a lot when the name change and team concept was forced onto it. I would have rather seen a gradual shift to that.

And now it seems to be in limbo except for a lame Ultimate universe crossover which cheapens the whole thing in my mind.

[Citizen V]

I remember there is a good Exiles fan site,that has information on characters.Anyone have the link?

[Jack-o-Lantern]

Sorry for the horrible scan....My scanner wont center right now. Here is the blind Hyperion....I dont know what earth he is from.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l318/rave74/scan0011.jpg

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l318/rave74/scan0009.jpg

[Expletive Deleted]

The "blind" Hyperion is the classic Squadron Supreme's Hyperion. His eyes were injured in a fight with the first Squadron Sinister Hyperion in Gruenwald's SQUADRON SUPREME max-series.

That may sound confusing, but it was basically Gru's take on a Superman/Bizarro fight in the form of Hyperion vs. his evil, artificial duplicate.

[Jadeskies]

The Hyperion that shows up in Exiles is an alternate reality version who basically rules a planet that is a nuclear waste zone and he is quite lonely.

He was bald and when Exiles were given missions he generally solved them quickly and brutally, mostly brutally. He decided to take over the world and killed a couple Exiles in an attempt to rule the multiverse (by taking over the exiles base which exists between realities) before being defeated by Barnell Bohusk (Mutant chicken boy with no powers) when Bohusk pulled 3 other alternate reality Hyperions that were good natured to the headquarters to fight bad hyperion. Hyperion ends up being put back on his wasteland planet.

Everytime something bad happens the Exiles check to make sure Hyperion is still in his reality where he belongs.

His body count was staggering, imagine superman without any morals.

[Jack-o-Lantern]

The "blind" Hyperion is the classic Squadron Supreme's Hyperion. His eyes were injured in a fight with the first Squadron Sinister Hyperion in Gruenwald's SQUADRON SUPREME max-series.

That may sound confusing, but it was basically Gru's take on a Superman/Bizarro fight in the form of Hyperion vs. his evil, artificial duplicate.


I am confused though because in the pics I posted one of them is the Hyperion from Earth 712. Hyperion 712 is the original good one right? The other one with the glasses is blind...so is he an alternate version of Hyperion 712?:confused:

[Expletive Deleted]

I am confused though because in the pics I posted one of them is the Hyperion from Earth 712. Hyperion 712 is the original good one right? The other one with the glasses is blind...so is he an alternate version of Hyperion 712?:confused:The image you posted is the cover to the "Alternate Universes" issue of OHOTMU from 2005. It's an iconic image, not a story image.

So . . . that's either "712" Hyperion from before he lost his eyesight (the glasses are in continuity, but not part of the "classic" look) or it's an alternate versions who looks just like him.

[Jack-o-Lantern]

The image you posted is the cover to the "Alternate Universes" issue of OHOTMU from 2005. It's an iconic image, not a story image.

So . . . that's either "712" Hyperion from before he lost his eyesight (the glasses are in continuity, but not part of the "classic" look) or it's an alternate versions who looks just like him.


They were both used in the Exiles to defeat king Hyperion. There were both said to be from different worlds. Thanks though for clearing that up.

[Expletive Deleted]

They are. That's the thing about Marvel's multiverse. They still have infinite earths.

The one with glasses is the original Squadron Supreme's Hyperion, as he now appears in continuity. The other . . . is from a different universe. I don't have those issues of EXILES handy, so I can't say for certain that he's not someone we've run across before, but he could be anything from a version of Hyperion who defeated his double without frying his eyes to a version with nothing in common except the costume and the powers. He's just your basic model Hyperion.

The Hyperions who matter have something distinctive about them (a different costume, a different accessory, a different haircut, whatever) to separate themselves from the generic template.

[Ben Morgan]

Now I'm confused, is the Hyperion with glasses the 712 hyperion?

[Shellhead]

Now I'm confused, is the Hyperion with glasses the 712 hyperion?

Correct. He is the same Hyperion who teamed up with the Avengers in #86, fought the Avengers in #141, #147-8, appeared in the classic Squadron Supreme 12-issue series by Gruenwald, and later came to Earth-616 to team up with Quasar.

[Expletive Deleted]

What Shellhead said.

Honestly, I think you're better off not worrying about which is which in the abstract. With the exception of EXILES, it's very rarely a problem figuring out which Hyperion you're dealing with in a given story.

[Ben Morgan]

Alright. Now about the Earth 31916 Squardon Supreme, is Supreme Power the name of the team?

[Expletive Deleted]

If you're talking about the characters who appeared in SUPREME POWER, its spin-offs, and so on . . . no, that's just the series title. The team's name is still "Squadron Supreme."

[bjtrdff]

There's a new thing called Wikipedia that's pretty good for precisely this sort of thing. Since 3/4ths of it is written by comic book addicts, it's pretty solid.

[Jack-o-Lantern]

Correct. He is the same Hyperion who teamed up with the Avengers in #86, fought the Avengers in #141, #147-8, appeared in the classic Squadron Supreme 12-issue series by Gruenwald, and later came to Earth-616 to team up with Quasar.


I think that Exiles story was jacked up. Because they were saying the one without the glasses was the one from Earth 712. They never stated where the one with the glasses came from.

They even introduced a later story Earth 712 and they re-introduced the Hyperion without the glasses as that Earth's hyperion.

[Ben Morgan]

Do all the members of the Squadron Supreme have this many versions?

[Expletive Deleted]

Technically, yes. Each universe with a Hyperion probably has a Squadron Supreme.

Practically, no. Writers seem to want Superman (and, to a degree, Batman) figures more often than they want the whole JLA. There are a couple extra Doctor Spectrums and Whizzers around, but usually only in the context of a Squadron Sinister team. And I think a Power Princess was (is?) a member of Exiles. The rest tend to only show up when the classic Squadron Supreme or the revamped Supreme Power version of the team is called for.

And I want to reiterate what I said earlier. 99% of the time, this stuff doesn't matter. You've got the evil JLA (Squadron Sinister), the good JLA (classic Squadron Supreme), and the revamp of the good JLA (Supreme Power). Those're pretty much the only versions that anyone cares about, and they're usually pretty easy to distinguish.

[MaxofSteel]

Do all the members of the Squadron Supreme have this many versions?

There's like, two or three other version of Nighthawk that I know of.

[Ben Morgan]

Technically, yes. Each universe with a Hyperion probably has a Squadron Supreme.

Practically, no. Writers seem to want Superman (and, to a degree, Batman) figures more often than they want the whole JLA. There are a couple extra Doctor Spectrums and Whizzers around, but usually only in the context of a Squadron Sinister team. And I think a Power Princess was (is?) a member of Exiles. The rest tend to only show up when the classic Squadron Supreme or the revamped Supreme Power version of the team is called for.

And I want to reiterate what I said earlier. 99% of the time, this stuff doesn't matter. You've got the evil JLA (Squadron Sinister), the good JLA (classic Squadron Supreme), and the revamp of the good JLA (Supreme Power). Those're pretty much the only versions that anyone cares about, and they're usually pretty easy to distinguish.The evil squadron sinister was the avengers villains right?

[Cthulhudrew]

The evil squadron sinister was the avengers villains right?

The first incarnation (and first appearance of the Hyperion character). The most recent version are Thunderbolts villains.

[Expletive Deleted]

The evil squadron sinister was the avengers villains right?They've fought a few other people, but yeah. Everyone loves a good Avengers vs. JLA fight, y'know.

[Expletive Deleted]

The first incarnation (and first appearance of the Hyperion character). The most recent version are Thunderbolts villains.Why distinguish between the two? Aside from the replacement members, it's the exact same team (http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix4/squadronsinister.htm).

[Cthulhudrew]

Why distinguish between the two? Aside from the replacement members, it's the exact same team (http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix4/squadronsinister.htm).

True, I guess I just don't feel as if the new team is quite as "sinister" as the old. The only really villainous one on there is the new Dr. Spectrum (Alice Nugent), who admits to killing just because she can. Of the others, Nighthawk is a definite good guy, Speed Demon is still toeing the line, but seems to be on the side of the angels more than not these days, and the new Hyperion (Zhib Ran) comes across as, well not quite a big blue boy scout, but as a guy who seems to want to do the right thing (save the universe) even if he has to ally himself with less than pure-hearted characters to do it (which, frankly, makes him more of a Thunderbolts character than a Squadron Sinister one).

The original team- mind-controlled or not- were pretty much out and out dastards.

[Ben Morgan]

I read that Hyperion is an Eternal, is that right?

[Expletive Deleted]

The classic Squadron Supreme's Hyperion is his world's equivalent, yeah. It came up in an issue of QUASAR.

[Shellhead]

Practically, no. Writers seem to want Superman (and, to a degree, Batman) figures more often than they want the whole JLA.

This is one thing that I find a little disappointing about Marvel. They created all these great characters during the silver age, but they also kept photocopying Superman and Batman. This has occasionally led to peculiar moments when two different distortions of the same hero meet up. For example, when Hyperion fought Gladiator in the pages of Quasar, it was like watching a warped version of Superman fighting Superboy. And for a few issues of the Defenders, there were two Batman-inspired characters on the same small team: Nighthawk and Moon Knight.

[Cthulhudrew]

The classic Squadron Supreme's Hyperion is his world's equivalent, yeah. It came up in an issue of QUASAR.

And (side note) Power Princess and her people are their world's Inhumans, as I recall (though I don't recall if that's from Gruenwald or from the generally bad Squadron Supreme: World In Chains, which had some interesting concepts, but then dropped the ball in a lot of ways in others.)

[Cthulhudrew]

And for a few issues of the Defenders, there were two Batman-inspired characters on the same small team: Nighthawk and Moon Knight.

Moench's original concept for Moon Knight wasn't really Batman themed at all, and he's spoken on the topic before (there's a really great interview with him out there about Moonie somewhere). Moon Knight was initially a supernatural hunter (specifically werewolves, hence his first appearance in Werewolf By Night and the silver and jet costume and weaponry- though many have tended to draw and conceptualize him as being white and black).

It wasn't until later that the Batman-esque elements creeped in, mainly (IIRC) from other writers playing more off of the playboy millionaire Marc Spector persona than his other personas and mercenary nature. If anything, Moon Knight seems to me to be more of a Christopher Chance or Nemesis type of character with more traditional spandex elements thrown in than anything.

Nighthawk, though, was always intended to be a thinly veiled Batman, later developments notwithstanding (such as they were- like the resurrected Death Seer concept of one of his minis).

[Ben Morgan]

The classic Squadron Supreme's Hyperion is his world's equivalent, yeah. It came up in an issue of QUASAR.
What about the Supreme Power version?

[Cthulhudrew]

What about the Supreme Power version?

Think "Kal-El" and you'll have it.

[Expletive Deleted]

What about the Supreme Power version?It's unlikely.

[StoneGold]

They created all these great characters during the silver age, but they also kept photocopying Superman and Batman.

Moon Knight, who was already discussed, aside, it's not like those characters existed for any purpose other than to let Marvel characters beat up on a thinly veiled copy of Superman. DC had the same type of characters, they just tended to be less memorable. Now, whether that was due to the quality of the knockoff characters, or Superman and Batman providing better templates to knock off of is a separate issue.