Justice Straight league

[Jason1Kent]

why isn't there a gay cahracter in the new JLA? I mean DC seem to want to show multicultural society but when it comes to the JLA? I think this is abit of a cop out if you ask me.

[rajah1]

I can't see it as being a cop out, hell not every race and sexual orientation can be represented on every team, who knows whether a gay character will join later on or not..meanwhile there are teams like Outsiders that have more than one gay or bi character in them.

[marshal99]

Damn , why is there no asian in the team , it's racist i say. Damn the writers. ;)

[shaunyc56]

Superman and Wonderwoman aren't going to be in the League? That's news to me.

[Kannoos]

Why should anyone even care about the sexual orientation of superheroes in the JLA? Putting an openly gay character in would just be a publicity stunt and wouldn't actually make the storylines better or anything.

[Hush Little Batman]

Damn you DC. On your new super team you failed to show diversity by including characters to represent Latinos, Arabs, Native Americans, Asians, Mongolians, Homosexuals, Bisexuals, Transsexuals and Transvestites. DC should stand for "Diversity Censored". :mad:

J/K :p

[Calybos]

I prefer to think that the League has probably had several gay members... but their teammates were too heroic to even inquire about it one way or the other.

You don't see them prying into each other's religion very often, do you? Same deal.

[Captain Atom]

Tasmanian Devil's you know, Obsidian. :rolleyes:

[Brack360]

Maybe Batwoman could join after 52 wraps up.

[The Spirit]

Why isn't there a character with a Hypo-thyroid condition on the team?

[Bored at 3:00AM]

There have been four openly gay and bi-sexual members of the JLA that I can remember.

[Constantine Drakon]

Interesting. I was just reading a thread on the dcboards where people were moaning about how trying to diversify the League was ruining it. Personally I think those people were wrong, but I don't think DC should be creating the team to try and make sure there's a gay man, a gay woman, a black man, a black woman, and asian man, an asian woman, Superman, Superwoman... etc.

[Armless Penguin]

I don't know--Roy and Hal are awfully close . . .

[Nstar83]

What character fits the bill for JLA member ship that is gay.Not to many top tier Characters are gay.I think outing an established char at this point would just give me a very very big headache when the fanboys would start to complain

[Hush Little Batman]

Why isn't there a character with a Hypo-thyroid condition on the team?

Don't forget about Hypochondriacs.

[Jack Zodiac]

Being gay doesn't make a character any more interesting, and not having a gay representitive on a team doesn't make a book an less interesting. Crappy writing does. Wanna' shove a random gay character on the League, get ready for some crappy writing, because if someone didn't intend on using a character when they started their story, imagine how well off that character's going to be during that run.

Batwoman's a good example. She was pumped up by D Didi as lesbian Batfamily heroine, and she's shown up all of twice, neither of which occasion was she very developed upon. Throw her in the League and all you have is an uninteresting lesbian character who's out of place in the book, not because of her sexuality, but because nobody knows or cares who the hell she is.

There's a huge spectrum of diversity in comics already. There's no need to ruin what could be decent books by forcing diversity on them. If, in the future, somebody has a good idea for a League line-up that includes a gay character or two, then great. They can write their story with a good grasp of every single character they're using and make it a good run. If you try to force gay characters into books you wind up with crap like... well, like Outsiders.

[Sandy Hausler]

Damn you DC. On your new super team you failed to show diversity by including characters to represent Latinos, Arabs, Native Americans, Asians, Mongolians, Homosexuals, Bisexuals, Transsexuals and Transvestites. DC should stand for "Diversity Censored". :mad:

J/K :p

You forgot Jews, you anti-Semite.<g>

Sandy Hausler

[dupersuper]

Wasn't Bluejay supposedly gay? Taz and Obsidian were already mentioned. Any one else?

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Wasn't Bluejay supposedly gay? Taz and Obsidian were already mentioned. Any one else?

Yep, Bluejay, Tazmanian Devil, Obsidian and Ice Maiden, the one with blue skin, not the one that was in love with Guy.

[Ontir]

While crappy writing is always a hurdle to be dealt with, so is the opinion that things are better if "they" aren't bothered with. I'm not saying that's what's been said here, though some comments seemed to be in the neighbourhood. (I always remember Jesse Jackson's line that there's always an issue with quotas where the number is higher than 0.)

If Batwoman fails, it's because no one made an effort to make her interesting, and to get readers connected with her, not because she's a lesbian character. It might've been nice, if Batman had refused to take part in the new JLA because of recently revealed events, or was less present because of it, and chose Batwoman as his stand-in.

[The Batman]

Interesting. I was just reading a thread on the dcboards where people were moaning about how trying to diversify the League was ruining it. Personally I think those people were wrong, but I don't think DC should be creating the team to try and make sure there's a gay man, a gay woman, a black man, a black woman, and asian man, an asian woman, Superman, Superwoman... etc.

Yup, for every one person who wants to see greater diversity in thier comics there seems to be a bunch of people that will complain that this diversity is ruining comics. This isn't because they're racist or homophobic or sexist or whatever but because there attatched to the idea of things always staying like they remember them.

[IamtheRock3]

Why should anyone even care about the sexual orientation of superheroes in the JLA? Putting an openly gay character in would just be a publicity stunt and wouldn't actually make the storylines better or anything.


I dont know..they put openly hetros

So if done right mention the homosexualness shouldnt be any force then mention someone romance with the ladies.

not saying they have to put a gay guy, promblem to much trouble poltically to try it. It WOULD become politcal from both side. Not that it should bit it

[IamtheRock3]

Best way to do it is something like

KISS KISS BANG BANG

Dude gay, surprise for a second, then really didnt make a big deal

Same with DR WHO

They had a bi sexual guy who now a spin off in Torchwood. They cracked a few jokes at first but the whole thing never seem really force and is a popular charcter


a BAD example

Batgirl


Promblem is in comics. you dealing with establish heroes. Who mostly white and straight. so any diversity is going to seem force. Because ANY new charcter is force, I dont care what there diveristy is. Putting a new charcter in a spotlight is hard

[malephoenix]

Yup, for every one person who wants to see greater diversity in thier comics there seems to be a bunch of people that will complain that this diversity is ruining comics. This isn't because they're racist or homophobic or sexist or whatever but because there attatched to the idea of things always staying like they remember them.

Personally, I really enjoy change. When it makes sense. But change just for the sake of diversification usually ends up nosediving. It looks good on paper, but sucks in execution. I'm one of only two white guys in the Minority Student Association at my university, and I'm the Vice Pres. I *am* the *only* white guy at my church. I sincerely enjoy diversity.

But I've learned that if it's a mandate, it usually results in bad feelings, frustration, and just a poor execution. "Justice Diverse League of America" isn't the way to make the book more diverse. There's a difference b/t a company mandate to diversify characters and characters that simply happen to be diverse.

It's not that I want things to stay the same - I make a stand to make things change, actually. But I don't like it when all of the sudden, JLA becomes Super Street Fighter II with no solid story to back that up.

[Jason1Kent]

Bluejay is gay?.............................................. .............it rhymes!

[cactusmaac]

I'm not white but it's never bothered me the JLA doesn't have a representative of my ethnic group. I read the comic for the stories and action.

[Jack]

I demand that the Justice League cater to my specific minority! No Jewish schizophrenics? HOW DARE THEY!

[Sijo]

Superhero comics should be about superheroes; there can be other subjects like race, sex or religion but they should ALWAYS be secondary. There are other places to handle those subjects better.

In the case of homosexuality, it should only matter on who gets to hook up with whom. If a heroine hits on a fellow hero and it turns out he's gay, that should be awkward but they should handle it as adults and just move on.

Comics should also wait until society finds it acceptable to show gay people making out/having sex. Right now it's considered controversial or lurid (though I see no reason why it should be.) Adding such scenes today just comes across as exploitative (see the (mis)use of Montoya in 52.) I believe we are headed toward more tolerant times; years ago something like Will and Grace would never have been acceptable on TV. But we still have some ways to go.

[Shellhead]

why isn't there a gay cahracter in the new JLA? I mean DC seem to want to show multicultural society but when it comes to the JLA? I think this is abit of a cop out if you ask me.

Suffering Sappho! What about Wonder Woman?

[mswood]

Yeah unforuately DC (and MArvel) are long running companies with its primary characters long ago being established as heterosexual.

Until fairly recently (as for as publishing history) neither company would ever show a gay hero (or if they did it was short lived).

So its going to be a while before a gay character can build any sort of fan base or be that prominent of character to really belong on the premier super team.

Nor as a gay man do I expect it.

The only time quota's really work for me is when its a storyline (see the Avengers 181. That worked. For that team (and well for that matter).

But it certainly wouldn't fly for most teams.

[Hellstormer]

This thread is ridiculous, having a team that MUST have a gay character is stupid, look at the police or the fire department some of those don't have gays or asians or blacks thats because either they didn't want to do it, had other priorities, or weren't qualified it wasn't because the departments were trying to make a statement.

[Mia]

Interesting. I was just reading a thread on the dcboards where people were moaning about how trying to diversify the League was ruining it. Personally I think those people were wrong, but I don't think DC should be creating the team to try and make sure there's a gay man, a gay woman, a black man, a black woman, and asian man, an asian woman, Superman, Superwoman... etc.


Oh I agree. Anything done for the sake of 'political correctness' saps creativity. I think that most of us are more interested in reading about good story telling. I am more interested in picking up a book based on the writing or the art work than simply due to the book catering to my 'group'. I think if people want to be represented then they or affirmation they should seek it elsewhere.




I'm not white but it's never bothered me the JLA doesn't have a representative of my ethnic group. I read the comic for the stories and action.

WORD.

That's all that should count. That's what I shell my hard earned money out for.




I demand that the Justice League cater to my specific minority! No Jewish schizophrenics? HOW DARE THEY!

LOL!

[IamtheRock3]

promblem is adding a gay guy

it almost HAS to be force. Sense comics worlld didnt have them for so long. So no matter how you do it, it will seem force

So you got to wait till society ready

When will they be. I dont know..now till forever.

So dont hold your breath. These things take Decades

Ethics groups a little more natural in a big City. I mean if you have a comic that new York like marvel. You really should see more then whites running around.

Same with city base stories like
Batman
Superman

But you dont HAVE to do
Think it makes more of a melting pot type story. Make the city come to life.

[Shellhead]

Actually, DC already has a Justice League with prominent gay members: The Authority. Okay technically it's Wildstorm, but DC owns Wildstorm and publishes their comics. Apollo and the Midnighter are very obviously gay Superman and gay Batman.

[Joker2503]

The problem with homosexual characters thus far in comics is that almost every character they try to introduce is a "GAY character", not a character who happens to be gay. I can't think of any comic characters that are homosexual and their homosexuality isn't the focal point.

I have no problem with a character in the JLA who is attracted to members of the same sex. I do have a problem with DC sticking in a gay character just to say they have one.

[Jason1Kent]

I think that if there was a gay character, it would be cool as it would give thw gay community a hero they can identify with. Midnighter worked well as does Northstar in Marvel!

Like the idea of BlueJay having WonderWoman as a Fag Hag! aswell as an icon ofcourse!

[Loren]

What Southerners as the Justice League had as members? I'm thinking mostly of characters who grew up in the South, but transplants (like Hawkgirl) can merit a mention too.

[dazzler_slave]

The problem with homosexual characters thus far in comics is that almost every character they try to introduce is a "GAY character", not a character who happens to be gay. I can't think of any comic characters that are homosexual and their homosexuality isn't the focal point.

I have no problem with a character in the JLA who is attracted to members of the same sex. I do have a problem with DC sticking in a gay character just to say they have one.
Actually, that's what I loved about the inclusion of Tasmanian Devil on the JLA back in the 90's. It was NEVER an issue that he was gay. He was a hero first. In fact he never really mentioned it. The only time it really came up was when he screamed and ran away when he found the female Dr. Light in his bed. The opposite happened with Ice Maiden. They made her being a lesbian the main focus of her character. All she ever did was lust after Fire, and turn down Atom Smasher when he asked her out and basically tried to out Obsidian by suggesting to Atom Smasher that they were more like lovers than friends. Some of these story issues would have been very interesting...if there had been more to Sigrid's character than just "The Lesbian". Instad, they watered down the book.

As a gay man, I wouldn't be sad to see a gay or lesbian character join the JLA as long as the character joining made sense. I don't want to see someone like Batwoman join just for media coverage. However, I don't think including a gay character would automatically make it a quota fill. If the character's joining makes sense, then their sexuality would just be an interesting facet of the character that could be used if the writer had a good story to tell.

[Count Vertigo]

A cop out? Oh come off it. How is it a cop out?

[Armless Penguin]

The problem with homosexual characters thus far in comics is that almost every character they try to introduce is a "GAY character", not a character who happens to be gay. I can't think of any comic characters that are homosexual and their homosexuality isn't the focal point.

Actually, there are quite a few gay characters I'd label a character who happens to be gay: Billy Kaplan, Teddy Altman, Holly Robinson, to a lesser extent Karolina Dean, and Ultimate Colossus before Kirkman's whole Nightcrawler thing not least among them.

[geordiesteve]

I demand an all white, all heterosexual, aged between 25-40, liberal, good god-fearing christian, vegetarian, environmentally-friendly and non-polluting JLA! That's what I want to see.

That was sarcasm for anyone who missed it.

Around Comics did an excellent podcast on this subject last week http://www.aroundcomics.com, about homosexuality in comics, they talked about when it appears and how it is handled, they talk about the Batwoman thing, and the difference between a character who happens to be gay, straight, bi, etc vs a GAY character. Yes, hello, I'm a giant gay man, oh and I also save people from crime, but mostly I'm gay, gay gay!! Also mentioned is NorthStar and how he was handled, and so on.

My opinion. If a particular comic is written to be an escape, then the creative team can have anyone type of character they like on the team. That is their choice. If it's are written to be representative of the society and world in which we currently live, so that people of diverse backgrounds find it easier to relate to the characters, and the writer wants to echo realistic diversity in this other universe, then diverse characters would be a more fair representation, be it the inclusion of black, white, asian, gay, muslim, jewish or whatever characters.

If their sexuality, or religion for that matter since its such a hot topic these days, is the most important aspect of that character, then that is lame and not something I would ever want to read. Same with tokenism, including someone from a particular minority to be politically correct is lazy, and while it gains media coverage and might cause a temporary spike in sales, the regular and long term comic fans would be the ones who keep the series going or not.

[geordiesteve]

The problem with homosexual characters thus far in comics is that almost every character they try to introduce is a "GAY character", not a character who happens to be gay. I can't think of any comic characters that are homosexual and their homosexuality isn't the focal point.

I have no problem with a character in the JLA who is attracted to members of the same sex. I do have a problem with DC sticking in a gay character just to say they have one.

Midnighter and Apollo started out this way on the Authority when Ellis took over, it wasn't a focus, we knew they were gay, for example I think saw Midnighter brush Apollo's hair in passing or something, but it didn't become the focus until Millar took over and then it was gay cliche central. The gay couple adopts a child and stuff like that, so the focus became on the issues relating to that kind of a situation. I stopped picking it up at that point.

[Sandy Hausler]

I demand an all white, all heterosexual, aged between 25-40, liberal, good god-fearing christian, vegetarian, environmentally-friendly and non-polluting JLA! That's what I want to see.

That was sarcasm for anyone who missed it.

Around Comics did an excellent podcast on this subject last week http://www.aroundcomics.com, about homosexuality in comics, they talked about when it appears and how it is handled, they talk about the Batwoman thing, and the difference between a character who happens to be gay, straight, bi, etc vs a GAY character. Yes, hello, I'm a giant gay man, oh and I also save people from crime, but mostly I'm gay, gay gay!! Also mentioned is NorthStar and how he was handled, and so on.

My opinion. If a particular comic is written to be an escape, then the creative team can have anyone type of character they like on the team. That is their choice. If it's are written to be representative of the society and world in which we currently live, so that people of diverse backgrounds find it easier to relate to the characters, and the writer wants to echo realistic diversity in this other universe, then diverse characters would be a more fair representation, be it the inclusion of black, white, asian, gay, muslim, jewish or whatever characters.

If their sexuality, or religion for that matter since its such a hot topic these days, is the most important aspect of that character, then that is lame and not something I would ever want to read. Same with tokenism, including someone from a particular minority to be politically correct is lazy, and while it gains media coverage and might cause a temporary spike in sales, the regular and long term comic fans would be the ones who keep the series going or not.

The perfect example of a character who happens to be gay was (is) Josiah Power. It was extremely well done by Kurt Busieck.

Sandy Hausler

[Count Vertigo]

Midnighter and Apollo started out this way on the Authority when Ellis took over, it wasn't a focus, we knew they were gay, for example I think saw Midnighter brush Apollo's hair in passing or something, but it didn't become the focus until Millar took over and then it was gay cliche central. The gay couple adopts a child and stuff like that, so the focus became on the issues relating to that kind of a situation. I stopped picking it up at that point.

Exactly. I've nothing against homosexuals (my best friend is a dyke) so if JLA introduced a gay character, I'm for it. But when their sexuality becomes a focus, then it becomes a problem. You don't see other heroes being overly sexual or the like.

[Mulett]

I agree with a lot of the comments on here, but some seem to lack insight.

It does matter, actually, that there are so few Gay characters and a shame the Justice League has no (openly) Gay members so far.

A character's sexuality shouldn't be the main focus of their story. But, at the same time, a character's sexuality is an important part of their life - as we see with all the straight heroes. I don't see anyone complain about the regular references to the Superman/Lois Lane relationship, or the Ollie/Dinah relationship for instance.

Anyone can be Gay, across any race or nationality. So a Gay character would actually be representing a very large demographic in one go. It needn't be a big deal, and it needn't be the only reason a character is in the new League. But, still, it would have been a very positive step to have had a Gay character in the new line up.

[kalorama]

But, still, it would have been a very positive step to have had a Gay character in the new line up.

But that implies not having one is somehow a negative step, and it isn't. Just as there's no intrinsic reason not to have one, there's really no intrinsic reason to have one. Just as there's no reason to specifically exclude Black Lightning or Vixen from the team and there's no reason to specifically include them on the team (other than the creators simply wanting them to be there).

The primary concern of any storyteller in creating and developing characters should be what helps tell the story.

[mattx110]

I demand that the Justice League cater to my specific minority! No Jewish schizophrenics? HOW DARE THEY!
you're looking in the wrong place. moon knight just got a relaunch a few months ago.

and well... if hawkman is on the team, that's close enouhg to a gay person as i need. maybe one time he sleeps with someone he thinks is a reincarnation of hawkgirl, and it turns out to be fred hawk... it could happen.

and having a gay character join the jla wouldn't ever be forced, because, well, the jla has had a million members over the years. including martian manhunter who can turn into a woman if he wants. with aliens, robots, lizardpeople and birdpeople as former jla members, a gay member would be kinda conservative.

[Magneto_X]

Damn , why is there no asian in the team , it's racist i say. Damn the writers. ;)

Wrong.

The second Dr.Light was Asian.

[kalorama]

But she's not on the team.