Who's Better: Cyclops or Storm?

[Karl J. Barnes]

I don't buy it, I think she's being brainwashed like Katie Holmes.

So you are saying that Black Panther is a Scienctologist!?!?

[Brian M.]

So you are saying that Black Panther is a Scienctologist!?!?

Might be...he does have all this fancy technology...could be from the Aliens. Zenu is powerfuler...according to the South Park kids. Scientologists already got one powerful Black Man in Chef...why not Storm too?

[Karl J. Barnes]

Might be...he does have all this fancy technology...could be from the Aliens. Zenu is powerfuler...according to the South Park kids. Scientologists already got one powerful Black Man in Chef...why not Storm too?

I CURSE YOU TOM CRUISE!!!!!

[unkiedev]

Fashion: Edge to STORM.

Thieving Abilities: Edge to STORM.

uhm, knife throwing ability?: EDGE TO STORM!

Remeber when Storm had the Mutants lie low in Australia because they were wanted terrorists? Good idea. Remember when Scott had almost every MUTANT ON THE PLANET at the Official x-building during one of their most crucial and vunerable times? What's the expression about putting eggs in one basket? Oh well, Scott & Emma will figure it out with their superior leadership skills.

[Jellobay]

Fashion: Edge to STORM.

Thieving Abilities: Edge to STORM.

uhm, knife throwing ability?: EDGE TO STORM!

Remeber when Storm had the Mutants lie low in Australia because they were wanted terrorists? Good idea. Remember when Scott had almost every MUTANT ON THE PLANET at the Official x-building during one of their most crucial and vunerable times? What's the expression about putting eggs in one basket? Oh well, Scott & Emma will figure it out with their superior leadership skills.

Stealing, running and hiding = Storm's leadership

[Brian M.]

Optic Blast Abilities: Cyclops Wins

Coolest Sunglasses: Cyclops Wins

Loving Most Redheads: Cyclops Wins

Bigger Wang: Storm Wins

[Jellobay]

Currently in the poll - Cyclops Wins. :)

[unkiedev]

Currently in the poll - Cyclops Wins. :)
Classic Jellobaby. The countless times (That's right, COUNTLESS!) Storm was ahead in the polls it is nothing but disparaging fwaffle! Soon as Scott's ahead: CLOSE THE POLLS! :rolleyes:

Scott is a stuffed shirt loser. If he couldn't fire optic blasts outta' his eyes, he woulda been a no-good, lowlife two bit Fast food employee.

If STORM wasn't a mutant, she would still have lead an exciting life as a queen of thieves on the streets of Africa!

[Jellobay]

Classic Jellobaby. The countless times (That's right, COUNTLESS!) Storm was ahead in the polls it is nothing but disparaging fwaffle! Soon as Scott's ahead: CLOSE THE POLLS! :rolleyes:

Scott is a stuffed shirt loser. If he couldn't fire optic blasts outta' his eyes, he woulda been a no-good, lowlife two bit Fast food employee.

If STORM wasn't a mutant, she would still have lead an exciting life as a queen of thieves on the streets of Africa!

First, Jellobay is always classic. ;)

Storm would be a stipper in Calcutta, stealing the wallets of the people she was giving lap dances too.

[unkiedev]

First, Jellobay is always classic. ;)

Storm would be a stipper in Calcutta, stealing the wallets of the people she was giving lap dances too.
I'm with you on the first point, however that second point.....Them's fightin' words! You're just being mean.

[Jellobay]

I'm with you on the first point, however that second point.....Them's fightin' words! You're just being mean.

Like say Cyclops would be a fry cook, wasn't low. :)

[Brian M.]

Classic Jellobaby. The countless times (That's right, COUNTLESS!) Storm was ahead in the polls it is nothing but disparaging fwaffle! Soon as Scott's ahead: CLOSE THE POLLS! :rolleyes:

Scott is a stuffed shirt loser. If he couldn't fire optic blasts outta' his eyes, he woulda been a no-good, lowlife two bit Fast food employee.

If STORM wasn't a mutant, she would still have lead an exciting life as a queen of thieves on the streets of Africa!

Wasn't Storm also a hooker?

[Jellobay]

Wasn't Storm also a hooker?

The term is escort.

[unkiedev]

Like say Cyclops would be a fry cook, wasn't low. :)
I'm not trying to be controversial, but I'm not sure it gets much lower then a stripper in calcutta.

It's established: Before Prof. X contacted scot he was an angry orphan who lashed out and caused trouble. He had no skills. He had no goals or ambitions. He was just another troubled American youth. Without his powers he probably would have ended up in pretty crime or a low end job.

If Storm never developed powers she would have been a successful pickpocket/burglar in Africa. She could have parlayed that into a criminal empire, who knows? I admit she'd be in Crime, maybe even dying young from a crime gone bad. I just think there is more potential there for her to rise then him:

Storm is a very self made person. If Scott didn't have Chucky X in his life he would have been a low life hood.

[Brian M.]

The term is escort.
I thought it was Goddess?

[unkiedev]

Wasn't Storm also a hooker?
this is just so typical. Attack a strong woman by calling her a whore and a stripper.

[Jellobay]

I'm not trying to be controversial, but I'm not sure it gets much lower then a stripper in calcutta.

It's established: Before Prof. X contacted scot he was an angry orphan who lashed out and caused trouble. He had no skills. He had no goals or ambitions. He was just another troubled American youth. Without his powers he probably would have ended up in pretty crime or a low end job.

If Storm never developed powers she would have been a successful pickpocket/burglar in Africa. She could have parlayed that into a criminal empire, who knows? I admit she'd be in Crime, maybe even dying young from a crime gone bad. I just think there is more potential there for her to rise then him:

Storm is a very self made person. If Scott didn't have Chucky X in his life he would have been a low life hood.


Now that was a big jump in logic there. Storm was already a crook. Cyclops was just angry he thought his parents were dead. He had to jump out of a plane while holding on to his younger brother. To me that shows character.
Storm just showed she had no morals. She was happy being a pick pocket.
To say Cyclops would be a low life hood is a big stretch. Forgive the guy for being angry that is life seemed ruined. He didn't turn to crime.
Storm parents died and that is what she did. Now who is the low life. :)

[Jellobay]

this is just so typical. Attack a strong woman by calling her a whore and a stripper.

Attack an orphan, by calling him a low life.

[Jellobay]

I thought it was Goddess?

No that is her "dancing name".

[Brian M.]

this is just so typical. Attack a strong woman by calling her a whore and a stripper.

No I believe it was sad somewhere, some issue, understated that she also did some other things while she was in the pockets of others.

Jean's a strong woman, Betsy is a strong woman, Rogue is a strong woman, Dani is a strong woman, Kitty is a strong woman, Sage is a strong woman, hell Emma's a strong woman but none of them are whores...well Emma...but still.

[unkiedev]

Now that was a big jump in logic there. Storm was already a crook. Cyclops was just angry he thought his parents were dead. He had to jump out of a plane while holding on to his younger brother. To me that shows character.
Storm just showed she had no morals. She was happy being a pick pocket.
To say Cyclops would be a low life hood is a big stretch. Forgive the guy for being angry that is life seemed ruined. He didn't turn to crime.
Storm parents died and that is what she did. Now who is the low life. :)
Storm lived in a third world country. There was no "child services" to put her into a lousy orphanage.
And the Reason I said Scott would end up no where is because he had no initiative. Storm was at least resourceful.

And I will appologize to all orphans in the world for my unintended slight if you and UTVol8102 appologize to all women for your's.

[Brian M.]

Storm lived in a third world country. There was no "child services" to put her into a lousy orphanage.
And the Reason I said Scott would end up no where is because he had no initiative. Storm was at least resourceful.

And I will appologize to all orphans in the world for my unintended slight if you and UTVol8102 appologize to all women for your's.

I didn't make any comments to all the women. I made a comment on Storm. I believe it was stated that when she got older the people she worked for also made her a hooker. That's not bashing her. If I'm wrong on that than I can admit I'm wrong.

[unkiedev]

I didn't make any comments to all the women. I made a comment on Storm. I believe it was stated that when she got older the people she worked for also made her a hooker. That's not bashing her. If I'm wrong on that than I can admit I'm wrong.
no, I hear you. Can you site sources?

There was an awful trend in 80-90's comics (started by Miller) that all women had to be whores at some point. Catwoman, Karen Page, everybody had to be a whore. I wouldn't be suprised if someone (Even Claremont) fell victim to this craptastic trend.

[Brian M.]

no, I hear you. Can you site sources?

There was an awful trend in 80-90's comics (started by Miller) that all women had to be whores at some point. Catwoman, Karen Page, everybody had to be a whore. I wouldn't be suprised if someone (Even Claremont) fell victim to this craptastic trend.

If I had a source I'd have stated it. It's a vague remembering from somewhere. Just becuase it was stated during an era where some woman were made like that doesn't mean it can be ignored. DDM or Fishtaco could probably answer it.

[unkiedev]

If I had a source I'd have stated it. It's a vague remembering from somewhere. Just becuase it was stated during an era where some woman were made like that doesn't mean it can be ignored. DDM or Fishtaco could probably answer it.
Please. It's comic books, any part can be ignored. You think Marvel really gives a dang about Continuity? How old are the classic X-men now? They were 16 in 68, so that would make them... 35 now, or late twenties for bobby?

[Jellobay]

Storm lived in a third world country. There was no "child services" to put her into a lousy orphanage.
And the Reason I said Scott would end up no where is because he had no initiative. Storm was at least resourceful.

And I will appologize to all orphans in the world for my unintended slight if you and UTVol8102 appologize to all women for your's.

But how can you say he had no initiative. You assume the worst for him, so I was doing the same to Storm, in a subtle way of showing you it is absurd.
And in no way are we insulting all women, Storm fans maybe, but not all women. ;)

[Brian M.]

Please. It's comic books, any part can be ignored. You think Marvel really gives a dang about Continuity? How old are the classic X-men now? They were 16 in 68, so that would make them... 35 now, or late twenties for bobby?

Ok well if that's the case that we can ignore the parts we don't like than this whole arguement is gonna be mute. I'm gonna ignore the parts where Cyclops screwed up and your'll ignore the parts where Storm did too.

[unkiedev]

Ok well if that's the case that we can ignore the parts we don't like than this whole arguement is gonna be mute. I'm gonna ignore the parts where Cyclops screwed up and your'll ignore the parts where Storm did too.
I like the way you think, brother! ;) On that note, the polls are tied up.

[Jellobay]

I like the way you think, brother! ;) On that note, the polls are tied up.

I want a recount. ;)

[LordAllMighty]

Just for the record, Storm has never been a "Lady Of The Night".

She was almost raped but she end up killing the guy with a knife. This is one of the reason why she want kill now.

[Jellobay]

Just for the record, Storm has never been a "Lady Of The Night".

She was almost raped but she end up killing the guy with a knife. This is one of the reason why she want kill now.

What do you me wont kill now? She rips out little girls hearts.

[unkiedev]

Now that was a big jump in logic there. Storm was already a crook. Cyclops was just angry he thought his parents were dead. He had to jump out of a plane while holding on to his younger brother. To me that shows character.
Storm just showed she had no morals. She was happy being a pick pocket.
To say Cyclops would be a low life hood is a big stretch. Forgive the guy for being angry that is life seemed ruined. He didn't turn to crime.
Storm parents died and that is what she did. Now who is the low life. :)
Well, it is starting to sound like this whole "prostitute" thing is a smear campaign tactic concocted by "No Sources" UTVol8102 and ran with by "I'm with UTVol8102" Jellobaby.

I'd like to get back to the above mentioned quote. So you like Scott because he "Shows Character" for being pushed out of a plane by his dead-beat dad, and a few posts later you want to argue that Storm is somehow not as good a person because you believed her to be a hooker (which she probably wasn't).

Storm had to deal with a far tougher life then Scott, and turned out a much better person. MAKE MINE STORM!

[Jellobay]

Well, it is starting to sound like this whole "prostitute" thing is a smear campaign tactic concocted by "No Sources" UTVol8102 and ran with by "I'm with UTVol8102" Jellobaby.

I'd like to get back to the above mentioned quote. So you like Scott because he "Shows Character" for being pushed out of a plane by his dead-beat dad, and a few posts later you want to argue that Storm is somehow not as good a person because you believed her to be a hooker (which she probably wasn't).

Storm had to deal with a far tougher life then Scott, and turned out a much better person. MAKE MINE STORM!

Now I said Storm was a thief and a stipper not a hooker. ;)

But how did Storm turn out to be a better person. Cyclops did steal, Cyclops did run and hide.
I just saying it is upsurd to call Scott the lowlife, when Storm is the one with the criminal record. :)

[Brian M.]

Hey buddy I said if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to admit it so you take the attitude you have and jam it up your ass. I was wrong about the Storm stuff. So I don't get the attitude that your displaying, it's pointless, it's over two characters that are FICTIONAL!!!. Ok. So calm down. Put down the Storm dirty pictures you've drawn and relax.

Smear Campiagn? Honestly? Seriously? That's what this is?

Going to your post how is Scott's Dad a dead-beat? He gave his one method of escape to his two children while he thought him and his wife were going to die...so that's dead-beat to you?

I don't really see how Storm had it any harder than Scott. He was raised in multiple ophranages before coming to Sinister's. He was experimented on, he was used by Jack Diamonds as a criminal. He's seen his loved ones over and over die and get hurt. He sent his kid to the future to save him...how is that an easy life?

[Kal]

Brian can you please close this poll why Cyclops is in the lead.

Thank you. :)

What?!?!?!? :rolleyes: Storm is leading. :p

[Jellobay]

What?!?!?!? :rolleyes: Storm is leading. :p

I know it makes me sad.

Its like when Bush won. :D

There are some (62) silly people out there. :)

[fireball87o]

Hey buddy I said if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to admit it so you take the attitude you have and jam it up your ass. I was wrong about the Storm stuff. So I don't get the attitude that your displaying, it's pointless, it's over two characters that are FICTIONAL!!!.

Scott and Storm are so not FICTIONAL and you know it!

they exist if you believe! ;)

[Brian M.]

I know it makes me sad.

Its like when Bush won. :D

There are some (62) silly people out there. :)

Hey now...

[unkiedev]

Hey buddy I said if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to admit it so you take the attitude you have and jam it up your ass. I was wrong about the Storm stuff. So I don't get the attitude that your displaying, it's pointless, it's over two characters that are FICTIONAL!!!. Ok. So calm down. Put down the Storm dirty pictures you've drawn and relax.

Smear Campiagn? Honestly? Seriously? That's what this is?

Going to your post how is Scott's Dad a dead-beat? He gave his one method of escape to his two children while he thought him and his wife were going to die...so that's dead-beat to you?

I don't really see how Storm had it any harder than Scott. He was raised in multiple ophranages before coming to Sinister's. He was experimented on, he was used by Jack Diamonds as a criminal. He's seen his loved ones over and over die and get hurt. He sent his kid to the future to save him...how is that an easy life?
Let's not get personal, now. I never got personal. I totally agree with you these are fictional folks, so lets all calm down.

I said Scott's dad was a deadbeat because in my opinion he is. He never really made much of an effort to get back to Earth, or be a presence in Scotts "Life".

Storm did have the tougher (Fictitious) life. Her momma and poppa blew up, an orphan on the streets, had to resort to crime, had to kill a rapist to survive. How does that compare to Scott shifting from orphanage to orphanage?

As far, Jellobaby, as "But how did Storm turn out to be a better person", That was me just stating the truth. Storm is a better "fictitious" person. This is true because it's my oppinion. :p

If it's any consolation I also believe in Bigfoot and enjoy the movies "George of the Jungle" and "The Stupids".

[Brian M.]

Scott had to deal w/ what he thought were dead parents aswell. He was used in crim aswell. They had similar lives.

[Jellobay]

Let's not get personal, now. I never got personal. I totally agree with you these are fictional folks, so lets all calm down.

I said Scott's dad was a deadbeat because in my opinion he is. He never really made much of an effort to get back to Earth, or be a presence in Scotts "Life".

Storm did have the tougher (Fictitious) life. Her momma and poppa blew up, an orphan on the streets, had to resort to crime, had to kill a rapist to survive. How does that compare to Scott shifting from orphanage to orphanage?

As far, Jellobaby, as "But how did Storm turn out to be a better person", That was me just stating the truth. Storm is a better "fictitious" person. This is true because it's my oppinion. :p

If it's any consolation I also believe in Bigfoot and enjoy the movies "George of the Jungle" and "The Stupids".

But then don't get upset if UT says Storm is a Hooker. That is his opinion, just as Cyclop is a dead beat is yours. :)
And my opion is I thing Storm would be a great dancer. ;) Ballet that is.

[Mind Shadow]

As the official poster of this topic, I would like to close the voting polls. ;)

[fishtaco]

Yes! Close it, before Cyke catches up! :D

[Mind Shadow]

Yes! Close it, before Cyke catches up! :D

Fishtaco, I am honored to use my 100th posting to give you a high five! Woot WOot! Celebrate!! Gimme my anniversary present and CLOSE THE VOTING POLLS!! :D

::confetti and springers shoots everywhere::
... dustball rolls by.... :rolleyes:

[Faded]

LOL It amuses me that everytime I visit the thread, every other time Storm is winning by 2 and the other times Cyclops is winning by 2.

[Kal]

I guess the thread can be locked now. We have a clear winner.

[JamesCole120]

storm, cyclosp is just so boring and serious, and storm has an awsome power

[Jellobay]

I guess the thread can be locked now. We have a clear winner.

I lost my faith in humanity again. :(

[Red Lotus]

If you are looking for a single powerful mutant then you pick Storn. But if you need some one to lead Cyclops is the guy. Outside of Cap there is not a better lead in the Marvel U.

Bishop said it best. Cyclops is the greatest X-men leader ever.

[Faded]

Jello, stop creating new accounts to vote for Cyclops!!! ;)

Its time to pull the plug...on Cyclops. :)

[Your Imaginary Pal]

Storm was a great leader in the 8-'s-90's w/o powers.
I haven't really seen much recently as a leader, but remember how well she maneuvered back then, without the guidance of Charlie or Erik.

[Jellobay]

Jello, stop creating new accounts to vote for Cyclops!!! ;)

Its time to pull the plug...on Cyclops. :)


Speaking of which Faded, you should see some of the posters that voted or Storm.

Something is just not right (well there is something even more not right with them, besides voting for Storm.)

Die, chamber, die. :D

[Brian M.]

Speaking of which Faded, you should see some of the posters that voted or Storm.

Something is just not right (well there is something even more not right with them, besides voting for Storm.)

Die, chamber, die. :D

Lets go dance on Scanner's grave and Preview's.

[mattbib]

Storm was a great leader in the 8-'s-90's w/o powers.The Morlocks disagree.

[spoon_jenkins]

Speaking of which Faded, you should see some of the posters that voted or Storm.

Something is just not right (well there is something even more not right with them, besides voting for Storm.)
Scarlet Storm and Storm Fan 1 each have only posted once on CBR. Guess where?

[xakko]

just because people vote one way doesn't make it true.

they both are great characters. well, cyke USED to be, IMO, and has had flashes of that post "Twelve". storm can still be great, sometimes she gets a little too uber for my tastes, and i don't know how her impending marriage will treat her.

if i needed one leader for the X-men, however, my money's on Scott.

[Brian M.]

just because people vote one way doesn't make it true.

they both are great characters. well, cyke USED to be, IMO, and has had flashes of that post "Twelve". storm can still be great, sometimes she gets a little too uber for my tastes, and i don't know how her impending marriage will treat her.

if i needed one leader for the X-men, however, my money's on Scott.

When I get the money, I'm gonna pull Dan Slott's Thing.

[Sentinel K]

Scarlet Storm and Storm Fan 1 each have only posted once on CBR. Guess where?

Suspicious isn't it!

Who would sign up just to vote in this thread?

Fishy.

[Brian M.]

Suspicious isn't it!

Who would sign up just to vote in this thread?

Fishy.

Voter Fruad...someone call the Democrats they'll wanna play the race card on this one too.

[Karl J. Barnes]

Voter Fruad...someone call the Democrats they'll wanna play the race card on this one too.

Or maybe someone should contact O'Reilly and Faux News....they could show some young girl getting killed in another country or how pagans are trying to ruin Christmas.

[Faded]

Noooo not Politics and UTVol8102!!! :eek:

Lets go dance on Scanner's grave and Preview's.

Preview laughs at your so-called 'dancing'. "Hahahaha!" she says!

Meanwhile, Scanner sits for a cup of tea...ALIVE... with her sexy depowered self. :cool:

*grumblesmumblesgrumbles*

[frogjitsu]

I don't know if I have a favorite. It depends on who is writing the comic at the time. I have to admit though, I tend to gravitate more to the books Storm is in. I like Scott alot better with Jean behind him. I really despise Emma write now and just the fact that Cyclops is with her makes me dislike him a little. I also feel that this Storm/BP mariage thing feels rushed and out of character. So right now, I'm dissapointed in both of them.

[Lawrence]

Seeing as the poll pretty much puts the two equal, who do you think would get more X-men supporting them should the two fall out over leadership stuff? After all, a leader needs a team to lead, otherwise their skills are wasted.

[Brian M.]

Seeing as the poll pretty much puts the two equal, who do you think would get more X-men supporting them should the two fall out over leadership stuff? After all, a leader needs a team to lead, otherwise their skills are wasted.

Jean, Bobby, Warren, Hank, Alex, Lorna and I think maybe Logan would go w/ Scott. The others I'm not too sure.

[LordAllMighty]

Seeing as the poll pretty much puts the two equal, who do you think would get more X-men supporting them should the two fall out over leadership stuff? After all, a leader needs a team to lead, otherwise their skills are wasted.

Interesting

Archangel, Iceman, Polaris, Beast, Jean, White Queen, Havok and maybe Cannonball would follow Cyke

Wolverine, Rogue, Dazzler, Psylocke, Bishop, Colossus, Shadowcat, Rachel, Nightcrawler, Gambit and maybe Sage would follow Storm

[Sentinel K]

Interesting

Archangel, Iceman, Polaris, Beast, Jean, White Queen, Havok and maybe Cannonball would follow Cyke

Wolverine, Rogue, Dazzler, Psylocke, Bishop, Colossus, Shadowcat, Rachel, Nightcrawler, Gambit and maybe Sage would follow Storm

I reckon Wolverine, as much as he likes Ororo, would actually go with Cyclops. It would be a hard decision though.

Maybe Bishop too. Isn't Cyclops a bit of a legend in his time?

[Zombienorthstar]

I reckon Wolverine, as much as he likes Ororo, would actually go with Cyclops. It would be a hard decision though.

Maybe Bishop too. Isn't Cyclops a bit of a legend in his time?


yeah but i think storm is a legend too...and he repects her judgement alot...it could go either way...

Logan ultimatley will do as he sees fit i think regardless of the person.

[Lawrence]

Here's my opinion of the subject:

Archangel: Definitely Cyclops, they've known each other for too long.
Iceman: Cyclops again, for the same reasons as above.
Beast: Ditto ^
Havok: Well... they're brothers
Polaris: How many times has she ever been on the same team as Ororo?
Wolverine: I say Storm, because ultimately, I don't think he even likes Scott.
Colossus: Storm. He's her "little brother".
Nightcrawler: Storm, I'm not sure he's that familiar with Cyclops.
Shadowcat: Storm, this one's obvious.
Rogue: Storm was the first one to trust her wasn't she?
Rachel: Storm. Because she resents that Scott's with Emma and she was one of the surviving X-men that she knew from DoFP.
Psylocke: Storm. Same as how she followed her on the X-treme team.
Dazzler: Storm. She spent the Outback days with her right? Has she ever met Cyclops apart from before the DPS?
Gambit: Storm. I get the feeling that he's not too keen on Cyclops, don't know why. And he seemed pretty close to her in X-treme.
Emma: Cyclops. They're loves him, duh. (With all her Predator's heart) But on reflecting the previous reference, wouldn't she do what's best for herself?
Bishop: I think Storm. She was as much of a legend to him as Cyclops I think. And she was the one to show him around initially. And he's often on her team.
Sage: I've never even seen Sage talk to Scott. But then again, I haven't read much Sage. Probably Storm.
Students: Probably Scott. Since Storm spends most of her time in Africa nowadays, they don't really know her whereas Scott is the Headmaster.

I counted 7 to Cyclops and 11 to Storm. I think I counted a bit wrong, but I'm too lazy to recount..

I've missed out Jean, Jubilee, Longshot and Xavier because currently, they're either dead, de-powered or I just have no idea at all. If I've missed someone important out, feel free to point it out to me.

[Sentinel K]

Here's my opinion of the subject:

Archangel: Definitely Cyclops, they've known each other for too long.
Iceman: Cyclops again, for the same reasons as above.
Beast: Ditto ^
Havok: Well... they're brothers
Polaris: How many times has she ever been on the same team as Ororo?
Wolverine: I say Storm, because ultimately, I don't think he even likes Scott.
Colossus: Storm. He's her "little brother".
Nightcrawler: Storm, I'm not sure he's that familiar with Cyclops.
Shadowcat: Storm, this one's obvious.
Rogue: Storm was the first one to trust her wasn't she?
Rachel: Storm. Because she resents that Scott's with Emma and she was one of the surviving X-men that she knew from DoFP.
Psylocke: Storm. Same as how she followed her on the X-treme team.
Dazzler: Storm. She spent the Outback days with her right? Has she ever met Cyclops apart from before the DPS?
Gambit: Storm. I get the feeling that he's not too keen on Cyclops, don't know why. And he seemed pretty close to her in X-treme.
Emma: Cyclops. They're loves him, duh. (With all her Predator's heart) But on reflecting the previous reference, wouldn't she do what's best for herself?
Bishop: I think Storm. She was as much of a legend to him as Cyclops I think. And she was the one to show him around initially. And he's often on her team.
Sage: I've never even seen Sage talk to Scott. But then again, I haven't read much Sage. Probably Storm.
Students: Probably Scott. Since Storm spends most of her time in Africa nowadays, they don't really know her whereas Scott is the Headmaster.

I counted 7 to Cyclops and 11 to Storm. I think I counted a bit wrong, but I'm too lazy to recount..

I've missed out Jean, Jubilee, Longshot and Xavier because currently, they're either dead, de-powered or I just have no idea at all. If I've missed someone important out, feel free to point it out to me.

Again, I'd disagree about Logan. I think he'd take the best leader over the person he likes better. And I reckon he'd consider Cyclops the better leader.

EDIT: And also, the fact that logan didn't leave with the X-treme team could show where his loyalties lie.

[Zombienorthstar]

Here's my opinion of the subject:


Rachel: Storm. Because she resents that Scott's with Emma and she was one of the surviving X-men that she knew from DoFP.
.


Disagree...shes made her peace with that...look at the recent issues of Uncanny where she was sneaking out...scotts more fatherly to he rin that than ever before...they have a great relationship at this point...same as in Deadly Genesis...there a real bond there.

[Lawrence]

I always took those moments to mean that she was willing to accept that Cyclops loves Emma and would tolerate it in order to receive Cyclops' fatherly attention, but still disapproves of Emma.

Actually, didn't Emma offer to give Rachel training at one point? Was that ever followed up? And why would she need it? I'd always been under the impression that Rachel's skills were pretty good and didn't expect her to need coaching...

[xakko]

Colossus: Storm. He's her "little brother".
no, I disagree. he cares for Ororo more, certainly, but I honestly think that he would feel that her "plan Omega" which lead to the Outback years was a failure of leadership, as it basically lead to more problems, especially the Maddy and Illyana aspects of Inferno, which eventually led to Illyana's death. Scott was his first leader, and, quite frankly, things went better for him with Cyclops leading.

Nightcrawler: Storm, I'm not sure he's that familiar with Cyclops.
again, most of what Kurt learned about leadership was under Cyclops. he didn't serve under Storm that long- just a smattering of issues, really. Then he went to Excalibur. And he had at least one heart to heart with Scott as fellow leaders, and seemed delighted to get Scott's approval in Excalibur #71.

Shadowcat: Storm, this one's obvious.
why? again, don't mistake affection for logic. I think you may be right on this point, but I don't feel it is that obvious.

Bishop: I think Storm. She was as much of a legend to him as Cyclops I think. And she was the one to show him around initially. And he's often on her team.
and yet, he stated explicitly that he considers Cyclops the X-men's greatest leader.

Sage: I've never even seen Sage talk to Scott. But then again, I haven't read much Sage. Probably Storm.
Sage would analyze it without emotion, and would most likely say Scott.

[LordAllMighty]

Again, I'd disagree about Logan. I think he'd take the best leader over the person he likes better. And I reckon he'd consider Cyclops the better leader.

Well that's still up for debate

EDIT: And also, the fact that logan didn't leave with the X-treme team could show where his loyalties lie.

IIRC, Logan didn't leave because Storm asked him to stay. Unlike Scott, Ororo doesn't fully trust Xavier, so she had Logan stay at the mansion to keep an eye on things. (See Uncanny X-Men 109)


Actually, didn't Emma offer to give Rachel training at one point? Was that ever followed up? And why would she need it? I'd always been under the impression that Rachel's skills were pretty good and didn't expect her to need coaching...

True, she was trained in the use of her abilities by Xavier but we have no idea how much she learned. While she is perhaps the most powerful psi on the planet she can still be overcome by more skillful telepaths (see Bogan and Emma). Besides, let's not forget that Emma held her own against the Phoenix Force for a couple of minutes. :)

especially the Maddy and Illyana aspects of Inferno, which eventually led to Illyana's death.

Storm had nothing to do with Maddy's madness. That falls all under Cyke for being a bad husband

again, most of what Kurt learned about leadership was under Cyclops. he didn't serve under Storm that long- just a smattering of issues, really. Then he went to Excalibur. And he had at least one heart to heart with Scott as fellow leaders, and seemed delighted to get Scott's approval in Excalibur #71.

Yet, he said that Storm was a good leader in Uncanny X-Men 465 (IIRC)

and yet, he stated explicitly that he considers Cyclops the X-men's greatest leader.

Yet, he's never been a member of Cyke's team.

Sage would analyze it without emotion, and would most likely say Scott.

Yet, she chose to follow Storm in Xtreme.

[FieryBalrog]

Storm was a great leader in the 8-'s-90's w/o powers.
I haven't really seen much recently as a leader, but remember how well she maneuvered back then, without the guidance of Charlie or Erik.

I remember how she almost got them all killed, failed to save the Morlocks, ran away from the team, got Kitty, Colossus and Nightcrawler injured...

[xakko]

Storm had nothing to do with Maddy's madness. That falls all under Cyke for being a bad husband
the X-men were removed from the mansion because they needed to set up the tension that would eventually turn into Inferno, but it manifested itself as Storm's "Plan Omega", which had nothing but disasterous effects. Just as the editorial decision to bring back Jean Grey manifested itself in the comics as Scott leaving Maddy (or, to be factual, leaving to see Jean, and Maddy stating that if he left, to not bother coming back.) If the X-men remain in New York, they would have necessarily encountered X-factor, and most likely, Scott would have tried to reconcile with his wife. He was not involved with Jean at that point, and certainly felt the obligation to Maddy that showed when he tried to find her. Maybe Jean moves on too, which would make some of the posters here happy. Regardless, there would have not been the incentive to choose S'ym's way, and thus no goblin queen.

Also, not making Illyana think they were dead, and being there for her in her battle for Limbo may have negated her own descent into the Darkchylde.

There was a lot of unnecessary pain and suffering from that decision, and Storm is to a certain extent responsible. It failed in the stated goal- it didn't protect their loved ones at all. Illyana (Colossus), Mystique (Rogue), Captain Britain & Jamie Braddock (Psylocke), Cyclops & Corsair (Havok) still had plenty of danger in their lives. I can't speak for Dazzler, but I really think if Phillip and Deborah Summers were in danger, it would be more from enemies of Scott than Alex. So who, exactly, were they protecting? What did they accomplish?

Yet, he said that Storm was a good leader in Uncanny X-Men 465 (IIRC)
saying that one is a good leader doesn't make the other a bad leader.

Yet, he's never been a member of Cyke's team.
so? I'm sorry, that isn't a logical argument. I thought we were asking who the X-men would consider the best leader. Bishop stated that Cyke was the greatest. 'Nuff said.

Yet, she chose to follow Storm in Xtreme.
again, your point? due to the misprint in the trade, I don't have the exact words, but didn't Ororo ask her?

Just because you prefer the mission of hunting down Destiny's diaries to being housed at the mansion (and doing commando raids into Genosha or Australia against Sentinels or whatever) doesn't say anything about the people leading. Sage's skillset would have made more sense with Storm's squad than fighting Sentinels.

[Brian M.]

Logan has stated quite a few times that he'd follow Cyclops to hell and back.

Also Kitty I think would choose Scott. She's seen him lead her whole life. He's done a good job.

[LordAllMighty]

I remember how she almost got them all killed, failed to save the Morlocks, ran away from the team, got Kitty, Colossus and Nightcrawler injured...

IIRC, we have already discussed this issue in this very thread. Do you really want to bring this up again?

the X-men were removed from the mansion because they needed to set up the tension that would eventually turn into Inferno, but it manifested itself as Storm's "Plan Omega", which had nothing but disasterous effects.

Explain?

Just as the editorial decision to bring back Jean Grey manifested itself in the comics as Scott leaving Maddy (or, to be factual, leaving to see Jean, and Maddy stating that if he left, to not bother coming back.) If the X-men remain in New York, they would have necessarily encountered X-factor, and most likely, Scott would have tried to reconcile with his wife. He was not involved with Jean at that point, and certainly felt the obligation to Maddy that showed when he tried to find her. Maybe Jean moves on too, which would make some of the posters here happy. Regardless, there would have not been the incentive to choose S'ym's way, and thus no goblin queen.

So in other words the editors made them do it.

Also, not making Illyana think they were dead, and being there for her in her battle for Limbo may have negated her own descent into the Darkchylde.

IIRC, Colossus did help her during one of her battle in Limbo. Also, her transformation into Darkchylde was going to happen no matter if Peter was there or not

There was a lot of unnecessary pain and suffering from that decision, and Storm is to a certain extent responsible. It failed in the stated goal- it didn't protect their loved ones at all. Illyana (Colossus), Mystique (Rogue), Captain Britain & Jamie Braddock (Psylocke), Cyclops & Corsair (Havok) still had plenty of danger in their lives.

That silly. It might have worked if the people you mention didn't put their lives in danger everyday. Also, if I remember correctly this was a team decision.

I can't speak for Dazzler, but I really think if Phillip and Deborah Summers were in danger, it would be more from enemies of Scott than Alex. So who, exactly, were they protecting? What did they accomplish?

I'm sorry you lost me here.:confused:

saying that one is a good leader doesn't make the other a bad leader.

I didn't say that.

so? I'm sorry, that isn't a logical argument. I thought we were asking who the X-men would consider the best leader. Bishop stated that Cyke was the greatest. 'Nuff said.

Yeah, but he also never knew Archangel had metal wings. He was a fanboy from the future who only had limited knowledge of the X-Men. So I wouldn't use his early opinion of the X-Men as actual fact on how he feel today. He been with the X-Men for many years now and has always been a part of Storm's team, so that should tell you where his loyalties lay.

again, your point? due to the misprint in the trade, I don't have the exact words, but didn't Ororo ask her?

As logical as Sage is, do you really think she would have joined Storm's team if she thought Storm wasn't a proper leader.:)

[xakko]

Explain?
removing the X-men from America to Australia was a plot device to keep them away from X-factor, as well as a way to "shake up" their world a bit.

So in other words the editors made them do it.
editorial mandated the Scott/Maddy breakup, CC was responsible for the Outback years, and I believe he had more planned, too, than what we got.

IIRC, Colossus did help her during one of her battle in Limbo. Also, her transformation into Darkchylde was going to happen no matter if Peter was there or not
yes, he helped her in #231. but she thought it was the result of her own necromantic spell. as for turning to the dark side, that was exacerbated by her going after Forge after the events in Dallas. also, given how big a threat Limbo had become, don't you think that the X-men would have helped out in the battle?

That silly. It might have worked if the people you mention didn't put their lives in danger everyday. Also, if I remember correctly this was a team decision...I'm sorry you lost me here.:confused:
My point is that it was Storm's plan, and not a very well thought out one. Everyone may have agreed, but as leader, she is responsible for the outcome. They were going to go underground to protect their friends and family, but if you look at the roster, most of their friends and family already was "living the life", as it were, so who exactly they hoped to protect was a reasonable question. And in the end, their sojourn through Australia ended up doing more harm than good, IMO

I didn't say that.
you said "Yet, he [Nightcrawler] said that Storm was a good leader in Uncanny X-Men 465 (IIRC)". My point was that whether Nightcrawler thinks of Storm as a good leader has no bearing on whether he thinks Cyclops or Storm is the best leader.

Yeah, but he also never knew Archangel had metal wings. He was a fanboy from the future who only had limited knowledge of the X-Men. So I wouldn't use his early opinion of the X-Men as actual fact on how he feel today. He been with the X-Men for many years now and has always been a part of Storm's team, so that should tell you where his loyalties lay.
are team assignments now based on choice? i thought it was more of an assignment thing. the X-treme squad was different, but that was a recruitment by Storm- she chose Bishop, not the other way around.

And, when the chips are down, such as when they were attacking Cable in "The Burnt Offering", Bishop served under Cyclops. Oh yeah. So did Storm.

As logical as Sage is, do you really think she would have joined Storm's team if she thought Storm wasn't a proper leader.:)
this isn't the argument- they are both good- even great- leaders. my point is that Cyclops is a leader with very few peers in the Marvel Universe. I personally think Storm is a notch below. Not incompetent at all- very, very skilled, but not on par with Scott.

[Zombienorthstar]

I actually think the best example of Storm leadership is in the first arc of X-treme you see how in control she is of all these loose canons around her like Rogue and a deep respect grows for the woman.

[Red Lotus]

Again, I'd disagree about Logan. I think he'd take the best leader over the person he likes better. And I reckon he'd consider Cyclops the better leader.

EDIT: And also, the fact that logan didn't leave with the X-treme team could show where his loyalties lie.

I'll agree Logan may not like Scott but he would stick with him. Logan respect Scott as a leader.

Wolverine from X-men 112

The guy's a leader as natural a leader as there ever was. Yeah I've been known to give him a hard time maybe more then once but even an old warhorse like me knows a leader when I see one. And this Scott Summers. The guy in charge of the X-men I'd follow him into hell if he said he needed me.

[element13]

i think wolverine would follow storm...though knowing him and the writers, he would somehow be on both teams at the same time. here's how i think it would be

cyclops- emma, angel, iceman, polaris, possibly beast, cannonball and havok.

imo, beast and havok are toss-ups for me. idk if havok would go to cyke because he hates playing second fiddle to his brother, and was with storm during the outback, and beast admitted during x-treme that storm was the x-man he trusted most. and when cannonball was with storm, they met an understanding, and he gained much respect for her, and i don't think he was ever under the leadershiop of cyclops.

storm- wolverine, rogue, dazzler, nightcrawler, gambit, psylock, colossus, shadowcat, and sage, possibly beast, cannonball, or havok.

[Hi-Fi]

EDIT: And also, the fact that logan didn't leave with the X-treme team could show where his loyalties lie.


He was going with them, but Storm asked him to stay and be the liason between the teams.

[element13]

I'll agree Logan may not like Scott but he would stick with him. Logan respect Scott as a leader.

Wolverine from X-men 112

wolverine has also stated that he would give his life for storm, and that he'd follow storm to hell and back. also, when cyke and storm fought, wolverine immediantley said he thought storm would win. at the end of the day, all the x-men know that both of them are the best of the best when it comes to leadership skills, and that both have had great moments, and their bad moments, so i think it comes down to who you like more.

[Sentinel K]

He was going with them, but Storm asked him to stay and be the liason between the teams.

:rolleyes:

Always have to make me look like an ignorant **** don't you.

[Hi-Fi]

:rolleyes:

Always have to make me look like an ignorant **** don't you.

And you thought your post was well-hidden a couple of pages back...:evilsmile

[Brian M.]

:rolleyes:

Always have to make me look like an ignorant **** don't you.

It's not hard. Now go play out in the yard while the big people talk.

[Sentinel K]

It's not hard. Now go play out in the yard while the big people talk.

But its dark outside and there are monsters. :(

[Brian M.]

But its dark outside and there a monsters. :(

I SAID GO!!!!!!!!!

Either that or go try and seduce that lady friend of yours.

[xakko]

The point is that Storm has often served under Cyclops, but not really vice versa. And in every recent mega-event- be it against Phoenix in Endsong or Cable in Burnt Offering. Cyke's in charge. Storm falls right into line.

By the way, Storm herself questioned her leadership skills in a conversation with Stevie Hunter following her return to the mansion after the Outback years.

Sorry folks, Storm's really cool and a great leader, but the evidence I see points to Cyclops being the best.

[element13]

The point is that Storm has often served under Cyclops, but not really vice versa. And in every recent mega-event- be it against Phoenix in Endsong or Cable in Burnt Offering. Cyke's in charge. Storm falls right into line.

By the way, Storm herself questioned her leadership skills in a conversation with Stevie Hunter following her return to the mansion after the Outback years.

Sorry folks, Storm's really cool and a great leader, but the evidence I see points to Cyclops being the best.

1) yes, cyke has served under storm as well just as much as vice versa

2) that instance is the only time storm questionex her leadership skills, cyke has done it on many occasions

3)what has cyke really done in the past few years? storm has come up with the plan to save an entire race, and save the entire galaxy, and lead her team through both instances. those two by themselves outclass what cyke has done recently. though who is better all depends on the writer. storm has been better than cyke, and vice versa. the fact is that it's almost impossible to pin-point who is actually better because it all depends on the writer.

[Brian M.]

1) yes, cyke has served under storm as well just as much as vice versa

2) that instance is the only time storm questionex her leadership skills, cyke has done it on many occasions

3)what has cyke really done in the past few years? storm has come up with the plan to save an entire race, and save the entire galaxy, and lead her team through both instances. those two by themselves outclass what cyke has done recently. though who is better all depends on the writer. storm has been better than cyke, and vice versa. the fact is that it's almost impossible to pin-point who is actually better because it all depends on the writer.

When has Cyclops served under Storm? When?

[element13]

When has Cyclops served under Storm? When?

secret wars, whic many would say out-classes endsong.

[Brian M.]

secret wars, whic many would say out-classes endsong.

So that one time would out class ALL THE OTHERS? Even when the teams were split into Blue/Gold and Scott would guest start in her team's book, he would lead. One time doesn't "out class" all the other times.

[xakko]

In Secret Wars, Xavier was the leader.

Not Storm, and she made a stink about it too.

[Brian M.]

In Secret Wars, Xavier was the leader.

Not Storm, and she made a stink about it too.

I've not read Secret Wars so I'm just assuming he's right.

[element13]

In Secret Wars, Xavier was the leader.

Not Storm, and she made a stink about it too.


no, storm states that she is the leader of the x-men, xavier doesn't disagree. he states that he knows what is best and would do the same if cyke was the leader as well or something similar. and UTVol8102, leading the x-men in an event that involved the entire marvel universe is more impressive than leading the x-men in an x-men comic. either way it's almost impossible to pin-point who is better because noth are different under different writers, and both have had their moments.

[Brian M.]

no, storm states that she is the leader of the x-men, xavier doesn't disagree. he states that he knows what is best and would do the same if cyke was the leader as well or something similar. and UTVol8102, leading the x-men in an event that involved the entire marvel universe is more impressive than leading the x-men in an x-men comic. either way it's almost impossible to pin-point who is better because noth are different under different writers, and both have had their moments.

So then in House of M when Scott led them would be almost the same? Or during Onslaught? Or against Phoenix? Or against Sinister in Inferno when both teams were there. Scott and Jean leave after OZT and who does HE LEAVE in charge...Storm.

[Huzzah!]

Cyclops has led 2 basic groups.

1. His friends and peers. Very little power struggle here, and no real leadership skills in terms of conflict.

2. A team with people who dislike each other. And in this instance storm was a lt to him and had to do what Cyclops could not, reign in wolverine. His failure in this regard early on should him to be more of a soldier than a leader. Without xavier he is pretty lost.

Storm on the other hand works well without Xavier, comes up with strategy's, and she doesnt blindly follow xavier as cyclops generally does.

Cyclops seems more of a good soldier with good tactics rather than a good leader. Hell look at the mansion. How many kids have died under his watch? A shit load.

[Jellobay]

Storm is supposed to be this great leader, but she leaves every body when the need her most.

She differs to Cyclops more often than not. She doesn't even seem to be leading a team for the forseeable future.

Storm is a great character, just not a great leader.

[Jellobay]

Cyclops seems more of a good soldier with good tactics rather than a good leader. Hell look at the mansion. How many kids have died under his watch? A shit load.


How many morlocks died on her watch? Oh thats right she was not watching. Great leadership there.

[Huzzah!]

The morlocks are adults, new x-men are children under ones direct care


and unlike the new x-men storm didnt have sentinels to fall back on. A direct tactical decision on scotts part led to one of the biggest horrific blunders ever.

Plus cyclops is such an idiot he put wolverine on three teams.

Check and mate my friend


check and mate

[Brian M.]

Also reread Claremont's first run. Cyclops reigned in Wolverine just fine. In the Savage Land he took on the team, he did in the Proteus arc. Wolverine was not a thorn.

[fishtaco]

Also reread Claremont's first run. Cyclops reigned in Wolverine just fine. In the Savage Land he took on the team, he did in the Proteus arc. Wolverine was not a thorn.True. Now read a bit further; Storm beat Cyclops in a fair duel. 'nuff said.

[Huzzah!]

he only reigned in wolverine in any regard because storm was there constantly to do it for him.

I suppose one could see that as a leadership quality, surrounding one with competent people....


but lets say storm wasnt on the team.

Cyclops would have said something to make wolverine ice his ass.

[Novaya Havoc]

What? So Storm is a better leader because she has boobs and Wolverine is FAR EASIER on female authority figures than males?

I do declare, the only woman he ever really gave a hard time (without the "tough love" schtick, which he only gives -- again -- to women) was, uh, Emma Frost. Even Rogue never had it so rough.

So I warrant that it's Storm's boobs that made him nicer to her. Not her innate leadership skills.

[Deus ex Chris]

What? So Storm is a better leader because she has boobs and Wolverine is FAR EASIER on female authority figures than males?

I do declare, the only woman he ever really gave a hard time (without the "tough love" schtick, which he only gives -- again -- to women) was, uh, Emma Frost. Even Rogue never had it so rough.

So I warrant that it's Storm's boobs that made him nicer to her. Not her innate leadership skills.
I'm going to say it's because she would kick his ass all over the place, and he knew it. ;)

[Huzzah!]

Plus Cyclops is a bad role model.

He's totally on the juice.

I can just imagine the track marks on his ass.


Yeah a guy named slim is built that big


riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigggggght.


And when it comes right down to it, Storm was able to convince beast, the smartest original x-men to join her team, and Wolverine to essentially spy on the mansion.


And again...cyclops put wolverine on 3 teams...and seems to not have a problem with him being an avenger....despite the constant death of x-men he is facing.

He seems more intersted in the White Queens breast. He cant in reign in his girlfriend

Wolverine and beast are fighting in front of the students.

Plus he offered membership to Xorn.....after xorn threatened to blow up the world.

Ace choice Scott. Good thing that didnt bite you in the ass...

oh wait

Plus come on. He left his wife a kid to hang around with his old girlfriend. PRICK move right there

[xakko]

no, storm states that she is the leader of the x-men, xavier doesn't disagree. he states that he knows what is best and would do the same if cyke was the leader as well or something similar. and UTVol8102, leading the x-men in an event that involved the entire marvel universe is more impressive than leading the x-men in an x-men comic. either way it's almost impossible to pin-point who is better because noth are different under different writers, and both have had their moments.
just read the book.

storm STATES she is, but Xavier corrects her, and if you look, is giving the orders in combat.

except when Cyclops took Rogue and Wolverine on a separate mission.

and even then, Cyclops had been pulled out of retirement into that battle.

and you haven't contradicted that when the chips have been down recently, Cyclops has commanded Storm.

[Brian M.]

True. Now read a bit further; Storm beat Cyclops in a fair duel. 'nuff said.

Then read on to that where Storm got her powers taken away by her b/f, your hero made it fact that Cyclops lost by some other influence and Cyclops comes back to mansion to reclaim HIS TEAM!

[fireball87o]

True. Now read a bit further; Storm beat Cyclops in a fair duel. 'nuff said.

Not completely true. Maddie enabled Storm's victory because she didn't want Scott abandoning her & baby Cable for the leadership of the X-Men.

[phantom1592]

I'll always consider Cyclops to be the true leader of the X-men. I consider Storm to be like Wasp or Hawkeye. Yes they CAN lead, but when Cap's around he's the one people listen to. Same with Cyclops. I don't remember him Ever getting bossed by Storm.

I do wish we could get back to a decent cyclops though. The last five years have been pretty rough on him. I couldn't even remember WHY I liked him so much till I came across some Essential X-men. THEN I remembered :)

[Huzzah!]

thats a seniority thing.


Storm is clearly the superior leader


Actually here is a good thing taht stands out


Once mystique was fighting some arcade robots or something, and not only did cyclops kill colossus, he got iced with some piano wire.

At least it took an explosion to get storm.


And for the third time...3 teams...wolverine on them all.

[LordAllMighty]

I have a question.

Do you think Cyke could lead the X-Men without his powers?

[Jake V]

I have a question.

Do you think Cyke could lead the X-Men without his powers?
Definitely. In fact, with the psychological problems his powers give him, he might end up being a better leader/tactician if he was free of the burdens his powers give him.

[Huzzah!]

He certainly can get a bus load of kids killed with them

Morlocks got killed by a super group of killers that were a real threat



New X-men got killed by a bazooka. Well done.

[Jellobay]

He certainly can get a bus load of kids killed with them

Morlocks got killed by a super group of killers that were a real threat



New X-men got killed by a bazooka. Well done.

And you still fail to see the point. As Xakko stated, when all is said and done, Storm herself defers to Cyclops.

And you noticed when those children died, Storm just stayed her safe distance away.

[Brian M.]

Hey, when the chips were up and mutants were down Storm was there. By there I mean off in Africa rubbing body parts w/ Black Panther. OOOH and getting married during the CIVIL WAR!!! Hey, a girls gotta do what a girls gotta do though right?

[Huzzah!]

again you miss that point that that is essentially seniority. A general orders a Lt. but that doesnt make him the better leader. I cant think of many decisions that he made outside of actual combat that were good in any regard.

Again...this is the guy who offered membership to someone who had to be talked out of blowing up the world.


Craaaaaaaaazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzyyyyyyyyyyy

[Alphaxman]

That’s not fair. She was on her way back but Bishop told her to stay in Africa. And I think Storm refers to Cyclops as much as Cyclops refers to her. They are on equal footing when it comes to leading the X-Men. But I think that Storm is more dedicated to the dream. They both don’t have a life outside the X-Men but Scott left more times then Ororo. This isn’t the first time major trouble hit the mutant world but when she sees trouble somewhere else, a place where she grown up and doesn’t have help to solve it what is she to do. There are plenty of X-Men at home to handle problems in the USA.
She has a whole continent she feels she has to protect. Yeah she’s running to marry Black Panther but what is it going to take. Maybe a couple of days Marvel time?
How long did Scoot take when Jean died, or when he married Madelyne, or when he got hurt during Operation Zero Tolerance and got better? I know I’m reaching. Besides I don’t think Storm would want to stay in the mansion with Emma in charge anyway.

[Huzzah!]

True true'

and at least a marriage is significant.


Cyclops wiener ass ran away when Psylocke hit on him


A boo hoo you baby


And its nice to see someone at least takes marriage seriously...unlike cyclops....who left his wife and newborn baby. And cheated on Jean. Class act baby. Class act.

[siops]

wow.. why do people keep on using cyclops' and storm's failures to define thier leadership skills? shoudnt we look at thier accomplishments as leaders and not only thier failures?

[Deus ex Chris]

And you still fail to see the point. As Xakko stated, when all is said and done, Storm herself defers to Cyclops.

And you noticed when those children died, Storm just stayed her safe distance away.

Hey, when the chips were up and mutants were down Storm was there. By there I mean off in Africa rubbing body parts w/ Black Panther. OOOH and getting married during the CIVIL WAR!!! Hey, a girls gotta do what a girls gotta do though right?

Are you guys intentionally being dense? We've been over this before--several times, in fact. Storm is in Africa freeing slaves and protecting entire villages from slaughter. She's doing a helluva lot more than any other X-Man at the moment.

[Huzzah!]

Yeah. if only she could be in the mansion punching the white queen like cyclops. Bravo man. Bravo.


Corsair needs to get some powers so he can come and take over the x-men leadership from his f-up sons

[phantom1592]

And for the third time...3 teams...wolverine on them all.


Well You don't hear Wolverine Complaining. Cyclops is just treating him like I treat my dog that's a little wild. RUN him. Run so that he's too exhausted to be trouble. Wolverine likes Action? GIVE him action. As much as we have!


That's GOOD leadership :)

[Huzzah!]

He's probably just worried Wolverine's gonna start tapping his new slice

He's insecure


I say thats a Bad leadership quality.

And he cant even keep Emma in line.

And despite the fact that Emma decided that the students should all go to the danger room and try to kill each other in order to see who will be the New X-men which is irresponsible, he seemed to just let it ride. Sure he got a hissy fit. But i dont see him overturning Emma's decision.

[phantom1592]

Emma considers herself a true leader. I don't see her defering to ANYONE, let alone Storm or Cyclops. Between the Hellfire Club, the Hellions, and Generation X, She's always been "the one in Charge" Granted she SUCKS at it, but that's irrelevant.

I wouldn't call thinking Wolverine was after your girl "insecure" It's actually has historical basis :)

[Novaya Havoc]

I think Val Cooper is the best leader.
http://pc59te.dte.uma.es/cdb/series/marvel/bitmaps/val.jpg

[unkiedev]

THIS thing is still going on? Wow.

Alright, let's stop with the "Storm is in Africa doing nothing" line. We all know that ain't how it's going down at all.

Storm is better because
A) She is more well-rounded.
B) She has seen more of the world.
C) She can empithise with more people
D) She makes friends easier.
C) She gells with everybody better
D) She doesn't cheat on her S.O.
E) She doesn't brood and whine like Scotty.

-The list goes on and on...and the Polls have Storm Ahead!

[Zombienorthstar]

Emma considers herself a true leader. I don't see her defering to ANYONE, let alone Storm or Cyclops. Between the Hellfire Club, the Hellions, and Generation X, She's always been "the one in Charge" Granted she SUCKS at it, but that's irrelevant.

I wouldn't call thinking Wolverine was after your girl "insecure" It's actually has historical basis :)


I wouldnt say she sucks at it...shes come up with some great ideas while others stadn there and go...duuuuh i dunno.

Th eonly downside is that her teams tend to welll...die.

[Red Lotus]

I think Storm is a great Leader. But when it come down to it Cyclops is a better one. Any time they are on the same team Storm follow Cyclops lead. I think the team may like Storm better as a friend. But that just shows you how much they respect Cyclops as a leader. They may not like him as friend but the all know he is the guy in charge. In the Marvel U Cyclops is look at as second to only Cap when it comes to leaders. Storm has never been looked at as the second best leader in the Marvel U.

[Brian M.]

IT's really all pointless b/c Storm is being subjected to Hudlin's pen and well that's gonna make her look like crap. Cyclops hasn't been written like a true leader since Claremont.

[Sentinel K]

IT's really all pointless b/c Storm is being subjected to Hudlin's pen and well that's gonna make her look like crap. Cyclops hasn't been written like a true leader since Claremont.

Woah! Be careful dude, that last sentence sounded like you know who! :D

[Brian M.]

Woah! Be careful dude, that last sentence sounded like you know who! :D

Well in my honest opinion Cyclops has been the great leader and tactician since him. Now Lobdell and Fabian did a good job aswell and I guess X-Factor 1-70. Ok so I change my mind, besides Claremont those are prime examples of Cyclops running laps around Storm in leadership.

[Sentinel K]

Well in my honest opinion Cyclops has been the great leader and tactician since him. Now Lobdell and Fabian did a good job aswell and I guess X-Factor 1-70. Ok so I change my mind, besides Claremont those are prime examples of Cyclops running laps around Storm in leadership.

I agree dude. I really wanna see Cyclops do something that makes me go "woah, this guy real is the dogs bollocks". Whedon came close, but its been a long time.

He's still better than Storm though.

This thread is just gonna run and run.

Then die.

Then be brought back again.

Probably.

[Mariah]

Woah! Be careful dude, that last sentence sounded like you know who! :D
I don't know, tell me! Please, unless you're referring to Fishtaco, then, I already know:p

But i agree with the statement. But the same could be said for Storm as well, as writer's have a hard time grasping her character.

[Zombienorthstar]

I


This thread is just gonna run and run.

Then die.

Then be brought back again.

Probably.


Like Jean!

WHo i thought was the best leade rin Morrisons X-Men

[Brian M.]

I agree dude. I really wanna see Cyclops do something that makes me go "woah, this guy real is the dogs bollocks". Whedon came close, but its been a long time.

He's still better than Storm though.

This thread is just gonna run and run.

Then die.

Then be brought back again.

Probably.

The scene w/ the Sentinel on the front lawn in the 2nd arc of Astonishing was great. Neither Colossus or Wolverine bothered to ask why. Just did then Scott openned up his eyes and GOOD BYE BITCH!

[Sentinel K]

The scene w/ the Sentinel on the front lawn in the 2nd arc of Astonishing was great. Neither Colossus or Wolverine bothered to ask why. Just did then Scott openned up his eyes and GOOD BYE BITCH!

It was cool, I agree.

That was one of those rare occasions when a double page spread was totallly justified.

He probably shouldn't have taken his visor off though. Technically that would weaken the strength of the force beam.


....but meh.


And Mariah. You already know. ;)

[Mariah]

Factor Three seeks the elimination, or forced utilization, of either of Xavier's lapdogs.

Summers is nothing more than a mound of clay to be shaped to our will.

The self-proclaimed goddess, while a much greater threat to our goals, is just as malleable.

It will only take acquiring one and the X-Men will fall like dominoes.

Factor Three is on the rise.
lol, can i say that i love you. Is that coming on a little too strong? That was too funny

[Mariah]

And Mariah. You already know. ;)
Sigh, um...I still don't know, unless it was my guess. I guess I should have warned everyone, my nickname is Jessica Simpson, and it's not because we share bra sizes:p

[Brian M.]

Sigh, um...I still don't know, unless it was my guess. I guess I should have warned everyone, my nickname is Jessica Simpson, and it's not because we share bra sizes:p

I love you..http://users.telenet.be/eforum/emoticons4u/love/new/love-smiley-076.gif..seriously.

[Mariah]

I love you...seriously.
Awww, thanks, I care for you too. xoxo Wait a minute, i just saw your smiley faces, oh my!

[Sentinel K]

Awww, thanks, I care for you too. xoxo

...She says while being humped.

[Brian M.]

Awww, thanks, I care for you too. xoxo Wait a minute, i just saw your smiley faces, oh my!

Lemme change that one.

http://users.telenet.be/eforum/emoticons4u/love/1296.gif

[Mariah]

Lemme change that one.

http://users.telenet.be/eforum/emoticons4u/love/1296.gif
I liked them both, but the second one you should do if you wanna do the first one;)

[Flight]

Oh, I just don't know which one to pick!
Its like picking between Hitler & Ricky Martin...

[Mariah]

Oh, I just don't know which one to pick!
Its like picking between Hitler & Ricky Martin...
I could see Storm sporting that mustache

[Flight]

I chose Cyclops.
I cannot betray my Summers love.

[Mariah]

I chose Cyclops.
I cannot betray my Summers love.
But with Scott around, Alex never has his chance to shine, as being the younger, dumber brother, who will never be as good as Scott:evilsmile

[Zombienorthstar]

But with Scott around, Alex never has his chance to shine, as being the younger, dumber brother, who will never be as good as Scott:evilsmile


Yeah he has...it was called Mutant X (the whole universe based around the premise of Alex beign the first X-Man and not Scott)

Id lvoe to see Scott get captured by Sinister and Alex take over his spot in astonishing but not get written as an emotionally impotent prick with an inferiority complex.

[fishtaco]

Yeah he has...it was called Mutant X (the whole universe based around the premise of Alex beign the first X-Man and not Scott)

Id lvoe to see Scott get captured by Sinister and Alex take over his spot in astonishing but not get written as an emotionally impotent prick with an inferiority complex.Havok wasn't written very well in Mutant X, imo. He was at his best in X-Factor, but only because of the build up in Uncanny X-Men. I miss those days...

[Zombienorthstar]

Havok wasn't written very well in Mutant X, imo. He was at his best in X-Factor, but only because of the build up in Uncanny X-Men. I miss those days...


I think he was very good in the frist few arcs of Mutant X...at least he wasnt an obnoxious tosser.

[Brian M.]

Havok wasn't written very well in Mutant X, imo. He was at his best in X-Factor, but only because of the build up in Uncanny X-Men. I miss those days...

It sounds like Brubaker may end up doing the samething to him. He's taking Havok and the group away from the mansion. He'll be away from Cyclops, noone to 2nd guess him, he should be able to exhibit more leadership and the kinda of qualities you saw in the Outback days and X-Factor days.

[fishtaco]

It sounds like Brubaker may end up doing the samething to him. He's taking Havok and the group away from the mansion. He'll be away from Cyclops, noone to 2nd guess him, he should be able to exhibit more leadership and the kinda of qualities you saw in the Outback days and X-Factor days.Not that I care much anymore, but I still hope so (for new reader's sake, though I won't be reading it). I think that extensive damage has been done to his character by a multitude of writers that can't be redeemed.

[Brian M.]

Not that I care much anymore, but I still hope so (for new reader's sake, though I won't be reading it). I think that extensive damage has been done to his character by a multitude of writers that can't be redeemed.

Well I'm not gonna tell you what to read and all but it could be a great story and it could give you what your looking for. Nothing is wrong in collecting the old stuff and enjoying how it's written, the downside is there won't be anything else like that coming out. Wait for the reviews and who knows, maybe it'll be the writing style you like.

[Zombienorthstar]

Well I'm not gonna tell you what to read and all but it could be a great story and it could give you what your looking for. Nothing is wrong in collecting the old stuff and enjoying how it's written, the downside is there won't be anything else like that coming out. Wait for the reviews and who knows, maybe it'll be the writing style you like.


true even Claremont doesnt write like his younger self anymore.

So youve got two options kid...

Stop collecting

OR

Try and find the good.

[Mariah]

It sounds like Brubaker may end up doing the samething to him. He's taking Havok and the group away from the mansion. He'll be away from Cyclops, noone to 2nd guess him, he should be able to exhibit more leadership and the kinda of qualities you saw in the Outback days and X-Factor days.
I thought Nightcrawler was gonna be the leader, unless Havok's gonna take control of the situation.

[Huzzah!]

Cyclops is abusive both emotionally and physically to women. Lamer ahoy!


Plus he's got a what...60-70% chance to blowing his own brains out?

If he was leading the aussie x-men someone would have taken the leadership from him

Without xavier or x-mansion gizmos he is useless.

Plus storm would waste his ass. She could kick the crap out of him without powers

Cyclops is too far up Xaviers ass , to close to the funk.

He just knows how to lead in fights...he cant lead in normal situations.

He's too close to the nest, never really branched off.

Plus if you are a hot chick and you kiss him he runs away to alaska

WUUUUUUUSSSSSSSSSYYYYYYYYYY

[Jellobay]

Cyclops is abusive both emotionally and physically to women. Lamer ahoy!


Plus he's got a what...60-70% chance to blowing his own brains out?

If he was leading the aussie x-men someone would have taken the leadership from him

Without xavier or x-mansion gizmos he is useless.

Plus storm would waste his ass. She could kick the crap out of him without powers

Cyclops is too far up Xaviers ass , to close to the funk.

He just knows how to lead in fights...he cant lead in normal situations.

He's too close to the nest, never really branched off.

Plus if you are a hot chick and you kiss him he runs away to alaska

WUUUUUUUSSSSSSSSSYYYYYYYYYY

Dude, you have to take you meds.
What do you mean he can't lead in normal situtations? What like watching TV or going on a picnic. Their whole like is not normal. And you say he never branches of and then you say he leaves, which is it?

He has to stay home now, because other, so called, leaders are out dreaming about their wedding night. ;)

[Huzzah!]

He's too close to Xavier mentally... in terms of approach

but i suppose like xavier he likes to take many vacations... Xavier does like to get away a lot

"WHats that? Colossus family just got killed? He could probably use a real leader to help him through that? Naaaah. Psylocke kissed me and im too much of a puss to deal with it so i have to run away to alaska."

As for the real world stuff im talking about adminstration and team dynamics. His team when not united against a foe are always at each others throats

His running of the school has been a joke and got lotta kids killed

And now that i think about it, his Corsairs werent doing taht well in the new mutant points thing

[Jellobay]

He's too close to Xavier mentally... in terms of approach

but i suppose like xavier he likes to take many vacations... Xavier does like to get away a lot

"WHats that? Colossus family just got killed? He could probably use a real leader to help him through that? Naaaah. Psylocke kissed me and im too much of a puss to deal with it so i have to run away to alaska."

As for the real world stuff im talking about adminstration and team dynamics. His team when not united against a foe are always at each others throats

His running of the school has been a joke and got lotta kids killed

And now that i think about it, his Corsairs werent doing taht well in the new mutant points thing

Do you even read the X-books?

Cyclops does way more adminstration and team dynamics that Storm ever has.
He put the teams together. He ran the School. Storm just runs away from any one important in her life. Poor Panther it is only a matter of time.

[Mariah]

Do you even read the X-books?

Cyclops does way more adminstration and team dynamics that Storm ever has.
He put the teams together. He ran the School. Storm just runs away from any one important in her life. Poor Panther it is only a matter of time.
Watch out boys, I'm having a Susan Powter moment, (grabs thighs and puts head in between them) STOP THE INSANITY!!!! lol

[Huzzah!]

Do you even read the books? Storm led a team through actual hard stuff.

Cyclops puts wierd random people together on teams. Thats bad leadership.

yeah ill stick crazy lorna alex and iceman on the same team....that couldnt possibly have bad ramifications


And again....he let Xorn on the team, after he threatened to blow up the world.


Its ironic, i think, that a cyclops fan is looking through the x-world with rose colored glasses

[Black Hole]

Interesting thread. Wasn't there one of these Pre "CBR Crisis"?

Anyway. I have always felt that Cyclops was the better leader, and indeed, I have voted for him in the poll, which at the time of this writing is tied.

To me, it's as simple as this: Who would I want to follow in a crisis? It's always been Cyclops.

Storm and Cyclops are similar in many respects...orphaned childhoods and they both repressed their emotions...for different reasons, of course.

It doesn't matter to me who would follow who. If every X-Man there ever was decided to follow Storm it would not change the fact the I think Scott is a better leader.

The terrible pain that this man has been through...pretty much nothing that Storm has done can trump (in my eyes) the final act of X-Men #137, when Jean turned back into Phoenix and immediately Scott knew he had to turn his power on the woman he loved to save everyone, possibly the entire universe. That's what a leader does.

As for the duel. I never once felt that Scott really lost. From the story, I thought that we were meant to realize (via Wolverine's comments -Ironically -Wolverine himself would lose a similar duel to Gambit years later) that Scott at his best would have won, and that he was at a very intense confluence of events in his life, thus causing him to lose. Later on it was "revealed" that Maddie may have been behind his loss, but I preferred the former explanation.

In fact, Storm only "won" because Cyclops would not have hurt her. If it would have been an actual battle merely opening his eyes could have destroyed her. They weren't playing a game to settle ranking on a sports team, they were fighting to see who would lead a very powerful team of heroes against increasingly deadly foes in an increasingly deadly and unsure world. If the stakes would have been "real", he would have won that duel, Maddie or not.

Now, the whole Morlock Massacre and subsequent events...I could never help but feel that everything would have went down much safer and better for everyone if Scott had been leading. Of course, it is impossible to prove that, but it always seemed like Cyclops would have just handled that shit and taken their enemies out.

Another thing that really struck me was during Inferno, Storm and the X-Men descended into darkness, while Cyclops and X-Factor did not. Again, I just don't think that would have happened to the X-Men if Scott had been leading.

As for now, post M-Day, I really don't think it would be a good idea to spread out the mutants all over the world. With that few of them, I think the right move was to secure the estate, then send out small teams to find other mutants and bring them back.

I think it was the right thing to do to want to concentrate your power, give pause to anyone who might attack you, let them know they can't just pick you off at will (New X-Men...grrrrrrr!). Seriously, though...there is some major power under that roof. There needed to be one safe haven for the mutants, I don't think that Storm's idea was a very good one at all, and seemed to be motivated from selfishness of having recently "rediscovered" her connection to the motherland.

I know the X-Men are acting like the governments bitches right now, but when the power in that mansion decides it has had enough, Sentinel Squad O*N*E* is going to have a pretty tough time doing anything about it. I believe we're going to see some serious ass-kicking when the X-Men break out. Storm would have been of much better service to what was left mutantkind by sticking with the X-Men.

I just feel that, with the worst disaster to ever strike mutantkind, you should go and help them confront it. It really looks like she wasn't happy with how Scott and Emma ran things, and she was afraid she would be relegated to a third place position so she just ran off. It would be more like a leader to come to the mansion and try to change things for the better.

I mean, is she really going to just leave those kids and her friends behind if she feels that they are under poor/misguided leadership? We all know the real reason Storm left the team. But the reasons provided by the story don't add much to her character as a leader. Just one more reason why I choose Cyclops over Storm.

[Brian M.]

You want to see the X-Men having enough of ONE read X-Men: Civil War. It has stated that the X-Men finally have enough w/ th 198 and ONE. It's on.

[Black Hole]

You want to see the X-Men having enough of ONE read X-Men: Civil War. It has stated that the X-Men finally have enough w/ th 198 and ONE. It's on.

Excellent. It's about time. Thanks for the heads up.

[Huzzah!]

Even if....all you are saying is Cyclops really wanted to he could have beat someone without powers...

And what does that say

:p

[Alphaxman]

I still think Storm is a better leader because she has a better working relationship with the people who follow her. Plus she knows how to take advice and when to not show all the cards in her deck. Scott is pretty much what-you-see-is-what-you-get kind of leader. Witch isn’t bad. Besides, if each character had to choose how they would follow, most of them would choose Storm. Only the other original four, Polaris, Emma and maybe Rachel (only because he’s her dad and they seem to have made up) would follow Scott. Alex would not follow his bother if he had have to. Logan, Kurt, Peter, Kitty, Rogue, Gambit, and Betsey are closer to Ororo. Bishop must feel that his option matter to Storm more then Cyclops. Sage was her right hand man so to speak. But I guess it comes down to who you like better as a character.

[Brian M.]

I don't get the statements about Alex not following his brother. Alex has always wanted to be the leader Scott could be. Always. He knows he's a good leader.

[Kal]

Jellobay has recruited more Cyclops worshippers. Ugh!

[Black Hole]

Even if....all you are saying is Cyclops really wanted to he could have beat someone without powers...

And what does that say

:p

Essentially that Storm was forced to rely on the mercy of her enemy. When I read that issue, I saw that Cyclops was essentially correct, without powers she was somewhat of a liability to the team.

If that had been a real fight she would have been killed.

[Exodus]

At the end of the day, Storm Lost her powers and still lead the team.

Cyclops wouldnt, couldnt do that.

-Exodus

[Blackcat]

It's a kind of 50/50, so we can draw our conclusion here.

[Huzzah!]

Essentially that Storm was forced to rely on the mercy of her enemy. When I read that issue, I saw that Cyclops was essentially correct, without powers she was somewhat of a liability to the team.

If that had been a real fight she would have been killed.

Well like bobby dinero said in Heat to Al pacino, there is a flipside to that coin


If she was a villain then cyclops would be neutered by someone who had some brains.


In contrast the Storm decision was a tactical one...and by knowing the enemy she knew hot to beat...if one wasnt going to show mercy and she had no reason to think he would, then the same attack wouldnt have been used.

[Sentinel K]

At the end of the day, Storm Lost her powers and still lead the team.

Cyclops wouldnt, couldnt do that.

-Exodus

Its never happened so how would you know that?

[Black Hole]

At the end of the day, Storm Lost her powers and still lead the team.

Cyclops wouldnt, couldnt do that.

-Exodus

But he did it before circa X-Men 150 when they lost their powers on Magneto's island. So I would definitely say that he would and could do it.

They were never following Scott because of a red beam shooting out of his eyes, they followed because they all trusted that he knew what to do, powers or not.

Of course now when you lose your powers you get kicked out of the mansion no matter what, so that couldn't happen today.

[Huzzah!]

Seems to me thats a cyclops decision.

One that worked out quite well for Tag Body Spray

[Red Lotus]

After the "12" when the X-men thought Cyclops was dead wasn't Gambit the leader of the team that Storm was on. It just seems odd to me that when they think Cyclops is dead and Storm is still around instead of her being the Leader its Gambit. :D :D

[Huzzah!]

actually im not really sure....maybe he was listed as...but as i recall he wasnt sort of with the team...but needed them...so they helped him for a few issues...or some such.

Havent read it in a while.

[Red Lotus]

He put the team together (one of those 6 months later after a big event crossover things they do) and they followed his lead for about a year.

[Zombienorthstar]

After the "12" when the X-men thought Cyclops was dead wasn't Gambit the leader of the team that Storm was on. It just seems odd to me that when they think Cyclops is dead and Storm is still around instead of her being the Leader its Gambit. :D :D


especially when Jean Cable and Beast were all members too...i think it was done to make him andf Rogue leaders of rival teams.

[Mariah]

especially when Jean Cable and Beast were all members too...i think it was done to make him andf Rogue leaders of rival teams.
I think it was to give them some kinda character development apart from each other.

[Black Hole]

Seems to me thats a cyclops decision.

One that worked out quite well for Tag Body Spray

A correct decision, too. If expedited a bit earlier would probably have saved lives, though. As it turns out, being at the mansion IS pretty damn dangerous.


But don't get me started on New X-Men.

This thread will blow up like the Godfather if I start venting about that.

[Zombienorthstar]

A correct decision, too. If expedited a bit earlier would probably have saved lives, though. As it turns out, being at the mansion IS pretty damn dangerous.


But don't get me started on New X-Men.

This thread will blow up like the Godfather if I start venting about that.


I agree i dont think removing the humans from the school was wrong...i just think it turned out badly for them...if anything i would have thought he was crazy if hed let them stay what with the inclusion of terrorists and murderers in the 198...of coruse he was right to let them go....the bus explosion was not his fualt. How could he have anticipated it? Answer- he couldnt which means it isnt a smear on his leadership skills.

[Speed]

People need to stop with the "Storm is better because she led the team and beat Cyclops with no powers" schtick.

Take a look at Scott Lobdell's X-Men issues #43 & 44.
Cyclops leads the Acolytes to safety and even gains their trust and pushes their abilities.
He's a born leader. Storm is a made one.

[Zombienorthstar]

I dont think eithers better...they have different qualities


Scotts more administrative, decisive and strtegic yet occasionally hes arorgant, distant and selfish.

Storm is more social, self-confident and morally assured yet has anger issues, an aloofness and is too ruled by her emotions.

[Speed]

I dont think eithers better...they have different qualities You voted Storm.

[Mariah]

People need to stop with the "Storm is better because she led the team and beat Cyclops with no powers" schtick.

Take a look at Scott Lobdell's X-Men issues #43 & 44.
Cyclops leads the Acolytes to safety and even gains their trust and pushes their abilities.
He's a born leader. Storm is a made one.
Cylcops is a great leader because of his tactical mind, and leading ability that stops short of Capt. America. He is more in your face strategy, while Storm prefers the non-direct approach. She's more sneaky, and subversive, and doesn't like to let her ace out of the bag as soon as others.
Cyclops achillies heel is powers, he depends on them, he isn't a hand to hand combatant, he is very dependant on his gifts, whether that be a hindrance or asset is still up in the air. While Storm has lead sans powers and come out on top, her achillies heel is her confidence. She has been underminded by so many people since she became field leader, it's not even funny. She "tore" out her soul to get the steel cajones to lead the group, but was underminded by Scott everytime he comes into the picture, as well as Xavier when he gained his ability to walk again.

[Zombienorthstar]

You voted Storm.


Yeah cause i enjoy that style of leadership if i was in that position.


yet thsi arguement made me think alot about it anf i think theyre both good...if anythign i only put Storm because i prefer her as a character.

[Jellobay]

People need to stop with the "Storm is better because she led the team and beat Cyclops with no powers" schtick.

Take a look at Scott Lobdell's X-Men issues #43 & 44.
Cyclops leads the Acolytes to safety and even gains their trust and pushes their abilities.
He's a born leader. Storm is a made one.


Dude you rock!

[Jellobay]

Cylcops is a great leader because of his tactical mind, and leading ability that stops short of Capt. America. He is more in your face strategy, while Storm prefers the non-direct approach. She's more sneaky, and subversive, and doesn't like to let her ace out of the bag as soon as others.
Cyclops achillies heel is powers, he depends on them, he isn't a hand to hand combatant, he is very dependant on his gifts, whether that be a hindrance or asset is still up in the air. While Storm has lead sans powers and come out on top, her achillies heel is her confidence. She has been underminded by so many people since she became field leader, it's not even funny. She "tore" out her soul to get the steel cajones to lead the group, but was underminded by Scott everytime he comes into the picture, as well as Xavier when he gained his ability to walk again.

During the Proteus arc, Cyclops took on all the new X-men just to test them out and held his own.
And for Storm it is not confidence it is arrogance. She was treated like a good in Africa and she still on occasion acts like one. Her powers are superior than a lot of the X-men, but she thinks she is superior in other ways also.
She might love her friends and team mates, but she will still leave them when she thinks she has something better to do.
Storm think of herself first and Cyclops thinks of the team.

[Mariah]

During the Proteus arc, Cyclops took on all the new X-men just to test them out and held his own.
And for Storm it is not confidence it is arrogance. She was treated like a good in Africa and she still on occasion acts like one. Her powers are superior than a lot of the X-men, but she thinks she is superior in other ways also.
She might love her friends and team mates, but she will still leave them when she thinks she has something better to do.
Storm think of herself first and Cyclops thinks of the team.
Yes, he did, and had Phoenix there handy in case things got out of hand, to save his bacon. He can't be alone, very codependent if you ask me, from Jean to Colleen, to Jean, to Lee Forrester, to Maddy, to Jean, to Emma. When he is single, he runs away and hides. Storm isn't arrogant, she is very fiercely willed and independent. She leads the team, gets results, does things the way she feels comfortable doing them, but just gets pushed aside when the boys wanna play again.

[Jellobay]

Yes, he did, and had Phoenix there handy in case things got out of hand, to save his bacon. He can't be alone, very codependent if you ask me, from Jean to Colleen, to Jean, to Lee Forrester, to Maddy, to Jean, to Emma. When he is single, he runs away and hides. Storm isn't arrogant, she is very fiercely willed and independent. She leads the team, gets results, does things the way she feels comfortable doing them, but just gets pushed aside when the boys wanna play again.

The way she feels comfortable doing them, is an other way of saying she does thing her way or no way.
After House of M when it was clear it was not going to be her way, she stormed (pun intended) off. She has always made herself and the people that follow her the out casts.
And listing Cyclops girlfriends only mean that those women wanted to be with leader. Storm can't seem to forge (again intended) a relationship with any one. Everytime she gets close to someone, she runs like always.
I hope her and the Panther are happy together, but good thing he is marrying her quick or she might just find another part of the world to run off to.
Storm is a good and powerful character, but all the X-men now that when they really need someone it is Cyclops that will be there for them.
Storm might pencil them in if she feels comfortable. ;)

[fireball87o]

why don't we all just play x-men legends & pair these two up & find out for ourselves who's better :D

[Deus ex Chris]

The way she feels comfortable doing them, is an other way of saying she does thing her way or no way.
After House of M when it was clear it was not going to be her way, she stormed (pun intended) off. She has always made herself and the people that follow her the out casts.
And listing Cyclops girlfriends only mean that those women wanted to be with leader. Storm can't seem to forge (again intended) a relationship with any one. Everytime she gets close to someone, she runs like always.
I hope her and the Panther are happy together, but good thing he is marrying her quick or she might just find another part of the world to run off to.
Storm is a good and powerful character, but all the X-men now that when they really need someone it is Cyclops that will be there for them.
Storm might pencil them in if she feels comfortable. ;)

Storm was already in Africa before House of M, and she wasn't angry when she spoke to Scott, so aside from the terrible pun, I see no reason for you to say she "stormed off" or whatever. As for the Forge thing, he walked away from her.

[Deus ex Chris]

After the "12" when the X-men thought Cyclops was dead wasn't Gambit the leader of the team that Storm was on. It just seems odd to me that when they think Cyclops is dead and Storm is still around instead of her being the Leader its Gambit. :D :D

Gambit called that group together for a specific mission--as a favor to him--and the only reason they all agreed to follow his lead is because Storm vouched for him.

[Jellobay]

Storm was already in Africa before House of M, and she wasn't angry when she spoke to Scott, so aside from the terrible pun, I see no reason for you to say she "stormed off" or whatever. As for the Forge thing, he walked away from her.

Forge is a smart man.

Bishop she keeps at a distance.

At least Ult. Storm isn't afraid to get close to some one.

She was already in Africa, you are right. She just decided that when the crap hit the fan she wanted no part of it. Maybe she was not comfortable with it.

I know if my family or friends have a crisis, I would go to them. She must not really love them at all. Maybe they know that, that is why they stayed with their true leader.

[Deus ex Chris]

She was already in Africa, you are right. She just decided that when the crap hit the fan she wanted no part of it. Maybe she was not comfortable with it.

I know if my family or friends have a crisis, I would go to them. She must not really love them at all. Maybe they know that, that is why they stayed with their true leader.

Or she realizes that the X-Men can take care of themselves, and that she'll be more effective in Africa. This has of course been shown several times in the comics and pointed out here, but you continue to ignore it. Why is that?

[Jellobay]

Or she realizes that the X-Men can take care of themselves, and that she'll be more effective in Africa. This has of course been shown several times in the comics and pointed out here, but you continue to ignore it. Why is that?


Because that is not Storm personality. She also told Cyclops that she did not agree with Emma and him. So the fact she doesn't agree with them would suggest that she doesn't think they are okay.
And her friends are in turmoil, but she won't help. Why do you continue to ignore that?

[Jellobay]

This thread had died for awhile and then a Storm voter posted on it to say how Cyclops was dead and the poll had spoken. But right now he is up by one again.

Thanks, Storm poster. :)

[Sentinel K]

..................
..................



Is this thread still going?!

Crikey!!

[Jellobay]

..................
..................



Is this thread still going?!

Crikey!!

I know, but look on the bright side. Cyclops is up by one. :D

[Sentinel K]

This thread had died for awhile and then a Storm voter posted on it to say how Cyclops was dead and the poll had spoken. But right now he is up by one again.

Thanks, Storm poster. :)

That was Kal.

And Votes mean **** all.

But Cyclops would be ahead anyway 'cos Storm has those fake votes.
Probably.

[Jellobay]

That was Kal.

And Votes mean **** all.

But Cyclops would be ahead anyway 'cos Storm has those fake votes.
Probably.

They felt comfortable making those votes. Storm would have done the same thing.

[Deus ex Chris]

Because that is not Storm personality
It is Storm's personality. She helps people who can't help themselves. That's what she does and what she has always done.

She also told Cyclops that she did not agree with Emma and him. So the fact she doesn't agree with them would suggest that she doesn't think they are okay.
She never said that she didn't think they were okay, and having a difference of opinion doesn't automatically suggest such things.

And her friends are in turmoil, but she won't help. Why do you continue to ignore that?
I haven't ignored it. I've referenced Storm's reasons for not being at the mansion. Once again: she feels that she'll be more effective in Africa. You don't have to agree, but the least you could--in order to keep intellingent discussion going--is acknowledge her reasoning, instead of continually saying she's lounging around Black Panther's palace or making wedding plans or being pissed at Scott or whatever else you decide to fabricate simply so Cyclops will win the poll.

[Beast]

Scott's a crybaby piss pants, judging by Deadly Genesis. :D

[Red Lotus]

Storm isn't arrogant, she is very fiercely willed and independent. She leads the team, gets results, does things the way she feels comfortable doing them, but just gets pushed aside when the boys wanna play again.


Storm is a great leader. But if the team viewed her as a better leader then Cyclops she wouldn't get pushed a side. Any time Scott isn't on the team and there is a major X-event going on they always bring him back and he is always the one who come in and leads the X-men out of it.

Gambit called that group together for a specific mission--as a favor to him--and the only reason they all agreed to follow his lead is because Storm vouched for him.

Yeah he did but then once that mission was over with he was still the leader for a while. And when Gambit had doubts about being a leader it wasn't Storm who talked to him and reassured it was Jean.

[Doom Hammer]

Scott's a crybaby piss pants, judging by Deadly Genesis. :D

I thought he responded pretty reasonably in not punching Xavier in his dirty sapien face.:p

[Jellobay]

It is Storm's personality. She helps people who can't help themselves. That's what she does and what she has always done.


She never said that she didn't think they were okay, and having a difference of opinion doesn't automatically suggest such things.


I haven't ignored it. I've referenced Storm's reasons for not being at the mansion. Once again: she feels that she'll be more effective in Africa. You don't have to agree, but the least you could--in order to keep intellingent discussion going--is acknowledge her reasoning, instead of continually saying she's lounging around Black Panther's palace or making wedding plans or being pissed at Scott or whatever else you decide to fabricate simply so Cyclops will win the poll.


:D You make me smile. I like you. :)

I don't agree that she thinks being in Africa is more important. I like Storm and I wouldn't want to think that she was that heartless and stupid. I do think she is there because she knows she would have to listen to Cyclops because he is the better leader. All the X-men know it. If being in Africa was so important wouldn't her team have followed her. Wolverine did, but since Jean is dead he went to his back up plan. Bishop loves her, but even he thinks the right place is home.

And she is not all about helping helping people. Well okay maybe if they worship her as a god then she will give them some rain for their crops. So I guess you have me there.

You don't think she is making wedding plans? I would feel sad if on this her happiest of days she didn't have say so on the colors and the flowers and things. I just hope she doesn't plan the wedding on the same day they have a funeral for one of her "friends". That would just be tacky.

[Jellobay]

Scott's a crybaby piss pants, judging by Deadly Genesis. :D


Beast is a PussyCat. :evilsmile

Yes I went there. :p

[Jellobay]

And when Gambit had doubts about being a leader it wasn't Storm who talked to him and reassured it was Jean.

Storm didn't feel comfortable with it. ;)

Your a cool dude Lotus. :D

[Deus ex Chris]

I don't agree that she thinks being in Africa is more important. I like Storm and I wouldn't want to think that she was that heartless and stupid. I do think she is there because she knows she would have to listen to Cyclops because he is the better leader. All the X-men know it. If being in Africa was so important wouldn't her team have followed her. Wolverine did, but since Jean is dead he went to his back up plan. Bishop loves her, but even he thinks the right place is home.
So you're basically telling me that you're ingoring what is written in the books in favor of some silly, petty reasoning that you yourself created? Got it. I guess you and I are done discussing this issue.

[Red Lotus]

: If being in Africa was so important wouldn't her team have followed her. .

You're right if it was that important they would have, When Scott asked her to come back to the school she told Scott that she was going to ask him to send her team to her. But he thought it was more important for them to stay at the School and even if it was the team she was leading and any number of them could have left and join Storm they stayed with Scott.

[Brian M.]

I've said it once, I'll say it again.

I don't like Storm b/c she's black.


:D

[Black Hole]

Scott's a crybaby piss pants, judging by Deadly Genesis. :D

I'm sorry, but this is hilarious...BWA-HA-HA-HA...

[Huzzah!]

Gambit called that group together for a specific mission--as a favor to him--and the only reason they all agreed to follow his lead is because Storm vouched for him.

Thanks for the verification. I thought i recalled that correctly.

Actually i seem to recall a pretty good sight gag from that too...gambit was making out with some chick, there was an explosion which caught his attention, then he went back to making out. Pretty fun if that was there

A correct decision, too. If expedited a bit earlier would probably have saved lives, though. As it turns out, being at the mansion IS pretty damn dangerous.


The decision to have them leave us up for debate...although considering they have now been marked as "close" to the x-men by their villains im not too sure how getting them away from the mansion could have turned out.

Im questioning his decision on how to do it. His pride and not wanting to ask for help from the sentinels cost them all their lives.

Cyclops is a great tacticion. I dont dispute that. But i believe he lacks almost every other quality of a good leader. He would be best be suited in say a war move as the sgt. the combat right hand man of the main leader. His adminstration of the school has been one giant disaster. He has left his girlfriend basically go unchecked in the adminstration and seems to be too gutless to really stand up to her.

Her latest all you kids go kick the crap out of each other in the dangerroom stint despite being publicly chewed out for still stands.

He seems okay with letting dangerous, super dangerous people around children.

He offered Xorn membership to the x-men after he just threated to blow up the world.

so on and so forth.

He has Polaris' crazy ass on an active team roster. Wolverine on 3 teams. He seems to have adopted many of xaviers extreme pro mutant stances he had taken on new x-men.

Do you think that its some big suprise/shock that Xavier was setting up Jean to take over the school rather than Cyclops? Seems to me he was able to see his faults.

Storm on the other hand not only persuaded all the x-men she brought to her Xavier cant be trusted meeting to join up with her in some regard

She also took a proactive stance in setting up the XSE

She developed her on philosophy towards mutant human relations rather than Cyclops who simply does what xavier does.

She left to go to Africa? There is a good reason for that

There was no good reason for Cyclops to run off to Alaska when the under the kwannon influence Psylocke kissed him

Every negative thing one might be able to say about Storm goes double or triple for Cyclops.

[Jellobay]

So you're basically telling me that you're ingoring what is written in the books in favor of some silly, petty reasoning that you yourself created? Got it. I guess you and I are done discussing this issue.

Though it is hard for you to believe I don't take what a characters says for fact. If you do cool, but I think it is up for the reader to decide what the character is truly saying.

When I said Storm was picking out her china pattern you thought I was serious too, so I can see how you would believe just what you read.

I bet you would get really confused if Magneto or Apolcolypse said they are good guy looking out for the best interest in mutants. Oh wait they already think that so who do you route for?

And weather you think my reasons or silly and petty that is up to you. I still respect yours, but I also notice that you dodge the point. If being in Africa is so important then why did only Wolverine follow her? If she is such a better leader then why would she only have one team mate with her? And that team mate is every where anyway.
Where are her X-men followers during the crisis? You can't lead if there is no one to follow Chris. Can you? ;)

[Mariah]

Okay, Scott always seems to run off to Alaska everytime he gets a little over-whelmed, so the fact that Storm is in Africa should be moot. She gave up the man she loved for this team, which should show the dedication she has for the dream. Now she disagrees with how the school is being run, by a former villianess who had a large hand in corrupting Phoenix, and took possession of her body, and tried to subjugate the New Mutants on several occasions, she's the deserter? When the chips come down, Scott will always run from his problems, leaving Storm to deal with the emotional stress the team ends up going through.

[Sentinel K]

They're both crap.

Everyone knows Lockheed should be leading this stupid bunch of mutant half-wits.



The End.

[unkiedev]

Scott's a crybaby piss pants, judging by Deadly Genesis. :D
This is the ultimate truth, hands down.

Jello- you are always returning to this "Storm in Africa" Point. Is this all that's bothering you? She has a life outside of the X-men. Scott has a life exclusively IN the X-men. That doesn't make one better.

Both Storm and Scott are doing what they think is best for themselves and for those around them. Scott and Storm do not always see eye to eye about how things should be handled.

-The leadership angle gets weird here, because the original debate was a simple, good ole' fashioned "Who's Better"...it's been turned into a leadership discussion....am I wrong?

Jello, is your official position here that Storm is off in Africa being self-serving/lazy/self indulgent?

[Deus ex Chris]

Ok, I'll bite.

Though it is hard for you to believe I don't take what a characters says for fact. If you do cool, but I think it is up for the reader to decide what the character is truly saying.
It is up to the reader, but everything you've suggested is wildly out of character for Storm, and if you're going to make such statements on a discussion board you should have some sort of textual evidence to back it up, which you don't.


When I said Storm was picking out her china pattern you thought I was serious too, so I can see how you would believe just what you read.
Condescend a little more. I dare you.


I bet you would get really confused if Magneto or Apolcolypse said they are good guy looking out for the best interest in mutants. Oh wait they already think that so who do you route for?
You're right: Magneto and Apocalypse genuinely do believe their actions are in the best interest of mutants, which is why both make compelling antagonists. That doesn't mean I agree with them, but that is something different entirely. We're talking about you assuming things about a character with no evidence to support those assumptions. You are entitled to make any assumptions you like, but don't be surprised when your opinions are dismissed because you can't provide any evidence to support them.

And weather you think my reasons or silly and petty that is up to you. I still respect yours, but I also notice that you dodge the point. If being in Africa is so important then why did only Wolverine follow her?
We still don't know how much of the situation Storm's team is aware of. We haven't seen anyone reference her conversation with Cyclops, and we haven't seen her ask anyone but Cyclops for assistance. The other X-Men may be under the impression that Storm simply left the team. We just don't know. Hopefully, the Uncanny X-Men Annual will resolve these issues.

If she is such a better leader then why would she only have one team mate with her? And that team mate is every where anyway.
I haven't once argued that Storm is the better leader. All I've done on this topic is respond to absurd, insupportable statements that you and others have made.

Where are her X-men followers during the crisis? You can't lead if there is no one to follow Chris. Can you? ;)
Storm isn't trying to lead anyone. She's trying to save lives. What about that is so hard for you to understand?

[unkiedev]

Every negative thing one might be able to say about Storm goes double or triple for Cyclops.
HERE HERE!

[Jellobay]

Ok, I'll bite.

Ouch, no physical contact.

It is up to the reader, but everything you've suggested is wildly out of character for Storm, and if you're going to make such statements on a discussion board you should have some sort of textual evidence to back it up, which you don't.

I don't think it is that wildly out of character at all. For a long time she has been trying to get as far away from the mansion as possible.

Condescend a little more. I dare you.

That was not condescending enough for you? I will try harder. ;)



You're right: Magneto and Apocalypse genuinely do believe their actions are in the best interest of mutants, which is why both make compelling antagonists. That doesn't mean I agree with them, but that is something different entirely. We're talking about you assuming things about a character with no evidence to support those assumptions. You are entitled to make any assumptions you like, but don't be surprised when your opinions are dismissed because you can't provide any evidence to support them.
What more evidence do you need? Her friends are dying and she doesn't want to help, because she doesn't feel comfortable how Scott and Emma run the team.
She is supposed to be a team leader, but is not with her team. Just how she was supposed to be leader of the Morlocks and left them a second later.


We still don't know how much of the situation Storm's team is aware of. We haven't seen anyone reference her conversation with Cyclops, and we haven't seen her ask anyone but Cyclops for assistance. The other X-Men may be under the impression that Storm simply left the team. We just don't know. Hopefully, the Uncanny X-Men Annual will resolve these issues.
Now who is assuming things. That is right we don't know. But I think it is a lot more believable that they know she asked for them since Wolverine has been with her than what you are dreaming up. Do you really think Cyclops would say "Storm is no longer with the X-men and doesn't want any of you," to her team mates. Don't you think Wolverine might contradict that if he did?
It is a lot more believable that "her team" knows where they are more needed. To bad Storm doesn't.

I haven't once argued that Storm is the better leader. All I've done on this topic is respond to absurd, insupportable statements that you and others have made.
You voted that she is, so I would guess thats how you feel.
All you have done is taken offence when someone says something negative about your perfect Strom. Heaven forbid. :eek:


Storm isn't trying to lead anyone. She's trying to save lives. What about that is so hard for you to understand?
Okay lets go with that, so if Storm is not trying to lead anyone, how does that make her a better leader.

[Jellobay]

To all Storm voters:

I want you all to know I really love you guys. I do, I mean I think you are all wrong, but that does mean I don't love you.

People often have a difference of opinions, but that does not mean the love still isn't there. You make me smile and that is a special thing. :)

You see Cyclops supporter are not so bad. We have feelings also, if you prick up do we not bleed?

It is all about the love. :D

** Big hugs **

[Brian M.]

Cyclops > Storm :p

[LordAllMighty]

I’ll say it once again, how stupid do you have to be to allow Sentinels, Marauders and Brotherhood members to stay on your front lawn?:confused:

[Brian M.]

I’ll say it once again, how stupid do you have to be to allow Sentinels, Marauders and Brotherhood members to stay on your front lawn?:confused:

You have to be smart to weigh the options of fighting them all at once and realizing that for once something is bigger then your petty differences.

[Jellobay]

I’ll say it once again, how stupid do you have to be to allow Sentinels, Marauders and Brotherhood members to stay on your front lawn?:confused:

He didn't really allow it, he just chose what to deal with first. They will be dealt with in good time.
I think that is sign of a good leader.

Though the could have when and saved mutants in Alaska, but I think you might bash him for that too. ;)

[Jellobay]

You have to be smart to weigh the options of fighting them all at once and realizing that for once something is bigger then your petty differences.

Testify. :)

[fishtaco]

I’ll say it once again, how stupid do you have to be to allow Sentinels, Marauders and Brotherhood members to stay on your front lawn?:confused:Absurdity such as this has caused me to drop nearly all of the X-books and consider all of the current X-books non-canon. :cool:

[element13]

why do people harp on storm for taking a leave of absence from the x-men for the first time in 15 years when cyke has left the x-men many, many times? yes, mutantkind is in danger, but how many mutants do they need at the mansion? storm is helping thousands of people over in africa. is she really going to make that big of a difference that now everyone is insulting her because she isn't at the mansion? heaven forbid she does one thing for herself instead of the x-men for once. she has given up everything she had for the x-men, and the second she does something for herself everyone complains? how many times has cyke put himself over the x-men? aslo, to the person that said storm wasn't a natural born leader...think again. storm had a leadership role before she was even ten. she was a part leader of the urchins, and then went on to lead an entire nation of african people.

[Jellobay]

why do people harp on storm for taking a leave of absence from the x-men for the first time in 15 years when cyke has left the x-men many, many times? yes, mutantkind is in danger, but how many mutants do they need at the mansion? storm is helping thousands of people over in africa. is she really going to make that big of a difference that now everyone is insulting her because she isn't at the mansion? heaven forbid she does one thing for herself instead of the x-men for once. she has given up everything she had for the x-men, and the second she does something for herself everyone complains? how many times has cyke put himself over the x-men? aslo, to the person that said storm wasn't a natural born leader...think again. storm had a leadership role before she was even ten. she was a part leader of the urchins, and then went on to lead an entire nation of african people.

Dude, when Cyclops took some time for himself they didn't just lose 90% of their race. Storm just throws a wedding during tragedy I guess.
She is helping thoundsands huh? Granted I don't read the Storm mini and I haven't read the latest Uncanny, but Thousands. All I've seen so far is a dead guy with some buzzards and small village of like 20-30 people. Please let me know where the thousands she is saving are because I might just pick up that book. :)
I'm not saying she is a bad leader, I am just saying she is no where near better than Cyclops.

[Doom Hammer]

Absurdity such as this has caused me to drop nearly all of the X-books and consider all of the current X-books non-canon. :cool:

Alright dude, you've been proclaiming this for weeks now. I thought the point of this was to save yourself and others irritation. We all know, you're done with the X-books. I'm glad you've found comics you enjoy, I seriously am. But move on with it, please? It's so much better than being negative all the time.

[Will.S]

Alright dude, you've been proclaiming this for weeks now. I thought the point of this was to save yourself and others irritation. We all know, you're done with the X-books. I'm glad you've found comics you enjoy, I seriously am. But move on with it, please? It's so much better than being negative all the time.
Just ignore him most of the time, it's what I do.

[Deus ex Chris]

What more evidence do you need? Her friends are dying and she doesn't want to help, because she doesn't feel comfortable how Scott and Emma run the team.
She isn't helping because she is in Africa helping people who need her help more than the X-Men do. Can you just acknowledge that? It's in the books.

Also, for the record she nearly did return to the mansion.
From Uncanny X-Men #469:
Storm: I'm coming home.
Bishop: Don't.
Storm: I beg your pardon?
Bishop: Intervention by you at this stage won't help. Plain fact is, you're better off where you are. As a free agent, you give the X-Men--and mutants in general--options.

So she obviously does care, or was she just saying that to seem like she cared? I'm sure that's your inference, right?

She is supposed to be a team leader, but is not with her team. Just how she was supposed to be leader of the Morlocks and left them a second later.
The Morlock example doesn't hold up for me. She challenged Callisto to save the X-Men, and that's it. She didn't want to lead them. She was trying to save her people--like a good leader would--and she left the Morlocks with their status quo intact. Callisto was still in charge.

Now who is assuming things.
I didn't assume anything.


But I think it is a lot more believable that they know she asked for them since Wolverine has been with her than what you are dreaming up. .
I haven't dreamed anything up. You're the one fabricating things, not me. I simply said that we don't know what actually happened.

Do you really think Cyclops would say "Storm is no longer with the X-men and doesn't want any of you," to her team mates. Don't you think Wolverine might contradict that if he did? .
I never suggested Cyclops said that. We don't know what he said. For all we know, he didn't say anything. Wolverine knew Storm was in Africa because he was with her when she decided to stay there.
It is a lot more believable that "her team" knows where they are more needed. To bad Storm doesn't..
Well, you don't have to believe she's where she's needed most. I do. I'm sure other fans do. She does, and even Bishop does--as I referenced earlier (something you've failed to do entirely).

You voted that she is, so I would guess thats how you feel.
All you have done is taken offence when someone says something negative about your perfect Strom. Heaven forbid. :eek:
Cyclops is a better strategist, but Storm has a better understanding of the big picture, in my opinion, and to me, that's more important, so I voted for her, but I do love them both. Again, I've only come to Storm's defense when unsubstantiated claims were made against her. Being that this is a discussion board, I'd say that's quite appropriate.



Okay lets go with that, so if Storm is not trying to lead anyone, how does that make her a better leader.
She's not trying to lead right this moment. That doesn't nullify her past as a leader or anything. We can still discuss it.

[Doom Hammer]

Just ignore him most of the time, it's what I do.

I don't really use the ignore function, I think it's a bad way to solve a problem of communication and there's the off chance that even the most ignorant of folk can say something enlightening.

And I respond to fishtaco because I don't dislike him - I just wish he would put all that wasted critical energy into something positive, like reviewing back issues or something.

[element13]

Dude, when Cyclops took some time for himself they didn't just lose 90% of their race. Storm just throws a wedding during tragedy I guess.
She is helping thoundsands huh? Granted I don't read the Storm mini and I haven't read the latest Uncanny, but Thousands. All I've seen so far is a dead guy with some buzzards and small village of like 20-30 people. Please let me know where the thousands she is saving are because I might just pick up that book. :)
I'm not saying she is a bad leader, I am just saying she is no where near better than Cyclops.

you expect storm to save the 10% they have left by herself? having her there or not is not going to make such a big difference to the point where it couldn't have been done without her. besides, if cyke is as good as leader as people make him out to be those people at the mansion should be all fine under him right? stopping starvation and things like that saves thousands alone. you can't say she is no where near cyke because they are both great under different writers. though, storm leading her team to save an entire race of people, and storm leading her team to save the galaxy outweighs what cyke has done. either way, both are good and bad under different writers.

[Jellobay]

She isn't helping because she is in Africa helping people who need her help more than the X-Men do. Can you just acknowledge that? It's in the books. We can still discuss it.


Dude this is where we disagree. I can acknowledge that you and some other people see what she is doing in Africa as better, but I don't.
And just because Bishops tells her to stay does not me that is the what she should be doing.
Maybe this should be who is a better leader Cyclops or Bishop since that just sounds like Storm can make a decision on her own and has to look for someone to justify what she is doing.
Maybe Bishop tells her this so there will not be a conflict when she can't take orders from Cyclops. Maybe he does not what his friends and family divided over her not wanting to follow. He loves her and doesn't want to have to deal with that.
Again the meaning behind what a character says is up to the reader to decided. But I don't think you can acknowledge that.
Ever time I give you my opinion you tell me I'm wrong and that it is not like that, but I accecpt that you see it differently, why can't you do that same?

I can accept that you think the maybe her team doesn't know that she wanted them sent to her. Why can't you accept that I think they know this is a crisis and at the mansion is the best place for them to be?

I like Storm, I think the can be a good leader, just not near the leader Cyclops is.

Why can't you just let me have my own opinions? ;)

[Jellobay]

either way, both are good and bad under different writers.


Exactly and right now Storm is awful. :)

[unkiedev]

Exactly and right now Storm is awful. :)
Yeah, but one day she could be good again. Slim was never good in the first place.

[unkiedev]

What more evidence do you need? Her friends are dying and she doesn't want to help, because she doesn't feel comfortable how Scott and Emma run the team.
Who are her friends that are dying? Who's dead? Who died? Who is in the process of dying?

Besides, even if an x-man WAS dying, would you care? Here is the list of X-men who have died and come back: Jean, Scott, Wolvie, Colossus, Psylock, Warren, Prof X just to name a few.

[Jellobay]

Who are her friends that are dying? Who's dead? Who died? Who is in the process of dying?

Besides, even if an x-man WAS dying, would you care? Here is the list of X-men who have died and come back: Jean, Scott, Wolvie, Colossus, Psylock, Warren, Prof X just to name a few.

I would care, but then again, I have feelings. ;)

I would think that since Storm is such an unselfish person and befriends children, that some of those poor kids on that poor bus would have considered her a friend. But maybe I am just kidding myself to think that she would have really cared for them.

I think Banshee considered Storm part of the X-man family, but maybe the love didn't go both ways. Sort of like how I love all of you Storm supporters, but I don't feel the love in return.

Maybe your right, maybe since those people have comeback from the dead, her heart has grown cold to the grief of others. But I have a hope that she is not that heartless, maybe I wrong. I hope not.

[Jellobay]

Yeah, but one day she could be good again. Slim was never good in the first place.

Now what ever did he do to you?

Heartless I tell ya. ;)

[Hi-Fi]

Jello, seriously now. You think Storm is in Africa taking a sun bath??? We see in the books what she's doing there.


And you don't like Storm at all, despite what you say, seeing that you use arguments like "Storm think she's superior etc etc etc..."

[Red Lotus]

though, storm leading her team to save an entire race of people, and storm leading her team to save the galaxy outweighs what cyke has done. either way, both are good and bad under different writers.


But its funny that every time there is a major X-men event the first person they turn to is Cyclops. Has there ever been a major X-event that Storm was the leader.

In House of M (A Major Marvel U event )when Cap wasn't around who did the heroes follow. Was it Storm. Wait they didn't even think enough of her to put her on their team.

[xakko]

But its funny that every time there is a major X-men event the first person they turn to is Cyclops. Has there ever been a major X-event that Storm was the leader.

Mutant Massacre.

Fall of the Mutants.

Inferno, to a certain extent.

c'mon folks, lets be fair here. both characters have examples of solid, effective leadership.

[Jellobay]

Jello, seriously now. You think Storm is in Africa taking a sun bath??? We see in the books what she's doing there.


And you don't like Storm at all, despite what you say, seeing that you use arguments like "Storm think she's superior etc etc etc..."

I like her, I like superior people. That is why I like Cyclops. :)

I like you Hi, and isn't when it is all said and done, what really counts. :)

[Hi-Fi]

I like her, I like superior people. That is why I like Cyclops. :)

I like you Hi, and isn't when it is all said and done, what really counts. :)

Stop talking non-sense!!!:p :D

[Jellobay]

In House of M (A Major Marvel U event )when Cap wasn't around who did the heroes follow. Was it Storm. Wait they didn't even think enough of her to put her on their team.

Testify!! :D

[Jellobay]

Stop talking non-sense!!!:p :D

Me, thinking you are a cool person is not non-sense. Stop putting yourself down like that. I won't tolerate it.

I love you man. :D