X-Men #185 Summary/Spoilers

[Volk1]

words:milligan
art:larocca

Love and Death

x-men:Cyclops,Frost,Colossus,Iceman,Rogue,Havoc,
new x-men: Rockslide,Bling!
baddies: Poccy, Ozymandias, Pestilence, Gambit/Death, War/Gazer
other:Sunfire/Famine, Val Cooper, Mystique, Pulse

*Gambit will still be referred to Gambit, not Death*

We start off with Havoc, Iceman, Rogue, Mystique, Pulse, and Bling! barging into the room where Poccy and Gambit/Death are. Rogue blasts Poccy, Gambit slaps Rogue. Remy's about to pounce on her when he stops as Rogue asks him "don't you know who I am?" Iceman decides to ice-blast Gambit at this time....

Havoc and Poccy duke it out, in turn destroying the antidote (the blood),while Gambit manhandles Iceman! War crashes into the Institute demanding Famine/Sunfire. He takes quick work of Rockslide, while Emma senses War's in the house...Poccy's ship is about to take off to care of repairs, Rogue is distraught about Gambit, Gambit is having trouble understanding what love is. Poccy tells him "an emotional response with some limited evolutionary benefit". a great line imo :p Gambit's about to kill Rogue when Mystique intervenes, saves her, and goes to escape along with Pulse...back in the Mansion, Emma confronts War, tries to use her telepathic powers on him, doesn't work and is subsequently blasted by War....Cyclops blasts him from behind: "get away from my girlfriend." *scott's so corny* :rolleyes: War still demands Sunfire when Shiro appears and fireblasts War declaring "tell your master he's lost a horseman".War leaves declaring the war will continue...Shiro thanks Emma then faints. Emma says that he's so weak, it's possible he may not live...

Havoc and company leave the ship thanks to Iceman's ice-slide, Ozymandias decides to stay on the ship mentioning that the Sphinx has many chambers and that it could take years for Poccy to find him...Iceman tells Rogue there'll be a way to help Remy....Go back to Gambit telling Poccy that he realizes that he's still Gambit...Gambit and Death at the same time and that part of him still loves Rogue. Poccy will not have any of that and threatens Gambit that any more talk of love will initiate more torturing and tests....Poccy has a plan up his sleeve and we next see them barging in a United Nations meeting. Poccy declares that since the antidotes have been destroyed, he will give humans one week to exterminate 90% of the human population. After, the remaining humans and mutants will duke it out for Earth. If they do not comply, he will unleash his fourth and final Horseman Pestilence - and that it will be set loose and kill all humans with a plague...

Zooom to New Mexico where we see Alex, Scott and Valerie Cooper talking in a O*N*E Sentinel Base...They seriously need to work together now that Poccy has set his deadline. They fear that the human elite will take Poccy on his deal and they must find a way to defeat them. She introduces the Summer Brosthers to two new, unpredictable Sentinel models Crazy Train and War Machine...(They look different from the Sentinels we're used to seeing, ones yellow, the other's green, and the yellow one kinda looks like Nimrod a bit...)

Back in the Sphinx, Poccy asks Pestilence if he/she is really ready for her role. Because of Gambit's wishy-washiness, he must know if Pestilence is truly no longer who they once used to be..."How do you feel when I say the name....Polaris?" "I feel nothing, master. Absolutley nothing." !!!!!! :)

Back story:Riddles of the Sphinx part 4
Lorna is strapped into a machine. She's yelling at Poccy that they're enemies...he's trying to convince her that he can give her her powers back. He tells her that she's "ripe for change", that she wants her powers back and a peace of mind...She asks what happened to the Leper Queen. He had interviewed her first for Pestilience but was rejected. She wanted the role "too badly", whereas Polaris is just perfect.....

**
I really liked this issue for some reason. Lorna's back! I like how the back story provided a glimpse of how she came to be Pestilence and that she rejected the role at first, still showing us she's got some heart in her still.

Havoc was awesome in this issue and he and Scott were on equal footing for the first time since who knows when..

Rogue's sorrow is bleh to me...time to move on girly....but what surprises me is why Gambit and Polaris can act or look hesitant and why Shiro was allowed to completley turn his back on Poccy. Is Poccy's power not as strong to keep his Hosemen obedient and in check anymore? It just seems so easy for them to be so unloyal..."thanks for the powers Poccy, see ya!"

Sunfire needs to be on an X-book. The guy is too cool for school....

7/10

[dotdotdot]

i can't wait for this to be over

[Brian M.]

Great summary Volk.

My biggest beef w/ this story is that it just doesn't feel like it's epic enough. It doesn't feel important enough to warrant Apoc. I keep feeling we should be turning a corner and the big bad dramatic stuff should be happening soon but I'm just not getting that emotional kick that I should be from a story like this. I love the art and Sal is doing a good job. I think if you replace the villian of the story w/ someone lighter than it works.

Milligan's writing just isn't my style. I feel like he can't write serious stuff now. I could be wrong, I loved the Further Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix but this stuff is missing with me.

[Beast]

This was actually a fairly decent issue. I loved Poccy for once being classic X-Factor and sinister in nature. Going to the U.N. and ordering that mankind cull 90% of it's population is something that perfectly fits with Apocalypse as a character. Especially when he gives them the ultimatum of saving 10% or being exterminated by his Meta-Plague. Shame that Milligan's getting him at the end, instead of from the beginning.

[Faded]

Thanks Volk, love!

I liked how you had the cast and other details at the top. That was a nice touch. ;)

[R Krippler]

I enjoyed the issue. I like that Gambit is actually fighting the transformation. I didn't like how Rockslide didn't get in any offense, and just got manhandles. Also I want to know what they did/are going to do with Leper Queen.

[BYC]

Apocalypse sounds like Apocalypse again, but rest it just sounds horrible. It's nothing new, but all these Horsemen betraying Apoc is getting old. Death may not be Death. Famine is Sunfire again after like 4 issues. I can't recall how many other Wars and Deaths there has been. Polaris is a villain...again...

The resolution is probably gonna be something lame like Sinister giving the UN the cure, while planting the seeds for his own plots. Death and Pestilence join forces and free themselves from Apoc (who loses more Horsemen...as usual). Yet another spectacular Apoc failure.

[streator]

sounds like sunfire and gambit didn't get enough of the "servant of apocalypse" juice.

any mention of daap?

[Beast]

I rather doubt that Gambit's going to get out of anything too easily. Given he's no longer on any teams with the upcoming reload. However, he may trade one Master for another, if you get my drift. ;)

[R Krippler]

sounds like sunfire and gambit didn't get enough of the "servant of apocalypse" juice.

any mention of daap?

Yeah, it seems that he wasn't kill but got projected somewhere during the blast when Apocalypse arrived.

[tunasammiches]

Ugh...I hated this issue. The dialog was so aweful and forced. I don't get why Peter Milligan's X-Men writing is so bland and lifeless while his Deadgirl series can be so good in the same token. I want X-Statix back.

[rilokyle]

I liked this issue for the most part, and especially because we FINALLY saw the return of Polaris!! She looked pretty sickly though when she took off the face mask- like the pestilence is actually in her body now. And I'm glad the backstory makes us sympathize with her, as she was turned into a horseman against her will. And seeing as she's in the new x-men lineup, I think its safe to say that she'll shed this persona and return to the x-men. It remains to be seen what kind of effects this will have on her mentally. Hmmm.

I agree with a lot you when you say that this story just doesn't seem epic enough. I feel like it's almost there, but not quite. The horsemen have been taken out pretty easily and I just don't feel that there's any real threat. The threat level has risen though with Apocalypse demaning humans to kill 90% of them within the next week, but we all know that's not going to happen.

I am excited though for the next issue to see where the new sentinels come into play, and what's in store for Lorna. I also liked the scene with Emma: it made yearn for her to be redeemed in Astonishing X-Men, as I really like her sass and vulnerbility. And Havok was really cool in this issue too. Where has he been hiding these past few years? He's been so whiney lately, so its a nice change of pace to seem him taking the lead and reminding us that he's powerful and strong. As for Sunfire, I'm glad he's back to normal again, although I felt it was so rushed. He was evil for like two minutes, but whatever; I'm glad he's not a villain. And Gambit? Uggggg. He had terrible dialogue this issue- I feel like this plot has not been well-played out, but I guess we'll have to wait and see where Milligan goes with Gambit.

All in all, a decent issue. Art was excellent!

[Volk1]

Great summary Volk.
My biggest beef w/ this story is that it just doesn't feel like it's epic enough.

Hey thanks UT. And I agree with the un-epic like feeling of this arc. Poccy really seems to be just going about things nonchalant-like and not like the Earth-destroyer he could possibly be. But, despite the drawbacks, I admit this is my fave issue of his run thus far. Alas, he only has one left!

Shame that Milligan's getting him at the end, instead of from the beginning. Totally agree Beast. He could have expounded on Poccy and the consequences of his actions on the X-team into perhaps a better run for him if he would have had Poccy before, I'm thinking prior to HoM. But I don't know, with HoM complicating things, perhaps it would not have mattered at all.....

Thanks Volk, love!
I liked how you had the cast and other details at the top. That was a nice touch. Aww always count on me Fadey...you make me giggle like a tickle-me Elmo :p

The resolution is probably gonna be something lame like Sinister giving the UN the cure, while planting the seeds for his own plots. I pray that scenario does not come into play. We need Poccy to go out in style, hopefully in a destructive one. I actually think it's going to be quite the sight when we see the Summers Brothers pilot those crazy new Sentinels and attack the Sphinx.

I just have to say again, that I really liked this issue. Granted, it does feel like Milligan's entire run was sub-par at best, and this, his final arc not at all grand and epic. But from what he have of him, I feel like this issue is one of his best on X-Men. I really enjoyed his characterizations. Finally, it seemed like everyone was acting how they were supposed to. Havoc imo, has become a force finally and it's just awesome seeing him as a true captain. And the Shiro/Emma scene seemed real to me. I hope Shiro doesn't bite it next issue....

Iceman didn't act stupid and his little remark to Rogue about "we're going to try and help Gambit" I thought was a cute little snippet and an awareness of Bobby actually being a caring and concerned teammate. Maybe this leads to a Rogue/Bobby relationship? The only grating aspect were Rogue's remarks about Gambit. I'm just like, let it go Rogue, but if Milligan is given any due, at least he's breaking up R&R for now. I'm not opposed to the relationship at all, I just think it's time for a break.

It's a shame Milligan's other issues were not written as good as this one IMO. From what the X-Men have been lately, you've gotta take what you can get, and I say X-Men #185 is one of the better issues as of late... :cool:

[Faded]

Aww always count on me Fadey...you make me giggle like a tickle-me Elmo :p

Awww...and I'd bum rush to K-Mart to pick you off the shelves like a crazed soccer mom on steroids. :D

Off topic-But what is the shock with NA 18?!?! And I love your return to a Preview avatar. :)

On-topic: I'm actually looking forward to seeing whats up with the Leper Queen. Haven't read the issue yet, mind you, but her and Polaris are really intriguing me.

[drwho]

I say every X-Man should become a horseman so thay can get suped up new powers and then easily betray Apocalypse. Personally, pretty sad that its looking like 3 of Apocalypses henchmen are going to end up betraying him.

[Volk1]

Awww...and I'd bum rush to K-Mart to pick you off the shelves like a crazed soccer mom on steroids.

Off topic-But what is the shock with NA 18?!?! And I love your return to a Preview avatar. :)

On-topic: I'm actually looking forward to seeing whats up with the Leper Queen. Haven't read the issue yet, mind you, but her and Polaris are really intriguing me.

Lol..consider me sold! :)

But yeah omg! New Avengers #18!! Preview makes an appearance. You know I had to go back to her...I actually feel normal again lol. SPOILERS....there's a splash page where Spider Man, Spider-Woman, and Shield are facing a gigantic screen with a lot of depowered mutants on the monitor..I mean they're showing everyone from Magneto and Polaris to Forearm and Phantazia and guess who's name not only appears but actually gets screen time? Preview! Right in between Postman and Prodigy. I was hoping that these were mutants who were just de-powered and not dead, but then Tag's on one of the screens :mad: Yet, I still have hope that she's alive and well! That's all that gets me through the day...hope *sniff* :( lol... No, but it's an awsome page to see a lot of obscure mutants on-screen...

As for Leper Queen, Poccy mentions that she's going to serve him when he sees fit...so I guess she's her slave for now....

[Sparta]

I'm just like, let it go Rogue, but if Milligan is given any due, at least he's breaking up R&R for now. I'm not opposed to the relationship at all, I just think it's time for a break.

Although I agree that Gambit and Rogue need time apart, I think it makes perfect sense for Rogue to be acting that way. I mean, it's only logic that someone would freak out if they suddenly see their boyfriend being transformed into a Horseman of Apocalypse. It's not something you can let go of that easily...

[Stagier]

Haven't read the issue, but the cyclops line might be an homage to the first movie, where scott tell logan to "stay away from his girl". just a thought.

[Blackcat]

Lol..consider me sold! :)

But yeah omg! New Avengers #18!! Preview makes an appearance. You know I had to go back to her...I actually feel normal again lol. SPOILERS....there's a splash page where Spider Man, Spider-Woman, and Shield are facing a gigantic screen with a lot of depowered mutants on the monitor..I mean they're showing everyone from Magneto and Polaris to Forearm and Phantazia and guess who's name not only appears but actually gets screen time? Preview! Right in between Postman and Prodigy.

Where can I see this preview??

[f4faith]

Thanks for the summary.

Finally, it seemed like everyone was acting how they were supposed to.

Except for Gambit - who's been slaughtered character wise all through the arc and most of the run. Yes I agree that finally everyone else is finally acting more like they should have this entire run but it's a little too little and too late. Polaris will redeem herself too - how convenient for that both Sunfire and her will change back so easily.

an awareness of Bobby actually being a caring and concerned teammate. Maybe this leads to a Rogue/Bobby relationship?

God I hope not. That would be soooooo original after the movie and Ultimate X-Men and it hasn't work for me in either of those that well.

The only grating aspect were Rogue's remarks about Gambit. I'm just like, let it go Rogue,

Why? It's not like he wasn't brainwashed and did exactly what the X-Men did to him with Mystique - ie was willing to trust the villain claiming to help despite the recent past (and in Mystique's case with him very recent). Only they seem to be very hypocritcal in their ability to decide who they will talk to and won't.

but if Milligan is given any due, at least he's breaking up R&R for now. I'm not opposed to the relationship at all, I just think it's time for a break.

A break would be fine if it was written well - none of this has been written well.

I say every X-Man should become a horseman so thay can get suped up new powers and then easily betray Apocalypse. Personally, pretty sad that its looking like 3 of Apocalypses henchmen are going to end up betraying him.

But poor Gambit didn't even get a suped up power. He traded explosives for "creating deadly gas" - first I have no idea how that relates to his old power like most of the other Horsemen and it's it just shows he didn't need a new power.

I liked this issue for the most part, and especially because we FINALLY saw the return of Polaris!! She looked pretty sickly though when she took off the face mask- like the pestilence is actually in her body now. And I'm glad the backstory makes us sympathize with her, as she was turned into a horseman against her will.

She starts out objecting but we never see her final response once Apocalypse ends his speach about her being perfect.

I agree with a lot you when you say that this story just doesn't seem epic enough. I feel like it's almost there, but not quite.

Why should it? We just found out in Cable/Deadpool that Cable doesn't even think of Apocalypse as a serious threat and brought him back for that reason - the X-Men will defeat him and he did it to "bring mutants against a common foe" - which is silly logic like this story too. Most of the 198 wanted to join Apocalypse not fight against him.

I am excited though for the next issue to see where the new sentinels come into play, and what's in store for Lorna.

And here's where I could care less. The whole O*N*E and the 198 has been done so poorly and the X-Men have looked like idiots for letting the governement use them as a concentration camp while it is ignored in Astonishing altogether that I could care less and knowing Polaris will be a book just makes it lame. And I want Milligan to explain his logic in the backup story about the leper queen. Wasn't she a mutant hater? Why would she want so badly to work with a mutant? It's nonsense.

As for Sunfire, I'm glad he's back to normal again,
although I felt it was so rushed. He was evil for like two minutes, but whatever;

Which is why Gambit conveniently staying that way is all the more lame. I am glad about Sunfire though.

All in all, a decent issue. Art was excellent!

This was a tad better than last issue just because something finally happened but this whole arc has been massively bad character and story wise.

[Dr Ray Palmer]

Ugh, this arc is so, so bad. As somebody else asked, Why is Milligan's X-Men so bad when his other books have been so good?

Many writers have written a spineless, mopey, dopey Rogue over the years, but I think Milligan's is the wimpiest, doormattiest, most ineffectual Rogue I've ever seen. Bleah. I'm all for breaking up Rogue and Gambit -- I've been wanting that to happen for years, actually, because I think their relationship became bad for both of them as characters ages ago -- but this is just ... well, a mess.

[Chiasm]

The saddest thing about this arc is that there are some bits of potential in here. But it mostly gets lost in horrible dialogue, out of character actions, and some really horrible plot devices to go along with the the few good things.

Meantime I'm just going to keep telling myself

*its almost over*
*its almost over*
*the bad man is going away*
*its almost over*
*its almost over*

[Teamballin]

Great job my man, I don't think that will be the last we see of the Queen tho.

[Flameworthy]

I'm so glad Sunfire is back to normal!!! I can't believe I'm saying this, but thank you Milligan! Now if Shiro can just survive the rest of this arc, everything should be peachy. I'm still hoping he joins one of the teams.

[larroca fan]

the comics are late this week for me so i won't read the issue till sometime, so how is larroca's art looking? can anyone scan some different pages of the issue for me ? if you can't scan them, then thanks anyway.

[Traser]

As for Leper Queen, Poccy mentions that she's going to serve him when he sees fit...so I guess she's her slave for now....


Possible she'll be a hound like Caliban was...who knows. Or she'll just fade away if the next team who uses Apoc doesnt want to bother with her.

Great Synopsis earlier btw..

[Madrox84]

Sounds like another rubbish issue, at least it's almost over...

I'll probably get a copy tomorrow...

[Keith_Martineau]

I don't usually resort to basic statements such as this but...

God in heaven this arc is pure crap. It sucks. Completely.

Yeah, Apocalypse was kinda cool at the U.N. and yeah, finally we get Cyke and Alex on equal footing---but so F'n what?
The whole plot is just utterly absurd with terrible character motivations, and nobody acting like they're even thinking at all. Milligan isn't even thinking clearly here.

Okay, so Apocalypse defeated the Sentinels. Okay, lets throw a couple new models at him (and I'm so utterly disappointed in Sal for doing a straight up Evangelion ripoff on those new designs.)
But, HOW did Apoc defeat the Sentinels? By Sunfire making everyone hungry and the pilots losing their minds. Then the Sentinels were just taken out cause they had no pilots. If Sunfire fall under his influence again, the new fangled Sentinels won't stand any better chance. It's stupid.
And these backup stories supposedly explaining the motivations behind these guys becoming Horsemen has been horse-s***.
This is the worst kind of fly by the seat of your pants storytelling, and Milligan isn't even flying that fast. I'm actually angry that I'll be spending 7 dollars more to end this run before Carey starts.

[Chiasm]

Oh yeah, those new models. You know what would have been cool - seeing a model that was or kinda looked like a precursor to Nimrod since that would have gone along with X-continuity. But instead I for a minute thought they had mistakenly put a page from Transformers in the book. And "War Machine." Isn't that name already taken?

[Beast]

Oh yeah, those new models. You know what would have been cool - seeing a model that was or kinda looked like a precursor to Nimrod since that would have gone along with X-continuity. But instead I for a minute thought they had mistakenly put a page from Transformers in the book. And "War Machine." Isn't that name already taken?
Jim Rhodes/War Machine is one of the heads of Sentinel Squad O*N*E, as seen in the mini-series. :)

[Volk1]

I don't usually resort to basic statements such as this but...

God in heaven this arc is pure crap. It sucks. Completely.

Yeah, Apocalypse was kinda cool at the U.N. and yeah, finally we get Cyke and Alex on equal footing---but so F'n what?
The whole plot is just utterly absurd with terrible character motivations, and nobody acting like they're even thinking at all. Milligan isn't even thinking clearly here.
And these backup stories supposedly explaining the motivations behind these guys becoming Horsemen has been horse-s***.
This is the worst kind of fly by the seat of your pants storytelling, and Milligan isn't even flying that fast. I'm actually angry that I'll be spending 7 dollars more to end this run before Carey starts.

Ok..Milligan's run is not that great, we know that. But don't you think this was one of his better issues? I mean, I said it before, we have to take what we can get and I'd take this one issue over the majority of all the others...I mean, since you keep buying it, you might as well try to see the goodness in some of it.

And you're still going to get the rest of his run!

Score: Marvel - 763 Keith Martineau - 0

Marvel wins every goshdarn time.... :rolleyes:

[Chiasm]

Jim Rhodes/War Machine is one of the heads of Sentinel Squad O*N*E, as seen in the mini-series. :)

Damn. Thats one less thing to bash Milligan about. :p

I'm not reading any of the associated series, figured I'd wait for the TPB, assuming this whole thing hasn't been retconned out of existence by then.

[TimGunn]

I thought this one was better than some of his, it is actually kind of a nice set up for Apocalypse to really fail miserable and then later he can come back but do things differently and then it will be epic, How many X-men turned horsemen have to go back to being good before he figures things out and gets some dependable horsefolk.

Also Gambit's motivation for volunteering to be Death - STUPIDEST THING I EVER READ IN COMICS

I wonder why Marvel has been so obvious about Polaris going over to UXM in July? Seems like they could have saved the spoil, it's not like knowing Lorna will be in that title really makes me want to buy anything now, whereas knowing Gambit would eventually be Death did make people start picking up this arc

[Will.S]

the comics are late this week for me so i won't read the issue till sometime, so how is larroca's art looking? can anyone scan some different pages of the issue for me ? if you can't scan them, then thanks anyway.
His art still looks really good, consistent with his usual great work in this arc.

As for the issue itself, I'm still enjoying the ride. I liked the parts with the reveal of the new Sentinels as well as that great U.N. scene. War also put up a good scene here when he went through both Emma and that rock dude (name escapes me at the moment). What's interesting is that Gambit did resist the brainwashing and is moderately aware of Rogue and his new self. His threatening of Apocalypse is a good balance between his good side and evil side since he can straddle the line in the future and remain a horseman along with War.

I was disappointed to see his new powers though, I thought Apocalypse was going to boost his kinetic energy output and REALLY jack him up to New Son levels but he just seems to have power over some gases and maybe is a bit stronger. The reveal of Polaris being Pestilence wasn't really surprising but cool nonetheless because it had to be either her or Leper Queen. I didn't think Milligan would really show the reason why Lorna was picked over the Leper Queen but he does it nicely in the back-up story. It was good to see Alex take more command over the team as well as Cyclops and Colossus doing their thing.

Overall 8/10 and I'm anticipating the last few issues to see where it all ends up.

[Sentinel K]

This whole arc seems like it was written on the back of a beer-mat, with Milligan's own runny excrement, while exceedingly drunk.

Is it just me who thinks this is moving incredibly slowly, but at the same times seems rushed? Yeah i know that is a stupid thing to say but that is how its reading for me.

There seems to be a genuinely decent idea here, hidden underneath the poor storytelling, rubbish characterization, and s****y dialogue, unfortunately we'll never see it. :(

[Slumber Hulk]

Is seems Poccy's hold on his Horseman is really weak. I mean Wolverine didn't start resisting this quickly when he was Death and he is a hard nut to crack.

Theory/Speculation: If there is any explanation in the Horseman independence issue it is probably that Poccy has changed his tactics to that of a leader and has less faith in himself than before.

[Will.S]

Is seems Poccy's hold on his Horseman is really weak. I mean Wolverine didn't start resisting this quickly when he was Death and he is a hard nut to crack.

Theory/Speculation: If there is any explanation in the Horseman independence issue it is probably that Poccy has changed his tactics to that of a leader and has less faith in himself than before.
I suppose it depends on the Horsemen psychological condition and the x-editor's plans for them.

Gazer and Gambit seem more like long term horsemen wheras Sunfire and Polaris get a power revamp courtesy of Apocalypse and continue elsewhere although I'm unsure where they're going with Sunfire.

[Faded]

Not enjoying this at all--not the story, not the art. Ummm...I guess I like Pulse though and Sunfire. Oh and Pestilence Lorna's herpes face was really disgusting. Disgusting like I couldn't really look at that page very long without compulsively scratching my face.

I'm usually one of the lone Milligan's X-Men fans, but this arc has had few high points unfortunately. Hopefully the conclusion will end well.

[Domo Goddess]

Does anyone have a picture of Pestilence Lorna ?

I hope to see more LQ in future issues.

[Madrox84]

Two words: Pure Crap.

[steve2275]

atleast COLOSSSUS is getting a lil taller

[Faded]

Does anyone have a picture of Pestilence Lorna ?

I hope to see more LQ in future issues.

Here she is unhooded without her armor

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/8228/xmen231857pz.jpg

[Stagier]

Could Apoc have merged doop/daap (what's the difference?) and lorna together?

[steve2275]

Could Apoc have merged doop/daap (what's the difference?) and lorna together?
not a bad idea

[Speed]

not a bad idea Its a stupid idea.

What has happened to Salvador Larroca's art? Compare this to early X-Treme and its absolute crap. Its so uninspiring. Did he forget to put backgrounds in?

It was nice to see the old Rogue back (for one panel) when she blasted Apocalypse, but she reverted back to her whiny self when Gambit/Death smacker her around.
And the new Sentinels are just ridiculous.

[Sentinel K]

"Oh look, we've got two mega sentinals that look like transformers hidden away"

"We can defeat Apocalypse with those."

How convenient.

Quality Storytelling. :rolleyes:

[Zombienorthstar]

Its more predictable that device Reed Richards used against Galactus.

[sephirothskiller]

What about the part with Canada? I thought that was pretty cool. I wanna know why the U.S. wants to invade (or not invade) Canada. Civil War stuff for sure, and it gives us a good measure of where this is taking place timeline wise.

[Will.S]

"Oh look, we've got two mega sentinals that look like transformers hidden away"

"We can defeat Apocalypse with those."

How convenient.

Quality Storytelling. :rolleyes:
Well they should at least fare better than the other ones that fall apart with one hit.

[Linguini]

I hate Larroca's art.

[rilokyle]

I hate Larroca's art.
Although I dislike using the word "hate," Larocca's art has definately diminished since he started pencilling Uncanny and Adjectiveless. Alebeit, I do like his new style that he's sporting. I still like him, and he is always consistent and doesn't seem to miss deadlines, but I do have to wonder what happebed to his artwork?

Do you guys remember when he pencilled "Excalibur" for an arc? Or his Generation X/Gen13 one-shot? Now that is what I call great art. Sure, its typical 90s superhero art, but I definitely prefer his earlier work to his recent stuff.

http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/excalibur/excalibur107.jpg

http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/genx/genx-13-1.jpg

[estee]

What about the part with Canada? I thought that was pretty cool. I wanna know why the U.S. wants to invade (or not invade) Canada. Civil War stuff for sure, and it gives us a good measure of where this is taking place timeline wise.

Hey that's not fair, you Americans sold us those WMD's, in fact we're still paying for them too. :p

[steve2275]

i miss that sal style

[larroca fan]

yer i miss that larroca as well, him doing his own inks is'nt a great idea. But if you look out for new universal you maybe able to see that style comeback, larroca's been on the same book now for 2years with the same charcters and crap writers, austen and milligan, austen is better than milligan, i know i always say it must be milligan but i think it is, larroca must be bored of that crap that milligans writing so larroca just does'nt know where to start, he was on a 2 issues a month role for nearly a year and a half so he must be tied. I think larroca will come back in new universal he gets to revamp the title and the charcters i can't wait, so it's like x-treme x-men, he'll be redesigning the marvel world, yay.

[Vegetarian Goat]

Maybe this has been answered elsewhere, but if Apocalypse's main agenda is ensuring that the "strong" survive, then why does he keep picking mutants who REALLY aren't strong to be horsemen? Like, a wingless Angel, legless Sunfire, skinny little Caliban, skinny little Gazer, redonkulously crazy Polaris... a wingless Deathbird, a legless Ahab... and wasn't the first "War" missing some limbs too? Hey, maybe there's a trend here!!

[Hi-Fi]

http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/genx/genx-13-1.jpg

I love this silly book!!

Aw. I want Gen 13 back now! And Gen X too.. :(

[Lord S]

This series keeps dragging on and on...can't wait for it to be finally over in a month's time.

I'm sorry, I just didn't feel any emotion between Gambit and Rogue. Certainly not at the level it was shown during Uncanny #350, where she leaves him at the South pole.

So Apocalypse is going to wipe out 90% of humanity? Yeah right...they could at least present it in a more believable fashion.

In conclusion: This sucks.

3/10.

[Mitsaso]

Where's Doop??? :confused: :(

I yet have to see what his connection to Poccy is!

[fishtaco]

Maybe this has been answered elsewhere, but if Apocalypse's main agenda is ensuring that the "strong" survive, then why does he keep picking mutants who REALLY aren't strong to be horsemen? Like, a wingless Angel, legless Sunfire, skinny little Caliban, skinny little Gazer, redonkulously crazy Polaris... a wingless Deathbird, a legless Ahab... and wasn't the first "War" missing some limbs too? Hey, maybe there's a trend here!!You raise a good point, but after just re-reading X-Factor (1st Series) 24-26, I think that Apocalypse takes people that are weak or crippled and make them his Horsemen (and give them powers) because they are easier to exploit and take advantage of. For example, Warren would not have joined Nur if he still had his wings. He was desperate, and he was willing to do anything to fly again. The same can be said for his other Horsemen.

God, this is awful. One of the worst X-Men stories ever told.

[Sentinel K]

Where's Doop??? :confused: :(

I yet have to see what his connection to Poccy is!

F**k Doop.

He's a clunge.

[Brian M.]

You raise a good point, but after just re-reading X-Factor (1st Series) 24-26, I think that Apocalypse takes people that are weak or crippled and make them his Horsemen (and give them powers) because they are easier to exploit and take advantage of. For example, Warren would not have joined Nur if he still had his wings. He was desperate, and he was willing to do anything to fly again. The same can be said for his other Horsemen.

God, this is awful. One of the worst X-Men stories ever told.

Oh I wouldn't say that. I think it's smarter than Dino-Rachel. It's just that Milligan choose the wrong villian for this. I would have loved it if say he picked Ozy. Have the stone man try and do what his boss has done. It would work I think. Ozy uses Apoc's ship and collects his Horsemen. In the end it's revealed that Apoc is still dead and Ozy is the one doing it.

[The Fury]

Well, art still sucks.

Story is getting kind of interesting, due to the fact I did not expect Lorna to be Pestilence.

[Beast]

Where's Doop???

I yet have to see what his connection to Poccy is!
Daap doesn't seem to have any connection what so ever. Check the first two panels of the back-up story. Polaris and Leper Queen get teleported away, and Doop seems to go flying up into the sky again. So basically, he served no purpose. And we already know that Carey isn't using him. :p

[Faded]

yer i miss that larroca as well, him doing his own inks is'nt a great idea. But if you look out for new universal you maybe able to see that style comeback, larroca's been on the same book now for 2years with the same charcters and crap writers, austen and milligan, austen is better than milligan, i know i always say it must be milligan but i think it is, larroca must be bored of that crap that milligans writing so larroca just does'nt know where to start, he was on a 2 issues a month role for nearly a year and a half so he must be tied. I think larroca will come back in new universal he gets to revamp the title and the charcters i can't wait, so it's like x-treme x-men, he'll be redesigning the marvel world, yay.

Larroca's art being awful is not Milligan or Austen's fault.

[Hi-Fi]

Daap doesn't seem to have any connection what so ever. Check the first two panels of the back-up story. Polaris and Leper Queen get teleported away, and Doop seems to go flying up into the sky again. So basically, he served no purpose. And we already know that Carey isn't using him. :p

That makes the whole Daap thing even greater for me! I love the randomness. :D

[Beast]

That makes the whole Daap thing even greater for me! I love the randomness. :D
It's not even random, it's pointless.

[Sentinel K]

It's not even random, it's pointless.

I swear milligan must have been taking something. His run was worse than Austen's.

And i never thought that would be possible.

[Jellobay]

I swear milligan must have been taking something. His run was worse than Austen's.

And i never thought that would be possible.

Have you read Austen's? :eek:

[Faded]

That makes the whole Daap thing even greater for me! I love the randomness. :D

LOL I love randomness too!

But I still hope this isn't the last we see of Daap. :)

[Hi-Fi]

LOL I love randomness too!

But I still hope this isn't the last we see of Daap. :)

It wont!

He'll reappear when we least expect! :D

[Sentinel K]

Have you read Austen's? :eek:

Yeah. And then I wiped my arse with it.

It hurt. :(

[Mitsaso]

Daap doesn't seem to have any connection what so ever. Check the first two panels of the back-up story. Polaris and Leper Queen get teleported away, and Doop seems to go flying up into the sky again. So basically, he served no purpose. And we already know that Carey isn't using him. :p
:(

I still don't get this.
Doop was in space BEFORE House of M, so Poccylips DIDN'T put him there. So why would he sent him into space again?

I need some exposition, Milligan!! :evilangry

I bet Doop is behind Poccy's ressurection and everything. He's just pulling the strings of everyone, while remeining hidden. :p

But even like this, it fits with Milligan's intentional absurdity!

[Beast]

Nope, we learned Pocy's back because of Cable. Even if that reveal was horrid. ;) :D

[Volk1]

Daap doesn't seem to have any connection what so ever. Check the first two panels of the back-up story. Polaris and Leper Queen get teleported away, and Doop seems to go flying up into the sky again. So basically, he served no purpose. And we already know that Carey isn't using him. :p

I noticed this as I re-read and I thought the same thing? So what was the connection between Daap and Lorna?! Just to show Lorna was still crazy? I just.....I just don't understand :(


I swear milligan must have been taking something. His run was worse than Austen's.

And i never thought that would be possible. I don't want to say anything that drastic but, I think something was going on with Peter M. I mean, I just.....man I don't even know what to say. I think Milligan and Austen were bad in their own diferent ways......Milligan's run wasn't as long as Austen's, and Austen didn't have to deal with HoM, Decimation, and a horrid Black Panther/X-Men crossover. But still, it's just a point of a writer and characters/artist/genre not connecting. Pick your poison.

As UK'ers love to describe bad things, they were both shite

[Dr Ray Palmer]

I think Milligan and Austen were bad in their own diferent ways......Milligan's run wasn't as long as Austen's, and Austen didn't have to deal with HoM, Decimation, and a horrid Black Panther/X-Men crossover. But still, it's just a point of a writer and characters/artist/genre not connecting. Pick your poison.

For me, the really frustrating thing about Milligan's run is that we know it could have -- and should have -- been so much better. I mean, we all know he's capable of doing much better work. I didn't LOVE his X-Statix run, and didn't read it religiously, but there were things I liked about it, and I knew it was well-written even if it wasn't exactly my cup of tea. I don't think his X-Men is even well-written, which is weird.

In the interest of complete disclosure, though, I should probably admit that I could've been a single-issue voter on Milligan's run, because the only character I care about in his cast is Rogue. If he'd written her well, I could've enjoyed his run even if everything else was kind of crappy. But for me, his Rogue has been even lamer than Austen's Rogue -- which is quite an accomplishment -- which means he doesn't even have that single saving grace to redeem all the other problems. And again, at least with Milligan we know he's capable of writing strong female characters, and writing them well, because we've seen him do it before. I've never seen Austen write a female character well, so I wasn't surprised that his Rogue was bad.

[Volk1]

In the interest of complete disclosure, though, I should probably admit that I could've been a single-issue voter on Milligan's run, because the only character I care about in his cast is Rogue. If he'd written her well, I could've enjoyed his run even if everything else was kind of crappy. But for me, his Rogue has been even lamer than Austen's Rogue -- which is quite an accomplishment -- which means he doesn't even have that single saving grace to redeem all the other problems. And again, at least with Milligan we know he's capable of writing strong female characters, and writing them well, because we've seen him do it before. I've never seen Austen write a female character well, so I wasn't surprised that his Rogue was bad.

Yeah, I mean, to me Milligan is a writer that can push the envelope so to speak. But he didn't do that on X-Men. He didn't even try to be creatively weird and risky during his run. It was just plain ol' weird.... :(

[Beast]

Yeah, I mean, to me Milligan is a writer that can push the envelope so to speak. But he didn't do that on X-Men. He didn't even try to be creatively weird and risky during his run. It was just plain ol' weird.... :(
I just see it as proof that Milligan's quirky nature just doesn't work with established characters. Sure X-Statix was fairly good, because they were mostly new characters created by Milligan, and it was meant to be fairly tongue-in-cheek. :)

[Faded]

Personally Milligan's run is still leaps and bounds better than Austen's.

Austen's run, IMO, harmed the established characters more than anything. Milligan was more harmless IMO, and to an extent, a bit bland. (Personally I liked Bizarre Love Triange, parts of Golgotha, and What Lorna Saw--I might be missing an arc though). When it was/is bad, it seemed harmless to me.

As long as he doesn't rewrite origins or insert things into the past, I don't see the harm.

I overused the word 'harm' in this post. BEWARE!!!!!

[Sparta]

The problem with this book is the dialogue. I actually think a lot of Milligan's ideas are good in this arc.

- He's got good line-up, Havok, Polaris, Rogue, Gambit and Iceman are popular characters.

- The idea of having Gambit and Polaris as Horseman provides a very dramatic and emotional story that would have a lot of impact on the other 3 characters who have a strong connection with the two.

- I never liked Apocalypse, but I will acknowledge the fact that he's a powerful foe. There's a lot you can do with him.

However, the big problem is that the dialogue is stiff, which is a suprise because Milligan is usually on the ball with that kind of stuff. There's Sentinels too, where someone here pointed out to be too convinient. I couldn't agree more...because where's the struggle? Apocalypse has no chance in hell against not only an exteded line-up by adding Beast, Cyclops and Colossus but also having a dozen Sentinels, a couple of upgraded ones...not only that...Gambit and Polaris aka Death and Pestilence will most likely turn against him. The battle was already won 2 issues ago.

[FieryBalrog]

Why is Lorna a brainwashed villain. Again. What is this, the 24th time? AHHHHH!

This arc seems to be just terrible. I've only sporadically read it since BLT, which was also awful, but character motivations are still a mess, and none of it seems believable in the slightest. To boot:

Golgotha: cool idea
thousands of Golgothas in space: idiotic idea
Mystique trying to get with Gambit: dumb idea
X-men's reasons for letting Mystique on the team: terrible
Wild Kingdom: weak
Gambit's reasons for joining Apocalypse: nonsensical
Apocalypse's dialogue and general depiction: awful
Doop or Daap or watever the heck: pointless and arbitrary
No one figuring out Lorna lost her powers during M day: wtf
Lorna being a mind-controlled villain yet again: wtf

[Syzygy]

I don't hate Milligan's work, as many here seem to, but it is flawed. I still liked Bizarre Love Triangle, though. I guess you've just got to admire Milligan for his super-quirkiness, or not at all.

Problems:

1) When U.S. government Sentinels first come to the X-Campus, Cyclops, the X-men, and a bunch of students rush out to confront them. Nonsense. Cyclops is an accomplished tactician, and that is not what I believe he would have done. Rather, he would evacuate via the Morlock tunnels or the teleporter Gateway and then detonate the underground complex. Given what Rachael Summers has shared of the future, why not evacuate right away when the Sentinels arive?

2) The arrival of Mystique and Pulse is sheer lunacy. Neither of these duplicitous characters would come to the Institute at exactly the time it is being turned into a concentration camp. They would leave the country as soon as the Sentinels were activated.

3) More on Mystique: While I enjoyed the “Foxx” storyline, I think it’s rather dubious that when Mystique attempts to “join” the X-Men, nobody mentions that she murdered long-time ally Moira MacTaggert. I guess they’ve all forgotten about her, huh? That’s pretty hardcore. Not only do you get killed for being an X-ally, but the team decides it’s forgive and forget with your murderer. And by the way, isn’t Mystique a wanted terrorist? What about what she did in Europe when she took over Banshee’s X-Corp and set attack helicopters upon the people of Paris? Am I to believe the O.N.E. isn’t just going to barge in and arrest her? Not to mention the X-men could get busted for harboring a fugitive....

4) The “Sentinel surprise” of having manned robots was amusing, but improbable. Don’t the X-Men keep track of these things? It would take, quite literally, TENS OF THOUSANDS of people to construct those robots--workers, technicians, suppliers, contractors, subcontractors, soldiers, accountants, executives, officers.... Kind of hard to keep it top secret, you know? So there is literally no way Sage, for example, would not know of this. So: WHY DIDN’T SAGE TELL THE X-MEN THAT MANNED SENTINELS WERE COMING TO THE MANSION? Is she evil or just incompetent?

5) Ever since Tony Stark’s heart got pierced by shrapnel, he’s abandoned the munitions industry. Until now, apparently (see: Sentinel Squad ONE). Well, actually, since these Sentinels would have to have been under construction for years, Stark has apparently been at it for some time now. I don’t believe it. A staple of Stark’s character for years has been: no weapons except for his own role as superhero. Not only do I not believe Stark would do it, there’s been no explanation as to why he would make this change. It’s very, very unheroic. What’s next, Captain America, passing out hand grenades to street gangs?

6) In fact, the general tech level of the Sentinels is a little outrageous. Not only can they hover in place for hours (antigravity?) but they’ve got force fields strong enough to deflect Cannonball. There was a time only guys like the Wingless Wizard and Dr. Doom had tech like this. Now, it’s standard military equipment? What energy source do these things have? Why are Marvel civilians still filling up at the gas pump if the US government has tech and energy sources like this? That Sentinel force field could probably sustain a fusion reaction for cheap, limitless electricity for all Marvel civilians. And the batteries they operate on would make electric cars vastly more efficient than gasoline powered autos. I understand that villains like Dr. Doom and the Mandarin want to horde tech, but why does the U.S. government do it? Do they like fighting wars for oil, rather than (as here in our universe) simply believe it to be an unavoidable necessity?


Okay, now let's talk about Lorna Dane/Polaris. Here are two little known conclusions I've drawn in my role as comic continuity detective.

1) Lorna's hair is still green, even though she's been transmuted to human form. No human gene produces green hair. Ergo: Lorna must have some mutant genes left in her. This is likely true of the other humanized mutants as well. In Son Of M, the mutants exposed to the terrigen mists get variants of their old powers back, rather than entirely new or random ones. Why would this occur in this way unless they had some mutant potential left? (The Inhumans themeselves cannot predict what powers someone will get from the mists.)

2) Lorna Dane once had her magnetic powers stolen away by her "sister", Zaladane. Moira MacTaggert confirmed that Zaladane was indeed Lorna's sister; she had to be for the transferrence process to work. The clincher? Zaladane was killed by Magneto when she tried to steal his power. So Magneto killed one of his own daughters!

Peace,
Syzygy

[f4faith]

I don't hate Milligan's work, as many here seem to, but it is flawed. I still liked Bizarre Love Triangle, though. I guess you've just got to admire Milligan for his super-quirkiness, or not at all.

I didn't mind the first two issues of Bizarre Love Triangle either. If Milligan had Rogue get peeved and start doing something (even if some of it didn't work and some did) about her power issue from it - it could have really been a significant arc. More it could have even been played that it was Mystique's plan all along to upset Rogue enough to get her to do something more progressive about her powers - would have been far more Mystique like. But instead the last two issues went stupid with the Mystique vote and Rogue whimping out by going back to just being suspecious. I agree with almost all you points listed below though.

3) More on Mystique: While I enjoyed the “Foxx” storyline, I think it’s rather dubious that when Mystique attempts to “join” the X-Men, nobody mentions that she murdered long-time ally Moira MacTaggert. I guess they’ve all forgotten about her, huh? That’s pretty hardcore. Not only do you get killed for being an X-ally, but the team decides it’s forgive and forget with your murderer. And by the way, isn’t Mystique a wanted terrorist? What about what she did in Europe when she took over Banshee’s X-Corp and set attack helicopters upon the people of Paris? Am I to believe the O.N.E. isn’t just going to barge in and arrest her? Not to mention the X-men could get busted for harboring a fugitive....

Exactly but more, everyone also seems to forget in Dream's End Mystique herself was trying to let a disease loose to kill all humans. I do consider attempted genocide a pretty big deal and beyond Moria a deal breaker for allowing her on a team. And given that is what she tried to do to "save mutants" - it makes no sense since she is at the mansion that Mystique isn't the first person running out to Apocalypse wanting to join up to help him give mutants a better chance - heck Mystique fighting against Apocalypse at this point given her radical mutants rights policies of the past is completely out of character for her.

2) Lorna Dane once had her magnetic powers stolen away by her "sister", Zaladane. Moira MacTaggert confirmed that Zaladane was indeed Lorna's sister; she had to be for the transferrence process to work. The clincher? Zaladane was killed by Magneto when she tried to steal his power. So Magneto killed one of his own daughters!

Well I suppose Zaladane could have been a material sister (Polaris' mother and someone else) and that's how she was able to steal the powers but didn't have those powers herself?

[fishtaco]

I don't hate Milligan's work, as many here seem to, but it is flawed. I still liked Bizarre Love Triangle, though. I guess you've just got to admire Milligan for his super-quirkiness, or not at all.

Problems:

1) When U.S. government Sentinels first come to the X-Campus, Cyclops, the X-men, and a bunch of students rush out to confront them. Nonsense. Cyclops is an accomplished tactician, and that is not what I believe he would have done. Rather, he would evacuate via the Morlock tunnels or the teleporter Gateway and then detonate the underground complex. Given what Rachael Summers has shared of the future, why not evacuate right away when the Sentinels arive?

2) The arrival of Mystique and Pulse is sheer lunacy. Neither of these duplicitous characters would come to the Institute at exactly the time it is being turned into a concentration camp. They would leave the country as soon as the Sentinels were activated.

3) More on Mystique: While I enjoyed the “Foxx” storyline, I think it’s rather dubious that when Mystique attempts to “join” the X-Men, nobody mentions that she murdered long-time ally Moira MacTaggert. I guess they’ve all forgotten about her, huh? That’s pretty hardcore. Not only do you get killed for being an X-ally, but the team decides it’s forgive and forget with your murderer. And by the way, isn’t Mystique a wanted terrorist? What about what she did in Europe when she took over Banshee’s X-Corp and set attack helicopters upon the people of Paris? Am I to believe the O.N.E. isn’t just going to barge in and arrest her? Not to mention the X-men could get busted for harboring a fugitive....

4) The “Sentinel surprise” of having manned robots was amusing, but improbable. Don’t the X-Men keep track of these things? It would take, quite literally, TENS OF THOUSANDS of people to construct those robots--workers, technicians, suppliers, contractors, subcontractors, soldiers, accountants, executives, officers.... Kind of hard to keep it top secret, you know? So there is literally no way Sage, for example, would not know of this. So: WHY DIDN’T SAGE TELL THE X-MEN THAT MANNED SENTINELS WERE COMING TO THE MANSION? Is she evil or just incompetent?

5) Ever since Tony Stark’s heart got pierced by shrapnel, he’s abandoned the munitions industry. Until now, apparently (see: Sentinel Squad ONE). Well, actually, since these Sentinels would have to have been under construction for years, Stark has apparently been at it for some time now. I don’t believe it. A staple of Stark’s character for years has been: no weapons except for his own role as superhero. Not only do I not believe Stark would do it, there’s been no explanation as to why he would make this change. It’s very, very unheroic. What’s next, Captain America, passing out hand grenades to street gangs?

6) In fact, the general tech level of the Sentinels is a little outrageous. Not only can they hover in place for hours (antigravity?) but they’ve got force fields strong enough to deflect Cannonball. There was a time only guys like the Wingless Wizard and Dr. Doom had tech like this. Now, it’s standard military equipment? What energy source do these things have? Why are Marvel civilians still filling up at the gas pump if the US government has tech and energy sources like this? That Sentinel force field could probably sustain a fusion reaction for cheap, limitless electricity for all Marvel civilians. And the batteries they operate on would make electric cars vastly more efficient than gasoline powered autos. I understand that villains like Dr. Doom and the Mandarin want to horde tech, but why does the U.S. government do it? Do they like fighting wars for oil, rather than (as here in our universe) simply believe it to be an unavoidable necessity?


Okay, now let's talk about Lorna Dane/Polaris. Here are two little known conclusions I've drawn in my role as comic continuity detective.

1) Lorna's hair is still green, even though she's been transmuted to human form. No human gene produces green hair. Ergo: Lorna must have some mutant genes left in her. This is likely true of the other humanized mutants as well. In Son Of M, the mutants exposed to the terrigen mists get variants of their old powers back, rather than entirely new or random ones. Why would this occur in this way unless they had some mutant potential left? (The Inhumans themeselves cannot predict what powers someone will get from the mists.)

2) Lorna Dane once had her magnetic powers stolen away by her "sister", Zaladane. Moira MacTaggert confirmed that Zaladane was indeed Lorna's sister; she had to be for the transferrence process to work. The clincher? Zaladane was killed by Magneto when she tried to steal his power. So Magneto killed one of his own daughters!

Peace,
SyzygyThis pretty much sums up a lot of the absurdity that this entire run is based on.

[Alexander the Drake]

Okay, now let's talk about Lorna Dane/Polaris. Here are two little known conclusions I've drawn in my role as comic continuity detective.

1) Lorna's hair is still green, even though she's been transmuted to human form. No human gene produces green hair. Ergo: Lorna must have some mutant genes left in her. This is likely true of the other humanized mutants as well. In Son Of M, the mutants exposed to the terrigen mists get variants of their old powers back, rather than entirely new or random ones. Why would this occur in this way unless they had some mutant potential left? (The Inhumans themeselves cannot predict what powers someone will get from the mists.)

A) Hair takes time to grow out and it hasn't been that long. Her roots could have been coming in brown but likely Marvel didn't think of that.

B) They've probably been reverted to an inactive state where they're latent or potential mutants so that the relevant genes are just introns now. Junk DNA with no start sequences.
They're now technically mutates and the mists seem to provide a different trigger than the X-Factor, hence the powers also express themselves differently.
The Inhumans' gene pool is very mixed and they were created by Kree tinkering, rather than arising from "natural" mutation, so they can't tell and that's why they have genetics counselling.
As should we all.

C) Did anyone really expect Magneto to stay depowered, with a new movie coming up? :p

2) Lorna Dane once had her magnetic powers stolen away by her "sister", Zaladane. Moira MacTaggert confirmed that Zaladane was indeed Lorna's sister; she had to be for the transferrence process to work. The clincher? Zaladane was killed by Magneto when she tried to steal his power. So Magneto killed one of his own daughters!

A) Regarding Zaladane, my pet hypothesis is that Moira, then under the influence of the Shadow King, said that to twist the knife. I have a few scans from that issue, and while she's performing the examination, Moira, who normally wears a relatively modest coverall bodysuit, is dressed in high heels, a cropped bustier, and miniskirt, with no date in sight.

I haven't read the rest of the story, but according to the UXM.net summaries, four issues later (and 2nd issue after to pick up the storyline), she's already redesigned everyone's uniforms to be much more revealing, and the other islanders are sensing something wrong. I believe one of the classic Claremontian symptoms of possession by evil is slutty dressing.

Also, Lorna's locked up by one of Legion's personalities at this point, who reveals that he's going to use her negative emotional energy powers in order to manipulate everyone else.

A couple of issues later, Moira tries to get Legion to track the X-Men using Cerebro. There's a psychic backlash, and the Shadow King's astral form appears.

So, I don't think it's out of the question that both Zaladane and Moira could have been lying about the sister thing (after all, Moira didn't examine the machine responsible, and she knows Rogue can steal powers perfectly well without any blood relation) and it's easier than coming up with a reasonable explanation for how Magneto, who's obsessed over his dead wife to the point where he turned down his gorgeous bikini-clad Brazilian physician friend in a Classic X-Men backup story, managed to produce not one, but *two* stray adult daughters he's remained unaware of all this time and didn't try to gather back into the family bosom, as he keeps doing with Wanda and Pietro.

Though one could argue that he did know about Lorna, since the entire incident with the Magneto-bot claiming to be her father could have happened if whoever was behind that had been working from some notebooks left behind when Magneto was abducted by the Stranger.

And he let her back into Genosha after he kicked Pietro out.

B) Eh...if you go by recent comics, Magneto killed his own son. And continues to neglect his other daughter, even though she, too, had a breakdown and tried to kill her teammates. Clearly, Wanda is the favourite child and gets all the *good* holiday presents.

[Will.S]

I think Syzgy has some interesting takes and questions on the X-Men stuff but I think I can explain the Sentinels.


1) When U.S. government Sentinels first come to the X-Campus, Cyclops, the X-men, and a bunch of students rush out to confront them. Nonsense. Cyclops is an accomplished tactician, and that is not what I believe he would have done. Rather, he would evacuate via the Morlock tunnels or the teleporter Gateway and then detonate the underground complex. Given what Rachael Summers has shared of the future, why not evacuate right away when the Sentinels arive?They didn't rush out, the Sentinels ambushed them and Cyclops tried to maintain a calm head as well as trying to reign Wolverine and company in but you know how that always goes (although I admit that Beast acted pretty out of character and a bit foolishly but there's a good explanation for that). He also noticed that they never attacked so if they weren't a threat he isn't going to have a huge reason for shooting and engaging them right away especially after being outnumbered.

4) The “Sentinel surprise” of having manned robots was amusing, but improbable. Don’t the X-Men keep track of these things? It would take, quite literally, TENS OF THOUSANDS of people to construct those robots--workers, technicians, suppliers, contractors, subcontractors, soldiers, accountants, executives, officers.... Kind of hard to keep it top secret, you know? So there is literally no way Sage, for example, would not know of this. So: WHY DIDN’T SAGE TELL THE X-MEN THAT MANNED SENTINELS WERE COMING TO THE MANSION? Is she evil or just incompetent?
It's not all to hard to swallow that they were protected from even Sage's prying eyes. I know she's really good with hacking and everything but she can't know EVERYTHING going on especially right after HoM and while she's in England. Plus I like their surprise "out of nowhere" ambush.

5) Ever since Tony Stark’s heart got pierced by shrapnel, he’s abandoned the munitions industry. Until now, apparently (see: Sentinel Squad ONE). Well, actually, since these Sentinels would have to have been under construction for years, Stark has apparently been at it for some time now. I don’t believe it. A staple of Stark’s character for years has been: no weapons except for his own role as superhero. Not only do I not believe Stark would do it, there’s been no explanation as to why he would make this change. It’s very, very unheroic. What’s next, Captain America, passing out hand grenades to street gangs?
Going by recent happenings on his own title as well as "Road to Civil War" it makes perfect sense. It goes hand in hand with Tony Stark's "futurist" way of thinking to be well prepared for the future and the Sentinel's roles are much different from their old uses. The technology used on the Sentinels are also a joint venture between Stark industries and S.H.I.E.L.D.

6) In fact, the general tech level of the Sentinels is a little outrageous. Not only can they hover in place for hours (antigravity?) but they’ve got force fields strong enough to deflect Cannonball. There was a time only guys like the Wingless Wizard and Dr. Doom had tech like this. Now, it’s standard military equipment? What energy source do these things have? Why are Marvel civilians still filling up at the gas pump if the US government has tech and energy sources like this? That Sentinel force field could probably sustain a fusion reaction for cheap, limitless electricity for all Marvel civilians. And the batteries they operate on would make electric cars vastly more efficient than gasoline powered autos. I understand that villains like Dr. Doom and the Mandarin want to horde tech, but why does the U.S. government do it? Do they like fighting wars for oil, rather than (as here in our universe) simply believe it to be an unavoidable necessity?
When Stark and S.H.I.E.L.D are involved you have to expect some big leaps and advances in MU tech especially when it comes to Sentinels since they've been recently reactivated under a new program.

As far as the gov't goes and sharing it's stuff, I wouldn't expect them to share all of it's secrets and technology when they can maintain the edge compared to the rest of the US and even the rest world. It's kind of like the same reason why the US military has it's own proprietary gear and weapons systems, maybe much later in the future when then technology is outdated will they share it with the rest of the world but throwing away that particular technological edge doesn't seem like an all too good tactical maneuver.

[Hulk_Is]

This is actually a comic I don't mind having to wait thirty days to recieve... but in a good way. It seems it's moving along with little excitement but, seems to be actually going somewhere... eventually? :)

I feel sorry for you longtime adjectiveless X-Men readers- it reminds me of what we Hulk fans had to endure for many years 'til thankfully Planet Hulk comes along and changed all of that!

I like the adjectiveless X-Men title as it's fair and I'm new to the title, and while not a huge Larocca fan, his current art has grown on me as it's rather 'pretty' to look at, if you will, though I see many of you like his older stlyle art- '90's looking... I'm a fan of the '90's art, but didn't quite love his- but, whatever.

How do any of you propose the next writer's style will effect this title- because I'm curious?

I find one of the only thing's I found engaging about Apocalypse's appearance to this title, is how I find him despicable and truly evil in his torturous transformation practices to make one his ultimately disposable slave. But, that's what I get from his appearance here which is good... being new-ish as a reader, I get a sense of what he does.

Here's to hoping next ish is amazing... or at least fair... can't do worse.

[Syzygy]

A) Hair takes time to grow out and it hasn't been that long. Her roots could have been coming in brown but likely Marvel didn't think of that.

B) They've probably been reverted to an inactive state where they're latent or potential mutants so that the relevant genes are just introns now. Junk DNA with no start sequences.
They're now technically mutates and the mists seem to provide a different trigger than the X-Factor, hence the powers also express themselves differently.
The Inhumans' gene pool is very mixed and they were created by Kree tinkering, rather than arising from "natural" mutation, so they can't tell and that's why they have genetics counselling.
As should we all.


A) Yes, hair takes time to grow out. But several weeks after M-Day, Alex and Lorna are hopping around Latin America, and Lorna has no brown roots showing.

B) Also, I believe it was established that the humanized mutants are not latents, but that they've been transmuted to human form. After all, Sage has the power to trigger any latent mutant. And certainly, Beast, Forge, and Magneto have the scientific and technological knowledge to activate latent mutantions (Magneto has done so in the past).

I think two things are the case. 1) The staff just goofed, and forgot that Lorna's hair should have reverted. 2) The "transmutation" to human form isn't complete. Perhaps only those mutant genes relating to the generation of mutant energies have been replaced/deleated, but others remain. Should the big "collective energy cloud" of Avengers #18 hit a depowered mutant, the specific energies there might "transmutate back" the missing gene sequences.

Unfortunately, we can't enter the comic book world and ask Dr. McCoy, "Hey, why is Lorna's hair still green?"

Seriously, I've always felt I could be of use to the X-Men, even as a human, pointing out all the things they miss! :D

Peace,
Syzygy

[Faded]

1) Lorna's hair is still green, even though she's been transmuted to human form. No human gene produces green hair.

Well that's not really Milligan's fault IMO. Someone had the idea to have some retain their physical mutations DESPITE losing their X-Gene, which caused aforementioned physical changes. Never really liked that idea myself.

[Haunt]

Well that's not really Milligan's fault IMO. Someone had the idea to have some retain their physical mutations DESPITE losing their X-Gene, which caused aforementioned physical changes. Never really liked that idea myself.


seems logical to me. none of us would recognize her without her green hair. no biggie.

[Syzygy]

Well that's not really Milligan's fault IMO. Someone had the idea to have some retain their physical mutations DESPITE losing their X-Gene, which caused aforementioned physical changes. Never really liked that idea myself.

IMO, friend Faded, that's a big negatory. Milligan wanted Lorna to conceal the fact that she had lost her powers from her teammates. No green hair would have been a giveaway.

The proper thing to do would have been to have Beast or Shadowcat scratching their head, "She's not a mutant any more, but her hair is still green. I wonder why?" Then, later, develop on that idea to tell us exactly just what happened.

seems logical to me. none of us would recognize her without her green hair. no biggie.

If this seems nitpicky, consider this. What I'm doing is imagining I'm there in the comic, seeing and hearing the things they do. So of course, if Lorna says her mutant gene is gone, but her hair is still green (or still coming in green), I'm going to ask why. I'm not going to just assume that God left her hair green because He's worried I won't recognize her if it's brown!

Peace,
Syzygy

[Loestal]

If Blob lost all his boddy fat and just had skin left over...then Polaris's hair should of been changed.

[UncannyAsianGirl]

You've all read the recent "Generation M" mini-series right? It showed that not all mutants were affected the same way by the wave. Some, like Beak did lose both their powers and altered appearance, while others were not so fortunate and lost the very aspects of their powers that allowed them to continue living.

Case in point, that long-necked girl. When the wave hit, her neck didn't shrink back to normal size. Rather she lost the aspect of her mutation that allowed her to survive with an elongated neck, and promptly died.

Or that dragon kid who fell out of the sky, because he no longer had the ability to fly, but still kept his dragonoid appearance even in death.

Probably the best, most well-known case for all of you would be Chamber. By your logic, wouldn't the hole in his chest caused by the manifestation of his powers simply be healed up, because it isn't possible for a base-line human to survive without the vital body parts he was missing?

So therefore if it's possible for mutants to lose their powers while keeping the same appearance, it's wholly possible that Lorna maintained her green hair, even though she was powerless.

[frogjitsu]

I know, Lorna's hair is still green because SHE DYES IT! Well, maybe not, but she did used to die her hair brown to disguise her being a mutant, so maybe now she dyes her hair green to conceal her being reverted back to a human.

[Beast]

I know, Lorna's hair is still green because SHE DYES IT! Well, maybe not, but she did used to die her hair brown to disguise her being a mutant, so maybe now she dyes her hair green to conceal her being reverted back to a human.
No, that's just silly. :p

[frogjitsu]

I know, it was just a joke. :D

Anyways, the lame thing about this story arc is that Sunfire and Polaris becoming Horseman, is just a lame excuse to return their former powers, and undo the things that were recently done to them, that should have never happened in my opinion. :mad: It like "Oh, Shiro has no legs and is powerless, and Polaris is powerless, so lets bring in Apocalypse and make them Horsemen. Then They can be restored to their former selves." If they were just going to undo the damage they recently had done, then why do it in the first place. Because of this logic, this story has been so predictable. Well at least Sunfire is whole again, assuming he stays alive, and Lorna gets some powers back.