X-Books: July 2006 Solicitations - Discussion Thread!!

[Beast]

Since the solicits end up hitting long before they slip out anymore, I felt we still needed an all encompassing thread so we can discuss the solicits and the issues. After all, that's half the run of reading them. So... here ya go. Scroll down to the link and for the covers and non-X-Books Solicitations. :)

CABLE & DEADPOOL #30
Written by FABIAN NICIEZA
Penciled by STAZ JOHNSON
Cover by ROBERTO CAMPUS
CIVIL WAR Tie-in!
THE HERO HUNTER" Part 1 (of 3)
With CIVIL WAR tearing the Marvel Universe apart, only one man can sew it back together... DEADPOOL?! Well, who else would make the perfect mercenary Hero-Hunter? In an effort to do his part, Deadpool crosses paths with the GREAT LAKES AVENGERS, and slices and dices his way to DAREDEVIL-THE MAN WITHOUT FEAR! What happens when the Merc with a Mouth faces the Sightless Scarlet Sentry? And where does CABLE stand in all this? Where he always does... pretending he's above the fray. Then why is he having a secret meeting with CAPTAIN AMERICA...?
32 PGS./Rated A ...$2.99

CIVIL WAR: X-MEN #1 (of 4)
Written by DAVID HINE
Penciled by YANICK PAQUETTE
Cover by JUAN DOE
"CIVIL WAR" Tie-in!
Enough is enough! The tension between the X-Men, the 198, and the O*N*E has finally reached a breaking point. As the Marvel Universe is ripped apart by the Civil War, the X-Men also find themselves crumbling from the inside out. Will they fold-up and admit defeat, or will the X-Men finally start to fight back? Find out here!
32 PGS./Rated T+ ...$2.99

EXILES #84
Written by TONY BEDARD
Penciled by Jim Calafiore
Cover by Paul Pelletier
"BACK IN THE SADDLE" Part 1 (of 1)!
With the World Tour finally at an end, the Exiles are demanding a break. They take the time to visit their homes and get some much needed down time. However, there are worlds out there that still need their help. But if the Exiles aren't willing to do the job...who will replace them?!
32 PGS./Rated A ...$2.99

NEW X-MEN #28
Written by CHRIS YOST & CRAIG KYLE
Pencils & Cover by PACO MEDINA
"NIMROD" Part 1(of 4)!
The New X-Men have been killed, blown up, and absolutely decimated. Now, they're on the offensive! But after all they've been through, will they have the strength to defeat their toughest enemy yet? Hey, maybe the New Avengers could help!
32 PGS./Rated T+ ...$2.99

NEW EXCALIBUR #9
Written by Frank Tieri
Pencils & Cover by MICHAEL RYAN
"CHEST PAINS" Parts 1 (of 1)!
New Excalibur is alerted to a depowered mutant that has recently been returned home to England...Chamber! Learn the secret history of Chamber, but will the team be able to find out the truth before Chamber is killed?!
32 PGS./Rated A ...$2.99

STORM #6 (of 6)
Written by ERIC JEROME DICKEY
Penciled by DAVID YARDIN & LAN MEDINA
Cover by MIKE MAYHEW
It's High Noon -- at 20,000 feet! Captured by the Bull and his cronies, bound and helpless on a transport helicopter and headed to God knows where, Ororo and T'Challa are in big trouble. If they are going to survive this ordeal, then Ororo must do what she has never done before: harness her terrifying powers and, for the first time, use them as a weapon. And that's the easy part! Trust us, True Believer, you won't want to miss this key issue of the limited series that tells the untold love story between Marvel's two pre-eminent Black super heroes -- Storm and the Black Panther!
32 PGS./Rated T+ ...$2.99

ULTIMATE X-MEN #72
Written by ROBERT KIRKMAN
Pencils & Cover by TOM RANEY
"MAGICAL" PART 1(OF 3)
He's a media darling, a vital part of the X-Men dynamic and the newest member of the team. His name-The Magician! Watch him live up to his name in ways you could never conceive. There is more-much, much more about this new mutant than any suspect. Plus-the fallout from the Shi'ar's test on Jean Grey has drastically unanticipated consequences.
32 PGS./Rated T+ ...$2.99

UNCANNY X-MEN #475 & #476
Written by ED BRUBAKER
Pencils & Wraparound Cover by BILLY TAN
"THE RISE AND FALL OF THE SHI'AR EMPIRE" Parts 1 & 2!
A brand new era for the Uncanny X-Men begins here! Fresh off X-MEN: DEADLY GENESIS, Ed Brubaker takes the helm of Marvel's mighty mutants. Billy Tan joins Ed for a story that won't just affect earth, but will rock the foundations of the entire galaxy! Vulcan is out for revenge and has his sites set on the Shi'Ar Empire! Get ready for the ride of your life! A perfect starting point for any new reader!
32 PGS. (each)/Rated T+ ...$2.99 (each)

WOLVERINE #44
Written by MARC GUGGENHEIM
Pencils & Cover by HUMBERTO RAMOS
"CIVIL WAR" Tie-in!
"VENDETTA"
The smackdown of the century is here: Wolverine vs. Nitro - The Human Bomb! But what dark secret does Nitro hold that threatens to shake up everything? And who are the three mysterious strangers tracking Wolverine? Everything you think you know is wrong.
32 PGS./Parental Advisory ...$2.99

WOLVERINE: ORIGINS #4
Written by DANIEL WAY
Penciled by STEVE DILLON
Cover by JOE QUESADA
"BORN IN BLOOD"
Reeling from his brutal battle with Nuke--as well as from having to confront some particularly sordid details of his past-- Logan once again resumes his dogged march toward vengeance...only to discover that the U.S. government isn't ready to give up just yet. Enter: CAPTAIN AMERICA! Will the Sentinel of Liberty shut Logan down for good...or does he have something else in mind? Also featuring a cameo by the X-MEN! Part 4 (of 5).
32 PGS./Parental Advisory ...$2.99

X-FACTOR #9
Written by PETER DAVID
Penciled by DENNIS CALERO
Cover by RYAN SOOK
CIVIL WAR Tie-in!
Jamie Madrox comes face to face with the thing that terrifies him the most: Having to make a decision. The divisiveness of CIVIL WAR has spread to his own team, as half of them want to cooperate with the government, while the other half wants to take a stand against it. It's Jamie's decision that may well decide whether X-Factor stands or cracks apart...and things aren't being helped by Quicksilver, who offers Rictor the opportunity to get his powers back -- but at what price? Guest starring QUICKSILVER!
32 PGS./Rated T+ ...$2.99

X-MEN #188 & #189
Written by MIKE CAREY
Pencils & Wraparound Cover by CHRIS BACHALO
"SUPER NOVAS" Parts 1 & 2
Mike Carey (ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR) and Chris Bachalo (UNCANNY X-MEN) take over the X-Men, or at least what's left of them! As old threats are still having their effects, new, more deadly threats emerge from the unlikeliest of places. Threats that spell doom for the X-Men. Plus, what could possibly strike terror into the heart of...Sabretooth!? And who are The Children? This is the book you've been waiting for! A perfect starting point for any new reader!
32 PGS. (each)/Rated A ...$2.99 (each)

X-MEN FAIRY TALES #3 (of 4)
Written by C. B. CEBULSKI
Penciled by KEI KOBAYASHI
Cover by CLAIRE WENDLING
Our storytellers turn their attention to the American South this month and tap the terrifying traditions of New Orleans in a retelling of the romance of Rogue and Gambit. When a voodoo priestess named Mystique meets a young girl who can speak with the spirits of the recently deceased, she tries to bend the girl's will and use her abilities for evil. They soon learn it's unwise to upset the ghosts and ghouls of the South, and it's up to a mysterious Cajun stranger to set things right!
32 PGS./Rated A ...$2.99

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=7123

[Jake V]

I'm way excited. I'll be buying more X-Books in July than I ever did in the past.

[Beast]

Some good stuff coming up, but NEX's solicit intrigues me the most.

As I said in another thread, Chamber in New Excalibur? Smells like Tieri is using his time on CC's book to deal with his own plot ideas. Maybe for the best, that way he doesn't screw up any of CC's stuff.

[Effect]

Wolverine vs. Nitro. Nice. I hope this goes down well. Nitro is pretty much the reason this whole Civil War thing got kicked off, or so it seems. While Wolverine doesn't seem like he'll get to much focus in the actual Civil War books beside his own title, I guess this a a nice way of having him play an important role by taking out the guy that got everything started and killed thousands or hundreds of people.

I do hope the Civil War tie-ins mean the end of the Sentinels standing guard. I'd love to see Scott have enough and just open fire on the Sentinels to get rid of them as he gets fed up with the entire situation. Take the heads off, etc... similar to the X-men animated series fights against the Sentinels.

[Jellobay]

I'm so excited I can barely contain myself. :D

I like the changes in the core books. I looks like we have a couple of major story arcs. I just hope the live up to it. :)

[MasterOdin]

I agree, I will be buying more X-stuff than I have in years. I really like what Brubaker has been doing in X-M:DG, so I will be picking up his Uncanny. The more I read about Carey's X-Men, I think that I am going to try that out as well.

[streator]

of the x-books, i'm getting:

civil war: x-men 1
x-factor 9
uncanny x-men 475
uncanny x-men 476
x-men 188
x-men 189


i'm surprised marvel is doing something with chamber already. too bad it's in new excalibur though.

[Speed]

In the past, Marvel have hired "questionable" writers to write the core books, that haven't really lived upto expectations and ultimitely annoyed and disappointed fans. (Milligan, Claremont back, Austen). I really think that for the first time in a long while, Marvel have chose 2 perfect writers to get the X-Books back on track and back among must buy comics. It might be alot of pressure but already seen from previews and solits, Carey & Brubaker seem to have what it takes to make the X-Books readable again.
Great covers, intriguing lineups and both writers have grade A CV's.

Nice to see Teiri on Excalibur too. I might pick that one up.

[Jake V]

CABLE & DEADPOOL #30
CIVIL WAR: X-MEN #1 (of 4)
ULTIMATE X-MEN #72
UNCANNY X-MEN #475 & #476
WOLVERINE #44
WOLVERINE: ORIGINS #4
X-FACTOR #9
X-MEN #188 & #189

Man, I haven't bought this many different X-titles since Fatal Attractions.

[streator]

it looks like polaris is getting back her magnetic powers, given the uncanny preview.

[Badger Boy]

In the past, Marvel have hired "questionable" writers to write the core books, that haven't really lived upto expectations and ultimitely annoyed and disappointed fans. (Milligan, Claremont back, Austen). I really think that for the first time in a long while, Marvel have chose 2 perfect writers to get the X-Books back on track and back among must buy comics. It might be alot of pressure but already seen from previews and solits, Carey & Brubaker seem to have what it takes to make the X-Books readable again.


I feel the same. I will also be buying more X-books in July than I have in years.

[Beast]

In the past, Marvel have hired "questionable" writers to write the core books, that haven't really lived upto expectations and ultimitely annoyed and disappointed fans. (Milligan, Claremont back, Austen). I really think that for the first time in a long while, Marvel have chose 2 perfect writers to get the X-Books back on track and back among must buy comics. It might be alot of pressure but already seen from previews and solits, Carey & Brubaker seem to have what it takes to make the X-Books readable again.
Great covers, intriguing lineups and both writers have grade A CV's.

Nice to see Teiri on Excalibur too. I might pick that one up.
Questionable writers? :rolleyes: Totally disagreed with you, especially after the disappointment with the developments in Deadly Genesis. And Carey's Ultimate X-Men/Fantastic Four was awful. We'll see if they deliver anything better here, but I'm not holding my breath for either.

[Jellobay]

Questionable writers? :rolleyes: Totally disagreed with you, especially after the disappointment with the developments in Deadly Genesis. And Carey's Ultimate X-Men/Fantastic Four was awful. We'll see if they deliver anything better here, but I'm not holding my breath for either.

Give them a shot. Cap. America is one of my favorites. :)

[rilokyle]

I'm so excited Polaris is back in action. I just hope that she's back to normal, and not some crazy woman. And I really hope Lorna and Alex get back together too!! I think I am hopeless. :rolleyes:

[Beast]

Give them a shot. Cap. America is one of my favorites. :)
I plan to. But Brubaker's DG and Carey's team are already giving them a handicap.

[Jellobay]

I plan to. But Brubaker's DG and Carey's team are already giving them a handicap.

You never know though, 20 years from now there could be a DDM 2 signing their praises. :)

[Badger Boy]

You never know though, 20 years from now there could be a DDM 2 signing their praises. :)

This would be me. Brubaker gets major bonus points from me for bringing back Warpath, and Carey gets major bonus points for having the courage to not be conservative with his roster choices and instead go off the deep end with them, talk about a shakeup.

[Beast]

This would be me. Brubaker gets major bonus points from me for bringing back Warpath, and Carey gets major bonus points for having the courage to not be conservative with his roster choices and instead go off the deep end with them, talk about a shakeup.
Yeah, but going off the deep end is often bad.... if you don't know how to swim. ;)
So we'll have to wait and see if Carey's team choices make sense, whether they sink or swim.

[xmanson]

After 14 years, no more core X-books for me.

I'll get to read some spin offs and stuff, but see those going away soon.

And Wolverine vs Nitro? Really? Whart gimmick will be used to a guy like Wolverine be able to take someone with power like Nitro's?


So the NEw Avengers must help the NX kids? Makes sense considering how incompetent both ONE and the X-men have been when protecting them.

[Beast]

And Wolverine vs Nitro? Really? Whart gimmick will be used to a guy like Wolverine be able to take someone with power like Nitro's?
Same way he always manages to defeat Magneto, who's capable of sensing the presence of metal around him with his powers. By being "The best there is at what he does." Best at being horribly twinky. :p

[Will.S]

Lots of great stuff on the horizon, can't wait for the Brubaker stuff and Civil War.

Questionable writers? :rolleyes: Totally disagreed with you, especially after the disappointment with the developments in Deadly Genesis. And Carey's Ultimate X-Men/Fantastic Four was awful. We'll see if they deliver anything better here, but I'm not holding my breath for either.
While I agree with you on Ultimate FF/X-Men what disappointed you about Deadly Genesis?

[Badger Boy]

Yeah, but going off the deep end is often bad.... if you don't know how to swim. ;)
So we'll have to wait and see if Carey's team choices make sense, whether they sink or swim.

But is'nt it cool to be able to observe problably what will be the most controversial X-Men roster of all time in action? Sink or swim, I am real interested to see this nonconventional group of characters interact in the confines of the X-Men universe. Even if it is a disaster, it will still be a great disaster to observe. Carey is really going out on a limb with this roster, and I respect him greatly for trying this unconventional move.

[Flameworthy]

This would be me. Brubaker gets major bonus points from me for bringing back Warpath, and Carey gets major bonus points for having the courage to not be conservative with his roster choices and instead go off the deep end with them, talk about a shakeup.

I see it the other way around. Brubaker loses major points for killing off Banshee for a cheap shock value death, and Carey loses major points for using a terrorist and cold blooded killer on his roster when threre's so many other characters that would fit better on the team and actually make sense.:rolleyes:

[Xany Kaos]

He's a media darling, a vital part of the X-Men dynamic and the newest member of the team. His name-The Magician! Watch him live up to his name in ways you could never conceive.

Er...is Marvel making fun of Mary Sue/Gary Stu fanfiction with this? Because they really don't need to. And if so, I can't believe they're carrying it one for 3+ books. >.<

[Flight]

Carey loses major points for using a terrorist and cold blooded killer on his roster when threre's so many other characters that would fit better on the team and actually make sense.:rolleyes: Omgz!
Can you give me some spoilers for the first issue??!?? Who is the blond girl??

[Flameworthy]

Omgz!
Can you give me some spoilers for the first issue??!?? Who is the blond girl??

Omgz, you're so funny!!! Not!!

[Flight]

Omgz, you're so funny!!! Not!! Oh ho ho!
Thats right!
You HAVEN'T read the issue yet, have you!

[Jake V]

Omgz, you're so funny!!! Not!!
Nice dodge, but his point still stands.

Carey could be writing a story that makes perfect sense for Mystique to be there. You have no idea what his run will be about, so you're making things up to complain about. Whats really going on is that you don't like Mystique and that's all. Just admit that instead of trying to justify your complaints with unfounded speculation.

[Beast]

Oh ho ho!
Thats right!
You HAVEN'T read the issue yet, have you!
That doesn't change the fact that Mystique is a Terrorist that has murdered one of the X-Men's closest friends in the past, Moira McTaggart. And that Sabretooth is in fact, a cold-blooded killer, a rapist, and a cannibal. :p

[Jellobay]

That doesn't change the fact that Mystique is a Terrorist that has murdered one of the X-Men's closest friends in the past, Moira McTaggart. And that Sabretooth is in fact, a cold-blooded killer, a rapist, and a cannibal. :p

Moira was a mercy killing. ;)

[Flight]

Nice dodge, but his point still stands.

Carey could be writing a story that makes perfect sense for Mystique to be there. You have no idea what his run will be about, so you're making things up to complain about. Whats really going on is that you don't like Mystique and that's all. Just admit that instead of trying to justify your complaints with unfounded speculation. OW3ND!~~~~

[Beast]

Moira was a mercy killing. ;)
What? And so was Banshee?

[Nobbel]

Wow, the 198-ers really look aggressive in X-Men: CW and Domino and Shatterstar are in it too!!!

Ironman, Nimrod and Ms. Marvel in New X-Men!!!!

[Midnite]

Nice to see that Caliban and Mammomax are wearing pants.

[Hi-Fi]

What? And so was Banshee?

Mysti just wanted him to be near Moira. Is that so wrong? :(

[Keith_Martineau]

That doesn't change the fact that Mystique is a Terrorist that has murdered one of the X-Men's closest friends in the past, Moira McTaggart. And that Sabretooth is in fact, a cold-blooded killer, a rapist, and a cannibal. :p

...And?
Seeing as how Mike Carey's storyline has been extremely well guarded (as opposed to Uncanny, where we know the threat, where they're going, what it deals with, and why the roster was chosen) we literally do not know WHAT reasons we'll have for these characters being cast members (note I said cast members, not team members.) This could be a great story. This could all make sense soon.
Instead we have people bitching that two villains are in the book, saying they won't read it, or that it's a mark against the book and the writer, as if you know what the story will be and that it won't work. You know nothing other than they'll be there.

Meanwhile we have our buddy Beast suggesting that DARK BEAST join New Excalibur in another thread, despite HIM being a criminal, commiting genetic crimes.

Noooooooo there's no double standards 'round here ;)

[Hi-Fi]

Wow, the 198-ers really look aggressive in X-Men: CW and Domino and Shatterstar are in it too!!!

Ironman, Nimrod and Ms. Marvel in New X-Men!!!!


Shattestar: ugh

Domino: Yay!

:)

[Flameworthy]

That doesn't change the fact that Mystique is a Terrorist that has murdered one of the X-Men's closest friends in the past, Moira McTaggart. And that Sabretooth is in fact, a cold-blooded killer, a rapist, and a cannibal. :p

Exactly!

Nice dodge, but his point still stands.

Carey could be writing a story that makes perfect sense for Mystique to be there. You have no idea what his run will be about, so you're making things up to complain about. Whats really going on is that you don't like Mystique and that's all. Just admit that instead of trying to justify your complaints with unfounded speculation.

Umm, yeah you're just putting words in my mouth. Where did I say I hated Mystique. I actually like Mystique and she was definately a top notch villain back in the day, but nowadays she's just portrayed as some crazy woman with no senses. However, just because I like her as a villain doesn't mean I want to see her running around with the X-Men. Especially considering all the horrible things she's done in the past. I just can't accept that the X-Men would even consider having her on the team. Same goes for Sabertooth.

Also, I never said this title would suck. Sorry, if my original post wasn't clear enough. All I was saying is that it loses major points for me, for including Mystique and Sabertooth.

[Jellobay]

That doesn't change the fact that Mystique is a Terrorist that has murdered one of the X-Men's closest friends in the past, Moira McTaggart. And that Sabretooth is in fact, a cold-blooded killer, a rapist, and a cannibal. :p

All it would take was for one of them to bring back Ape Beast and you would be baking them a cake. :p

[Jellobay]

What? And so was Banshee?

Banshee died in the line of duty. He will be missed.

Moira was just whinny.

[Beast]

...And?
Seeing as how Mike Carey's storyline has been extremely well guarded (as opposed to Uncanny, where we know the threat, where they're going, what it deals with, and why the roster was chosen) we literally do not know WHAT reasons we'll have for these characters being cast members (note I said cast members, not team members.) This could be a great story. This could all make sense soon.
Instead we have people bitching that two villains are in the book, saying they won't read it, or that it's a mark against the book and the writer, as if you know what the story will be and that it won't work. You know nothing other than they'll be there.

Meanwhile we have our buddy Beast suggesting that DARK BEAST join New Excalibur in another thread, despite HIM being a criminal, commiting genetic crimes.

Noooooooo there's no double standards 'round here ;)
That's why I said I'm willing to wait and see if it's logically explained. There has to be a reason they would be on the team that makes sense. As for Dark Beast, he was offered a deal and accepted it to work with the group rebuilding Genosha. While still harboring a heavy resentment of 616 Beast, he still worked with the others because it served his purpose. But you could see the glimmer of hope that he was trying to reform. I knew that there was no way that he would continue that reform for very long though, but that was part of what worked. In the case of Sabretooth, he's a great deal more psychologically screwed up than Doc could ever dream of being. McCoy wasn't a rapist or cannibal. Sabretooth is like a force of nature, it can't be easily tamed. It will take a damn good explaination for him to make sense as a team member for an extended period of time.

[Jellobay]

That's why I said I'm willing to wait and see if it's logically explained. There has to be a reason they would be on the team that makes sense. As for Dark Beast, he was offered a deal and accepted it to work with the group rebuilding Genosha. While still harboring a heavy resentment of 616 Beast, he still worked with the others because it served his purpose. But you could see the glimmer of hope that he was trying to reform. I knew that there was no way that he would continue that reform for very long though, but that was part of what worked. In the case of Sabretooth, he's a great deal more psychologically screwed up than Doc could ever dream of being. McCoy wasn't a rapist or cannibal. Sabretooth is like a force of nature, it can't be easily tamed. It will take a damn good explaination for him to make sense as a team member for an extended period of time.

If Jean was still around, she woop his butt and keep him in line. :)

[Keith_Martineau]

That's why I said I'm willing to wait and see if it's logically explained. There has to be a reason they would be on the team that makes sense. As for Dark Beast, he was offered a deal and accepted it to work with the group rebuilding Genosha. While still harboring a heavy resentment of 616 Beast, he still worked with the others because it served his purpose. But you could see the glimmer of hope that he was trying to reform. I knew that there was no way that he would continue that reform for very long though, but that was part of what worked. In the case of Sabretooth, he's a great deal more psychologically screwed up than Doc could ever dream of being. McCoy wasn't a rapist or cannibal. Sabretooth is like a force of nature, it can't be easily tamed. It will take a damn good explaination for him to make sense as a team member for an extended period of time.

Oh Dark Beast was never reforming. Just surviving and waiting for his opportunity.
Anyway. Everything we've seen and heard about Carey's run---which has been quite little, all things considered---suggests to ME that it is not going to adhere to the traditional mansion/team structure. If you ask me, Sabretooth is gonna be there just cause he's in the same boat and has to be, not because he WANTS to be. That'd be reason enough for me. Just like Dark Beast on Genosha. There cause he was stuck and had to be, and was waiting for his opportunity.

[Jake V]

I just can't accept that the X-Men would even consider having her on the team. Same goes for Sabertooth.
Wouldn't it make more sense to actually read the comic and see why those things are happening before not accepting it?

Claremont created a plausable explanation for Magneto becoming a nice guy in the past, and he killed way more people than Mystique ever did. Why would you assume that Carey wouldn't create a plausable explanation of his own for Mystique and Sabretooth?

[Hi-Fi]

I would love to be able to read all Marvel titles so I could completely dive in Civil War. The solicitations are making me want to be in the middle of the action.

[Jellobay]

Wouldn't it make more sense to actually read the comic and see why those things are happening before not accepting it?

Claremont created a plausable explanation for Magneto becoming a nice guy in the past, and he killed way more people than Mystique ever did. Why would you assume that Carey wouldn't create a plausable explanation of his own for Mystique and Sabretooth?

Jake that would be being rational and who wants that. ;)

[ibrakeforchinwe]

Banshee died in the line of duty. He will be missed.

Moira was just whinny.

Banshee's death was one of the stupidest things ive ever read. Moira was the coolest human around.

I'll miss her alot more than banshee, but his death was so dumb, I wish he was back too.

[Hi-Fi]

Oh Dark Beast was never reforming. Just surviving and waiting for his opportunity.
Anyway. Everything we've seen and heard about Carey's run---which has been quite little, all things considered---suggests to ME that it is not going to adhere to the traditional mansion/team structure. If you ask me, Sabretooth is gonna be there just cause he's in the same boat, not because he HAS to be. That'd be reason enough for me. Just like Dark Beast on Genosha. There cause he was stuck and had to be, and was waiting for his opportunity.

Exactly. Dark Beast was not reforming. He was just there and he was still evil. I bet Sabes situation will be something like that.

[Jellobay]

Banshee's death was one of the stupidest things ive ever read. Moira was the coolest human around.

I'll miss her alot more than banshee, but his death was so dumb, I wish he was back too.

Banshee death was a little stupid.

But how was Moira cool? She spent all her days trying to do better than Prof. X.

[Flameworthy]

Wouldn't it make more sense to actually read the comic and see why those things are happening before not accepting it?

Claremont created a plausable explanation for Magneto becoming a nice guy in the past, and he killed way more people than Mystique ever did. Why would you assume that Carey wouldn't create a plausable explanation of his own for Mystique and Sabretooth?

Sure I'll give it a try by reading it in the store, but I'd rather spend my money on other things. Nowadays, comics are just a luxury for me, which I can't really afford. Especially with the increase in prices. Plus, I just can't support a book that has Cable in it. Man, I hate that guy with a passion.

[Beast]

Exactly. Dark Beast was not reforming. He was just there and he was still evil. I bet Sabes situation will be something like that.
I disagree. It started out that way, but he was making a conscious effort as the series developed, because he was getting acknowledged and appreciated for his genius and his work.

[Volk1]

NEW EXCALIBUR #9
Written by Frank Tieri
Pencils & Cover by MICHAEL RYAN
"CHEST PAINS" Parts 1 (of 1)!
New Excalibur is alerted to a depowered mutant that has recently been returned home to England...Chamber! Learn the secret history of Chamber, but will the team be able to find out the truth before Chamber is killed?!
32 PGS./Rated A ...$2.99

Blast Marvel for doing this! Having me pick up another book.... A definite pick-up and it won't be a Claremont What-If!

I wonder if Tieri will delve into Chamber's history at Weapon X since he was the writer for that book? Or a connection to Apocalypse somehow? :confused:

Hmmmm...very interesting indeed... :)

[Beast]

My planned July pulls. Wow, my smallest month ever. And there's only 2-3 non X-Books on my list. :)

CIVIL WAR: X-MEN #1 (of 4)
EXILES #84
NEW X-MEN #28
NEW EXCALIBUR #9
ULTIMATE X-MEN #72
UNCANNY X-Men #475 - 476
X-FACTOR #9
X-MEN #188 & #189
X-MEN FAIRY TALES #3 (of 4)

-Plus:-
CIVIL WAR: YOUNG AVENGERS & RUNAWAYS #1 (of 4)
ALL-NEW OFFICIAL HANDBOOK OF THE MARVEL UNIVERSE A TO Z #7

[PhoenixBoyX]

But is'nt it cool to be able to observe problably what will be the most controversial X-Men roster of all time in action? Sink or swim, I am real interested to see this nonconventional group of characters interact in the confines of the X-Men universe. Even if it is a disaster, it will still be a great disaster to observe. Carey is really going out on a limb with this roster, and I respect him greatly for trying this unconventional move.

Ack no. See, the problem is, it stops being a question of "the most controversial X-Roster ever! How cool was that!?" A lot of times years later, people look back and say "Jesus-what the fuck was he thinking!?"

I prefer my core books, for lack of an accurate word, "safe." If there is to be a team with Mystique and Sabreooth (who served together on X-Factor), Cannonball and Cable (who served together on X-Force), and Iceman and Rogue (who even went off on their own littles adventures for a few issues after Rogue absorbed Gambit's powers), then let it be a side book, giving Rogue and Iceman a break from the heavy amount of corebook time they've spent lately, giving someone different a chance (different meaning like Cecelia Reyes, not different like Idk, making Toad an X-Man, though I guess we'll see, after all, I didn't like Juggernaut as a good guy at first but LOVE him now ((though I still dispise most baddies turn good))).
-Nick

[bfrank]

And who are The Children?

LOL!

[Madrox84]

I'll be getting all of the Civil War stuff and all of my regular X-Titles... Here is the full list:-

AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #534
BLACK PANTHER #18
CIVIL WAR #3 (OF 7)
DAILY BUGLE: CIVIL WAR SPECIAL EDITION
CIVIL WAR: FRONT LINE #3 & 4 (OF 10)
CIVIL WAR: X-MEN #1 (of 4) Yay Domino!!!
CIVIL WAR: YOUNG AVENGERS & RUNAWAYS #1 (of 4)
FANTASTIC FOUR #539
NEW AVENGERS #22
THUNDERBOLTS #104
CABLE & DEADPOOL #30
WOLVERINE #44
X-FACTOR #9 Yay PAD writing Quicksilver again!!
SENSATIONAL SPIDER-MAN #28
ETERNALS #2 (of 6)
DAREDEVIL #87
MOON KNIGHT #4
MS. MARVEL #5
MARVEL SPOTLIGHT: ROBERT KIRKMAN/GREG LAND
EXILES #84
NEW X-MEN #28
NEW EXCALIBUR #9 Should be interesting, maybe it'll clear up how Chamber escaped from the situation he got himself in to in Weapon X.
STORM #6 (of 6)
UNCANNY X-MEN #475 & #476 I seriously can't wait!!
X-MEN #188 & #189 See above comment...
WOLVERINE: ORIGINS #4

Which should be more than enough comics for one month... Maybe...

[Erik Lehnsherr]

I have to check out Brubaker's debut and Chamber's fate? I'm sold on that too.

[Faded]

Shattestar: ugh

Domino: Yay!

:)

Same, babe!

I could touch myself!!! Everything seems awesome!!!!

Uncanny - Tan..Brubaker..POLARIS!!!! Whoo hoo!!!
X-Men - Not much to chew on, but I sure am hungry!
X-Factor - Very interested. Tricky, tricky, Quicksilver!!
Exiles - Yay visits home!!!!! And Caliafore art!
New Excalibur - Chamber!!!!!!!! Don't kill him off Mr Tieri!!! REPOW3RdNEss!!!11
Runaways/YA - Cheung drawn Runaways!!! It actually works!!!
X-Men Civil War seems like chaos, but I'm excited to see the 198 put to use. Strange that at the end of the 198, Johnny D is still there!!! I would've thrown his ass in a jar or something.

I might be forgetting something, but all around awesomeness.

[Faded]

Civil War 3
Civil War Front Line 3/4 (maybe)
Civil War X-Men 1
Civil War Young Avengers & Runaways 1
New Avengers 22 (maybe)
Thunderbolts 104
OHOTMU A-Z 7 (maybe)
Marvel Adventures The Aventures 3 (maybe)
Runaways 18
Exiles 84
New Excalibur 9
Uncanny X-Men 475/476
X-Men 188/189

Unfortunately, I think I might be completely dropping Ultimate X-Men and New X-Men by this time, both of which aren't really grabbing my attention right now. I don't know if I want to be picking up things JUST for Civil War (ie Front Line).

New Excalibur is really caught onto a safety net bringing in Chamber. Speaking of which, its cover seems like one they've used like twice in the past already. :confused:

[Young Avenger]

Wow, I'm interested more than one X-book! With New Avengers appearing in New X-Men I have a reason to read that book now. Cable & Deadpool Civil War tie-ins sounds very interesting. I'm definitely reading that.

[xakko]

Banshee death was a little stupid.

But how was Moira cool? She spent all her days trying to do better than Prof. X.
Moira was awesome in Excalibur.

Laying the smackdown on X-man made me feel bad about Nate.

I'm rather excited about New Excalibur and X-Factor, albeit with reservations. I'm schizoid like that sometimes.

[fishtaco]

Ugh. the X-Men franchise is steadily getting worse and worse every month.

[Faded]

Ugh. the X-Men franchise is steadily getting worse and worse every month.

Why do you feel this way, fishy, if you don't mind me asking? :)

[Radical_dreamer]

Ugh. the X-Men franchise is steadily getting worse and worse every month.

Feel free to stop reading it at any time.

[Beast]

Feel free to stop reading it at any time.
But reading allows him free reign to complain about the books. It's the only fair way. :)

[Jake V]

Ugh. the X-Men franchise is steadily getting worse and worse every month.
Really? What objective criteria was used to arrive at that conclusion?

Or was that just code for saying that you don't like what's coming out in July?

[fishtaco]

Feel free to stop reading it at any time.I might do that. Nearly every character that I love (which includes hundreds of characters) has been ruined or killed off. The status quo can't get any more unoriginal, outdated, inconsistent, erroneous, and boring. The only reason I'm sticking around is to...hmm...now I'm not so sure. I'm just going to be building up my collection of back issues. There's still plenty of incredible X-Men stuff from the 80's, 60, 70's, and hell, even the 90's to read. I think I am going to quit. My interest in the X-Men pretty much now revolves around delving into the infinite mysteries of the hundreds upon hundreds of plots that have been built up by the writers who actually know/knew what they're doing. It can get very, very depressing, and it fuels hatred for particular editors, but I feel that X-Men was cancelled after 1991, and everything afterwards isn't canon (even though there still was some good stuff afterwards).

I still have to read Dazzler, Captain Britain, Daredevils, Alpha Flight, finish Louise's X-Factor and New Mutants runs, get the last remaining issues I haven't read of Claremont's original run, plus his New Mutants run and Excalibur run, not to mention all the mini series I haven't read yet (I really want to read X-Men vs Mephisto, Firestar, X-Men vs Avengers, X-Men vs Fantastic Four, Beauty and The Beast, X-Men and Alpha Flight, X-Men Spotlight on Starjammers, Magik, Nightcrawler, Iceman, Wolverine: Jungle Adventure), plus the rest of the Classic X-Men backups I don't have yet, stuff I haven't finished from Alan Davis's Excalibur run, and Roy Thomas and Arnold Drake's respective runs. And of course, all the stuff that came later by Claremont, Simonson, David, and my other heroes (I just bought the first issue of Warlock and loved it). I really want to read Fabian Nicieza's Gambit, X-Men: The Hidden Years, the rest of the original AOA I don't have yet, the rest of Claremont's revolution run I don't have yet, the rest of X-Man I don't have yet, Exiles, the rest of Mystique I don't have yet, more of Frank Tieri's Weapon X, more of Larry Hama's Wolverine, that Chamber mini, the last issue of the first Domino mini, all of Deadpool, that 3 issue Beast mini, the last issue of True Friends. I'll even read stories past 1991 that happen somewhere chronologically in 1963-1991. :(

[jawbreaker]

regarding Chamber in Excal:

My first reaction was WTF? I thought we weren't supposed to see him for a while yet...

then I dug up that post Claremont wrote about the future of Excal

#8 is Betsy.

#'s 9-11 are a projected arc, as are 12-14, but since the green-light for the stories isn't official yet, I will say no more.

So it seems that due to Chris's illness, the projected arc for 9-11 has been put on hold & Tieri will be taking over the book after 8? cuz 9 wasn't one of the issues supposedly plotted by Claremont...they only mentioned 7 & 8 will use his plotting...

that's important cuz if #9 is actually a Claremont plot i was thinking that Jono would probably just be a prop for whatever crazy telepath of the week wanted to take over his empty shell..that had me kinda thinking...eh, of course. :rolleyes:
but if this is Tieri's own story then that could mean we get some info on what happened in Weapon X...that would be great! Maybe that's what "secret history" is referring to? I hope they dont mean his past cuz I always hoped Brian K. Vaughan would someday write Jono's pre X-Men history...

Oh well I'll be crossing my fingers this will be good...

on a completely unrelated note... is this Magician guy from Ultimate X-Men supposed to be the Ult. counterpart to anyone from 616? Magik?

[Stephane Garrelie]

New Excalibur for me... perhaps.
To support the book and keep the sales decent till the return of Claremont. But I'm far from enthousiastic.

None of these X-Books appeal to me.

[Beast]

on a completely unrelated note... is this Magician guy from Ultimate X-Men supposed to be the Ult. counterpart to anyone from 616? Magik?
Nope, supposed to be an all new character with no 616 counterpart.

[david r]

How could Frank Tieri call his fill-in on "New Excalibur" Chest Pains?

Under the circumstances (Chris Claremont's heart condition), that title is totally inappropriate.

[Jake V]

How could Frank Tieri call his fill-in on "New Excalibur" Chest Pains?

Under the circumstances (Chris Claremont's heart condition), that title is totally inappropriate.
Oh man, I hadn't thought of that. Pretty bad.

Though, it's a story about Chamber, so it makes sense in that context.

[Badger Boy]

Though, it's a story about Chamber, so it makes sense in that context.

This is why it is not in bad taste.

[Steven F.]

I noticed the title right off, and felt that it was maybe not appropriate, but I don't think it was mean spirited or anything.

[Young Avenger]

How could Frank Tieri call his fill-in on "New Excalibur" Chest Pains?

Under the circumstances (Chris Claremont's heart condition), that title is totally inappropriate.

Seeing how the story is about Clamber, a guy who is missing his chest and lower half of his face. The title is appropriate in that respect. I don't think it's anything direct to CC's straight condition.

[Novaya Havoc]

Really? What objective criteria was used to arrive at that conclusion?


Less Claremont in the core titles, I'd wager.

[FieryBalrog]

That doesn't change the fact that Mystique is a Terrorist that has murdered one of the X-Men's closest friends in the past, Moira McTaggart. And that Sabretooth is in fact, a cold-blooded killer, a rapist, and a cannibal. :p


I hate the idea of Mystique on the team mostly because of the horrible way Milligan wrote it. Not once in the voting did anyone bring up the fact that she MURDERED Moira and Banshee, that she's a crazy psycho murderer. Instead you have Lorna voting for her because "there aren't enough women on the team". Great reason Lorna.

[Novaya Havoc]

Whatever. Lorna's trying to keep the diversity quota of the X-Men so they don't lose federal funding. ;)

[xakko]

I hate the idea of Mystique on the team mostly because of the horrible way Milligan wrote it. Not once in the voting did anyone bring up the fact that she MURDERED Moira and Banshee, that she's a crazy psycho murderer. Instead you have Lorna voting for her because "there aren't enough women on the team". Great reason Lorna.
i thought that was Vulcan?

depending on your reading of Lorna's line, it could've been ironic. she had a pretty good sense of humor, once.

oh yeah, that was in PAD X-factor. darn, i really miss that.

[Hi-Fi]

I hate the idea of Mystique on the team mostly because of the horrible way Milligan wrote it. Not once in the voting did anyone bring up the fact that she MURDERED Moira and Banshee, that she's a crazy psycho murderer. Instead you have Lorna voting for her because "there aren't enough women on the team". Great reason Lorna.


Don't you dare question Crazy Lorna!! Don't you dare! :evilangry

[jawbreaker]

Nope, supposed to be an all new character with no 616 counterpart.

thanks, I had been wondering about that...

[Brian M.]

I love the way the books are sounding. Mike Carey is a good writer and I believe his X-Men will work. Brubaker is great. I disagree w/ everyone whos says he won't know what he's doing. Unoriginal, boring all that stuff being sad is crap to me. I'm loving it. Civil War sounds great, Ultimate X-Men sounds great, I'm loving this stuff.

[dotdotdot]

I prefer my core books, for lack of an accurate word, "safe."


you are the problem.

[Beast]

you are the problem.
Said the pot.

[dotdotdot]

Said the pot.

turn that into a sensible post?

[Beast]

turn that into a sensible post?
I'm just amused at you calling anyone a problem. ;)

[dotdotdot]

I'm just amused at you calling anyone a problem. ;)

purchase more new excalibur.

[MakeshiftHero]

I'm surprised no one has said this but In the uncany preview it shows Lorna just like it showed Wanda during the last pages of HoM. The almost exact same scenes. So does this mean that she was looking for Wanda or something of that nature, or maybe that's where she's been since she has been missing from her encounter w/ doop. Let me know if you think it has some tie in to Wanda or if you just want to let me know there's no relation at all.

[Beast]

I'm surprised no one has said this but In the uncany preview it shows Lorna just like it showed Wanda during the last pages of HoM. The almost exact same scenes. So does this mean that she was looking for Wanda or something of that nature, or maybe that's where she's been since she has been missing from her encounter w/ doop. Let me know if you think it has some tie in to Wanda or if you just want to let me know there's no relation at all.
Considering a half dozen people have mentioned it, you arn't the first. And I doubt it has anything to do with Wanda, given that Polaris appears to be in India and Wanda was in a village at the base of Mount Wundagore. :)

[steve2275]

all but storm and fairy tales

[Twigglet]

Beast, how do you know where Wanda was?

I think these X-books look better than ever! Brubaker and Carey! Finally a change to the status quo! (How can Fishtaco complain that this is unoriginal?!)

[Joe Rice]

I'll give the Brubaker and Carey books a shot. I'm sure they'll be loads better than the recent stuff, but unless they're Great with a capital, then they'll not last long for me.

[milly3cat]

NEW X-MEN #28
Written by CHRIS YOST & CRAIG KYLE
Pencils & Cover by PACO MEDINA
"NIMROD" Part 1(of 4)!
The New X-Men have been killed, blown up, and absolutely decimated. Now, they're on the offensive! But after all they've been through, will they have the strength to defeat their toughest enemy yet? Hey, maybe the New Avengers could help!
32 PGS./Rated T+ ...$2.99



I can't believe we have six more issues Of Nimrod in the Church to go ....
We have to wait till issue 29 before a new story ... :eek:

[Blackcat]

X-Men Civil War seems like chaos, but I'm excited to see the 198 put to use. Strange that at the end of the 198, Johnny D is still there!!! I would've thrown his ass in a jar or something.

I might be forgetting something, but all around awesomeness.

Yeah, same thought here. I assumed that Johnny D would ‘be taken care off’ by the X-Men or the 198-ers at the end of the series. Guess we have to wait and see what happens. I got the feeling X-Men CW is a follow-up on the 198 series, with a sauce of ex X-Forces and a bit of Bishop in top.

I hate the idea of Mystique on the team mostly because of the horrible way Milligan wrote it. Not once in the voting did anyone bring up the fact that she MURDERED Moira and Banshee, that she's a crazy psycho murderer. Instead you have Lorna voting for her because "there aren't enough women on the team". Great reason Lorna.

Don’t forget: She even stabbed her own daughter too! Lorna’s reason was soooo stupid. But I like Mystique, she is my favorite female villain, but I do not want her on a team. It just don’t feel right. The X-Men seem to forgive every (censored) thing a person did. Also Sabretooth almost killed Meltdown and Psylocke once. No-one would forgive Sabretooth or Mystique in real life. Now it probably will barely be mentioned while they gave Rogue a hell of a time before SHE got excepted while she never killed before. I think the forgive and forget are getting to easy at the mension these days.

I can't believe we have six more issues Of Nimrod in the Church to go ....
We have to wait till issue 29 before a new story ... :eek:

Up until now the story is great, so if they keep up the good work, I don't mind. Besides, a bus full of students blown up with 5 known character dead becaudse of that (Tag, DJ, Network, Rubbermaid and Dryad), a New Mutant shot dead in the head, one loosing his wings, that's a kind of heavy and big in the lives of the New X-Men and shouldn't be treated in just 4 issues.

[Joe Rice]

Didn't Vaughn establish in his Mystique series that some of these more heinous Mystique acts were committed by a shapeshifting imposter?

[MakeshiftHero]

Considering a half dozen people have mentioned it, you arn't the first. And I doubt it has anything to do with Wanda, given that Polaris appears to be in India and Wanda was in a village at the base of Mount Wundagore. :)
Ok thanks for the info I was trying to see if anyone did mention it but i guess i over looked it thanks.

[f4faith]

Didn't Vaughn establish in his Mystique series that some of these more heinous Mystique acts were committed by a shapeshifting imposter?

No. He had Mystique imply that but it was all her word (well wouldn't it be in Mystique's character and favor to lie about something like that?) and it really made no sense since there was far more evidence that most of it was Mystique. You might could discount the one who cut Banshee's throat but when Mystique killed Moria, stabbed Rogue and tried to kill the entire human population, she was captured. That captured Mystique was the same one who told Gambit and Storm about Destiny's complete set of Diaries - something Destiny left for Kitty previously at one of Mystique houses and Mystique sent to Xavier others so they could drive him crazy. Now why would an imposter know or care about giving that to the X-Men?

I think these X-books look better than ever! Brubaker and Carey! Finally a change to the status quo! (How can Fishtaco complain that this is unoriginal?!)

Well Carey's whole story idea does sound suspeciously like Claremont's the Neo during Revolution and adding unbelievable villains to the cast without addressing the fact that no one would do that so simply has recently been a staple of X-Men. Not that Carey might not make it work but it's been done.

I'm still more on board with Brubaker but Deadly Genesis was pretty predictable and I'ver never been a big Sh'iar fan.

all but storm and fairy tales

I'm getting all four of the Fairy Tales. I'm especially interested to see the Xavier and Magneto one. I think they could be quite fun and in this case I love a good ghost story.

[fishtaco]

Beast, how do you know where Wanda was?

I think these X-books look better than ever! Brubaker and Carey! Finally a change to the status quo! (How can Fishtaco complain that this is unoriginal?!)Because it is unoriginal. Nearly everything over the past 15 years has been unoriginal. I'm pretty much done here. Off to back issues, with me.

[darkchambers]

I'm sincerely hoping that New Excalibur re-powers Chamber somehow. I really don't care how, although I'd like it more if it was original or really interesting, I just wish it happens. He'd make a pretty good member for Excalibur in my opinion. If not, I'm still holding on to the hope that he pops up in X-factor re-powered or something.

[Novaya Havoc]

Considering a half dozen people have mentioned it, you arn't the first. And I doubt it has anything to do with Wanda, given that Polaris appears to be in India and Wanda was in a village at the base of Mount Wundagore. :)

That is so not India. I'd wager anywhere between Turkey to (at farthest east) Pakistan.

[The Sword Is Drawn]

I'm sincerely hoping that New Excalibur re-powers Chamber somehow. I really don't care how, although I'd like it more if it was original or really interesting, I just wish it happens. He'd make a pretty good member for Excalibur in my opinion. If not, I'm still holding on to the hope that he pops up in X-factor re-powered or something.

It would be a bit contrived...

But yes, I agree he'd be an asset. NEX do not currently have a Psi Talent on board.

Even if he's not repowered right now, I'd like New Excalibur to check up on him occasionally. Keeping him in the books.

Maybe Brian could build him some mechanical organs, at least keeping him alive. Rather a flatscan than dead.

[Brian M.]

Because it is unoriginal. Nearly everything over the past 15 years has been unoriginal. I'm pretty much done here. Off to back issues, with me.

How is it unoriginal?

[Beast]

Beast, how do you know where Wanda was?
Because they showed her in the village at the base of Mount Wundagore in House of M #8.

[Doom Hammer]

Because it is unoriginal. Nearly everything over the past 15 years has been unoriginal. I'm pretty much done here. Off to back issues, with me.

"Nearly" doesn't count. :D

Grant Morrison's run, though widely disputed, was amazing and original. If you read it more often, you'll have more faith in humanity. Believe me.

I'm convinced that the problems of jaded fans everywhere could be solved by the inclusion of more Grant Morrison into their diets. Not just X-Men, either. Buy some All-Star Superman, and some of his older Vertigo books. They'll change your life.

*Waits for Beast to roll his eyes* :p

And on that note...

And how awesome does C&D sound? Deadpool v. the Great Lakes Avengers: THE REMATCH! Aw, hellz yeah, son! Ooh, and he gets to hang with Daredevil again! Remember the last time that happened? I do! '97 annual featuring Deadpool and Daredevil, kiddies. One of the greatest annuals eva'!

[Beast]

"Nearly" doesn't count. :D

Grant Morrison's run, though widely disputed, was amazing and original. If you read it more often, you'll have more faith in humanity. Believe me.

I'm convinced that the problems of jaded fans everywhere could be solved by the inclusion of more Grant Morrison into their diets. Not just X-Men, either. Buy some All-Star Superman, and some of his older Vertigo books. They'll change your life.

*Waits for Beast to roll his eyes* :p
Grant Morrison's run wasn't original. He rehashed many of Claremont classic plots and stories with new twists. Inovative maybe, but original... hardly. His characters didn't read true to their established personalities, and for the most part you could have shuffled the dialogue balloons around without even noticing. Using the characters for his own personal little sandbox to voice what he considered to be the problems with the series was equally horrid, such as ignoring facts just to have Logan make idiotic comments about wearng costumes. But I won't be rolling my eyes, because I did enjoy about half of Morrison's New X-Men. Assault on Weapon Plus, Planet X, and Here Comes Tommorow were dreck however.

[Novaya Havoc]

Grant Morrison's run wasn't original. He rehashed many of Claremont classic plots and stories with new twists. Inovative maybe, but original... hardly. His characters didn't read true to their established personalities, and for the most part you could have shuffled the dialogue balloons around without even noticing.

Wow. Sounds like New Excalibur. Minus the innovative part.

[Jellobay]

Grant Morrison's run wasn't original. He rehashed many of Claremont classic plots and stories with new twists. Inovative maybe, but original... hardly. His characters didn't read true to their established personalities, and for the most part you could have shuffled the dialogue balloons around without even noticing. Using the characters for his own personal little sandbox to voice what he considered to be the problems with the series was equally horrid, such as ignoring facts just to have Logan make idiotic comments about wearng costumes. But I won't be rolling my eyes, because I did enjoy about half of Morrison's New X-Men. Assault on Weapon Plus, Planet X, and Here Comes Tommorow were dreck however.


Don't forget Cat-beast, that was a classic move there.

[Beast]

Wow. Sounds like New Excalibur. Minus the innovative part.
Hardly. At least New Excalibur has quality writing. :p

[Faded]

I didn't even read the C&D solicit. Great Lakes Avengers? I guess this is going to be my jumping on point for the title.

[Novaya Havoc]

Hardly. At least New Excalibur has quality writing. :p

Quality compared to what? Millie the Model?

[zonzorp]

Quality compared to what? Millie the Model?
Compared to Dazzler 13, the "Women in Prison" catfight issue.

[Novaya Havoc]

Compared to Dazzler 13, the "Women in Prison" catfight issue.

Really? I'd figure you'd like it, considering Dazzler defeated, like, 4 characters at once. Sounds kind of like Sage in near every appearance she's in, except Sage does it without getting hurt.

[zonzorp]

Really? I'd figure you'd like it, considering Dazzler defeated, like, 4 characters at once. Sounds kind of like Sage in near every appearance she's in, except Sage does it without getting hurt.
You haven't been paying attention. (http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/5854/sagelosing7sy.jpg) Sage gets hurt quite a bit.

[Novaya Havoc]

You haven't been paying attention. (http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/5854/sagelosing7sy.jpg) Sage gets hurt quite a bit.

Oh. She gets slapped now and then. But that's in between her jumpstarting every mutant in a 3-mile radius while providing free wifi to needy college students everywhere.

[zonzorp]

Oh. She gets slapped now and then. But that's in between her jumpstarting every mutant in a 3-mile radius while providing free wifi to needy college students everywhere.
Sage has used her jumpstart 4 times in 5 years.

[Hi-Fi]

Sage has used her jumpstart 4 times in 5 years.

You think that's not a lot?? :eek:

[Doom Hammer]

Grant Morrison's run wasn't original. He rehashed many of Claremont classic plots and stories with new twists. Inovative maybe, but original... hardly.

And in which issue did Claremont introduce fetus-boxing? :D

He toyed with a lot of classic X-Men storylines and concepts, sure...but he introduced a lot of new junk into it. Mutant culture, U-Men, the new vision of Xavier's school, X-Corps: an entire groundwork for a new X-Men era (which was largely discarded, but oh well...)

No, you do have good points that I won't argue, though. They just don't bother me that much, but I do acknowledge their existence. Different strokes, and all that.

But I won't be rolling my eyes, because I did enjoy about half of Morrison's New X-Men. Assault on Weapon Plus, Planet X, and Here Comes Tommorow were dreck however.

How was Here Comes Tomorrow bad?! Ah, Beast, I fear I will never understand that idea...

[Beast]

How was Here Comes Tomorrow bad?! Ah, Beast, I fear I will never understand that idea...
I just didn't buy the reason behind Hank's downfall. I don't have a problem with Hank being corrupted, but the reasoning was rather poor. Plus Sublime is a horrid concept. The human race doesn't need an intelligent bacteria to hate and fear mutants. There isn't one behind all the hate and fear running rampant in the world today. That said, there are 3 things I like about HCT. 1. Tito Bohusk, Beak II. 2. Cassandra Nova as a reformed villain. 3. Dark Phoenix Beast shutting off Wolverine's healing factor and cutting him in half. :D

[Faded]

In the new Newsarama article Hi-Fi posted in the Psylocke thread (now that its closed), are the Runaways getting new looks? Gert looks so effin hot its ridiculous.

[Jake V]

How was Here Comes Tomorrow bad?! Ah, Beast, I fear I will never understand that idea...
Coming from probably the biggest fan of Morrison's run on this board (and I'll challenge anyone for that title!), there was one really big problem with Here Comes Tomorrow:

Marc Silvestri.

He was horribly mismatched for that story. Morrison should have found a way to get Quitely back for those last 4 issues. Hell, Van Sciver would have been a better choice.

[Hi-Fi]

In the new Newsarama article Hi-Fi posted in the Psylocke thread (now that its closed), are the Runaways getting new looks? Gert looks so effin hot its ridiculous.

I made the same question in BKV forum. I don't know if that pic is an old sketche or new designs.

Nico's hair looks really cool! She's hot! Gert looks ultra hot too!

[Hi-Fi]

Oh, and Molly's new hat is super cute as well.

[fishtaco]

"Nearly" doesn't count. :D

Grant Morrison's run, though widely disputed, was amazing and original. If you read it more often, you'll have more faith in humanity. Believe me.

I'm convinced that the problems of jaded fans everywhere could be solved by the inclusion of more Grant Morrison into their diets. Not just X-Men, either. Buy some All-Star Superman, and some of his older Vertigo books. They'll change your life.

*Waits for Beast to roll his eyes* :p I thought that Morrison brought a lot of new ideas to the table. He is one of the best X-writers ever, imo. There was a lot he did that I do not like, but most of it was dead-on. Look over everything from the past 15 years anywhere from Lobdell, to Raab, to Whedon, to Brubaker, to Pak, Harras, Austen, Milligan, Waid. It's all been done before. I won't be reading Grant Morrison's DC books, or anything by DC for that matter (except for V for Vendetta).

The books have never been worse. Not even in the 90's was it this bad. I'm fed up with it. The writers, the editors, the gimmicks. So I'll be focusing completely on back issues in a manner of months. Why would I pay 2.99 for something that I think is garbage when I can pay 25 cents for something that is a million times better quality?

[dotdotdot]

I just didn't buy the reason behind Hank's downfall. I don't have a problem with Hank being corrupted, but the reasoning was rather poor. Plus Sublime is a horrid concept. The human race doesn't need an intelligent bacteria to hate and fear mutants. There isn't one behind all the hate and fear running rampant in the world today. That said, there are 3 things I like about HCT. 1. Tito Bohusk, Beak II. 2. Cassandra Nova as a reformed villain. 3. Dark Phoenix Beast shutting off Wolverine's healing factor and cutting him in half. :D

you know no one cares that you have a favorite character really. it makes you a stickler.......beast's attempt to run the school ending in despair is completly in line with his mild depression and extreme love of the students that was built up over the entire run. rushed? maybe. but it wasn't poor reasoning.
and the sublime concept tied everything together so well, much better villian concept than anything else they've faced, save nova and magneto. it also made phoenix's death mean something and it gave the series an amazing jumping off point with scott and emma running the school, while also taking care of the problems of the sublime explanation by having phoenix extract sublime from reality.
it had problems and was rushed, but it was really a win-win storyline/arc on all levels. can't imagine how anyone could complain here.

edit: man that was off-topic.
june's going to solve everything, the flagship needs storytelling like brubaker's, and x-men needs a reason to exist, which like it or not will at least be solved by this wacky line-up.

[Beast]

you know no one cares that you have a favorite character really. it makes you a stickler.......beast's attempt to run the school ending in despair is completly in line with his mild depression and extreme love of the students that was built up over the entire run. rushed? maybe. but it wasn't poor reasoning.
and the sublime concept tied everything together so well, much better villian concept than anything else they've faced, save nova and magneto. it also made phoenix's death mean something and it gave the series an amazing jumping off point with scott and emma running the school, while also taking care of the problems of the sublime explanation by having phoenix extract sublime from reality.
it had problems and was rushed, but it was really a win-win storyline/arc on all levels. can't imagine how anyone could complain here.
Actually, it doesn't make me a stickler. I noted that I don't have problems with Hank being corrupted. I said I have issues with the reason why, and also with the whole concept of Sublime as a whole.

And no, Sublime was an absurd villain and a cheap knock-off of 'That Which Endures' from Great Lakes Avengers. And Sublime wasn't extracted from reality, all Phoenix did was decontaminate Hank. It's still out there, another of the countless dropped plots that won't be mentioned, other than in the 'Weapon X: Days of Future Now' mini that was awful and didn't clear up anything that was promised.

And clearly people can complain, because I'm not the only one who doesn't like that arc.

[dotdotdot]

Actually, it doesn't make me a stickler. I noted that I don't have problems with Hank being corrupted. I said I have issues with the reason why, and also with the whole concept of Sublime as a whole.

And no, Sublime was an absurd villain and a cheap knock-off of 'That Which Endures' from Great Lakes Avengers. And Sublime wasn't extracted from reality, all Phoenix did was decontaminate Hank. It's still out there, another of the countless dropped plots that won't be mentioned, other than in the 'Weapon X: Days of Future Now' mini that was awful and didn't clear up anything that was promised.

And clearly people can complain, because I'm not the only one who doesn't like that arc.

no it was extracted from reality, it's gone.
and it's not as if something like this wasn't done before GLA, so that's an extremely absurd perspective. you've also got no idea how to differentiate between someone ripping something off and someone being influenced. for example, your gripes about originality vs innovation pertaining to claremont's influence on new x-men...... try to objectify a bit.

[Beast]

no it was extracted from reality, it's gone.
and it's not as if something like this wasn't done before GLA, so that's an extremely absurd perspective. you've also got no idea how to differentiate between someone ripping something off and someone being influenced. for example, your gripes about originality vs innovation pertaining to claremont's influence on new x-men...... try to objectify a bit.
No, Sublime is not extracted from reality. I just re-read all of Morrison's run, all she did was decontaminate Beast of Sublime 150 years in the future. And then cut away that dark future. She never extracted Sublime from reality. In fact the whole concept of 'Days of Future Now' was that Sublime still existed.

Sure, it's been done in other mediums before. But Sublime and 'That Which Endures' have more than just similarites going for them. Both claim to or have influenced evolution and didn't exist in mutants. Both used a means of infusing themselves to a mutant, and controlling them. It's the same exact thing, just wrapped up in a new package with a new name. Just like the majority of Grant Morrison's run.

[dotdotdot]

No, Sublime is not extracted from reality. I just re-read all of Morrison's run, all she did was decontaminate Beast of Sublime 150 years in the future. And then cut away that dark future. She never extracted Sublime from reality. In fact the whole concept of 'Days of Future Now' was that Sublime still existed.

Sure, it's been done in other mediums before. But Sublime and 'That Which Endures' have more than just similarites going for them. Both claim to or have influenced evolution and didn't exist in mutants. Both used a means of infusing themselves to a mutant, and controlling them. It's the same exact thing, just wrapped up in a new package with a new name. Just like the majority of Grant Morrison's run.

the implication is that she took care of sublime and saved the timeline. i think the reason it hasn't been mentioned again is because it's done, and that weaponx mini is more a case of a writer not understanding that than it is of a writer acknowledging the villian. and as far as the villian its a pretty vague concept, it's not as if two writers couldn't come up with that same thing, even from being influenced by separate sources (john carpenter's the thing comes to mind, probably dozens of other stories/concepts)
maybe if you had read more morrison you'd have an idea of what's going on here, which isn't said to be pretentious, its just i think you're talking out of your ass as far as making assumptions about originality/ripping someone off.

but we should probably leave this for another thread.
june solits is hottt freal

[Beast]

the implication is that she took care of sublime and saved the timeline. i think the reason it hasn't been mentioned again is because it's done, and that weaponx mini is more a case of a writer not understanding that than it is of a writer acknowledging the villian. and as far as the villian its a pretty vague concept, it's not as if two writers couldn't come up with that same thing, even from being influenced by separate sources (john carpenter's the thing comes to mind, probably dozens of other stories/concepts)
maybe if you had read more morrison you'd have an idea of what's going on here, which isn't said ot be pretentious, its just i think you're talking out of your ass as far as making assumptions about originality/ripping someone off.

but we should probably leave this for another thread.
june solits is hottt freal
There's nothing implied at all about what she did. She decontaminated and destroyed Sublime 150 years into the future of a reality that no longer exists. Nowhere in that last issue is it implied that Sublime is destroyed and cleansed from existance. And it's hardly a vague concept when both entities share so many similarities. I'm not saying that Morrison stole the idea and used it as his own, for all we know he read the TWE storyline years ago, and it inspiried him. And that he never realized that he was basically doing the same thing with Sublime that was done with TWE. And don't have to read more of Morrison's work to understand what is going on, it's all laid out there in the books as clear as crystal. I'm not talking out of my ass, I'm deconstructing the obvious similarities and outright carbon copies of things in Morrison's run.

[dotdotdot]

There's nothing implied at all about what she did. She decontaminated and destroyed Sublime 150 years into the future of a reality that no longer exists. Nowhere in that last issue is it implied that Sublime is destroyed and cleansed from existance. And it's hardly a vague concept when both entities share so many similarities. I'm not saying that Morrison stole the idea and used it as his own, for all we know he read the TWE storyline years ago, and it inspiried him. And that he never realized that he was basically doing the same thing with Sublime that was done with TWE. And don't have to read more of Morrison's work to understand what is going on, it's all laid out there in the books as clear as crystal. I'm not talking out of my ass, I'm deconstructing the obvious similarities and outright carbon copies of things in Morrison's run.

actually you do, sublime is the aerosol version of the invisibles, the sheeda, status-q, etc. morrison concepts, all. you are extremely uninformed here - you're out of your element. and yes, i think its a basic misunderstanding of the arc, the point of that ending in the white hot room is that she cleansed sublime from existence AND altered the timeline so that scott says yes, saving the day twofold.
i guess start with animal man, maybe, you'll enjoy it.

[Beast]

actually you do, sublime is the aerosol version of the invisibles, the sheeda, status-q, etc. morrison concepts, all. you are extremely uninformed here - you're out of your element. and yes, i think its a basic misunderstanding of the arc, the point of that ending in the white hot room is that she cleansed sublime from existence AND altered the timeline so that scott says yes, saving the day twofold.
i guess start with animal man, maybe, you'll enjoy it.
All which are post-TWE. And no, that's never implied once she reaches the White Hot Room. The only thing that she does is nudge Scott together with Emma. The aspects of Sublime are not refrenced at all, post her decontamination of Hank. And there's nothing to imply that she did that, given that Sublime still exists and has been shown in the guise of Dr. Sublime after that. And no thank you, I have no interest in punishing myself by reading more of Grant Morrison's work.

[dotdotdot]

All which are post-TWE. And no, that's never implied once she reaches the White Hot Room. The only thing that she does is nudge Scott together with Emma. The aspects of Sublime are not refrenced at all, post her decontamination of Hank. And there's nothing to imply that she did that, given that Sublime still exists and has been shown in the guise of Dr. Sublime after that. And no thank you, I have no interest in punishing myself by reading more of Grant Morrison's work.

way to admit that you are completely off-base and refuse to acknowledge the information.

[Beast]

way to admit that you are completely off-base and refuse to acknowledge the information.
No, I am not off base. My opinion is just as valid as yours.

At least I don't refuse to acknowledge the similarities when they exist.

[dotdotdot]

No, I am not off base. My opinion is just as valid as yours.

At least I don't refuse to acknowledge the similarities when they exist.

i see the similarities, but the other morrison concepts from earlier work have zero to do with that which endures but still obviously lead up to the concept of sublime, and now sheeda.
you're grasping at straws, and you should let go of that.
what's awesome and surprising is that i just saw a pic from that which endures which does resemble mckenna's "magic mirror", but that's probably projecting from having read that material and seen magic mirror used by morrison a few times.

[dotdotdot]

No, I am not off base. My opinion is just as valid as yours.

At least I don't refuse to acknowledge the similarities when they exist.

also all opinions aren't valid.

[Beast]

also all opinions aren't valid.
You would be incorrect in that assumption.

[dotdotdot]

You would be incorrect in that assumption.

we can all pretend that you can use "it's just my opinion" as a disclaimer and somehow escape from being wrong. but the world doesn't work that way. people should just get informed instead, it's sheer laziness otherwise.
this was a general statement that has little to do with our argument.

[dotdotdot]

sup with them june solicits tho

[Beast]

we can all pretend that you can use "it's just my opinion" as a disclaimer and somehow escape from being wrong. but the world doesn't work that way. people should just get informed instead, it's sheer laziness otherwise.
this was a general statement that has little to do with our argument.
I am informed. And just because you want to ignore a similarity, doesn't make your opinion or your interpretation factual.

[dotdotdot]

I am informed. And just because you want to ignore a similarity, doesn't make your opinion or your interpretation factual.

i've read everything the author in question has done = informed.
also read up on that which endures.
also observed your skewed perspective in plenty of other threads.
informed.
like i said, i see the similarity, but you shouldn't need everyone to give you recognition for finding it. it's coming off like you're just so angry that no one else really remember's twe, and you just want to point it out, which has a typical fanboy ring to it. but i'd rather give you a little more credit than that.

[Beast]

i've read everything the author in question has done = informed.
also read up on that which endures.
also observed your skewed perspective in plenty of other threads.
informed.
like i said, i see the similarity, but you shouldn't need everyone to give you recognition for finding it. it's coming off like you're just so angry that no one else really remember's twe, and you just want to point it out, which has a typical fanboy ring to it. but i'd rather give you a little more credit than that.
Having read everything the author has done doesn't make your opinion a fact.

[dotdotdot]

Having read everything the author has done doesn't make your opinion a fact.

certainly gives my opinion more validity.
anyways, this debate's finished.

[Doom Hammer]

Wow, I'm really sorry I brought this up.

I haven't read all things Morrison, but I'm a big fan, so I've read a bit.

A character/being like Sublime is common to a lot of Grant Morrison's stories, sure. Worlds inside of worlds, the influence of unseen factors, it's not like he's never touched on the concept. Just look at the Filth. Sublime hates mutants because they represent change and difference, the Filth eliminates "anti-persons" because they disrupt the status quo. Sure, it's a simplistic way of looking at it, but I'm trying to make a point.

Having said that, Beast brings up a perfectly valid point about Sublime's presence in the context of the Marvel Universe. It's not new. And to imply that someone has to have read anything Grant's ever touched to understand his X-Men run is laughable, but at least I understand why Morrison fans get the reputation they have now.

[dotdotdot]

Wow, I'm really sorry I brought this up.

I haven't read all things Morrison, but I'm a big fan, so I've read a bit.

A character/being like Sublime is common to a lot of Grant Morrison's stories, sure. Worlds inside of worlds, the influence of unseen factors, it's not like he's never touched on the concept. Just look at the Filth. Sublime hates mutants because they represent change and difference, the Filth eliminates "anti-persons" because they disrupt the status quo. Sure, it's a simplistic way of looking at it, but I'm trying to make a point.

Having said that, Beast brings up a perfectly valid point about Sublime's presence in the context of the Marvel Universe. It's not new. And to imply that someone has to have read anything Grant's ever touched to understand his X-Men run is laughable, but at least I understand why Morrison fans get the reputation they have now.

oh the only problem was a lack of understanding about what should be considered ripping off or unoriginal. but if you're going to accuse an author of such things and then refuse to read his work..........you might get called out on it.
there's no need to mediate here. anyway i fully agree with this post, except at the end there where you kinda lose it.
let's put this baby back on topic though....

edit: oh and i went back and read something, i really like this that beast said:
"The human race doesn't need an intelligent bacteria to hate and fear mutants. There isn't one behind all the hate and fear running rampant in the world today."
though i think that in his manifesto a way that morrison may have wanted to push the franchise past its 60s roots is to manifest that issue or race and human reaction to it as a villian, eradicate it, and see what's left after that. cause we really don't need god loves man kills 3.

[Beast]

Wow, I'm really sorry I brought this up.

I haven't read all things Morrison, but I'm a big fan, so I've read a bit.

A character/being like Sublime is common to a lot of Grant Morrison's stories, sure. Worlds inside of worlds, the influence of unseen factors, it's not like he's never touched on the concept. Just look at the Filth. Sublime hates mutants because they represent change and difference, the Filth eliminates "anti-persons" because they disrupt the status quo. Sure, it's a simplistic way of looking at it, but I'm trying to make a point.

Having said that, Beast brings up a perfectly valid point about Sublime's presence in the context of the Marvel Universe. It's not new. And to imply that someone has to have read anything Grant's ever touched to understand his X-Men run is laughable, but at least I understand why Morrison fans get the reputation they have now.
Thank you. It's the same way with Radical Claremont fans. I try to find the good in everyone's work. That's why I like most of half of Morrison's run, as well as aspects of Austen's, Milligan's, and Whedon's. As well as the boatload of other writers who have had signifigant impacts on the X-Men franchise.

[Hi-Fi]

Oh, and Molly's new hat is super cute as well.


No one is talking about Molly's new super cute hat. :evilangry

[Sentinel K]

No one is talking about Molly's new super cute hat. :evilangry

Thats coz it sucks balls. Like a hammer.

[Hi-Fi]

Thats coz it sucks balls. Like a hammer.

Go f*ck ypurself, troll!! :evilangry

[Beast]

No one is talking about Molly's new super cute hat. :evilangry
Who's Molly, and why do I care about her hat? ;)

[Hi-Fi]

Who's Molly, and why do I care about her hat? ;)

Molly is the Runaways youngest member, she's a mutant, she'll someday marry Wolverine and she has a new super cute hat. :)

[Hi-Fi]

Thats coz it sucks balls. Like a hammer.

Ok, it's kinda ugly....

[Beast]

Molly is the Runaways youngest member, she's a mutant, she'll someday marry Wolverine and she has a new super cute hat. :)
I still need to get that HC sometime. :)

[Sentinel K]

Ok, it's kinda ugly....

Just for the record I have no idea what you are talking about.

Or why hammers suck balls.

[Hi-Fi]

I still need to get that HC sometime. :)

Yes, you need...like now.

[Hi-Fi]

Just for the record I have no idea what you are talking about.

Or why hammers suck balls.

Don't you read Runaways, sucker??

Go read it...like now.


Déja vu.

[Sentinel K]

Don't you read Runaways, sucker??

Go read it...like now.


Déja vu.

I might read the trades one day. Maybe. Possibly.

[Doom Hammer]

It's the same way with Radical Claremont fans.

This is true, very true. I kept thinking that, because it goes both ways.

I try to find the good in everyone's work. That's why I like most of half of Morrison's run, as well as aspects of Austen's, Milligan's, and Whedon's. As well as the boatload of other writers who have had signifigant impacts on the X-Men franchise.

And that, my friend, is why I don't hate you. :D

[Doom Hammer]

I still need to get that HC sometime. :)

I actually went and bought it a while ago. It's pretty awesome. The giant-sized artwork looks nice.

(Thought I haven't picked up the ongoing yet. I wonder why that is?)

Come on, it's like $35 for 18 issues. You can't get a better deal in a trade/HC.

[Faded]

Molly's new hate IS super cute!!! But in the sketches she looks like she's grown up a lot, and NOW she's getting a panda hat??!?! :D