The Original Human Torch

[Alan2099]

What the old WWII era Human Torch been up to latley? I'e heard somehwere that he's switched to actually using fire based gadgets rather than flaming on. What's the deal with that?

[The Shadow]

I think he died at the end of the New Invaders run...

[captain_unimpressive]

I think he died at the end of the New Invaders run...

That's too bad. Asbestos Man's been dying to get back into comics.

[dopexvii]

I think he died at the end of the New Invaders run...
as strong a story it was and as great a character i felt torch was i felt he was writen of unneccissarily
he should have been treasured been one of marvels original creations
hell i feel original torch had more potential than storm, i did however feel the last issue or funeral issue for torch quite touching "we'l leave the light on for you"
was some of the best wording in a long time
especially for those who had read the rather touching Marvels book
it's a shame is all i can say..

[mattbib]

as strong a story it was and as great a character i felt torch was i felt he was writen of unneccissarilyI think his death would be simple enough to undo.

[Joe Acro]

I think his death would be simple enough to undo.
They undid Vision's deaths. DC has undone Red Tornado dying. Androids don't stay dead if you don't want them to.

[davros42]

What the old WWII era Human Torch been up to latley? I'e heard somehwere that he's switched to actually using fire based gadgets rather than flaming on. What's the deal with that?

Dead again. For like the third time. If you're a Marvel Character from before 1963 and your name isn't Captain America or Namor, prepare to get the short end of the stick.

Agents of Atlas will hopefully reverse the trend of Marvel crapping on it's Golden Age properties.

[Sean Walsh]

Agents of Atlas will hopefully reverse the trend of Marvel crapping on it's Golden Age properties.

Unless they're all slated to die at the end of it, that is. ;) :p

[BloodstoneFreak]

It really does piss me off how Marvel kills their older characters and obscure ones. Some of them could be used a lot more than they care to realize.

[TheDrizzt]

I'd rather they kept Hammond around and knocked off Namor, myself. There are only so many stories you can tell with him, it seems. Even Byrne's two attempts at a "new direction" with him flopped miserably. The Torch (with powers or not) at least has potential.

[Kirk G]

I'd rather they kept Hammond around and knocked off Namor, myself. There are only so many stories you can tell with him, it seems. Even Byrne's two attempts at a "new direction" with him flopped miserably. The Torch (with powers or not) at least has potential.
I challenge that.
I wouldn't say that Byrne's "Namor" series flopped. He carried the series successfully for at least 27 issues.
Then, Jay Lee popped in, with a radically different style and took it in a new direction, that only partially worked...
and then someone else came in after the 40s...
and THAT's WHEN THE SERIES STALLED AND DIED.

What OTHER attempt did Byrne make at a new direction...????:confused:

[The Shadow]

I challenge that.
I wouldn't say that Byrne's "Namor" series flopped. He carried the series successfully for at least 27 issues.
Then, Jay Lee popped in, with a radically different style and took it in a new direction, that only partially worked...
and then someone else came in after the 40s...
and THAT's WHEN THE SERIES STALLED AND DIED.

What OTHER attempt did Byrne make at a new direction...????:confused:Nice post... ya beat me to it.

[Valen]

I'd rather they kept Hammond around and knocked off Namor, myself. There are only so many stories you can tell with him, it seems. Even Byrne's two attempts at a "new direction" with him flopped miserably. The Torch (with powers or not) at least has potential.
When is it appropriate to stop saying a character has potential, iven though it is older than my parents? I think at this point it may be time to admit that, even though there are a few devoted fans, the character itself has used up all of its potential.

[Joe Acro]

Does anybody else think that Human Torch I is a better character than Human Torch II?

[Nomad]

Oh come on! Bring back torch and we can have an android squad. That'd be cool for thirty or so seconds. Maybe Johnny can die in the hospital and marvel can replace him with the real deal. Or better yet, Torch could hench for Doom and be a F4 villain...

Is there any connection between the Human Torch and the Vision? I remember reading something.

[Alan2099]

The Vision's body was created from another version of the Human Torch that was split from the time stream by Immortus, or Kang, or one of those guys.

[TheDrizzt]

I challenge that.
I wouldn't say that Byrne's "Namor" series flopped. He carried the series successfully for at least 27 issues.
25 issues of being a low-selling book during a time of much higher sales (and with the second-lamest attempt at a mutant tie-in of all time).

Which led to...
Jay Lee popped in, with a radically different style and took it in a new direction, that only partially worked...

and then someone else came in after the 40s...
and THAT's WHEN THE SERIES STALLED AND DIED.
Issues 26-32 were written by Byrne and drawn by Lee (I believe the editor may have stepped in as co-writer near the end of that run). Bob Harras wrote 33-35 with Lee on art.

Two attempts at different views on Namor (the first one pretty inspired, IMO). Both flopped. And now he's back to "king who occasionally chooses to irrationally declare war on the rest of the world when he's off his meds."

[TheDrizzt]

When is it appropriate to stop saying a character has potential, iven though it is older than my parents? I think at this point it may be time to admit that, even though there are a few devoted fans, the character itself has used up all of its potential.
If you're talking about Namor, I tend to agree. Love for someone to prove me wrong, though.

If you're talking about the Torch, he's appeared in, what, maybe 3 dozen issues in the past 50 years (not counting Thomas' Invaders)? And he dies in two of those? Hard to use up potential when the character isn't actually used.

[StoneGold]

If you're talking about Namor, I tend to agree. Love for someone to prove me wrong, though.

If you're talking about the Torch, he's appeared in, what, maybe 3 dozen issues in the past 50 years (not counting Thomas' Invaders)? And he dies in two of those? Hard to use up potential when the character isn't actually used.
According to that logic, Bantam had even more potential than the Torch, given that he's only appeared twice and died in one of those issues.

[The Shadow]

The Vision's body was created from another version of the Human Torch that was split from the time stream by Immortus, or Kang, or one of those guys.
... head... ache... imminent...... time stories... make head... hurt...

[TheDrizzt]

According to that logic, Bantam had even more potential than the Torch, given that he's only appeared twice and died in one of those issues.
When one doesn't start with much potential, it doesn't take much to use it up.

When you're an android who looks human, who fought beside Captain America in WWII, and who also happened to kill Hitler... eh, I tend to think a few (mostly background and mostly depowered) appearances probably isn't enough to say that well's gone dry yet.

[Joe Acro]

The Vision's body was created from another version of the Human Torch that was split from the time stream by Immortus, or Kang, or one of those guys.
After Torch was burnt out after an encounter with The Thinker and Quasimodo, Immortus made a copy of his body. The copy was later used to create Vision.