First look at: New X-Men #28

[Stagier]

uh so we got some shots for the upcoming new xmen.

new avengers show up, well carol and tony, so far, the drinkers.
and they uncover...... A DEAD JAY. DAMN IT!

so much for his powers kicking in. i am so pissed.

[X-Factor]

Ya got link?

Can't say I'm surprised, they needed someone to die every issue and they may not have enough to kill for the rest of their run.

[Syzygy]

A DEAD JAY. DAMN IT!

so much for his powers kicking in. i am so pissed.

This is a huge mistake, character-wise.

Think of the character development as Jay, residing at the X-Mansion, has to come to terms with what he's done, his stupidity, his treachery, his lethal gullibility, with virtually everyone hating him.

The story material for this situation is immense! Or rather, would be.

Death is the easy way out for Jay, which is why, plot-wise, he should have lived.

--Syzygy

[Stagier]

well that kind of is what happend with josh 2.

he was a reaver, and mutant hater, then was outed and had to deal with the reprecussions.

yes i am still reading this book, but c'mon stop the killing.. wanda better fix all of this next year. or superboy.

[Vaal]

uh so we got some shots for the upcoming new xmen.

new avengers show up, well carol and tony, so far, the drinkers.
and they uncover...... A DEAD JAY. DAMN IT!

so much for his powers kicking in. i am so pissed.
Oh, come ON!

I grew to love my burgeoning hatred of Jay during this arc, but geez -- are we even capable of plot devices OTHER than shock deaths?

This is like the Simpsons when Bart's talking about the 'banned' Radioactive Man comic -- the one where he and Fallout Boy die on every page.

[Syzygy]

well that kind of is what happend with josh 2.

he was a reaver, and mutant hater, then was outed and had to deal with the reprecussions.

Dude!

Both Cannonball and Elixer worked for Reaver-man Pierce...but they never got anyone killed because of it...much less 44 children.

Also, Cannonball and Exiler worked for the Reavers BEFORE they ever went to the Xavier Institute, not after.

Jay has been there at least a year, and has two older siblings who are X-Men...he ought to have known better.

Forty-four dead children. How could Jay ever get over it? How could anybody ever forgive him?

Great story material. Way past the kid-stuff mistakes of Cannonball and Elixer.

Peace,
Syzygy

[jawbreaker]

you know, years from now I cant see this comic being thought of fondly or reminisced in the same way fans do now for New Mutants or Gen X...

sure the comic sells, kids(kids? teens? adults?) pick it up, but are they really enjoying the characters & stories or are they just picking it up for some excitement & rubbernecking...

then again, tastes have changed...maybe today's kids & teens have become too accustomed to the throw away fast food lifestyle & treat their comic book heroes the same way...

[Affinity]

well that kind of is what happend with josh 2.

he was a reaver, and mutant hater, then was outed and had to deal with the reprecussions.

yes i am still reading this book, but c'mon stop the killing.. wanda better fix all of this next year. or superboy.
That joke isn't funny anymore, man...

[ibrakeforchinwe]

The Sept solicit said that there will be implications for the future and past. With the DOFP tribute cover and the inclusion of Nimord. I strongly believe that by september or october or w/e, atleast SOME of the kids will be alive again. Probably the main ones like Laurie and Jay.

[Stagier]

time travel?!! gah make it stop. where is christina and nunzio?

it's hard to say whether these stories will be fondly remembered. I have a hard time with gen x stuff, and i DO remember enjoying those stories at the time, where as opposed to the original mutants, and everything they did I think is gold.

weird huh?

[Yoel]

time travel?!! gah make it stop. where is christina and nunzio?

it's hard to say whether these stories will be fondly remembered. I have a hard time with gen x stuff, and i DO remember enjoying those stories at the time, where as opposed to the original mutants, and everything they did I think is gold.

weird huh?

Thats cos it WAS gold:D
The thing I remember about the original New Mutants was that you really went on a journey with the characters - as opposed to comics for todays market which seems to be not so much about telling a good story, but all about shocking deaths, crappy costume changes and the next big event.

[Callisto]

i think the new creative team on new x-men is bringing fresh air to a once dull and boring title that was new x-men. let's face it, half the characters in the book were quite unimpressive with equally unimpressive powers it was only a matter of time before they were used as cannon fodder by some other writer so atleast they were able to go out while they still had some fame.

[X-Factor]

i think the new creative team on new x-men is bringing fresh air to a once dull and boring title that was new x-men. let's face it, half the characters in the book were quite unimpressive with equally unimpressive powers it was only a matter of time before they were used as cannon fodder by some other writer so atleast they were able to go out while they still had some fame.

Coming from someone who's name is Callisto?

I mean I like the character from which your screenname is derived from, but let's be real. You have to have time to develop a character. Its development and time that lets characters like Callisto and potentially the New X-Men kids to shine.

Say what you like about the previous run, but to think it was a good idea to resort to killing the characters is silly to me.

[Vaal]

NXM was hardly dull or boring. It may not have had random 'splosions but it was a fun and solid book.

NXM now is just another team book with more deaths because all the characters are new and relegated to a Non X-men X-book, so its 'safe' to slaughter them with no regard to the small, but devoted fan base.

They couldn't get away with killing 80% of an X-men book and they shouldn't be able to do it here.

[Blackcat]

Take a look at the preview pages of New X-Men #28. It has guest appearances of Ironman and Ms Marvel.

Be aware, another death will be confirmed in this preview!!!
SPOILERS AT:
http://www.popcultureshock.com/reviews.php?id=5662

[Syzygy]

A DEAD JAY. DAMN IT!

so much for his powers kicking in. i am so pissed.

I said it before, and I'll say it again.

Killing Jay is a huge mistake, character-wise.

Think of the character development as Jay, residing at the X-Mansion, has to come to terms with what he's done, his stupidity, his treachery, his lethal gullibility, with virtually everyone hating him.

The story material for this situation is immense! Or rather, it would be....

Death is the easy way out for Jay, which is why, plot-wise, he should have lived.

--Syzygy

[Dazzler]

sad and pointless.

--Dazz

[Quasar]

EDITfgnggbggg

[That JonoGuy]

That's who that was? I thought it was some girl I didn't know of. I guess I need to have my eye-sight checked. Either that or start picking up the missing NXM-AX I need.

[Radical_dreamer]

sad and pointless.

--Dazz

that about sums up your post.

[Zombienorthstar]

Personally i dont mind...Jay was always kinda lame to me...i just want Cannonball/Husk reprucussions...maybe this is why Sam gets angry with Scott and leaves with Rogues team....

...I thought some guys would appreciate someone calling Scott out on the crappy way hes dealt with the kids.

[Affinity]

Wow. Ms. Marvel looks cool under Medina.

[Lady Obie]

This will be my first issue that flies or flops on its own merits (meaning I let my sub end last issue after being po'ed at all the deaths in the last few issues).

Even though Jay wasn't one of my faves, starting this issue off with yet another dead student, the very thing that caused my interest in this comic to plummet because of an excess of it, doesn't present me with a good sign that this will be an issue I'll like :eek:

Over the past few months this series has had too much focus on death and despair and too little focus on life and hope.

When or if hope becomes a big presence in this series again, I'll look to buy it.

Until then, I'll keep up with it by reading posted spoilers and the comics off the spin rack when they come out in my local bookstore ;)

[shaunyc56]

Personally i dont mind...Jay was always kinda lame to me...i just want Cannonball/Husk reprucussions...maybe this is why Sam gets angry with Scott and leaves with Rogues team....

...I thought some guys would appreciate someone calling Scott out on the crappy way hes dealt with the kids.


I'm gonna miss Jay. I think he flourished in the squad on squad stuff. I also thought that his squadmates were helping him. That run really showed the Xmen as teachers to these kids too. This death every issue stuff, coupled w/ no real teaching, is starting to bother me. Oh yeah, give David back his damn powers already.

[Zombienorthstar]

I'm gonna miss Jay. I think he flourished in the squad on squad stuff. I also thought that his squadmates were helping him. That run really showed the Xmen as teachers to these kids too. This death every issue stuff, coupled w/ no real teaching, is starting to bother me. Oh yeah, give David back his damn powers already.


I think post Nimrod the deaths are ending as Yost said in a private message to me that next years stories are going to involve the other students more heavily.

[Cayman]

Poor Jay, I wanted him to live.

He was probably the best things to come out of Austen's run.

Cay

[R Krippler]

I am surprised so many people thought that Jay would live. If his wings didn't grow back people should have known that wasn't going to recover from a bullet to the head. I am suprised that people aren't crying that Stryker was shown being put in a bodybag, cuz God knows that no one should die in comics:rolleyes:

[Siddon]

Can't say I am to sad to see him go. the roster had to be trimmed down and Jay- Laurie - Brian where good characters but I just didn't see them being relevant 5 years down the road. Think of how great New Mutants would have been had Dani died during the Demon Bear Saga or Karma during the Shadow King story of course then we would have been deprived of 2 or 3 good stories we have seen from each character since.....

So 3 characters dead
2 characters in limbo (Wind dancer Whither)
1 character relegating into the supporting role (Prodigy)

I don’t consider these to be shock deaths, if you want shock deaths read Infinite Crisis, these removals where necessary for the book to survive and prosper. You can’t have a book with 14 main characters and a dozen or so supporting characters.

[riotgear]

So are people hoping my theory is correct now? :)

[RH_Duncan]

So are people hoping my theory is correct now? :)
Nope, it's a worthless idea. If the creative team would do what you predict, a lot of readers will stop reading the book. Believe me, your theorie is a fun idea figured out, but worthless to the book sales.

[Zombienorthstar]

So are people hoping my theory is correct now? :)


Yeah man despite my love of some of the dead characters (WHY DJ WHY :( ) I understand why the deaths are crucial to the new tone of the book...

If this is a dream ill drop the book...at least the writers are showing some stones this way...the fact is the deaths of these characters are SUPPOSED to be emotive. They're supposed to make you angry. They're supposed to make you be on the New X-Men's side when they're going adfter the bad guy that killed their friends. They're supposed to make you chant 'HELL YEAH' during the inevitable Cyke-Cannonball confrontation. There being done to do just this...make the readers angry.

It's what the writers do after the death that will define them...

[riotgear]

Yeah man despite my love of some of the dead characters (WHY DJ WHY :( ) I understand why the deaths are crucial to the new tone of the book...

If this is a dream ill drop the book...at least the writers are showing some stones this way...the fact is the deaths of these characters are SUPPOSED to be emotive. They're supposed to make you angry. They're supposed to make you be on the New X-Men's side when they're going adfter the bad guy that killed their friends. They're supposed to make you chant 'HELL YEAH' during the inevitable Cyke-Cannonball confrontation. There being done to do just this...make the readers angry.

It's what the writers do after the death that will define them...

I'm not saying it's a dream. I'm saying it's either a danger room sequence designed by Emma to find the next team (the free-for-all was too simple for Emma's style), or the danger room program started by David at the beginning of C&C's run is still going, and they don't know it.

[Zombienorthstar]

I'm not saying it's a dream. I'm saying it's either a danger room sequence designed by Emma to find the next team (the free-for-all was too simple for Emma's style), or the danger room program started by David at the beginning of C&C's run is still going, and they don't know it.


Yeah and the specifics of your idea still have the same reprucussions as it being a dream...it still makes all the character development and deaths for nothing...

It being a danger room sequence or a dream makes no difference.

[Callisto]

Coming from someone who's name is Callisto?

I mean I like the character from which your screenname is derived from, but let's be real. You have to have time to develop a character. Its development and time that lets characters like Callisto and potentially the New X-Men kids to shine.

Say what you like about the previous run, but to think it was a good idea to resort to killing the characters is silly to me.

my username is derived from the callisto of xena warrior princess not the callisto of x-men. Regardless what you say is true, time is indeed needed to develop characters to shine but the new x-men children were given enough time to "shine" and all they really did was stay in the darkness. With this new fast paced exciting thriller that has become new x-men readers like myself have grown to acctually care about these characters and fear for there fate! something i never did in the prior run because all the characters were about as interseting toothpaste and at times i acctually prayed they were killed.

[Callisto]

I said it before, and I'll say it again.

Killing Jay is a huge mistake, character-wise.

Think of the character development as Jay, residing at the X-Mansion, has to come to terms with what he's done, his stupidity, his treachery, his lethal gullibility, with virtually everyone hating him.

The story material for this situation is immense! Or rather, it would be....

Death is the easy way out for Jay, which is why, plot-wise, he should have lived.

--Syzygy



Not to be cruel but lets be honest.jay was nothing more then warren with red hair and wings and was an atrocious offspring of the infamous writer "chuck austen". the scenes prior to His death gave him more character development then he had in all the x-men issues he was in.

[Vaal]

Think of how great New Mutants would have been had Dani died during the Demon Bear Saga or Karma during the Shadow King story
You mean not at all?

You just want blood for the sake of blood. Deaths should mean something, not be a gimmick. This is just doing thier damndest to kill one every issue. There's not point to it anymore. We're way past the whole 'setting the tone' line people like to toss out, heedless of the fact that the 'tone' is exactly the same as every other book now.

And as for 'supposed to make you angry' thing -- bull. We're not angry at the villains. Stryker was just a means to an end and bought it within thirty seconds of meeting the team. No, we're angry at the creative team.

Edit: Is it just me, or does Beast look like some kind of troll in that last page?

[Faded]

I think these deaths are so ridiculously excessive that we MUST be getting at least a few ressurections. :D

[Faded]

Oh and I love Medina and his colorist. :D

[Siddon]

You mean not at all?

You just want blood for the sake of blood. Deaths should mean something, not be a gimmick. This is just doing thier damndest to kill one every issue. There's not point to it anymore. We're way past the whole 'setting the tone' line people like to toss out, heedless of the fact that the 'tone' is exactly the same as every other book now.

And as for 'supposed to make you angry' thing -- bull. We're not angry at the villains. Stryker was just a means to an end and bought it within thirty seconds of meeting the team. No, we're angry at the creative team.

Edit: Is it just me, or does Beast look like some kind of troll in that last page?

Gosh I would hate to deprive the world of all of those great Karma stories post 1982 ... like the one where she was in the background in X-force .... or Mekanax .... or well I think thats all the Karma appearences since Shadow King.

Now if I could actually remember a good Karma story since the Shadow King a might be able to move on I would rather have a good death (I.E. Doug Ramsey/ Magik) or a good ressurection (Warlock) then a bad death (Skin) or a trip into the void (Gaia, Penance, Karma) only to be trotted out in 5 years when Superboy prime decides to punch there heads off.

[Faded]

Superboy references evade me. :confused:

I really must catch up.

[Vaal]

Superboy references evade me. :confused:

I really must catch up.
Inifinite Crisis in the DCU. Superboy punched the walls of reality to change it.

Much like Wanda punched reality to screw up the X-books.

[Volk1]

Just when I'm starting to really like the book, they gotta go and kill Jay. :(

Two reasons why I hate it.
1. He's a Guthrie. I love the Guthries. That's just wrong. It's going to feel empty thinking about the Guthries without Icarus.
2. I had just re-read She Lies With Angels. Yes, an Austen arc that I really liked. Jay was incredible in that story.

I totally agree with Syzygy. Killing off Jay right now does more hurt than keeping him alive. What's more interesting to see? A solemn, depressed, angry, mutilated, shocked, and healing kid, looking for answers, hope, and a future (along with probably some great brother/sister interaction with Paige and Sam)

OR

a dead Jay.


Yeah. C&C just laid an egg on that one. This book totally messes with my brain cells.






*If for some reason or another Jay comes back alive in that issue then I take it back!

[Affinity]

Not to be cruel but lets be honest.jay was nothing more then warren with red hair and wings and was an atrocious offspring of the infamous writer "chuck austen". the scenes prior to His death gave him more character development then he had in all the x-men issues he was in.
I don't think he's speaking as a Jay fan, but rather he's trying to say that the stories that would come out of Icarus' betrayal would be fabulous, it'd add a whole lot of tension and drama and it'd be pretty cool to read, whether it was X, Laurie, or Sooraya who betrayed them.

[HellFrost]

I don't think he's speaking as a Jay fan, but rather he's trying to say that the stories that would come out of Icarus' betrayal would be fabulous, it'd add a whole lot of tension and drama and it'd be pretty cool to read, whether it was X, Laurie, or Sooraya who betrayed them.
...I agree with Callisto... but Nunzio and Christina were breaking him out of that horrible characterization slowly, but effectively.:(

[rilokyle]

I'm so torn when it comes to this book; I have a very love-hate relationship with it. It's kinda like a car-wreck on the highway: it's awful that all the drivers and passengers are in an accident, but at the same time, you want to watch and drive by slowly to see what the damage is. New X-Men is like that for me. I feel awful that I'm like this, but I get a little excitement over who's dying and who's depowered, because it's all just so shocking. I actually feel like no character is truly safe and they're all in terrible danger, and I guess that's the desired reaction Chris and Craig are looking for. This book has not been predictable, and in a strange way, I kinda like it. I definitely miss a lot of the characters that are now gone, but it sure has been one helluva ride. :o

[Dazzler]

that about sums up your post.


if you don't have anything intelligent to say...
well. look who i'm talking to.

i have my own trollish stalker. neat.

--Dazz

[Mariah]

I used to be alright with the book before the relaunch/vamp whatever, and then I started to love the book, but with all these deaths, I'm just to the point where I don't care, why get attached to a character if it's just gonna die. But I'm gonna wait, and pick it up after the massacre has ended. Unless y'all know something that I don't.

[Zombienorthstar]

If anything i believe Jays death will be the 'best' death so far...simply because of the stories that break out of it...

1) Lucinda Guthrie and her confrontation with Xavier/Cyclops

2) Sam and Paige re-examining their position as X-Men

3) Tensions in the Angel/Husk relationship...

4) General grief..and the examination of the family dynamic after death...

[Beast]

If anything i believe Jays death will be the 'best' death so far...simply because of the stories that break out of it...

1) Lucinda Guthrie and her confrontation with Xavier/Cyclops

2) Sam and Paige re-examining their position as X-Men

3) Tensions in the Angel/Husk relationship...

4) General grief..and the examination of the family dynamic after death...
Please, like any of that will be addressed. It will be glossed over, as always. They haven't even shown any real character development or grief for all the students that died on the bus. When they get around to having all the characters act like human beings over tons of their friends being murdered, then get back to me. So far, I'm just not seeing it. We need a one-shot story where the 'New X-Men' see a psychiatrist over this.

[X-Factor]

my username is derived from the callisto of xena warrior princess not the callisto of x-men. Regardless what you say is true, time is indeed needed to develop characters to shine but the new x-men children were given enough time to "shine" and all they really did was stay in the darkness. With this new fast paced exciting thriller that has become new x-men readers like myself have grown to acctually care about these characters and fear for there fate! something i never did in the prior run because all the characters were about as interseting toothpaste and at times i acctually prayed they were killed.

Okay...Xena. Gothca.

[Zombienorthstar]

Please, like any of that will be addressed. It will be glossed over, as always. They haven't even shown any real character development or grief for all the students that died on the bus. When they get around to having all the characters act like human beings over tons of their friends being murdered, then get back to me. So far, I'm just not seeing it. We need a one-shot story where the 'New X-Men' see a psychiatrist over this.


Yeah apart from that whole funeral issue...where all they did was deal with the kids on the bus...

[Vaal]

Great Lakes Avengers mini.

That's what I'm reminded of.

Is it possible to take a parody and make a 'serious' version of it?

[Metallurgique]

When the original New Mutants were killed by the Beyonder, it took almost five or six issues for them to finally deal with the aftermath. During which time, I might add, they ended up under Emma's telepathic influence and among the original Hellions in Massachusetts. Only Dani and Warlock did not go with them..

The "retro" cover of #27 suggests that we might be getting into a larger arc similar to that one.

But the bottom line is, it's time to actually make this a real story and not just death for shock value every issue.

It might not be too bad to quit it with the crossovers for awhile, Marvel - they seem to have dramatic repercussions on any ongoing stories for this book.

[Vaal]

It might not be too bad to quit it with the crossovers for awhile, Marvel - they seem to have dramatic repercussions on any ongoing stories for this book.
Well that's the one thing that's been consistant with both runs: NXM has been the only book that's really consitantly effected by the events in the other X-books.

[Beast]

Yeah apart from that whole funeral issue...where all they did was deal with the kids on the bus...
Having a funeral issue, isn't character development. It's just a 'Look at how many people the writer killed, isn't the book cool now' moment.

[Metallurgique]

When you have that many titles, the repercussions of what happens in one have to land someplace - and it seems like Academy X has had it's knees cut out from under it by having to reconcile all of these developments which were clearly not intended for it.

I took a LONG hiatus from comics, and before a month ago I hadn't read an X-book since 1994.

The best years of the X-books, IMO, were those before the major crossovers, or during the smaller crossovers such as the Mutant Massacre and the Fall of the Mutants. After Inferno, the number and frequency of crossovers started to rise as Marvel discovered how many books they could sell with these storylines. But IMO, devoting four or five issues a year to crossovers greatly cuts down on the time the characters get to tell their own stories. Team ups and crossovers are cool, but they've been overused and IMO, they've hurt the franchise as a whole. As has the constant recycling of Magneto.

[Zombienorthstar]

Having a funeral issue, isn't character development. It's just a 'Look at how many people the writer killed, isn't the book cool now' moment.

What i was responding to is the line where you said 'They haven't even shown any real character development or grief for all the students that died on the bus'...there has been grief...i saw a whole new side of Rockslide in that issue alone (character development)...

the reason we havent had as much reflection is because the kids as still dealing with the fall out of other attacks...but saying theirs been no grief for the dead bus students is just silly...

[riotgear]

Yeah and the specifics of your idea still have the same reprucussions as it being a dream...it still makes all the character development and deaths for nothing...

It being a danger room sequence or a dream makes no difference.

Not necessarily... if this is a Danger Room sequence that the team has been going through this whole time, there could be a severe sense of betrayal against Emma. Think about it. As the team members are "killed", they are pulled out of the sequence, only to realize that what they've gone through is only a "game". And when the survivors come to the end of the sequence, Emma has her "team" picked, but they want no part of her. A lot like the manipulations that she pulled back in the day with Firestar and Magma. Heck, even one of the covers (#27, with them in the graves) was a tribute to the New Mutants issue with Emma's manipulations on the New Mutants and Hellions.

[Zombienorthstar]

Not necessarily... if this is a Danger Room sequence that the team has been going through this whole time, there could be a severe sense of betrayal against Emma. Think about it. As the team members are "killed", they are pulled out of the sequence, only to realize that what they've gone through is only a "game". And when the survivors come to the end of the sequence, Emma has her "team" picked, but they want no part of her. A lot like the manipulations that she pulled back in the day with Firestar and Magma. Heck, even one of the covers (#27, with them in the graves) was a tribute to the New Mutants issue with Emma's manipulations on the New Mutants and Hellions.

Nope...i still think it cheapens the entire run...

[Vaal]

Except the solicits imply that fighting the big pink deus ex machina will cause Forge to tear the universe a new Fry-hole (incidentally introducing a whole new echelon of physics to the normal 'alternate timeline creation' schema of the Marvel Universe.)

Even Emma, as evil as she is couldn't think up something that convoluted.

Edit: No, zombienorthstar, the fountain of student blood cheapened the entire run. Making that go away and never come back would redeem it.

[Zombienorthstar]

Except the solicits imply that fighting the big pink deus ex machina will cause Forge to tear the universe a new Fry-hole (incidentally introducing a whole new echelon of physics to the normal 'alternate timeline creation' schema of the Marvel Universe.)

Even Emma, as evil as she is couldn't think up something that convoluted.

Edit: No, zombienorthstar, the fountain of student blood cheapened the entire run. Making that go away and never come back would redeem it.

I think 'the fountain of student blood' as you put it...hasnt cheapene the run..its justified the new direction. As far as im concerned powerless the bus full of students were useless...but by doing this they serve a purpose.

[riotgear]

I think 'the fountain of student blood' as you put it...hasnt cheapene the run..its justified the new direction. As far as im concerned powerless the bus full of students were useless...but by doing this they serve a purpose.

Wow, that's a "Soylent Green" statement...

[Zombienorthstar]

Wow, that's a "Soylent Green" statement...


Oh be fair to the writers..if the depowered kids had trundled off in the bus...and survived...that would have been a big waste of a potential story.

[Vaal]

Oh be fair to the writers..if the depowered kids had trundled off in the bus...and survived...that would have been a big waste of a potential story.
Has depowerment EVER stuck?

Blowing up the bus screwed many, many stories for when this whole stupid Decimation thing is fixed.

And no potential story came from blowing them up. They got all of two sentences from Stryker's 'master plan' and the reasoning there was shady at best.

"Oh, the God-robot didn't have a word to say about them, but clearly, I know more about my pink future-god, so I killed them too." There wasn't even a real reason for them to die in the book.

Its all just blatantly been about trying to make the book dark and hopeless.

[Legato]

God willing if some new, and actually good, writers take over this book any chance that this piece of sh*t is gonna be retconned?

Like most of Morrison's X-Men run.

[Zombienorthstar]

Has depowerment EVER stuck?

Blowing up the bus screwed many, many stories for when this whole stupid Decimation thing is fixed.

And no potential story came from blowing them up. They got all of two sentences from Stryker's 'master plan' and the reasoning there was shady at best.

"Oh, the God-robot didn't have a word to say about them, but clearly, I know more about my pink future-god, so I killed them too." There wasn't even a real reason for them to die in the book.

Its all just blatantly been about trying to make the book dark and hopeless.

So your saying that this story is bad if you assume that Marvel totally reneages on its promise to not repower anyone...i have to have more faith in the company than that...more fool me maybe.

Why is everyone forgetting the great funeral issue? The bus kids got their dues.

[Vaal]

So your saying that this story is bad if you assume that Marvel totally reneages on its promise to not repower anyone...i have to have more faith in the company than that...more fool me maybe.
I'm actually just praying they do because Decimation was bad for the X-books.

Then again:
Edit: blast, how do I do spoilers?

And if you really think Professor X is going to stay depowered... heh.

Why is everyone forgetting the great funeral issue? The bus kids got their dues.
My post was about the fact that they didn't serve a single purpose inthe book itself. I know that in the meta, they died to make the New Mutants all dark and broody and 1990's Liefeld.

[Faded]

Spoiler tags = [spoil]
;)

Oh be fair to the writers..if the depowered kids had trundled off in the bus...and survived...that would have been a big waste of a potential story.

I really don't follow you here. ;)

[Mariah]

So your saying that this story is bad if you assume that Marvel totally reneages on its promise to not repower anyone...i have to have more faith in the company than that...more fool me maybe.

Why is everyone forgetting the great funeral issue? The bus kids got their dues.
I loved the emotion on Rockslides face. It actually made him grow as a character a little. Truth be told, I do like how they portray the kids that are left. I just don't think they should have a core group, and leave out the rest of the kids. And is Medina the new regular penciler?

[Callisto]

Having a funeral issue, isn't character development. It's just a 'Look at how many people the writer killed, isn't the book cool now' moment.


please beast, wait and see. I'm sure there will be an issue devoted to the students dealing with the deaths of there friends, i just believe with all the violent deaths happening so quickly there hasn't been much time for the students to fully absorb it all.

[Callisto]

Has depowerment EVER stuck?

Blowing up the bus screwed many, many stories for when this whole stupid Decimation thing is fixed.

And no potential story came from blowing them up. They got all of two sentences from Stryker's 'master plan' and the reasoning there was shady at best.

"Oh, the God-robot didn't have a word to say about them, but clearly, I know more about my pink future-god, so I killed them too." There wasn't even a real reason for them to die in the book.

Its all just blatantly been about trying to make the book dark and hopeless.


the reason they were depowered in the first place was because they were deemed USELESS by marvel. So the odds of them getting there powers back is quite unlikely seeing as marvel clearly is more interested in seeing these characters destroyed to lessen the once oversized mutant population.

[Metallurgique]

Trouble is, that overpopulation happened as a result of the very same issues that ultimately led to the bus explosion - the creation of too many random mutants to serve immediate purposes, which were then forgotten - mostly through the continuing development of Genosha after the X-tinction Agenda. The "Genosha as Mutant homeland" coupled with the proliferation of titles and the villians and innocent mutant bystanders needed to fill them just led to more and more "cannon fodder" and "shock value."

[Vaal]

the reason they were depowered in the first place was because they were deemed USELESS by marvel. So the odds of them getting there powers back is quite unlikely seeing as marvel clearly is more interested in seeing these characters destroyed to lessen the once oversized mutant population.
Yeah, if you can't make 'splosions, Joe Q has no use for you. I'm looking at you Wolf Cub. You're next.

Who needs flavor in context to mutants in the MArvel Universe when we can clear it all away to make room for more mutie 'foightin'?

[Zombienorthstar]

How long do you think before we get a New X-Men cover homage of this cover

http://image.milehighcomics.com/istore/images/fullsize/56757119524.39.GIF

[Vaal]

Fits more in theme with what's going on with Astonishing, actually.

[Affinity]

Yeah, unless Emma is okay in Astonishing and five years down the line they bring in the psycho Emma once more.

I for one am sick of this "Emma as a teacher: FAIL" thing. The Hellions, okay. Synch...ooookay....and then this whole massacre being HER fault? That's ridiculous. They just want to point fingers at someone and that's wrong. Just as wrong as Psylocke wearing a thigh high, plunging v-necked dress to a funeral.

[Zombienorthstar]

Yeah cause its not like shes pitting the students against eachother or subjecting one of them to mental torture is it?:D

[Callisto]

the last one if very out of character but the first one is clearly no different then what charles did when training his x-men.

[chickrockguitar]

Horrible, horrible, horrible previews... :mad:

[Vaal]

I for one am sick of this "Emma as a teacher: FAIL" thing. The Hellions, okay. Synch...ooookay....and then this whole massacre being HER fault? That's ridiculous.
Don't forget Negasonic Teenage Warhead.

Emma just doesn't have a good track record of keeping students alive. Combine this with Xavier's Intitute's propensity for exploding at a moment's notice and you've got a recipe for gratuitous tragedy.

I know part of her character is wanting to be a teacher, but... Frost needs to not be Headmistress. Teach a telepathy class or something -- somewhere she has fewer charges for her teaching mojo to eat.

Karma could be Headmistress.

They just want to point fingers at someone and that's wrong.
Well, she is the one with the track record and the mean streak.

It'd help if the school wasn't also host to the biggest tragedy magnet in the MU this side of Peter Parker and *now* part of a concentration camp.

[Callisto]

Karma could be Headmistress.

karma? lmao you can't be serious?:D :D

[Vaal]

karma? lmao you can't be serious?:D :D
She handled The Pargons, Alpha Squadron and the lower class for a good while, alone and on a personal level. I don't think she'd make a bad Headmistress. Emma couldn't even keep the Hellions in line; that is to say, she barely tried with the exception of the Hellions mini.

[Metallurgique]

Why do people doubt Emma's worthiness as a teacher?

Well...

- She allowed Empath to keep Firestar in thrall to be one of the Hellions for an unknown amount of time, until the Cheyenne Mountain debacle in Uncanny 193.

- She used Empath to keep Magma in thrall to protect Selene's interests and to keep Magma's substantial abilities (she was the most powerful of all of the Hellions) for herself.

- She had no trouble mentally manipulating 3/4ths of the original New Mutants to get them to do what she wanted while they were in a traumatized state after their encounter with the Beyonder.

- She put her original Hellions in harm's way countless times - often for no real reason (that's the case with their encounters with The New Warriors at least).

- She has her own machinations for her "new Hellions" though that squad has now been disbanded. She may or may not have begun manipulating them, or at least giving them extreme preferential treatment as far back as New Mutants Vol.2 #10.

- She emotionally and psychologically manipulated X-23 to get rid of her - something absolutely unconscionable by any standard. Her actions toward X-23 were far more offensive than Rahne's involvement with under-age Elixir.

- She put X-23 in harm's way repeatedly during her "big battle" - a scenario which further put her at odds with three students she seemed to have lost interest in - the Stepfords.

- She likewise had no interest in students who weren't particularly powerful, like Sammy Pare. A teacher should teach, not determine who is worthy of their teaching.

- She booted Dani because she was de-powered despite Dani having been a reliable and long-serving teacher. Dani was teaching American History - not anything related to powers and abilities.

- She's routinely undermined other members of the faculty.

- She never hesitates to manipulate people psychologically, but she wouldn't force Jay to accept Elixir's healing touch. Funny, that. Of course, we might not know the end of that arc yet.

- She's never dressed "appropriately" for anything other than a Victoria's Secret catalog.

--------

Face it, Emma is a disaster as a teacher. In the real world, she wouldn't get anywhere near a classroom. Yes, the Marvel Universe is not the real world - but since when should we suspend our beliefs of how a school should work?

[Zombienorthstar]

Why do people doubt Emma's worthiness as a teacher?

Well...

- She allowed Empath to keep Firestar in thrall to be one of the Hellions for an unknown amount of time, until the Cheyenne Mountain debacle in Uncanny 193.

- She used Empath to keep Magma in thrall to protect Selene's interests and to keep Magma's substantial abilities (she was the most powerful of all of the Hellions) for herself.

- She had no trouble mentally manipulating 3/4ths of the original New Mutants to get them to do what she wanted while they were in a traumatized state after their encounter with the Beyonder.

- She put her original Hellions in harm's way countless times - often for no real reason (that's the case with their encounters with The New Warriors at least).

- She has her own machinations for her "new Hellions" though that squad has now been disbanded. She may or may not have begun manipulating them, or at least giving them extreme preferential treatment as far back as New Mutants Vol.2 #10.

- She emotionally and psychologically manipulated X-23 to get rid of her - something absolutely unconscionable by any standard. Her actions toward X-23 were far more offensive than Rahne's involvement with under-age Elixir.

- She put X-23 in harm's way repeatedly during her "big battle" - a scenario which further put her at odds with three students she seemed to have lost interest in - the Stepfords.

- She likewise had no interest in students who weren't particularly powerful, like Sammy Pare. A teacher should teach, not determine who is worthy of their teaching.

- She booted Dani because she was de-powered despite Dani having been a reliable and long-serving teacher. Dani was teaching American History - not anything related to powers and abilities.

- She's routinely undermined other members of the faculty.

- She never hesitates to manipulate people psychologically, but she wouldn't force Jay to accept Elixir's healing touch. Funny, that. Of course, we might not know the end of that arc yet.

- She's never dressed "appropriately" for anything other than a Victoria's Secret catalog.

--------

Face it, Emma is a disaster as a teacher. In the real world, she wouldn't get anywhere near a classroom. Yes, the Marvel Universe is not the real world - but since when should we suspend our beliefs of how a school should work?

Sounds like my headteacher...

[Legato]

Face it, Emma is a disaster as a teacher. In the real world, she wouldn't get anywhere near a classroom. Yes, the Marvel Universe is not the real world - but since when should we suspend our beliefs of how a school should work?

The real world dont have people running around in costumes saving people nor mutants running a school.

Like you said Marvel isn't the real world so why should we try to compare it to the real world? It's like trying to compare Professional Wrestling to MMA, one is fake while the other is real.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Another great Preview. I can't wait to see this. I loved how Jay in his dying managed to scribble down NIMRO as he tried to warn his friends. Its gonna be a good issue and I can't wait.

[Affinity]

Don't forget Negasonic Teenage Warhead.

Emma just doesn't have a good track record of keeping students alive. Combine this with Xavier's Intitute's propensity for exploding at a moment's notice and you've got a recipe for gratuitous tragedy.

I know part of her character is wanting to be a teacher, but... Frost needs to not be Headmistress. Teach a telepathy class or something -- somewhere she has fewer charges for her teaching mojo to eat.

Karma could be Headmistress.


Well, she is the one with the track record and the mean streak.

It'd help if the school wasn't also host to the biggest tragedy magnet in the MU this side of Peter Parker and *now* part of a concentration camp.
Yeah, I see how Emma just ISN'T good with students and being LARGE AND IN CHARGE...and so the writers need to stop. I'm a HUGE Emma fan but I hate her as headmistress (...how, again?) and I hate her with Scott. Headmistress of the Massachusetts Academy made sense, the entire dream of Xavier's School? No, that's just wrong.

And then people blow kids up and blame it on Emma.

[Vaal]

And then people blow kids up and blame it on Emma.
Well it was mostly Icarus on the one. Emma just comes up with the assist. She laid that rock up right over the basket for Jay to dunk.

Where Emma has become inexplicably (okay, maybe it was obvious) evil, Jay became inexplicably stupid.

Maybe that's Nimrod's real power. You know how Omega Red has those death spoores? Nimrod has 'out of character' spores.

[Callisto]

She handled The Pargons, Alpha Squadron and the lower class for a good while, alone and on a personal level. I don't think she'd make a bad Headmistress. Emma couldn't even keep the Hellions in line; that is to say, she barely tried with the exception of the Hellions mini.


emma has done far more teaching wise than karma has done in her miserable lifetime in comics.

[Zombienorthstar]

Yeah, I see how Emma just ISN'T good with students and being LARGE AND IN CHARGE...and so the writers need to stop. I'm a HUGE Emma fan but I hate her as headmistress (...how, again?) and I hate her with Scott. Headmistress of the Massachusetts Academy made sense, the entire dream of Xavier's School? No, that's just wrong.

And then people blow kids up and blame it on Emma.


To be fair the school used to get blown up just as much when Xavier was headmaster...

all the troubles been since the school went public...which makes sense and is hardly a good reason to blame emma.

[Faded]

Another great Preview.

Preview is awesome, isn't she? :D

[Vaal]

emma has done far more teaching wise than karma has done in her miserable lifetime in comics.
And has the body count to prove it!

Just as the Five... er Four... er Three-in-One!

[Beast]

emma has done far more teaching wise than karma has done in her miserable lifetime in comics.
Well, that's because she's nearly twice Karma's age. Since Emma's nearly 40. ;)

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Preview is awesome, isn't she? :D


Yep....times like these I'm happy to be an X-Fan. I really can't wait to read the dialogue for Tony in this issue.

[Foley]

You know, people keep saying the X-mansion got blown up all the time. That's true. But how many students did Xavier lose compared to Emma? I'm thinking Emma's gotta be up 10-15 easily.

[Zombienorthstar]

You know, people keep saying the X-mansion got blown up all the time. That's true. But how many students did Xavier lose compared to Emma? I'm thinking Emma's gotta be up 10-15 easily.

THe thing is we notice Emma's students deaths because they're characters....its recognised that a LARGE number of students were killed during Planet X...though i cant recall if anyone died during Riot at Xaviers apart from Quentin Quire and Sophie Cukoo...

I think people will say emma has lost more because we simply dont know the exact figure for Xavier's losses...though id wager it was more than Emma.

[Beast]

THe thing is we notice Emma's students deaths because they're characters....its recognised that a LARGE number of students were killed during Planet X...though i cant recall if anyone died during Riot at Xaviers apart from Quentin Quire and Sophie Cukoo...

I think people will say emma has lost more because we simply dont know the exact figure for Xavier's losses...though id wager it was more than Emma.
Doubtful. Considering she lost all of her students on Genosha. ;)

[Vaal]

Having Emma Frost as your teacher is the equivalent in terms of life expectancy of smoking a carton of cigarettes a day.

Attending Xaviers is the equivalent of having asbestos bedsheets.

Attending Xaveir's while its run by Emma Frost is the equivalent of eating that Japanese Puffer fish for lunch everyday after it's been prepared by a novice student chef that doesn't particularly like you.

[Foley]

Having Emma Frost as your teacher is the equivalent in terms of life expectancy of smoking a carton of cigarettes a day.

Attending Xaviers is the equivalent of having asbestos bedsheets.

Attending Xaveir's while its run by Emma Frost is the equivalent of eating that Japanese Puffer fish for lunch everyday after it's been prepared by a novice student chef that doesn't particularly like you.

Post of the year. :D