USM 101: Spoilers

[gliderpilotgirl]

Wow..this is officially the crappiest USM issue I have ever read. After 100, I was really counting on this one issue to pick up it. It didn't..It crapped on two key characters..Gwen and Mary Jane. Gwen, as Carnage went on a rampage with the FF stepping in, and Richard claimed that he doesn't know what happened to Gwen, she came to him like that. At the end of the fight Carnage depowered into Gwen. Aunt May was being taken away by Sue for medical treatment, as Richard had suddenly forgotten his medical skills. ( Me thinks he is a clone etc..not the real deal. )
And then, to top it off, Kaine revealed he had injected MJ with Oz. She appeared okay at first, then she got angry at him, ( rightfully so ) and transformed into a huge red sasquatch goblin.
Wow..what a disappointment. If Death of the Goblin is about MJ. I am so done with this book.

[Effect]

Thanks Gilder but not be unappreciative but can someone else post a summary of actual events without the personal opinion. An objective review and summary I mean. Thanks.

[Sparda]

I was about to make this thread but he beat me to it. Don't listen to him THIS ISSUE OWNS BIG TIME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

S
P
O
I
L
E
R

Basically this, Gwen goes all mad crazy on the drones and are massacaring them while Peter is talking to his dad about getting May to a hospital. Fury shoots with all the slayers at carnage trying to catch her but instead hits parkers house. This pisses peter off and goes out the window in fury and grabbed Nick by the throat demanding that he stop shooting and he'll end up accidently killing may. Fury as usual is a asshole government guy who wants to clean up the spider clone incident to even stoop down to arresting peter and possibly hold him in a cell or kill him. Peter get's shot down by one of the Slayers and fury threatens to shoot him in the head if he does'nt stand down. His gun got roasted by none other than the human torch himself and the FF comes into the scene. Even Johnny mentioning he has 3 friends in the world and won't let fury hurt one of them. Richards demanded an explaination on why Fury is doing so much destruction and that it was'nt even peter's fault that he got cloned. Carnage meanwhile attacks Ben and threw him into some warehouse (damn!!!!). Sue meanwhile goes into the house and takes May for treatment while using her shields. Carnage all of a sudden attacks Reed (it was funny you should read this) while reed tries to examine her. Fury ordered all the slayers to fire at carnage even knowing reed is in the crossfire and she reverts back to Gwen. Peter lays on his knees crying and cursing Fury and wondering if his aunt will be alright.
Don't know what happend to Reed though.

Edit: oh ya forgot to mention that MJ turned into some kind of red wendigo monster and is about to attack ult Kaine.

Oh ya Fury says in a funny dialogue that Peter was the worst thing since the hulk became the hulk. Spidey got lime light :)

END OF SPOILERS

My final thoughts................. BRING ON THE NEXT ISSUE!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[gliderpilotgirl]

I was about to make this thread but he beat me to it. Don't listen to him THIS ISSUE OWNS BIG TIME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

S
P
O
I
L
E
R

Basically this, Gwen goes all mad crazy on the drones and are massacaring them while Peter is talking to his dad about getting May to a hospital. Fury shoots with all the slayers at carnage trying to catch her but instead hits parkers house. This pisses peter off and goes out the window in fury and grabbed Nick by the throat demanding that he stop shooting and he'll end up accidently killing may. Fury as usual is a asshole government guy who wants to clean up the spider clone incident to even stoop down to arresting peter and possibly hold him in a cell or kill him. Peter get's shot down by one of the Slayers and fury threatens to shoot him in the head if he does'nt stand down. His gun got roasted by none other than the human torch himself and the FF comes into the scene. Even Johnny mentioning he has 3 friends in the world and won't let fury hurt one of them. Richards demanded an explaination on why Fury is doing so much destruction and that it was'nt even peter's fault that he got cloned. Carnage meanwhile attacks Ben and threw him into some warehouse (damn!!!!). Sue meanwhile goes into the house and takes May for treatment while using her shields. Carnage all of a sudden attacks Reed (it was funny you should read this) while reed tries to examine her. Fury ordered all the slayers to fire at carnage even knowing reed is in the crossfire and she reverts back to Gwen. Peter lays on his knees crying and cursing Fury and wondering if his aunt will be alright.
Don't know what happend to Reed though.

Edit: oh ya forgot to mention that MJ turned into some kind of red wendigo monster and is about to attack ult Kaine.

Oh ya Fury says in a funny dialogue that Peter was the worst thing since the hulk became the hulk. Spidey got lime light :)

END OF SPOILERS

goodness...I'm a SHE!! not a he, but anyways..I suppose if you like a big brawl the issue would be cool. But there was some out-of-character-ness going on..first all, Fury usually has some contingency plan..And the FF seemed a little too eager to trounce Fury. I didn't mind that part too badly, though I am still disliking the idea of Gwen being Carnage. What upset me the most was the hulking out of MJ. If they are going to give her powers they could have done it gracefully..not Harry part 2. Well...we are agreed that we eagerly await the next issue.

[robbrooks78]

I liked the issue, but I was upset by the ad for Ultimate Power that they dropped right into the middle of a 2 page spread. I read the whole first page wondering what I was missing, until I found the 2nd page.

[Effect]

Well does Fury even know about Carnage. If he's not heard about it then he wouldn't have planned for it. That part seems simple enough. As for the Fantastic Four, as I understand it they don't actually like Fury or are buddy buddy with him either. They started out as a government think tank and it isn't as if they can break away on their own.

It comes down to Shield having way to much power in this universe but I have a feeling that will change. With the Fantastic Four in somewhat of an open revolt against Fury's troops in order to protect Peter and his family. With the X-men suppose to be getting in on this I don't think his hold on power is going to last. Especailly if all these teams are suppose to continue after this. Then there are the Ultimates but I don't know what their relationship is like with Fury.

MJ being turned into a Goblin I pretty much assumed was going to happen with her being locked in the Osborune lab. Seemed like a logical conclusion on my part. Especailly with the next arc being called what it's being called. Killing her might be a bad idea. However this furthers my feeling that she'll want nothing to do with Peter or Spider-man after things settle down. To much has happen to her in relation to Peter.

[kel25]

Aunt May was being taken away by Sue for medical treatment, as Richard had suddenly forgotten his medical skills.
I want to make it clear that I have NOT read the issue at the time I wrote this response. Like you said she was taking May away for medical treatment. What were you expecting Richard to do? He had no real medical facilities to treat her with because, OMG, they were in a civilian house. Kind of hard to treat such a major condition without the proper equipment.

I’m a pretty good mechanic but if my engine throws a rod noone would expect me to be able to fix it without getting it to a garage with proper equipment.

[gliderpilotgirl]

I want to make it clear that I have NOT read the issue at the time I wrote this response. Like you said she was taking May away for medical treatment. What were you expecting Richard to do? He had no real medical facilities to treat her with because, OMG, they were in a civilian house. Kind of hard to treat such a major condition without the proper equipment.

Ok..it's not so much that he didn't do anything..he appeared to not be capable.
Sue walked in and asked him if she had had a heart attack or a stroke..had he been using the first aid kit. etc.. all stuff he could have done. No, he said he didn't know. As a trained doctor, he should have been able to tell the diff between them, or at least try to to help. Heck, I could tell the diff and I know what to do and I only have first aid training!

[ultimatespyder20]

Ok, I haven't read this issue yet either. Hope to God it gets here by the end of the week, but from what I read it's sounds pretty cool. MJ transforming into some goblin was expected. The whole fight with Gwen doesn't sound to ba either, but what about the next arc. If the whole "Death of the Goblin" is abouth Mj dieing, well idk. I don't really think that would be a route to take. I mean think of the story possiblitys now. MJ is now some goblin creature, this could rly show some stories where maybe so runs away, and tries to figure out her life. Really show her facing this problem. I mean why not write about this instead of just ending it. Still, I haven't read this issue yet, hope it gets here soon.

Alec

[Shadow ES]

I hope MJ isn't the goblin who dies in the next arc, but then I don't really want any of them to die yet. They still have a lot of potential in them, and their death would just be cheapened by the knowledge that it'll be retconed before issue 200.

[ultimatespyder20]

I hope MJ isn't the goblin who dies in the next arc, but then I don't really want any of them to die yet. They still have a lot of potential in them, and their death would just be cheapened by the knowledge that it'll be retconed before issue 200.

I also feel the same way. I hope Bendis just doesn't kill off one of the three coolest and biggest characters in the series when they have been barely been used. They have so much story for them. It would just be stupid.

Alec

[gliderpilotgirl]

I also feel the same way. I hope Bendis just doesn't kill off one of the three coolest and biggest characters in the series when they have been barely been used. They have so much story for them. It would just be stupid.

Alec

At least we seem to all be agreed on that. Who else do you consider big 3?
Gwen or May? I am assuming Peter is the first. For some reason, I think Bendis may be banking on our reactions to this. He mentioned somewhere that he had to talk his editor off a fence on one thing..I am BETTING it's MJ. For some reason, Death of the Goblin MJ may be too obvious for him. I still hope it's Norman. Well..on the bright side..if this doesn't kill her, and she looks normal um, normally..any guys to attack her would be freakin' suicidal!

[Red Lotus]

I like this issue alot. I hope Gwen isn't a clone but the real deal. Who knows what Ultimate Carnage did to her. So maybe it is her. I dont want Richard to die at the end of this arc. I think they can do so many stories with him. Is Mj now the Ultimate Goblin Queen. Don't know. I don't think this is going to end good for her. They may think she back to normal but they thought the same thing with Harry.

[caney]

This story arc has really thrown me for a loop. I have no clue what to expect next, which is fun, but it's so crazy it almost feels like a what if? story.

Obviously Fury knows more than anyone else what is actually going on, but I was very confused about his actions. I don't see how taking Peter into custody can really be his top priority, when he talks about this being "the biggest genetic disaster we've had since the Hulk became the Hulk." Shouldn't he be going after the people responsible for all the cloning? How is locking Peter up going to help the situation?

I'm not sure I like having Mary Jane turn into whatever she turned into, but I must admit it will make a great scene when Peter has to take her down.

Also, is it just my issue or did everyone else have an Ultimate Power preview split up panels that stretched across two pages? I didn't even realize it until after flipping passed the preview. :confused:

[wolp]

No way this is the crappiest USM issue ever...I take the Doctor Strange issue as worse than this anyday. This was a solid issue.

[stillanerd]

So... instead of MJ turning into the Ultimate version of Man-Spider, she turns into the Ultimate version of Sasquatch? Geez, if Bendis does kill her off in this saga, then you'll see a sharper decline in sales of this book moreso than when Bagley leaves. And is it just me or is the idea of the Fantastic Four being involved in what is supposed to be a major turning point for Ultimate Spider-Man seem necessary? I mean, why not Curt Conners, who certainly has far more connections to this story, let alone Spidey's world than the FF. Course the original clone saga had guest appearances by the Punisher and New Warriors for cross-promotion purposes and its the same thing here.

Well, I'm still thinking that the only way she's going to get cured is, thanks to the fact that since Doc Ock is the only one who knows how the OZ formula actually works, Spidey's going to turn to him for help. I'm still saying "Richard" is full of it, not only because he claims not to know any medical skills--which is automatic BS considering how he supposed to be a geneticist, meaning he had to have taking some knowledge of basic medicine as part of his education--but also the notion he wasn't responsible for having Gwen be Carnage. Maybe not, but he certainly did know about her "condition." His saying he found her that way could actually mean that he "found her" when Ben Reilly provided him and whoever he's working for with the Carnage sample that contained Gwen's DNA. All I can say that unless Bendis states otherwise (let's see, seven part story extended to eight, only three issues left, with no clue as to who is behind this? Anyone think this is NOT going to be rushed at the end?) I'm not really buying Richard's the real deal and I'm certainly not buying the notion that he's all that squeaky clean and just wants to catch up on the missing years of Peter's life.

[Expletive Deleted]

I mean, why not Curt Conners, who certainly has far more connections to this story, let alone Spidey's world than the FF.The FF are more fun. And more useful in a fight scene.
... considering how he supposed to be a geneticist, meaning he had to have taking some knowledge of basic medicine as part of his educationGenetics isn't a medical degree. Some people with medical degrees do genetics and some geneticists also have medical degrees, but there's not necessarily an overlap.

[stillanerd]

The FF are more fun. And more useful in a fight scene.

True on both counts. :) Just saying that for a "personal story" in Ultimate Spider-Man history to have the FF involved this late in the game seems too much like an attempt at promoting Ultimate FF, which of course is Marvel's perogative.


Genetics isn't a medical degree. Some people with medical degrees do genetics and some geneticists also have medical degrees, but there's not necessarily an overlap.

I never said genetics was a medical degree. What I said was that one would probably have to have a basic knowledge of medicine if they worked with genetics. Especially when you consider that things like cell biology, biochemistry, and microbiology--which are medical degrees as far as I know--involve genetics and gene therapy. And also, Richard is supposed to be a biologist who was working on a cure for cancer, meaning that at some level he is a doctor, which means as part of his training, he had to take some level of basic medicine, especially if he's a medical school graduate. Perhaps his speciality is not cariovasualar surgury, but he should know enough about medicine and biology to know how to take care of a patient, especially Aunt May.

[Expletive Deleted]

cell biology, biochemistry, and microbiology--which are medical degrees as far as I know--Nope.

Working in a field related to the human body isn't the same thing as knowing anything about medicine, especially if it's microscale rather than macroscale. I know researchers who could tell you a million things about cancer cells but couldn't tell the difference between a pancreas and a spleen if their lives depended on it.

A buddy of mine does computer simulations of the biochemical pathways in genetically modified cells, and he has no practical medical knowledge whatsoever.

[megabyte01]

Man, that was a crazy issue.


so, we have Gwen/Carnage trashing all the robots outside Peter's house. when richard offers to help Aunt May after she passed out, peter finally wises up and says no to a mad scientist offering medical assistance (i'm looking at you, Conners). Richard said something about Gwen coming to him this way, and he was just trying to help her. I'm starting to think he's full of it after his story last issue. if he isn't full of bs, then is Gwen/Carnage the real Gwen Stacey?

Putting aside the question of legitimacy for the moment, Gwen/Carnage is real enough to trash all of the Tinkerer's robots, mainly because he forgot to program them to engage targets other than Spider-Man. then, Peter jumps out in a fury to stop Fury (i couldn't help myself). Peter makes a good effort, but he is shot in the back, and Gwen/Carnage is having too much fun trashing the robots to help him. Just when it looks to be lights out for Peter, The Fantastic Four come in to save the day! (I have to say though, since they put out the call to Fury that got him out in Forest Hills in the first place, maybe they would have helped Peter more by NOT calling Fury, like they said they would. I can't wait to see Peter's face when he finds out!) (by the way, Bendis? do not use the word "Geekasm" in USM ever again!)

So, while poor comic relief Ben gets tossed into a store a couple blocks away, Sue goes in to help Peter's aunt and Reed takes a look at Gwen/Carnage (you guys got a better name?). Sue airlifts Aunt May out of the house because Richard is not that kind of a doctor. while Sue takes her out of the house, Reed is trying to question an uncooperative Gwen/Carnage, and he says a couple of things older marvel fans will find funny. not that May and Richard are on their way to the hospital, Peter redoubles his efforts get to Fury. In response, Fury orders his troopers to "Do it. Full Power" then, a large blue blast that no one is going to miss. Everyone is stunned by the impact. they all look on in amazement to see...

a confused and naked (but still convieniently covered by smoke trails) Gwen is standing in the street, with a bunch of guns pointed at her. She passes out without saying a word. Peter cries while Jonny and Ben oogle in disbelief and Reed starts taking notes (note to editor: where did Reed get this notebook all of a sudden?) Poor Peter is dumbfounded by everything. When he asks Fury whe he did, Pruy says "You didn't do anything. It was your clones." he seems to be genuinely sorry for what he did. Still, he knows more than he is letting on about the clones. I'm sure if it.

Last, (and in my opinion least) we are back at oscorp. "Kaine" has let MJ out of her glass bottle, and you can see poor Tarantula on the floor. she seems fine at first, but she becomes more angry and distraight as "Kaine" tries to justify wht he did to her. MJ wigs out, then transforms into a red, hairy version of the goblin. Note that the angle is a little off. We could be seeing this transpire from Tarantula's point of view.

I said earlier that the last part of the issue was my least favorite part. that is because because i don't believe this is the right way to go with MJ as a character. after all the time spent developing her, Bendis is just going to turn her into a monster and make her another of spidey's villians? Still, at least she didn't become some kind of man(or woman?)-spider. That would have been overkill.

[stillanerd]

Nope.

Working in a field related to the human body isn't the same thing as knowing anything about medicine, especially if it's microscale rather than macroscale. I know researchers who could tell you a million things about cancer cells but couldn't tell the difference between a pancreas and a spleen if their lives depended on it.

A buddy of mine does computer simulations of the biochemical pathways in genetically modified cells, and he has no practical medical knowledge whatsoever.

Thanks for the correction. And yes, there would be medical researchers or technicians who would specialize in certain areas. And I'll grant you that those who study cancer cells wouldn't necessarily know much about emergency medical procedures. However, if you're talking about someone who is a biologist, which Richard Parker is, and who specialized in cancer research, which Richard Parker did, I would imagine he has to have taken some courses in medicine. For example, here's part of the cirriculum for the NYU
School of Medicine for FIRST YEAR medical students:


The first year lays the groundwork for an in-depth understanding of human biology. Teaching sequences are arranged to demonstrate the relevance of basic science to clinical science and set the stage for an understanding of the sociological aspects of medicine.

The Macroscopic Structure and Development of the Human Body module consists of two units, Anatomy and Embryology. This module introduces students to the structural organization and development of the human body at the macroscopic level. The two units use a variety of approaches to stimulate student-student interactive learning and to facilitate faculty-guided instruction. The Anatomy laboratory sessions include demonstrations by students and discussions of their findings. The Embryology unit includes the study of both normal human development and abnormalities of medical importance.

The Cell Structure and Function module consists of the Biochemistry, Molecular Biology, Genetics, Cell Biology, and Cellular Physiology units. The objective of this module is to provide an integrated view of key cellular processes at the molecular level, and to relate them to normal human development and function and also to the diagnosis and treatment of human disease.

The Host Defense module integrates material in Microbiology, Parasitology, and Immunology. Viruses, bacteria, fungi, protozoa, and helminths are studied as biologic agents of infectious disease. Emphasis is placed on life cycles, epidemiology, pathology, clinical symptoms, treatment and prevention of disease. Study of the immunological system and the molecular nature of its response to infection are integrated throughout this module.

In the Tissues and Organs module, the Histology and Physiology units expand the introduction to normal and abnormal biology. Among the topics covered are: the maintenance of equilibrium of the organism, especially in situations of stress; the means of communication among various cell groups; and the mechanisms of exchanging products of anabolism and catabolism.

http://www.med.nyu.edu/medicaldegree/curriculum/first.html

And here's the second year:


The year begins with an introduction to the principles of pharmacokinetics and pathological disease processes shared among organ systems. With this background, students enter an extensive, integrated Mechanisms of Disease module. The pathology, pathophysiology, and pharmacology of disease are approached in an organ-system-based, multidisciplinary manner centered around problem-solving. This instruction is fully coordinated with acquisition of clinical skills through the parallel Skills and Science of Doctoring module. The emphasis is on relating pathogenic mechanisms to the clinical manifestations of disease; introductory lectures are followed by precepted, small group discussions, seminars, and student-patient sessions.

The Skills and Science of Doctoring is a longitudinal, interdisciplinary module that spans the first two years of the curriculum. Within the first few weeks of medical school, students—in the very small precepted Patient Narrative unit—encounter patients and illness. Later in the first year and throughout the second year of training—in The Physician, Patient and Society I and II—they learn communication skills; grapple with questions of medical ethics, cultural diversity, disease prevention, and professionalism; and begin the development of clinical skills, including history-taking, physical examination, and evidence-based decision-making. These skills are reinforced and further developed during the Physical Diagnosis and Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Preventive Medicine units.

http://www.med.nyu.edu/medicaldegree/curriculum/selectives.html

After that comes a two-week clerkship orientation, followed by another year of clinical experience:


The Core Curriculum consists of clerkships in medicine, surgery, psychiatry, obstetrics-gynecology, pediatrics, neurology, ambulatory care medicine, critical care, and advanced medicine. Clerkships provide a rich experience on the wards of our teaching hospitals, where the student learns to deal with the most serious problems in physiological dysfunction. The student becomes a member of the healthcare team and participates in all phases of the patient’s care, from admission through discharge.

The faculty guides the student through the principles of medicine toward a rational understanding of human illness. Bedside instruction is the basic element of teaching in the clinical clerkship. The student learns to integrate the essentials of history-taking, the physical examination, and results of laboratory tests with an understanding of the mechanisms of disease in order to reach a meaningful differential diagnosis. Teaching methods, however, are not limited to direct interaction with patients; they also incorporate standardized patient encounters with observation and feedback, and case studies that vertically integrate and amplify material introduced in the pre-clinical years.

During the Clinical Elective period, students may pursue research or clinical programs at the School of Medicine, its affiliated hospitals, or at other institutions here and abroad. During the clinical elective months, students are encouraged to complete an Independent Study project. Opportunities for projects are available in areas of biomedical research, clinical investigation, urban health, computer science, and many others.

http://www.med.nyu.edu/medicaldegree/curriculum/clinical.html

Then, we have the fourth year:


While their third-year counterparts are participating in the Clerkship Orientation, rising fourth-year students, seasoned with a full year of clinical experience, engage in an in-depth, seminar- and original-literature-based selective in advanced science. Students select from a palette of topics drawn from the frontiers of translational medicine and biomedical technology, making choices based upon their own individualized interests and emerging differentiated focus. Topics include Stem Cell Therapy, Models of Multigenic Disease, Vaccine Development, Neurobiology of Pain, Ion Channels and Disease, DNA Technology in Medicine, Anatomy for Surgeons, and the Microbiology of Bioterrorism.

http://www.med.nyu.edu/medicaldegree/curriculum/selectives.html

I would think that Richard Parker, being a biologist for the treatment of various kinds of cancers, would have gone through medical school and learned about medical procedures and their treatments, including first aid with regards to Aunt May, although I will grant you he could be a bit rusty on a few things. But when you couple this with his story that he told in USM #100--where, if you noticed, he made himself out to be the victim in EVERY INSTANCE, and had a weaker personality in the flashbacks compared to how he presented himself when talking to Peter--and I'm guessing that "Richard" is NOT who he claims to be (Ultimate Chameleon, perhaps? Or is he another clone?) or is deliberately holding something back.

[MrPunch0]

Three words can sum up this issue for me.

WORSE. THAN. GELDOF.

If this is where USM is going - my pull list just got a little smaller. This issue was OK - but those last two pages just jumped the shark.

[sephirothskiller]

I was on the fence about the issue as well, and then saw the last two pages and was like: "Holy shit... An ending like that hasn't happened since... Last issue!!" Who ends two issues in a row with girls getting stressed and transforming into monsters?

THUMB DOWN!

[Young Avenger]

So the disfigured Peter has been identified as Kaine this issue?

[Sean Whitmore]

If this is where USM is going - my pull list just got a little smaller.

If what is where it's going?

I don't see what anyone's complaining about. There's not one thing that's happened so far in this story that suggests to me how the book's going to be afterwards.

That's why I'm digging it so much. Almost anything could happen.


SEAN

[Sean Whitmore]

So the disfigured Peter has been identified as Kaine this issue?

No, and neither would I expect him to. Kaine was just a name a Peter clone took after he'd realized what he was and gone on the run. This one still thinks he's Peter, so he's just...Peter.

But, I mean, yeah, he's basically Kaine. :)


SEAN

[BadAssMofo]

Wow..this is officially the crappiest USM issue I have ever read.

This book was nice. Action packed, Nick Fury jerking it up, Petey crying, FF helping out. What more do you want buddy?

[Expletive Deleted]

However, if you're talking about someone who is a biologist, which Richard Parker is, and who specialized in cancer research, which Richard Parker did, I would imagine he has to have taken some courses in medicine.I agree there's something hinky going on with Richard, too.

Buuuuuuut . . . biology /= medicine, especially for someone whose specialty is genetics. Richard certainly could have a medical degree or some medical skills, but it's not a given.

Here (http://www.cals.ncsu.edu/genetics/gradrequirements.html#phd) are the course requirements for a PhD in genetics at one university. Here (http://agsci.oregonstate.edu/genetics/phd.html) are another set. Here (http://www.cvm.ncsu.edu/cbs/cell_biology_req.htm) are a set for molecular and cell biology. I'm using these because they pop-up on Google first, but I think they work.

[Jeff-E]

I personally have been enjoying the Clone story arc, its a good fun story. Not too bogged down with "reality" I'm just really digging the series... However I've seen a couple of people refrence the next story arc... Whats it called?

[jwd]

So I'm one of those crazy people that actually enjoyed the first clone saga. It wasn't flawless by any means but overall I liked it.

I always figured Peter would revealed to be the real one in the end and take back over while Ben headed out and become a nomadic Scarlet Spider or went to another city. At the time there were a lot of books like DC had Superboy, Steel and Azrael. Marvel had books like Force Works, War Machine and Thunderstrike. Looking back though I can see how they might take away the uniqueness of the originals.

Anyway - I quit reading Ultimate Spider-Man on a monthly basis way back after the 2nd time Norman reared his ugly Goblin head. I read 3 or 4 tpb after that and didn't buy anymore. So I'm probably 3 or 4 tpb behind.

Last month I noticed 100 said "Clone Saga pt 4". So I picked up pt 1-4. It did have a nice recap to catch me up. It wasn't to bad but I was a little disappointed 100 wasn't the finale. The idea Richard Parker is alive is an interesting twist. Also I'm curious to know if that really is Gwen or if Carnage just takes on the form of someone its absorbed.

With issue 101 though - Read the issue. $3 to see Peter go outside and Aunt May get taken to the hospital. That's it. The entire issue is Peter going outside. Oh and I guess MJ turned into something. I know people will call me insane but I feel this story is moving slower than the MU clone saga that took over 2 years to tell. After reading this story I'm remembering why I dropped this series.

Anyone know how many more issues there are for this story?

[ultramandingo]

geezz . i shoulda stoped reading this the first time carnage showed up. thats it , no more bendis for me

[MrPunch0]

If what is where it's going?

What? How about MJ turning into a giant (red of course) wolf thing? I was OK with this arc up until then.

Peter's dad is alive? Sure, OK. May hates Peter and kicks him out of the house. OK, that has potential. Gwen returns from the dead and is revealed to be Carnage. OK, that's interesting.

Then MJ got angry and "hulked out."

It's been said that Bendis has had a plan for all of this since the beginning and the seeds for this have been planted since issue one. If I read 100 issues so he could turn all of Peter's friends into OZ monsters then I take back every nice thing I said about Bendis.


There's not one thing that's happened so far in this story that suggests to me how the book's going to be afterwards.

Well it's not looking good no matter what.
1) MJ and Gwen stay monsters. Will they be good? Will they be bad? Doesn't matter because it's a crap idea to start with.
2) MJ is cured - which is just a big cop out.
3) It was all a dream.

[Chou Blaster]

I personaly think Brian Bendis hates MJ, a lot for this crap.

needless to say, I enver really liked Bendis to begin with.

(In mean Hell in 616, They plot to destroy Peter's realtinoship for Good, ro damn well tried it, so in ultiamtes they are attempting the same crap.)

But yeah the Irony is this: 616 Civil War is trying to give Shield fa rmore pwoer.

In Ultiamtees, Shield is already sai dpwoerufl so if a Ultiamtes Civil War, it's folks verses Shield?

Because I doubt the Ultiamtes are staying a stheir attakc dogs after Ultimates 2 finale.

[Effect]

I really think there will be or needs to be a revolt against Shield. They just have to much power and control in the Ultimate universe. I was hoping that was what Ultimate Power was going to be about but guess now.

[megabyte01]

Last month I noticed 100 said "Clone Saga pt 4". So I picked up pt 1-4. It did have a nice recap to catch me up. It wasn't to bad but I was a little disappointed 100 wasn't the finale. The idea Richard Parker is alive is an interesting twist. Also I'm curious to know if that really is Gwen or if Carnage just takes on the form of someone its absorbed.

I thought that Carnage was just imitating Gwen, but now i'm not so sure. Remember that fury has the technology to revert genetic mutations; he used it on peter in the final part of the venom arc when peter tried to sneak up on him. if Carnage was just a pile of goo imitating Gwen, it would have been vaporized when Fury's troops fired on Carnage. but it wasn't. Richard also said something about Gwen comming to him this way, and he was trying to help her. Maybe Gwen wasn't as dead as she looked when Carnage attacked her 30-odd issues ago.



Anyone know how many more issues there are for this story?

according to Marvel's website, there are three issues left. each issue will be published one month after the other. However, DO NOT GO TO THE WEBSITE IF YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE SPOILERS!!! (especially for part 8)

[Agent Helix]

I shall call her... Gwarnage.

[gliderpilotgirl]

You know what, I made a decision. Remember when Bendis said somewhere that he had to talk his editor off a fence about something? ( I BET it was this. ) He's probably counting on this reaction. I'm going to sit back and not judge anymore. Maybe this is his way of getting everyone interested in MJ rather than Kitty again. Maybe this is going to turn alright, we just can't see the big picture yet.

[[WB]BlackWolf]

We're probably going to see something relating back to the "Hobgoblin" arc thad had Fury mentioning it was time for Peter to lose his powers. I.E. either Reed or Sue adapts potential formula to suppress Gwen/Carnage or MJ or both of them from their Monster personas. Or Peter bargains with Fury in exchange for "Whatever he wants" if he can help the two of them, either way I doubt we're going to see the Red Goblin, Lady Carnage plus Spider-Man and his Amazing Not-Insane Clones fighting Crime together in the next arc.

But that would be one crazy What If if they start doing those for Ultimate Universe.

In any case, I have faith in Bendis that we'll get a worthy conclusion in January to where all this madness seems to be going.

[Doom Hammer]

I haven't read this issue yet, but it sounds beautiful. Particularly in that it sucks to be Peter.

I mean, just take a look at the women in his life. One puked on his crotch after seeing his face, one is booting him out of the house and dying, and the other two are literally rampaging monsters.

That's freakin' awesome.

Bad luck for Peter, though. :D

[Mystique25]

I liked the issue, but I was upset by the ad for Ultimate Power that they dropped right into the middle of a 2 page spread. I read the whole first page wondering what I was missing, until I found the 2nd page.


You know, you can take those out without ruining the comic in any way whatsoever. Just letting you know.

[MaxofSteel]

I shall call her... Gwarnage.

Gwarnage has a nice ring to it. I also like "Carn Stacy" or "Maximum Gwenage".

Hey btw, I have yet to pick up the ish but is Peter even in costume yet?

[gliderpilotgirl]

Gwarnage has a nice ring to it. I also like "Carn Stacy" or "Maximum Gwenage".

Hey btw, I have yet to pick up the ish but is Peter even in costume yet?
I can't help laughing at that..I feel terrible for the Gwen fans..at least us MJ fans are suffering as much!
No, he wasn't in costume.

[ultimatespyder20]

Got the issue today. Awesome stuff. The art was excellent, and story was great. MJ as the goblin creature looked very cool.(Ha ha she has a beard now. lol) Anyway, I hope Gwen is the real thing, I still think Richard is the real guy, and Aunt May I still think she'll probably die. Peter went through a lot in the issue. I really felt for him by the end. His entire world has been shattered. I'm really looking forward to next issue, because some of these questions are going to be explored and answered. I liked seeing the Tinkerer in this one, and having the FF was cool. Great issue. Looking foward to the next one(Like always:D).

Alec

[Sean Whitmore]

I'm going to sit back and not judge anymore. Maybe this is his way of getting everyone interested in MJ rather than Kitty again. Maybe this is going to turn alright, we just can't see the big picture yet.


You're making too much sense. You have to leave this board immediately. ;)


SEAN

[Sean Whitmore]

2) MJ is cured - which is just a big cop out.


...wow. If you really believe that, then there's really nothing I can say. Except to ask:

1) You do realize that good guys being turned into monsters and then being cured is an extremely old comic staple?

2) If Doctor Octopus breaks out of jail, and Spidey defeats him and puts him back in jail, is that a cop-out to the "Doctor Octopus breaks out of jail" story?


SEAN

[wolp]

People complain about things staying the same or about things changing 2 much....like the other poster said...the bigger picture could be clearing up soon. My only question is....when Fury was threatening to shoot Peter couldn't Peter just jump outta the way? I mean Fury isn't as fast as Peter...or am I making 2 much sense for a comic?

[Armless Penguin]

Really, the main reason I like this storyline is because every single thing about Peter's life is really being destroyed--right down to MJ. It's utterly horrible, and it makes for interesting story-telling, honestly.

[Sean Whitmore]

My only question is....when Fury was threatening to shoot Peter couldn't Peter just jump outta the way? I mean Fury isn't as fast as Peter...or am I making 2 much sense for a comic?

Ultimate Peter is an untrained idiot. At point-blank range, my money would be on Fury.


SEAN

[gliderpilotgirl]

You're making too much sense. You have to leave this board immediately. ;)


SEAN
It's called "cooling off" , I started this thread yesterday and boy was I CRANKY! I am still disgruntled, but willing to let it play itself out.

[robbrooks78]

You know, you can take those out without ruining the comic in any way whatsoever. Just letting you know.

I don't care about the ad being being there, I just didn't know it was a 2-page spread until after I read the first page, thus reading it out of order. That's just not good ad placement.

My theory with the MJ/Goblin is that she will die, but it'll turn out that she's aclone of the real MJ, who is now Spider-Girl/Woman. Or maybe Spider-Girl is the clone. Either way, they're both MJ and one will die.

[Pyro]

I don't care about the ad being being there, I just didn't know it was a 2-page spread until after I read the first page, thus reading it out of order. That's just not good ad placement.
I did the same thing and I agree with you. I bought 3 Marvel comic books this week (this, X-Men, and New Avengers) and each one of them had ads like that, which I ended up ripping out. I suppose if I can rip them out, then there are less ads cluttering my book, but I don't enjoy having to rip pages out of my comic books.

As for the issue, I liked it. However, the Mary Jane monster thing came out of nowhere, and the design was quite...odd. Besides that, the art was great and really hit it's stride, whereas, it seemed less "together" on some of the recent issues (i.e. #97) IMO. I don't know if that makes any sense.

[sephirothskiller]

...wow. If you really believe that, then there's really nothing I can say. Except to ask:

1) You do realize that good guys being turned into monsters and then being cured is an extremely old comic staple?

2) If Doctor Octopus breaks out of jail, and Spidey defeats him and puts him back in jail, is that a cop-out to the "Doctor Octopus breaks out of jail" story?


SEAN
Except its completely different in an issue like the clone saga arc. If you have a Doctor Octupus breaks out of jail and then gets sent back story its not signficant. The Clone saga is supposed to be significant, we're supposed to see the status quo change, and therefore, curing MJ would be a copout. Of course the whole OZ thing in my opinion was just stupid so...

[Sean Whitmore]

The Clone saga is supposed to be significant, we're supposed to see the status quo change, and therefore, curing MJ would be a copout.

Just a brief note in case people are simply using the word wrong:

A cop out is when somone avoids fulfilling a commitment or a responsibility.

Ending an issue with MJ turning into a big monster is not a commitment that she will be a big monster forevermore. Anymore than a cliffhanger with Spider-Man falling off a roof is a commitment that he has to hit the ground and die.

There are a hundred ways this storyline could end that will still change the status quo of the series. Anyone complaining about said change without yet knowing what it is is just looking for something to complain about.


SEAN

[Young Avenger]

I haven't read this issue yet, but it sounds beautiful. Particularly in that it sucks to be Peter.

I mean, just take a look at the women in his life. One puked on his crotch after seeing his face, one is booting him out of the house and dying, and the other two are literally rampaging monsters.

That's freakin' awesome.

Bad luck for Peter, though. :D

Ultimate Peter's women problems put Daredevils to shame.

[MrPunch0]

...wow. If you really believe that, then there's really nothing I can say. Except to ask:

1) You do realize that good guys being turned into monsters and then being cured is an extremely old comic staple?

2) If Doctor Octopus breaks out of jail, and Spidey defeats him and puts him back in jail, is that a cop-out to the "Doctor Octopus breaks out of jail" story?


SEAN

By cop out I mean that I expect more from Bendis.
Despite how I sound in this thread, I'm not a big Bendis hater.
This arc (and a few others - but especially this one) just make me want to give up on the book.

But I'll stick around until the end of the arc like I always do. If Bendis can turn it around, then I'll keep buying the book.

But for now I stand by my statement that the end of USM #101 was crap.

[stillanerd]

Okay, tell me MJ does NOT look like Sasquatch from Alpha Flight here:

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i310/DonCoyote/MJ.jpg

or maybe it's not really MJ but Fox as a werewolf from Disney's Gargoyles:

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/6/65/GargoyleWerewolf.jpg

Or considering how male "Demogoblin" looks (yes, seriously, Bendis nicknamed the Goblinized MJ that on his message boards), espeically with her "exposed breasts" and Bagley's interesting rendition of the smoke around the crotch region, maybe we should start calling her "Hairy Jane" from now on.

Yes, I'm sure there are folks out there who couldn't get enough of naked Gwen eager for naked MJ. Perverts. :D :p

[Sparda]

To me I find MJ transformation to be ultimate Wendigo. Except she's red.

[kudlaty_true]

Hah! I'm such a comic geek...
I've just finished reading and more than anything my attention went to one panel with Gwen. And I thought I've seen this somewhere before:D
Hehe, Bagley starts to repeat himself:P Or maybe this is tribute to his work in 616 clone saga:D?
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/8397/gwen2006td9.jpghttp://img206.imageshack.us/img206/8319/gwen1995eh2.jpg
The other slide is from ASM#399. (If your screen resolution is set to at least 1152x864, the pics will be aside each other.)

[Sheldon]

I was loving the issue until the end.....MJ's transformation...ugh talk about silly....I guess its better than her becoming spider-girl or something.

[Web Slinging Nerd]

I really liked this issue, and thought it was a great a follow-up to issue 100. The previous issue was mostly exposition, and so this issue being mostly action was a nice contrast. In addition I thought the action was superb. Gwenage kicked butt, Spidey took out some slayers and went for Fury with a passion, and the FF got involved. Combine all that with great art and overall it made for an entertaining fight imho.

Besides the action, though, the thing about this issue I really liked was the portrayal of Peter (which in general is what I've liked the most about this arc so far). Despite the fact that May just disowned him, Peter's number 1 priority throughout this issue is saving her. I found that very touching and I thought it really showed a lot about the strength of Peter's character. The clones, the return of Gwen and his father, the hundreds of robots there to utterly destroy his life, none of that matter because his aunt needed him, and so he went into a fight that he was not going to win to save her. Even after suffering several painful hits from the blasters he just kept going because May needed to be saved. I just thought it was great. Then this was followed by the thank you panel, which in particular stands out as a great panel to me. I just really love the relief and sincere gratitude that is portrayed by the art in the panel. Finally I loved what happened next. With May safe the true weight of the mess he is in really hits home, and he just loses it, collapsing to the ground in tears. I really liked this collapse because he just hits home who Peter his. He is not a PhD. scientist or military trained hero. He is just a kid who is in way over his head, and it is simply more than he can handle. So instead of going out in a blaze of glory, he simply collapses under the pressure. It just worked incredibly well, and really made me feel for Peter.

As far as the MJ issue, I think it has a lot of potential, as it could lead to a battle between Goblin MJ and Spidey. The fact that Peter would have to fight the woman he loves in order to do what is right could be an emotionally gripping storyline if done well. You could really get into the inner turmoil that Peter fills over this, and show his struggles both with bringing himself to do what he must, and with figuring out a way to stop MJ without hurting her. It would have the elements of Spidey fighting Harry, but pumped up to the emotional extreme. The whole thing, if written properly could be great. Of course in the end I would want her to be turned back to normal. Though Spidey vs. Goblin MJ has the potential to be awesome once, in the end I don't see Goblin MJ working as a recurring villian, and would much rather have MJ normal again. Of course she will never truly be normal again as the memory of the Goblin experience would haunt her, which also has the potential to introduce some interesting new charater dynamics into the story. Overall I think Goblin MJ could be good as long as it is not permanent (and as long as they don't kill her) so I will wait and see where the story goes before I make final judgements on the element.

Though on a side note on Goblin MJ, I kind of would've prefered a spider monster MJ instead. I mean instead of Kaine injecting her with Oz directly, he could have tried to recreate the accident that gave Peter the Spider powers, but then messes things up and the result is a "Man-Spider" MJ. I just think that sort of approach would have fit better with the rest of the clone-saga, but that is a minor gripe that is not that big of a deal to me.

[Shadow ES]

And is it just me or is the idea of the Fantastic Four being involved in what is supposed to be a major turning point for Ultimate Spider-Man seem necessary? I mean, why not Curt Conners, who certainly has far more connections to this story, let alone Spidey's world than the FF.
Conners was put in jail at the end of the carnage arc.

[megabyte01]

As far as the MJ issue, I think it has a lot of potential, as it could lead to a battle between Goblin MJ and Spidey. The fact that Peter would have to fight the woman he loves in order to do what is right could be an emotionally gripping storyline if done well. You could really get into the inner turmoil that Peter fills over this, and show his struggles both with bringing himself to do what he must, and with figuring out a way to stop MJ without hurting her. It would have the elements of Spidey fighting Harry, but pumped up to the emotional extreme. The whole thing, if written properly could be great. Of course in the end I would want her to be turned back to normal. Though Spidey vs. Goblin MJ has the potential to be awesome once, in the end I don't see Goblin MJ working as a recurring villian, and would much rather have MJ normal again. Of course she will never truly be normal again as the memory of the Goblin experience would haunt her, which also has the potential to introduce some interesting new charater dynamics into the story. Overall I think Goblin MJ could be good as long as it is not permanent (and as long as they don't kill her) so I will wait and see where the story goes before I make final judgements on the element.

You have a good point. Spidey forced to fight MJ has good potential. I think it will work the same way that the Hobgoblin arc should have worked, but didn't, because MJ is a much more sympathetic character than Harry. i didn't really feel sorry for Harry because he was a scitzoid psychopath. Poor MJ was kidnapped out of her home by a crazy version of Peter, and she has been horribly mutated. I feel sorry for Peter knowing that he will have to stop her in an upcoming issue.



Though on a side note on Goblin MJ, I kind of would've prefered a spider monster MJ instead. I mean instead of Kaine injecting her with Oz directly, he could have tried to recreate the accident that gave Peter the Spider powers, but then messes things up and the result is a "Man-Spider" MJ. I just think that sort of approach would have fit better with the rest of the clone-saga, but that is a minor gripe that is not that big of a deal to me.

I think mutating her was enough. Turning her into Man-Spider would be too much for me (but i've always been squeamish when it comes to Man-Spider)

[Slade.]

I officialy HATE Aunt May now. What a dumb ho.

And Nick Fury too.

[geHuC]

Wow for the first time i'm happy to see the human torch :D
i dont like what they did to MJ :( What's she supposed to be :? a female version of the Man-Wolf :evilangry (i've never liked him)

[Beast]

I officialy HATE Aunt May now. What a dumb ho.

And Nick Fury too.
Having a heart attack makes her a dumb ho? Huhbuhwha?

[Sean Whitmore]

Having a heart attack makes her a dumb ho? Huhbuhwha?

I assume he means earlier in the story, when she was trying to kick Peter out of the house.


SEAN

[Pyro]

I officialy HATE Aunt May now. What a dumb ho.

And Nick Fury too.
Ha! That's a hilarious post.:p

[MaxofSteel]

I posted this on another thread but who sees Ult Spidey getting a costume change as a result of this whole arc?

[Beast]

I posted this on another thread but who sees Ult Spidey getting a costume change as a result of this whole arc?
What's wrong with his current costume? Or were you one of those people who liked Electro Superman? :p

[Shadow ES]

I posted this on another thread but who sees Ult Spidey getting a costume change as a result of this whole arc?
what makes you think that's even a posibility?

[Weapon Ick]

616 spiderman is going to have a costume change after civil war. I don't think it's going to be his original costume either. So I doubt marvel would have both Ultimate and 616 versions without the familiar webs.

[Sparda]

I prefer Ultimate May a billion times over the 616 may. 616 version is just a plain annoying old lady that can't take care of herself while the ult may is more independent. They really should have killed may during the clone arc (616 of course)

[Sean Whitmore]

I prefer Ultimate May a billion times over the 616 may. 616 version is just a plain annoying old lady that can't take care of herself while the ult may is more independent. They really should have killed may during the clone arc (616 of course)


That hasn't described 616 May for some while now. And I'm not too crazy about how many times Ultimate May has threatened to kick her child out of the house or call the police on him.


SEAN

[90'sCartoonMan]

Okay, tell me MJ does NOT look like Sasquatch from Alpha Flight here:

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i310/DonCoyote/MJ.jpg

Wow, Mary Jane certainly has blossomed into a beautiful young woman. It's easy to understand what Peter (and his clones) see in her.

I think the real highlight of the Clone Saga is how frantic and panicked Peter is. He's constantly bombarded with shock after shock, and it just gets tougher for him. Not easy to keep a level head in all that.

Fury's such a tool, but I can sort of understand that he needs to neutralize all this Parker/spider/DNA stuff because it's already gotten out of hand. Still, he's a tool.

The Fantastic Four's appearance was pretty cool as well.

[Slade.]

Having a heart attack makes her a dumb ho? Huhbuhwha?

What Sean said is true.

But I also cheered when she said she was having a heart attack. I was like "YES!!!! BOOM POW SUPRISE!!!".

[kudlaty_true]

I was like "YES!!!! BOOM POW SUPRISE!!!".
BUUUAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
LOOOL Nice comment, ROTFL

[Arilou]

Thus far I actually love it.

Just hoped he manages to actually, you know, MAKE A GOOD ENDING.

Bendis usually doesen't do that.

Also, his action sequences take too long.

[killerbass]

And I'm not too crazy about how many times Ultimate May has threatened to kick her child out of the house or call the police on him.

If that is Ultimate May...

Maybe she was kidnapped by Miles Warren and the May we are seeing is, wait for it, a clone...

Gasp. :eek:

--Tom

[phantom1592]

But I also cheered when she said she was having a heart attack. I was like "YES!!!! BOOM POW SUPRISE!!!".


ReallY?!!? My friends and me had a different reaction. It was more "Yeah, It's about time for one of those."

[Erik B]

I was sitting here thinking about what we know so far with the CLone Saga Redux. Alright we know that "Scorpion" said a bunch of things about "The Zoo" and immediately we assume ok something is happening at a zoo but i think that isnt he case at all. If we all remember correctly - Oz was being made at Osborn Industries and being tested on animals. That was the very first scene in the entire series. In issue three we see Doc Ock work on Norman and Harry comes in at the very time it explodes, causing him to be th Hobgoblin, his dad to be the Green Gblin, and giving Doc Ock the control of his arms. Now the very next issue opens with the same scene (what i am calling the zoo) and everyone is dead and the animals are gone. We also know in issue 1 that Norman had acquired Peters blood.

So my conclusion, that this is the genetic diaster that Fury was talking about. Hogbolin, Green Goblin, Doc Ock, Spidey and all the "The Zoo" animals are all the product of issues 1-4. There is no Miles Warren behind it, there MAY NOT be a mastermind at all. Richard is very very suspicious and as for his Doc Ock arms, im not sure...but i think maybe after "the zoo" blew up then the CIA came in and all this nonsense happened, hence the costumes. Im not too thought out on the costumes, but im sure The Zoo is what i mentioned.

[1WEBHEAD]

I just read it(stupid mailman) and I thought it was neat. My only complaints is the stupid Ultimate Power preview that was in the middle of the 2 page splash. I dont think I like MJ turning into a red Goblin/Wendigo monster either.There went my hopes for Ult firestar.:( On the plus side, the art is good. The naked gwen part had ":eek: " written all over it.;)

9/10

[kel25]

There went my hopes for Ult firestar.:( I wouldn’t worry about that. She could still be done.

[Enigmanaut]

Do I sense one of these being pushed shortly?

http://www.enigmanaut.com/reset-button.jpg

[Sean Whitmore]

Do I sense one of these being pushed shortly?

http://www.enigmanaut.com/reset-button.jpg


Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...no.


SEAN

[wingsofdamnation]

so is mj ultimate manwolf?

[Nick MB]

Just read this. Wow. That was incredibly cool. The only bit I'm not sure about was, yah, the MJ/Demogoblin thing. I'm assuming Bendis has an out for that. Or it's Kaine's nightmare/crazy vision. (He did have those in 616)

[MrPunch0]

so is mj ultimate manwolf?

Off the top of my head I don't know that the "new and improved" MJ is an ultimate version of any 616 character.

Like Peter was crossed with OZ and a spider - I think MJ got crossed with OZ and the ugly stick. ;)

[Crimson]

I fear this book could be about to jump the shark.

Not that I hate everything that going on but so much stuff if changing, it's going to be near impossible to change by the end of the arc leaving this as (perhaps) the new Status Quo.

It'll be interesting to see if fans can handle this much change and not drop the book.

[Crimson]

Okay, tell me MJ does NOT look like Sasquatch from Alpha Flight here:

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i310/DonCoyote/MJ.jpg


That reminds me of my friend who took a whole bunch of birth control pills at once... she had to shave for a week.

I can't wait for the next issue. This is a ballsy arc to say the least.

[carabas]

Working in a field related to the human body isn't the same thing as knowing anything about medicine, especially if it's microscale rather than macroscale. I know researchers who could tell you a million things about cancer cells but couldn't tell the difference between a pancreas and a spleen if their lives depended on it.

It doesn't matter, really.
Even if Ultimate Richard Parker was the world's most talented doctor, without the necessary equipment and drugs and such, ther's really very little he could have done, other than to tell Peter that swinger her around like a ragdoll would be fatal.

I mean, did he not ask for a first aid kit?

[ultramandingo]

I fear this book could be about to jump the shark.
fonzie jumped , wiped out and was rushed off to the er awile ago. i think potsie is going to give it a try this arc

[Joe Acro]

I am so utterly confused with this arc by now that there better be one hell of an ending. Why doesn't Fury kill the clones first? Why is Richard acting so odd? Why do the FF show up at that moment? Who made the clones? Who gave Gwen to Richard? How did that clone get access to Oz in the first place? Will Mary Jane be the same after all this is over?

I have too many questions and this issue didn't really answer any I had before. Can Bendis write a straight-forward story anymore?

[sgt pepper]

It hit a few wrong notes and some of the dialogue was clunky, but overall, a fun read.

So Reed and Sue are medical doctors? I guess it's possible.

And the Mary Jane monster is apparently male? No hips or breasts? Strange, but if that goo can turn her into a monster, why not a man.

[GRANDPA]

its now official bendis is now a hack

[megabyte01]

its now official bendis is now a hack

because the rest of the Ultimate Spider-Man series has been good, i'll wait untill the end of the arc before i proclaim Bendis (not benis) a hack for writing a seemingly crappy clone saga. there are still three issues. a lot can happen in three issues. I have faith that things will turn around. In fact, i think they are already taking a turn for the better, if you look carefully.

[Shadow ES]

I have too many questions and this issue didn't really answer any I had before. Can Bendis write a straight-forward story anymore?
you were expecting alot of answers in the 5th part of an 8 part story?

[Joe Acro]

you were expecting alot of answers in the 5th part of an 8 part story?
It would've been nice for it to answer one. I never said it should answer all of them.

[megabyte01]

I think that we got an answer to a small question: is Gwen a real person, or just Carnage imitating her? Since Gwen was left standing after the large explosion, I am inclined to believe she is the genuine article. Still, the preview for the next issue doesn't bode well for Gwen's return to the regular series. We will have to wait three weeks to see.

As shadow ES said, it was only part 5 of 8, you can't expect all the exposition to come that soon in the story (especially a story like this). If you ask me, the whole sad back story will come out in part 7, then break out for a mostly action packed finale in part 8.

[MythicBrawn]

It hit a few wrong notes and some of the dialogue was clunky, but overall, a fun read.

So Reed and Sue are medical doctors? I guess it's possible.

And the Mary Jane monster is apparently male? No hips or breasts? Strange, but if that goo can turn her into a monster, why not a man.

I think she's still female. The smoke is conveniently placed to hide her groin area. I guess there could be a penis there but more than likely it's a vagina. As far as the breasts, I think she bulked up to the point where they are pretty much non-existent. And, the hips are just artistic license taken with the character.

[MrPunch0]

I think she's still female. The smoke is conveniently placed to hide her groin area. I guess there could be a penis there but more than likely it's a vagina. As far as the breasts, I think she bulked up to the point where they are pretty much non-existent. And, the hips are just artistic license taken with the character.

Or it could just be that crap has no gender. ;)

[Towelie88]

I'm still rather excited by this entire arc, if a little confused. It's nice to see Bendis completely messing with the formula when it comes to this particular Ultimate book, and I don't think he should be constrained by the mainstream titles. Seeing Mary Jane as Ultimate Wendigo or Sasquach or whatever is fun, but it's probably just Bendis following his own rules about the Oz formula; mainline exposure = big ugly hulking oddity. Looking at the other freaks on parade in this book Peter sure was lucky.

Oh, and I don't think anything too bad will happen to MJ. Bendis seems to have a soft spot for her from what I've read, and has made her into a well-rounded, realistic character. Which would make it all the sadder if she was to cop it...

[ReZourceman]

Word.

I reckons Aunt May might bite the dust, but possibly just be hospitilised and maybe even become a vegetable?

Im enjoying it so far though.

[MaxofSteel]

It's nice to see Bendis completely messing with the formula when it comes to this particular Ultimate book, and I don't think he should be constrained by the mainstream titles.

Yea keep in mind that this is not Spider-man. It's Ultimate Spider-man. In terms of story and characterization, everything's fair game to Bendis.

And I happen to like what he's doin' this arc so far.

[Joe Acro]

Word.

I reckons Aunt May might bite the dust, but possibly just be hospitilised and maybe even become a vegetable?

Im enjoying it so far though.
I don't think people become vegetables through heart failure.

[ReZourceman]

Well a few thoughts;

Something else might happen.

We dont know for sure its heart failure, and even if it is, it could be linked to something.

This is comics afterall.

[Agent Helix]

I don't think people become vegetables through heart failure.

They can, if the reduction in blood flow to the brain is severe enough. It happens.

[Joe Acro]

Thanks for correction, Helix. And thanks for the elaboration, ReZourceman.

I doubt anything terrible will happen to her given the medical attention she is currently getting.

[Agent Helix]

No problem. Brain damage is always a concern when bloodflow is disrupted, be it via stroke or severe heart attacks, especially in the elderly.

[Chris S.]

I just read it(stupid mailman) and I thought it was neat.
I guess you are a subscriber? All I have to tell you is I JUST got it today. USM always seems to be on the following weeks Friday.

Well, the issue defiantly was surprising. I was really disappointed to see MJ turn into a Sasquatch looking thing. I of course liked the red Sasquatch thing as well. I really did...... OK I absolutely hated it, up until this moment great issue. I was hoping we would see an MJ with similar powers to Peter, not some transformed MJ. That is what I hated about Bendis's take on the goblins. I imagine she will lose her powers by the end.... a good twist could be her powers go dormant and she doesn't know she still has them. They come out occasionally and Peter has to take her down. Could work...

I like where the clone saga is headed though. Bendis has definitely separated from the initial clone saga we all know and love. I like that. His foundations are similar, but his execution has played out so differently

Snake Eater you mentioned the whole zoo thing. What you mentioned was the first thing that jumped into my mind following seeing "clone peter" (not calling him Kaine for Shawn W's previsouly mentioned point) at oscorp. This "zoo" idea is really going to play out to be very important I think.

[Joe Acro]

I guess you are a subscriber? All I have to tell you is I JUST got it today. USM always seems to be on the following weeks Friday.

Well, the issue defiantly was surprising. I was really disappointed to see MJ turn into a Sasquatch looking thing. I of course liked the red Sasquatch thing as well. I really did...... OK I absolutely hated it, up until this moment great issue. I was hoping we would see an MJ with similar powers to Peter, not some transformed MJ. That is what I hated about Bendis's take on the goblins. I imagine she will lose her powers by the end.... a good twist could be her powers go dormant and she doesn't know she still has them. They come out occasionally and Peter has to take her down. Could work...
This is quite likely, actually. Norman has some control over his powers. Presumably, MJ will also be able to transform back and forth. Though, given Oz's history, she might become mentally unstable, just as Norman and Harry did.

[Frizey]

It's going to be interesting to see how all this Carnage and Clones stuff is all connected, if it is connected of course. Holy Crap this arc is amazing!

[bbmakdaddycomics]

Not to get off subject
but what if gwen is the real gwen. when she died ben reilly
could have injected her with a piece of carnage and that revived
her.

[MaxofSteel]

Not to get off subject
but what if gwen is the real gwen. when she died ben reilly
could have injected her with a piece of carnage and that revived
her.

I'd love that to happen. I really want this current Gwen to be the real one. Not some Carnage clone thingy.

[bbmakdaddycomics]

i feel the same way. but i'm going to make a prediction spider-woman is a clone of peter (jessica or julia parker)lol, that would be cool. also who hopes nick fury will die soon? i sure do.

[megabyte01]

Not to get off subject
but what if gwen is the real gwen. when she died ben reilly
could have injected her with a piece of carnage and that revived
her.

If Gwen isn't the real Gwen, then at least she isn't a pile of Carnage goo imitating Gwen. Remember that Fury's has the technology to stun and temporarily disable rapid genetic mutations. we saw this in ultimate six. When these weapons were used on Carnage, Carnage reverted to Gwen. that lends credibility to this being the real gwen. Richard Parker also said something about gwen comming to him this way. we'll have to wait untill next week to see what he means.

[MaxofSteel]

also who hopes nick fury will die soon? i sure do.

I'd be happy enough if he just loses his other eye!:evilsmile

[bbmakdaddycomics]

I'd be happy enough if he just loses his other eye!:evilsmile
you got that right.

but back to the big c
A.) I think spider woman is a clone because:
1. her dialouge in 98.
2. she was shown sticking to the wall when she said
"well, this is awkward."
3.she shot webs out of her fingers
4.think CLONE SAGA.

B.) mj might go crazy and kill kaine-peter.
C.) gwen will hopefully kill nick fury lol
D.) richard might die
E.) aunt may might take peter back in and apollogize.
F.) spider woman might start going to go to school with peter and pretends to be his cousin or something.

[bbmakdaddycomics]

what if aunt may looses her memory of peter being
spiderman?

[malephoenix]

F.) spider woman might start going to go to school with peter and pretends to be his cousin or something.

That could lead to some really cool character moments. I would start picking this series up every issue if Peter had to go to school with his female clone.






And it would really suck if the status quo is reset after this arc. (As in everything being the same: Peter lives with Aunt May, who doesn't know he's Spider-Man, going out with MJ, Richard dies, MJ has no transformation/memories of such, Gwen is dead, etc...)

[MaxofSteel]

I sooo hope Pete's girl clone doesn't die. She's awesome.

[phantom1592]

I hope they use this as a really sweet place to diverge from the 616 universe. May dies, Richard lives. Peter Parker living with his Scientist dad. How great could THAT be!

[malephoenix]

I hope they use this as a really sweet place to diverge from the 616 universe. May dies, Richard lives. Peter Parker living with his Scientist dad. How great could THAT be!


Yeah, right. It would be nice, but...

[bbmakdaddycomics]

c'mon i love aunt may

[bbmakdaddycomics]

what if doc ock plays the role green goblin did
in the original clone saga?

[megabyte01]

what if doc ock plays the role green goblin did
in the original clone saga?

It says Doc Ock in the previews, but I'm not sure Otto Octavius is behind all this. Granted, Otto is a genius, and this sick, twisted scenario is one that he would love to create. Don't foget that he has been in SHIELD custody for months. Otto wouldn't have access to any of the necessary materials to make clones or new arms. If you ask me, the Doc Ock on the cover of 104 is really Richard Parker. I know it doesn't make sense now, but the inevitable plot twist in 103 - the one that shatters USM and Peter as we know it - will justify Richard Parker fighting Spider-Man.

[bbmakdaddycomics]

[QUOTE=megabyte01]Otto wouldn't have access to any of the necessary materials to make clones or new arms. QUOTE]

in the hobgoblin arc
norman said in notes that their was an new set of arms.
as for the cloning, he could have hired ben reilly to do it while in
s.h.i.e.l.d custody.

[Keehar]

It says Doc Ock in the previews, but I'm not sure Otto Octavius is behind all this. Granted, Otto is a genius, and this sick, twisted scenario is one that he would love to create. Don't foget that he has been in SHIELD custody for months. Otto wouldn't have access to any of the necessary materials to make clones or new arms. If you ask me, the Doc Ock on the cover of 104 is really Richard Parker. I know it doesn't make sense now, but the inevitable plot twist in 103 - the one that shatters USM and Peter as we know it - will justify Richard Parker fighting Spider-Man.

A few people were thinking along these lines too before USM #102 came out. I don't why Richard Parker would have a penchant for wearing tentacles.

Good to know it's the real Otto Octavius who's back.

[Xris]

Did anyone else notice the similarities between the spider man clones and the symbiotes from the spiderman saga, where there were like 5 new symbiotes that were created in "Vemon: Lethal Protectors"?? (or w/e story arc that was) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c7/Venom_Spawns_%28not_including_carnage%29.jpg
i just sorta noticed it right now, but there are alotta similarities, color being a big one, any chance this was on purpose or just by luck??