Wolverine Origin Question

[Billy Parker]

I just finished Wolverine Origin on DVD (it's a kick ass format of comics! (http://www.eagleonemedia.com/dcb_titles.htm) ) My question is: Who is Wolverine's biological father? Can anyone tell me or is it unkown?

Because his grandfather had claws, which would mean he has to get them from his father's line. BUT, he looks exactly like Thomas Logan, who had an affair with James/Wolverine's mama, but Thomas Logan doesn't have claws.

Also, does his grandfather have a healing factor? If he does, how old does that make him?

So who is his father?!

Well if these answers are spoilers of the upcoming Wolverine Origins #1, write a spolier warning above it please.

[Affinity]

On DVD, eh? How does that work?

Like, the camera just pans across the panels or what?

[Will.S]

I just finished Wolverine Origin on DVD (it's a kick ass format of comics! (http://www.eagleonemedia.com/dcb_titles.htm) ) My question is: Who is Wolverine's biological father? Can anyone tell me or is it unkown?

Because his grandfather had claws, which would mean he has to get them from his father's line. BUT, he looks exactly like Thomas Logan, who had an affair with James/Wolverine's mama, but Thomas Logan doesn't have claws.

Also, does his grandfather have a healing factor? If he does, how old does that make him?

So who is his father?!

Well if these answers are spoilers of the upcoming Wolverine Origins #1, write a spolier warning above it please.
Although it's left a bit ambiguous, I believe Wolverine is the bastard son of Thomas Logan and Elizabeth Howlett. The grandfather was on John's side of the family and he and Thomas Logan didn't have any mutant powers although it's very possible that Thomas carried the mutant gene.

The big question is how Elizabeth got that claw scar on her back which is odd.

[R Krippler]

That was answered in Wolverine the end it was his older brother who also has claws, he was thought to be dead, in origins

[Will.S]

That was answered in Wolverine the end it was his older brother who also has claws, he was thought to be dead, in origins
I don't think Wolverine The End is canon though. Plus Dog never revealed any claws during Origin.

Edit: Actually let me correct myself, you were right, it was the older deceased brother from before James was born so it looks like Elizabeth might have been the prime carrier of the mutant gene.

[R Krippler]

I don't think Wolverine The End is canon though. Plus Dog never revealed any claws during Origin.

O if its not canon then I don't know. But I wasn't talking about dog, but his older brother from Elizabeth who died. They mention him in Origins subtly.

[Billy Parker]

On DVD, eh? How does that work?

Like, the camera just pans across the panels or what?
Yes, they move over the actual panels, and voice actors read the narration and dialogue. It works really well and the voices actors are good too. It plays like a movie. You should get one to try it out, it's sweet, and affordable/cheap!

I just don't see how James/Wolvie gets the claws. From who? Thomas Logan doesn't have claws. I guess John Howlett must be his father. That would mean Thomas Logan never inpregnated Elizabeth Howlett.

And then Dog (who is Sabertooth I believe, right?) must have some other mother, right?

Yah and about those claw marks on Elizabeth...doesn't John Howlett see them and think "What the fu..? So who gave her those?" Her first son, or her father-in-law maybe?

And then James/Wolverine Howlett still looks identical to Thomas Logan. Why?

At this point, it doesn't make logical sense to me. Maybe someone can clarify? I still like the story though.

[Crimson]

When was his grandfather shown with claws?

Oh and according to Jenkins, Dog wasn't meant to be Sabretooth.

[Billy Parker]

When was his grandfather shown with claws?

Oh and according to Jenkins, Dog wasn't meant to be Sabretooth.
I believe his grandfather has claws right before he tells Rose to leave with James/Wolverine. He gives them money and says to leave on the train and never return. I could be mistaken, but I'm sure I remember him having claws. They are short so it may be tough to see at first. Someone look for it.

[Crimson]

I believe his grandfather has claws right before he tells Rose to leave with James/Wolverine. He gives them money and says to leave on the train and never return. I could be mistaken, but I'm sure I remember him having claws. They are short so it may be tough to see at first. Someone look for it.

I'll flick over the issue tonight in bed. Sounds interesting... Thanks

[R Krippler]

I believe his grandfather has claws right before he tells Rose to leave with James/Wolverine. He gives them money and says to leave on the train and never return. I could be mistaken, but I'm sure I remember him having claws. They are short so it may be tough to see at first. Someone look for it.
I see where it appears that his grandfather has claws, but I think he is just holding James hand.

[Billy Parker]

I see where it appears that his grandfather has claws, but I think he is just holding James hand.
Hm, that's another thing I was wondering. Yes, he may be holding James hand. I'm not sure. Now that I think about it, that might be what happens.

Well I'm still a little confused. I guess I'm wondering who he gets the claws from and who is his real father since that is not really answered. Maybe it will be answered in the new Wolverine Origins.

[mattbib]

Well I'm still a little confused. I guess I'm wondering who he gets the claws from and who is his real father since that is not really answered. Maybe it will be answered in the new Wolverine Origins.The claws are his genetic mutation.

He doesn't "get" them from anybody...just from the genes he inherited.

[R Krippler]

The claws are his genetic mutation.

He doesn't "get" them from anybody...just from the genes he inherited.
Yeah but somebody else has/had claws because his mother has claw marks on her side, and they never tell us who did it. Thats what we are trying to figure out. In Wolvie The End they say it is his older brother but they sa ythat that isn't canon.

[Tag06]

Yeah but somebody else has/had claws because his mother has claw marks on her side, and they never tell us who did it. Thats what we are trying to figure out. In Wolvie The End they say it is his older brother but they sa ythat that isn't canon.

It's based off of canon, so it was Wolvies bro who clawed the mom.

[R Krippler]

thanks for the clear up tag

[TJ Shoun]

Thomas Logan is Wolverine's biological father, the result of an affair with Elizabeth Howlett.

Wolverine's older brother - supposedly dead in Origin- is the one who clawed Elizabeth, their mother.

This also bears out in Wolverine The End, even though it's not canon. (Of course, in The End, Wolverine's older brother is alive.)

Poor John Howlett... his wife was screwing around on him, and he probably had no idea that James wasn't truly his son. Elizabeth was a basketcase ever since birthing her first mutant child (the villain in The End), as evidenced by the scars on her back.

Dog and Wolverine are half-brothers -- Thomas Logan is father to both.

Just going from appearance and similarity of mutation, it looks like James's older brother (the villain in The End) is also Thomas Logan's child, which would imply that...

- Their particular mutant gene is paternally inherited.

and

- Elizabeth Howlett and Thomas Logan had an ongoing affair, not a one-time fling.

and

- Thomas Logan needs to buy some condoms. The older Howlett brother, James, and Dog are all implied to be his.

Jenkins and Co. and stated that Dog wasn't explicity intended to be Sabretooth, but they did leave it ambiguous on purpose. After all, if he is Victor Creed, why didn't the healing factor erase his facial scars? (Granted, healing factors are sometimes a secondary mutation, so there are ways around that.)

I hope it's revealed Dog is Sabretooth. I love the idea of Wolverine and Sabretooth being half-brothers. :)

[bagheera]

Whoa, there, mister! We don't know that James' older brother was also by Thomas Logan. Mom may be the carrier of the mutant gene.

The striking resemblance of grown-up-Logan to Thomas Logan is so undeniable, it would be a far-fetched coincidence for them to say that Logan wasn't his bastard child.

Red herrings, anyone?
:rolleyes:

[Tag06]

thanks for the clear up tag

Your Welcome.

[TJ Shoun]

Whoa, there, mister! We don't know that James' older brother was also by Thomas Logan. Mom may be the carrier of the mutant gene.

The striking resemblance of grown-up-Logan to Thomas Logan is so undeniable, it would be a far-fetched coincidence for them to say that Logan wasn't his bastard child.

Red herrings, anyone?
:rolleyes:

Sure, but what are the chances that Thomas Logan fathered 3 sons by two different women (James and his older brother by Elizabeth, and Dog by someone unknown)... and both mothers happened to carry the mutant gene for feral-type mutation.

No, it's much more likely that Thomas Logan - the father - is the carrier. Besides all three children exhibit similar mutations... and it's much more likely that Thomas Logan is the genetic connection.

Besides, does Wolverine's older brother really resemble John Howlett in The End? No.

Of course, I could be wrong... and Marvel hasn't committed to anything (as usual) but it's the only way it makes sense.

[Buddahbelly]

I hope it's revealed Dog is Sabretooth. I love the idea of Wolverine and Sabretooth being half-brothers. :)

I beleve in the first ongoing wolverine series ish 42,43, or 44, there was a genetic test done on logan and sabertooth and found to have no genetic relation. Therefor either dog and logan are not brothers or dog is not sabertooth.

[Asian Knight]

What about Dog being in fact Kyle Gibney? I mean Kyle is a feral to my knowledge with the fangs and look. He was also a villian as Weapon Omega right or wrong? And then turned good as WildHeart.

[TJ Shoun]

What about Dog being in fact Kyle Gibney? I mean Kyle is a feral to my knowledge with the fangs and look. He was also a villian as Weapon Omega right or wrong? And then turned good as WildHeart.

Kyle is a smaller-framed guy -- a feral-type mutant, yeah, but nowhere near the size of Dog or Sabretooth.

Y'never know, but I don't think Kyle is Dog.



I beleve in the first ongoing wolverine series ish 42,43, or 44, there was a genetic test done on logan and sabertooth and found to have no genetic relation. Therefor either dog and logan are not brothers or dog is not sabertooth.

Wasn't it revealed that SHIELD had altered the test results, or something along those lines?

I remember the test results being scrutinized for some reason...

[streator]

What about Dog being in fact Kyle Gibney? I mean Kyle is a feral to my knowledge with the fangs and look. He was also a villian as Weapon Omega right or wrong? And then turned good as WildHeart.
wildchild is not dog.
in fact, wildchild's powers partially come from spliced dna of a mutant named wyre.
read about it here:
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/db/spotlight/showquestion.asp?faq=10&fldAuto=81

[TJ Shoun]

Of course, I'm going by the assumption that Dog (Sabretooth or not) is indeed a mutant.

It's been a while since I read Origin -- I can't recall if there was any evidence of Dog being a mutant. Maybe he isn't.

If Dog is a regular human, then the older Howlett brother may very well have been fathered by John Howlett or someone else.

Still, I feel like Marvel has laid the groundwork for expalaining the Sabretooth/Wolverine relationship, even if they haven't committed to it yet.

Think about it this way: if Dog turns out to be someone other than Victor Creed, then the whole thing becomes silly. That would mean there are two very similar characters (both in personality and body structure) who have deep ties to Logan's past, and feel they have carte blanche to beat on Logan.

That would be kinda stupid.

Besides, Creed always had a bully mentality when it comes to Logan, a lot like Dog's relationship to James.

[Buddahbelly]

Wasn't it revealed that SHIELD had altered the test results, or something along those lines?

I remember the test results being scrutinized for some reason...
The tests stated the blood types were clearly decernible. Nick Fury knew sabertooth wasn't his father but stated that sabertooth "really thought he was your pappy logan".

[Buddahbelly]

Nick said he couldn't tell him cuz it was "classified ultra hush".

[TJ Shoun]

Nick said he couldn't tell him cuz it was "classified ultra hush".

Fury couldn't tell him what exactly?

[Buddahbelly]

Fury couldn't tell him what exactly?
that he knew that sabertooth wasn't logans father. But regardless, the test said no relation.

[fishtaco]

I wish it was Sabretooth, but I know now that this isn't the case. There were already so many hints dropped in Uncanny X-Men #'s 212-213, Wolverine (2nd Series) #'s 10, 125-128. :(

[Mr.Musgrave]

After all, if he is Victor Creed, why didn't the healing factor erase his facial scars? (Granted, healing factors are sometimes a secondary mutation, so there are ways around that.)


Remember that Sabretooth didn't have a healing factor when he first appeared as an Iron Fist villain. I'm not sure when it kicked in but he didn't have it when he was first introduced.

And as someone else said, Dog not being Sabretooth would be really silly. Not that the rest of the Origin book wasn't silly, but still....

[ednemo]

Okay, here goes:

James is the bastard son of Elizabeth Howlett and Thomas Logan.
Dog is the human son of Thomas Logan and is dead.
Logan's older brother is the son of Elizabeth Howlett and John Howlett.
Elizabeth got the scars from her first child and she is the one that carries the mutant gene.
The grandfather is holding James' hand and does not have claws.

That's it in a nutshell. Sabretooth is just another guy. Though it is possible that he is Wolverine's son, brother, or whatever. James' parents seem to wander into different beds constantly, so it's not outside the realm of possibility.

[TJ Shoun]

Okay, here goes:

James is the bastard son of Elizabeth Howlett and Thomas Logan.

This is heavily implied, yeah.


Dog is the human son of Thomas Logan and is dead.

C'mon... this is comics, nobody stays dead forever. ;)



Logan's older brother is the son of Elizabeth Howlett and John Howlett.

We don't know that. It's left purposely ambiguous who the older brother's bioogical father is. It isn't revealed in The End either. John Howlett was probably under the assumption that James was his child, so who's to say James's older brother was John's child?



Elizabeth got the scars from her first child and she is the one that carries the mutant gene.

There is no proof that Elizabeth is gene carrier because we don't know who the father is. It could still go either way, which I'm sure was Marvel's intent with the mini series. Give some answers but leave more questions.



That's it in a nutshell. Sabretooth is just another guy. Though it is possible that he is Wolverine's son, brother, or whatever. James' parents seem to wander into different beds constantly, so it's not outside the realm of possibility.

Again, that's also left cloudy so we don't know for sure.

Instead of Origin, this book should have been called Ambiguous.

[Buddahbelly]

I guess the way I took it the affair didn't start untill after Liz was injured by the first child, as she blamed John for the "different" child. However she is has the gene. I can accept Dog and Logan being brothers, but not that Dog is Sabertooth. My opinion... ednemo's got it. Unless someone can come up with proof otherwise.

[R Krippler]

Does origin apply to the Ultimate Universe as well as the 616. Sorry to ask but I just want make sure that I don't have to worry about Ultimate Origin

[ednemo]

Does origin apply to the Ultimate Universe as well as the 616. Sorry to ask but I just want make sure that I don't have to worry about Ultimate Origin

No. Ultimate Wolverine has yet to be explained.

[beserkerclaw]

well the way the official guide state it is that John and Elizibeth Howlett are the parents but it could very well be Thomas Logan as the parent of Dog(who isnt sabretooth at all as said in Wolverine 43 and in volume 2 #50-55) and James but unless they say so he is not related to Thomas or Dog.

[SayOcean]

i really hope sabertooth isnt related to wolverine...that would just be dumb...next wed be seeing how feral, thornn, and rahne all came from the same litter....not ever mutant with similar powers has to be related

[Congo Jack]

Does origin apply to the Ultimate Universe as well as the 616. Sorry to ask but I just want make sure that I don't have to worry about Ultimate Origin
Jeph Loeb and Michael Turner were scheduled to do Ultimate Wolverine's Origin before Turner passed away.


...Dog(who isnt sabretooth at all as said in Wolverine 43 and in volume 2 #50-55)...
It's Vol. 3 :smile:


i really hope sabertooth isnt related to wolverine...that would just be dumb...next wed be seeing how feral, thornn, and rahne all came from the same litter....not ever mutant with similar powers has to be related
That was the intent with Sabretooth though, that he would be related to Wolverine. And that was before a few hundred mutants all had the same powers as each other.

[Bronze Badger]

Dog = Romulus

[beserkerclaw]

i really dont think so his origin seems to indicate that Romulas lived since the dawn of humanity making him older them Apocalypse if those were is memories he gave Logan in Evolution

[roleplay]

And then James/Wolverine Howlett still looks identical to Thomas Logan. Why?

At this point, it doesn't make logical sense to me. Maybe someone can clarify? I still like the story though.

Because Thomas is most likely the real father. It was strongly hinted that Elizabeth had a affair with Thomas after all. How do we know James isn't Thomas' son?

Good site for Wolverine info btw:
http://www.typingmonkeys.com/wolverine/