X-Men: Phoenix Warsong #1 - Review and Spoilers!!

[Hi-Fi]

Super Weird Book!

So the Cuckoos are walking around the mansion, and when they realize it, they're right next to Esme and Sophie's tombstones. Celeste thinks they're dreaming, but Phoebe says it's real.So they suddenly hear a voice calling them and they start to fly!

The phone rings in Scott's bedroom. It's Beast saying there's trouble. But before Scott can do anything, Emma is going all Phoenix over him. She kills him, then kill the students, them kill the rest of the Astonishing team, then destroy the Earth!

The phone rings in Scott's bedroom. It's Beast saying there's trouble with the Cukoos. Emma just had a nightmare, that's all!

The team go to the yard and they see a ONE Sentinel catching the flying sisters. Emma screams at Hellion, thinking it's just a prank he's doing with the girls. Well, it's not. Emma to the Cuckoos: "You're grounded!"

Cut to three boxes inside the Cuckoos mind(s). Emma isolated them from each other, so they're all alone now. Emma want some anwsers. Phoebe: "No!". She is able to unite herself to her sisters again, and together they break in Emma's mind! Emma gives up.

Celeste is crying. Phoebe is tired of her whinning. She goes away. Celeste: "But we're the three-in-one!"

Emma talks to the Astonishing team. She says the girls will go to them vulnerable and they need to use that. She's worried about the Cuckoos new powers. Beast says that secondary mutations (!) are a normal thing now. But Emma knows there's something more to it.

Celeste is talking to Beast. She says she has something dark growing on her and she's scared. Beast says everybody has a dark side that needs to be controled (or something like that).

Phoebe is training with Wolverine. She now uses her telekinesis (or flying ability??) for her advantage. Logan hits her and she gets angry.

Mindee and Emma meet in front of the Phoenix statue. Mindee says Emma is scared of them. Emma says Mindee is not capable of handling what's going on. Mindee: "You think I'm not strong enough?"

They start to fight with their minds (I think) and the ground begins to crack.

Then, a calling. The Cuckoos all start flying and burst into flames, going all Phoenix.

Emma, on the ground: "My girls, my girls..."

Quentin Quire is awake in his cell.

Then, Sophie skeleton gets out of the ground, followed by Esme!!!

"Come, Esme. Our sisters need us."

To be contiuned...

[Beast]

Beast says that secondary mutations (!) are a normal thing now.
God. Just when you thought that we'd heard the end of the crapfest that is Secondary Mutations, we have to have it brought up again. And how can they be a normal thing now, considering Decimation and the fact only a few mutants even had one before that. Sounds like a fun read otherwise. :)

[Titan76]

This book sounds stupid. Glad I'm not getting it.

[dotdotdot]

the horror movie vibes make this book a good time.

[Omega Alpha]

Yeah, it was alright. Not as good as Endsong, though.

[Sentinel K]

Yeah, it was alright. Not as good as Endsong, though.

I would never put those 2 words in the same sentence.

[comicfreak]

Well, reading the summary I'm not convinced enough to buy this book. Guess I'll wait for the trade.

[Arilou]

Mindee: "I can break things with my mind now!"
Emma: "Really? I just break minds."

P0WN3D!

[jsg2295]

I just finished the first issue, maybe it is just me but I feel this book is just "rushed", not that it went at a frantic pace or anything, just that the characters really didnt develop in any way that would make me interested in this story.
I hate the fact that the Cuckoo's havent been see since the last series and then are just rushed along to get to the main focus of the story.
Emma tells them she feels there is a connection between the Phoenix and what is happening to the girls. Apparently, no one on the team has the same instincts even though Emma is a flipping telepath. They say it is just secondary mutation and puberty. Apparently since this probably happened less than six months before (marvel time), they just dont seem to feel the need to think it is a Phoenix-related event.
I feel nothing for these girls...and ultimately for this first issue.

[Hi-Fi]

I hate the fact that the Cuckoo's havent been see since the last series and then are just rushed along to get to the main focus of the story.


The Cuckoos are appearing in New X-Men since Decimation, in supporting roles.

[Beast]

The Cuckoos are appearing in New X-Men since Decimation, in supporting roles.
They also showed up in Astonishing X-Men. And a few other places.

[drwho]

Eek that review makes me not even want to read it.

[Hi-Fi]

Eek that review makes me not even want to read it.

Yay, my review skills are getting better and better!


I didn't like the issue much, anyway.

[jsg2295]

The Cuckoos are appearing in New X-Men since Decimation, in supporting roles.
What is sad is that I get New X-Men and just havent noticed them.

[kate-pryde]

I read it in the LCS today and passed on buying it. It's just a convoluted mess!
It makes no sense and the Cuckoos are the most annoying characters ever created.

[Daithi]

It makes no sense and the Cuckoos are the most annoying characters ever created.

I like the Cuckoos but hate the fact that the Phoenix bolted onto them. At least Jean and Rachel made a slight appearence. Pity Ray in her Romita Phoenix outfit...

[Mitsaso]

Bloody weird. Crappy pacing and not really an interesting re-take on the Phoenix stories. The last page was the only thing that was worth something.:rolleyes:

[DDM]

I'm so glad I'm not buying this series. As if Phoenix Endsong is not enough, Marvel is taking another crap on Phoenix.

[Joey]

I agree the last page was the best part of the book...the rest was rather blah

[Sparda]

The book was'nt that great but it was insteresting ending at the end for some strange reason the cuckoos having the phoenix force. Also of interest is the dead rising from the ground (jean grey?). This issue was just merely an intro. Art was nice though.

[Brian M.]

Lemme first say this: I'm buying this book soley on the hope that Jean Grey will appear and come back to life for good. I'm praying and hoping it happens, it won't, but still. If that doesn't I hope Emma dies. That probably won't happen either.

So after reading this first issue here are my thoughts:

-The pacing wasn't so bad, although I find it weird that the Cuckoos go from flying and getting captured to "Dr. Phil" time w/ the teachers. It's not a bad idea for them to have the PF...saying you ignore everything that's been written about it so far. Of course we have no idea right now why it's in the Cuckoo's so I'll hold a wait and see approach. The dialogue wasn't bad, I like Pak's writing from everything I've read. The last page was interesting although I can't say I like the PF being used as a magic wand bringing people back to life willy nilly.

For the art...it's so so. I think Kirkman is a poor man Silverstri. I'm not saying that's bad b/c his art is good but if your gonna get art like that, why not have Silverstri draw it?

Overall it's the first issue, it kinda set some things up I think this would be a good mini if it didn't have the Phoenix in it. We should learn more about the Cuckoo's but why tie the Phoenix into it?

PS: I'm glad Beast mentioned Rachel, I was hoping she might appear in here...hopefully to reclaim the dam fire bird.

[CE_Rap]

I do like the Cuckoos as characters. I feel like they should be doing more. The thing is.........................................what the hell do they have to do with Phoenix?! why are they at the fore front of this story? I dunno. I'd rather their roles in New X-Men be played up rather then have them be the new Phoenix avatars or whatever they are.

we'll just wait and see.

[Beast]

I do like the Cuckoos as characters. I feel like they should be doing more. The thing is.........................................what the hell do they have to do with Phoenix?! why are they at the fore front of this story? I dunno. I'd rather their roles in New X-Men be played up rather then have them be the new Phoenix avatars or whatever they are.

we'll just wait and see.
Other than hoping to see Jean in this, I'm eagerly awaiting the promised backstory of the Cuckoos.

[CE_Rap]

Other than hoping to see Jean in this, I'm eagerly awaiting the promised backstory of the Cuckoos.

same here. that concerns me more than anything.

[dellicious]

Overall it's the first issue, it kinda set some things up I think this would be a good mini if it didn't have the Phoenix in it. We should learn more about the Cuckoo's but why tie the Phoenix into it?



because they are trying to get the jean grey/phoenix fans to get the issue
otherwise a series starring the cuckoos would sell like used toilet paper

skimmed through it
meh

[Callisto]

i always thought the cuckoos when combined were pretty much an unbeatable telepathic team.

[Beast]

i always thought the cuckoos when combined were pretty much an unbeatable telepathic team.
I don't see it. They're too young and inexperienced.

[blackphoenix]

This book sounds stupid. Glad I'm not getting it.

Wish I had your fortitude, dude, but as you can tell by my username, I'm a sucker for ANYTHING having to do with Phoenix...

....but this "musical chairs" Phoenix Force crap has got to stop. I thought this sequel was gonna be about Jean, not some jailbait usurpers of her powers! Not to be blunt, but I don't give a rats ass about the Three-In One. Why not deal with their blossoming womanhood(wow, that didn't come out right...:evilsmile )in New X-Men or something and leave this mini for the further adventures of Phoenix??

[Kid Kyoto]

The important thing is Jean is still seriously dead.

let's all unite behind keeping Jean in the grave forever and ever and ever and ever.

[blackphoenix]

The important thing is Jean is still seriously dead.

let's all unite behind keeping Jean in the grave forever and ever and ever and ever.

BITE YUIR TONGUE, SIRRAH!!!!

Such words will get you your ass handed to you(not by me, tho. Someone else. *ahem*). If you read Phoenix:Endsong#1(did you???), you would know that Jean was already ressurected by her pet flaming turkey, so there!:p

[Beast]

The important thing is Jean is still seriously dead.

let's all unite behind keeping Jean in the grave forever and ever and ever and ever.
Jean hasn't been dead since Phoenix: Endsong. She's just in the WHR, there is no body in the grave.

[Beast]

Wish I had your fortitude, dude, but as you can tell by my username, I'm a sucker for ANYTHING having to do with Phoenix...

....but this "musical chairs" Phoenix Force crap has got to stop. I thought this sequel was gonna be about Jean, not some jailbait usurpers of her powers! Not to be blunt, but I don't give a rats ass about the Three-In One. Why not deal with their blossoming womanhood(wow, that didn't come out right...:evilsmile )in New X-Men or something and leave this mini for the further adventures of Phoenix??
If you had read the solicits, you would know that the entire mini-series is set to focuses on the Cuckoos. Phoenix is, as was said above, simply a means of selling more copies.

[Michael P]

Mindee
Ack. Is there any way we can retcon that gods-awful name? Or at least put her in the ground, too, so no one ever has to say it again>

[dellicious]

The important thing is Jean is still seriously dead.

let's all unite behind keeping Jean in the grave forever and ever and ever and ever.

the important thing is understanding
you need to re read endsong
shes far from dead
her body isnt even in her grave and shes off collecting her pieces

lets not

[fishtaco]

I'm a sucker for ANYTHING having to do with Phoenix...Even if Mammomax, Willie Lumpkin and Oprah all became Phoenix at the same time? I wouldn't be suprised if this is what will happen in the next Phoenix mini by Greg Pak, and the supposed Last Phoenix Story. A sequel to a sequel to a sequel to a sequel to a sequel.

I wonder if Marvel has the slightest notion of just how ridiculous this is. I wonder if they have the slightest idea of how much they are convoluting Phoenix and making the biggest mockery in quite possibly all of comic book history.

[Fede]

who's this silvestri wannabe? the art was horrible to look at.

the writing isn't that bad, but i wont read it twice. i dont like this bitchy phoenix that can get inside anyone :mad:

[Cayman]

It was pretty cool, but the art was too murky. I don't really like the 3-In-1 having individual personalities. Beast was good. If the art had been better suited to the story, I would have enjoyed it more.

[Michael P]

the important thing is understanding
you need to re read endsong
shes far from dead
her body isnt even in her grave and shes off collecting her pieces

Actually, I don't think her body even exists anymore. And as I understood it, the Phoenix is collecting its pieces. Jean is not the Phoenix, any more than one plank of wood is a ship, or a glass of water is the water itself.

[Beast]

Regardless of how bad the art is, at least it isn't 'The Tracer'. ;)

[Beast]

Actually, I don't think her body even exists anymore. And as I understood it, the Phoenix is collecting its pieces. Jean is not the Phoenix, any more than one plank of wood is a ship, or a glass of water is the water itself.
No, Phoenix Endsong restated that Jean is the Phoenix, and the Phoenix is Jean.

[Michael P]

No, Phoenix Endsong restated that Jean is the Phoenix, and the Phoenix is Jean.
Impossible, given that the Phoenix entity had an independent existence of its own before it ran into Jean, as well as a presence in Shi'Ar folklore for millennia before she was even born.

Jean may have been a vessel for the Phoenix, and she may be irrevocably bound to it because of that, but she isn't, as the dwarves say, the thing and the whole of the thing.

[Cayman]

I wish they'd gotten the guy who did Drax The Destroyer to do the art for this one.

[blackphoenix]

If you had read the solicits, you would know that the entire mini-series is set to focuses on the Cuckoos. Phoenix is, as was said above, simply a means of selling more copies.


Pak said right here that Jean was gonna be in the story--did he lie? Screw those three jailbait hoes, man. Where's Jean, damn it all???

[Beast]

Impossible, given that the Phoenix entity had an independent existence of its own before it ran into Jean, as well as a presence in Shi'Ar folklore for millennia before she was even born.

Jean may have been a vessel for the Phoenix, and she may be irrevocably bound to it because of that, but she isn't, as the dwarves say, the thing and the whole of the thing.
You forget how the White Hot Room works though. Jean touches all points of time and space from within' it. 'The Phoenix' has already said in the past that it has taken it's form/it's very essence from Jean. You'll also note that Jean manifested the Phoenix Raptor and the White/Gold Phoenix costume long before she ever encountered the so-called Entity on the shuttle. She had it as a child. It doesn't matter if the Phoenix was a in Shi'ar folklore for millennia before Jean was born. Time means nothing.

[Michael P]

You forget how the White Hot Room works though. Jean touches all points of time and space from within' it. 'The Phoenix' has already said in the past that it has taken it's form/it's very essence from Jean. You'll also note that Jean manifested the Phoenix Raptor and the White/Gold Phoenix costume long before she ever encountered the so-called Entity on the shuttle. She had it as a child. It doesn't matter if the Phoenix was a in Shi'ar folklore for millennia before Jean was born. Time means nothing.
I find this notion both nonsensical and crappy, so I reject it.

[Beast]

I find this notion both nonsensical and crappy, so I reject it.
Well, it's what canon says until it's retconned. Jean even reminded the PF in Endsong that it is her.

[The Shadow]

Well, reading the summary I'm not convinced enough to buy this book. Guess I'll wait for the trade.
So... you won't spend $3.00 and try the first issue but you'll drop $20 on the trade? :confused:

[Beast]

So... you won't spend $3.00 and try the first issue but you'll drop $20 on the trade? :confused:
Welcome to the wonderful world of comic fans, complain but buy it anyway. :)

[Ryan K]

Ugh. No better than anything seen in the horrendous Phoenix: Endsong.

Marvel just needs to never bring up the Phoenix again. Unless its in reference to the classic storyline. Has there ever been a good Phoenix-related storyline since the original? Not even close in my opinion. Yet Marvel just continues to regurgitate the concept, but make it confusing and stupid.

Seriously though, its crap like this that makes me embarrassed to be an X-Men fan sometimes.

[Brian M.]

It's really not that bad yet. Give it time, maybe wait until the end of the series to judge it.

[fishtaco]

Well, it's what canon says until it's retconned. Jean even reminded the PF in Endsong that it is her.Due to previous canon that the canon you are describing is contradictory and thus erroneous, the reader has the right to choose which vision he wants. And do we need more retcons? And are you saying that Jean reminded Jean that Jean is Jean?

[Brian M.]

Due to previous canon that the canon you are describing is contradictory and thus erroneous, the reader has the right to choose which vision he wants. And do we need more retcons? And are you saying that Jean reminded Jean that Jean is Jean?

:mad: forget it, now your just trying to start stuff.

[Beast]

Due to previous canon that the canon you are describing is contradictory and thus erroneous, the reader has the right to choose which vision he wants. And do we need more retcons? And are you saying that Jean reminded Jean that Jean is Jean?
It's not contradictory. It fits in perfectly with the established canon, if you actually think. And no, Marvel has the right to choose which version it wants. And yes, the Force was confused because it was seperated from Jean at the time, and she had to remind it that they are one in the same.

[Cayman]

I hope Quentin gets a lot of page time.

[streator]

i pre-ordered this issue...

the comments here are about what i expected.

i don't anticipate much from it, but hopefully it's okay.

i am getting this issue (and the rest of the series) to see what pak does with morrison's characters, which he mostly dealt with in endsong. i really don't care about jean grey whatsoever. bring on kid omega and do something interesting with the phoenix force.

[Syzygy]

Jeez, what a tough crowd!

Well, I liked the issue, mainly for the Cuckoos. I enjoy seeing otherwise minor characters get some star time. And it was interesting to finally see the other three Cuckoos get some personality. So far, I've got them down as:

Sophie: the heroic, noble-souled, self-sacrificing one.
Esme: the slutty, sleazy, bad-tempered, villainous one.
Celeste: the emotionally-oversensitive one.
Phoebe: the athletic, pugnatious, physically energetic one.
Mindee: the cerebral one.

I gather that of those who didn't like it, most of you had an objection to the presence of the Phoenix Force, yet again. Well, I don't know what to tell you about that.... Basically, I think I agree with Beast, in that the laws of space and time, while they apply to us mortals, don't apply to the Phoenix. On the other hand, if you're just tired of the Phoenix Force, well, then I guess nothing could have saved this issue for you.

For myself, I wasn't focusing on the Phoenix so much as I was enjoying the Cuckoos and other mortal characters interact. I pretty much view the Phoenix as a prop, sort of like the Black Bird in the Maltese Falcon. It's there, everybody has strong feelings about it, yeah, but ultimately, for me, the story is about the characters, not the props.

Sorry to hear so many of us are so down on this issue. I consider myself a tough audience, and I liked it.

Peace,
Syzygy

[Doom Hammer]

Due to previous canon that the canon you are describing is contradictory and thus erroneous, the reader has the right to choose which vision he wants. And do we need more retcons? And are you saying that Jean reminded Jean that Jean is Jean?

Personal selective continuity is, seriously, the stupidest idea that has sprung forth from any comic geek. Ever. And that's saying a lot, no joke. It is a worthless concept. Devoid of worth. Absolutely and completely. So much so, I can barely type in complete sentences. Man.

[Brian M.]

Personal selective continuity is, seriously, the stupidest idea that has sprung forth from any comic geek. Ever. And that's saying a lot, no joke. It is a worthless concept. Devoid of worth. Absolutely and completely. So much so, I can barely type in complete sentences. Man.

I'm voting for you for X-Poster of the Month, if you never post again your'll get my vote hands down. Thank you.

[Cayman]

Seems weird to me that Esme was buried at the school.

[Beast]

I'm voting for you for X-Poster of the Month, if you never post again your'll get my vote hands down. Thank you.
Ditto. Doom Bunny for X-Poster of the Month. :D

[Beast]

Seems weird to me that Esme was buried at the school.
It's just like the X-Men themselves, they'll take anyone. :p

[Cayman]

It's just like the X-Men themselves, they'll take anyone. :p

It'd be cool if you could hear the earrings still rattling around in her skull.

[Omega Alpha]

For myself, I wasn't focusing on the Phoenix so much as I was enjoying the Cuckoos and other mortal characters interact. I pretty much view the Phoenix as a prop, sort of like the Black Bird in the Maltese Falcon. It's there, everybody has strong feelings about it, yeah, but ultimately, for me, the story is about the characters, not the props.


Yeah, the Phoenix Force is the McGuffin for me too. Actually, it was also like that in Endsong , and i think it was intentional, Pak focused more on how the characters react to it's return rather than in the Phoenix itself.

[evilheroics]

this book was wierd and confusing...

i dont see myself getting issue #2. those sisters dont seem to hold my interest. the book reminded me of carrie or one of those lame 80's horrow movies.

[Volk1]

It'd be cool if you could hear the earrings still rattling around in her skull.
LOL.

I don't think I ever read anything like this before in an X-book whcih means I-don't-know-what-exactly but I'm intrigued. But the premise being that it surrounds Emma and the Cuckoos with Phoenix kinda turns me off.

I don't know if I'll continue to get it but the art did grow on me as I continued to read and I loved the Beast/Celeste conversation. Beast is great as a mentor.

Hellion? 4 way with the Cuckoo's? Don't blame him but dream on buddy....

Oh yeah. QUENTIN QURE!!!! I hope he escapes the Institute. I like him as a bad guy and I think he needs to get out of Beast's lab because I don't think Beast really wants him there anyways.

[tunasammiches]

Did everyone on this board take classes in Bitchy Queen 101 ? Not liking an issue or the idea for a story concept is one thing, but I swear to god I read through all the posts and I felt like I was in a gay bar where entitlement ruled. I know that this is what forums are for but dayum.

I gotta admit, it's kinda weak that there's another Phoenix story so soon but I'm intrigued why they chose the Cuckoos. I do like the horror story feel. I think that's the most interesting part about it. Since I'm consciously spending he money to buy this book, I will wait for the mini-series to progress more before judging it too harshly.

The only thing that really chaps my ass lately is that, no matter what comic, under which artist...although almost always well written, NO ONE can seem to draw Beast's cat-face well.

[Beast]

Did everyone on this board take classes in Bitchy Queen 101 ? Not liking an issue or the idea for a story concept is one thing, but I swear to god I read through all the posts and I felt like I was in a gay bar where entitlement ruled. I know that this is what forums are for but dayum.
Nice. Make offensive stereotypical comments about gay people. Go you!

[tunasammiches]

Nice. Make offensive stereotypical comments about gay people. Go you!

Oh c'mon. I'm gay too, and I've seen it enough to know that gay men + bitchy /snarky/sarcasm is a common place phenomenon. (Btw, did the "Go You" part of your comment just prove my joke?)

I'm not saying EVERY gay person does it, I just experience it a lot. Plus I'm gay too...and a person of color (who, unfortunately had to grow up in an all white neighborhood in a Chicago 'burb as a teenager)...so I know all about the offenses of stereotyping. If I pretended to be PC 100% of the time...well, I just don't do that. As a double minority, I think it is okay to take ownership of a joke every now and then.

But that's just my opinion. Sorry if I offended, Beast.

[The Shadow]

Welcome to the wonderful world of comic fans, complain but buy it anyway. :)
LOL

It just... confuses me. :confused:

Spend $3.00 and decide if you want to invest in the rest... or spend $20 for it all when you might not like it... the $3.00 would be the smarter choice... I would think...

I. Just. Don't. Get. It. ;)

[Slung]

I find this notion both nonsensical and crappy, so I reject it.

I will try to break the story down: There is this force that is the sum of all life (spark of creation, chaos bringer, whatever). As Jean Grey is dying on the shuttle she comes in contact with said force.

Jean Grey and the force merge and Jean creates a new body to inhabit. It is said in the text that it’s consciousneess and it’s abilty to communicate on this plane of existence are derived from Jean. The old body is put in a coccoon (or as Morrison calls it, "Phoenix Egg") to heal (with only a tiny spark of her soul left inside - a "just in case" measure - Classic X-Men 8)).

Jean dies on moon. Her soul has a conversation with Death in the M'Kran Crystal/White Hot Room/Afterlife. He tells her that the Phoenix isn't a being or entity but a force. Jean had hoped that they had been two seperate entities and is disappointed to learn that is not the case.

Her body in the coccoon rejects the memories of Jean's time as Phoenix (because of the whole Dark Phoenix thing) and sends that part of her soul to Maddie and into the future to Rachel (or not if you prefer the non-Rachel mess-o-continuity). (As referenced in Inferno and in some convoluted issues of Excaliber - around 50)

The Jean body in the coccoon awakens. She eventually reunites with the rest of her soul that Maddie was keeping. Jean continues to be in a state of denial about the Phoenix.

Morrison, later, had Jean come to grips with her "Phoenix"-ness and she embraces her role.

In the future, we see that Jean left another coccoon (Phoenix egg) on the moon where she died as Phoenix years earlier. She finds herself in the White Hot Room/M'Krann Crystal/Afterlife where she is outside of space and time - nexus of reality - and can surgically alter timelines. There are other lower-class Phoenix characters who defer to Jean as the "White Phoenix of The Crown" or something equally silly-sounding.

In Endsong, rogue Shi'ar warriors attempt to resurrect the Phoenix and destroy it. They think it has resurrected without its host. Wounded, it falls to earth. It is confused and crazy. It resurrects Jean and she has difficulty with understanding what's going on - all she knows is, it was resurrected before it's time and it is disturbed.

In the end, the seemingly two different beings, the Phoenix and Jean, merge and they realize they are the same being - they had been fractured at some point in time and their psyche was scattered across the multiverse - possibly even through time and space.

The outcome of these events, establishes Jean as the Phoenix, whose soul has been fractured and may have been used by various other Phoenix's across the multiverse (including Feron, Giraud, the other reality Quentin Quire and possibly Rachel). Morrison and Pak's "retcon of the retcon" reinforce the Classic X-Men stories in issues 8, 42 and 43.

Warsong - seems to be side-stepping anything really Phoenix and opting to merely cash in on a popular character and prop up C-list characters (Cuckoos).

[Beast]

Oh c'mon. I'm gay too, and I've seen it enough to know that gay men + bitchy /snarky/sarcasm is a common place phenomenon. (Btw, did the "Go You" part of your comment just prove my joke?)

I'm not saying EVERY gay person does it, I just experience it a lot. Plus I'm gay too...and a person of color (who, unfortunately had to grow up in an all white neighborhood in a Chicago 'burb as a teenager)...so I know all about the offenses of stereotyping. If I pretended to be PC 100% of the time...well, I just don't do that. As a double minority, I think it is okay to take ownership of a joke every now and then.

But that's just my opinion. Sorry if I offended, Beast.
No worries, after all the crap over Gay Colossus etc., I jump on anyone who makes the gay jokes, unless I'm sure they're a fellow. No worries, we good. :)

[Beast]

Well done, Slung. You managed to pull together all of the continuity a whole lot better than many of the writers have. And the fractured pieces scattered through space/time definatly do a good job of explaining others who have been shown with the Phoenix. As well as the 'Green Phoenix Corps'. :)

[tunasammiches]

No worries, after all the crap over Gay Colossus etc., I jump on anyone who makes the gay jokes, unless I'm sure they're a fellow. No worries, we good. :)

Wurd up. Wait...Colussus is gay?

[Beast]

Wurd up. Wait...Colussus is gay?
Ultimate Colossus is a sistah, yeah. :)

[tunasammiches]

Ultimate Colossus is a sistah, yeah. :)

Oh right. I forgot.

[Mariah]

Ultimate Colossus is a sistah, yeah. :)
He's not gay, he's just sensitive.

[Omega Alpha]

Yeah, he has shown plenty of sensibility dating Northstar:D

[Blackcat]

I must say I did like it!

I think this ltd. series is more about the Cuckoos themselves instead of the Phoenixforce.

Also liked to see the difference in characters a bit more cleared up.

Phoebe is the agressive one, who is good in a fight (though Mindee was too when Exodus' Brotherhood attacked a while ago) and doesn't like to discuss thing, but likes to act. At this moment she seems the one who's calling mostly the shots.

Celeste is the most reasonable one within the 3 in 1. But also is the softer side and is the most insecure character.

Mindee is the one who never has gotten a good mood after the death of her boyfriend Germaine. We saw that when she helped out the (temporary) blind Gambit against the Brotherhood and also now she isn't the most friendly one. She's also the one who loves to make sharp remarks and loves to discus. She doesn't seem to be afraid of anything.

Sophie was the more caretaking and helping out sweet sister. A kind of girl next door. The one with the least selfcentered ego. She sarcrifised herself to help others. Though it seems Esme stimulated her. (because Sophie was on to her) Kid Omega was totally in love with Sophie, but she didn't like him at all. Quintin brought her back from death once and she commented: "Eeeuw" upon seeing Quire she chose to return to death.

Esme was the bad, darker side of the Cuckoos and was the one mosty in control. She actually did not wanted to be one of the five. So she became a slutty looking Cuckoo with a very bad hairdo. She betrayed the Cuckoos (and the X-Men) when she secretly usurped control of the Cuckoo's group mind. When Sophie resisted, Esme influenced her death and was later killed herself by a fake Magneto.

[The Fury]

Read this in a store today. My Reaction:

*Sigh*

End of.

[saintsaucey]

I liked it more coukoos please. They are fun. and nice to look at. Endsong was good. I would have rather seen it than that lousy movie that was X3. it would have made much more since.

[Kid Kyoto]

Such words will get you your ass handed to you(not by me, tho. Someone else. *ahem*). If you read Phoenix:Endsong#1(did you???), you would know that Jean was already ressurected by her pet flaming turkey, so there!:p

yup then she was multipley stabby stabbed by razorsharp adamamantium thigamajigs by some short hairy guy whose supposed to be pretty good at what he does.

bringing her back would be insulting to stabbing victims world wide.

[Kid Kyoto]

LOL

It just... confuses me. :confused:

Spend $3.00 and decide if you want to invest in the rest... or spend $20 for it all when you might not like it... the $3.00 would be the smarter choice... I would think...

I. Just. Don't. Get. It. ;)

I go on the system of wait for it to end, read reviews, see it in the store, then decide whether or not to buy. Saves me money on thing that start strong and end weak like Identity Crisis.

[Sentinel K]

I don't really know what I though of this.

I didn't DISLIKE it.

I was just a bit.....'meh'.

Art was quite nice though.

What has happened to Silvestri though? Emma and Kitty look WEIRD on that cover.

[TinMan]

I don't really know what I though of this.

I didn't DISLIKE it.

I was just a bit.....'meh'.

Art was quite nice though.

What has happened to Silvestri though? Emma and Kitty look WEIRD on that cover.

I agree, the story wasn't fabulous, but I'll read it all then judge.

I enjoyed the art quite a bit, I can't remember the penciler's name for the life of me, but he was pretty damned good. Looking forward to more of his work.

As for the cover, I do have to say that Emma and Kitty did look weird. I mean, they didn't look bad, but they just didn't looke like Emma and Kitty. Colossus, Beast and Cyke however, did look pretty kickass. Logan on the other hand, looked a bit odd.

[Sentinel K]

I agree, the story wasn't fabulous, but I'll read it all then judge.

I enjoyed the art quite a bit, I can't remember the penciler's name for the life of me, but he was pretty damned good. Looking forward to more of his work.

As for the cover, I do have to say that Emma and Kitty did look weird. I mean, they didn't look bad, but they just didn't looke like Emma and Kitty. Colossus, Beast and Cyke however, did look pretty kickass. Logan on the other hand, looked a bit odd.

Yeah logan looked like he was drawn by Liefeld. Beast looed Surprisingly good and Cyke and Petey looked excellent.

The artists name was Kirkham. I think Warsong is part of that IMAGE deal Marvel did a few months back.

[TinMan]

Yeah logan looked like he was drawn by Liefeld. Beast looed Surprisingly good and Cyke and Petey looked excellent.

The artists name was Kirkham. I think Warsong is part of that IMAGE deal Marvel did a few months back.

I'm really not surprised Beast looked good, Silvestri drew the best feline Beast I've seen so far in the Here Comes Tomorrow arc of New X-Men. This one on the cover wasn't quite as good, but its WAY better than 90% of the other depictions I've seen.

Thats it, Kirkham! It most definitely is part of the Top Cow deal, on the final page with the credits it says something along the lines of "Art by Top Cow studios", or some such blather.

[Affinity]

Blah blah blah, no one cares.

Thanks for the AWESOME review, Hi-Fi!

[Blackcat]

There is also that monologue by the unknown dark force linked to the Cuckoos who's asking the relevant question:

"Why have they never asked why you're called Cuckoos?"; and then goes on to mention how a cuckoo "lays it's eggs in a songbir'ds nest", with the "stupid warbler" unaware of the situation until it's too late.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm!

Something else: it is possible that the Cuckoos are omega-level mutants. This suggestion is supported by the fact that a fragment of the Phoenix Force now resides inside the girls; and the Phoenix seems to require or prefer omega-level avatars

[Slung]

yup then she was multipley stabby stabbed by razorsharp adamamantium thigamajigs by some short hairy guy whose supposed to be pretty good at what he does.

bringing her back would be insulting to stabbing victims world wide.
But after the stabbings, she was still alive. At the end of the book, she was still alive.

And Wolverine being alive is insulting to all burn victims world wide.

So, there you go.

[Beast]

But after the stabbings, she was still alive. At the end of the book, she was still alive.

And Wolverine being alive is insulting to all burn victims world wide.

So, there you go.
Wolverine being alive is insulting to comic fans. ;)

[Beast]

Just got my comics and I read this first. I have to say I was surprised, it was actually pretty good. Much better than Phoenix: Endsong so far. And Beast's talk with Celeste was definatly a highlight of the issue. I would like to know what moment Hank was talking about though, when he says that everyone has lost it. I recognized all the other moments, but I can't place Hank's. Unless that's referring to his feral side in X-Treme X-Men: Savage Land.

[Callisto]

I don't see it. They're too young and inexperienced.


we don't know anything about them to know wheter they are inexperienced or young after all 150 years into the future the cuckoos looked exactly the same they could have been alive for centuries.

[Beast]

we don't know anything about them to know wheter they are inexperienced or young after all 150 years into the future the cuckoos looked exactly the same they could have been alive for centuries.
Yes, but at the moment they are young and inexperienced. For cripes sake, one of them freaked out trying to woogie Sabretooth. And no, they haven't been alive for centuries.

[The Fury]

I have to say I was surprised, it was actually pretty good.
Blasphemy!!!!

[Beast]

Blasphemy!!!!
Hey man, sorry... I actually liked it. The Beast/Celeste scene made it wonderful.

[Cayman]

Hey man, sorry... I actually liked it. The Beast/Celeste scene made it wonderful.

That was my favorite part too.

[Callisto]

I will try to break the story down: There is this force that is the sum of all life (spark of creation, chaos bringer, whatever). As Jean Grey is dying on the shuttle she comes in contact with said force.

Jean Grey and the force merge and Jean creates a new body to inhabit. It is said in the text that it’s consciousneess and it’s abilty to communicate on this plane of existence are derived from Jean. The old body is put in a coccoon (or as Morrison calls it, "Phoenix Egg") to heal (with only a tiny spark of her soul left inside - a "just in case" measure - Classic X-Men 8)).

Jean dies on moon. Her soul has a conversation with Death in the M'Kran Crystal/White Hot Room/Afterlife. He tells her that the Phoenix isn't a being or entity but a force. Jean had hoped that they had been two seperate entities and is disappointed to learn that is not the case.

Her body in the coccoon rejects the memories of Jean's time as Phoenix (because of the whole Dark Phoenix thing) and sends that part of her soul to Maddie and into the future to Rachel (or not if you prefer the non-Rachel mess-o-continuity). (As referenced in Inferno and in some convoluted issues of Excaliber - around 50)

The Jean body in the coccoon awakens. She eventually reunites with the rest of her soul that Maddie was keeping. Jean continues to be in a state of denial about the Phoenix.

Morrison, later, had Jean come to grips with her "Phoenix"-ness and she embraces her role.

In the future, we see that Jean left another coccoon (Phoenix egg) on the moon where she died as Phoenix years earlier. She finds herself in the White Hot Room/M'Krann Crystal/Afterlife where she is outside of space and time - nexus of reality - and can surgically alter timelines. There are other lower-class Phoenix characters who defer to Jean as the "White Phoenix of The Crown" or something equally silly-sounding.

In Endsong, rogue Shi'ar warriors attempt to resurrect the Phoenix and destroy it. They think it has resurrected without its host. Wounded, it falls to earth. It is confused and crazy. It resurrects Jean and she has difficulty with understanding what's going on - all she knows is, it was resurrected before it's time and it is disturbed.

In the end, the seemingly two different beings, the Phoenix and Jean, merge and they realize they are the same being - they had been fractured at some point in time and their psyche was scattered across the multiverse - possibly even through time and space.

The outcome of these events, establishes Jean as the Phoenix, whose soul has been fractured and may have been used by various other Phoenix's across the multiverse (including Feron, Giraud, the other reality Quentin Quire and possibly Rachel). Morrison and Pak's "retcon of the retcon" reinforce the Classic X-Men stories in issues 8, 42 and 43.

Warsong - seems to be side-stepping anything really Phoenix and opting to merely cash in on a popular character and prop up C-list characters (Cuckoos).



WHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT?!!!?:confused: can someone just kill that convulted fire bird already!!!

[X-Factor]

Not bad at all.

If it were not a game of hacky sack the Phoenix, I might even say I thoroughly enjoyed it. However, the art was extremely generic. If one were to use an Image artist, it might as well have been Marc Silvestri or Andy Park. This particular artist seemed more fitted to draw a miniseries revolving around Barbie.

[Callisto]

Yes, but at the moment they are young and inexperienced. For cripes sake, one of them freaked out trying to woogie Sabretooth..


now you and i both know chuck austens characterisation of any character should never be taken at face value.


And no, they haven't been alive for centuries.


you don't know that for sure.

[Beast]

you don't know that for sure.
They were created by the Weapon Plus project. So unless it's retconned in this mini, yes we do.

[Ryan K]

I would like to know what moment Hank was talking about though, when he says that everyone has lost it. I recognized all the other moments, but I can't place Hank's. Unless that's referring to his feral side in X-Treme X-Men: Savage Land.

Maybe it refers to his current state in Astonishing X-Men. Though that's the cause of someone else tampering with his mind.

[Daithi]

Maybe it refers to his current state in Astonishing X-Men. Though that's the cause of someone else tampering with his mind.

That's the same with some of the people gone bad in that scene. Rachel, Scott and Kitty spring to mind.

[Beast]

Maybe it refers to his current state in Astonishing X-Men. Though that's the cause of someone else tampering with his mind.
Well, it's clearly post Apeman Beast. But the only two moments that would fit is X-Treme X-Men: Savage Land and the current arc in Astonishing. But that depends when this takes place as.... Scott still has his visor.

[Ryan K]

Well, it's clearly post Apeman Beast. But the only two moments that would fit is X-Treme X-Men: Savage Land and the current arc in Astonishing. But that depends when this takes place, as Scott still ............

Achem. Spoilers sir.

[Beast]

Achem. Spoilers sir.
Fixed. Sorry about that. :D

[blackphoenix]

Even if Mammomax, Willie Lumpkin and Oprah all became Phoenix at the same time? I wouldn't be suprised if this is what will happen in the next Phoenix mini by Greg Pak, and the supposed Last Phoenix Story. A sequel to a sequel to a sequel to a sequel to a sequel.

I wonder if Marvel has the slightest notion of just how ridiculous this is. I wonder if they have the slightest idea of how much they are convoluting Phoenix and making the biggest mockery in quite possibly all of comic book history.

God, Oprah as Phoenix would be better than those flat chested cows(and funny as hell). This book just graduated to one of those ones I read in the store, at least until Jean shows up(which she probably won't, of course).

EDIT:

In the Wikipedia entry for Jean Grey, the following is written about Phoenix:Warsong:

Greg Pak is returning as writer. He has said that Warsong "is not another Jean Grey resurrection story. It's an essential Phoenix story, and therefore ultimately an essential tale for understanding Jean Grey." [1] Pak also stated that Warsong will lay the groundwork for the future of both Jean and the Phoenix.

Huh. Mebbe I spoke out of turn? :)

[Slung]

WHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT?!!!?:confused: can someone just kill that convulted fire bird already!!!
And here I thought I had broken it down fairly easily and without too much confusion.

If you want to get really confused by mindnumbing convolution, I could attempt to break down Wolverine, Cable, Nightcrawler, Psylocke or Rachel's story...

[Affinity]

Oh my godddddd, this was so bland.

The art, I hate. All of Top Cow's Silvestri-emulators are DAMN ANNOYING.

[fishtaco]

yup then she was multipley stabby stabbed by razorsharp adamamantium thigamajigs by some short hairy guy whose supposed to be pretty good at what he does.I've tried so hard to forget that. Was that page supposed to be shocking and thrilling, or really sad? It wasn't either to me, but I'd like to know what Pak's intention was.
God, Oprah as Phoenix would be better than those flat chested cows(and funny as hell)Which two?Greg Pak is returning as writer. He has said that Warsong "is not another Jean Grey resurrection story. It's an essential Phoenix story, and therefore ultimately an essential tale for understanding Jean Grey." [1] Pak also stated that Warsong will lay the groundwork for the future of both Jean and the Phoenix.Lol. For obvious reasons, I don't take his claim seriously. I think I'll just not read anymore issue summaries, because I've gotten to the point that, despite being a big fan of Jean Grey and even though Rachel Summers is my favorite character, I don't even want to know what Pak is going to do with Phoenix. But if Oprah or Mammomax really does become Phoenix, then I'll be too curious. ;) Personal selective continuity is, seriously, the stupidest idea that has sprung forth from any comic geek. Ever. And that's saying a lot, no joke. It is a worthless concept. Devoid of worth. Absolutely and completely. So much so, I can barely type in complete sentences. Man.If you say so. For me, though, it's working wonders, especially where this mini is concerned. No headaches, no confusion and contradictions, no convolution, minimal off-characterization, and a sensical, retcon-free, plausible, consistent, and flat-out brilliant X-lore. It's not worthless and stupid {to me, at least) if it spares me headaches and what I think is bad content that taints what I think is good content. No one's forcing anything on you. The best way for me is to not even pay any attention to this stuff, that way I won't even know of it's existence. Yet I still pay a considerable amount of attention...If you want to get really confused by mindnumbing convolution, I could attempt to break down Wolverine, Cable, Nightcrawler, Psylocke or Rachel's story...Them, and several other major X-character. Professor X, Rogue, Gambit, Magma, and Shatterstar all have ultra-messy histories. The Phoenix, however, is the "winner". Unless that's referring to his feral side in X-Treme X-Men: Savage Land.I can't help but say that I doubt Mr. Pak is picking up on or even referring to a lost plotline from a rather obscure mini series from some years ago now that wasn't even well-regarded by fans, and was written by a writer that isn't all that well-regarded anymore. ;) They were created by the Weapon Plus project. So unless it's retconned in this mini, yes we do.And, since they were created by the Weapon Plus project, and since they look like they are teenagers and have often acted immature, therefore they ARE biologically teenagers, and there is no possibility that, despite them looking the same way 150 years later, they could be much older than they look. Right, then. I think Callisto has presented an interesting idea. Warsong - seems to be side-stepping anything really Phoenix and opting to merely cash in on a popular character and prop up C-list characters (Cuckoos).That, and more importantly, it's totally disregarding logic, reason, sense, and already established character history and events. I see X-Men: Phoenix Endsong and Warsong thus far first and foremost as a gimmick and/or parody poorly put together by clueless writers and editors who might be able to tell good stories if they were consistent with previous work that they at the same time consider to be classic.

[Beast]

I can't help but say that I doubt Mr. Pak is picking up on or even referring to a lost plotline from a rather obscure mini series from some years ago now that wasn't even well-regarded by fans, and was written by a writer that isn't all that well-regarded anymore. ;)
Well, it's only one of two times that Beast has been out of control since being feline. The second being Astonishing, which hadn't even occured yet given the timeline. Not to mention that there's no evidence that Pak would know about what was upcoming in Astonishing X-Men. And for god sake, they showed Cyclopalypse. That's a lot more horid than XXM: Savage Land, which was rather good, IMHO.
And, since they were created by the Weapon Plus project, and since they look like they are teenagers and have often acted immature, therefore they ARE biologically teenagers, and there is no possibility that, despite them looking the same way 150 years later, they could be much older than they look. Right, then. I think Callisto has presented an interesting idea.
Considering the Weapon Plus project hasn't even been around that long, I find it highly doubtful that they're not simply teenagers. As for why they were alive in the HCT future... that was never explained. Of course Beast was alround also, so I guess that makes him even older than established now also? Start making some sense, please.

[fishtaco]

Well, it's only one of two times that Beast has been out of control since being feline. The second being Astonishing, which hadn't even occured yet given the timeline. Not to mention that there's no evidence that Pak would know about what was upcoming in Astonishing X-Men. And for god sake, they showed Cyclopalypse. That's a lot more horid than XXM: Savage Land.That's three different writers with three different visions of the X-Men and story agendas. Marvel comics may be a shared universe, but things don't work that way.

Considering the Weapon Plus project hasn't even been around that long, I find it highly doubtful that they're not simply teenagers. As for why they were alive in the HCT future... that was never explained. Of course Beast was alround also, so I guess that makes him even older than established now also? Start making some sense, please.Has it ever been stated how long the Weapon Plus project has been around? Len Wein intended for Wolverine to be a teenager, but today it is established he's around a hundred years old. Beast was around because Sublime kept him alive. "Highly doubtful" isn't the same as being sure. There's no point in speculating how old they are because no writer since Morrison has showed any signs of a plot like this, and the chances of them ever doing so is unlikely. Regardless of the convolution and technicalities, Callisto provided an interesting idea. And as long as we're talking about current continuity, you can't expect anybody to start making sense.

[Beast]

That's three different writers with three different visions of the X-Men and story agendas. Marvel comics may be a shared universe, but things don't work that way.
That reply didn't even make sense. And yes, they do.
Has it ever been stated how long the Weapon Plus project has been around? Len Wein intended for Wolverine to be a teenager, but today it is established he's around a hundred years old. Beast was around because Sublime kept him alive. "Highly doubtful" isn't the same as being sure. There's no point in speculating how old they are because no writer since Morrison has showed any signs of a plot like this, and the chances of them ever doing so is unlikely. Regardless of the convolution and technicalities, Callisto provided an interesting idea. And as long as we're talking about current continuity, you can't expect anybody to start making sense.
Weapon X was founded in the 1940's. Yes, it was established that Weapon Plus broke away from Weapon X just after Wolverine was given the Adamantium Bonding Process. Dr. Sublime was even present when Wolverine escaped the facility. It doesn't matter what Larry Hama intended. Larry Hama didn't write Logan's origins and he didn't write about Weapon Plus. If there's no point in speculating on how old they are, then there is no point in speculating on Callisto's idea either. And considering we're getting the answers as to the Cuckoo's origins in this mini, it is being dealt with now. That's the whole purpose of the mini.

[Kid Kyoto]

Greg Pak is returning as writer. He has said that Warsong "is not another Jean Grey resurrection story. It's an essential Phoenix story, and therefore ultimately an essential tale for understanding Jean Grey." [1] Pak also stated that Warsong will lay the groundwork for the future of both Jean and the Phoenix.


What future for Jean Grey? New and interesting worms to eat her? She dead!

[Beast]

What future for Jean Grey? New and interesting worms to eat her? She dead!
She hasn't been dead since Endsong, for the hundreth time.

[Syzygy]

we don't know anything about them to know wheter they are inexperienced or young after all 150 years into the future the cuckoos looked exactly the same they could have been alive for centuries.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on this, Cal.

To me, the Cuckoos of HERE COMES TOMORROW looked like adult women of maybe 20-21. Currently, they look--to me at least--like teenagers who have yet to reach they're full stature. That is, they looked taller to me in HERE COMES TOMORROW.

My hypothesis is that whoever "made" them included some age-retarding factor in their genes; similar perhaps Mystique or Wolverine, their DNA doesn't degrade the same way ours does.

So I believe that they ARE teenagers now, but that they'll stop aging at 21 years or so, and that's why they were still around in HERE COMES TOMORROW.

Supposedly, this hypothesis will be confirmed, or not, by the miniseries.

Peace,
Syzygy

[Slung]

What future for Jean Grey? New and interesting worms to eat her? She dead!

She isn't dead? She's quite alive. Sorry to disappoint you, man, but Jeanie is kicking around as the Phoenix.

[Kid Kyoto]

Isn't her dead corpse buried under tons of ice or something? with some comment to the effect of 'she's as dead as she's ever going to be'.

[Beast]

Isn't her dead corpse buried under tons of ice or something? with some comment to the effect of 'she's as dead as she's ever going to be'.
No, she came back out of the ice and remerged with the Phoenix Force. Then they went into the White Hot Room to regather their fractured pieces.

[d newton]

That, and more importantly, it's totally disregarding logic, reason, sense, and already established character history and events. I see X-Men: Phoenix Endsong and Warsong thus far first and foremost as a gimmick and/or parody poorly put together by clueless writers who might be able to tell good stories if they were consistent with previous work that they at the same time consider to be classic.
And your real problem with Phoenix: Endsong & Warsong is what exactly? I mean just because it doesn't involve Jean or Rachel makes it a "poor parody", does it?

[Slung]

And your real problem with Phoenix: Endsong & Warsong is what exactly? I mean just because it doesn't involve Jean or Rachel makes it a "poor parody", does it?
Whether or not it makes it a "poor parody" is not for me to say. Without Jean or Rachel it is rather pointless and uninteresting though. I don't mind Endsong as much, since it had Jean in it (even if it was more of a prop to further validate the immoral Emma/Scott extramarital love affair).

Isn't her dead corpse buried under tons of ice or something? with some comment to the effect of 'she's as dead as she's ever going to be'.
The mini isn't that bad of a book and it does have some pretty pictures and does a fine job of attempting to tie many of the Phoenix loose ends together. I would suggest picking it up in trade paperback. It will answer most of your questions regarding the current state of Jean Grey. For a quick summation though:

She did get buried in the ice. But, when Emma allowed the Phoenix Force to possess her body, Jean couldn't allow the "stupid woman" to steal her husband and her force, so she decided to burst out of the ice, rip the Phoenix force from Emma's body (before it destroyed her) and then merged with it. Once she merged with the force she realized that they were the same being that had been fragmented and there was no seperate entity: just Jean as Phoenix. When the Shi'ar attempt to kill everyone with some black hole gun or something, Jean saves the day and then leaves for the White Hot Room, where presumably she will set out from again to find and collect her missing fragments. She is not dead, she is journeying the multiverse (presumably) to find the missing pieces of her soul.

Her body was resurrected and she is quite alive (though, still sadly missing from the books - find those dumb pieces and come back already).

[Sheldon]

Jean is traveling the cosmos, a wandering vagabond trying to gather her fragments, whatever the hell that means. I still think Carter is one of the fragments.

Anyways I don't mind a little diversion into the mystery of the Cuckoos. I like the characters. I do think the mini is called Phoenix:Warsong, just to sell it to people who miss Jean tremendously. Its a shame because I'd rather have a Cuckoos mini w/o all the storyline baggage the phoenix force brings to any story....

[Kid Kyoto]

She did get buried in the ice. But, when Emma allowed the Phoenix Force to possess her body, Jean couldn't allow the "stupid woman" to steal her husband and her force, so she decided to burst out of the ice, rip the Phoenix force from Emma's body (before it destroyed her) and then merged with it. Once she merged with the force she realized that they were the same being that had been fragmented and there was no seperate entity: just Jean as Phoenix. When the Shi'ar attempt to kill everyone with some black hole gun or something, Jean saves the day and then leaves for the White Hot Room, where presumably she will set out from again to find and collect her missing fragments. She is not dead, she is journeying the multiverse (presumably) to find the missing pieces of her soul.

Her body was resurrected and she is quite alive (though, still sadly missing from the books - find those dumb pieces and come back already).

Wierd. I only flipped through the book, I can't get past the cut and paste art. I could have sworn it ended with her buried and one of the cucoos getting the phoenix.

Doesn't worry me thought, the one wandering the universe is probably just a skrull.

[phoenixV]

Whether or not it makes it a "poor parody" is not for me to say. Without Jean or Rachel it is rather pointless and uninteresting though.


Warsong seems pointless to me as well. It's not about Jean or Rachel, and the Stepford Cuckoos or Emma Frost should have no role in the Phoenix mythology. It's not about them, it's about Jean. This whole series reeks of just slapping Phoenix on the cover to make people think the books is about one thing, while trying to continue to promote Emma and the Cuckoos.

[milly3cat]

Just read the issue and thought it was great, I hope they bring back the dead sisters, I like the five in one. idea.... :)

[Lord S]

I picked it up and didn't think it was that bad...it wasn't that great either, but still good enough to warrant picking up #2.

Oh, and props go out to Slung for his detailed, yet easy to read, summary of the Phoenix.

[steve2275]

i hope celeste keeps her sox ON thru this mini:)

[Accroître]

Warsong seems pointless to me as well. It's not about Jean or Rachel, and the Stepford Cuckoos or Emma Frost should have no role in the Phoenix mythology. It's not about them, it's about Jean. This whole series reeks of just slapping Phoenix on the cover to make people think the books is about one thing, while trying to continue to promote Emma and the Cuckoos. Completely Agree! Emma and the Cuckoos should have NO part of the Phoenix mythology. Why now?

[Blackcat]

Emma and the Cuckoos should have NO part of the Phoenix mythology. Why now?
Because as speculated before: It is possible that the Cuckoos are omega-level mutants. This suggestion is supported by the fact that a fragment of the Phoenix Force now resides inside the girls; and the Phoenix seems to require or prefer omega-level avatars. Why can the Phoenix Force not choose another strong mutant?

[fishtaco]

Completely Agree! Emma and the Cuckoos should have NO part of the Phoenix mythology. Why now?I'm confused by this. According to the previous mini and Morrison's run (or at least, just fanboy's interpretation of it), Jean is Phoenix and Phoenix is Jean. But now Phoenix is also the Stepford Cuckoos. Does it make sense for more than one person to be Phoenix at the same time? If Jean is Phoenix, and if the Stepford Cuckoos are Phoenix, and if Emma is now Phoenix, then logically, Jean, the Stepford Cuckoos, and Emma are all the same person, right? :rolleyes:

[Beast]

I'm confused by this. According to the previous mini and Morrison's run (or at least, just fanboy's interpretation of it), Jean is Phoenix and Phoenix is Jean. But now Phoenix is also the Stepford Cuckoos. Does it make sense for more than one person to be Phoenix at the same time? If Jean is Phoenix, and if the Stepford Cuckoos are Phoenix, and if Emma is now Phoenix, then logically, Jean, the Stepford Cuckoos, and Emma are all the same person, right? :rolleyes:
Jean/Phoenix is fragmented. There's small pieces scattered throught space and time, due to the Shi'ar bringing the Phoenix back early before it was time and trying to destroy her. One of those pieces inhabited Emma in the first mini, and at the end of the mini one of those pieces bonded with the Stepford Cuckoos.

[xmanson]

I decided to read it.

I shouldn't have done it.

[chickrockguitar]

It makes no sense and the Cuckoos are the most annoying characters ever created. Lmao. True.

[Omega Alpha]

Jean/Phoenix is fragmented. There's small pieces scattered throught space and time, due to the Shi'ar bringing the Phoenix back early before it was time and trying to destroy her. One of those pieces inhabited Emma in the first mini, and at the end of the mini one of those pieces bonded with the Stepford Cuckoos.

Yep.


It makes no sense and the Cuckoos are the most annoying characters ever created.

Yes, it does make sense, and the Cuckoos rule.:D

[Beast]

Yep.



Yes, it does make sense, and the Cuckoos rule.:D
I like the Cuckoos also. It's funny, as much as I didn't like aspects of Morrison's run... his new characters were great. Cassandra Nova, Beak, Dust, and the Cuckoos. Not big on QQ or Sublime (Human or Aeresol), but nobody is perfect. And Xorn was cool, before the whole Xorneto mess. :)

[Cayman]

Some of us have been waiting a long time to see the Cuckoos get the spotlight.

[fishtaco]

This isn't even how the Phoenix works.

[Beast]

Some of us have been waiting a long time to see the Cuckoos get the spotlight.
Aye. I agree it's a shame that the mini is being presented as 'Phoenix' when it's really about the Cuckoos. But as was said above, a Stepford Cuckoos mini has about as much chance as selling as Jubilee's ongoing did.

[Omega Alpha]

I like the Cuckoos also. It's funny, as much as I didn't like aspects of Morrison's run... his new characters were great. Cassandra Nova, Beak, Dust, and the Cuckoos. Not big on QQ or Sublime (Human or Aeresol), but nobody is perfect. And Xorn was cool, before the whole Xorneto mess. :)

Agree on everything. Xorn was already one of my favorite characters, and for me the best one created in a looooong time.

[Beast]

This isn't even how the Phoenix works.
How do you know? Jean/Phoenix was never shattered into fragments unil Phoenix: Endsong. The fragments being the source of the Green Phoenix Corps seen in 'Here Comes Tommorow' (not to mention other beings who had the Pheonix) at least fixes that major "yeahbutwhat?" moment. :D

[Beast]

Agree on everything. Xorn was already one of my favorite characters, and for me the best one created in a looooong time.
Agreed. I wish that Marvel's attempt to salvage Xorn would have worked out better. But well, it was Chuck Austen... what can you do. God, it would have been so much easier to say that Xorn II was the original Xorn from Feng Tu, and that he was replaced at the monestary by Xorneto, a creation of Sublime. :(

[Cayman]

Agreed. I wish that Marvel's attempt to salvage Xorn would have worked out better. But well, it was Chuck Austen... what can you do. God, it would have been so much easier to say that Xorn II was the original Xorn from Feng Tu, and that he was replaced at the monestary by Xorneto, a creation of Sublime. :(

Yeah, it was kind of a waste. If Austen's story had been better, we still could've had a Xorn roaming around being all cool and Zen.

Maybe one day we'll get an Ultimate Xorn (preferably after Kirkman leaves).

[xmanson]

The Xorn thing was way too stupid.

The simple solution was that there was ONE Xorn that was crazy and thought he was Magneto.

That's it. Story over, no mess. No need for Xorn II, Collective or the amount of crap added to the mess.

It makes me crazy imagining the writers and editors talking about this and thinking that all those added things were good ideas.

[xmanson]

This isn't even how the Phoenix works.


The best way to deal with the Phoienix is not giving a fuck about it. It works the way a certain writer wants it to and that's it. It's an unsalvageble mess now.

[Beast]

The Xorn thing was way too stupid.

The simple solution was that there was ONE Xorn that was crazy and thought he was Magneto.

That's it. Story over, no mess. No need for Xorn II, Collective or the amount of crap added to the mess.

It makes me crazy imagining the writers and editors talking about this and thinking that all those added things were good ideas.
Well, Marvel wanted to please fans of Xorn also. You still hear a lot of complaints about how a character they liked turned into 'Magneto' and then died. Hell, I'm someone who really liked Xorn myself. Mostly because new characters that are captivating and interesting do not happen that often. Not since the 80's anyway. Marvel knew they had to salvage Magneto, but yeah... they probably went to far by trying to bring Xorn back as well.

[Christopher O]

This isn't even how the Phoenix works.
How does it work, then?

The way Claremont intended for it to work? The way Alan Davis decided it should work? Grant Morrison? Who?

The Phoenix has never had consistent behavior.

[melodyrider]

The Phoenix has never had consistent behavior.

Agreed. And for a being tied to the force of Chaos, should it?

[Slung]

Agreed. And for a being tied to the force of Chaos, should it?
It isn't even a being - its a force :).

[melodyrider]

It isn't even a being - its a force :).

I stand corrected :D

[Shane Shooter]

Aye. I agree it's a shame that the mini is being presented as 'Phoenix' when it's really about the Cuckoos. But as was said above, a Stepford Cuckoos mini has about as much chance as selling as Jubilee's ongoing did.

Jubilee's ongoing is great because I debuted in it.

[Beast]

Jubilee's ongoing is great because I debuted in it.
Her ongoing was awesome, one of the few solo books I loved. Shame it got little attention.

[fishtaco]

They were created by the Weapon Plus project. So unless it's retconned in this mini, yes we do.What if it's retconned in...the next mini!?!??!?!?! :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Beast]

What if it's retconned in...the next mini!?!??!?!?! :eek: :eek: :eek:
Until it is, it's canon.

[fishtaco]

Until it is, it's canon.Okay, that wasn't the point, but whatever... :rolleyes:

[Beast]

Okay, that wasn't the point, but whatever... :rolleyes:
Then what was the point? Other than being pointless?

[BYC]

I predict the Cuckoos are weird psychic seeds of Jean Grey/Phoenix. In fact, I think the entire Marvel universe is the Phoenix now.

[jeangreydp]

Then, a calling. The Cuckoos all start flying and burst into flames, going all Phoenix.

Emma, on the ground: "My girls, my girls..."

Quentin Quire is awake in his cell.

Then, Sophie skeleton gets out of the ground, followed by Esme!!!

"Come, Esme. Our sisters need us."

To be contiuned...

One time I took a shit on 32 pages and sold it to Marvel.

I didn't think they'd actually put it on the rack.

[Blackcat]

My goodness what a bunch of naggers. Fortunately there are still a lot of fans who do like it.

[Ryan K]

My goodness what a bunch of naggers. Fortunately there are still a lot of fans who do like it.

Just because someone doesn't like something and expresses it, does not make them a nagger.

[Beast]

Just because someone doesn't like something and expresses it, does not make them a nagger.
What Ryan Kirk said.

[Zombienorthstar]

I always kind of hoped Cukoos were a result of Sinister mixing Havok and Emma Frost DNA as an alternative to the Scott/Jean experimentation. Would have played to some great drama for all involved.

[Omega Alpha]

I always kind of hoped Cukoos were a result of Sinister mixing Havok and Emma Frost DNA as an alternative to the Scott/Jean experimentation. Would have played to some great drama for all involved.

What drama? I can imagine the scene, Emma goes and tells him:
"Hey, Alex, the Cuckoos are a mix of out DNA made by Sinister"
"Really? That bastard! But they are already grown up and since we did not want those kids and they were created against our will, we don't have to anything about it, right?"
"Yeah, i guess. Bye"
"Bye".

And that's it. Plus, it would be a really stupid idea.

[Callisto]

They were created by the Weapon Plus project. So unless it's retconned in this mini, yes we do.


says who? are you refering to that little caption in "heres comes tommorow" that doesn't mean anything, infact all it could mean is that those cuckoos who appeared in here comes tommorow were clones of the original created by weapon x or the girls were simply enhanced by weapon x at one point. there origin is pretty much unknown and for you to throw statements about there past around like there fact is quite misleading for newbies especially when the tale of there origin is apparently going to be revealed in this mini.

[Beast]

says who? are you refering to that little caption in "heres comes tommorow" that doesn't mean anything, infact all it could mean is that those cuckoos who appeared in here comes tommorow were clones of the original created by weapon x or the girls were simply enhanced by weapon x at one point. there origin is pretty much unknown and for you to throw statements about there past around like there fact is quite misleading for newbies especially when the tale of there origin is apparently going to be revealed in this mini.
Wrong. They were referred to as Weapon XIV in Here Comes Tommorow. Weapon XIV is the only weapon that Morrison didn't introduce during the storyline. He didn't introduce Weapon XI either, but it was mentioned by John Sublime. But he did introduce them, they just weren't revealed as Weapon XIV until HCT. Their origins are not pretty much unknown, we know they're the Weapon Plus project codenamed 'Weapon XIV'. ;)

Weapon XI - Unknown (Believed to be Cassandra Nova)
Weapon XII - Huntsmen
Weapon XIII - Fantomex
Weapon XIV - The Stepford Cuckoos
Weapon XV - Ultimaton

[Brian M.]

One time I took a shit on 32 pages and sold it to Marvel.

I didn't think they'd actually put it on the rack.

Your words woo my heart. Poor Jean...poor Jean.

[Callisto]

Wrong. They were referred to as Weapon XIV in Here Comes Tommorow. Weapon XIV is the only weapon that Morrison didn't introduce during the storyline. He didn't introduce Weapon XI either, but it was mentioned by John Sublime. But he did introduce them, they just weren't revealed as Weapon XIV until HCT. Their origins are not pretty much unknown, we know they're the Weapon Plus project codenamed 'Weapon XIV'. ;)

Weapon XI - Unknown (Believed to be Cassandra Nova)
Weapon XII - Huntsmen
Weapon XIII - Fantomex
Weapon XIV - The Stepford Cuckoos
Weapon XV - Ultimaton

that still doesn't refute any of the possibilities i've mentioned. those cuckoos who appeared in here comes tommorow could have easily been enhanced weapon x clones of the originals.

[Beast]

that still doesn't refute any of the possibilities i've mentioned. those cuckoos who appeared in here comes tommorow could have easily been enhanced weapon x clones of the originals.
Yes it does. Because they wouldn't go back to an already passed designation for a future project. Not to mention it's already been said that Weapon Plus is going to be addressed in this mini.

[Callisto]

Considering the Weapon Plus project hasn't even been around that long, I find it highly doubtful that they're not simply teenagers. As for why they were alive in the HCT future... that was never explained. Of course Beast was alround also, so I guess that makes him even older than established now also? Start making some sense, please.


it doesn't matter how long the weapon-x project has been around. as i said before they could easily have been born before the whole weapon x thing took place and later on were captured like wolverine and experimented on. you don't have to be created by weapon-x to have things done to you by them and get labelled.

[blackphoenix]

Ugh...

The Phoenix is JEAN! No one else should be able to ield the Force for long without being burnt to a cinder! But, of course, Pak doesn't want it that way. Way to go dude, establish Jean as THE Phoenix, then pass it off onto three jailbait brats. Jean better show up or...

...ah, i'll probably buy it anyway.:D

[steve2275]

so much for a quiet night at home

[Blackcat]

Ugh...

The Phoenix is JEAN! No one else should be able to ield the Force for long without being burnt to a cinder! But, of course, Pak doesn't want it that way. Way to go dude, establish Jean as THE Phoenix, then pass it off onto three jailbait brats. Jean better show up or...

...ah, i'll probably buy it anyway.:D
Nah, the Phoenix force lookes for a powerfull host. Once that host was Jean, once that host was Rachel, now the force has chosen another host: The Cuckoos. I really do not understand all the crying about Jean being the one and only Phoenix. Jean was just a host for the Phoenix and was able to use it's powers, same thing for Rachel later. Jean was just the host who did the most memorable things. Now it's time for another one.

You should get used to changes.

I do not see you guys crying if Malice took over another person instead of Polaris, because she was did the most memorable things in Lornas body.

[widdershins]

Nah, the Phoenix force lookes for a powerfull host. Once that host was Jean, once that host was Rachel, now the force has chosen another host: The Cuckoos. I really do not understand all the crying about Jean being the one and only Phoenix. Jean was just a host for the Phoenix and was able to use it's powers, same thing for Rachel later. Jean was just the host who did the most memorable things. Now it's time for another one.

You should get used to changes.

I do not see you guys crying if Malice took over another person instead of Polaris, because she was did the most memorable things in Lornas body.

Maybe it has to do with the fact that the Phoenix force is merely the byproduct of a retcon whose primary purpose was to bring Jean Grey back to life with a clean conscience. That the x-men's and Marvel's all-time best-seller has no mention of the Phoenix as a force,but instead has Jean as Phoenix,not a celestial fairy godmother that clones her and takes her role.
That the "powers of the Phoenix" she was able to use were just her powers,telepathy and telekinesis,at godlike levels;and now that she's confirmed as an omega-level mutant the difference b/w Jean as Phoenix and Jean at full potential is nonexistant.
That the idea that of Phoenix as an entity that goes on possessing bodies like Malice does is
1) silly
2) uninteresting and unnecessary-very few people would be interested in the Phoenix if not for her connection with Jean and Rachel.
3) a gimmick in order to create cheap interest in random characters furtherly
diluting the meaning of the original Phoenix saga. "Hey look! The Cuckoos got the Phoenix! Kool!" next: "Hey look! Toad got the Phoenix! Kool!"
4) pretty much a mutant version of Captain Universe

and goes against Claremont 's interpretation and all the effort Morrison put into retconning the retcon and tying back the Phoenix to mutation.

[Bobster777]

Hmm, I thought I wouldn't be able to stand this story, but I'm actually intrigued. I will definitely get the second issue.

[Blackcat]

The Phoenix force will never go into low level mutants like Toad of course. First of all the Phoenix Force only took strong telepaths so far. The Cuckoos have been rumored to be Omega-level. So, it's understandable if rthe Phoenix takes over the Cuckoos.

Yeah, it's no Grey woman this time, so what?

I think it's a very intertesting development for both the Phoenix Force as well as the Cuckoos.

Besides this whole Phoenix part, we are gonna learn a lot about the Cuckoos themselves, as well of their mysterious past. I for one think the Cuckoos are one of the most interesting students and I'm very curious to learn more about them.

[dellicious]

The Phoenix force will never go into low level mutants like Toad of course. First of all the Phoenix Force only took strong telepaths so far. The Cuckoos have been rumored to be Omega-level. So, it's understandable if rthe Phoenix takes over the Cuckoos.

Yeah, it's no Grey woman this time, so what?

I think it's a very intertesting development for both the Phoenix Force as well as the Cuckoos.

Besides this whole Phoenix part, we are gonna learn a lot about the Cuckoos themselves, as well of their mysterious past. I for one think the Cuckoos are one of the most interesting students and I'm very curious to learn more about them.

this is where youre wrong
the shattered fragments of jean can go to anyone
but only can in other omega mutants can they hope not to be burned out
thats why they have mistakenly gone into a mere firefly and emma

if they wanted to learn more about the cuckoos theres no reason to tack phoenixjean on there
do it in new xmen where the focus is on students
warsong so far is just a tactless way of using a beloved character to try and sell what otherwise wouldnt

[Blackcat]

Nah, it's not.

It's just another development of some characters (Phoenix-force and the Cuckoos).

Because it's subject to characters that haven't had any spotlight before, or just very long ago and these are characters who were very interesting from the the first time they appeared in the X-books makes this book interesting. Looking at the first issue it promises to become a great ltd series.

Jean was Phoenix, as in used to be Phoenix, now the Force moves on and I love it! RThings change over time, not only in the real world, also in the X-universe.

They choose to do it in a ltd. series and I like the fact that they did it that way. If they did this story in New X-Men or Astonishing, some others (and probably you too) would complain because the Cuckoos are not on those teams. So, it's a good choice to do this story in a separate ltd series.

[dellicious]

Nah, it's not.

It's just another development of some characters (Phoenix-force and the Cuckoos).

Because it's subject to characters that haven't had any spotlight before, or just very long ago and these are characters who were very interesting from the the first time they appeared in the X-books makes this book interesting. Looking at the first issue it promises to become a great ltd series.

Jean was Phoenix, as in used to be Phoenix, now the Force moves on and I love it! RThings change over time, not only in the real world, also in the X-universe.

They choose to do it in a ltd. series and I like the fact that they did it that way. If they did this story in New X-Men or Astonishing, some others (and probably you too) would complain because the Cuckoos are not on those teams. So, it's a good choice to do this story in a separate ltd series.

if u paid attention in endsong or even morrisons run, jean is still phoenix
a piece of jean is with the cuckoos
jean went off as the white phoenix to find all her pieces and id imagine shes at least making an appearance to tear this one from the jailbait 3

yes the cuckoos are not on the astonishing team nor on the new x-men team, but neither are they a part of the phoenix mythos thats why you have a lot of fans not liking this book

[Blackcat]

if u paid attention in endsong or even morrisons run, jean is still phoenix
a piece of jean is with the cuckoos
jean went off as the white phoenix to find all her pieces and id imagine shes at least making an appearance to tear this one from the jailbait 3


If take a look at Warsong you may assume by now it's not a fragment of the Phoenix Force anymore, but probably the Phoenix Force itself that entered the Cuckoos. But guess we'll see if that's what happened or not later in this series, which you will not read.

Also the Phoenix Force started in Endsong as a firefly and that same firefly came to (one of the) the Cuckoos, remember!?!

Anyways, I love Warsong so far, you hate the fact they use the Phoenixforce or a fragment of it in any different way if it's not about Jean.