Is Superman so Immortal?

[jackolover]

To all those DC fans, I have a few questions about their DC God

1. When Supes was killed, did you guys feel betrayed that the writers went that step and killed off your major character?

2. When supes was killed he didn't really die, he turned into superman red and blue. That means every other Krytonian who dies turns into a red and blue version of themselves. Why haven't these Kryptonians ever come looking for Kal Al, and overtake a new planet?

[Jack Zodiac]

1. When Superman died, I knew it wouldn't stick, so I didn't care. I mean, it was a great story and the art was fantastic, but everybody knew he wasn't really dead.

2. Superman Red and Superman Blue weren't a result of his death, they were a result of him getting his powers kickstarted after Final Night, and another failed attempt at "refreshing" the character.

[jackolover]

2. Superman Red and Superman Blue weren't a result of his death, they were a result of him getting his powers kickstarted after Final Night, and another failed attempt at "refreshing" the character.

Wait. You don't think other Kryptonians can do this?

[Joe Acro]

2. Superman Red and Superman Blue weren't a result of his death, they were a result of him getting his powers kickstarted after Final Night, and another failed attempt at "refreshing" the character.
Him turning into an energy being was a result of Final Night. The split was due to a later attempt of Hank Henshaw to siphon all of his energy and, thus, get rid of him. Somehow, despite him losing his entire body, he split into two forms and reclaimed his energy.

But to answer the title, I don't think Superman is immortal. Like everything else, he has the potential to die.

[Knight Lancer]

They might, but they probably don't want to go down that avenue...

[Kara Zor El]

To all those DC fans, I have a few questions about their DC God

1. When Supes was killed, did you guys feel betrayed that the writers went that step and killed off your major character?

2. When supes was killed he didn't really die, he turned into superman red and blue. That means every other Krytonian who dies turns into a red and blue version of themselves. Why haven't these Kryptonians ever come looking for Kal Al, and overtake a new planet?

I didn't feel betrayed because I knew he'd come back. And I enjoyed the story and really enjoyed he Reign of the Supermen. I didn't like the way he was brought back though. with Pa Kent having a heart attack and then his spirit finding Clark's spirit in limbo with demons parading him around on a throne type thing and all that jazz.

As Zodiac says above you got that wrong about red and blue supes. Nothing to do with his death and came years after his resurrection.

[Jack Zodiac]

Him turning into an energy being was a result of Final Night. The split was due to a later attempt of Hank Henshaw to siphon all of his energy and, thus, get rid of him. Somehow, despite him losing his entire body, he split into two forms and reclaimed his energy.

Right. Either way, the electromagnetic powers and the splitting into Superman Red and Superman Blue, in both cases that it happened, had nothing to do with him being Kryptonian, so...


Wait. You don't think other Kryptonians can do this?

...no, they couldn't/can't.

[jackolover]

I didn't feel betrayed because I knew he'd come back. And I enjoyed the story and really enjoyed he Reign of the Supermen. I didn't like the way he was brought back though. with Pa Kent having a heart attack and then his spirit finding Clark's spirit in limbo with demons parading him around on a throne type thing and all that jazz.

As Zodiac says above you got that wrong about red and blue supes. Nothing to do with his death and came years after his resurrection.

Hang on. Didn't red and blue appear immediately after Supes died? Who were those imposters?

[karasu]

That was one of the worst moments in Comic history IMO. I wasn't even reading his books back then, but it was such an obvious plea for attention that it made me sick. Then I read the story and it's unbelievably vapid.

[PatrickG]

Hang on. Didn't red and blue appear immediately after Supes died? Who were those imposters?

No. Four people showed up as "Supermen" after Superman died. One was Steel, a guy carrying on his work. One was his clone, Superboy. One was a weapon from Krypton named the Eradicator. One was a fake Cyborg Superman.

None were the real Superman who came back due to a lot of coincidences and efforts to save him. He teamed with Steel, Superboy and the Eradicator to fight the Cyborg.

Superman Red and Blue showed up years later and were basically the result of several scientific flukes in a row. And had nothing to do with Superman being Kryptonian.

Also, DC's not my god. I don't understand prefering DC over Marvel or Marvel over DC or Superman over Batman or Batman over Superman. I like what I like. Probably more DC than Marvel but I think any "competition" between the two companies is usually pretty fake and that taking either side is retarded.

[dupersuper]

The red/blue thing had NOTHING to do with the death/return story. It just happened to occur shortly after the return, that's all. He died and came back. He got split into 2 different energy beings. He's also been in a t-rexs' mouth, wrestled a rebelling angel, and been at the big bang an impressive 3 times. He's Superman; for him these all fall into the "just another day at the office" heading.

[jackolover]

No. Four people showed up as "Supermen" after Superman died. One was Steel, a guy carrying on his work. One was his clone, Superboy. One was a weapon from Krypton named the Eradicator. One was a fake Cyborg Superman.

None were the real Superman who came back due to a lot of coincidences and efforts to save him. He teamed with Steel, Superboy and the Eradicator to fight the Cyborg.

Superman Red and Blue showed up years later and were basically the result of several scientific flukes in a row. And had nothing to do with Superman being Kryptonian.

Also, DC's not my god. I don't understand prefering DC over Marvel or Marvel over DC or Superman over Batman or Batman over Superman. I like what I like. Probably more DC than Marvel but I think any "competition" between the two companies is usually pretty fake and that taking either side is retarded.

Thanks for the rundown of that post-Superman period, but in that rundown you mention supes teams up with those 3. Does that mean Kal Al is immortal if he was still teaming up, while he was dead? (Obviously, the Red and Blue were not a part of this story - thanks)

Just to clear up, what I meant was that Superman was the God of DC, not that DC was a God.

[PatrickG]

Er.

No.

Kal-EL came back from the dead.

He's not immortal.

He has died a few times.

So has Batman.

[Joe Acro]

Thanks for the rundown of that post-Superman period, but in that rundown you mention supes teams up with those 3. Does that mean Kal Al is immortal if he was still teaming up, while he was dead? (Obviously, the Red and Blue were not a part of this story - thanks)He fought alongside them with limited powers after awaking from his "coma" or "stasis" or whatever it was.


Just to clear up, what I meant was that Superman was the God of DC, not that DC was a God.You may think so, but he isn't. Spectre doesn't serve him. In fact, Morrison portrayed himself as God once.

[jackolover]

He fought alongside them with limited powers after awaking from his "coma" or "stasis" or whatever it was.

You may think so, but he isn't. Spectre doesn't serve him. In fact, Morrison portrayed himself as God once.

Allergorically, I mean, Superman is the DC God, not an actual God.

And explain to me again what this stasis or coma is, if he was killed by Doomsday, please Joe?

[Joe Acro]

I think the story is or was that Superman wasn't really dead, just in a dead-like state. Whatever the case, he was brought back to life via a regneration chamber in the Fortress due to the meddling of the Eradicator.

[jackolover]

I think the story is or was that Superman wasn't really dead, just in a dead-like state. Whatever the case, he was brought back to life via a regneration chamber in the Fortress due to the meddling of the Eradicator.

Thanks, Joe.

Does there still hang a question over whether Kal Al can be killed then, if Doomsday can only send him into a coma, and Doomsday practically wrote the book on killing?

If so, then Kal Al must be immortal, or pretty close too. Then why can't all Kryptonians survive the death of their planet, too?

[MaxofSteel]

Thanks, Joe.

Does there still hang a question over whether Kal Al can be killed then, if Doomsday can only send him into a coma, and Doomsday practically wrote the book on killing?

If so, then Kal Al must be immortal, or pretty close too. Then why can't all Kryptonians survive the death of their planet, too?

Having Supes not actually die was a method used by the writers to "believably" bring him back to life. He definitely can die though, otherwise, why would his enemies even bother trying to kill him?

And as far as the Kryptonians on Krypton go, the light of their Red Sun keeps them powerless, so they're basically like us. And I doubt any of us would survive if Earth exploded.:p

[Joe Acro]

And as far as the Kryptonians on Krypton go... they're basically like us.
They shouldn't be, but it's fiction. I suppose I have to let it slide.

[jackolover]

Having Supes not actually die was a method used by the writers to "believably" bring him back to life. He definitely can die though, otherwise, why would his enemies even bother trying to kill him?

That has never been established


And as far as the Kryptonians on Krypton go, the light of their Red Sun keeps them powerless, so they're basically like us. And I doubt any of us would survive if Earth exploded.:p

Good point. Krypton exploding would kill all powerless Kryptonians. But, boy, is this a very fragile literary device. You're saying Kal Al somehow, gets this magical power of strength from our yellow sun that makes him practically invulnerable?

However, apart from your apology for the writers to believably bring Supes back to life, the writers would have a hard time really killing him off, not just metaphorically , or DC cutting there own throats by dispensing with the character, but even in the books physically.

I'll give you an example. Doomsday was a Kryptonian. He or she, was case hardened for countless generations. When he came to earth, he had the same magical transformation into an invulnerable being as Kal Al with our yellow sun. Now my question is, if he was this case hardened
Kryptonian creature, is he/she just an ugly Superman, or a Superman to the nth degree? If Doomsday is just an ugly Superman then I can believe the outcome of the death fight. If Doomsday is Superman to the nth degree, then he should have been able to squeeze Kal Al out between his fingers. Why didn't he?

[Agent Helix]

Is Kal-Al married to Peg-E?

[Joe Acro]

I'll give you an example. Doomsday was a Kryptonian. He or she, was case hardened for countless generations. When he came to earth, he had the same magical transformation into an invulnerable being as Kal Al with or yellow sun. Now my question is, if he was this case hardened
Kryptonian creature, is he/she just an ugly Superman, or a superman to the nth degree? If Doomsday is just an ugly superman then I can believe the outcome of the death fight. If Doomsday is Superman to the nth degree, then he should have been able to squeeze Kal Al out between his fingers. Why didn't he?Actually, Doomsday isn't Kryptonian in the same sense that Superman is. Yes, he's from Krypton, but he doesn't have Kryptonian DNA, so far as we know. The yellow sun does not give Doomsday his powers. His strength is part of his genetic makeup. Doomsday does have better recuperative powers than Supes, as clearly evidenced by him building himself back from the that blast by Imperiex.

(By the way, it's Kal-El.)

[MaxofSteel]

You're saying Kal Al somehow, gets this magical power of strength from our yellow sun that makes him practically invulnerable?

I may have missled when I said Kryptonians are like us. Kryptonians aren't exactly like us, their genetic make-up gives them the ability to aborb solar rays into their cells. This build up of solar energy allows them to be stonger, move faster, and so on.

Perhaps it's possible to come up with some type of scientific explanation for how this all works but, y'know, it's science fiction so there's no real sense in trying imo.


Now my question is, if he was this case hardened
Kryptonian creature, is he/she just an ugly Superman, or a Superman to the nth degree?

Joe said it already, The D-man isn't your average Kryptonian. And if you want to talk about immortal, I'd say that award goes to Doomsday more so than Supes.

Check this out:


Doomsday was artificially created in the distant past on Krypton, long before the humanoid Kryptonian race had gained dominance over the planet.

Doomsday was created and evolved through cloning an infant and having it killed over and over again by one of the most dangerous species of the universe and in one of the harshest habitats in existence, prehistoric Krypton. As such, he returns to life every time he dies and becomes resistant or immune to what killed him before.

As a result of these evolutions, Doomsday is covered by bony protrusions all through out his body that serves as added protection for what little vital organs he has (brain, eyes, heart, nervous system) and as weapons (in the form of claws, fangs, and elbow/knee spurs).

This is from Wikipedia if you ever wanna get more info on this stuff.

Hope this helps.:)

[Joe Acro]

Perhaps it's possible to come up with some type of scientific explanation for how this all works but, y'know, it's science fiction so there's no real sense in trying imo.If you want to read a way Superman's powers could be explained, you should read The Science of Superman by Mark Wolverton and Roger Stern.

[jackolover]

Actually, Doomsday isn't Kryptonian in the same sense that Superman is. Yes, he's from Krypton, but he doesn't have Kryptonian DNA, so far as we know. The yellow sun does not give Doomsday his powers. His strength is part of his genetic makeup. Doomsday does have better recuperative powers than Supes, as clearly evidenced by him building himself back from the that blast by Imperiex.

(By the way, it's Kal-El.)

Hmm. Not how I remember it. I thought an ugly Kryptonian scientist came to this world and cloned Doomsday from a Krypton baby. Doomsday was on the way back to Krypton when he ran into a Kryptonian on Earth. So, to me, he's full blood Krypton, not from some far distant past, but recent. So D-Day should have the same powers from the sun as Kal Al, only magnified.

[jackolover]

This is from Wikipedia if you ever wanna get more info on this stuff.

Hope this helps.:)

Thanks for the reference, but does everyone agree this is the sequence and the facts? I remember different.

[MaxofSteel]

If you want to read a way Superman's powers could be explained, you should read The Science of Superman by Mark Wolverton and Roger Stern.

Hm. Heard about this not too long ago. I might check it out. Thanks Joe!:)

[PatrickG]

Hmm. Not how I remember it. I thought an ugly Kryptonian scientist came to this world and cloned Doomsday from a Krypton baby. Doomsday was on the way back to Krypton when he ran into a Kryptonian on Earth. So, to me, he's full blood Krypton, not from some far distant past, but recent. So D-Day should have the same powers from the sun as Kal Al, only magnified.

Nah. An ugly alien scientist took Doomsday from an unknown planet and cloned him on Krypton.

[Jack Zodiac]

Thanks, Joe.

Does there still hang a question over whether Kal Al can be killed then, if Doomsday can only send him into a coma, and Doomsday practically wrote the book on killing?

If so, then Kal Al must be immortal, or pretty close too. Then why can't all Kryptonians survive the death of their planet, too?

It's Kal-El. And yes, Superman can be killed. Case in point, his cousin, Kara Zor-El, was killed in the first Crisis. She was genetically identical to him aside from a Y chromosome. He isn't immortal in the sense that nothing can kill him, just that he's practically immortal. Like Diana is practically immortal. He will not age like a normal human being because of his powers (or so several Elseworlds books and DC 1,000,000 would have us believe), but he can be killed.


Actually, Doomsday isn't Kryptonian in the same sense that Superman is. Yes, he's from Krypton, but he doesn't have Kryptonian DNA, so far as we know. The yellow sun does not give Doomsday his powers. His strength is part of his genetic makeup. Doomsday does have better recuperative powers than Supes, as clearly evidenced by him building himself back from the that blast by Imperiex.

(By the way, it's Kal-El.)

Actually, genetically, Doomsday is a prehistoric Kryptonian. Whatever homo something evolved from on Krypton, that's what Doomsday was. He's exhibited weaknesses to both green kryptonite and red solar energy in the past, and has grown considerably stronger over time after being left on Earth and escaping from his cage to absorb yellow solar energy. However, Doomsday's "immortality" is a genetic alteration, not a natural Kryptonian trait.

[jackolover]

Nah. An ugly alien scientist took Doomsday from an unknown planet and cloned him on Krypton.

I forgot that. Thanks Pat and others.

[Joe Acro]

Actually, genetically, Doomsday is a prehistoric Kryptonian. Whatever homo something evolved from on Krypton, that's what Doomsday was. He's exhibited weaknesses to both green kryptonite and red solar energy in the past, and has grown considerably stronger over time after being left on Earth and escaping from his cage to absorb yellow solar energy. However, Doomsday's "immortality" is a genetic alteration, not a natural Kryptonian trait.
I'm not aware of any stories in which he exhibits weakness to Kryptonite or loses power due to red solar energy. When did these occur?

[Jack Zodiac]

I'm not aware of any stories in which he exhibits weakness to Kryptonite or loses power due to red solar energy. When did these occur?

Lex trapped him and Superman in a red solar cage in Superman #175, and I think he was exposed to kryptonite during Our Worlds at War.

[niall mc cann]

Good point. Krypton exploding would kill all powerless Kryptonians. But, boy, is this a very fragile literary device. You're saying Kal Al somehow, gets this magical power of strength from our yellow sun that makes him practically invulnerable?

As opposed to being struck by lightening, finding a magic ring from another world, or being bitten by a radioactive spider?

In terms of the conventions of the genre, the explaination isn't so strained.

[jackolover]

As opposed to being struck by lightening, finding a magic ring from another world, or being bitten by a radioactive spider?

In terms of the conventions of the genre, the explaination isn't so strained.

Yes, supes is given some neat powers, but he's practically invulnerable on a planet where it's normals don't get any such advantage from our yellow sun. Couldn't he just get strength. Why all the X-ray vision, the hovering flight, the heat rays, and considering everyones tried to kill him and can't, because Doomsday was the best shot, Kal El can think he's a god on this planet. It just seems extreme. These Kryptonians must have had some genetic makeup. Maybe if we went to a blue sun we would become Supermen like Kal El.

[niall mc cann]

Yes, supes is given some neat powers, but he's practically invulnerable on a planet where it's normals don't get any such advantage from our yellow sun. Couldn't he just get strength. Why all the X-ray vision, the hovering flight, the heat rays, and considering everyones tried to kill him and can't, because Doomsday was the best shot, Kal El can think he's a god on this planet. It just seems extreme. These Kryptonians must have had some genetic makeup. Maybe if we went to a blue sun we would become Supermen like Kal El.

Possibly we would. There's the germ of a story there, maybe.

I don't know. I don't get superman's current power set any more diffficult to believe than if he were just invulnerable. Simply being invulnerable is impossible. There's no degrees of impossibility. It's no more impossible that he have all those powers as any one of them, to me.

As far as Doomsday is concerned? He's a nobody. All rep and nothing worth reading, when it comes down to it. Lex Luthor's the anti-superman contingent's best bet for a world without superman. Doomsday's a one-note cypher that should be forgotten about post-haste.

[PatrickG]

I'm not aware of any stories in which he exhibits weakness to Kryptonite or loses power due to red solar energy. When did these occur?

That was after Luthor spliced Doomsday with some of Superman's DNA as a control mechanism.

SUPERMAN #175.

[jackolover]

Doomsday's a one-note cypher that should be forgotten about post-haste.

I would take Doomsday off DC's hands. I would make him one badass walking piece of destruction, that no one can kill. I think DC lost it's opportunity of using such a powerful being, that, though, he's one dimensional, in that he uses his power at ground level and doesn't issue power rays from his eyes, (well, not yet he doesn't, but hmmm...), he makes a phenomenal foil to any other universe of heros he comes across. You don't like him? I'd take him in a minute.

[niall mc cann]

I would take Doomsday off DC's hands. I would make him one badass walking piece of destruction, that no one can kill. I think DC lost it's opportunity of using such a powerful being, that, though, he's one dimensional, in that he uses his power at ground level and doesn't issue power rays from his eyes, (well, not yet he doesn't, but hmmm...), he makes a phenomenal foil to any other universe of heros he comes across. You don't like him? I'd take him in a minute.

As far as i'm concerned, you'd be more than welcome.:)

He's a two-bit fury rip-off, but not a tenth as creepy.

[666MasterOfPuppets]

Lex trapped him and Superman in a red solar cage in Superman #175, and I think he was exposed to kryptonite during Our Worlds at War.

Wasn't that a Kryptonite cage?

[666MasterOfPuppets]

Actually, Doomsday isn't Kryptonian in the same sense that Superman is. Yes, he's from Krypton, but he doesn't have Kryptonian DNA, so far as we know. The yellow sun does not give Doomsday his powers. His strength is part of his genetic makeup. Doomsday does have better recuperative powers than Supes, as clearly evidenced by him building himself back from the that blast by Imperiex.

(By the way, it's Kal-El.)

IIRC, the original Doomsday died during OWaW, as a result of the godlike blast from Imperiex.

All that survived --again, IIRC-- was a bone. He was cloned by President Luthor, and then jokerized by --who else-- The Joker.

As for Superman being immortal, I remember an one-shot called "Where's Thy Sting" (I didn't read it, though), in which Death comes to pay Superman a visit, because he's "the only man who has the potential to live forever".

IMO, Superman is immortal. His powers come not only from a star different from a red star. He also has a very "dense molecular structure" or something among those lines.

If DC One Million and other stories that portray Superman outliving many of his comrades and partners (like JLA #0, I believe, in which Superman is shown mourning the death of Batman without having aged a single day, or the thousand years he spent with Diana in Asgard) don't prove that he is immortal, I don't know what else will.

[jackolover]

he's a two-bit fury rip-off, but not a tenth as creepy.

Who is fury?

[niall mc cann]

Who is fury?

Someone will probably give you a more up-to-date explanation of the guy, but i encountered him in Alan Moore's Captain Britain series. It was great stuff.

SPOILERS****** He was a silent, adaptive superhero killer, a cyborg designed by the perfect madman to end all opposition to his superhuman powers in his native universe. Captain Britain found himself trapped in the alternate reality that birthed the Fury where he, as the last (or maybe second last; i'd have to check), superhuman left in that reality took on the Fury to save that universe and was anihilated. To save the multiverse from Mad Jim Jaspers and his perfect killing machine, some cosmic entity or other destroyed that entire reality, erasing it and everything in it from existence. The Fury survived, washing up on the shores of our reality, where it found not only a reborn captain britain but an entirely new universe of superhumans in which to continue it's mission of superhuman anihilation. As far as i know, it's been wandering the MU ever since.******Spoilers end

[Jack Zodiac]

Wasn't that a Kryptonite cage?

The cage itself? Might've been made of kryptonite, but I'm positive that after it closed on them, it started shooting red sunlight.

[Jack Zodiac]

Someone will probably give you a more up-to-date explanation of the guy, but i encountered him in Alan Moore's Captain Britain series. It was great stuff.

SPOILERS****** He was a silent, adaptive superhero killer, a cyborg designed by the perfect madman to end all opposition to his superhuman powers in his native universe. Captain Britain found himself trapped in the alternate reality that birthed the Fury where he, as the last (or maybe second last; i'd have to check), superhuman left in that reality took on the Fury to save that universe and was anihilated. To save the multiverse from Mad Jim Jaspers and his perfect killing machine, some cosmic entity or other destroyed that entire reality, erasing it and everything in it from existence. The Fury survived, washing up on the shores of our reality, where it found not only a reborn captain britain but an entirely new universe of superhumans in which to continue it's mission of superhuman anihilation. As far as i know, it's been wandering the MU ever since.******Spoilers end

Yeah... Claremont dusted him off for a run a year or so ago. Sucked to high Heaven.

[666MasterOfPuppets]

The cage itself? Might've been made of kryptonite, but I'm positive that after it closed on them, it started shooting red sunlight.

Damn... I can't remember that. I'll take your word for it, since my copy of that issue must be buried... Somewhere.

*Thinks about how to better organize comic books*

[Jack Zodiac]

I'm just goin' on memory. Been years since I read that issue because I, too, have a very disorganized collection and not nearly enough time to fix it.

[666MasterOfPuppets]

I hear you. Lack of space and time can be such a pain in the ass.

I guess you just learn to live with it...

[Jack Zodiac]

I sit on a throne of longboxes. I've got twelve of 'em hiding under my billiard table and four of 'em are keeping one of my coffee tables up. :p

[jackolover]

Someone will probably give you a more up-to-date explanation of the guy, but i encountered him in Alan Moore's Captain Britain series. It was great stuff.

SPOILERS****** He was a silent, adaptive superhero killer, a cyborg designed by the perfect madman to end all opposition to his superhuman powers in his native universe. Captain Britain found himself trapped in the alternate reality that birthed the Fury where he, as the last (or maybe second last; i'd have to check), superhuman left in that reality took on the Fury to save that universe and was anihilated. To save the multiverse from Mad Jim Jaspers and his perfect killing machine, some cosmic entity or other destroyed that entire reality, erasing it and everything in it from existence. The Fury survived, washing up on the shores of our reality, where it found not only a reborn captain britain but an entirely new universe of superhumans in which to continue it's mission of superhuman anihilation. As far as i know, it's been wandering the MU ever since.******Spoilers end

He sounds pretty awesome from that descrition. Why hasn't he ravaged the MU yet, if he's here?

[IRONY...]

superman stopped being immortal when he died and came back...His death made him more mortal and more down to earth...

[jackolover]

superman stopped being immortal when he died and came back...His death made him more mortal and more down to earth...

Did it? I don't know if that's been tested, or if that's your take on the incident. What if Kal El became more case hardened like Doomsday, and is less inclined to be killed? Maybe superman is harder to kill now. It's not like he gave up one of his kidneys to the cub reporter. He survived death.

[666MasterOfPuppets]

Well, it is known that Superman has become more and more powerful with the years. And after Superman #175, the D-man can't do squat to Big Blue (apparently, of course. It depends on the writer. Doomsday can be scary again, dammit!).

[jackolover]

Well, it is known that Superman has become more and more powerful with the years. And after Superman #175, the D-man can't do squat to Big Blue (apparently, of course. It depends on the writer. Doomsday can be scary again, dammit!).

Yes he can!!

[666MasterOfPuppets]

He can what? Be scary or hurt Big Blue?

[jackolover]

He can what? Be scary or hurt Big Blue?

Doomsday can be scary again, dammit!.

[666MasterOfPuppets]

Hell yeah. And this is the perfect time to make the proper changes.