Chris Benoit commentary

[Deaconbluezzz]

Dear Sir,

I've been a visitor to this page for years now, but have never felt the need to contact any of it's staff until now. After a lengthy "Oh gosh, he really was a great guy" piece on Chris Benoit, you wound up the commentary with this update...

"Late date correction: what was really sad has become truly appalling, as the real situation has turned out to be premeditated murder with bizarre ritualistic overtones that now paints a picture of Benoit as a genuine monster. So his previous image is no longer overshadowed, it's obliterated. I feel ill."

Newsflash...his previous "image" ought to be obliterated. The POS not only killed his wife, but his own child as well. He doesn't need to be painted as a monster, he was a monster. Excuse it any way you please with every good deed in the book prior to this event, but when you kill your own 7-year old son...who apparently idolized his dad...you're a bigger monster than 95% of the folks currently on death row.

The whole worshipful tone of this article left me sick to my stomach.

Sincerely,
James Connell

[Steven Grant]

Understandable. I was still sort of numb when I wrote that, but the coda was meant not to suggest that Benoit was being tarred by some unwarranted portrayal of him as a monster, but to agree that he was a monster. I guess I fumbled that. Sorry. When I wrote the first bit as an early reaction mid-Monday, the whole thing was still shrouded in confusion and no timeline had been established. So there was more of a sense of sheer loss than of general horror, though of course even the immediate revelation of a double murder-suicide was horrifying. But that was still a point where you could imagine "excuses," which isn't the right word but they would mitigate things slightly - the scenarios that would not justify the events, there's no doing that, so much as make them make some kind of sense. Even roid rage would generate some kind of sense. There's a slight difference between someone who snaps and someone who's a total monster.

By Tuesday afternoon it was absolutely evident, no question about it, that Benoit was a total monster and that the murders were pure cold-blooded. Sorry if I gave the impression that I felt otherwise. But there was never a moment when, because he was one of my favorite wrestlers, I was willing to overlook that he killed his wife and child or interested in suggesting that his wrestling career was somehow more important than that. But had he simply snapped and killed his family, then hung himself for whatever reason, that would have been awful and terrible but it wouldn't necessarily mean I'd, say, never be able to watch another Chris Benoit match on tape anymore than Phil Spector getting convicted of murder would mean I'd never listen to "Da Doo Ron Ron" again. That's what I meant about the murders overshadowing his wrestling career. There wasn't any value judgment intended; it was simply a statement of fact. They would, and there was never any intent to suggest they shouldn't.

But... given the more elaborate circumstances now known, any value his career may have had in the moment is now completely obliterated, and there's absolutely no intent to suggest it shouldn't be. It should be. Having anything to do with Benoit matches is now the equivalent of buying a John Wayne Gacy clown painting. The mere idea of watching a Benoit match sickens me. I don't know about before that, but at the end, at least, he was beyond a shadow of doubt a monster, and deserves to be remembered that way and that way alone, if he's remembered at all.

We clear now?

- Grant

[stealthwise]

Strange, I got exactly where you were coming from in your short write-up, Stephen. Benoit was such a hero to me while I was still able to watch wrestling (the exploitation of Eddie's death killed it for me completely), but this... is just f-ed up tragedy. It's still hard to believe that Benoit was such a monster, capable of the most atrocious acts imaginable.

[Steven Grant]

Yeah, it's hard to shake some twenty years of following a guy's career in the blink of an eye, but that doesn't mean we're not horrified or that we feel nothing for Nancy and David. (I vividly remember Nancy's ring career as well.)

I see today the WWE is going around to talk shows (like ABC Good Morning America) and pushing hard the theory that the murders erupted from a fight over their son's genetic condition - so blatantly to turn the eyes of the press away from steroids toward some other hot tabloid topic - and they trotted Linda McMahon out to be the concerned feminine face of the theory. (Oddly, she's much better spoken than on WWE TV; maybe they should just let her ad lib from now on.) At this point I doubt we'll ever find out what triggered it, so I guess we're now officially into the wild tabloid journalism part of the story.

- Grant

[Deathstroke]

When it first broke that Benoit had killed his wife and kid, my first reaction was that it completely and utterly tarred his career as a wrestler for me.

I haven't watched wrestling in years, it's something that I just lost interest in, but when I was watching I really liked how he conducted himself in the ring.

Now, even seeing clips repulses me.

[Briareos]

Now it's getting really wierd. A IP address traced back to stamford conn. (Hq of WWE but not yet traced to the building of the WWE) posted 13 hours before the discovery by police of the deaths that Nancy had died on wikpedia.

[berk]

... the coda was meant not to suggest that Benoit was being tarred by some unwarranted portrayal of him as a monster, but to agree that he was a monster. ...I thought your intention was pretty clear when I read the addendum.

[Perry Holley]

Sorry if I gave the impression that I felt otherwise. Don't worry, your intent was clear.

Quite frankly, I'm not certain how the OP got the impression they did from what you wrote.

[Sabrinaset]

I dunno. When I was a lil kid, around four or five, I really thought the people on TV actually were who they were, and I remember being astonished when daddy told me that Worf didn't really look like that IRL, that he was some guy walking around in makeup and a head prothesis and was really named Michael Dorn. I couldn't get over that. I was actually depressed because of it too for awhile.

I think a lot of what's going around is the same thing, people who were so entertained by Benoit are now having to wrap around their heads the fact that the guy they really believed was a good guy was capable of killing his wife and son, then himself. The sheer amount of cognitive dissonance ... it's hard to take.

[bartl]

I see today the WWE is going around to talk shows (like ABC Good Morning America) and pushing hard the theory that the murders erupted from a fight over their son's genetic condition - so blatantly to turn the eyes of the press away from steroids toward some other hot tabloid topic
But that is the point. Benoit was not a monster. He was a human being, who did a terrible thing. And he continued to take the steroids, knowing that he could do terrible things under their influence, because he considered his wrestling career to be more important than his wife, his kid, or his sanity. But to just say "he was a monster" takes some of the blame away from an industry that insists on people working for it keep up an appearance which is physically impossible without use of illegal drugs, and then says, in surprise, "We never TOLD him to take steroids."

OK, maybe Benoit was a monster. But he wasn't the ONLY monster.

[Steven Grant]

But that is the point. Benoit was not a monster. He was a human being, who did a terrible thing. And he continued to take the steroids, knowing that he could do terrible things under their influence, because he considered his wrestling career to be more important than his wife, his kid, or his sanity. But to just say "he was a monster" takes some of the blame away from an industry that insists on people working for it keep up an appearance which is physically impossible without use of illegal drugs, and then says, in surprise, "We never TOLD him to take steroids."

No, it doesn't. Like I said, murdering your wife and child is a monstrous act, but a monstrous act doesn't necessarily make you a monster, it just makes you someone who under the right circumstances is capable of a monstrous act.

But dragging it out over a weekend, that pushes it over the line.

Honestly, I don't see steroids as taking an immediate role in this thing. His behavior was not consistent with the behavior of someone out of control on steroids. But we won't know until the autopsy is done. Which isn't to say the wrestling business (like the bodybuilding business, professional football, etc.) shouldn't be put on the spot over its emphasis on steroid mutants.

- Grant

[Citizen V]

The whole thing is very sad,and disturbing indeed.In a way,i dont think its Benoit`s fault.I would say its the steroids,but it isnt the first time steroids has made people do insane things.

Would stress and such also play a factor?Not the fact that Benoit was a hard worker,just the stress of working for the WWF.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

No, it doesn't. Like I said, murdering your wife and child is a monstrous act, but a monstrous act doesn't necessarily make you a monster, it just makes you someone who under the right circumstances is capable of a monstrous act.

But dragging it out over a weekend, that pushes it over the line.

Honestly, I don't see steroids as taking an immediate role in this thing. His behavior was not consistent with the behavior of someone out of control on steroids. But we won't know until the autopsy is done. Which isn't to say the wrestling business (like the bodybuilding business, professional football, etc.) shouldn't be put on the spot over its emphasis on steroid mutants.

- Grant


This is right on. Sadly the last theory I have heard is pretty much the one I think that will get the focus. Benoit seemed very ok when he showed up Friday at the doctor. He asked about his son and the talk from some was that Nancy wanted Chris home more for Daniel. But with his career being one the way it is...I can see the friction it caused.

The 2 had a horrible fight , Chris snapped and realized he had really taken away Daniel's mom. I'm sure he thought and realized that he would be locked away or put in the chair and who could take care of Daniel.

It doesn't excuse Benoit period. The man was someone I looked up to and he ruined that forever. I can't even watch a WWE DVD and see his image without thinkin of what a damn monster he is.

[Steven Grant]

Look, if Benoit had simply hauled off and killed her, I'd say he snapped. But we don't really have evidence of any "fight" that I know of. We don't know what happened.

Except that Benoit bound Nancy hand and foot before killing her. That's not "snapping," that moves into cold-blooded pre-meditated murder. I'm not saying he thought of it hours before he did it, but he clearly worked it out in his head enough that it can't be viewed as a crime of passion. It doesn't fit. And it completely makes it Benoit's fault, even if you can make an argument that it wasn't completely Benoit's fault, if you get the difference. At some point, he decided to kill her, and then he carried it out. She wasn't struggling or fighting back. She couldn't. At the point that he killed her, she was already helpless. So there was something going on there besides a crime of passion. It was too methodical for roid rage. His murder of his son was too methodical to call it roid rage, though I suspect he had convinced himself by that point it was a mercy killing - which doesn't excuse it. If he was that methodical, he had time to decide to walk away from it instead, and he didn't. The only possible (but yet unproven) contributory factor that I've heard so far that comes anywhere near mitigating is the possibility of long term brain damage from years of getting struck in the head - Benoit was famous for his ability to take a chair shot right to the skull - and subsequent untreated concussions. But this is highly theoretical - former WWE wrestler and sports medicine expert Chris Nowinski, who has been studying to long term effects of un-or-undertreated head injuries in athletes, proposed to and asked the coroner to check for damage in specific regions of the brain, but so far the coroner appears disinterested - and so far not supported by any evidence. All we know for sure is that Chris Benoit went home, bound and murdered his wife, then murdered his son, then hung himself, and he took his own sweet time about it.

- Grant

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Look, if Benoit had simply hauled off and killed her, I'd say he snapped. But we don't really have evidence of any "fight" that I know of. We don't know what happened.

Except that Benoit bound Nancy hand and foot before killing her. That's not "snapping," that moves into cold-blooded pre-meditated murder. I'm not saying he thought of it hours before he did it, but he clearly worked it out in his head enough that it can't be viewed as a crime of passion. It doesn't fit. And it completely makes it Benoit's fault, even if you can make an argument that it wasn't completely Benoit's fault, if you get the difference. At some point, he decided to kill her, and then he carried it out. She wasn't struggling or fighting back. She couldn't. At the point that he killed her, she was already helpless. So there was something going on there besides a crime of passion. It was too methodical for roid rage. His murder of his son was too methodical to call it roid rage, though I suspect he had convinced himself by that point it was a mercy killing - which doesn't excuse it. If he was that methodical, he had time to decide to walk away from it instead, and he didn't. The only possible (but yet unproven) contributory factor that I've heard so far that comes anywhere near mitigating is the possibility of long term brain damage from years of getting struck in the head - Benoit was famous for his ability to take a chair shot right to the skull - and subsequent untreated concussions. But this is highly theoretical - former WWE wrestler and sports medicine expert Chris Nowinski, who has been studying to long term effects of un-or-undertreated head injuries in athletes, proposed to and asked the coroner to check for damage in specific regions of the brain, but so far the coroner appears disinterested - and so far not supported by any evidence. All we know for sure is that Chris Benoit went home, bound and murdered his wife, then murdered his son, then hung himself, and he took his own sweet time about it.

- Grant

Whats really scary is the fact the last I heard Grant was that Chris may have tied and bound her up...after killing her. If they changed that scenerio then its been a few days since I really wanted to hear the grizzly details.

[Sean Walsh]

Quite frankly, I'm not certain how the OP got the impression they did from what you wrote.

This is something the mainstream media has been repeating ad nauseum since Tuesday: Dan Abrams on MSNBC has been quite sickening in showing his "shock and concern" at it: that the WWE paid tribute to a murderer!

What they're overlooking/ignorant of is that the first details of what really happened (that it was HE who murdered them) didn't come out until 10pm Monday night, more than halfway thru the tribute. They don't seem to understand that, at 8pm, the tribute began with NO ONE knowing what Benoit had really done. All they, and we, knew was that he was found dead in his home with his wife and son.

In fact, you could almost see where during the heartfelt tribute it turned into a fairly uncomfortable "Oh crap, we have to just finish this now, get it over with" program. The commentators weren't as emotional and talkative, Triple H's comments seemed fairly cold, and William Regal looked visibly uncomfortable while only speaking of Benoit in a professional sense.

People who say clearly weren't watching. (And don't care about wrestling, as the various news shows have displayed all week - factual data being wrong, uneducated questions being asked of wrestlers, heck at one point even FOX News were showing footage of Lex Luger and saying that was Benoit!)

When I learned of what may've happened (since it was pretty speculative Monday night), I got sick to my stomach and went to bed. Tuesday morning......every sympathetic thought I'd felt about Benoit changed for the absolute worst and I haven't given him any compassionate thought since.

[Steven Grant]

Whats really scary is the fact the last I heard Grant was that Chris may have tied and bound her up...after killing her. If they changed that scenerio then its been a few days since I really wanted to hear the grizzly details.

Like I said, until forensics and autopsy reports come in, which take awhile, we're at that point where people try to fill the lull with speculation, and generally the more lurid the speculation the more it'll be seized on. Like that story running about of Benoit killing either Nancy or David or both with his signature wrestling finisher, the Crossface Crippler. This blithely ignored that it was established from the start both were strangled or suffocated, but while the Crossface is a submission move it isn't a chokehold. He might be able to break their necks or backs with it if it were applied hard enough, and even that's not certain, but it'd be useless for suffocation or strangulation. It has obviously been thrown into the speculation mix to tart things up with a stronger pro wrestling connections by people who don't have any knowledge of pro wrestling or what various moves entail. So of course to them he could have strangled or smothered his family with the Crossface. These are people who "know," say, that TRANSMETROPOLITAN is a superhero comic because, hey, it's a comic, isn't it? I turned on TV on Wednesday to find all the "news" shows repeating the idiot rumor that Benoit was depressed because he's been "demoted" by the WWE - one said to a coach (he in fact had just been moved into a new position, which, yes, did entail basically becoming an "in-ring trainer" to younger wrestlers who needed training and experience, but it also entailed him getting a championship belt and becoming the focal point of one of the WWE brands, so to the extent it was anything, and as far as I know his salary, etc. were all staying the same, if not rising, it was a promotion), one saying "from the Four Horsemen to RAW," which is SO idiotic it would have totally destroyed her credibility had she had any (Benoit was in a late incarnation of legendary heel group the Four Horsemen eleven years ago, in WCW, a promotion that hasn't even existed for six years, and RAW is the WWE's top TV show). So far it's just rampant idiot speculation. Yesterday's "shocker" of someone posting of Nancy's death on Wikipedia turns out to be just some asshole wrestling fan in Connecticut who made it up to explain why Benoit wasn't at the show, and got lucky. (He claimed he got the news from the Wrestling Observer to try to cover his ass, but that was nonsense. Like that wouldn't be easy enough to check.)

The Benoit case so far is gaudy and lurid enough on its own without people trying to jack it up.

- Grant

[Rob on the Job]

Some of the things that make this creepier than your ordinary run-of-the-mill killings:

1) The Wikipedia entry about his wife's death a half-day before her body was found ... who knew? Who thought the most important thing to do was first amend a Wiki entry?

2) The WWE deploying into defense mode.

3) The fact that Benoit bound her and killed her first, waited a number of hours before killing their son, and a few more hours before ending his own life.

4) Victims in a routine murder-suicide usually are not bound.

5) Sherry Martelle, who was involved with Nancy Benoit's ex, dies of a drug a week before Nancy Benoit.

[Steven Grant]

Which ex are you talking about? Kevin Sullivan? They weren't involved recently, were they? That's creepy, but just coincidence. Frankly, anybody being involved with Kevin Sullivan always seemed a little creepy, but what the hey...

Hard as it is to believe, the Wikipedia thing is coincidence as well. Just a smartass fan getting clever, except he also ended up being right.

As for WWE, they've been through so many deaths of wrestlers in recent years, and the press fingerpointing that always follows, that they go automatically into defense mode. Same thing with their tribute to Benoit show on Monday. They're so used to fans screaming about them ignoring wrestler deaths - people spent the last week bitching about them giving no more than a nod to Sensational Sherri, matter of fact - that a major player like Benoit got the treatment quickly. And then they got the details, and looked like total creeps. I wouldn't think too badly of them for it. They were just following the standard playbook, but in this case it was the wrong play.

- Grant

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Lono posted this on the Wrasslin Thread at the TV/Film board. Here goes.

More notes from the observer

Some interesting points:

-Dave confirmed he used a form of the Crippler Crossface on Daniel. This is interesting since Bryan was adamant that the story was bullshit. Apparently investigators found marks on the boys arm and face that they didn't understand and upon watching a tape of a Benoit match and seeing the move it made sense. They just said it was a "choke" as to not further sensationalize an already sensationalized story.

-Dave said Bryan was closer to Benoit (he found his writing hilarious) then he was and that Dave hardly ever talked to Chris (while Bryan [in the new F4W newsletter] seemed to indicate semi regular contact). Thought that was interesting as we rib Bryan about getting all his sources through Dave but I never thought he'd have more access to someone like Benoit then Dave.

-Benoit got a prescription for the anti-depressant Zoloft (not Xanax) at the doctor's visit on Friday.

-Benoit started going downhill after Eddy died because he lost the one guy who he could confide in and shared his problems with. Apparently close friends always knew Benoit had the same problems as Eddy (pills, etc.) and suggested Benoit seriously needed to see a therapist but no one suggested it since he wasn't the type to be open to that sort of thing.

-Apparently the death of Johnny Grunge hit Benoit even harder then Eddy since they were neighbors and him and Nancy fighting was somewhat common and he'd be the one to come over and defuse situations and make Chris laugh. After he died, Chris didn't have that buffer when things got out of control.

-Chris and Nancy had recently separated for a period of time, and Dave received a change of address form for an apartment different then their house (I believe Bryan mentioned he got a different address too).

-Chris recently opened up a new life insurance claim naming his ex-wife and his older 2 kids as the beneficiaries and refused to include Nancy or Daniel.

-When there were rumors of him leaving for TNA, Dave asked him about it and Chris was paranoid thinking Dave had inside info that WWE was going to release him. He apparently may have thought ECW was a demotion and the next step would be out the door. He was reportedly obsessed with establishing himself at the HHH/HBK level. He had grown increasingly paranoid that someone was out to get him and didn't let Nancy leave the house at night or Daniel to play outside and would take different routes from the airport home each time in case he was being followed.

-Nancy confided to a friend in wrestling days before the murders that she feared for her life and the friend told her to go take Daniel to her parents place in Florida (as she had done before when Chris became violent) but she didn't this time. Apparently she had a lockbox at the bank with notes indicating if something happened to her, it was Chris.

-Theory is that she told him she was leaving him for good and taking Daniel and that's when he snapped on her. Loved his son and when she filed for divorce all he wanted was joint custody. Theory is he killed Daniel because in his mind he couldn't bare to let him be alone without his parents and in his condition so it was a "mercy killing".

-Someone in WWE informed Dave before the RAW show that Chris had killed them, but others in the company were unaware but at least someone high up knew before the tribute show was put on the air.

-Dave says he can't write a proper obit/career retrospect and doesn't know if he ever will.

It appears that Benoit was suffering more than from steriods and was mentally losing it. Its a shame whats happened. Benoit should have seeked help for his problem and is more to blame than ever for not.

[Steven Grant]

Yeeesh.

Meltzer has since clarified that change of address thing was just them setting up a drop box because they didn't want mail coming to the house anymore.

I wonder if whoever started the rumor that Benoit was considering jumping to TNA feels pretty crappy about it now, since that may have exacerbated a deteriorating situation...

- Grant

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Yeeesh.

Meltzer has since clarified that change of address thing was just them setting up a drop box because they didn't want mail coming to the house anymore.

I wonder if whoever started the rumor that Benoit was considering jumping to TNA feels pretty crappy about it now, since that may have exacerbated a deteriorating situation...

- Grant

Yeah I know. But Benoit seemingly had it planned Grant. He had his new Life Insurance policy listed to his ex-wife and kids.

[hyzmarca]

While there is a great deal of assumption that he did it, I'm actually gong to give him the benefit of the doubt. Many people have been accused of slaughtering loved ones before being proven innocent years later. It isn't an uncommon occurrence. With Chris dead, there will be no trial and no defense experts to examine the evidence. This leaves us with a rather myopic view of the incident.

[Steven Grant]

Given the context, it's possible but pretty unlikely.

- Grant

[dancj]

it wouldn't necessarily mean I'd, say, never be able to watch another Chris Benoit match on tape anymore than Phil Spector getting convicted of murder would mean I'd never listen to "Da Doo Ron Ron" again.
True - but I don't think I can every listen to Gary Glitter again since it came out that he's a paedophile

Dan

[Steven Grant]

Not the analogy I'd make, since I never listened to Gary Glitter in the first place...

On the other hand, I stopped buying or owning classical records conducted by Herbert Von Karajan after it finally came out that his Nazi past was considerably more voluntary than he had previously insisted it was...

- Grant

[bartl]

True - but I don't think I can every listen to Gary Glitter again since it came out that he's a paedophile

Dan
Hell, I haven't been able to watch a Woody Allen movie for years.

[mattx110]

Not the analogy I'd make, since I never listened to Gary Glitter in the first place...

On the other hand, I stopped buying or owning classical records conducted by Herbert Von Karajan after it finally came out that his Nazi past was considerably more voluntary than he had previously insisted it was...

- Grant

that man is a character... i bet him and wagner are chilling by the water cooler right this very second in some metaphysical realm.