Midnighter Preview

[Subotai]

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=84411


Looks pretty good. Some Preacher "War in the Sun" vibes there.

[hex111]

I still don't understand this whole "kill a mass murderer or die!!" thing they that are going with... first panel, Midnighter kicks some dude's head off... think he gives a flying eff about killing a mass murderer... unless that mass murderer turns out to be someone that he is friends with or something... cause he still wouldn't have a problem with it if it was an alternate version of a friend from the Bleed... if it's one of his friends, he might have a problem with it... but probably not much of one...

[Subotai]

One good thing about Ennis is he is pretty respectful of his character's histories....We see that with Castle, of course, and Preacher, and now Kev. I'm sure he's dying to explore the origins of Midnighter, including 'The Gay Team.' It'll be interesting to see how this assassination plays out.

[Stellar]

so why'd he let the last guy go?
i didn't know Sprouse was going to be on Midnighter. his art is great, but not really fitting for a series like Midnighter.

[Ragnorok64]

Oh why oh why, did i even click the preview. I know I already hate Midnighter's character, and this isn't going to help. Maybe it's just me, but does anyone else think the only thing that keeps Midnighter from being a villain is the fact that most of the people he kills are "bad" (or at leaste the Authority thinks they're bad). Seriously he seems to actually enjoy killing people in brutal and needlesly sadistic ways. He's fully capable of non-lethal takedowns if he wanted to.

[Subotai]

Oh why oh why, did i even click the preview. I know I already hate Midnighter's character, and this isn't going to help. Maybe it's just me, but does anyone else think the only thing that keeps Midnighter from being a villain is the fact that most of the people he kills are "bad" (or at leaste the Authority thinks they're bad).

That was part of the original take on Midnighter, a sadistic, vicious, ex-special forces soldier. Really easy to pin as a bad guy from a certain POV. But when you look at it in context, Midnighter is not different from many Wildstorm/Stormwatch/Wildcats characters in not hesitating to kill bad guys.

[Mia]

That was part of the original take on Midnighter, a sadistic, vicious, ex-special forces soldier. Really easy to pin as a bad guy from a certain POV. But when you look at it in context, Midnighter is not different from many Wildstorm/Stormwatch/Wildcats characters in not hesitating to kill bad guys.

Funny how he was originally penned as being the gay Batman. Personally I think the characters are as different as night and day. The Midnighter seems to be more in line with Wolverine or the Punnisher. A mindless thug who beats up on other thugs.

I was contemplating getting this--I've advocated that he get his own book for years. That until I thought about who is writting it. I know that Ellis won't be able to resist sly tongue in cheek jokes about him being gay.

Not that I don't mind poking fun at things. But the digs I've seen in the past at A&M seemed to be more cheap and spiteful than anything else. There was an air of mean spiritedness about it which turned me off.

And I also don't want to read about the excessive violence. Just too much estrogen to enjoy that ;) .

[Stellar]

except Midnighter's the kind of guy who takes the fight to the enemy instead of being on the defense like the Wildcats and others

on a sidenote, ENNis is writing the book, not ELLis

[Mr. Palmer]

From what I've seen, I like. I'll definitely be picking this up...

[Subotai]

Funny how he was originally penned as being the gay Batman. Personally I think the characters are as different as night and day. The Midnighter seems to be more in line with Wolverine or the Punnisher. A mindless thug who beats up on other thugs.

I was contemplating getting this--I've advocated that he get his own book for years. That until I thought about who is writting it. I know that Ellis won't be able to resist sly tongue in cheek jokes about him being gay.

Not that I don't mind poking fun at things. But the digs I've seen in the past at A&M seemed to be more cheap and spiteful than anything else. There was an air of mean spiritedness about it which turned me off.

And I also don't want to read about the excessive violence. Just too much estrogen to enjoy that ;) .

I'm not sure if you mean Ellis or Ennis, but Ennis is the only writer who's dealt with Midnighter's sexuality in an up-front and adult manner. That scene where he dresses down Kev for being homophobic is terrific writing.

And as for Midnighter being mindless - I don't know about that. I'd like to see if he was always so brutal or if something drove him to it. Ennis seems to mock guys like Wolvie and Punisher because they take themselves so seriously.

I'm sure the violence will be serious - although Midnighter's violence is most often threatened. We rarely get to see him follow up on his promises of unimagined carnage.

[Mia]

I'm not sure if you mean Ellis or Ennis, but Ennis is the only writer who's dealt with Midnighter's sexuality in an up-front and adult manner. That scene where he dresses down Kev for being homophobic is terrific writing.




I wouldn't call it adult. It seemed to be more about 'soapboxing' than anything else. The original treatment by Ellis (got that right) seemed more adult than that. In that he was just another character. There was no pontificating or lecturing. When I looked at the first issue of Kev where that he wonders out loud if A&M are 'poofters'. And then the end result after they beat him up I just groaned.


Which was too bad. Because up until that time I always got the impression that the Midnighter couldn't give a damn about what you thought of him. He always struck me as the type of guy where if you told him a 'fag' joke he'd just laugh---at you for---telling it in the first place. Now he's lecturing and chastising people for being homophobic.


except Midnighter's the kind of guy who takes the fight to the enemy instead of being on the defense like the Wildcats and others

on a sidenote, ENNis is writing the book, not ELLis


You're right. I meant Ennis. The same guy who wrote The Punnisher right? I had a taste of that already and to say that I wasn't impressed would be a gross understatment. So I'll pass on this book.

[Subotai]

I wouldn't call it adult. It seemed to be more about 'soapboxing' than anything else. The original treatment by Ellis (got that right) seemed more adult than that. In that he was just another character. There was no pontificating or lecturing. When I looked at the first issue of Kev where that he wonders out loud if A&M are 'poofters'. And then the end result after they beat him up I just groaned.

Soapboxing? It was hardly a self-important diatribe. Midnighter wouldn't bother telling his views to someone else, just knock his head off. But Kev earns some points for standing up for his friend and in the field. That's what pisses Midnighter off, just as it has his whole career, probably - why judge a person based on their sexuality? And, in a few condemning sentences, he explains Kev's train wreck of a life to him.

And that's the issue neither Ellis or Millar had the stones to address, an issue which would have to be addressed in the real world. America couldn't handle an NFL player coming out the closet (or maybe not, but we'll never know) so could you imagine how real superheroes coming out of the closet would be treated? God knows they would be called 'poofters' and much worse by people in the military. It seems immature, the cracks by Kev and the kids in the sequel, but then it IS immature, people's views towards homosexuals.

[Subotai]

Which was too bad. Because up until that time I always got the impression that the Midnighter couldn't give a damn about what you thought of him. He always struck me as the type of guy where if you told him a 'fag' joke he'd just laugh---at you for---telling it in the first place. Now he's lecturing and chastising people for being homophobic.

Never got that feeling, not at all. Midnighter's wound tighter than a snare drum.

And he was right to chastise Kev. You shouldn't have to put up with that crap.

[Subotai]

And not to beat this topic to death, but as Kev's SAS mates explain to him, it's one thing to make a joke (as rude as it is) but Kev's behaviour is deeply prejudiced. Thankfully Midnighter and Kev eventually do eventually come to terms, but the story continues - the Kev series is really about a man overcoming his arrested development - Kev is still learning to take Midnighter's advice to heart.

[Mia]

Never got that feeling, not at all. Midnighter's wound tighter than a snare drum.

And he was right to chastise Kev. You shouldn't have to put up with that crap..

The earlier one wasn't. He had a rappier wit and knew what to take seriously and what to shrug off. He was more confident, and less thin skinned. It's why I liked the character.


Soapboxing? It was hardly a self-important diatribe. Midnighter wouldn't bother telling his views to someone else, just knock his head off. But Kev earns some points for standing up for his friend and in the field. That's what pisses Midnighter off, just as it has his whole career, probably - why judge a person based on their sexuality? And, in a few condemning sentences, he explains Kev's train wreck of a life to him.

And that's the issue neither Ellis or Millar had the stones to address, an issue which would have to be addressed in the real world. America couldn't handle an NFL player coming out the closet (or maybe not, but we'll never know) so could you imagine how real superheroes coming out of the closet would be treated? God knows they would be called 'poofters' and much worse by people in the military. It seems immature, the cracks by Kev and the kids in the sequel, but then it IS immature, people's views towards homosexuals.


But that still sounds like, rather heavy handed preaching and lecturing to me. Especially since it comes from a character who seemed to take the term 'actions speak louder than words' to a whole new level. However I really appreciate your extrapolating and giving me a taste of what Ennis has in store. I just thought that he would potray the Midnighter as simply a knuckle dragging thug. But a knuckle dragging thug who pontificates and lectures people is even worse! Now I know I should really stay away from the book.

[Subotai]

The earlier one wasn't. He had a rappier wit and knew what to take seriously and what to shrug off. He was more confident, and less thin skinned. It's why I liked the character.

Really don't know how anyone could get the idea the Midnighter was thick-skinned, he's practically killed everyone he's ever met besides Kev and the Authority. Never saw him shrug anything off, unless it was teasing from Jenny Sparks. And even then, she never mocked his sexuality. Millar wrote him as more of a smart-ass, but that was a mistake and standard 'Millar-speak'.

But that still sounds like, rather heavy handed preaching and lecturing to me. Especially since it comes from a character who seemed to take the term 'actions speak louder than words' to a whole new level. However I really appreciate your extrapolating and giving me a taste of what Ennis has in store. I just thought that he would potray the Midnighter as simply a knuckle dragging thug. But a knuckle dragging thug who pontificates and lectures people is even worse! Now I know I should really stay away from the book.

Sounds like it.

[Majinlex]

There's an interview with Ennis at newsarama as well
http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA06/DC/Ennis_Mid.htm

I thought this part might interest ye.
Speaking of his sexuality, and the fact that this will be the first ongoing comic from either Marvel or DC starring a gay hero in the title role, Ennis isn’t shying away from it at all.

“His opening monologue touches on his sexuality, but not in the way people might expect,” Ennis said. “His sexuality is not a complex issue: he likes fucking men. He likes fucking one man in particular - but that doesn’t mean he wants to be around the guy 24/7, hence the solo book. He has no more questions about himself in that regard, so why should we?
Doesn't sound like he's going to be making cheap gay jokes to me.

[Mia]

Really don't know how anyone could get the idea the Midnighter was thick-skinned, he's practically killed everyone he's ever met besides Kev and the Authority.





You don't understand the concept of 'thick skinned'. A thick skinned person is someone who does not take offense easily. And I don't get how he could have killed practically every person he could have met. That doesn't make sense.


Never saw him shrug anything off, unless it was teasing from Jenny Sparks. And even then, she never mocked his sexuality. Millar wrote him as more of a smart-ass, but that was a mistake and standard 'Millar-speak'.

Warren Ellis wrote him with a wit as well, which was very amusing and sharp.. And I've seen people tease him about things, which he basically which he either ignored or basically gave them an 'f-u'.

[Subotai]

There's an interview with Ennis at newsarama as well
http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA06/DC/Ennis_Mid.htm

I thought this part might interest ye.

Doesn't sound like he's going to be making cheap gay jokes to me.

Thanks for that. This will be interesting. I wouldn't be surprised to have had Midnighter cross paths with Team 7 at some point in his past, with his Special Forces background.

[Subotai]

You don't understand the concept of 'thick skinned'. A thick skinned person is someone who does not take offense easily. And I don't get how he could have killed practically every person he could have met. That doesn't make sense.

Um, never mind.

Warren Ellis wrote him with a wit as well, which was very amusing and sharp.. And I've seen people tease him about things, which he basically which he either ignored or basically gave them an 'f-u'.

Besides the Authority? They's be measuring their lifespan in nanoseconds if Apollo wasn't around to cool him off. And Ennis has written him witty as well as anyone.

[Subotai]

“I always thought Batman was the gay Batman, but there you go,” the writer said. “I think the Midnighter is very much his own man; his sexuality is just one part of that. Never mind the fact that he doesn’t kill people, would Batman do the things we’ve seen the Midnighter do? Batman fights for the status quo, the Midnighter fights to make the world better. Simple as that.”

Good stuff.

[BigBoss]

wildstorm has some badass stuff coming out this is defintly going on my pull list.

[matt levin]

"Kill a mass murderer or die"?
sounds like Nexus, to me. Ah, Nexus.


Matt

[ultramandingo]

ah nexus indeed ......

anyhoo . ennis. sprouse . that gay allah quoting batman . and tanks . what did wildstorm ever do to deserve this ? they must have video of ennis , morrison , gean ha and a goat or something