RALLY THE TROOPS! Marvel threatens a *FAN* site!!!

[Uncle Nobs]

We need your help.

X-Assault--a game hosted by fans, for fans, at a fan site--has been threatened by Marvel's lawyers.

Nixonvision--the creators of this online game, who have never asked for anything in return for their labor of love--were warned to take the game down or else Marvel would take legal action.

Nixonvision followed all of Marvel's rules for runnning a fan site featuring their properties, and Marvel even featured a link to the game at one time.

It's arbitrary and greedy. Worse, it sets a dangerous precedent. Marvel could decide to take action against any fan site.

I'm no lawyer, so maybe my fears have no grounding in reality. But still, this is just WRONG.



Please, even if you've never played, even if you hate the game, visit Nixonvision (http://www.nixonvision.com/) to learn how you can help.

[The Fury]

After reading the site, That would be the Version with The Fury init.

I am outraged, I mean what harm is it doing to Marvel? if not, it's promoting them.

Why must Marvel do this? :confused:

[Crimson]

They'll be doing it cause some people may prefer it too their offical games... thats the only reason, now your forced to by the offical stuff.

So uncanny X-Men.net etc. won't be closed as it doesn't effect sales.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Odds are Marvel saw how popular the game Is.They want to own the game and make people buy It I suppose.It sucks but thats business.


The WWE went after E-Fed Wrestling sites for this very reason.That way they can operate thier own Fantasy League.Which they are gonna start soon.

[Crimson]

Odds are Marvel saw how popular the game Is.They want to own the game and make people buy It I suppose.It sucks but thats business.


The WWE went after E-Fed Wrestling sites for this very reason.That way they can operate thier own Fantasy League.Which they are gonna start soon.

Another wrestling fan I see.

It does suck but we're the ones that want Marvel to stick away and thats what their doing. Their acting smarter now and trying to make money every way they can so they never end up in trouble like they were a few years back.

[Uncle Nobs]

They'll be doing it cause some people may prefer it too their offical games... thats the only reason, now your forced to by the offical stuff.

So uncanny X-Men.net etc. won't be closed as it doesn't effect sales.

That's a valid point, but still...

1) It promotes Marvel's properties and generates interest among fans. I know that a few times while I've played it, some of the dialogue between various characters made me curious, reminding me of stories and titles I hadn't yet read.

2) It's a very primitive game, with almost no interactivity with other players. The "official" games that are designed for profit tend to be more advanced, include many more variables, and allow players to interact. As this game is designed, it's not much more than a simple diversion--no more complicated than a simple crossword puzzle. Fans know they can get a more satisfying gaming experience if they fork over the cash for a "real" game. As it stands, this is hardly any different than fans spending hours picking through UncannyX-Men.net's 'Cerebro Files' or 'Spotlight On' pages.

[DarkCrisis]

Bad move, Marvel, and bad form.

[Uncle Nobs]

Odds are Marvel saw how popular the game Is.They want to own the game and make people buy It I suppose.It sucks but thats business.

I could accept that, if that were the case. But it's not.

Marvel hasn't made any offers to Nixonvision. Just threats.

If Marvel wanted to own the game, they'd have to buy it from Nixonvision.

If Marvel wanted to develop an identical game--or just a game similar enough that they feared X-Assault might compete with it--it would be far more cost-effective for them to buy it from Nixonvision than to spend the countless hours it would take to develop the game from scratch.

[Brian Cronin]

I totally agree that people should write in and tell Marvel to stop being such hardasses.

With that being said, the law is pretty much on Marvel's side. They were willing to look the other way before (as they should), and now they're not.

So the cause really here is to get Marvel to (as they should) go BACK to looking the other way.

-Brian

[DDM]

Marvel is really smart at pissing on their fans.

[Evan Grubbs]

This isn't the first time either.

I used to go to lots of sites that had X-related games, info, and other good stuff, and they were all shut down by Marvel.

I can't find the links, but I do remember it happening.

[Tag06]

Marvel!! curse you!! Damn those money hungry bastards. DC is looking better and better these days.

[Beast]

Honestly, I can see both sides of it. Even if X-Assault isn't making much money off this, they're still using copyrighted characters for a game that Marvel has no control over it's content. It sets a bad precedent, where everyone could do something like this without having to reach a licensing agreement with Marvel Comics. If they let one place get away with using it's characters, art, and such for entertainment...it sets a bad precedence that can be used to justify it by others. It's no different then those first person shooter hacks that were using copyrighted characters. Should Marvel back off a little and try to reach an agreement with them, yes? But I wouldn't make Marvel out to be an evil mustache twirling villian in this case.

[Doom Hammer]

I dunno, seems pretty shady to me. What, Marvel isnt making enough money with their multi-dozen-million dollar movie?

But Marvel HAS the right to take legal action, even though it is sorta lame.

[Uncle Nobs]

True, true... The law is very clearly on Marvel's side here. It's their right.

But I can't help but be annoyed. Nixonvision submitted their application to be considered an official fan site by Marvel on day one. They followed all of Marvel's rules. I mean literally. Several years ago, Marvel released their rules for fan sites to follow. Nixonvision followed the rules exactly. They were respectful and fair.

Marvel, on the other hand, refused to reply to Nixonvision's application or subsequent inquiries. Marvel's only response was a link featured on Marvel's own site, guiding their own fans to X-Assault. Then, YEARS LATER, one day out of the blue, Marvel drops Nixonvision a letter saying, "By the way, we're going to sue your penniless asses if you don't stop this instant. We didn't bother telling you this YEARS AGO when you could have saved yourself untold time and money because we don't have to. We're Marvel, be-yotch! We don't even have to play by our own rules, and we don't give a damn about your love for our characters and how well you freely promote them for us. Now bend over and take your medicine."



...So I took some liberties, so what? You get the idea.

[bakla]

While we sometimes tend to think of Marvel as one unified entity that we can like or deplore in one fell swoop, I can imagine some newcomers (with just enough power) to their legal staff making an issue of what was a non-issue before. Or maybe they're finding the site to be more successful than they imagined it *should* be and are suddenly getting greedy face. Could be so many reasons, and sadly, Marvel's previous blind eye to the fan site might have been the exception to what would be their normal reaction.

[Uncle Nobs]

While we sometimes tend to think of Marvel as one unified entity that we can like or deplore in one fell swoop, I can imagine some newcomers (with just enough power) to their legal staff making an issue of what was a non-issue before. Or maybe they're finding the site to be more successful than they imagined it *should* be and are suddenly getting greedy face. Could be so many reasons, and sadly, Marvel's previous blind eye to the fan site might have been the exception to what would be their normal reaction.

True enough, George, but...

1) Whoever is responsible for the decision, it is now Marvel's (as a unified corporate entity) official position.

2) Even if Marvel is surprised by Nixonvision's "success", they're only being successful at promoting Marvel's properties and getting more and more people involved in the geek orgy. They receive NOTHING in return.

3) It's still such bad form. Not only is it sudden, not only is it inconsistent with their policies and previous course of action in this particular case, but it clearly sends a message to all fans: "Watch out. Because while we want you to become absolutely addicted to our brand, if you dare to have a little fun with our toys--playing by the rules we established--we will shut you down."

[bakla]

No arguments here, Nobs. Just imagining the other side of a rather unfortunate situation - having been on the negative end of Marvel's (as a company's) actions myself, despite positive relations with some of their employees. Speaking from experience, it personally makes it harder for one to reconcile loving the comics when you can't stand the company that puts them out.

[Uncle Nobs]

Our friendship is saved! *Whew!* Close call! :rolleyes:

What? You still think it wasn't pure coincidence that Marc Silvestri designed the exact same costume you did, right after you did, right after Claremont asked you to design it? Oh, get real. These things happen. You and Silvestri are obviously likeminded creative types. Absolutely innocent. :p

[bakla]

To his credit, the thong was different. :rolleyes:

:aside: Man, married life is making you post more...

[Uncle Nobs]

Re: posting more

That's about to change. Big changes ahead. I'll tell everyone about it in X-Cres when I have time.



...oh yeah... um, BOO MARVEL! (I am NEVER off-topic!) :D

[bakla]

What?!? You can't be leaving? DON'T LEAVE US, NOBS! Because then, Marvel would have won!! DON'T DO IT, MAN!




somewhat on topic in a vaguely unrelated way...

[Beacon]

...So I took some liberties, so what?

Nah, that's pretty much exactly like what Marvel did to Jim :mad:

[For the Good of X]

I read about this story elsewhere and while the situation is sad on all sides...it's not like another version of this won't be started up in some other form/guise?

Just as Napster went down to the RIAA...other services replaced it. It's cyclical.

[Beacon]

I read about this story elsewhere and while the situation is sad on all sides...it's not like another version of this won't be started up in some other form/guise?

Just as Napster went down to the RIAA...other services replaced it. It's cyclical.

But it won't, you see. I used to work with Jim (the guy who made the game) over at CXF. Having this happen was one of the many things that's happened of late that drove him away from reading comics.

[satchmo the dragon]

The WWE went after E-Fed Wrestling sites for this very reason.That way they can operate thier own Fantasy League.Which they are gonna start soon.
Is this true and where did you hear that?

[hydro123456]

Crap, I always hear about these things after they get shutdown. Anyone know if theres still a way to download it?

[FuzzyLogic]

Here's Marvel's problem with this game. When you create something (like a comics universe and the characters in it) you own it. No one else is allowed to use that world or those characters without your permission. It doesn't matter if they are making money, or the fans really like itm or whatever. X-Assault is an unauthorized use of copyright.

To make matters worse, even if Marvel looks at what they are doing and likes it and thinks it is good for the fans, they still have to shut it down. In copyright law, if you don't defend your copyright when it is being infringed, you lose it. If Marvel does not go after "little guys" like this, then when others want to use their characters without permission, it becomes harder for Marvel to stop it.

This is not Marvel being a bad guy. Try the same thing with any other property (Disney, the NFL, NASCAR, Lord of the Rings, you name it) and the lawyers will be down on your head quickly. Sorry to rain on the parade of anyone who is a fan of this game (and it looks like fun), but no amount of pleading or threatening Marvel is going to save this one.

[I_am_scifi]

Okay, this is truly starting to get out of hand. While Marvel does have every right to shut down a site dealing with its copyrighted characters if they see it as a threat, this game is far from a threat. Sure, it's a fan game that plenty of people play. But is that not a good thing? I am sure there have been at least a few people who found this game first, and then started collecting comics on a regular basis.

If Marvel wishes to buy this game and use it as their own, that is one thing. Chances are it would not be nearly as popular as the free version, but that's not the point. The point is: Marvel is giving us another reason to dislike them. Us, the fans, are being mistreated once more. Shutting down a fan site that is perfectly in compliance with the company's rules on such site is simply a shame.

They don't care about the fans. They care about the money. It has never been clearer than right now. Sure, we've known this for years, but there was still a sliver of hope that Marvel did indeed still look for our respect along with our money.

Any respect we might have though we had is now a memory. We are not allwoed ot be fans. We are merely numbers. We are not allowed to do anything Marvel does not want us to do with their characters, even if there is no malicious intent involved. The game has neevr made a dime off it. It never will. And because it's not making any money for Marvel, it needs to be weeded out.

For shame Marvel. For shame. I honestly thought you had matured a bit over the years. Guess I was wrong.

DC's next with their ban on fanfilms. Wait and see.

[Brian Cronin]

In copyright law, if you don't defend your copyright when it is being infringed, you lose it.

Trademark, not copyright.

You can let people use your copyrights without any danger of you losing them.

The only possible negative that you would face is the inability to, in the future, make the SAME copyright argument about a similar copyright violation (as the people would be able to say, "Marvel lets fans make not-for-profit online video games."

The way around THAT is for Marvel to specifically say, "We're giving X-Assault permission to use our copyrights."

Then Marvel would be protected against any future violations by OTHER people.

-Brian

[Steven F.]

I'm sorry, I LOVED this game, but Marvel DOES have every right to shut it down, and to be honest, it is in the best interests of Marvel to do so. Marvel is a BUSINESS and they are there to make money. This is something that MAY or MAY NOT lose money for Marvel, because the game was extremely popular, and could cause people to download this free game, instead of buying the ones that are in stores. Sad as it is for us fans of X-Assualt, but the truth hurts sometimes.

Steven

[Beacon]

Here's Marvel's problem with this game. When you create something (like a comics universe and the characters in it) you own it. No one else is allowed to use that world or those characters without your permission. It doesn't matter if they are making money, or the fans really like itm or whatever. X-Assault is an unauthorized use of copyright.

The thing is that they DID have Marvel’s permission. They jumped through all the hoops they had to in order to become an official Marvel fansite when they first came out.

[Brian Cronin]

The thing is that they DID have Marvel’s permission. They jumped through all the hoops they had to in order to become an official Marvel fansite when they first came out.

Right.

Which is why it's so jerkish.

I am pretty sure Marvel has the pretty well-reserved right to REVOKE that permisision, but to do so is a real jerkish thing....so that's why we all have to write to them to tell them that it is a jerkish move!!!

-Brian

[LoneWolf21]

After months of waiting an update from the official site....with a hint of light at the end of the tunnel?

http://www.nixonvision.com/

[roguestorm]

We need your help.

X-Assault--a game hosted by fans, for fans, at a fan site--has been threatened by Marvel's lawyers.

Nixonvision--the creators of this online game, who have never asked for anything in return for their labor of love--were warned to take the game down or else Marvel would take legal action.

Nixonvision followed all of Marvel's rules for runnning a fan site featuring their properties, and Marvel even featured a link to the game at one time.

It's arbitrary and greedy. Worse, it sets a dangerous precedent. Marvel could decide to take action against any fan site.

I'm no lawyer, so maybe my fears have no grounding in reality. But still, this is just WRONG.



Please, even if you've never played, even if you hate the game, visit Nixonvision (http://www.nixonvision.com/) to learn how you can help.



is marvel losing alot of money now or something? why have they suddenly become so desprete to sue any tom dick and harry that has anything affilated with them without payment?

[RED KING]

Well, Stan Lee is getting a sudden cut of the movies featuring characters he helped create. And the books are generaly in a downward spiral quality-wise...

Generaly sepaking, I'm inclined to think the trademark/copyright lawyers in the over-all entertainment industry are insturcted to hit fansites with more or less random threats as general chest thumping. I'm sure most of you have heard of simmiler issues with Star Trek and Harry Potter sites. Marvel's not the only one shooting themselves in the foot. If this game site was following all the guidelines, they at LEAST deserve an explination rather than the formletter from the lawyers.

[gambitsgurl]

It's like they are turning into Disney! :mad:

[Fede]

when did marvel care for their fans? they only care for the money. they are furious they cant get any money with that game, wich i've played and its great

i marvel could read this....U SUCK

[comicartfan]

Has anyone heard any news regarding nixonvision? Their site is down. was hoping marvel gave them a break.

[Corey Dreher]

Well we could make a petion.

[hoopoe]

The site's been pulled down.

If Marvel had a fraction of a brain, they would strike a deal with Nixonvision and bring them on board rather than sending a C and D order.

[comicartfan]

i used to have the first edition of the game, but sadly no more, it was a blast to play. shame that marvel has to be so crappy about it. does anyone have a copy they would be willing to share? p.m. me if there is any way i could get a copy , doesn't matter which version.

[Uncle Nobs]

I don't know how anybody could look at this and not immediately be struck by the phrase 'bite the hand that feeds you'. It's just too bad that we comix fans are too disorganized and argumentative to send Marvel a clear message with our money.

[Faded]

I miss X-Assault!!! Fun game, even though I suck (times 3) at trivia.

[cable guy]

That's a valid point, but still...

1) It promotes Marvel's properties and generates interest among fans. I know that a few times while I've played it, some of the dialogue between various characters made me curious, reminding me of stories and titles I hadn't yet read.

I see where Marvel is coming from, but...

I wish Marvel would see this is a good thing, and stop feel threatened they are losing a couple of bucks as opposed to gaining all new fan interest. Which would lead to alot more money.

[Porcelain]

After reading the site, That would be the Version with The Fury init.

I am outraged, I mean what harm is it doing to Marvel? if not, it's promoting them.

Why must Marvel do this? :confused:
At a guess I'd say Marvel are thinking or are about to bring out their own on subscription, so they're looking to cull the free competition before hand.

Is it a role playing thing? Or an actual online game?

edit: Oops old post, sorry didn't realise.

[The Lucky One]

It's an online game that's kind of like an RPG. Basically, you play a student at Xavier's who wakes up one day to find every other person in the mansion gone without a trace. You call all the affiliate X-teams, nothing. But four X-baddies use the absence to start wreaking havoc. Cerebro has enough charged energy to locate and attempt to contact 8 different mutants, so a screen full of ever-shifting pictures floats in front of you, and you try to stop on the one you want (or just randomly click the spacebar), then answer a trivia question about that mutant to recruit them. Miss it, they're no longer available to be recruited. After using your 8 tries, you assemble a team of 5 and send them out after the bad guys. Each character has stats in four areas (strength, fighting, intelligence, energy), so you match yours up against the bad guy and try to make sure you come out on top. You sort of have to play it to figure it out, but it's a fun game, and the minigames (recruit Xavier and Bishop on the same team and you can go to the Age of Apocalypse and use those characters for a while) are awesome. Damn shame about it getting shut down.

-D

[The Fury]

edit: Oops old post, sorry didn't realise.
Tell, me about it.

Hey TLO, you still play This a fair bit right?

[The Lucky One]

Yeah, not in recent weeks (got a few new Gamecube games), but I did up until then. Why do you ask?

-D

[The Fury]

Yeah, not in recent weeks (got a few new Gamecube games), but I did up until then. Why do you ask?

-D
Just wondering.

Every now and then you'd mention it in X-cres.

[Porcelain]

Cheers for the explanation.

[Chou Blaster]

Ok I see why Marvel would do it (Copyright laws.)

BUT: The site is not maknig any money, no ris it hurting Marvel, so it's just plain lame.

[slively]

We need your help.

X-Assault--a game hosted by fans, for fans, at a fan site--has been threatened by Marvel's lawyers.

Nixonvision--the creators of this online game, who have never asked for anything in return for their labor of love--were warned to take the game down or else Marvel would take legal action.

Nixonvision followed all of Marvel's rules for runnning a fan site featuring their properties, and Marvel even featured a link to the game at one time.

It's arbitrary and greedy. Worse, it sets a dangerous precedent. Marvel could decide to take action against any fan site.

I'm no lawyer, so maybe my fears have no grounding in reality. But still, this is just WRONG.



Please, even if you've never played, even if you hate the game, visit Nixonvision (http://www.nixonvision.com/) to learn how you can help.


You know that Marvel did this very same thing with City of Heroes? And that game did not feature Marvel characters outright. However Marvel felt that the similiarities were close enough to their characters that it was an infringement.

[Beast]

Ok I see why Marvel would do it (Copyright laws.)

BUT: The site is not maknig any money, no ris it hurting Marvel, so it's just plain lame.
Actually they were accepting donations, so they were making some money.

[Chou Blaster]

Actually they were accepting donations, so they were making some money.


But does it make as much as say Marvel? or DC? or HURT their business?

But yeha they will win due to the Copyright Laws an dthe donations/money.

But my point is this: Marvel should show more than enough respect to not attack fan sites. It make sthem look like penny pinching bastards who have no respect for fans.

And it's FANS who buy their damn comic books and keep their company going.

[Cowlander]

But does it make as much as say Marvel? or DC? or HURT their business?

But yeha they will win due to the Copyright Laws an dthe donations/money.

But my point is this: Marvel should show more than enough respect to not attack fan sites. It make sthem look like penny pinching bastards who have no respect for fans.

And it's FANS who buy their damn comic books and keep their company going.
doesnt matter how much moneu its making. Its not licensed as a charitable oranization so any donations they take make them for profit. I'm BS'n the legalese but something like that.

I heard it was a good game. But Marvel or any company has to pursue any potential infringements on copyright. If you go after the small guys a big guy can say and win on the grounds that"they didnt pursue them, what makes us any different" thats the wy it goes. People were explaining over on the rama when the marvel vs CoH lawsuit was getting underway.

[Uncle Nobs]

I'm always surprised when this old thread winds up on the first page of the boards, but I'm glad to see we're still ticked off by it.

So has anyone actually DONE anything about this? How many of you have written Marvel?

[Romus]

Is the site down? I want to see the game but can't find it. Anyone have it or link it?

[The Lucky One]

Is the site down? I want to see the game but can't find it. Anyone have it or link it?

Did you read this thread? The whole reason people are complaining is because Marvel shut down the site- you can't download X-Assault anymore. It's a damn shame, but...

EDIT: However, you can take a look at what the game looked like by going to this site:

http://www.xassault.net/

It's not up-to-date with the most recent version of the game (which was being beta-tested when Marvel shut them down), but it's pretty comprehensive.

-D

[Novaya Havoc]

You know that Marvel did this very same thing with City of Heroes? And that game did not feature Marvel characters outright. However Marvel felt that the similiarities were close enough to their characters that it was an infringement.

Dude, Marvel shut down my Dazzler site one time. Marvel goes in spurts about online fan-site policies.

X-Assault was a decent game. Special Encounter KOs were lame, IMO. Nothing special (I wish they'd speed up the "battles") but seriously nothing to go all nutso copyright over.

-BR

[Faded]

I'm always surprised when this old thread winds up on the first page of the boards

*shamedly raises hand*

EDIT: However, you can take a look at what the game looked like by going to this site:

http://www.xassault.net/

Cool. I thought even the site got shut down.

[Jim Lemoine]

Just stumbled across this thread - I know it's highly dated and I know that everybody's moved on (myself included), but as the guy who wrote and designed and fought Marvel over X-Assault, just wanted to thank you guys.

I don't even read comics anymore and haven't been on the net much in several months (I live in Louisiana, and Katrina hit me hard), but I still get lots of e-mails requesting the X-Assault files on a disturbingly regular basis. And it just kills me that I've got this kick-ass new version that nobody's ever seen (well, except for a few beta-testers) sitting on my hard drive.

So, again, thanks. Wish it hadn't ended the way it did. For those who played the game, I'll be posting some explanation on NixonVision of what was in the update, and what the overall story was soon. For those who didn't... well, there's always the file-sharing networks, I guess....

[Uncle Nobs]

Hey Jim! Thanks for finding my old thread and makin' with the update.

I really enjoyed the game--especially once someone at Nixon shared the cheat codes with me! ;) I still think Marvel could have handled this better.

Have you heard anything further from Marvel since the cease & desist order?

[Jim Lemoine]

Actually, we were talking for a while about me working with Marvel.Com to make X-A part of their site - a couple of people over there were pretty excited about the possibility of that. I mean, I didn't ask for any money - I was perfectly happy to let them use X-A for free if they'd just stop threatening to sue me.

Then a few other people there stomped on the deal a few times. Nothing since then.