BPRD 4 and Book of

[Mikolaj]

http://www.darkhorse.com/profile/preview.php?theid=13-677&p=1
http://www.darkhorse.com/profile/preview.php?theid=12-465&p=1
...Monsters preview at Dark Horse. =_= Damn it! Had some trouble with pressing the enter to soon. Sorry for th strange title.

[Neil Hill]

Thanks for the heads up Khan! No preview of Mike's Monster story unfortunately, but still looks good.

[Jake Capps]

I am really diging this story arc!

[Jack Zodiac]

Damn. When I saw Hellboy on the cover of Universal Machine #4 I thought it meant he'd be coming back. :( Ah, well. A flashback's good enough for me. It's just been way too long since we've gotten to see Hellboy and Abe together.
________
VOLCANO CLASSIC REVIEW (http://vaporizer.org/reviews/volcano)

[kid cthulhu]

Can't wait for this!
Tomorrow...

[Tad]

Can't wait for this!
Tomorrow...
Probably not if you're in the US. Comic delivery is usually a day late in weeks with a postal holiday.

[Myron L]

Probably not if you're in the US. Comic delivery is usually a day late in weeks with a postal holiday.

Exactly...new comic day is Thursday this week, due to the holiday and shipping being delayed by no mail. Happens every holiday...dammit !
:)

[Neil Hill]

Exactly...new comic day is Thursday this week, due to the holiday and shipping being delayed by no mail. Happens every holiday...dammit !
:)

Well, at least that parts predictable enough. I remember cluing into this little bit of schedule interuptus when I was quite young, trying to figure out why comics sometimes shipped on Monday's (as new comic day used to be on Friday in those days) rather than the day they were scheduled. I remember secretly thinking that the guys at Diamond Comics (or wherever my 14 yr old mind thought they shipped from then) were taking days off when they should be working 'round the clock to make sure I get my comics! ;)

[Mikolaj]

That is somewhat simmilar to my corrent fixation: why do my comic books spend so long in the taxation ofice. What if these guy's read'em?? ;)

[Gary_B]

We got our comics on Wednesday as usual here in Canada. I just had my first read of #4 and it's great. I love the cover with Liz, Abe and Hellboy. It's nice to see a Mignola drawing of Liz. Guy Davis' drawings are getting better and better and I really like his take on Hellboy. He shows him from some unusual angles and draws a nice RHOD. How the heck does Hellboy put on coats with that thing on the end of his arm?

[kid cthulhu]

I was all excited to see the flashback scene drawn by Mike, but that obviously didn't happen. Guy did a great job as usual, and it was fun to see his take on Big Red. I wonder why I was under the impression that Mike was doing the flashback sequence?

Oh, and apologies for my long winded letter in the back. It's always interesting to see your letter in print long after you'd almost forgotten about it.

[Mikolaj]

I was almost sure mike will be stepping up to draw the sequence... But knowing what good work Guy is capable of- I'm still waiting with the same curiousness.

[-=Valkyre=-]

Got my Issue 4 just yesterday, thank GOD I managed to get it when I did. *dances* Really great, can't wait to see the next one!

[Neil Hill]

*BPRD issue 4 SPOILERS AHEAD- BE WARNED*

I read through BPRD: Universal Machine #4 yesterday. Good lordy, what a great experience that was!! Wonderful creepy little vignette-like stories, all very gothic, nuanced and in some ways quite sad. Poor Daryl the Wendigo. That whole section of the story just seemed to come out of left field, but what a great slice of juicy storytelling by all involved it turned out to be!

My one lament for this issue is that Mike didn't draw any of the flashback sequences. Someone somewhere had hinted that he might, and I kept turning the page hoping to see Mike's unique take on any section of the story, but alas it was not meant to be. Guy's artwork more than filled that particular void for me though, and he was in rare form on the Hellboy and Abe sequence (involving Daryl the Wendigo, as mentioned previously) specifically.

Great issue overall! In fact, I almost don't want this storyline to end in the next issue, as I'm enjoying the ride that much. :D

[InAdia]

There is just so much to cover in the next issue that I almost get the feeling that it will either be rushed, advanced greatly in the beginning, or perhaps a cliffhanger ending. Either way, we find out Roger's future in The Univeral Machine number five. Good lordy I simply cannoy wait.

The Real Inadia

[el seth]

That Wendigo scene was maybe the most gut-wrenching and powerfull thing I've ever read in a comic. Damn good job all around, guys.

[Jack Zodiac]

I wouldn't go that far, but I agree. It was an emotional scene, especially considering that it involved a character we only had two pages to meet and care about. That takes a depth of writing skill that should be considered godlike.

Also, what I love about Hellboy and BPRD stories written by Mike is that, when a creature from myth is introduced into his stories, I can usually recognize it right away, and then point out what things are common to its mythos and what are either uncommon or so unusual, Mike had to have added that element himself.

That's why I think Makoma will be my favorite Hellboy story for a long while.
________
redheaded Cam (http://www.girlcamfriend.com/webcam/redhead-girls/)

[kid cthulhu]

I'm really hoping we see more of Daryl in the future. He would make a great addition to the team!

[Myron L]

There is just so much to cover in the next issue that I almost get the feeling that it will either be rushed, advanced greatly in the beginning, or perhaps a cliffhanger ending. Either way, we find out Roger's future in The Univeral Machine number five. Good lordy I simply cannoy wait.

The Real Inadia


Yep...that's my fear , too, ...I really dig where this arc has gone (and is going), but I feel that the dreaded "rush" is about to happen for the last ish...how can it all wrap up neatly enough in one book ? Mike, John and Guy have done this well, but...don't squeeze to make these series to fit into five issues...use however many it needs to get it right...you know we'll all be there to buy it (at least,I know I will)...just my five cents worth !
;)

[Jack Zodiac]

I'm really hoping we see more of Daryl in the future. He would make a great addition to the team!

Yeah! A ghost that murders and eats people! That's who I want watchin' my back. ;)
________
LIVE SEX (http://camslivesexy.com/)

[Neil Hill]

Yeah! A ghost that murders and eats people! That's who I want watchin' my back. ;)

Yeah, but he means well. :D He may have permanent blood stains dappling his chin, but that doesn't mean he's a bad person. :p

[Petersen]

I think this issue really shows off the talent of the creative team on this book. It is an interlude chapter. It does very little to move the story forward, but never felt like a stall. We have two parallel stories in this mini, much like in The Dead; one is a slower paced emotional thing, the other has the high drama and suspense. The roundtable ghost/death stories chat is starting to rival the (what fist seemed like the more interesting story) of Kate trapped in a meuseum-like estate filled with arcane artifacts and treasures trying to barter of the book that may bring Roger back..inside a painting!

The story of Daryl was wonderful. It was touching. A wonderful spin on typical mythology/lore and the Helly world. And what a design!! I'm glad that he didn't look like the old X-Villian 'Wendigo' aka white bigfoot. If we see more of him, I would be glad, but I could see him being just like the corpse, a one shot colorful character. (although having him in the BPRD is like having a Jekell/Hyde character...when he remembers his family, he's sweet and dear, when not, he's a blood stained monster. And eventualy the monster will overcome.)

This issue could have really fallen flat and been terrible, it does very little to move the story along, it showcases characters sitting around telling stories which don't push the story....but it overcame all of that. Unlike the Dead's parallel bit with Abe and his wife, it was interesting, moving, and never dragged (don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the Abe &wife parts of the dead, but they seemed very seperate). I didn't wonder 'why don't we get to know about what's happening to Kate?' Not knowing what is going on in the painting and delaying the negotiations for the book is only adding to the tension of the story..we needed this interlude. 'Wonderful job' to the writers, artist, and colorist!

[Tad]

This is possibly my favorite BPRD arcs. The military stuff of previous stories was cool and made BPRD a whole different type of comic than HELLBOY but I love the haunted atmosphere of this one. Other arcs had much bigger concepts but I like the intimate feel here. Roger is serving as a great Hitchcock mcguffin. Kate's adventure is creepy, echoing the claustrophobic traps of JONATHAN STRANGE AND MR. NORRELL (http://www.jonathanstrange.com).

I agree that we're left with alot to wrap up in a single issue. I know it will all fit in, but an expanded issue or an extra issue would let it play out with more suspense. But whatever, I'm enjoying it!

[kid cthulhu]

Yeah! A ghost that murders and eats people! That's who I want watchin' my back. ;)

It's that inner turmoil that makes a character interesting and allows us to cheer them on when they overcome. I mean, Hellboy is the beast of the apocalypse for pete's sake, and we cheer him on at every turn. Granted, he hasn't killed and eaten anyone, at least as far as we know, but I get the feeling that at some point in the future we may learn something about him that could be quite disturbing.

And what about the werewolf girl in the last novel? She had a bit of wickedness in her past, but was able to overcome it and become worthy of our sympathy.

Just thinking "out loud" here is all...

[Hellcow]

I really enjoyed this issue, no surprise there. But I didn't enjoy it as much as the first 3.

Unlike you David, to me I did feel the stall and I was feeling like I needed at least 1 panel of what was happening with Kate.

As has been expressed, given the magnificent pacing and tension built in the first 3 issues, it feels like this arc needs about 8 issues to do it justice. I hope issue 5 doesn't feel like a rush job. It would have been nice to see the others back at BPRD trying to come to terms with what has happened and trying to work out a few ideas as to how they will deal with the situation.

But yeah, maybe these 5 issues will end on a cliff hanger?

[Sparky]

To quote one of my favorite Ogden Nash poems:

The wendigo, the wendigo!
I saw it just a friend ago!
Last night it lurked in Canada,
Tonight, on your veranada!

[Poe Ghostal]

The presentation of the wendigo legend here is similar to that in the story "The Wendigo" (http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/10897) by Algernon Blackwood (although the monster itself doesn't appear in the flesh in that story).

I have to say I found Abe's tale a bit arbitrary--it felt wedged in to the greater arc, as if Arcudi or Mignola had wanted to tell a story about Hellboy and a wendigo and they saw an opportunity to throw it in. A shame. I would rather have seen an entire story devoted to the wendigo legend (it would have been perfect for the Book of Monsters).

I've come to think the pacing of BPRD is unsatisfying in single-issue format. Too slow. I may switch to collecting just the trades after this series.

I'm not a betting man, but right now I'd only give Roger a 40/60 chance of coming back. And I'd be surprised if he came back in the next issue--even if Kate got the book, she'd need a lot of time to resurrect Roger (barring a deus ex machina spell or something).

[Donald]

I'm glad I'm not the only one that doesn't like the pacing of the book. This issue didn't really have anything to to do with the story so far. It felt like an issue worth of stall and padding. The Wendigo story was interesting but it a side trip that went no where, just showed Abe wasn't ready to tell his friends what he knows about himself. Liz's story didn't amount to much either, we knew she felt guilty about killing her family and I thought the time in the monistary/llamasary helped her deal with it. It looked like she and Diamo were starting to get along and his verbal attack came out of nowhere and wrecked that. What happened this issue may comeback later and be important but right now, the issue is just a -meh-. Who does how much on BPRD anyway? Is it just a story out line by MM and Arcudi does the rest, are they working together on the whole issue, story, action & dialog? Just curiosous.

Donald

[Hellcow]

I'm glad I'm not the only one that doesn't like the pacing of the book. This issue didn't really have anything to to do with the story so far. It felt like an issue worth of stall and padding. The Wendigo story was interesting but it a side trip that went no where, just showed Abe wasn't ready to tell his friends what he knows about himself. Liz's story didn't amount to much either, we knew she felt guilty about killing her family and I thought the time in the monistary/llamasary helped her deal with it. It looked like she and Diamo were starting to get along and his verbal attack came out of nowhere and wrecked that. What happened this issue may comeback later and be important but right now, the issue is just a -meh-. Who does how much on BPRD anyway? Is it just a story out line by MM and Arcudi does the rest, are they working together on the whole issue, story, action & dialog? Just curiosous.

Donald

Its definitely very different from the first 3. It didn't seem to handle the tension or suspense as well.

[Petersen]

Donald, Poe, Hellcow: How did you all like the Abe & wife story diversion in the dead? as I mentioned before, I found it much more distracting and taking me away from the story than this did. Just wondering how you three saw it..

[hellboyone]

That Wendigo scene was maybe the most gut-wrenching and powerfull thing I've ever read in a comic.

I've read more gut-wrenching but this was pretty good. And another great issue. I hope this team never stops making BPRD comics. BPRD is the best comic book right now, period.

[Poe Ghostal]

Donald, Poe, Hellcow: How did you all like the Abe & wife story diversion in the dead? as I mentioned before, I found it much more distracting and taking me away from the story than this did. Just wondering how you three saw it..I agree, the Abe/wife storyline was also running perpendicular (and not parallel) to the main storyline, but the greater problem was that it was as slow as molasses.

The Abe story in this issue is a bit more jarring as it comes out of nowhere and doesn't really work well thematically. The wife story at least ran through the entire Dead series.

[Neil Hill]

The Abe story in this issue is a bit more jarring as it comes out of nowhere and doesn't really work well thematically. The wife story at least ran through the entire Dead series.

I disagree Poe, as just about any typical storyline technique seems to be askew when it comes to the BPRD-verse. In other words, the very fact that BPRD is unpredictable and iconclastic is exactly what makes it appealing to me each month. Did Abe's story follow a typical narrative and relate back to the other stories playing out around it (in the issues previous)? No it really didn't. Did it need to in order to be better understood? No, it really didn't. It seemed to suite Abe's current state of mind more. Almost as if Abe is out of time, out of sorts, and not relating to the world around him as everyone else is. Which makes Daimio's comment at the end of Abe's story all the more fitting, when he basically re-asks Abe if he has any stories about his own history, rather than the story he just told which didn't really relate at all. Also, the blank stares around the table after Abe finishes his tale relate on another note, which is that it seems people are beginning to wonder after Abe's state of mind. Heck, I would be!

In fact the round table discussion that the various BPRD agents are currently involved in is more indicative of how such a "real" conversation WOULD be. People just telling stories- some related, some not. I can wrap my intellect around that much better than if everyone just told typical origin stories, one after the other in turn.

Does that make sense, Poe? You probably still don't agree, but that's the beauty of opinions. :D

[Poe Ghostal]

In fact the round table discussion that the various BPRD agents are currently involved in is more indicative of how such a "real" conversation WOULD be. People just telling stories- some related, some not. I can wrap my intellect around that much better than if everyone just told typical origin stories, one after the other in turn.Only Daimio told an origin story. The theme of their discussion is death, and that's what all the stories were supposed to be about. The argument I'd like to hear is how the wendigo story is about death. Being a former English major I could probably come up with one, but it would feel forced. I thought Abe's story seemed like a contrived guest appearance by Hellboy. It pulled me out of the fictive dream, as John Gardner might have said.

And I still think the Abe/wife story was too slow, revealed little, and was anticlimactic, with no evident effects on Abe's development as a character (other than becoming increasingly somber). That said, I loved the revelations in Plague of Frogs #5 (probably my favorite single issue of BPRD thus far).

[hellboyone]

The argument I'd like to hear is how the wendigo story is about death. Being a former English major I could probably come up with one, but it would feel forced. I thought Abe's story seemed like a contrived guest appearance by Hellboy. It pulled me out of the fictive dream, as John Gardner might have said.


Death of his life with his family. His own eventual death as he continues to forget about his family in his current Wendigo state. The empathy Abe feels for the creature since his own former life was taken from him in much the same way as the Wendigo, effectively killing Abe the first time around. Death, death, death. And I wasn't an English major. :)

I didn't find the Hellboy appearance gratuitous either. It would be different if it were like in Marvel comics where Wolverine used to appear in every book because he sold comics ("What the hell is Wolverine doing in Thor?"). Hellboy WAS a member of the BPRD. He's bound to appear in a flashback or two (and has before in pre-Guy Davis books).

[Poe Ghostal]

Death of his life with his family. His own eventual death as he continues to forget about his family in his current Wendigo state. The empathy Abe feels for the creature since his own former life was taken from him in much the same way as the Wendigo, effectively killing Abe the first time around. Death, death, death. And I wasn't an English major. :)Still feels too thin to me. But I'll grant that this is definitely a gray area where one's opinion is the final arbiter.

I didn't find the Hellboy appearance gratuitous either. It would be different if it were like in Marvel comics where Wolverine used to appear in every book because he sold comics ("What the hell is Wolverine doing in Thor?"). Hellboy WAS a member of the BPRD. He's bound to appear in a flashback or two (and has before in pre-Guy Davis books).I'm not saying I think Hellboy's appearance was motivated by marketing considerations. Hardly. But I do think it's possible that, say, Guy Davis wanted a chance to draw Hellboy, or Arcudi wanted a chance to write Hellboy, and this was a way of granting them that, though it ended up not really working (in my opinion) within the context of the little discussion they have going.

To be honest, I don't think it's really worth arguing over too much--I didn't think it worked, but it's just a few pages. But the feedback on this forum tends to be very positive, and I grant MM & company the benefit of believing they know not everything they do is perfect, and that they can handle a little constructive criticism now and then. ;)

[hellboyone]

Just for the record, I'm not a "BPRD can do no wrong" guy. I actually didn't like BPRD when it first started and even stopped buying issues after the 2nd one. But it grew on me after reading the trade.

Oh...and if I sounded argumentative, apologies. I thought we were just discussing things. Nuance isn't one of the internet's strong points. :)

[Neil Hill]

I still think the Abe/wife story was too slow, revealed little, and was anticlimactic, with no evident effects on Abe's development as a character (other than becoming increasingly somber).

Well, foreshadowing can be an elusive and interesting fish (no pun intended, as relates to Abe). My guess is that the story regarding Abe's wife will bear more interesting fruit in the future, as Abe's story in general seems to be a major slow burn- a little revealed here and there.

Personally, I place copious amounts of faith in what Guy, Mike, and John are doing with BPRD on all levels, so I reserve comment on what impact I feel the Abe wife story has overall. I didn't find it slow and unnecessary though. That much I can say with confidence. :D

[Donald]

I re-read the Abe story in The Dead and it didn't really go any where for me either. It had a nice build up in the first two issues, but after that the story went no where. The way it was presented was too choppy and cut into the flow of the main story. If what was in issues 3-5 was in the last half of the last issue it would have flowed a bit better.

Hellboyone does make a good point about Abe putting himself in the Wendigo story, but I think he has it the wrong way around. In The Dead Abe says he has no memories of Langdon Caul's life. I'd say Abe see himself as the Wendigo spirit, inflicting himself on an innocent man and taking his body and life away.

All the little Abe snippets may be building to something but it is doing it too slow and with no foreshadowing of direction I can see. I can't share Stygian's faith in John or Guy to get where Mike wants to go. None of the BPRD books have had the same solid feel that a MM-solo Hellboy story has.

[Hellcow]

Donald, Poe, Hellcow: How did you all like the Abe & wife story diversion in the dead? as I mentioned before, I found it much more distracting and taking me away from the story than this did. Just wondering how you three saw it..


You know its funny, the Abe/Wife story didn't feel so distracting for me. Like it had more meaning to the story/characters. I'm not sure why. Maybe I'll read them back to back to try and work out why.

In this current arc, I didn't mind what the story was itself. In fact maybe it introduced us to a potentially interesting new BPRD member....

But in the context of the main story, the pacing in this latest issue didn't feel right given the previous three issues. Maybe I'll change my mind when I read issue 5.

In anycase, I still think BPRD is the most entertaining comic out there right now.

BTW I'd give Mouse Gaurd a VERY CLOSE second place. Well done.

[Poe Ghostal]

None of the BPRD books have had the same solid feel that a MM-solo Hellboy story has.
I think Hollow Earth has that feel. I wish we could get another story like that one. And I really enjoyed Plague of Frogs.

[Neil Hill]

And I really enjoyed Plague of Frogs.

Interesting how opinions differ. I actually didn't care for that story as much as some of the more recent series. Perhaps it wasn't quirky enough or seemed too "standard" (if that's the right word) when compared with some of the later BPRD series offerings.

I'm not sure exactly why, but the Plague of Frogs story, although the kick-off and a nice little series in its own right, didn't have the benefit of upping the ante' like later series were able to. Not to say that I didn't like POF, just not as much as say The Dead or Universal Machine.

[Poe Ghostal]

Interesting how opinions differ. I actually didn't care for that story as much as some of the more recent series. Perhaps it wasn't quirky enough or seemed too "standard" (if that's the right word) when compared with some of the later BPRD series offerings.

I'm not sure exactly why, but the Plague of Frogs story, although the kick-off and a nice little series in its own right, didn't have the benefit of upping the ante' like later series were able to. Not to say that I didn't like POF, just not as much as say The Dead or Universal Machine.PoF had some of the most beautiful images I've ever in a comic book, especially the underwater sequence in issue #5. It also has Liz using her power to really burn some stuff up--complete with gorgeous oranges and yellows by Mr. Stewart, to say nothing of the creepy bright green of the zombies. There's action, mystery, and supernatural horror in Plague of Frogs, and it's all paced very well. PoF is definitely my favorite of the Arcudi-Davis team so far.

[Neil Hill]

PoF had some of the most beautiful images I've ever in a comic book, especially the underwater sequence in issue #5. It also has Liz using her power to really burn some stuff up--complete with gorgeous oranges and yellows by Mr. Stewart, to say nothing of the creepy bright green of the zombies. There's action, mystery, and supernatural horror in Plague of Frogs, and it's all paced very well. PoF is definitely my favorite of the Arcudi-Davis team so far.

Well, if we all liked the color blue and the same types of music, it would be a much more boring world mon' frere. :D

I do agree regarding the imagery though. My favorite is that dead dog animated by Johann to impart information to Liz and Kate. Super creepy looking IMO.

[Poe Ghostal]

Well, if we all liked the color blue and the same types of music, it would be a much more boring world mon' frere. :D Indeed, agreed.