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fly on the wall
09-21-2006, 08:17 PM
'A Dissident Of Islam'
By George F. WillThursday, September 21, 2006; Page A25

While her security contingent waits outside the Georgetown restaurant, Ayaan Hirsi Ali orders what the menu calls "raw steak tartare." Amused by the redundancy, she speculates that it is intended to immunize the restaurant against lawyers, should a customer be discommoded by that entree. She has been in America only two weeks. She is a quick study.
And an exile and an immigrant. Born 36 years ago in Somalia, Hirsi Ali has lived in Ethiopia, Kenya, Saudi Arabia She quickly became a Dutch citizen, a member of parliament and an astringent critic, from personal experience, of the condition of women under Islam. She wrote the script, and filmmaker Theo van Gogh directed, "Submission," an 11-minute movie featuring pertinent passages from the Koran (such as when it is a husband's duty to beat his wife) projected on the bodies of naked women.

It was shown twice before Nov. 2, 2004, when van Gogh, bicycling through central Amsterdam in the morning, was shot by an Islamic extremist who then slit his throat with a machete. Next, the murderer (in whose room was found a disc containing videos of "enemies of Allah" being murdered, including a man having his head slowly sawed off) used another knife to pin a long letter to van Gogh's chest. The letter was to Hirsi Ali, calling her a "soldier of evil" who would "smash herself to pieces on Islam."

The remainder of her life in Holland was lived under guard. Neighbors in her apartment building complained that they felt endangered with her there and got a court to order her evicted. She decided to come to America.
Holland evidently tolerates everything except skepticism about the sacramental nature of multiculturalism. One million of the country's 16 million residents are Muslims, and the political left has appropriated the European right's traditional celebration of identity grounded in racial and ethnic traditions and culture. But the recoil of many Dutch people from Hirsi Ali suggests that the tolerance about which Holland preens is a compound of intellectual sloth and moral timidity. She was more trouble than the Dutch evidently think free speech is worth.

Her story is told in a riveting new book, "Murder in Amsterdam," by Ian Buruma, who is not alone in finding her -- this "Enlightenment fundamentalist" -- somewhat unnerving and off-putting. Having experienced life circumscribed by tribal and religious communities (as a girl she suffered the genital mutilation called female circumcision), she is a fierce partisan of individualism against collectivism.

She reminds Buruma of Margaret Thatcher's sometimes abrasive intelligence and her fascination with America. He is dismissive of the idea that she is a Voltaire against Islam: Voltaire, he says, offended the powerful Catholic Church, whereas she offends "only a minority that was already feeling vulnerable in the heart of Europe."

She, however, replies that this is hardly a normal minority. It is connected to Islam's worldwide adherents. Living sullenly in European "dish cities" -- enclaves connected by satellite television and the Internet to the tribal societies they have not really left behind -- many members of this minority are uninterested in assimilation into open societies.

She calls herself "a dissident of Islam" because, given what Allah supposedly enjoins and what she knows is right, "the cognitive dissonance is, for me, too much." She says she is not "a militant atheist," but the emphasis is on the adjective.

Slender, elegant, stylish and articulate (in English, Dutch and Swahili), she has found an intellectual home here at the American Enterprise Institute, where she is writing a book that imagines Muhammad meeting, in the New York Public Library, three thinkers -- John Stuart Mill, Friedrich Hayek and Karl Popper, each a hero of the unending struggle between (to take the title of Popper's 1945 masterpiece) "The Open Society and Its Enemies." Islamic extremists -- the sort who were unhinged by some Danish cartoons -- will be enraged. She is unperturbed.

Neither is she pessimistic about the West. It has, she says, "the drive to innovate." But Europe, she thinks, is invertebrate. After two generations without war, Europeans "have no idea what an enemy is." And they think, she says, that leadership is an antiquated notion because they believe that caring governments can socialize everyone to behave well, thereby erasing personal accountability and responsibility. "I can't even tell it without laughing," she says, laughing softly. Clearly she is where she belongs, at last.

**********end of article

Interesting article. My favorite part was when the lady's nieghbors in the condo felt threatened by her being there since the Islamics might come and blow them up trying to get to her. So the courts threw her out. This is the state of protection of Free Speech in Europe. You get thrown out of your apartment if your free speech has made you a target. Note that the neighbors are acknowledging that they think about Muslims in assuming the apartment building will be blown up.

It reminds me of the "Piss Christ" exhibit in America where a crucifix was sealed into a plexiglass box full of urine. A horrible slap in the face of Christians but nobody got their throat slit. And there was the demolition of the giant Budha statues in Afganistan. No reprisals, again. When American scholars decided the Elephant God in Hindu religion contained a phallic symbol and his father symbolically castrated him the Hindus did complain, but they didn't kill anyone.

Islamic people are alright as long as you don't criticize the Prophet, and of course since the Prophet wrote the Koran, you can't criticize the Koran either. So to make them happy you really aren't allowed to make comments about their religion at all. Presumably we could still criticize they way they dress; the thing is they dress pretty cool.

The other thing that is odd is whenever anyone criticizes them it makes international news. The same can not be said about criticisms of other religions, which no one much cares about. Rightly so.

Meanwhile moslems can say what they want about other religions and no one gets too bent of shape.

Perhaps they are perfect and theirs is the one true religion and that's why it's a bad thing to criticize perfection. Time will tell.

I have no beef against their religion, the Prophet or the Koran. I've heard the Koran is a thing of poetry and beauty. I've heard that Islam gives peace and meaning to lives by encouraging submission to the will of God. Sounds like most religions. Why fight God? You can't win.

But the beheadings and slit throats bother me, though. We can kiss free speech good bye if this kind of thing keeps up. Remember how easily the other people in that apartment building folded on free speech once they thought they might get blown up. And the courts went along with them.

Doesn't everyone need to be criticized?

Wesley Dodds
09-21-2006, 08:22 PM
Amused by the redundancy, she speculates that it is intended to immunize the restaurant against lawyers, should a customer be discommoded by that entree.

Ah, George Will's famous common touch. The worker's pundit.

(This is just drive by snark, I promise to come back and respond more seriously later.)

Iangould
09-21-2006, 09:46 PM
Seeing as she's a proven liar, my reaction is why should you believe a single word she says?

Iangould
09-21-2006, 09:59 PM
'A Dissident Of Islam'
By George F. WillThursday, September 21, 2006; Page A25

She decided to come to America.

Funny how Will omits to mention her "decision" was prompted by the possibility of her being stripped of her Dutch citizenship for making false statements in her asylum application.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayaan_Hirsi_Ali

Youth

Ayaan Hirsi Ali was born in Somalia into the Majeerteen sub-clan of the Darod clan. Her first name, Ayaan, means "lucky person" or "luck" in the Somali language. Her father, Hirsi Magan Isse, was a prominent member of the Somali Salvation Democratic Front and a leading figure in the civil war of Somalia. Although her father, who had studied in Italy and the United States, was opposed to female genital cutting, a Somali tradition, when Hirsi Ali was five years old her grandmother had the procedure performed on her while her father was abroad.[5]

When she was six, her family left the country for Saudi Arabia, later moving to Ethiopia and then to Kenya, where the family obtained political asylum. In Kenya she attended the English-language Muslim Girls' Secondary School in Nairobi under sponsorship of the UNCHR, where, for a brief period she received guest lessons from a fundamentalist teacher called Aziza. Following the invasion by the secular nation of Iraq of the Islamic republic of Iran, she sympathised with Iran, and the Islamist Muslim Brotherhood, and wore a hijab (full head-scarf) together with her school uniform. After secondary school she attended a secretarial course at the Valley College in Nairobi (near Yaya centre) for one year.
[edit]

Pre-political career

Hirsi Ali arrived in the Netherlands in 1992. There is considerable lack of clarity about the events leading up to her arrival, because she has since admitted to making false statements in her application for asylum.

Hirsi Ali maintains that in 1992 her father arranged for her to marry a distant cousin living in Canada. Her family has denied this, however. It is not disputed that in 1992 she traveled from Kenya to visit family in Düsseldorf and Berlin, Germany. Others have put the story of her forced marriage in doubt[6]. After a brief stay in Germany, she decided to go to the Netherlands instead of Canada.

Once in the Netherlands, she requested political asylum and received a residence permit. It is not known on what grounds she received political asylum. Legally, since her first stop was in Germany, she should have applied for asylum there. Also she had already resided in and had been granted refugee status in Kenya, a safe country. In the Netherlands, she gave a false name and date of birth to the Dutch immigration authorities. She is known in the West by her assumed name, Hirsi Ali, instead of her original name, Hirsi Magan. On the advice of her aunt, she told the immigration authorities that she had come straight from Somalia, instead of Kenya where she had been living for eleven years. In Somalia there was a serious famine at that time and a civil war leading to the Operation Restore Hope by the United States. Due to these circumstances, asylum seekers from Somalia were routinely granted asylum on humanitarian grounds. Hirsi Ali received a residence permit within three weeks on arrival in the Netherlands.

Iangould
09-21-2006, 10:15 PM
Doesn't everyone need to be criticized?

Yes but everyone deserves to be criticised based on fact.

People may have noticed I've been spending a disproportionate amount of time lately disputing what I see as misinformation about Islam.

There's a reason for that:

When the Nazis arrested the Communists,
I said nothing; after all, I was not a Communist.
When they locked up the Social Democrats,
I said nothing; after all, I was not a Social Democrat.
When they arrested the trade unionists,
I said nothing; after all, I was not a trade unionist.
When they arrested the Jews, I said nothing; after all, I was not a Jew.
When they arrested me, there was no longer anyone who could protest.

- Martin Niemoller

Iangould
09-21-2006, 10:22 PM
Because of her statements about the Islamic prophet Muhammad in a Trouw interview, a discrimination complaint was filed against Hirsi Ali on April 24, 2003. The Prosecutor's office decided not to prosecute her, because her critique did "not put forth any conclusions in respect to Muslims and their worth as a group is not denied.[7].

Earlier that year, the group "The Hague Connection" produced and distributed the rap song Hirsi Ali Dis on the Internet. The lyrics of this song included violent threats against Hirsi Ali's life. The rappers were prosecuted under Article 121 of the Dutch criminal code, because they hindered the execution of Hirsi Ali's tasks as politician. In 2005 the rappers were sentenced to community service and a suspended prison sentence [9]

Yeah it really sounds like her rights were being trampled on.

gunny how people who decry Muslim bigotry are happy to believe virtually anything derogatory about those spineless, degenerate, amoral, terrorist-appeasing cowardly traitorous Europeans.

Iangould
09-21-2006, 10:44 PM
On the subject of female circumcision:

http://www.amnesty.org/ailib/intcam/femgen/fgm1.htm#a11

Religion
FGM predates Islam and is not practised by the majority of Muslims, but has acquired a religious dimension. Where it is practised by Muslims, religion is frequently cited as a reason. Many of those who oppose mutilation deny that there is any link between the practise and religion, but Islamic leaders are not unanimous on the subject. The Qur'an does not contain any call for FGM, but a few hadith (sayings attributed to the Prophet Muhammad) refer to it. In one case, in answer to a question put to him by 'Um 'Attiyah (a practitioner of FGM), the Prophet is quoted as saying "reduce but do not destroy". Mutilation has persisted among some converts to Christianity. Christian missionaries have tried to discourage the practice, but found it to be too deep rooted. In some cases, in order to keep converts, they have ignored and even condoned the practice.

FGM was practised by the minority Ethiopian Jewish community (Beta Israel), formerly known as Falasha, a derogatory term, most of whom now live in Israel, but it is not known if the practise has persisted following their emigration to Israel. The remainder of the FGM-practising community follow traditional Animist religions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_circumcision#Areas_of_practice

Female genital cutting is today mainly practiced in African countries. It is common in a band that stretches from Senegal in West Africa to Somalia on the East coast, as well as from Egypt in the north to Tanzania in the south. In these regions, it is estimated that more than 95% of all women have undergone this procedure. It is also practiced by some groups in the Arabian peninsula [10], especially among a minority (20%) in Yemen. The majority of Muslim countries (except in parts of sub-Saharan Africa) do not practice it [11].



In other words, the majority of Muslims DO NOT practice female genital mutilation and a significant number of nonmuslims including Jews and Christians DO.

But let's not let the facts get in the way.

oddieson
10-21-2006, 03:38 PM
Hey Fly , ( I used to be Big JIm Mctagert if you remember howis the old gang?) totally agree on your comments . uhmm what do you think is psycologically responisble for 911, being a u.s. conspiracy? Is it tied to people thinking rad. islam terrorists not being dangerous?

Jerry Kraut
10-21-2006, 04:19 PM
. uhmm what do you think is psycologically responisble for 911, being a u.s. conspiracy?
Government distrust is hardly a new concept. And then there is that unfortunate story about a planned irak invasion pre 9/11.

Is it tied to people thinking rad. islam terrorists not being dangerous?
I'm pretty sure the danger is being blown out of proportions currently. Some people's claims sound rather ridiculous, in the "will to" as well as in the "means to" departments.

Charles RB
10-21-2006, 04:26 PM
Funny how Will omits to mention her "decision" was prompted by the possibility of her being stripped of her Dutch citizenship for making false statements in her asylum application.

I like that she did that and then became a major member of a political party with a hardline stance on immigration and asylum seeking, who then suddenly backtracked to stop One Of Their Own getting hit for making false statements on asylum applications.