Apocalypses 12

[rZi]

So reading on wikipedia about Iceman i noticed this: "Currently an Omega-level mutant, Iceman's powers have evolved considerably over the years. Apocalypse considers Iceman to be one of the twelve most powerful mutants on Earth."

I was curious to know who else apoc considers to be omega level? I mean there has always been talk of Jean Grey...but being the some what x-noob i am in need of your help....

NAME OF THE OTHER 11 AND WIN A COOKIE ~

[Novaya Havoc]

So reading on wikipedia about Iceman i noticed this: "Currently an Omega-level mutant, Iceman's powers have evolved considerably over the years. Apocalypse considers Iceman to be one of the twelve most powerful mutants on Earth."

I was curious to know who else apoc considers to be omega level? I mean there has always been talk of Jean Grey...but being the some what x-noob i am in need of your help....

NAME OF THE OTHER 11 AND WIN A COOKIE ~

The 12 were so not "the most powerful." It had to do with elements and was hella weak.

Omega-level is a different story.

[rZi]

My bad...like i said, x-noob here =) Is it even possible to name the most powerful 12? Id find that hard if you could but give it a shot....don't forget a cookie is at stake here!

[Zombienorthstar]

There was a topic about this i think, about how Apcalypse's Twelve werent representitive of actual power.

Many people thought individuals like Franklin Richards, Scarlet Witch etc should have been included.

But it was all elemental hence why it was totally useless.

[Karl H]

Abhorrent story. If you fancy torturing yourself it's due out in trade form soon though.

[twilight]

If you still wanted to know the twelve 'Poccy assembled to fuel his death ray or whatever it was were:

Cyclops
Phoenix
Cable
Storm
Sunfire
Iceman
Magneto
Polaris
Bishop
Mikhail Rasputin
Living Monolith
Professor Xavier

[PatchMadripoor]

Apocalypse's twelve took a good, long running idea that there were 12 mutants of significant prominence and power who would lead and save the mutant (and human) population once the world turned to disorder in the near future. Then sometime after the Age of Apocalypse and the introduction to Nate Grey, Holocaust, Dark Beast and Sugarman to the MU 616, the twelve stopped being the leaders of the future and became Apocalypse's elemental fuel source so he could evolve to near Celestial level powers.

I hope they manage to retcon this, because after the Decimation the idea of twelve mutants providing the leadership for the rest of the surviving mutant population does not sound too bad. It's too good a concept, and it could be revitalized. Just make sure Cyclops isn't on the list.

[twilight]

Just make sure Cyclops isn't on the list.

Why?

He's a brilliant tactician and the best leader the X-Men have ever had.

[Pro]

The 12 were so not "the most powerful." It had to do with elements and was hella weak.

Actually the concept was based on the kabbalah with each of the mutants placed in one of the sephiroth positions, each sephiroth representing a specific element of God's creation. In the kabbalah the sephiroth combined form the body of Man transformed into Man-God (although in the kabbalah there are 10 sephiroth).
The concept was weak, they shouldn't have linked it to the 12 prophesy which was in itself a good enough concept to flesh out and the mutants used seemed pretty much arbitrary. Like someone in the comic said there was no point killing the 12 to prevent apocalypse from using them because apocalypse would have found 12 new ones. If that is so why the hell didn't he use the 12-circuit before?

Not to mention it ignored a huge portion of continuity.

[Thorlief]

the twelve? Are we talking about Claremont's great sublplot or the total mess it was Apo:the twelve?

[dotdotdot]

the twelve? Are we talking about Claremont's great sublplot or the total mess it was Apo:the twelve?

great subplot? more like tiny mention that sat and did nothing for years and ended up only creating problems.

[Karl H]

great subplot? more like tiny mention that sat and did nothing for years and ended up only creating problems.

Along with the Summers revolution, and Forge founding the XSE

[Red Lotus]

Along with the Summers revolution, and Forge founding the XSE

You can throw the 3rd Summers brother in on that one too. How long did it take for that storyline to happen after it was first hinted.

[Karl H]

You can throw the 3rd Summers brother in on that one too. How long did it take for that storyline to happen after it was first hinted.

I deliberately excluded it as it is now resolved.

Although it should always have been Adam X - the X-treme!

[Omega Alpha]

the twelve? Are we talking about Claremont's great sublplot or the total mess it was Apo:the twelve?

It was a Louise Simonson idea, not CC's.

[Mikl C]

I kinda liked Davis' explanation. If the story HAD to be done.
Storm Iceman Sunfire- elementals
Jean Cyke Cable- crazy powerful family
Magneto Polaris- opposing magnetic poles
Mikhail Bishop- time/space
Xavier- mental
Monolith channels it.
Dunno, just thought it was explained well with who was available at the time.

[DDM]

the twelve? Are we talking about Claremont's great sublplot or the total mess it was Apo:the twelve?

"The Twelve" originally came from X-Factor #13-14 from the Master Mold II (programmed with Steven Lang's personality); Nimrod further hinted of "the Twelve" in Uncanny X-Men #208-209. Obviously, originally the "Twelve" are the X-Men who would rise up & change humanity in some way.

"The Twelve" that was released is just an awful contrived mess not even related to the original concept. Comatose editors leave their mark.

[Titan76]

So reading on wikipedia about Iceman i noticed this: "Currently an Omega-level mutant, Iceman's powers have evolved considerably over the years. Apocalypse considers Iceman to be one of the twelve most powerful mutants on Earth."

I was curious to know who else apoc considers to be omega level? I mean there has always been talk of Jean Grey...but being the some what x-noob i am in need of your help....

NAME OF THE OTHER 11 AND WIN A COOKIE ~
There have been a NUMBER of threads here about Omega mutants.

Here a few to help you out:
19010
137905
102003

The search function is your friend:)

[Thorlief]

It was a Louise Simonson idea, not CC's.

whoops, my bad. But I loved how Claremont threw hints here and there

[PatchMadripoor]

The big issue a lot of old time reders have is that Wanda Maximoff and Franklin Richards were supposed to be part of the 12, Franklin in particular because of his heritage and unquestionable raw power.

[Peeps]

im pretty sure the 12 were first mentioned well before xfactor came out

[Omega Alpha]

im pretty sure the 12 were first mentioned well before xfactor came out

No, they weren't. The first mention is in X-factor #14, when the rogue Master Mold is fighting Cyclops, and he recognizes him as one of the Twelve that he is supposed to kill. The other ones shown were Storm, Jean, Franklin Richards and Apocalypse, all very powerful mutants, and except by Franklin, all leaders as well.

[Peeps]

No, they weren't. The first mention is in X-factor #14, when the rogue Master Mold is fighting Cyclops, and he recognizes him as one of the Twelve that he is supposed to kill. The other ones shown were Storm, Jean, Franklin Richards and Apocalypse, all very powerful mutants, and except by Franklin, all leaders as well.


i could have sworn i remember seeing a mention in an earlier comic where i think it was the last page where it had like a fractured drawing of several mutants ( i think the scene was out in space ) and it made mention of the 12

it could be that it was xfactor, but i thought it was xmen, its been years cince i even looked at my back issues though

[DDM]

i could have sworn i remember seeing a mention in an earlier comic where i think it was the last page where it had like a fractured drawing of several mutants ( i think the scene was out in space ) and it made mention of the 12

it could be that it was xfactor, but i thought it was xmen, its been years cince i even looked at my back issues though

"The Twelve" is also mentioned in Power Pack #36 when the Master Mold tries to kill Franklin Richards & Power Pack, but this is after X-Factor #13-14:

http://image.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/fullsize/63125057422.36.GIF

[blackphoenix]

Franklin was definitely supposed to be one of the Twelve. Maybe Apocalypse's Twelve is a separate thing? In the list above, I'd definitely leave out Iceman, Sunfire Living Monolith, and Polaris--those four couldn't lead their way out of a paper bag. Add in Franklin, Scarlet Witch, and...um...?

[jarrod]

The Twelve storyline was bit dissapointing, but after that kind of build up I think about any resolution would've felt similar or worse. Davis' lead up was quite good though I thought, especially the issue focusing on Kurt, Rogue, Kitty, Mystique and Lorna.