Backseat Driving: The Superman Books circa 1986

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Okay, here's the idea. You have been put in charge of revamping the Superman books following the Crisis on Infinite Earths reboot.

You have complete control over what direction the Superman comics franchise will take. The only directives you've been given from DC head honchos Jennette Khan & Dick Giordano is that Superman has to undergo a radical revamp in order to drum up interest in the character.

The only caveats is that your choices have to be vaguely realistic to the time period we're talking about. So, before everybody falls over themselves to say "Give the books to Alan Moore", remember that Moore and DC's relationship deteriorated very quickly after Crisis. Similarly, guys like Grant Morrison and Mark Waid weren't even blips on the industry's radar yet. So you can't put guys like them on the books either.

[jaguarshark]

So, it's 1986 and I'm charged with revamping Superman. What do I want to do? I want to freshen him up a bit, as the books have grown a little stale. As great and beloved as Curt and Kurt are, I aim to add some new storytelling vitality to the books, with a truly exciting artist at the helm. Preferably somebody who's demonstrated a gift for space operatic sci-fi adventure.

And, of course, I want to put a fan-favourite writer on the book, too, a wordsmith that'll get folks interested in the books again and has demonstrated his ability to revamp classic characters.

So, I think I'll take the guy that won over fans with his electric pencilling on X-Men, and his stellar plotting and pencilling on the Fantastic Four,and put him in charge. How sweet would his run on Superman be?

I don't want to give that guy total run of the place, though, so I still want to bring in that fan-favourite writer. Moore's out, so howabout I go after the guy behind this whole Crisis thingamajig, and the writer of our most popular book, New Teen Titans? You know, the one that successfully reinvented Robin.

Yeah, that'd work nicely. John Byrne and Marv Wolfman for me, thanks. Honestly, I don't think DC could have made a better decision in '86, and I wouldn't want to change it.

[PatrickG]

Hm.

Off the top of my head...?

I'd play up the reaction to Supergirl's death, have Lois get engaged to someone else and lead Superman to question whether any of the Kryptonians he's met are actually Kryptonians or simply a similar race that took note of his fame and attached themselves to him through an elaborate series of stunts.

Job two then becomes mythos expansion. I see a new super-pet, a new HQ (replacing the FoS), a new photographer and some new enemies in the works. A new Superboy too.

[Dr. Drake Ramoray]

Not sure about which writer of the period, but I'd definately throw some money at Gil Kane to draw one of the books!

[Kummi]

Yes - I agree. Taking Byrne on the job was pure genius. He was still burning then, and not burned out.

I remember how excited I was as a 15 year old when the 6-ish Man of steel came out. And I wasnt disappointed at all.

He got what we love about Jeph Loeb: That feeling for the creative wealth and versatility of the whole DC universe; and he is (or was) a more linear writer than Loeb.

Whoever says, Miller should have got the job, or Claremont, or Jim Shooter (haha) revamping the S-mythos is plain wrong.

Miller was considered art noir back then, and still would be the odd choice for revamping a fresh clean Man of steel today.

[Jack Zodiac]

For the title book, Superman, I think I would've stuck with Byrne on scripts and pencils, because he did a very excellent job with reviving the book. The only creative influence I'd force on him as an editor would be that while making Superman relatable, to remember that he's Superman. You can still write about a powerhouse hero mauling colorful supervillains while keeping him down-to-Earth. Spider-Man does it all the time. I'd say, for the length of his run, have Intergang remain an underlying theme until people were more interested in the book again, and then whip out Darkseid for a huge throw-down.

On Action, I'd have given Giffen scripting and Perez pencils. Keith writes great stories, fun stories with a lot of action. He can make something light-hearted and entertaining and still pump it full of action, and that's what Action comics should be, just fun and exciting. You pick up that book already knowing who Superman is, and you read it expecting Superman to throw down. And when it comes to drawing action, Perez is tops (especially around the late Eighties). I think this book would've been a great compliment to Byrne's relatable Superman. I'd have told Keith to follow the same Intergang plot in the background of the book and, maybe after a year or so, there could've been a short crossover weekly between the two books, a four-part showdown with Darkseid. Mmmm, Perez's Darkseid.

Also, I think Keith could've remained as popular as he was back then with a great book like Action selling well, despite the whole Muñoz art theft ordeal. And then, maybe, with a book more suited to a character like him, Ambush Bug wouldn't have disappeared into comic book limbo.

[karasu]

Byrne wrote some great stories, but I didn't like his take on Krypton or Superman's power levels.


I'd depower him from silver age levels to more or less where he is now. Instead of taking away a tank load of his ability, I'd try to introduce more challenging villains/themes. Lex Luthor would get a few years off, seriously. The guy is common, and his existence makes Superman look incompetent. When my Superman wasn't trying to effect social change of some kind, he'd be handling the epic threats that his power level was made for.

His powers would be partially due to gravity, and primarily due to the sun. As such, Kryptonite or a "Red Sun" would weaken him, but not completely. He'd always be at least a thousand times stronger than a man due to the difference in Gravity between Krypton and Earth. I'd also ditch the aura, because I can't stand silly things like Superman's inability to get his face dirty due to a super aura. He'd just have tough skin or whatever, like any other character who's nearly invulnerable.

I'd give him a bit of a harder edge as well. Not like the Punisher or anything, more like his social activist attitude from the early books. He'd still be 'him', but he'd also have the air of someone who's been through all of the things that he's been through. No more 'flying is still the safest way to travel' or PR type stuff. Replace "boy scout' with 'noble'

I would try my hardest NOT to constantly pay homage to Superman imagery of the past.

[brundlefly]

Lex Luthor would get a few years off, seriously. The guy is common, and his existence makes Superman look incompetent.

:rolleyes: *sigh* Repeat after me:

World's.

Smartest.

Man.

Nothing "common" about that. If anything, Superman's continued existence makes Lex look incompetent.

[The Shadow]

I would get Neal Adams on a book as artist no matter what the cost!

I would also look at seriously bulking up Superman's rogues gallery. Zod would be a biggie... but he needs more than just Lex.

And I'd let Byrne do whatever he wants!

[karasu]

"World's Smartest Man". I hate that. It's beyond cheesy. I swear, Lex's inventions, ray guns, and all of that tom foolery are on the same level of silliness as Superman's long gone abilities to juggle planets or use super hypnotism. Lex is common because he's so overdone. Flesh out Superman's rogues gallery please. Lex hasn't been enough since the 60's. Lex looks incompetent because he is. His continued existence is nothing more than an act of mercy on Superman's part.

[brundlefly]

"World's Smartest Man". I hate that. It's beyond cheesy. I swear, Lex's inventions, ray guns, and all of that tom foolery are on the same level of silliness as Superman's long gone abilities to juggle planets or use super hypnotism. Lex is common because he's so overdone. Flesh out Superman's rogues gallery please. Lex hasn't been enough since the 60's. Lex looks incompetent because he is. His continued existence is nothing more than an act of mercy on Superman's part.

Your anti-Lexite rantings fall on deaf ears and show a clear lack of comprehension of the character. "Common." :rolleyes: Please.

Supes' rogues galley has been "fleshed out" in the past with the kinds of "kewl" new, overpowered villains you seem to be begging for, and they've generally bombed and no one's wanted to see them again (anyone clamoring for the return of Preus, for example?), preferring instead the classic rogues with actual substance and staying power, such as Lex and Braniac or the current revampings of Bizarro and Zod over in ACTION.

[karasu]

Your anti-Lexite rantings fall on deaf ears and show a clear lack of comprehension of the character. "Common." :rolleyes: Please.

Supes' rogues galley has been "fleshed out" in the past with the kinds of "kewl" new, overpowered villains you seem to be begging for, and they've generally bombed and no one's wanted to see them again (anyone clamoring for the return of Preus, for example?), preferring instead the classic rogues with actual substance and staying power, such as Lex and Braniac or the current revampings of Bizarro and Zod over in ACTION.

I said nothing of overpowered villains, and if those guys didn't stand the test it had more to do with writing than anything else. Like Preus. You can't just keep doing the kryptonian villain thing over and over again and expect it to be interesting.

You don't seem to understand. Lex is common because he's overused! From comics, to movies, to Tv Shows. Is it even possible for him to surprise an audience anymore? Jesus, look at Batman. You don't see The Joker showing up every other month.

[brundlefly]

Jesus, look at Batman. You don't see The Joker showing up every other month.

Actually, yeah, you do these days.

And Lex's presence in the Supes books is akin to the way Wilson Fisk showed up so many issues of Daredevil while he was Kingpin of NYC's underworld. Both were recurring characters & supporting cast members more than they were "event villains," breaking out of jail and trying to destroy the city or kill the hero (like the Joker, for instance). Lex's role as LexCorp CEO (and later as President) meant that of course he was going to have high visibility and recurring appearances in the Superman books, particularly if a story was set in Metropolis. Why not complain that Lois or the Kents or the Daily Planet staff were "overused" because they "showed up every other month?"

[karasu]

Why not complain that Lois or the Kents or the Daily Planet staff were "overused" because they "showed up every other month?"



hahaha, yeah His wife and his job are SO overused! That doesn't even make sense. Lookit, I think Luthor has too much time in the spotlight. People often complain that Superman is overpowered, not because he's actually overpowered, he's no more powerful than Thor or the Silver Surfer. Its because half of the time they see him face off against a villian, it's Lex Luthor who's schemes have become a joke, in all mediums. Real estate scams, brainwashing Bizarro with prolonged exposure to a television set, kryptonite for the 933rd time etc etc. It's enough for pity's sake. It's not that Lex hasn't been involved in some great stories. It's that a hero is only as strong as his foil, and Lex has failed so many times that he almost seems harmless. If you want to add an element of danger to the books, don't take away Superman's powers, give Lex a break. Pump up Darkseid, or Zod, steal Dr. Doom or something, whatever, as long as they're dangerous. But ya know, different strokes and all of that.

Which reminds me, I'd also get rid of kryptonite!

[brundlefly]

hahaha, yeah His wife and his job are SO overused! That doesn't even make sense.

Sure it does. Lex's supporting cast-member role in the Superman books made him a recurring character, just like Lois, the Kents, or the Daily Planet staff. Hence your complaint about him being "overused" would have to apply to them, as well. Is anyone who appears regularly as a supporting cast member in a comic book "overused?" That doesn't make sense, frankly.



it's Lex Luthor who's schemes have become a joke, in all mediums. Real estate scams, brainwashing Bizarro with prolonged exposure to a television set, kryptonite for the 933rd time etc

Pshaw. Every bad guy gets dumbed down or given something stupid in the movies. Lex gets real-estate schemes, Doc Ock gets mind-controlled by his own tentacles, Doom became just another corrupt businessman instead of the ruler of Latveria, etc. Brainwashing Bizarro was simply a plot device used to turn Bizarro from a comedic goofball into a serious and deadly threat to Superman; Lex was just the means to that end. And every Superman rogue tries to take Supes down with Kryptonite. Now there's an element of the Superman books that's overused. Lex's other "schemes" in the comics have been pretty successful, actually: starting and successfully running a billion-dollar company and guiding the future of Metropolis, capturing the US Presidency, winning the OWAW conflict with Imperiex and Braniac 13, the list goes on. It's killing Superman that's stymied him, which for a perfectionist like Lex means that of course he's going to try again until he gets the job done. :D



Pump up Darkseid

A common complaint among Darkseid fans is that he was depowered so that Superman could go toe-to-toe with him and believably win. I too would like to see Darkseid back to being a nigh-invincible "god" as opposed to just another relatively beatable cosmic Superman rogue like Mongul.



steal Dr. Doom or something, whatever, as long as they're dangerous.

Wouldn't Doom be just as "common" as Lex, though? They're parallel analogues of each other, as Doom also has no superpowers and is instead Marvel's "World's Smartest Man." You seem to find intelligence "cheesy" as a villain's strength, so how could he be considered dangerous in your book if Lex isn't? ;)



Which reminds me, I'd also get rid of kryptonite!

I do agree with that, or at least seriously reducing the amount of it. Between Metallo's Kryptonite heart, the Kryptonite Man, Kryptonite meteor showers, Kryptonite rings, and Kryptonite rays, every DC villain should conceivably be packing some green K if it's that plentiful.

[karasu]

Wouldn't Doom be just as "common" as Lex, though? They're parallel analogues of each other, as Doom also has no superpowers and is instead Marvel's "World's Smartest Man." You seem to find intelligence "cheesy" as a villain's strength, so how could he be considered dangerous in your book if Lex isn't?

Doom has these monologues and this arrogance that Lex just can't match. He's probably the coolest villian ever.



A common complaint among Darkseid fans is that he was depowered so that Superman could go toe-to-toe with him and believably win. I too would like to see Darkseid back to being a nigh-invincible "god" as opposed to just another relatively beatable cosmic Superman rogue like Mongul.

Even in the 80's stuff? If so eh, Superman was powered down too, so I can deal with it.

[brundlefly]

Doom has these monologues and this arrogance that Lex just can't match. He's probably the coolest villian ever.

True, Doom's ego and arrogance are pretty much without peer in either DC or Marvel. I was disappointed that none of that persona was brought to the FF movie version. A classic referring-to-himself-in-the-third-person monologue from Doom might have saved that film.


Even in the 80's stuff? If so eh, Superman was powered down too, so I can deal with it.

Most recent complaints about Darkseid's reduced power levels were from his portrayal in the SUPERMAN/BATMAN "Supergirl" arc, when Darkseid was beaten up and tossed into the Source Wall by Supes after a brief fight. I'm on the "Darkseid should go back to being formidably godlike" side of things, as he got defeated by both Supes and Batman almost embarassingly easily in that storyarc. His 80s defeats weren't so bad by comparison. Darkseid is the kind of DC menace that should take the combined efforts of the entire JLA to defeat, not just a one-on-one tussle with Superman.

[Super Buddies Forever]

The only thing I'd want to change about the immediate Post-Crisis Byrne stories is the Legion/Superboy Pocket Universe mess. So Superboy doesn't exist anymore. Let's just make Superman the Legion's inspiration and avoid the convulated mess that was to follow.

Supergirl/Matrix could then simply be a lab experiment created by our universe's Luthor. Kind of like a foxy Bizarro.

[umbc8]

I would have kept Byrne, except for making a couple of changes. Superboy would have stayed in the picture as a time period for learning how to use his powers, plus the Legion/Pocket Universe confusion would be prevented. Supes would be powered down a bit (no super-ventriloquism, no moving planets, no flying fast enough to crack the time barrier), but still more power than Byrne actually gave him.

I also would not have Byrne change Krypton like he did. Being born on earth, maybe not learning about Krypton until later would still keep his humanity, but more stories would open up dealing w/him learning about Krypton.

Lastly, there would be 3 super-books, but not all three would be Superman. Byrne could take the main Superman book (continuing numbering instead of restarting), and develop the new history of Superboy in a Superboy book (that could occasionally crossover with Legion). Then I would give Action the the "Crisis" team of Wolfman and Perez (although, if Perez is too busy with Wonder Woman, Ordway would work too).