A Tale of Two Dennises

[Hintermann]

I am sure a lot of you have heard of Hank Ketcham's comic strip character "Dennis the Menace". He has featured in newspaper strips, comic books, TV shorts etc. In most parts of the world including India where I come from, 'Dennis the Menace' means just one thing....this little blond American boy Dennis Mitchell, created by Ketcham. But not so in the UK, where he is (not so well) known as simply "Dennis"....with good reason.

This is cos the Brits have their own version of Dennis the Menace, a gawky character from Beano comics. When it became known that there were two Dennis the Menaces, there was some question as to which one came first. After a good deal of research,the American kid won by 3 days!

It was discovered that Hank Ketcham's Dennis the Menace first appeared as a strip on 12th March 1951; by sheerest coincidence, the UK character made his debut only 3 days later on the 15th! He was created by a local artist named David Law and is totally different from the other Dennis. When the existence of the 2 Dennises became known to all concerned, it was agreed that Law could not possibly have 'stolen' the Ketcham character's title and so both were allowed to retain the same name. And thst's how it remains to this day, over 50 years later!

[Agentum]

Intresting, i have not heard of that english version, what is that comic about, is the story similar to the american Dennis?

[Hintermann]

Intresting, i have not heard of that english version, what is that comic about, is the story similar to the american Dennis?

Similar? Not by a long chalk. I suppose it is a case of each to his or her own, but the British DtM is practically unknown outside the UK, whereas as American one was once an international comic megastar. here is a link on the UK DtM:

http://www.paulmorris.co.uk/beano/strips/dennisthemenace.htm

[Rob Allen]

Here's another page about the British Dennis, written by a former habitue of this very board:

http://www.toonopedia.com/dennisb.htm

[Hintermann]

I don't have all the details with me but in 1979 someone researched a bit deeper into the origins of the two Dennis the Menaces, looking at the times before the actual publication of the two comic titles. In the end, it was proven beyond all doubt that the American DtM was concieved before his UK counterpart and so justifiably remains the "senior" in terms of comic chronology.

[T GUy]

What about Archie Andrews and Sgt. Rock?

[Hintermann]

What about Archie Andrews and Sgt. Rock?

I checked this. I am not familiar with Sergeant Rock (either of them) but it looks like the US version preceded his British SAS counterpart by around a decade (1959 against 1970).

I have been reading Archie Comics for almost 40 years. Archie Andrews, the redhead American teenager, debuted in 1941; the British character with the same name seems to be a ventriloquist's dummy from a radio talk show that started almost 15 years later.

I don't think these two cases can be as easily dismissed as coincidence like Dennis the Menace.

[joe bloke]

Peter Brough, the ventriloquist who introduced Archie Andrews to British radio listeners ( " Educating Archie " - 6th June 1950 ), named the puppet after a Scottish bloke he served alongside in the war ( the second one ).

Brough's career kind of floundered somewhat once they decided to put Archie on television - it turned out that he was actually a bit shit at ventriloquism and you could see his lips move. He and the puppet retired from public view in 1958.

Incidently, in 1951, somebody stole the Archie Andrews doll, and the concern this created amongst the British public was unprecedented. The police actually treated the theft as A KIDNAPPING. In the end, the "kidnapper" felt so guilty about what he'd done that he sent a note to The Daily Mirror telling them that he was sorry and that they could find Archie in a box at the Lost Property Office of Kings Cross Station.

The doll was sold a few years back for £58,000. Several seperate heads went for, I think, somewhere around £30,000 each. That's a lot of money for a wooden kid.

Sgt. Rock, which run in the weekly VALIANT comic, was a direct attempt to do a British version of Robert Kanigher and Joe Kubert's brilliant US vehicle. It was rubbish.

[T GUy]

Hi, Joe! Sgt. Rock, which run in the weekly VALIANT comic, was a direct attempt to do a British version of Robert Kanigher and Joe Kubert's brilliant US vehicle. It was rubbish.

I only ever came across Sgt. Rock, S. A. S. in a Lion Holiday Special. Perhaps Lion merged into Valiant (like everything else did...) and carried Rock o'er?

But my - very vague, admittedly - recollection of it recalls no real similarity with the K'n'K classic. Perhaps I need to re-read it thirty years on...

Oh, and have you and Hintermann any notes on the 'Iron Man' strip in The Eagle? Again, I only recall this from one place, the Annual from 1966 (I think - there's a photo' of a water-skier on the cover) - I recall something akin to Robot Archie, maybe more of a humanoid type.

I always forget one of the four when remembering these counterparts.

[Hintermann]

I only recall this from one place, the Annual from 1966 (I think - there's a photo' of a water-skier on the cover) - I recall something akin to Robot Archie, maybe more of a humanoid type.

The only "Robot Archie" that I recall from the mid-to-late 60s is one where a "Crush" agent makes robot replicas of Archie & rest of the gang (who are all P.O.P Agents in the plotline). The replicas of Reggie, Betty, Ronnie & Jughead are accidentally destroyed right at the start, but the Archie Robot is let loose to impersonate him and steal P.O.P secrets. However, the real Archie cottons on to the plot, captures & immobilises the robot and replaces it with himself, thus penetrating the enemy headquarters and defeating them. A good comic.

[joe bloke]

Hey, T Guy. Hey, Hinterman. I don't know too much about Iron Man, other than he was a super-strong humanoid robot, created by one Professor Wentworth Farrad, originally drawn by Gary Embleton, who made his first appearance in the Boy's World comic in the early ' sixties, where he stayed until Boy's World merged with the Eagle in 'sixtyfour, and continued until cancellation when Eagle merged with Lion in 'sixtynine. It wasn't the best of efforts.

As for Archie, if you want to catch a couple of great takes on the character - hey, let's face it, the original strip wasn't the bestest, was it? - then may I suggest Grant Morrison and Steve Yeowell's ZENITH books four and five ( " WAR IN HEAVEN " ), in which the titular character finds himself caught up in a grand battle between the heroes of a number of alternate realities against a common foe ( the Maxi-man ). Archie puts in an appearance ( " Aciieeeeeed! " ), as do adult version of Billy the Kat and Katie, among others, although the names are changed. Also, Alan Moore's ALBION, which features a number of great old British comic book characters - Archie, the Spider, the Steel Claw - given the old Moore shake-up.

And, yes, you're right, Sgt Rock WAS Lion, and not Valiant. There's a mistake on my part, fella. And it's similarities with it's American namesake are more to do with individual characters than plot-line. A far superior war strip, a classic regardless of whichever side of the Atlantic you're on, would be Battle Weekly's Charlie's War by Pat Mills and Joe Colquhon. Fantastic stuff. Check it out.