Do The GLA Count As "Avengers"?

[Young Avenger]

Do they? I know that they used the Avengers name in there group but were they ever officially recognize as Avengers?

P.S. I am aware they are the Great Lakes X-Men now.

[LordSplendor]

The Great Lakes Avengers were encouraged by the Avenger Hawkeye as a joke to defend the Midwest and mistook his comments as a right to use the Avengers' name.

Whether the GLA count as "actual" Avengers is a complex one. The Avengers as they are now do not like them using the name and have tried to order them to cease and desist. However, they have been trained by Avengers who gave them permission, fought with the East and West coast branches on several occasions, and when the Scarlet Witch summoned all Avengers in the final issue of JLA/Avengers, the GLA showed up.

[Will.S]

Personally, I wouldn't count them.

[Den]

I would say they have earned the title by blood, sweat, and tears...
Heck, Mr Immortal alone has died for the team dozens of times ;)


I guess a lot depends on if you consider the Blue Beetle, Booster Gold, Guy Gardner etc crew deserved their title of "Justice League" in the 80s.

[Young Avenger]

The Great Lakes Avengers were encouraged by the Avenger Hawkeye as a joke to defend the Midwest and mistook his comments as a right to use the Avengers' name.

Whether the GLA count as "actual" Avengers is a complex one. The Avengers as they are now do not like them using the name and have tried to order them to cease and desist. However, they have been trained by Avengers who gave them permission, fought with the East and West coast branches on several occasions, and when the Scarlet Witch summoned all Avengers in the final issue of JLA/Avengers, the GLA showed up.

Nice copy and paste of the information on Wikipedia.

[Mariah]

Nice copy and paste of the information on Wikipedia.
He could be the avengers version of DDM. Very nice guy who knows everything about everything.

[Alan2099]

Wasn't it just the Stark foundation that funds the Avengers who sent them a cease and desist?

[TimmyTony]

In a word, nope...

[jade_nova]

In their eyes they are Avengers.

[shaunyc56]

Nice copy and paste of the information on Wikipedia.


oooooohhhhhh burn....

[Sean Walsh]

Technically, the ol' Injustice League (Clock King, Major Disaster, Multi Man, Big Sir, Cluemaster) were considered Justice Leaguers.

So sure, the GLA are Avengers!

[Miss Kitty Fantastico]

Well one can assume from the cease-and-desist noted above that, legally, they're not entitled to call themselved Avengers, and insofar as 'the Avengers' are an institution with the legal right to protect their 'brand', no, the GLA aren't.

That said, so long as being an Avenger means more than signing up and hanging out with other Avengers, so long as heroism and determination and humanity matter, so long as there's haphazard evil that needs to be equally-haphazardly fought, so long as saving lives through serial suicide, two-dimensionality, weight gain, extremely limited teleportation, and hazelnut-flavoured invincibility counts for something, then yes, Virginia, there is a Santa- I mean, yes, they're Avengers.

[GreatLakesAvengers]

Pre-Slott, I'd say there counted as Avengers. They were trained by Avengers and have even teamed up with both branches of Avengers on a few occassions.

Post-Slott, I'd say they're not welcome to call themselves Avengers.

[kel25]

P.S. I am aware they are the Great Lakes X-Men now.

Hate to break it to you but they are NOT the GLXM anymore. They are once again the GLA.

I’ve always felt that they are Avengers but at the same time they are the Avengers great shame. Think of it as a friends kid brother that hangs around. They look up to you but annoy you. You don’t want them around. At the same time you really cannot tell them to drop dead because people look at you as being moral and it would ruin your reputation.

[StoneGold]

Technically, the ol' Injustice League (Clock King, Major Disaster, Multi Man, Big Sir, Cluemaster) were considered Justice Leaguers.

Yes, but they were also formed and sanctioned by Max Lord, who was the guy in charge of the JL back then. Whereas the closest the GLA got to any sanction was running with Hawkeye for a bit.


Let's put it this way, if Pete Rose plays with a bunch of guys on a softball field, that doesn't make them the Reds.

[Kirk G]

Though I was looking forward to seeing them accepted as the GLA team of the Avengers, I think it is fairly clear that the mainstream of the Avengers have never recognised nor interacted with them to any great degree, other than in about West Coast Avengers #49 or so....

So I would say they use the name, but aren't really Avengers.... Hawkeye's desires not withstanding....

[Cthulhudrew]

The Great Lakes Avengers were encouraged by the Avenger Hawkeye as a joke to defend the Midwest and mistook his comments as a right to use the Avengers' name.

That's not exactly accurate. Hawkeye didn't encourage them as a "joke," he actively and eagerly took on the role of their leader (with Mockingbird's encouragement), and at least for a brief period of time, Hawkeye considered them to be very legitimate Avengers.

For whatever reason (editorial issues, presumably), Hawkeye soon returned to the West Coast Avengers and the GLA were largely forgotten for a while. The next time they showed up was when they fought against Terminus, with Mockingbird as their leader.

They seemed to have been considered official enough as Avengers up until post-Heroes Return, when Kurt Busiek sort of dismissed them somewhat as not being "official" Avengers (though, notably, he does have them turn up in the JLA/Avengers series, but then so do a lot of JLAers that aren't necessarily "official" either). Then, more recently, in GLA: Disassembled, the Maria Stark Foundation sent them a "cease and desist" letter.

Of course, the Avengers proper had disassembled at that time (post Disassembled) and so it could be construed as the Maria Stark Foundation's letter referring to that, and not to the GLA specifically as being illegitimate. (As in, "since Stark disbanded the Avengers, *all* Avengers everywhere must be disbanded. Possibly a West Coast team- had one existed- would have received a similar letter.)

Now that the Avengers are a team again, is it possible that the GLX could become recognized again? Who knows. They are supposedly returning to the GLA title soon, from interviews I've seen.

[Cthulhudrew]

Though I was looking forward to seeing them accepted as the GLA team of the Avengers, I think it is fairly clear that the mainstream of the Avengers have never recognised nor interacted with them to any great degree, other than in about West Coast Avengers #49 or so....

I don't know- they were shown training in the East Coast Avengers mansion in an issue of Avengers (#309), and Cap and the Human Torch both seemed to consider them legitimate enough in West Coast Avengers #64.

Of course, once Hawkeye and Mockingbird left them, they do seem to have sort of been written off (even Hawkeye and Mock could be construed as having lost hope and given up on them, frankly), so it could be that it was only the presence of those two that led anyone to believe they were remotely legit.

[ocelotrevs]

I'll just say that they were originally called the Thunderbolts (i think)

I don't think that they're classed as Avengers, because they had that cease and desist. Meaning that the main Avengers don't see them as actual Avengers, and are quite pissed at them for thinking so.

[Kirk G]

Of course, once Hawkeye and Mockingbird left them, they do seem to have sort of been written off (even Hawkeye and Mock could be construed as having lost hope and given up on them, frankly), so it could be that it was only the presence of those two that led anyone to believe they were remotely legit.


Aw, both Hawkeye and Mockingbird are dead.... what'da they know?:rolleyes:
(Oh, that's right, most of the GLA are too....)

[Sam T.]

Aw, both Hawkeye and Mockingbird are dead.... what'da they know?:rolleyes:
(Oh, that's right, most of the GLA are too....)


Hawkeye isn't dead...

[DDM]

No. It's like comparing a Beatles cover band to the original Beatles. The Great Lakes Avengers are not & never have been official Avengers in any capacity. The Guardians of the Galaxy are official Avengers compared to the Great Lakes Avengers.

[StoneGold]

I'll just say that they were originally called the Thunderbolts (i think)

That came significantly later, and they were the Lightningrods. That started off as a one-off joke in Deadpool when the Avengers were dead, although Busiek had the Rods attack the T-Bolts after they had been revealed for the Masters of Evil.

[Alan2099]

I imagine they'd get the kind of respone D-man got if they showed up to an Avengers meeting, "Who teh heck made them Avengers?" of course if Hawkeye was there, he'd stick up for them, but I imagine most of the others wouldn't.

[Dermie]

Pre-Slott, I'd say there counted as Avengers. They were trained by Avengers and have even teamed up with both branches of Avengers on a few occassions.

No, they were not officially considered Avengers--which is why they were not included in #1-3 of AVENGERS vol.3 by Busiek and Perez. They are certainly Avengers associates, but they never had any official standing with the team.

[ocelotrevs]

That came significantly later, and they were the Lightningrods. That started off as a one-off joke in Deadpool when the Avengers were dead, although Busiek had the Rods attack the T-Bolts after they had been revealed for the Masters of Evil.
So my big piece of info was crap. Great.
I remember now.

[Cthulhudrew]

No, they were not officially considered Avengers--which is why they were not included in #1-3 of AVENGERS vol.3 by Busiek and Perez. They are certainly Avengers associates, but they never had any official standing with the team.

John Byrne (their creator) certainly seemed to consider them official Avengers, and it really wasn't until Busiek came on board that we were given any reason to consider them anything but. It was nothing that had ever come up explicitly, obviously, but the circumstantial evidence was pretty strongly in favor of them being official.

Again, though, when Kurt took over is when it suddenly became an issue of "the guys aren't really Avengers," and that has continued to this day. The matter certainly wasn't helped by the GLA's adopting of the "Lightning Rod" moniker in the wake of the Avengers disbanding (the first time, post-Onslaught), and their eagerness to capitalize on the success of others (first with Avengers, then TBolts, X-Men, etc.)

[Grazzt]

Again, though, when Kurt took over is when it suddenly became an issue of "the guys aren't really Avengers," and that has continued to this day. The matter certainly wasn't helped by the GLA's adopting of the "Lightning Rod" moniker in the wake of the Avengers disbanding (the first time, post-Onslaught), and their eagerness to capitalize on the success of others (first with Avengers, then TBolts, X-Men, etc.)

They weren't really capitalizing on the success of the X-Men, though. They just realised the entire team was made up of mutants. Why not throw an X into their name?

[dazzler_slave]

I personally consider them Avengers and always will. The mini and the one shot are stored with my Avengers titles. They call themselves Avengers and Hawkeye and Mockingbird were on the team so that's good enough for me! :)

[Haunt]

they aren't Avengers. they are professional wannabes. it's why they were created. it's why they went on to imitate the Thunderbolts and X-Men.

[Dermie]

John Byrne (their creator) certainly seemed to consider them official Avengers, and it really wasn't until Busiek came on board that we were given any reason to consider them anything but.

Not true. They never had any official status in Byrne's issues--they were supporting characters in the book, but they were never acknowleged by the Avengers as official members in any of Byrne's issues, and issues of the Roy Thomas run specifically stated that they were not officially members.