Dating question

[Noah Johnson]

Now, there's an assumption in our society that when finding someone to date, the gentleman ought to make the first move, the lady demurely waiting for the fellow to pursue her. And I'm not one to perpetuate sexist stereotypes, but this does seem to play out in practice a majority of the time.

I can't tell you how many women I've had complain to me that the guy they're interested in won't come over and talk to them/email them/call them/tear their clothes off and do obscene things to them. Lots of women seem to think that sending invisible telepathic signals is as much as they can do, despite the low success rate of this tactic. Nevertheless, there is resistance to the idea of women making the first move. One of my girlfriends even insists that the one time she tried approaching a guy herself, he was repulsed, insisting that girls aren't supposed to initiate contact.

So, a few questions that arise:

Women, do you do this? Why? How's it working out for you?

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?

How the heck do two women ever get together?

[TCJohnson]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?


Actually, yes I do.


How the heck do two women ever get together?


Well, if you use SK as an example....they don't.

[Expletive Deleted]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?Since I'm really bad at asking women out . . . holy balls, yeah.How the heck do two women ever get together?I'd imagine it would necessarily involve a meetcute. There are rules, after all.

[Ogdred]

How the heck do two women ever get together?

It's my understanding that it usually begins with some sort of tickle-fight.

[Tommy]

My advice: Don't do it.

[Noah Johnson]

My advice: Don't do it.
Don't do what, exactly?

[Lester C.]

Well, if you use SK as an example....they don't.

Best quote ever. :)

[Night Swordsman]

I do believe that TC has summoned the wrath of SK and her ferretweasels of Doom.

Let us mourn TC<bows head>

Here lies TCJohnson. He was a ok guy. But he should of NEVER crossed paths with a woman with attack ferrets. May he rest in pieces.

[Crowley]

it depends on the situation... I typically am the pursuer... but on the rare ocassion I've been the pursuee...

[Sabrinaset]

Women, do you do this? Why? How's it working out for you?

How the heck do two women ever get together?

Depends on the situation, or how cute the guy is. I guess it works out okay, except for the fact that I haven't really had any relationships last longer than a month...then again, it's hard dating a med student, something I've also heard a lot. I have no problem making the first move if I think the guy would be receptive to it. Or if I'm dating a comic book geek, which I have a few times. Yeah, I've been asked out at the comic shop I go to. But in those cases, I HAVE to make the first move! :)

You DO know there are these kinds of dating services for women, right? Heck, even the singles section in my paper has a "Women seeking women" portion on it, if you wanna do Dial-a-Date. Or the net. And Ms. Gail Simone always knows plenty of Lebians to hook me up with if I ask her nicely.

[Noah Johnson]

You DO know there are these kinds of dating services for women, right? Heck, even the singles section in my paper has a "Women seeking women" portion on it, if you wanna do Dial-a-Date. Or the net. And Ms. Gail Simone always knows plenty of Lebians to hook me up with if I ask her nicely.
Sure, I've used personals and matching sites myself. Even on there, though, someone has to make the first move, and the onus usually seems to fall on the fella. I've heard women say "This guy's profile looks hot... I wish he'd message me."

And, of course, I am aware that women hook up all the time, that question was mostly a humorous aside in the context of the situation I describe.

[Tommy]

Don't do what, exactly?
Date


lalalalalala

[lonesomefool]

Yes, because everyone wants to wind up sad, old and alone...that's my life goal ;)

Seriously, I would LOVE, LOVE, LOVE girls to come up to the guys they are interested in and make the first move. A lot of guys are just like me, with little self-esteem who just dont believe anyone would be interested them and end up possibly missing out on the "one".

[Tommy]

Yes, because everyone wants to wind up sad, old and alone...that's my life goal ;)
Tis better than poor and treated like crap.

[lonesomefool]

I dont know your life story so I cant comment on that too much, except that a true, healthy relationship should never leave you poor or treated like crap. I may never find love, chances are I wont, but I'm not one of those people who can fill my life with riches and feel whole, some can and live perfectly happy lives, but I already know I'm not one of them. Let me put it this way, last week I spent close to $50 on comics. If I had the choice between going on a date with a nice girl who I felt an emotional connection with or those comics, I would toss those comics so fast it isnt even funny.

[Tommy]

The inherent problem being that the likely hood of finding a true healthy relationship with someone whom you share an emotional connection with is basically nil. You have to date an endless stream of the worst humanity has to offer to find some one approaching decent. Chances are that girl would "surprise" you after a month with the fact that she has been seriously dating someone the whole time. So you would be better off with the comics in the long run.

[lonesomefool]

God your bitter.


I like you.

[lonesomefool]

Seriously, I can see your viewpoint, but I guess it depends on the person. You seem content at the very least not being in a relationship. I'm not one of those people, chances are if I dont find love by the age of, say 35, I will either go bat**** crazy or drown in the drinks. Yes, I know that sounds unhealthy and all, but for me, it's the truth. Some guys hate, and I mean hate having to go home to a wife or GF or remember important dates...I just wish I had that "problem".

[Tommy]

God your bitter.


I like you.
Well I have had a lot of experiences in my life. Like...

-Someone refusing to date me due to my hair cut.
-Someone refusing to date me due to the fact that I think sex should be special.
-Going on a date only to have him spend the whole night talking about his ex (they had been broken up for a year mind you.)
-Having approximately 100,000 people be totally undependable.
-Being told I remind someone too much of their little brother to date.
-Going out with someone the day after they broke up with someone only for the following day them to return to said person.
-Finding out someone does copious amounts of drugs.
-Winding up on a blind date with an anorexic pagan former prostitute.
-Being told in the middle of sex about the person's girlfriend.
-Being told my entire future by someone (based off of this "I've allready gone through what you are going through."

And that is just off the top of my head.

[lonesomefool]

Well, that's more than I have experienced, a LOT more. I'm sorry to hear about all that stuff, hopefully when you least expect it someone will come along for you. So far the excuses girls have given me are these

1.I'm not popular enough to date
2.I'm too fat to date
3.I'm too nice to date
4.I dont drive a nice enough car
5.I read comics
6.I like Country Music
7.I'm a good friend
8.I'm going to Tech School instead of a 4 year college
9.I dont drink heavily
10.I dont smoke


And all of those are true about me, and most of those are perfectly understandable reasons. Honestly chances are your right, I wont meet the right person, and if I do she will get smart and leave, but I personally have to keep up some semblence of hope. To me, life just wouldnt be worth living if I dont find someone.

[Sabrinaset]

Well I have had a lot of experiences in my life. Like...

-Someone refusing to date me due to the fact that I think sex should be special.
-Going on a date only to have him spend the whole night talking about his ex (they had been broken up for a year mind you.)
-Going out with someone the day after they broke up with someone only for the following day them to return to said person.
-Finding out someone does copious amounts of drugs.
-Being told my entire future by someone (based off of this "I've allready gone through what you are going through."

And that is just off the top of my head.

I think all of those have happened to me at some point. Well, not exactly the first one. I think guys like me because I'm easy.

Usually, the dates I have that do lots of drugs start becoming users after meeting me.

I went through the last one four months ago...but he had an excuse, he said he was a psychic. I should have asked him to gimme the winning lotto numbers.

[Tommy]

but he had an excuse, he said he was a psychic. I should have asked him to gimme the winning lotto numbers.
Did you ask him what he was doing on September 10th?

[Gilda Dent]

How the heck do two women ever get together?

Emily and I were both consultants on another message board which had a panel of experts in a variety of fields to answer general knowledge questions--she was a chemistry/general science person, and I was a literature/grammar person. We'd both been there for about a year when a question came up regarding how hormones work, and we both ended up giving similar answers in a close time frame. She PM'ed me after we'd gone back and forth several times, and we began to notice each other in threads a lot more, and interact a lot more. By interact, I mean flirt.

It grew from there over the next year and a half, and eventually we met up and hit it off as well in person, which was a good thing, as we'd been banned from the message board by then and didn't have any place where we could turn threads about eye color genes and whether to use the air conditioner when defrosting your windshield into flirt threads bordering on soft core pornography. And sometimes sneaking past the border a bit.

Others just go to a lesbian bar. With no guys around, it's generally known that the rules are different.

Also, lesbian couples tend to love setting up their friends, kinda like married couples do. I know Emily and I do that sort of thing, or at least would if we had any lesbian friends, which we don't.

Gilda

[The Xenos]

I'm a guy. And dear crap, I'm so shy and introverted, a girl has to hit me over the head with a bat to get my attention. Though mild indications work too. Shy girls can drop hints to.

For girls to just wait there for a guy they like to ask them out.. that's pretty dumb. Please girls, don't do it. If a guy is offended by you making the first move, then he's a moron anyway.

[sk716]

Actually, yes I do.




Well, if you use SK as an example....they don't.

HEY!


Well, I have yet to run across a lesbian that was afraid to "make the first move", so to speak. Lesbians in general seem to be pretty good at declarative statements.

[sk716]

The inherent problem being that the likely hood of finding a true healthy relationship with someone whom you share an emotional connection with is basically nil. You have to date an endless stream of the worst humanity has to offer to find some one approaching decent. Chances are that girl would "surprise" you after a month with the fact that she has been seriously dating someone the whole time. So you would be better off with the comics in the long run.

Give Emma a cookie!

Alas, what a bitter board are we.

[sk716]

Well, that's more than I have experienced, a LOT more. I'm sorry to hear about all that stuff, hopefully when you least expect it someone will come along for you. So far the excuses girls have given me are these

1.I'm not popular enough to date
2.I'm too fat to date
3.I'm too nice to date
4.I dont drive a nice enough car
5.I read comics
6.I like Country Music
7.I'm a good friend
8.I'm going to Tech School instead of a 4 year college
9.I dont drink heavily
10.I dont smoke


And all of those are true about me, and most of those are perfectly understandable reasons. Honestly chances are your right, I wont meet the right person, and if I do she will get smart and leave, but I personally have to keep up some semblence of hope. To me, life just wouldnt be worth living if I dont find someone.


Well, my first piece of advice would be to avoid shallow people.

[lonesomefool]

I try to, but it seems I have VERY poor taste in people and stuff. It's not so much as shallow as much as it is them trying to make up excuses not to go out on a date with me because they dont want to say what I already KNOW. I'm just no damn good. Honestly, outside of woman asking guys that's the second thing I want, just be honest with a guy.

The thing of it is is I dont see myself getting a date, much less a relationship anytime soon. My life is too unsettled, I dont know where I will be working after tech school, I dont know where I want to live, etc. Not to mention my shyness and the fact i have zero self esteem, and the last girl I really fell for burned the hell out of me emotionally. Plus, I need to first forget her before going after another girl, I dont buy into the whole "getting over one with another" bull, cause all your doing in that case is hurting the girl, and setting yourself up for further heartache down the line when it finally hits you.

I'm not really bitter towards women or anything, I place 100% of the blame on myself. By that I mean, I probably had a shot with girls I liked, but I never pulled the trigger, and I still do that. I dont know if it's self esteem issues, or if I just cant see myself being happy with someone. I'll never understand me.

[west3man]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?
Yes. Yes, I do.

[Lubichev]

I'll take a slice of that pie too.

[Night Swordsman]

I am too shy and not the most social person to ever ask a woman out any more. Which would explain why i do not date.

I am enjoying solitude in my later years,and too old to get married anymore.

[Noah Johnson]

So far I'm hearing universal support from the guys for women making the first move. Frankly, I couldn't agree more.

Ladies, if you haven't ever made the initial approach yourself, (and if you have, good for you and keep it up) take my word for it, it's a lot of pressure. It's enough pressure that a lot of guys never quite get the nerve up to do it, so everyone loses. Even those of us who've gotten better at it are always a little nervous, taking a chance like that.

Consequently, when a woman makes the first move, talks to us first, expresses a more-than-friendly interest first, whatever, we love it. It's as though she's offered to take a burden off our backs. Plus it's flattering, and who doesn't love being flattered? (Another double standard: Men are expected to pay overt compliments to women. Women are not, by and large, expected to reciprocate. It's NICE to get a compliment once in a while...) Thus, making the first move works double for a woman, as it bridges the communication gap, and makes a sufficiently good first impression to hopefully go from a "maybe" to a "hell yes."

[PatrickG]

There is the flipside to that, Noah.

If there's no mutual interest, it can be dicey.

However, better to get it out in the open early, right?

[howyadoin]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?Definitely. It shows that she can step up to bat, and that she's at least a little less likely to play bullshit games.

[Noah Johnson]

There is the flipside to that, Noah.

If there's no mutual interest, it can be dicey.

However, better to get it out in the open early, right?
Well, yes, that's a fair point. I'm sure it's no more fun for a woman to get turned down than a man. You put your ego on the line and get rejected, ouch. It sucks. But why shouldn't both sexes run that risk equally? I don't think women are incapable of just getting used to it and letting it roll off their backs. Men learn to do that, after all. God knows I have, despite my extremely sexy hat...

[Charles RB]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?

Yes, because I am lazy and oblivious and her doing something would the only way I'd know to do something.

[Arilou]

It grew from there over the next year and a half, and eventually we met up and hit it off as well in person, which was a good thing, as we'd been banned from the message board by then and didn't have any place where we could turn threads about eye color genes and whether to use the air conditioner when defrosting your windshield into flirt threads bordering on soft core pornography. And sometimes sneaking past the border a bit.

Gilda


:rofl Funniest post ever :p Great description :p

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?

Yep. Definately. (not that it has ever happened or anything, but theoretically I'd like it)

[Larry Dixon]

How the heck do two women ever get together?

They meet in the welding aisle at Home Depot,
eyes lock,
sparks fly....

[hellokittykat]

I was the one who approached my now husband.
Which is really weird because I had never dated, never kissed, never flirted, ect, but I somehow knew he was the one and I didn't want to waste time playing games.
Of course it did end up being eight years before we got married. ;)

[west3man]

When you REALLY get down to it, my girlfriend made the move that ultimately lead to us getting together. She set the feminist movement back a coupla decades by pretending she was having a harder time with a programming project than she really was since I was hanging around helping other people.

I think that was the most we'd ever interacted and ultimately lead to us becoming more than passing strangers. Now I'm in-love (although, hopefully, I'm not alone in that :p ).

[emilytbm]

Women, do you do this? Why? How's it working out for you?

I'm 50/50 on this. My esteem fluctuates all the time so when I'm feeling good about myself I will aproach my prey first. However, when I'm down on myself (hehehe) I get very introverted and shy. Most times I'm down and I don't even believe that someone likes me even if they openly tell me so. Sometimes it even follows into relationships. I can date someone for weeks, months even, and still not fully believe they like me.

Online, however, I am flirty as heck. I have no problems collecting online friends and potential dates.


Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?

I am not a man but I do like women so I guess I can answer this. I am very, very, very shy about women and I like it when they make the first move. On the other hand, if they move to fast I freak out and run away. Silly, silly games!

How the heck do two women ever get together?

Good question, I wish I knew the answer. Until I figure it out, I have shades0077 ^_~


ETA: I have no qualms initiating hot sex acts once I am dating someone.

[K'Nort]

So far I'm hearing universal support from the guys for women making the first move. Frankly, I couldn't agree more.

Ladies, if you haven't ever made the initial approach yourself, (and if you have, good for you and keep it up) take my word for it, it's a lot of pressure. It's enough pressure that a lot of guys never quite get the nerve up to do it, so everyone loses. Even those of us who've gotten better at it are always a little nervous, taking a chance like that.

I do have to say it depends, however.

Initiating things with guys who are shy and uncomfortable with dating games usually works well. But with the aggressive player Type As, not so much. And I have had guy friends admit that they always wished the woman would make the first move, but once it actually happened, they were turned off by it. And felt very confused and ashamed about that, but nevertheless it was the knee-jerk response.

[Gaz]

I do have to say it depends, however.

Initiating things with guys who are shy and uncomfortable with dating games usually works well. But with the aggressive player Type As, not so much. And I have had guy friends admit that they always wished the woman would make the first move, but once it actually happened, they were turned off by it. And felt very confused and ashamed about that, but nevertheless it was the knee-jerk response.
How did those guys react to unplanned social interaction in general?
I could seem me being taken aback by it, but only in so much as anyone approaching me and initiating conversation doesn't happen often. Plus some left over schoolyard BS, but that's me specifically...

Oh, and I'm all for the woman making the first move.

[K'Nort]

How did those guys react to unplanned social interaction in general?

I could seem me being taken aback by it, but only in so much as anyone approaching me and initiating conversation doesn't happen often. Plus some left over schoolyard BS, but that's me specifically...

There's a significant difference to many people between making random generic small talk with strangers and being asked out on an official date or invited back to someone's place, etc.

[Gaz]

There's a significant difference to many people between making random generic small talk with strangers and being asked out on an official date or invited back to someone's place, etc.
Asked out, true... I just meant that there might be some corelation.

How many people ever suggest going home with the other person as their opener? :confused:

[Ogdred]

How many people ever suggest going home with the other person as their opener? :confused:

Don't judge me! It's efficient!

[i_mmmchocolate]

Women, do you do this? Why? How's it working out for you?

I tried making the first move on two separate occasions and it didn't lead to anything. I think most guys simply prefer initiating the interaction.

[west3man]

When women initiate things and it leads to nothing, they conclude that the guys want to make the first move.

When a guy initiates things and it leads to nothing, he concludes that women want some other guys.

[Dark Galaxy]

It seems that my most sucessful relationships have been initiated by me. Maybe it's because I am not nervous or tentative about the person, I have already decided that he shall be mine. :evilsmile

I actually made the first contact between CFT and myself, and that seems to have worked out alright. You know, with the many kids and the years of wedded bliss and all.

Perhaps my fowardness came out of necessity. One of my best friends (that I always would go out with) is tall, blonde, with huge knockers. If guys were to approach us, it was really to approach her. And I'm cute dammit! But I'm short, not blonde, and boobs seem to trump cute in a lot of cases. (of course she was cute too...curse her). So, I learned, if I wanted something I had to go for it. Worse case scenerio, I'd still be alone.

I guess I just started going with the 'life is too short not to give it a shot' motto. *shrugs* It worked for me. Oh, and booze helps too, lotsa booze. :p

[Super Sonic]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?

Please I'm sitting here in front of a computer, reading a post on a damn comic book forum....what do you think? =P

...so alone, but so unwilling to change.

[bfrank]

In my mind, there's nothing hotter than a chick who is so sure of her self that she makes the first move.....

[Ogdred]

In my mind, there's nothing hotter than a chick who is so sure of her self that she makes the first move.....

Unless she's, like, ugly or something.

[bfrank]

i figured that went without saying.....

[Ogdred]

i figured that went without saying.....

Just making sure we're all on the same page.

[Greg Blackman]

Well I have had a lot of experiences in my life. Like...

-Being told I remind someone too much of their little brother to date.

And that is just off the top of my head.

FUCKRY!!! I don't know how you came back from that one.

[Greg Blackman]

When women initiate things and it leads to nothing, they conclude that the guys want to make the first move.

When a guy initiates things and it leads to nothing, he concludes that women want some other guys.

West3man : Poet, Truthsayer, Speaker of Wisdom.

[howyadoin]

When women initiate things and it leads to nothing, they conclude that the guys want to make the first move.

When a guy initiates things and it leads to nothing, he concludes that women want some other guys.Bingo.

.

[i_mmmchocolate]

When women initiate things and it leads to nothing, they conclude that the guys want to make the first move.

When a guy initiates things and it leads to nothing, he concludes that women want some other guys.

It all makes sense now.

[Gaz]

It all makes sense now.
It really does. Seriously, when you posted that, my first thought was "She's asking the wrong guys..." where you thought "They like to make the first move..."

West, you am smart. S-M-R-T, smart... :cool:

[K'Nort]

How many people ever suggest going home with the other person as their opener? :confused:

We clearly have different definitions of "the first move." Generally initiating conversation isn't it. (Although sadly some men do think so, which can cause all sorts of confusion.)

[K'Nort]

FUCKRY!!! I don't know how you came back from that one.

See, I would think a comment like that ("you remind me too much of my little brother") would be one of the easier ones to recover from. Because it's totally non-personal and not some sort of character flaw. Just bad luck.

[west3man]

We clearly have different definitions of "the first move." Generally initiating conversation isn't it. (Although sadly some men do think so, which can cause all sorts of confusion.)
I know we're polar opposites in this and other ways, but I'd be interested in reading your definition, if you're willing to share it.

[Gaz]

We clearly have different definitions of "the first move." Generally initiating conversation isn't it. (Although sadly some men do think so, which can cause all sorts of confusion.)
See, that was what I thought this thread was asking...

*check initial post*

Yup, at least I think that's what the question means... :confused:

[Noah Johnson]

See, I would think a comment like that ("you remind me too much of my little brother") would be one of the easier ones to recover from. Because it's totally non-personal and not some sort of character flaw. Just bad luck.
It's code. Just like "You're a big cuddly teddy bear" means "Goddamn, you're fat", "You're like my little brother" means "In my mind, you have no penis."

Which is less easy to recover from than you'd think.

[Night Swordsman]

Well, that's more than I have experienced, a LOT more. I'm sorry to hear about all that stuff, hopefully when you least expect it someone will come along for you. So far the excuses girls have given me are these

1.I'm not popular enough to date
2.I'm too fat to date
3.I'm too nice to date
4.I dont drive a nice enough car
5.I read comics
6.I like Country Music
7.I'm a good friend
8.I'm going to Tech School instead of a 4 year college
9.I dont drink heavily
10.I dont smoke


And all of those are true about me, and most of those are perfectly understandable reasons. Honestly chances are your right, I wont meet the right person, and if I do she will get smart and leave, but I personally have to keep up some semblence of hope. To me, life just wouldnt be worth living if I dont find someone.


All of the above were not enough for a girl to not date you...then i read #6.
OmG!. You POOR POOR guy!

Your doomed. But least you will be a nice guy who dosn't drink and smoke,and have plenty of comics to read.

[titanfan]

Between all of the dating/clothes/looks/insecurity questions that pop on this board, I'm convinced we all need to get out more. Too bad we can't have the "YABS Social" or something like that....

[west3man]

"Making a move" is doing anything that expresses your romantic/sexual interest in another person. As far as I'm concerned, conversation counts. Obviously, others will disagree, which is fine. For me, the idea that I'm making the *wrong* move by actually trying to get to know another person says, "Right move, wrong person."

The thing is you never know until you try. People who put themselves out there, who try, particulary in a respectful way, get respect from me - for that, anyway.

[howyadoin]

See, I would think a comment like that ("you remind me too much of my little brother") would be one of the easier ones to recover from. Because it's totally non-personal and not some sort of character flaw. Just bad luck.If the comment were sincere, sure. But how often does "you're like a brother to me" actually mean "you're like a brother to me", and not "I couldn't imagine having sex with you. Ever."?

[stealthwise]

If the comment were sincere, sure. But how often does "you're like a brother to me" actually mean "you're like a brother to me", and not "I couldn't imagine having sex with you. Ever."?

Yeah, guys and girls, never say that to someone. EVER.

Hell, I still get crap for saying something similar to my wife years upon years ago, despite good intentions.

[WhiteRose]

HEY!


Well, I have yet to run across a lesbian that was afraid to "make the first move", so to speak. Lesbians in general seem to be pretty good at declarative statements.


We are blunt yet sexy. *nods*

[i_mmmchocolate]

We clearly have different definitions of "the first move." Generally initiating conversation isn't it. (Although sadly some men do think so, which can cause all sorts of confusion.)

See, I consider initiating a conversation as a 'first move'. Even if awkward. In fact, the more awkward the better because I'm not an ace at breaking the ice either.

[howyadoin]

See, I consider initiating a conversation as a 'first move'.If you don't already know the person, it's a huge step.

[west3man]

If you don't already know the person, it's a huge step.
Howso? What's the alternative?

[howyadoin]

Howso? What's the alternative?It's a big step in the sense that you're going from being two complete strangers to... well, hopefully a lot more. Striking up a conversation with someone you sorta know isn't as big a step.

If that made any sense.

[Budgie Inspector]

Thus, making the first move works double for a woman, as it bridges the communication gap, and makes a sufficiently good first impression to hopefully go from a "maybe" to a "hell yes."

Don't know about y'all, but a sufficiently bold opener from a woman has made me go from "oh, hell, no" to "maybe after a couple more drinks." I've never been turned completely around, but such things definitely cause me to consider a previously-unthinkable possibility.

I like 'em fiesty.

[i_mmmchocolate]

If you don't already know the person, it's a huge step.


That's true. I completely ruled out acquiantancess in the equation. Actually, I may be messing myself up dating-wise by excluding them out, or rather, assuming they just like me as just a friend.

[PatrickG]

It's code. Just like "You're a big cuddly teddy bear" means "Goddamn, you're fat", "You're like my little brother" means "In my mind, you have no penis."

Which is less easy to recover from than you'd think.

The "Teddy Bear" one *can* be a turn on for some women if they have a history of dating "teddy bears". I've also seen the, "You're just like me little brother" one INTENDED as a turn on. I have WITNESSED girls turn that one around after saying it several times and say, "You're just like my kid brother. Except I could make out with you."

But in general, I think you're right.

Let me add this one, "You're just like my boyfriend." Assuming it's presented as a compliment, I think the implicit subtextual beat here is this:

"Anything wrong with my current relationship would be wrong between us. Also, I fail to see how going for you would be trading up. Basically, I'm not interested except possibly in some sort of obscure rebound scenario. By and large, I'm just trying to work my boyfriend into the conversation to remind you I have one though."

[PatrickG]

Don't know about y'all, but a sufficiently bold opener from a woman has made me go from "oh, hell, no" to "maybe after a couple more drinks." I've never been turned completely around, but such things definitely cause me to consider a previously-unthinkable possibility.

I like 'em fiesty.

I couldn't go from "hell no" to "maybe". EVER.

But I could definitely go from "I barely noticed you exist and didn't even know your name even though I see you every day" to "hell yes" with the right conversation.

[Ogdred]

You know...there seems to be some single ladies and some single fellas on this board, all of whom don't seem to want to be all that single. So, why don't y'all just pair up?

And then, when you eventually break up, you can come back here and trash-talk each other. It will be fun for everyone!

(I realize there's more single fellas than single ladies, so I'm proposing some sort of lottery system.)

[west3man]

A conversation isn't "a lot more," to me. It's just a conversation.

If you don't know the person, at all, and you don't see each other regularly, I say one has to seize the opportunity.

When I was single, if I saw someone at a mall that I thought was attractive and carried herself well, I could either approach her and attempt to talk to her or do nothing.

If it's true that you get what you put into life, then doing nothing gets you nothing.

[K'Nort]

It's a big step in the sense that you're going from being two complete strangers to... well, hopefully a lot more. Striking up a conversation with someone you sorta know isn't as big a step.

If that made any sense.

Is that enough though?

For the guys here who are saying "It would help out my love life a lot if girls would make the first move once in a while because I'm really shy," would a girl striking up a conversation at a bar be enough in itself to put you over the hump and ask for a phone number, date, etc?

[Budgie Inspector]

I couldn't go from "hell no" to "maybe". EVER.

Now, I'm talking about someone who -- between the moment you noticed their presence and the moment they opened their mouth -- you've sized up and concluded that you're not even slightly physically attracted to them. You've got no info on their personality; you just know that this isn't a lust-inducing physical specimen.

And then they say something that blows your mind. You don't award points for style?

[Budgie Inspector]

For the guys here who are saying "It would help out my love life a lot if girls would make the first move once in a while because I'm really shy," would a girl striking up a conversation at a bar be enough in itself to put you over the hump and ask for a phone number, date, etc?

Honestly? Yes. But you have to take into account some degree of obliviousness. I know for a fact that I've missed an intriguing opportunity or two, over the years, because I didn't put two and two together in time.

"Oh, this attractive young lady and I are having a delightful conversation. She's very nice. Whoops - gotta run! Hope you have a nice life, pretty girl!"

[Gaz]

Is that enough though?

For the guys here who are saying "It would help out my love life a lot if girls would make the first move once in a while because I'm really shy," would a girl striking up a conversation at a bar be enough in itself to put you over the hump and ask for a phone number, date, etc?
Possibly. If there's attraction on my part, and some sign that it's reciprocal (which the conversation would usually suggest), then probably.
Although, one could include those things as "first", so either person could do it.

[Typo Lad]

Men, do you like it when a girl makes the first move, even if it's just emailing you or something?



If my wife hadn't made the first move, I'd still be single.

[Typo Lad]

See, I would think a comment like that ("you remind me too much of my little brother") would be one of the easier ones to recover from. Because it's totally non-personal and not some sort of character flaw. Just bad luck.

See, my resposne would be "So how long have you wanted to screw your little brother for?"

[howyadoin]

Is that enough though?

For the guys here who are saying "It would help out my love life a lot if girls would make the first move once in a while because I'm really shy," would a girl striking up a conversation at a bar be enough in itself to put you over the hump and ask for a phone number, date, etc?Well, I can't speak for them, obviously. But yes, that certainly would be - and has been - good enough for me.

[Noah Johnson]

Honestly? Yes. But you have to take into account some degree of obliviousness. I know for a fact that I've missed an intriguing opportunity or two, over the years, because I didn't put two and two together in time.

"Oh, this attractive young lady and I are having a delightful conversation. She's very nice. Whoops - gotta run! Hope you have a nice life, pretty girl!"
It's so true. Geeks are famous for being the only guys in the world who are able to sincerely tell themselves "Oh, she probably meant 'Fuck me right now on the floor, you mighty stallion' just in a friendly way..."

[CURSD BLADE]

I, for one, have never been the one to make the move despite being male. My wife, for instance, and I had been working together at the local roller rink when we were 17, and she was crushing over me for weeks, I was just too oblivious to pick up on it. Finally, she bluntly stated "I like you, lets go out some time". She was only my second girl friend, and I was/am an insecure, shy fellow, so she had to make just about all the moves from there.

She initiated the first kiss, the first cuddle, the first...you get the picture. Still, had she not, it probably never would have happened. Hell, I didn't even propose to her until she dropped not-so-subtle hints that marriage would be pretty cool.

I don't think it should be placed solely on the shoulders of men, for it adds so much extra pressure on us, which is never a good thing.

[Trulyures]

I'm old fashioned...... I think the guys should ask the girls out :)

[Noah Johnson]

I'm old fashioned...... I think the guys should ask the girls out :)
You'll note from this topic that you're tremendously limiting your options by thinking that, as apparently most guys would LOVE it if you'd ask them out for a change. I don't know what your present romantic situation is, but maybe you ought to reconsider your stance, for your own sake if no one else's. :)

[atorifan]

i tend to be pretty oblivious to women, who knows how many millions have had secret flames for me. i imagine it like win a date with tad bablablah movie. except he wasn't clueless, and i'm not that good looking. i'm sure there were things i realized, which developed the friendship. but ones that i didn't think were strong enough to indicate a romantical interest. i like a woman to make it clear she's interested, but i don't like being pursued. shuts me down, guess i can't take those red sonja/she hulk type woman.

[K'Nort]

I'm old fashioned...... I think the guys should ask the girls out :)

It may not just be an issue of old-fashioned. After all, the gist of the thread is that everyone wants the other person to do the asking. Because it's the asker that deals with all the anxiety.

[Ogdred]

It may not just be an issue of old-fashioned. After all, the gist of the thread is that everyone wants the other person to do the asking. Because it's the asker that deals with all the anxiety.

Precisely. So, we should all die lonely.

[Gaz]

Precisely. So, we should all die lonely.
Life should be like a kid's dance, everyone is forced to ask someone to dance or you get a time out. :D

[west3man]

It may not just be an issue of old-fashioned. After all, the gist of the thread is that everyone wants the other person to do the asking. Because it's the asker that deals with all the anxiety.
I think the gist of the thread is that most people (maybe everyone) want the other person to be willing to ask. The reasons vary.

In my case, single-west3man wouldn't want to miss out on an opportunity to get to know a potential romantic interest simply because of some old-school rules of engagement.

I see no reason to be bound by such things. I'll even go a step further and say I'd be mildly wary of a woman who IS so bound.

I suspect that a woman who's too timid to initiate contact may be too timid to initiate sex or express her sexual/romantic needs and desires. It all comes down to communication... for me, anyway.

[howyadoin]

I think the gist of the thread is that most people (maybe everyone) want the other person to be willing to ask. The reasons vary.

In my case, single-west3man wouldn't want to miss out on an opportunity to get to know a potential romantic interest simply because of some old-school rules of engagement.

I see no reason to be bound by such things. I'll even go a step further and say I'd be mildly wary of a woman who IS so bound.

I suspect that a woman who's too timid to initiate contact may be too timid to initiate sex or express her sexual/romantic needs and desires. It all comes down to communication... for me, anyway.I'm with west on this one. I've already wasted too much of my life dealing with other people's emotional problems.

[Trulyures]

You'll note from this topic that you're tremendously limiting your options by thinking that, as apparently most guys would LOVE it if you'd ask them out for a change. I don't know what your present romantic situation is, but maybe you ought to reconsider your stance, for your own sake if no one else's. :)
actually, I don't want to get into a serious relationship right now... I mean the girl can show she's interested and everything which I don't mind, but I'd rather have the guy do the asking. It's just how I am :)

[K'Nort]

I'm with west on this one. I've already wasted too much of my life dealing with other people's emotional problems.

It does go both ways. You'd be amazed by how many emotional problems the men can have about the whole asking thing too. Not to mention the guys who think initiating conversation is always code for 'I totally want to have sex with you and anything said that contradicts that is part of the game so don't give up and be sure to follow me to my car.'

[west3man]

It does go both ways.No argument there.

You'd be amazed by how many emotional problems the men can have about the whole asking thing too. Not to mention the guys who think initiating conversation is always code for 'I totally want to have sex with you and anything said that contradicts that is part of the game so don't give up and be sure to follow me to my car.'No doubt these guys exist. Probably in high numbers that move in herds, even.

Honorable mention to the ladies who think initiating conversation is always code for "I totally want to have sex with you and anything said that contradits that is part of the game so be sure to follow me to my car and give it up."

One way to combat this would be for more decent folks, male AND female, to be willing to do the asking that way such behavior doesn't remain associated with only a subset of the population (i.e. slut-puppies).

[howyadoin]

It does go both ways. You'd be amazed by how many emotional problems the men can have about the whole asking thing too.Heh. Y'know, I don't think I would be.

And I wasn't just referring to problems asking guys out; I was thinking of the deeper problems that something like that could be symptomatic of.