What If Joel Schumacher + Tim Burton Traded Places?

[TMC1982]

In all honesty, how do you think Joel Schumacher would've handled the Joker, Penguin, and Catwoman while Tim Burton handled Riddler, Two-Face, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, and Bane?

[Dustin Griffin]

In all honesty, how do you think Joel Schumacher would've handled the Joker, Penguin, and Catwoman

Well, he put two Jokers in Forever. He probably couldnt have f*cked up The Penguin's origin any worse than Tim Burton did in Returns. And as for catwoman, it probably would have been closer to the catwoman solo movie (noe playing in Hell's Cineplex).

while Tim Burton handled Riddler, Two-Face, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, and Bane?

Well, since he never read the comic, his riddler probably would have been like the T.V. Riddler. technically Two Face was in his first movie. He couldnt possibly have f*cked up Mr. Freeze worse than Schumacher did. He probably could have handled Poison Ivy's special effects well. And if someone had explained to him who Bane was, then - He couldnt possibly have f*cked up Bane worse than Schumacher did.

He did a good job on Sleepy Hollow I thought, so his Scarecrow might have been interesting. Corpse Bride made me vomit from my eyeballs though so he's gonna have to kick ass on his next movie to win my respect back.

[colossus34]

Well, he put two Jokers in Forever. He probably couldnt have f*cked up The Penguin's origin any worse than Tim Burton did in Returns
.

This is one thing I don't get...why is everyone pissed at Penguin in Returns? The comic portrayal is boring and very pety in my opinion. At least the movie version is a more interesting, dynamic and cooler character.

[Damo]

Yeah, I don't get that either. Seriously? Is there the original origin that much better? His dad died from pneumonia so his mom made him walk around with an umbrella all the time?

[Dustin Griffin]

This is one thing I don't get...why is everyone pissed at Penguin in Returns? The comic portrayal is boring and very pety in my opinion. At least the movie version is a more interesting, dynamic and cooler character.

Comic Origin: Oswald Cobblepot, cursed with an obsessive mother is forced to carry an umrella to school everyday. The other students make fun of him and ridicule him and therefore, a social outcast, all he has for friends are the birds in his mothers petshop. A kid named Sharkey begins to call him "Penguin" due to his nose and weight problem and forces him to dress in a tuxedo causing all of the other kids to laugh at him, then kicks the crap out of him. Oswald reverts to his aviary and his books and grows a kinship with the birds after seeing a "runt" of a bird defend himself against the others. He takes up pugilism and studies martial arts. After training for months, Cobblepot confronts Sharkey and beats him within an inch of his life, knocking all of his teeth out. feeling triumphant from his victory, Cobblepot returns to the petshop to find all of his bird friends dead, killed by Sharkey, and the walls painted with their blood. The result was madness, and the birth of the Penguin. Later, as a crime lord, the Penguin tracked down Sharkey and found that he had replaced his teeth with metal shark-like teeth. The penguin force fed him fish and liquor, then welded his teeth shut and fed him to a bunch of lions. (secret Origins Special 1, 17 years ago)


Movie origin: Penguin boy is born with webbed hands.

[Devil May Care]

What if Joel Schumacher & Judomaster swapped?

I hate Joel Schumaker.

[Paul Dee]

For me it's not so much the origin but the general betrayal of the character. Instead of being an intelligent, devious crime lord Burton portrays him as nothing more than a puppet for Shreck's schemes. Burton completely wasted the potential in the Penguin. But then, I've never had any time for Batman Returns; it's not *that* much more of a betrayal of the 1989 movie as Batman Forever to be honest.

[the_coldest_sun]

Comic Origin: Oswald Cobblepot, cursed with an obsessive mother is forced to carry an umrella to school everyday. The other students make fun of him and ridicule him and therefore, a social outcast, all he has for friends are the birds in his mothers petshop. A kid named Sharkey begins to call him "Penguin" due to his nose and weight problem and forces him to dress in a tuxedo causing all of the other kids to laugh at him, then kicks the crap out of him. Oswald reverts to his aviary and his books and grows a kinship with the birds after seeing a "runt" of a bird defend himself against the others. He takes up pugilism and studies martial arts. After training for months, Cobblepot confronts Sharkey and beats him within an inch of his life, knocking all of his teeth out. feeling triumphant from his victory, Cobblepot returns to the petshop to find all of his bird friends dead, killed by Sharkey, and the walls painted with their blood. The result was madness, and the birth of the Penguin. Later, as a crime lord, the Penguin tracked down Sharkey and found that he had replaced his teeth with metal shark-like teeth. The penguin force fed him fish and liquor, then welded his teeth shut and fed him to a bunch of lions. (secret Origins Special 1, 17 years ago)


Movie origin: Penguin boy is born with webbed hands.


Well, there's a very even contrast and compare of the two origins...

[Titan76]

Well, there's a very even contrast and compare of the two origins...
Just what I was thinking.

Edit: As for the topic, I think if Schumacher had done the first two Batman films there wouldn't have even been a third or fourth film for Burton to do.

[Paul Dee]

Let's not forget Burton helped produce Batman Forever so he's not completely free from blame.

[the_coldest_sun]

For me it's not so much the origin but the general betrayal of the character. Instead of being an intelligent, devious crime lord Burton portrays him as nothing more than a puppet for Shreck's schemes. Burton completely wasted the potential in the Penguin. But then, I've never had any time for Batman Returns; it's not *that* much more of a betrayal of the 1989 movie as Batman Forever to be honest.

You obviously werent paying attention to the movie. It was the Penguin who used Max to get what he wanted. Once Penguin surfaced from the sewers, he went straight to working on his intial plan: murdering the first born children of Gotham. He wasnt trying to find out who his parents were at the Public Archives, he was getting the list of children's names. But yes, Max did draw his attenion away when he pushed to get him into the mayor's office. However, Penguin's plan from the start was to kill the first-borns.

I can see why many people hated this movie, but I for one absolutely LOVE it and the version of the Penguin portrayed in it.

As for the topic, I would have LOVED to seen a Burton style Two-Face, especially if it was to be played by Billy Dee Williams. I dunno, I kind of love the "making it your own" approach to licensed characters. I dont view these movies as definative versions (and yes I can see fanboys griping because its what the masses will see and believe to be "true"). I see them as another person's take on it. To me, these movies are like cover songs. I think its awesome when a familiar song is done in a different way, but still captures that feeling I loved about the original... especially when it rocks!

But...thats just me.

[Paul Dee]

You obviously werent paying attention to the movie. It was the Penguin who used Max to get what he wanted. Once Penguin surfaced from the sewers, he went straight to working on his intial plan: murdering the first born children of Gotham. He wasnt trying to find out who his parents were at the Public Archives, he was getting the list of children's names. But yes, Max did draw his attenion away when he pushed to get him into the mayor's office. However, Penguin's plan from the start was to kill the first-borns.

He still comes across as being in Shrecks shadow though somehow; he's not believable as a criminal mastermind in any way. Burton places too much emphasis on his monstrous qualities instead.

[BoSoxJay]

Burton's filmns are fun in that they display Batman in a very iconic hoorror movie type setting. It's to bad he didn't just adapt "Red Rain" or "Bloodstorm" because that's really the version of Batman you are getting with Tim Buton and I'm fine with that. I love the mood, setting, etc.

"Batma and Robin" sucked royal ass but "Batman Forever" would have been my favorite of the first three if Michael KEaton had been playing Batman and the dialogue had been a bit better. Batman did cool athletic stuff, there was a lot of action, and he acted like a superhero instead of a vampire stalking the shadows and doing little else.

[Dustin Griffin]

I see them as another person's take on it. To me, these movies are like cover songs. I think its awesome when a familiar song is done in a different way, but still captures that feeling I loved about the original... especially when it rocks!

But...thats just me.

Well, since Burton hasnt read the books his take on the characters is much more akin to a "Imagine If...Stan Lee" than a cover song. Kind of like covering Purple Haze if you had only read the name of the song and seen Jimi Hendrix on TV.

[Dustin Griffin]

Well, there's a very even contrast and compare of the two origins...

Your right, I left out the master stroke that his father was alive and Pee Wee Herman in the movie.

[OverMaster]

Yeah, I don't get that either. Seriously? Is there the original origin that much better? His dad died from pneumonia so his mom made him walk around with an umbrella all the time?

Damo... a baby raised by underground penguins. How lame is that? How could the penguins give milk to a newborn? How could they prevent him from freezing to death until the Circus guys found them?

I mean, next to that, even the Ten-Eyed Man's origin looks excellent.

[NotSuper]

Yeah, I have to agree that the movie origin is pretty campy. And isn't it a little convenient that a child that looked like a deformed bird would be raised by birds (in a sewer no less)? And why did Burton put missiles on their backs near the end? What was up with that?

But, then again, none of the Penguin's origins really stand out to me. There's nothing that really captures a person's imagination. Compare that with the origins of the Joker, Two-Face, and the Scarecrow.

[Hellcow]

If they had swapped, there would have only been one Batman film ever.

[Paul Dee]

And why did Burton put missiles on their backs near the end? What was up with that?

I know, that's pure Schumacher.

[Nefarius]

Damo... a baby raised by underground penguins. How lame is that? How could the penguins give milk to a newborn? How could they prevent him from freezing to death until the Circus guys found them?

I mean, next to that, even the Ten-Eyed Man's origin looks excellent.

I agree that his movie origin has enough plot holes but i loved movie version of Penguin.It was a dramatic hero and i felt sad when he died at the end.But i never want to see this origin in comics.The old-fashion crime boss version was right for comics.