Digital Comics

[Capta]

Okay, I wanted to see what the big thing about downloading Comics was about so I went and downloaded a certain Program. Wow....every Comic imaginable was on there. EVERYONE! I downloaded some Amazing Spidey#1-10 and some newer stuff. It's all scanned pretty well with all the ads and everything. But....theres still something about holding a Comic in my hand rather than staring at the CPU screen. While I could see the advantages of Digital Comics(quick, cheaper, large library)I still prefer the Paper version best. Comments?

[CyberCoyote]

Not sure what program you're talking about (not sure I wanna), but there is a lot lost reading comics on a computer screen. I've got the FF DVD and much prefer digging through my boxes to find the issues rather than 'looking' at them on my monitor.

Portability is a big issue, too. Heck, I keep a stack of comics in the bathroom, have some in the basement (well, a lot), a few in the car, and in my nighstand by the bed. Reading comics on the PC isn't quite as bad as trying to read a book on it, but pretty darned close. I don't think they'll go totally digital until there's an easier and cheaper way to print them on the user side. Maybe marvel could sell a specialized HP printer and comic packages that'd print out and staple a home made comic, or the download you get for your sub allows for X number of said printings before it expires? Gotta have something in your hands, it's the only real way to appreciate the work put into them.

[scottv]

I ordered the ASM DVD set and so it should be coming pretty soon but I think I might do that for the old issues since I have only recently gotten into comics but I agree that you can't beat holding them in your hand. I am looking into getting maybe the X-Men, Avengers, and Fantastic Four DVDs when they come out. What do you guys think... are there any others that I should look at?

[Psylocked]

Dude,May i have the site for that.It seems interesting like u said it might not be the same like holding it into your hands and stuff.But I sure want to try that.Hey i will really appreciate if u gave me the program through MSN,My Msn is cyclone_21@hotmail.com plz! :p :cool: :cool:

[foxfire]

You guys do know that talking about downloaded comics is abhorred on a comic book message board...

[Beast]

Indeed. It's illegal and hurts the industry. You're also hurting it for everyone. Support what you enjoy.

[BeastieRunner]

I think I shall make a "Don't Download This Comic" parody . . .

[Effect]

Indeed. It's illegal and hurts the industry. You're also hurting it for everyone. Support what you enjoy.

I really question how much it hurts the industry. I'd say the industry is more hurt by the low quality which results from editorial decisions and rising price of comics then any type of downloading.

[Capta]

You guys do know that talking about downloaded comics is abhorred on a comic book message board...

Yeah, I'm not promoting it. I actually don't like it, I much prefer having the Comic in my hands. I wanted to see what all the hoopla was about. But how can they(Marvel/DC)shut down these sites?

[Capta]

I really question how much it hurts the industry. I'd say the industry is more hurt by the low quality which results from editorial decisions and rising price of comics then any type of downloading.

I'm really not enjoying the Comics that take me all of 5 minutes to read for $4.00.

[foxfire]

Yeah, I'm not promoting it. I actually don't like it, I much prefer having the Comic in my hands. I wanted to see what all the hoopla was about. But how can they(Marvel/DC)shut down these sites?
Yeah it's more difficult than targeting pirated videos or songs, because those are electronic and can be traced. But pirated comics are just scanned files... kinda hard to shut down those.

[Effect]

I'm really not enjoying the Comics that take me all of 5 minutes to read for $4.00.

Same here. A lot of comics due to the content, good or not, isn't worth the price I feel or the trouble I have to go through in order to get the comic. That goes from getting them online (add shipping cost as well) or driving to the only comic store in 30 miles (I only go now if I have to go that way for something else now, the drive alone is worth more then any comic purchases).

I think digital is the way to go and I wish Marvel and DC would adapt sooner to it. So one misses out on holding the comic. Personally I don't see the big deal with that and if allowed to print out the comic is avaliable that solves that problem easily.

[Kirk G]

Yeah, I'm not promoting it. I actually don't like it, I much prefer having the Comic in my hands. I wanted to see what all the hoopla was about. But how can they(Marvel/DC)shut down these sites?
Nothing can beat the smell of the ink, the feel of the pages, the ability to flip back and forth to compare images... and, the ability to flip through TWO issues at the same time to compare dialog, art, layout and developments.

That seminal sensation is the root of all comic collecting....:rolleyes:

[drwho]

I'm all for the digital type collections. I got a laptop and can carry tons of books with me without carrying a few 30 pound long boxes.

[ninjapeps]

Indeed. It's illegal and hurts the industry. You're also hurting it for everyone. Support what you enjoy.
because of scanned comics, I bought all the Transmet trades, Superman: Secret Identity, Formerly Known as the Justice League, I Can't Believe It's Not the Justice League, and started collecting Ex Machina, Y: The Last Man, Runaways, New Avengers and Cable/Deadpool. and that's just this year. I don't see how that hurts the industry.

[sherlockbones]

isn´t this a discussion for the more general sections of cbr?
it is definitly not a marvel only topic...

[Majinlex]

True, and when the time comes a mod will have to move it.

But while it's here I'll offer this.
It's very easy to imagine that in the future there'll be some form of digital paper.
Like this:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/majinlex/digital-paper.jpg

With this kind of technology it'd be very easy to have a template comic book (think of the template books in season 5 of Angel, only more technological) where you can download issues into the book. It could even have a hard drive and some form of OS where you can browse different books.
This'll give you something to hold in your hand plus if you really want I'm sure there'll be some form of ink-scented air-freshener :p

[sherlockbones]

i´d buy it. another advancement would be it being waterproof and better for the enviroment. modern society produces so much paper it almost drives me insane when i think of it

[curefreak]

has anyone tried to read the free digital comics at marvel.com?
its a virtual pain in the neck!
you have to sign in with every comic you read and its really slow especially if you want to go back and forth...
ive read scanned comics before and theyre a lot easier.
but i will say that they helped me get into astonishing back when i was still getting my feet wet again.

[Effect]

It's the same type of thing with the music industry. Comic companies I think would be hard pressed to try and prove that scanned comics actually hurt the industry enough that it takes away from sales, etc. There are to many factors to consider here to come away with a very clear cut answers especially since sales were and have been dropping for years and they can't blame the internet and downloading of comics for that decline and current situations can be argued as being a continuation of that previous trend and how can comic companies actually say it's NOT part of that trend?

I still feel if they actually worked creating a viable official method of getting comics online and not the setup Marvel.com now has cause that's just annoying and frustrating, that things would be better. They can do previews on sites pretty well, they can look at how Ebooks are done and sold. The technology and software is there I feel. It just has to be used and the risk taken. They could still release TPBs for those that want to hold the comic in their hand or at the start try it out with only a few titles. One that is avaliable in only online format or one that is out in both ways (online and store bought) and compare them to just store bought titles and see how well they do. THey'd have to do this with a high problem title and a low expected selling title and not just unknown characters cause that's doomed to fail if no is even interested in the character now.

I say make it an site membership situation where for a monthly fee you can view select number of titles (you decide which ones and can swtich which titles you want to view and or add new ones for an additional price, keep number low at say 3 or 5 titles). Make packages for franchises like all major X-titles or Avenger related titles or Spider-man titles, etc with extra for addition titles outside of that package and for events that come about like Hous of M, Civil War, etc. After a set amount of time passes then they put up the previous titles you read (they are still avalaible on your account) for download via PDF so you can print them out. This is long after the TPB has come out. Make it worth while I feel and people would pay, especailly if there are extras.

Something like that makes it hard to keep current downloading going since the store issues start to disappear and there is less to scan. Copying from the site is made harder as well which cuts it down too. At the same time you make comics avalible to an even greater number of people by directly connecting with them cutting out the middleman aka comic shops which are few already. This cuts down on the comic companies actual publishing and shipping fees as well since they don't have to pay those after a time, only with tpbs. Don't have to worry about buying back issues from stores either. The market greatly opens up, worldwide without many problems for readers obtaining the books. If they can stop peopel from copying from the site which can be done with code or even using a special program to login styled of online video games then it can be done with very positive results I feel.

[Majinlex]

The digital comics at Marvel.com definitely need to be fixed if they want to be taken seriously, but it's a great idea.
I remember when they were doing dotComics. Those were fantastic and really got me reading the Ultimate U books when I probably wouldn't have bothered with them. Back then the scanning through panels was done really well but the ones at marvel.com are all messed up. The speech bubbles are always mis-aligned, some panels won't load, etc.
And they keep posting random issues into one big pile. It'd be better if they had the first few issues of a series or story arc and organised them into categories.

[BadAssMofo]

I love this idea because who can really afford to go back and purchase every single Amazing Spider Man book or Uncanny X-Men for that matter? You're looking at like a million bucks on ebay (including shipping). I hope they continue to do this for every story ever made. I'm waiting for DC comics to get busy on Bat Man and Superman so I can read into those. :o

[curefreak]

the thing i find weird is the only people complaining about pirating is the music and the movie studios, ive never heard the comic companies say anything about downloading, nor do i hear the porn industry saying anything at all about it, and everyone knows that porn is heavily downloaded, maybe even more than music in some places.

[Majinlex]

I've heard Joe Q mention it a good few times. His stance seems to be "Digital comics goods, Pirated comics bad" (not comics about pirates just to clarify, though they are bad in my opinion :D)

[ninjapeps]

has anyone tried to read the free digital comics at marvel.com?
its a virtual pain in the neck!
you have to sign in with every comic you read and its really slow especially if you want to go back and forth...
they were a lot better about four years ago. back then, the enitre issue could be downloaded and then read with either Flash or their special comic reader. the "improvements" made the whole thing unbearable.

[curefreak]

they were a lot better about four years ago. back then, the enitre issue could be downloaded and then read with either Flash or their special comic reader. the "improvements" made the whole thing unbearable.
wow that sounds like something dc would do, try to improve something that wasnt broken in the first place..

[zypher]

I gotta say i recently downloaded a copy of a hulk comic... and i ain't ever doing it again. The digital comics over at the marvel site are difficult enough to navigate i sure don't need that process made harder by acrobatic reader. All in all nothing beats browsing the shelves of the local comic store( actually two towns away) and picking up your favorite title (along with the back issues u missed from living so far away) Stop being cheap and show some support for the real heros, the publishers AKA the people who pay the lawyers to fight the crazy anti-comic parents...

[metr0man]

The only digital comics that aren't a pain in the ass are the illegal pirated copies.

CBZ/CBR files, huge resolution, viewed in CDisplay (or equalivalent), filling up the screen width-wise, beats the ever loving shite out of PDFs and Flash garbage. Scrolling in CDisplay is a snap. The images are such high resolution that you can view them a number of ways and still be crystal clear.

It's so simple.

Simply TAKE the piracy format. Add your own basic DRM protections. and release it.

[patch]

i would rather buy digital comics than paper ones now...i appreciate the paper books for what they were, but the cost of the books is getting to the point where i have to cut books out so i dont overspend on comics and its only going to get worse, how long until we see single issues for 5 bucks.

and god help me the storage...i dont want my house to look like a comicshop with long boxes everywhere and have to go on a scanveger hunt of epic porportion just to read an old back issue that pops into my head...i would replace my whole collection if i could, i buy the boks for the stories and the art, im not collecting for collectings sake.

i just hope they get away from programs like acrobat or zinio that are bulky and sometimes slow programs and can develop something akin to cdisplay a lightweight sequential image viewer but with more security to meet their concerns about piracy.

i look forward to a day when i can get all my books digitally, even the books from smaller publishers that i pick up on a whim sometimes

[illmatic]

i'll stick with my comic book store, until they can improve digital comics

[Herald of Asgard]

If you like comics enough to read them, you should like them enough to spend your money for them. It's that simple. New issues or back issues? It doesn't matter. If you download the newest issue of Cable/Deadpool, then thats one less comic sold for a title that already needs as much help as it can get. Or if you download a Silverage comic, you have to think of how that will hurt the LCS industry in the longrun, because most comic shops make most of their money related to comic books by their Current and Silver Age sales, so if you take both of those away...where does that leave the people that brought you most of your hobby needs since you were a kid?

So, I think its just as much a question of honor and respect as it is the law. And anyone who doesn't pay for their comics are very bad people....and probably former employees at ENRON.

[CyberCoyote]

I like the digital comic book idea someone posted. Download the files from the producer at a fee and store them for viewing in a digi-comic that displays those digital paper pages. I'd pay for that.

diamond wouldn't like it, for sure. And it would kill comic shops. I think LESS comics would go to print, driving the prices up even further until it killed them. the only things available in print would be trades, probably.

Of course I'd open me up a Comic Cafe along the lines of a cyber cafe where customers can come in to download their favorites or view them on licensed digital comic books. Now my dream of a coffee/comic shop can be made real without worrying about customers staining all the merchandise :)

[foxfire]

diamond wouldn't like it, for sure. And it would kill comic shops. I think LESS comics would go to print, driving the prices up even further until it killed them. the only things available in print would be trades, probably.


Crap, good point. Things ain't looking that great for print, are they.

[Shane Shooter]

If the Industry was smart they'd Come out with some type of Digital Comic Book reading instrument, I'm thinking maybe like a PSP but with a Bigger screen ...without you can download comics straight from MARVEL and it would be much nicer than a book because you can read it in the dark ..... Thats what they should do ....they gotta change with the times.

[davros42]

Indeed. It's illegal and hurts the industry. You're also hurting it for everyone. Support what you enjoy.

For the sake of arguement, how is downloading a copy of a comic for free any more or less illegal than buying a second-hand copy? Either way DC, Marvel, Image, or whoever don't see a dime on the transaction. You can make a case for the scanning and downloading of 0-day Comics as illegal, but the comics industry has always supported the right of the end user to redistribute their comics after they've purchased them for their own profit or not. Something the movie and music industry has always done their best to squash.

Personally, I buy a LOT more comics now that I can use scanned copies to get quickly up to date on series I'm coming in on the middle of or to check out big-hype series, or just to pick up impossible to find, out-of-print books like Zenith or Flex Mentallo.

[Expletive Deleted]

Back issues are redistribution; scanned comics are mass redistribution. Until back issues can be redistributed a nigh-infinite number of times in a nigh infinitesimal span, they're a far less problematic secondary market.

[Tadhg]

For the sake of arguement, how is downloading a copy of a comic for free any more or less illegal than buying a second-hand copy?

The latter isn't copyright infringement.

[Beast]

The latter isn't copyright infringement.
Bingo, Bango, Bongo.

[spyridona]

Warren Ellis pokes fun at the pirates in Nextwave. But since he's cool beans, I buy Nextwave.

I read and delete comics online. Really, in a medium where the story is connected to ones prior, I would like to keep up with the story but not reward those who did a poor story that will be connected a future one.

[Herald of Asgard]

I still stand by my belife of "If you want to read it, then pay for it". Its really quite simple. If you can't afford to buy all the comics you want to read, then set yourself up a comic-bin at your LCS, its not hard. Back issues are usually $1 each for filler issues, so no excuse there.

And since your downloading copies, you obviously don't care for the collectability factor, so go out...buy a busted ass copy of whatever you want...and read it all you want. Run down copies usually cost 10% of book value, if that!

So for those of us that like to pay for what we get, do us a favor and pay for your shit. The comic biz goes through hard enough times as is.

-Peace

[Billy Parker]

Digital Comics are NECESSARY because WE readers want to know the HISTORY! I actually WANT to read every issue ever made about Spider-Man, Yes, EVERY ISSUE. I've read #1-276 of Amazing Spider-Man so far on the CD-ROM collection, and I'm not stopping until I get to the current issues, of which I've read #520 and on. And I want Spectacular, Web of, Team-Up, Spider-Man, ultimate, and all the limited Spidey stories in digital format too.

WHY do I want them digital? Because I MISSED out! I just got into comics. I didn't get to read them when they came out. I'm not going to hunt them down. I can't physically. I can't keep them all. I can't afford them. But put them on a digital disc for $30-$40, and YES I will buy them. Because I need them. I have all the Marvel DVD-ROMs so far, and will get the future ones as long as they make "Spectacular Spider-Man DVD-ROM" and so on with Web Of and adjectiveless.

Understanding the history of Spidey and reading his books from the 60s were my favorite. This got me into comics big and I read/buy about 15 comics monthly currently. it's not bad for the industry, anyway you look at it.

And digital comics aren't as bad as people make it out to be. People are afraid of change, but digital is the future embrace. Get with it people. Alot of times I prefer it to the actual books.

[davros42]

The latter isn't copyright infringement.

The RIAA and MPAA thank you for drinking their Kool-Aid.

I bought something. I paid for it. I can re-sell it or give it away free. End of story. That is NOT illegal. I'm not taking credit for it. I'm not claiming it as mine. I am making a profit off someone else's work though, but since it's "investing" it's not copyright infringement, but scanning my comics and giving them out free to all comers is?

Not sure I follow the logic here. I was really hoping to steer this towards a more interesting conversation than the usual kneejerk "ZOMG UR ALL THEIVING PIRATES" or "DOOD, WHERE CAN I DL SOME FREE COMIXS, LNKS PLS KTHNXBI" but I can see that's how most folks here want to frame the discussion.

ED made a decent point, that the nigh-infinte reproducability of scanned comics makes then a bigger issue than back issue bins. But to me it's all the same philosophy, either I can do what I want with the comics once I buy them (including selling them, shredding them, or giving to my friends) or I can't. Comics has ALWAYS been about the former. Is expecting people not to extend this philosophy into the digital medium too much?

[CyberCoyote]

And hey, if comics do go all digital then those mounds of real printed copies we've got in storage that aren't worth the $1.00 original price now will slowly become major collectors items again.

"Grandpa, were comic books really books once?"

"Books? Hah, they were 22 page miniature magazines that came out monthly!"

"What's a magazine?"

[Just John]

I own the Fantastic Four DVD-ROM collection and it only took me a minute to get use to reading it on ADOBE. Nothing beats a real comic book, but digital comics sure do beat TPB or hardback books or whatever. Its a better bargain.

Digital Comics are perfectly fine as long as they are legit. Really, no matter how well you think you can intellectually rationalize it, stealing is still a crime and a sin.

[Crimson]

You know what I'm seeing as a problem? Everyone is imagining an electronic book that could be the interface your weekly comics, simply plug in you memory card and you can have the entire run of your favourite comic ready too choose from. I love this idea, don’t get me wrong…

However, who would produce this thing? If it’s a comic company like Marvel it only makes sense it would play their file types and no one else. DC has the money to invest in producing something like this too but smaller indy comics can’t, they would be screwed.

It would take an outside party to produce something like this or otherwise the smaller companies would die.

I also don’t see how newer fans would find a way to get into comics either. If you’ve got to go out and put down $50 on this and then the books, chances are you’d never get new fans. It’d me way more expensive then walking into a shop these days and paying $3 for an issue.

I suppose the comics would have to run on the PC as well to avoid these problems.

I love the idea of the electronic book mind and if/when we have to make the change over that is the way I’d be happiest.

I also think they need to think of something for their “Hype TPBs”. For example with the new Onslaught mini they are hoping people will buy the reprints of the crossover, however if the entire Marvel collection is already up for download there is no reason to do that… they would have to offer a discount on those items for a few months for the hype to have a real effect on the sale of those back issues.

Distributors would be f’d IMO. Seeing as though every stock item would come from the publisher (meaning no rare items etc), no postage costs and other things, it would be the lowest price wins.

Just a few thoughts… I had more but I forgot them.

[Majinlex]

However, who would produce this thing? If it’s a comic company like Marvel it only makes sense it would play their file types and no one else. DC has the money to invest in producing something like this too but smaller indy comics can’t, they would be screwed.

It would take an outside party to produce something like this or otherwise the smaller companies would die.
You're right, the Marvel/DC file types things wouldn't work. It'd need to be a standard format, like CD's. Every CD player can play CD's from different record labels.

I also don’t see how newer fans would find a way to get into comics either. If you’ve got to go out and put down $50 on this and then the books, chances are you’d never get new fans. It’d me way more expensive then walking into a shop these days and paying $3 for an issue.

I suppose the comics would have to run on the PC as well to avoid these problems.
Definitely. The electronic book would be, in my mind, for niche customers. I can't really think of a good, real world example. Maybe like how some people just want to listen to music on their computers and others want to have it on their iPods, etc. Although this type of technology might be pretty cheap, and who knows, maybe as standard as a printer 20 or so years in the future.

Distributors would be f’d IMO. Seeing as though every stock item would come from the publisher (meaning no rare items etc), no postage costs and other things, it would be the lowest price wins.
There may still be a place for distributors but it would most likely be like the coffee/comic shop idea (which by the way, I love).
Although, you'd only have to read the "Distribution should be Good" thread in Comics should be Good to see why departing from the standard LCS we have today would be a good thing.

[The Sword Is Drawn]

Shamed to admit it, but on some occasion, when books have sold out - or not made it over to the UK - I have scoured torrents for the odd issue before.

Yes, I know it's illegal. But I don't do it on mass. Only when I really can't get a book any other way. God knows I spend £60 to £70 a month on comic books, (And usually a couple of TPBs, too) so I don't feel too guilty.

What gets me though is that Marvel are missing such a huge opportunity here. I know that there really is nothing quite having the book in your hands - even a TPB - but if so many people are doing it illegally why don't Marvel try to stamp it out by doing it properly themselves?

I know Marvel put out Uncanny X-Men on CD, but these were PDF files. PDF simply does not (And cannot) provide a great quality of image, and can't really be read properly as a book even when viewed full screen on a laptop. Acrobat reader was never specifically designed for it.

When I have read downloaded books in the past I've used CDisplay (Comic Book Reader. It's freeware, third party, and the size options for books is so much better than PDF can ever deliver. It's just an image viewer. It simply displays the contents of a Zip file or Rar file of images, in alphabetical order. But it really makes the best of the images - adjusting and brightening where necessary.

If Marvel were to put out large chunks of continuity in that format, like a full run of an writer, or a full run of a book, I would gladly pay money legally to have that on DVD or download.

They're seriously missing a trick there.

[Citizen V]

I can imagine that someday,Digital Comics will someday replace paper as the format comics will be seen on.This topic is on a number of comic forums i got to now,even my own forum.

But like it was said before,there is just something about holding a comic in your own hands.Turning the pages with your own hands,instead of the click of a mouse.

I can imagine some people liking this,but for me.Ill aways read on paper,and when this is no longer done,then it will be time for me to stop reading.

[CyberCoyote]

Okay, so Marvel sells the digital comics..for download? What's to stop it from getting mass dispersed after that. It's the big catch. Even if you can only view the things on-line all you do is print-screen and capture the whole thing. Now no one even has to scan and color correct the stuff to post it online. Maybe there's a registration key on each disk (I'm sure there're ways around that, too)

Didn't Layton's or one of those other companies that rose and fell in the last five or six years have on-line subscriptions? Did anyone try it? Was it good-bad-something else?

How much money would they save if they didn't have to print the books?

[Effect]

The only digital comics that aren't a pain in the ass are the illegal pirated copies.

CBZ/CBR files, huge resolution, viewed in CDisplay (or equalivalent), filling up the screen width-wise, beats the ever loving shite out of PDFs and Flash garbage. Scrolling in CDisplay is a snap. The images are such high resolution that you can view them a number of ways and still be crystal clear.

It's so simple.

Simply TAKE the piracy format. Add your own basic DRM protections. and release it.

Good point. The method is there, it's about coming up with the proper and worthwhile protection to limit and decrease the piracy. You not going to completely stop it so don't even try since it will happen no matter what format you are on. Hell people pirate novels so really if a person wants to they are going to do it. Limiting it is the way to go and progress can be made especially if you cut off the reason for piracy.

A lot of reason people do it is because of either price I feel or simply not being able to get comics from a comic store because there isn't one near them and the cost of getting to one (time, gas, etc) doesn't even make it worthwhile and getting subscriptions isn't good because what if you dislike a comic after a few issues. You are stuck.

Take care of that and give a good price and attention will be on that more and less on the pirated copies. Like said, the pirated versions of comics blow any type of online version or digital copy Marvel has released from what I've seen. They should just take that method and change it to benefit them.

Also like said if it's such a problem then Marve, DC, or whoever should get off their ass and try to head it off themselves. If so many people are doing it and they are losing so much money then take steps to redirect those potential sales to them by giving these readers the method that they want but officially. Lost sales and even that is arguable don't really bother me since if Marvel was really hurting or anyone else then they'd do something about it. The technology and software is there, they just have to look around and/or modify it. Will comic shops hurt because of it, yes but really is that the consumers problem in the end? Why should they care I ask you?

If you own one then it's understandable but for someone that spends their money should they really be concerned as long as they are getting the product for a good price? Or can comic shops or it's owners not adapt and alter their business to deal with this new change? Talk about how shops would suffer is one thing but how could they adapt to this I wonder. Anyone have any ideas?

[The Sword Is Drawn]

One solution from a comic book shop POV would be the ability for them to sell genuine and official digital comics in store. Maybe the facilities for a customer to choose some comic books off a PC, pay for them, and then choose to have them mailed to them or burnt onto a CD/DVD in store.

This could range from a few odd back issues to say a TPB or a full run of a writer/full series.

That way the store gets a cut and so does the publisher.

[Tadhg]

The RIAA and MPAA thank you for drinking their Kool-Aid.


How nice of you to try and dismiss me by saying "I've drunk the kool-aid." I guess I'll have to speak plainly.

I bought something. I paid for it. I can re-sell it or give it away free. End of story. That is NOT illegal. I'm not taking credit for it. I'm not claiming it as mine. I am making a profit off someone else's work though, but since it's "investing" it's not copyright infringement, but scanning my comics and giving them out free to all comers is?

I never said you couldn't resell or give away a comic you bought. In fact, I explicitly said it wasn't copyright infringement. "Investing" has nothing to do with why it's not copyright infringement. Doctrine of First-sale is why it's not infringement. You have the right to do what you want with that copy. But those are the key-words; That copy.

Not sure I follow the logic here. I was really hoping to steer this towards a more interesting conversation than the usual kneejerk "ZOMG UR ALL THEIVING PIRATES" or "DOOD, WHERE CAN I DL SOME FREE COMIXS, LNKS PLS KTHNXBI" but I can see that's how most folks here want to frame the discussion.

There's nothing kneejerk about it. You don't have the right to reproduce intellectual property that you don't own. I really don't see how this is hard to understand. Redistributing product that the copyright holder produced = legal(That would be the second-hand market). Reproducing product without the copyright holder's permission = illegal(That would be scanning and distributing comics on your own). It's that simple and there's no Kool-aid involved.

ED made a decent point, that the nigh-infinte reproducability of scanned comics makes then a bigger issue than back issue bins. But to me it's all the same philosophy, either I can do what I want with the comics once I buy them (including selling them, shredding them, or giving to my friends) or I can't. Comics has ALWAYS been about the former. Is expecting people not to extend this philosophy into the digital medium too much?

It's not even the same philosophy. With a comic sold in the second-hand market, the copyright holder already got their money from that issue with the original sale. The fact that it moves around is irrelevent as it's still a single copy that the owner was compensated for. Like I said, the difference is redistribution vs. reproduction. They are very different animals.

[Nstar83]

I think comic writers an the respective companys are not all that hurt by the scanned downloaded issues.THe big two may manly be comics but thier chars are being used in a variety of other forms of commercial media which is sure enough that there not hurting for cash.Personally I wouldn't download,meens i probably stop collecting when things go digital.I find reading it on a screen etc a bit annoying when you have to focus in on a panel or some such thing like that.I will always probably be an ink an paper type of guy.

[NormanB]

Okay, so Marvel sells the digital comics..for download? What's to stop it from getting mass dispersed after that.

Seems to be working for Apple and itunes...

:)

[CyberCoyote]

Seems to be working for Apple and itunes...

:)

Yeah, suckers like my wife pay for music :)

[Mark Wallace]

I remember when they were doing dotComics. Those were fantastic and really got me reading the Ultimate U books when I probably wouldn't have bothered with them.

... Which is exactly what the scanner community says, and they're right.

I don't think anyone would prefer reading digital comics over the real thing, but the current cost of comics (and of back issues from the "Guild of Thieves" that runs comic shops) prevents too many people from reading too many comics. If those people download the issues they can't afford -- thereby keeping themselves "in the continuity loop" -- then they are going to continue collecting whatever comics they can afford, rather than just give up and collect Barbies, instead. It does a lot less damage to the industry than cassette tapes did to the music biz (and that ended up as being precious little).

I started out scanning my own comics for my History files (as per the sig), but found that it was less effort to use "the program" to download copies that were already scanned by people who are better with a scanner than I am. No-one loses there, either.

The industry doesn't make a penny out of back issues (all the profit goes to the Guild of Thieves), so I don't see why anyone should feel guilty about downloading older comics, many of which will never be reprinted, and are not even available from the Guild.

Again, though, reading scanned back issues -- the history of one's favourite characters, for example -- is likely to inspire people to keep buying comics, so the industry gains from it.