ultimate beast

[bbmakdaddycomics]

i just went to the marvel.com catalog for april 2007
and beast is returning.

[Beast]

Yes, we've been discussing it a bit in the solicits thread. :D

[Sparda]

I like beast better without all that fur and keep him Ape like in his human form. It'll be pretty cool to have him join the ultimates.

[rwe1138]

I'm glad he's back. IMO, his death was one of the lamest in comic's history.

[Greg Anderson]

I hate the fact that he's coming back, I really do. I was hoping for the Ultimate Universe to be different with no resurrecting characters, but whatever. Bah!

[Beast]

I hate the fact that he's coming back, I really do. I was hoping for the Ultimate Universe to be different with no resurrecting characters, but whatever. Bah!
As has been mentioned before, it's a little late to do that now... considering all the resurrections that we've already had in the Ulimate Universe. Plus a bit early to judge, before reading the story.

[Sparda]

As has been mentioned before, it's a little late to do that now... considering all the resurrections that we've already had in the Ulimate Universe. Plus a bit early to judge, before reading the story.
I'll find your reaction's hilarous if Kirkman in some way or the other messes this up. Hell the reseructed beast is ultimate wolverine in disguise!!!!!!

Seriously he messed up Cable, so what's stopping him from getting beast to have a connection to logan?

I'll skip this issue.

[Greg Anderson]

As has been mentioned before, it's a little late to do that now... considering all the resurrections that we've already had in the Ulimate Universe. Plus a bit early to judge, before reading the story.

Heh, you're only defending this because you're a stinkin' Beast lover. :p I'm know how'd you feel if it were Cyclops who had died. :D

[CaptainMech]

i love beast but did nto want him returning either

[Canemacar]

In the future, you will look back on this day and mark it as the day the Ultimate Universe jumped the shark.

[Beast]

In the future, you will look back on this day and mark it as the day the Ultimate Universe jumped the shark.
Not really. You guys keep acting like this is the very first resurrection.

[Canemacar]

Of this calibur and unbelievability it is. Others have died, but their death wasn't driven home as much as Beast's was.

[Beast]

Of this calibur and unbelievability it is. Others have died, but their death wasn't driven home as much as Beast's was.
Betsy's was pretty major. So was Sabretooth's. And Magneto's.

[Canemacar]

But we were there to see the after effects of his death. There was a funeral, people wept and felt grief, Storm cut her hair, it was referred to later on, etc. Them simply saying "it's all better now" is is far worse than someone else popping up after not appearing in a few issues.

[Beast]

But we were there to see the after effects of his death. There was a funeral, people wept and felt grief, Storm cut her hair, it was referred to later on, etc. Them simply saying "it's all better now" is is far worse than someone else popping up after not appearing in a few issues.
What makes you think him coming back undoes any of those events? It doesn't retcon the death and it's effects. That still effected people, those effects don't magically vanish as if they never happened.

[Canemacar]

What makes you think him coming back undoes any of those events? It doesn't retcon the death and it's effects. That still effected people, those effects don't magically vanish as if they never happened.

I would have thought the answer was self-evident. Having shown people dealing with a loss and exploring how it affected them is undermined by suddenly having Beast return. Beast's death causes ripples and changes in the people around him.

[Beast]

I would have thought the answer was self-evident. Having shown people dealing with a loss and exploring how it affected them is undermined by suddenly having Beast return. Beast's death causes ripples and changes in the people around him.
And said changes don't magically go away. Just like when someone is missing and presumed dead.... those feelings don't magically vanish if someone turns up alive.

[Canemacar]

When you see the body and bury it, it does. Thats dealing with a permenant loss (as opposed to a presumed loss like when someone goes missing) that turns out to be not quite so permenant.

[Smokeyjay]

I find it silly how the Ultimate universe somehow didn't manage to keep deaths permanent.

Its a lot smaller and contained. I would understand for the 616 universe, since there are a whole bunch of stories and writers, but not for ultimate.

[tetragene]

I understand what Canemacar is saying. Like, for example, Storm's trouble dealing with it. She went through a lot and essentially distanced herself from the team because of the grief and depression she felt over Beast's death. If he all of a sudden turns up--it doesn't negate the grief she originally felt, but it does have kind of a "magically healed" element to it. She's not having to eventually make peace with it and move on (like people normally do in such a situation)--because poof, there's Beast...problem solved, grief/depression suddenly healed.

If Beast's death wasn't so clearly laid out (we see him smushed, characters say he is dead, they bury him and have a funeral) then the ressurection wouldn't be so ridiculous. Like with Karma waaaay back in New Mutants. Unless I'm remembering incorrectly, there wasn't any "finality" about her death. Everyone just assumed she had died in the explosion--she turns up later and it's not such a huge lame moment, because it wasn't like they saw her die and buried her.

[Greg Anderson]

Man, I really hope he comes back as a ghost or a dream or something...

[Joe Acro]

Betsy's was pretty major. So was Sabretooth's. And Magneto's.
Betsy came back? Sabretooth died once?

Magneto's was really more of a retcon than an actual resurrection. His death never happened in the first place.

[Beast]

Betsy came back? Sabretooth died once?

Magneto's was really more of a retcon than an actual resurrection. His death never happened in the first place.
Betsy was crushed by a car thanks to Colossus when she was inhabited by Proteus. She came back in the body of Kwannon during the wrap up issue for Return of the King.

Sabretooth got decapitated by Wolverine during Return of the King. When he turned back up, they had some nonsense about Logan not taking his whole head off which allowed him to heal. But if you look at the panel in ROTK, his whole head is coming off in the panel.

And yes, Magneto's return was a retcon. Who's to say Beast's isn't?

[Joe Acro]

Betsy was crushed by Colossus when she was inhabited by Proteus. She came back in the body of Kwannon during the wrap up issue for Return of the King.

Sabretooth got decapitated by Wolverine during Return of the King. When he turned back up, they had some nonsense about Logan not taking his whole head off which allowed him to heal. But if you look at the panel in ROTK, his whole head is off.

And yes, Magneto's return was a retcon. Who's to say Beast's isn't?I really don't remember that Kwannon thing. But even still, her body still died, so it both does and doesn't count.

I will concede the Sabretooth one.

Perhaps Beast's will be.

[bbmakdaddycomics]

maybe beast was so sad about his relationship with storm that
he cloned himself while he looked for a cure to revert him back to his human stage and now he finally found one.

or maybe professor didn't die he took cables time traveling machine stoped beast from dying and helped find a cure.

[Canemacar]

Who's to say Beast's isn't?

Well for one thing, the effrects of his death were far too broad for it to simply be retconed and have any integrity left.

[Beast]

Well for one thing, the effrects of his death were far too broad for it to simply be retconed and have any integrity left.
You mean exactly like how Magneto's was? Again, the effects have nothing to do with whether Hank died or not. Just those who were his friends believed him to be dead.

[Canemacar]

You mean exactly like how Magneto's was? Again, the effects have nothing to do with whether Hank died or not. Just those who were his friends believed him to be dead.

Well since they were the ones who placed his shattered, lifeless body in a box and buried it, I think this one has wee bit less wiggleroom than Magneto(whom no one expected to remain dead anyway).

[superhornet34]

hate the fact that he's coming back, I really do. I was hoping for the Ultimate Universe to be different with no resurrecting characters, but whatever. Bah!

Have you guys seen the sales of this book? Its been dropping to below 70K. it used to be above 100K didnt it? The only reason for this resurrection is for a sales bump. The only reasons for resurrections are sales bumps and because the writer ran out of ideas.

[Greg Anderson]

I doubt his return will peak interest and rise up sales.

[superhornet34]

You would think, but for some reason it always does. Hopefully like someone said its just something in flashback or dream state.

[scottv]

I really doubt that it would really help sales because if they are bring him back it would probably piss off the people that are still buying the book.

[Greg Anderson]

Like me for example! :mad:

[Beast]

I really doubt that it would really help sales because if they are bring him back it would probably piss off the people that are still buying the book.
Won't piss me off. And it doesn't look like it's flashbacks or a dream state.

His return is being tied with the debut of the 'Ultimate All-New All-Different X-Men'. :D

[Greg Anderson]

Won't piss me off. And it doesn't look like it's flashbacks or a dream state.

His return is being tied with the debut of the 'Ultimate All-New All-Different X-Men'. :D

You're simply enjoying my disgust, aren't you? :mad:

[Beast]

You're simply enjoying my disgust, aren't you? :mad:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0e/Hedonism_Bot.JPG

"It's as delectable as dipping my bottom over and over into a bath of the silkiest oils and creams."

[gravling]

'Ultimate All-New All-Different X-Men' should have been 'Ultimate All-New All-Different No Kirkman X-Men'.

That would REALLY bump sales back up.

[Karl O'Neill]

ultimate beast looks like non from action comics.

it's all adam kuberts fault!!!!

[tetragene]

I don't really think this was the best move to make, then again Kirkman doesn't seem to care about doing any good things for this title. I mean if we're going to bring back a character that we saw get smooshed by debris and we saw get buried--why not just go ahead and bring Blink back, she was only mentioned to have died. Or Marrow, Synch, or Maggot--we didn't see any of them actually get killed.

Bah--I would have rather had Angel return or Northstar join the team. I'm guessing Wolverine, Jean, Cyke, and Storm (with Beast) will definitely be remaining on the team. Leaving Colossus, Kitty, and Nightcrawler to get the boot. If that happens Kirkman is uber lame.

[Neptunicus]

Yeah this is pretty lame and it is going to make it that much harder inject any gravitas onto the Ultimate plot lines. When death isn't final it turns down the volume on all dangerous situations. In the 616 universe when a major character dies now I'm pretty much - "meh" - about the situation. You start investing personally in the characters and then all of a sudden none of it really matters b/c someone may die next issue and then be brought back to life. To me it seems as if either writers with egos want to write themselves into X-Men Canon b/c (maybe b/c they are fans) or it is a tactic to boost sales by having these major life and death events occuring.

What is even lamer in my opinion is that Kirkman is reinventing a lot of the characters (Rogue's Powers / Prof. X in love / Cable / Dazzler left / Nightcrawler going crazy) and it's destroying the continuity built from the previous 70 issues...

If Beast being revived isn't handled well I'll probably quit picking up the title for awhile.

[Pro]

you're only defending this because you're a stinkin' Beast lover.

This sentence would be wrong on so many levels if it wasn't comics we're discussing .. :p

[gravling]

i'm still sort of stunned by kirkman's move with xaviers - 'i'm in love with jean' - and then oops, next issue xavier's dead - nice one, kirkman, what exactly WAS the point of that?

i think nightcrawler and rogue are on their way out, dazzler too, sadly - three characters either utterly misued or under-used since even before kirkman took over the title - possibly also cyclops, don't know why, just a gut feeling.

[Canemacar]

I wonder if the next writer would be so kind as to start his run with a "retcon bomb" which erases Kirkman's entire run.

[Beast]

I wonder if the next writer would be so kind as to start his run with a "retcon bomb" which erases Kirkman's entire run.
I think that he's actually been told where stuff is supposed to be at the start of Singer's run. That's why we're getting these shake-ups and returns. Because Bryan Singer has said he wanted Beast in X1 and X2, and never got to do it.

[Canemacar]

They're actually going ahead with Singer's run? I assumed that fizzled out once he left the X-men films for the Superman ones.

[Beast]

They're actually going ahead with Singer's run? I assumed that fizzled out once he left the X-men films for the Superman ones.
According to Joe Quesada it's still on the block, and they've recieved scripts.

[Canemacar]

Better late than never, I suppose. Still, his run will have to be FANTASTIC to make up for Kirkman's. He's already ruined 5 of the Ultimate X-men for me and that number is likely to keep growing the longer he's on the book.