Thunderbird and Wolverine

[Ogrebear]

I found this in the entry for Thunderbird (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunderbird_%28comics%29) over on Wikipedia:


It is interesting to note that, metatextually, Marvel editors decreed Proudstar should die because he and Wolverine were too similar, personality wise; if things were just a little different, Wolverine may have been chosen to die in his place.

I was wondering if anyone could shed some light on why it was Thunderbird chosen over Wolverine?

Also does anyone else consider it was a bad move considering the slavish fan boys and idiotic stuff often published by Marvel concering Wolverine aka 'cash cow' Logan?

Any specualtion what things might be like if Thunderbird had survived instead of the looney?

[Beast]

Actually, I think that's somewhat incorrect. Claremont has said on numerous occassions, and Len Wein has confirmed that Thunderbird was created to die early in the series. The Wolverine aspect is due to the fact that for years after Thunderbird died, the letters columns in Uncanny were filled with people who didn't like Wolverine and wanted him to leave the team or die, and would have preferred he died instead of Thunderbird. :)

[Wagner Time]

Wolverine wasn't always popular.

A number of fans of the original series didn't think a character like him had any place in the X-Men. He was too close to a bad guy.

Hard to imagine it now.

These days he's just hated for overexposure... :D

[Titan76]

Actually, I think that's somewhat incorrect. Claremont has said on numerous occassions, and Len Wein has confirmed that Thunderbird was created to die early in the series.
Really? I heard differently. Now I know how people feel about John Byrne but I am going to say this anyways, on his website in his FAQ he said that Claremont was forced to kill Thunderbird off. I have the link if you want to read it, he says this as he tells how he created Kitty.

[Beast]

Really? I heard differently. Now I know how people feel about John Byrne but I am going to say this anyways, on his website in his FAQ he said that Claremont was forced to kill Thunderbird off. I have the link if you want to read it, he says this as he tells how he created Kitty.
Well, no offense to John Byrne... but the man's been a bit of a lunatic for years. Both Len Wein and Claremont have both said that Thunderbird was created to die. I would take their word over John Byrne's anyday. He's not exactly the most reliable person when it comes to remembering stuff as of late. And it's clear from how he regularly trashes Marvel, that he has an agenda against the company. :)

[The Lucky One]

Any specualtion what things might be like if Thunderbird had survived instead of the looney?

Good question. As many people know, Claremont initially hated Wolverine and went out of his way to make him look like an ass as much as possible... it's why he took a beatdown in nearly every issue for the first few years. And then, as we all know, the character grew on him and Claremont created the Wolverine that everyone is familiar with and (some more than others) enjoys today. But would he have had the same reactions to Thunderbird, or gone out of his way to change him into a deep, fully realized character? For that matter, would readers have taken to him as much, leading to his inevitable solo series and massive overexposure? Doubtful, but we'll never know for sure.

-D

[Titan76]

Well, no offense to John Byrne... but the man's been a bit of a lunatic for years. Both Len Wein and Claremont have both said that Thunderbird was created to die. I would take their word over John Byrne's anyday. He's not exactly the most reliable person when it comes to remembering stuff as of late. And it's clear from how he regularly trashes Marvel, that he has an agenda against the company. :)
Well, can't agure with you about Byrne being nutty at times. But this was posted on his website during the time he was working for Marvel. Its no longer there because he updated it with a new FAQ but I have it on bookmark which is why I can still link it. He wasn't trashing Marvel or anything just making a side comment about this.

Do you have any links of Claremont or Le Wein saying otherwise, because I would like to see them. If you don't then no problem.

[Beast]

I don't have links off hand because Comixfan regularly purges old posts to save database space, but Len Wein stated as such recently in the chat that was held here. :)