Official Handbook of the M. U. Gripes and Comments

[Jason Everett]

For the record, I hope that this will be a thread where we can talk about the Official Handbooks to the Marvel Universe. Any comments that you may have regarding inclusions, ommissions, mistakes and things you may like or not like, this is the place to air them out.

If this is already a thread somewhere else, let me know. I can't seem to find it and I want to vent...

The latest issue of the OHTTMU has recently spurred me to start this thread. There were two glaring ommissions. Clandestine and Blackwulf.

I noticed that there have already been other Marvel UK ommissions. So, hoping that eventually there will be a OHTTMUUK, hopefully we will see Clandestine pop up in that along with all of the other Marvel UK characters and teams. It has already been said and to some degree proven that the UK characters and stories took place on Earth 616, so I don't know why they couldn't just be included in the regular handbooks. Regardless, as long as they are eventually covered. I'll be happy.

But, as far as Blackwulf is concerned, where is he?

He and the related characters first appeared in Thunderstrike, and the Avengers showed up somewhere around issue 5, AND the title ran for 10 issues... Why were these characters left out of the Handbook? I thought that this was the SPECIFIC reason for the latest incarnation of the Handbook was to handle the characters that wouldn't fit into the specific title related handbooks.

AND Blackwulf was great...

I have already written to Marvel, but so far I haven't gotten a response.

Anyway, comments on this or any other OHTTMU comments and questions?

[Expletive Deleted]

From the OHOTMU FAQ (http://www.marvunapp.com/ohotmu/ohotmufaq.htm#favorite):Q: Why haven't you covered (fill-in-the-blank), who is my favorite character / a really important character?

A: Marvel estimates it has nearly 5,000 "properties" (e.g. characters); over at the unofficial Marvel Appendix site, which many of the Handbook writers are involved with, we've already covered got more entries than that, and we haven't even listed any of the "big names". So far, we've produced some 380 entries over 13 Handbooks, and it doesn't take a Math genius to realize that's only just scratched the surface of what's there. The current format is for themed books, and in some cases, a given character hasn't been covered yet simply because an appropriate theme hasn't come round yet (Speedball, to take a random example, wouldn't fit any of the themes so far); in most other cases, it's because we simply haven't had enough Handbooks to get round to them yet. Groups such as the X-Men or Avengers (for example) have lengthy membership lists and hordes of enemies, and a single Handbook can't contain them all. Even if we were to only give every character within a single page entry, which we don't want to do because it would short-shift many characters, we still couldn't fit them all in a single volume. The Handbooks is a series, not a string of individual and unconnected books, and if you view it this way, the omission of a character from a given volume isn't quite so devastating. Sometimes, when deciding who makes the cut for a given book, we will have two equally worthy candidates vying for a place, and our decision can get swayed by which one is more likely to fit the remit of a subsequent book; if one of the characters could fit into a later book and another couldn't, then the character with more options will get held back. A good example of this was the Rhino; considered for the Spider-Man Handbook 2004, he was dropped to make more space for other Spidey villains, and included in the Hulk Handbook instead.

We've covered just over 420 entries in 15 Handbooks; the most comprehensive of the older Handbooks, the Deluxe Edition, covered just under 900, but it had a 20 volume run plus 8 update volumes to reach this total. Give us some time.

[milly3cat]

Thunderstrike ??? Blackwulf ? :confused: . I a fraid I never heard of them . What year is that comic ?

Does anybody know if Negasonic Teenage warhead will be listed, maybe issue 9.

[Expletive Deleted]

Thunderstrike ??? Blackwulf ? :confused: . I a fraid I never heard of them . What year is that comic ?1994, give or take.

[Jason Everett]

My only argument against all of that is the simple fact that in the latest issue alone, Marvel has included Benny Beckley, Bloodwraith and the Bogatyri. ANd that in just the first 15 pages of the issue.
After looking through the list of properties, Marvel chose those three over Clandestine, a property created by ALAN DAVIS, one of the current grandmasters of comicdom who has more than established himself; and Blackwulf, a series co-created by Angel Medina, a creator who just came off a LONG run on Spawn and is currently working on Sensational Spider-man, another HOT book.
Where is the logic?

[Jason Everett]

Thunderstrike ??? Blackwulf ? :confused: . I a fraid I never heard of them .

Thunderstrike, I wouldn't reccommend. But, Blackwulf. I behoove (Spelling?) everyone to seek it out and give it a read. I feel that is probably the only new property in the 90s that had a solid foot to stand on, and was also one of the most creative cosmic titles to appear since the New Gods. I'd even put it as more colorful than the Eternals or the Inhumans.

Clandestine, I felt, was England's version of the X-Men. With Alan Davis at the helm for the first 9 issues, it was stellar materiel.

I understand that they were both cancelled during the crash of the mid-90s, so that can explain a lot. But, with Marvel re-hashing the New Universe now, (which, by the way, I don't mind), I wonder how these books would fare in the current comic climate. Food for thought.

[Nevets F]

I expect we may see Blackwulf and Clan Destine (I loved both books) in the Marvel Legacy 90's edition.

[Sean McQuaid]

The latest issue of the OHTTMU has recently spurred me to start this thread. There were two glaring ommissions. Clandestine and Blackwulf.

Someone has already helpfully pasted in some material from our FAQ about profile selection, but I'll throw in a couple of brief comments regardless:

1) Every character is somebody's favourite; and space being limited, practically nobody gets to see all of their favourites included in a given issue or project, not even the handbook writers themselves. There are characters I'd have loved to see included in the A-Z run who got left out, but that's an unavoidable aspect of this sort of series.

2) The omitted characters you mention are well-known and well-liked by at least a couple of handbook writers; one of whom, for instance, has already done some online Blackwulf profiling...

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/blackwulfi.htm

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/blackwulfii.htm

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/blackwulfiii.htm

3) Sometimes when a character's left out of one handbook project, it's because there are plans for that character in another handbook project. I can't confirm or deny whether that's the case in these examples, but I will say that the two subjects you're interested in weren't overlooked or forgotten, and those subjects did come up during our planning discussions for 2006.

I noticed that there have already been other Marvel UK ommissions. So, hoping that eventually there will be a OHTTMUUK, hopefully we will see Clandestine pop up in that along with all of the other Marvel UK characters and teams. It has already been said and to some degree proven that the UK characters and stories took place on Earth 616, so I don't know why they couldn't just be included in the regular handbooks. Regardless, as long as they are eventually covered. I'll be happy.

We've already featured some UK characters and stories in various handbooks (including some A-Z material), and we'll continue to do so in future; not sure if there will ever be a volume devoted exclusively to UK stuff, though...

-Sean

[Darkoth]

I've held off for the longest time getting into the OHOTMU,as I have the first two editions from the 80's.Then they put out that horror edition and I wuz HOOKED!I'm enjoying seeing the likes of Boris Valejo,Julie Bell,and Joe Jusko among the remastered four color artwork.

[cable guy]

Why isn't Captain America in the second one?!

[Leebenhouse]

Was ClanDestine in the Teams one?

[Loki]

Why isn't Captain America in the second one?!
Because Captain America was already covered earlier in the series, in Avengers 2004.

[Sean McQuaid]

Why isn't Captain America in the second one?!

Cap got profiled in the first of the recent Avengers handbooks, and in the Golden Age handbook as well, plus a 1960s-centric Cap profile in the first Marvel Legacy: 1960s book, so we didn't include him in this A-Z run. I imagine he'll be updated again sooner or later in upcoming editions...

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

Was ClanDestine in the Teams one?

Nope--though as noted earlier, their absence from one or more existing volumes doesn't mean they won't necessarily be featured in an upcoming edition...

-Sean

[I-M-F]

Will they cover Motormouth, from the UK.

A nice charcater that hasn't been seen since Peter David had her show up on his run on Hulk with Gary Frank.

I'm not collecting the book as Who' WHo book's become out of date as soon as they are printed, because the character that is being featurred has done something else, so the history is out of date.

[Faded]

I know its been covered before, but I wish we got new artwork for the handbooks. Sorry to beat the dead horse, but it especially is bad when you have the other recent handbooks and get the same headshot twice or three times in a row.

Also, the shift from themes to A-Z was kinda irritating because we'll obviously not get characters in the A-Z format that we got in the themes. On the other hand, it'd be a waste of an entry to have a repeat profile so soon. So its kinda lose-lose.

Personally, I think a new edition of the Encyclopedias for each "franchise" or species even (Mutants, Superhumans, Aliens, Etc...) would be much better.

Negatives aside, I think the writers are doing a good job and deserve a pat on the back for their work.

[Jason Everett]

I will agree that so far the history has been well written and thorough. But, I also agree that the artwork needs to be updated. That's what made the initial run in the eighties so great.
Also, If you want to look up Ms. Marvel, do you look in the Avengers handbook? or the regular handbook? or the women of Marvel handbook?
I know that they give us a listing of where to find some of the characters in the front of the newer handbooks, but what about the characters that don't get released in a handbook until a year from now? As we've already discussed, Where will I look for Dark Angel or Clandestine or the Warheads? It doesn't say in the current handbook "look in the Marvel UK Legacy edition 2008". What if I didn't start collecting comics until way later and so on and so forth.
If they'd put them in a proper order, than people would be more apt to look at more character profiles rather than just the Avengers or the Fantastic Four or the X-Men. Reading new profiles, people may be more apt to seek out these back issues of books that they've never heard of before, therefore helping the poor retailers of the world milk more revenue and deplete some stock on some ice cold issues gathering dust.
I'm sort of straying from the point, but back issues ARE a good thing. There is so much good material out there, if only...
Bitch and Moan, that's what I'm here for. You'd never guess that I really do love Marvel and a lot of the books that they release. If I didn't have anything to gripe about, I don't know what I'd do. (I do know what I'd do, so please, no snide replies. I get it.) :D

[Babylon23]

Also, If you want to look up Ms. Marvel, do you look in the Avengers handbook? or the regular handbook? or the women of Marvel handbook?
I know that they give us a listing of where to find some of the characters in the front of the newer handbooks, but what about the characters that don't get released in a handbook until a year from now? As we've already discussed, Where will I look for Dark Angel or Clandestine or the Warheads? It doesn't say in the current handbook "look in the Marvel UK Legacy edition 2008". What if I didn't start collecting comics until way later and so on and so forth.

This has essentially been my prodlem with the Handbook. I was hoping for a comprehensive A-Z listing, along the lines of the original handbooks. I was a little annoyed when I picked up A-Z issue 1 and found that I needed to buy about 10 other handbooks to get the full picture.

I'd love to see Marvel release a full A-z Handbook in trade form at some point.

[LordEd1976]

With regards to the Legacy Handbooks;

We know that the 1970s handbook is on the way in May with profiles on Steve Rogers as Nomad, the Defenders, Hellcow, and the X-men team that debuted in Giant-Size X-Men #1.

My question is who do you cover in a 1980s handbook? By the early 80s the original OHFTMU came out and by the close of 1989 we had 3 different versions which covered characters like the Beyonder, US Agent, Venom, Aocalypse, Mr. Sinister, Alpha Flight, Ms. Marvel (Sharon Ventura), Volcana, the New Mutants, and any other i could think would have to be included. Sp who do you have in a 1980s Legacy Handbook?

[X-Factor]

The simultaneous releases of the All New handbooks plus the themes and time period handbooks seems to me as an attempt to grab completists.

Becuase of this, some lines and books feel redundant. Why not incorporate them all to the main Official Handbook line? Even then, there are obvious (and not so obvious) exclusions from the Handbooks like Longshot that have made me decide to discontinue buying any handbooks for the time being as of issue 3.

As a consumer who enjoys reading profiles for reference, I would be much more inclined to purchase enyclopedias based on the specific lines at Marvel as they had earlier this decade. Should that come about I hope it shall be much more comprehensive, including obscure characters. If every shown Shi'ar would be profiled albiet briefly, I would hope Strong Guy or the X.S.E. characters would as well.

Additionally, while probably not the writers of the handbooks fault, I'm disappointed with Marvel's attempt to finish up stories in the handbooks, as was the case with the Acolytes' true identities, Xorn (which was changed later anyway), and who would or would not be depowered.

[Sean McQuaid]

Will they cover Motormouth, from the UK.

As advance solicitations have since revealed, Motormouth will be fully profiled in this month's A-Z issue.

-Sean

[Soundrave]

Additionally, while probably not the writers of the handbooks fault, I'm disappointed with Marvel's attempt to finish up stories in the handbooks, as was the case with the Acolytes' true identities, Xorn (which was changed later anyway), and who would or would not be depowered.

The Marvel Handbooks have been doing that since the 1980s.

[Sean McQuaid]

I will agree that so far the history has been well written and thorough.

Thanks for that.

But, I also agree that the artwork needs to be updated. That's what made the initial run in the eighties so great.

I've never fully agreed with this, myself -- while it would be nice to have lots of original artwork or even all-original artwork, it's not really necessary for a reference book most of the time; as long as the art depicts a given subject in a clear and appealing manner, it doesn't really matter from a reference standpoint if it's a new image or not.

And as noted on occasion before...

a) all-new artwork isn't quite so practically viable in terms of costs/production as it used to be in yesteryear's market; and

b) the old 1980s Deluxe edition (probably the best-loved version of the Handbook) used plenty of reprinted art for its main profile images, and nobody seemed overly concerned about it back in the day.

All that being said, we do use new art on occasion. The most recent entries for White Tiger (in the Marvel Knights handbook) and Goliath (in the current A-Z run) both sported new art since proper reference images of those characters in those forms didn't exist in print yet.

Also, If you want to look up Ms. Marvel, do you look in the Avengers handbook? or the regular handbook? or the women of Marvel handbook?

She's currently covered under "Warbird" in the AVENGERS 2004 handbook, but I imagine we'll get around to an update for her eventually.

Plus, the second-generation Ms. Marvel (Sharon Ventura alias She-Thing) appears in the current A-Z run...

I know that they give us a listing of where to find some of the characters in the front of the newer handbooks, but what about the characters that don't get released in a handbook until a year from now? As we've already discussed, Where will I look for Dark Angel or Clandestine or the Warheads?

Dark Angel actually got profiled last year, in the WOMEN OF MARVEL 2005 handbook. As for the other two subjects, at least one of them is already slated for coverage in the relatively near future...

If they'd put them in a proper order, than people would be more apt to look at more character profiles rather than just the Avengers or the Fantastic Four or the X-Men. Reading new profiles, people may be more apt to seek out these back issues of books that they've never heard of before, therefore helping the poor retailers of the world milk more revenue and deplete some stock on some ice cold issues gathering dust.

We love getting readers acquainted with the less-famous characters, and we try to do at least a little of that in most handbooks, even some of the big-name theme books (the last Avengers Handbook, for instance, may have had stars like Sentry and Spider-Woman, but it also had less prominent characters like Living Lightning). And there's generally LOTS of off-the-beaten-path characters in our A-Z books and Legacy (decade) collections...

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

I was hoping for a comprehensive A-Z listing, along the lines of the original handbooks. I was a little annoyed when I picked up A-Z issue 1 and found that I needed to buy about 10 other handbooks to get the full picture.

Keep in mind that over the life of the current Handbook line, we're covering more characters and more eras than early Handbooks, so that's inevitably going to be spread out over a greater number of books; and it was nearly impossible to roll the whole thing out as a single A-Z series from the start, for two reasons:

1) We're living in a much smaller, much tighter market than the old days. Virtually no Marvel project, let alone alone a modest-selling specialty/niche project like the Handbooks, gets approved for guaranteed runs of more than a year anymore, let alone the three-plus years (bare minimum) that a fully-loaded all-inclusive A-Z run would have required.

2) When Marvel first returned to Handbooks they weren't remotely sure of how well or poorly they would sell (keep in mind they'd been off the market for about a decade), so they experimented with volumes built around popular themes to test the market. Once a year-plus of 2004-2005 theme books had run their course, we didn't want to rip off regular Handbook buyers with a 2006 A-Z series that spent most of its pages virtually reprinting the 2004-2005 material, so the A-Z run has been devoted primarily to subjects that either weren't covered in the 2004-2005 books or have never been covered before at all.
There are exceptions, where we revisit a 2004-2005 subject that desperately needs updating -- Quicksilver, for instance, will be getting some A-Z coverage in 2006 -- but second looks at the 2004-2005 subjects will mostly have to wait until after 2006.

I'd love to see Marvel release a full A-z Handbook in trade form at some point.

Always possible, and this has been discussed in-house quite a bit. You may eventually see a longer, more inclusive A-Z run (now that the new Handbooks have a reasonably solid sales track record), or updates of the 2004-2005 theme books, or trade paperbacks compiling multiple recent handbook projects, or all of the above. Too early to say whether or when we'll see any of that yet, but these sorts of things are definitely under consideration.

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

My question is who do you cover in a 1980s handbook? By the early 80s the original OHFTMU came out and by the close of 1989 we had 3 different versions which covered characters like the Beyonder, US Agent, Venom, Aocalypse, Mr. Sinister, Alpha Flight, Ms. Marvel (Sharon Ventura), Volcana, the New Mutants, and any other i could think would have to be included. Sp who do you have in a 1980s Legacy Handbook?

A pretty wild mix of stuff, actually. Some of it's going to revisit subjects already profiled during the 80s (but presenting the subjects from a different perspective or in more detailed ways), and a lot of it's going to be characters and things that never got covered in the 80s books for one reason or another. As the 60s and 70s Legacy books have shown, we're willing and able to cover a lot of subjects that got left out of the early Handbooks...

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

some lines and books feel redundant. Why not incorporate them all to the main Official Handbook line?

See one of my other posts in this thread for some explanations regarding why Marvel didn't/couldn't do one big all-inclusive A-Z run from the beginning.

Even then, there are obvious (and not so obvious) exclusions from the Handbooks like Longshot that have made me decide to discontinue buying any handbooks for the time being as of issue 3.

Sorry to see you go, especially since there are definite Handbook plans for Longshot in the near future...

As a consumer who enjoys reading profiles for reference, I would be much more inclined to purchase enyclopedias based on the specific lines at Marvel as they had earlier this decade.

Marvel's self-published 'pedia line has been dormant for some time now; but as others have noted, DK will be releasing a generalized Marvel 'pedia soon.

I'm disappointed with Marvel's attempt to finish up stories in the handbooks, as was the case with the Acolytes' true identities, Xorn (which was changed later anyway), and who would or would not be depowered.

As another poster observed, revealing new info and/or filling in story blanks in conjunction with editorial is an old Handbook practice, dating back to the original editions and continuing through pretty much every version of the Handbook. Sometimes it works well, sometimes less so, but it's pretty standard practice and usually benign.

-Sean

[Beast]

Id be happy with a complete A-Z series with new pictures and power charts with the levels for easy comparison.
Which will never happen, due to the niche market of the product.

[bd2999]

I think for the UK line they also had Death's Head in there too, both one and two. What I have not liked about some of the entries, especially cosmic entries, is that they are adding stuff that has no basis in comics.

[Sean McQuaid]

Id be happy with a complete A-Z series with new pictures and power charts with the levels for easy comparison.

Which will never happen, due to the niche market of the product.

Well, never say NEVER...one doesn't know what the future might bring. But for now, yes, what stormkid is describing sounds pretty unlikely.

A "complete" A-Z series would probably require at *least* a three to four year run to do it remotely well -- and getting a project that long approved is a major hurdle in itself. Adding the extra expense/complication of all-new art would make it even harder to get a book like this off the ground.

Still, that doesn't mean we won't/can't see a large-scale A-Z run of some sort again someday, or a TPB compilation that achieves much the same thing.

As for power charts, they run in all our A-Z issues and most of our theme handbooks (though we don't use them in Legacy handbooks or non-handbook publications), so folks who like comparisons have plenty of opportunity to sample same...

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

I think for the UK line they also had Death's Head in there too, both one and two.

Two generations of Death's Head have been featured in the recent Handbooks, yes.

What I have not liked about some of the entries, especially cosmic entries, is that they are adding stuff that has no basis in comics.

Such as...?

-Sean

[Nevets F]

So when is the 80's legacy book going to be solicited? I can't wait for it!

I love each and every handbook that has been put out so far. :)

[Sean McQuaid]

So when is the 80's legacy book going to be solicited?

Should be soon, I'd imagine -- initial deadlines for the text are wrapping up this week.

I love each and every handbook that has been put out so far. :)

Thanks, glad you're enjoying the books.

-Sean

[jade_nova]

In the third issue they leave an entry out. On the cover and on the back they list a character called Crazy Eight as the last one in the book. However, the character is not included in the book or the next one.

[Soundrave]

In the third issue they leave an entry out. On the cover and on the back they list a character called Crazy Eight as the last one in the book. However, the character is not included in the book or the next one.

Check the half-pagers.

The only characters I recall them leaving out were Rhino who was on the cover to OHOTMU Spider-Man 2004 (but was later profiled in Hulk 2004) and Death's Head 3.0 who was on the cover to OHOTMU A-Z #3 (but who I suspect will be getting a nice profile in the Planet Hulk Handbook).

Speaking of the Planet Hulk handbook, is there anything you can tell us about that? Will Marvel be releasing any preview pages? The subject matter in general and the interview they had about it in Giant-Size Planet Hulk has me very intrigued as to its contents.

[Sean McQuaid]

In the third issue they leave an entry out. On the cover and on the back they list a character called Crazy Eight as the last one in the book. However, the character is not included in the book or the next one.

You're actually thinking of the second issue, which does indeed feature a solo character called Crazy Eight -- she's only a half-pager, so she was slotted onto the same page as the previous half-pager in that issue, Centennial. This sort of arrangement seems to confuse some folks, though, so we've since begun grouping all the half-pagers together at the back of a given issue.

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

The only characters I recall them leaving out were Rhino who was on the cover to OHOTMU Spider-Man 2004 (but was later profiled in Hulk 2004) and Death's Head 3.0 who was on the cover to OHOTMU A-Z #3 (but who I suspect will be getting a nice profile in the Planet Hulk Handbook).

The Rhino thing was before my time, but if memory serves, they got tight for space in the Spidey book and decided to move Rhino to the upcoming Hulk book, Rhino being one of the only then-profiled Spidey characters who would fit well in another Handbook (since he's very much a Hulk foe as well as a Spidey foe).

As for Death's Head 3, that was a plain old error -- when we saw the rough pencils for the cover, we thought DH3 was somebody else, and didn't realize all three DHs had been drawn into the cover composition even though DH 1 & 2 were the only ones profiled. By the time we saw a more finished version and realized DH3 was on the cover with his predecessors, it was too late to change it.

Speaking of the Planet Hulk handbook, is there anything you can tell us about that?

Not really. I'm not involved in the PH book, which is being handled primarily by Anthony Flamini.

-Sean

[TommyV]

This has essentially been my prodlem with the Handbook. I was hoping for a comprehensive A-Z listing, along the lines of the original handbooks. I was a little annoyed when I picked up A-Z issue 1 and found that I needed to buy about 10 other handbooks to get the full picture.

I'd love to see Marvel release a full A-z Handbook in trade form at some point.

I absolutely agree - it makes me nuts that I have to seek out and find entries on the A-List (and often B-List!)characters in other random editions. It should really be a true A-Z format, IMHO. The write-ups ARE fantastic, though!

[LordEd1976]

This has essentially been my prodlem with the Handbook. I was hoping for a comprehensive A-Z listing, along the lines of the original handbooks. I was a little annoyed when I picked up A-Z issue 1 and found that I needed to buy about 10 other handbooks to get the full picture.

I'd love to see Marvel release a full A-z Handbook in trade form at some point.

I actually have an idea. Why not do a series of Tradepaperbacks that consist of all the entries that have appeared in all the Handbooks since 2004?

I know that we're talking something along the lines of over 1,000 entries. But then thats why I suggested a series of trades. Just create an alphabetical master list of every character that has been profiled in a handbook since the project began in 2004. Then for people who have been covered more than once (Spider-Man, Captain America, Zzzax, Quicksilver, etc.) pick whichever entry is most up to date and use that. even stick in entries from such projects as the Legacy books, the Outlaw Files, the Avengers Most Wanted, Nick Fury's Secret Files, etc. While some of these may deviate from the standard format, they may add some flavor text to the proceeding and give the books some illusion that the reader may be reading a book that exists in the MU. To further cut down the page count, the Ulitmate Handbooks could be made into their own smaller trade since they take place in a seperate universe.

what does everyone think?

[riotgear]

Such as...?

-Sean

I'm thinking he might be referring to the universe-numbering, which they are actually getting from MarvUnApp.com, not the comics.

For example, Earth-1191 is Bishop and Shard's original reality, but it has never been numbered in the comics. However, it was stated in a recent A-Z. They do credit the site in the Acknowledgements, though.

[Soundrave]

I'm thinking he might be referring to the universe-numbering, which they are actually getting from MarvUnApp.com, not the comics.

For example, Earth-1191 is Bishop and Shard's original reality, but it has never been numbered in the comics. However, it was stated in a recent A-Z. They do credit the site in the Acknowledgements, though.


Dude, I think they own the site.

[Expletive Deleted]

I'm thinking he might be referring to the universe-numbering.Or possibly the Multi/Mega/Omniverse thing. Multiverse and Omniverse have a basis in the comics (thanks, Grue!), but I think "Megaverse" is strictly a Handbook thing.

[Soundrave]

Not really. I'm not involved in the PH book, which is being handled primarily by Anthony Flamini.

-Sean

Thanks anyway. I did some pro searching on My Space today and found this:
http://www.myspace.com/amflamini, so maybe I'll hit him up for some answers there.

There's actually a lot of Marvel creators on there:
http://www.myspace.com/briankvaughan
http://www.myspace.com/msumerak
http://www.myspace.com/purepop
http://www.myspace.com/warrenellis
http://www.myspace.com/satberia
http://www.myspace.com/geoffjohns

[Soundrave]

Or possibly the Multi/Mega/Omniverse thing. Multiverse and Omniverse have a basis in the comics (thanks, Grue!), but I think "Megaverse" is strictly a Handbook thing.


Well wasn't alot of that type of terminology originally a Handbook thing? I remember them having a glossary of terms in the back of every issue in the 1980s. Not all of those terms had specific definitions given in the comics. The handbooks always went further to explain phenomena like that.

[Darkoth]

Y'know what I'd really like to see,an appendix with specific strength levels rather than a general grid.I want to see it in black and white that the Hulk is indeed the strongest,that Herc is slightly stronger than Thor,and just who is stronger,the Thing or Collossus?

[DDM]

Y'know what I'd really like to see,an appendix with specific strength levels rather than a general grid.I want to see it in black and white that the Hulk is indeed the strongest,that Herc is slightly stronger than Thor,and just who is stronger,the Thing or Collossus?

Marvel has such an appendix in The Essential Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Deluxe Edition: Book of the Dead, Volume 3 which reprints The Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Deluxe Edition #15-20.

[Sean McQuaid]

It makes me nuts that I have to seek out and find entries on the A-List (and often B-List!)characters in other random editions. It should really be a true A-Z format, IMHO.

As explained in other posts, far easier said than done -- and it was more or less out of the question back when Marvel first started rebuilding the Handbook line in 2004-2005.

Which doesn't mean we won't *ever* see a larger-scale A-Z project than the 2006 version, just that it'll be a while before we see one even if it does come to fruition -- gotta give the 2004-2006 material at least a little time to age before updating it becomes worthwhile, after all.

The write-ups ARE fantastic, though!

Glad you're liking them, and we'll do our best to sustain (or maybe even improve upon) the quality...

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

I actually have an idea. Why not do a series of Tradepaperbacks that consist of all the entries that have appeared in all the Handbooks since 2004?

That's a popular idea, and something that's been discussed and considered for some time within Marvel, though when and if we'll see this sort of thing remains uncertain.

One thing I will say is that before we do any such set of TPBs, it might be wise to do a few small-scale updates of select 2004-2005 material first -- partly because the older material is more out of date than the more recent 2005-2006 material, but also because our earlier handbooks from 2004 and early 2005 were more of a work in progress. Entries tended to be shorter, textual style a bit less tight, layout a bit less conducive to maximum content, and so on.

In short, might be worth expanding/updating some of the early 2004-2005 material at some point before we start compiling 2004-2006 material into compilations (if and when that happens) -- otherwise, it'll feel a bit off-kilter when folks notice that, say, MACH IV has a bigger entry than Iron Man.

I know that we're talking something along the lines of over 1,000 entries. But then thats why I suggested a series of trades. Just create an alphabetical master list of every character that has been profiled in a handbook since the project began in 2004. Then for people who have been covered more than once (Spider-Man, Captain America, Zzzax, Quicksilver, etc.) pick whichever entry is most up to date and use that.

Again, this sort of thing has definitely been discussed, though if/when it'll happen is still up in the air. In the meantime, good sales for the standard Handbooks would certainly help bolster the case for these sorts of compilations...

even stick in entries from such projects as the Legacy books, the Outlaw Files, the Avengers Most Wanted, Nick Fury's Secret Files, etc. While some of these may deviate from the standard format, they may add some flavor text to the proceeding and give the books some illusion that the reader may be reading a book that exists in the MU.

While I'm always one to stuff in as many extras as possible, I'm not sure how well some of those different-format books would blend with standard Handbook material unless they were rewritten/reformatted to be more in line with Handbook norms. Also, some of these projects (such as the Most Wanted Files and the Marvel Monsters files) have already been compiled as part of other TPBs and hardcovers (the Most Wanted Files as part of a NEW AVENGERS compilation volume, for instance).

To further cut down the page count, the Ulitmate Handbooks could be made into their own smaller trade since they take place in a seperate universe.

They've already been reprinted as part of the Ultimate X-Men/FF trade, though I do think the Ultie handbooks would make a good standalone reprint volume.

-Sean

[Sean McQuaid]

I'm thinking he might be referring to the universe-numbering, which they are actually getting from MarvUnApp.com, not the comics. For example, Earth-1191 is Bishop and Shard's original reality, but it has never been numbered in the comics. However, it was stated in a recent A-Z. They do credit the site in the Acknowledgements, though.

The Marvunapp.com site is owned and run by the Handbooks' current overall head writer, Jeff Christiansen. Any new info (such as an Earth number) introed by the Handbooks gets okayed or rejected by Marvel editorial on a case by base basis, regardless of whether the same info might appear somewhere on Jeff's site. And it's sometimes the Handbooks that feed the Appendix site rather than vice versa...Appendix entries often feature info that was compiled during the research done for a Handbook profile, for instance.

-Sean

[Soundrave]

Any completists out their that have every single handbook from marvel, even the transformers one? I have an old Marvel RPG character guidebook that is similar to the OHOTMU would that count?

I think they had Conan ones too, but I never bought any.

[LordEd1976]

. Also, some of these projects (such as the Most Wanted Files and the Marvel Monsters files) have already been compiled as part of other TPBs and hardcovers (the Most Wanted Files as part of a NEW AVENGERS compilation volume, for instance).



They've already been reprinted as part of the Ultimate X-Men/FF trade, though I do think the Ultie handbooks would make a good standalone reprint volume.

-Sean

Thats one thing we can agree on. While its kinda cool that certain handbooks get reprinted in TPBs like the Most Wanted Files being in the back of the Sentry Hardcover and the Ultimate handbooks being put in the back of the XMen/FF Ultimate teamup trade, I would like to see some sort of standalone trade for the Handbooks because its seems kind of unfair that someone who would really want to own a copy of let's say Most wanted, is then forced to either dig around a comic shop or the Net and be at the mercy of whateverprice the dealer is willing to pay OR have to pick up a trade dealing with a story they have no interest in.

You know, one other idea maybe to do smaller trades that put together Handbooks of a similar nature. One could do an X-Men Handbook trade that features both the 2004 & 2005 handbooks and the Age of Apocalypse trade. There can also be a trade the Avengers featuring the 2004 & 2005 handbooks and the Most Wanted. The Legacy handbooks could be placed in one trade. The current A-Z could be done in a trade or two. Of course there's then the question of what to do with Handbooks like Women in Marvel, Monsters, Book of the Dead, Golden Age, Outlaw Files, and the Nick Fury Secret Files.

[Sean McQuaid]

While its kinda cool that certain handbooks get reprinted in TPBs like the Most Wanted Files being in the back of the Sentry Hardcover and the Ultimate handbooks being put in the back of the XMen/FF Ultimate teamup trade, I would like to see some sort of standalone trade for the Handbooks because its seems kind of unfair that someone who would really want to own a copy of let's say Most wanted, is then forced to either dig around a comic shop or the Net and be at the mercy of whateverprice the dealer is willing to pay OR have to pick up a trade dealing with a story they have no interest in.

Folding handbook reprints into other books has some advantages -- for instance, the NEW AVENGERS compilation probably exposed the MOST WANTED FILES to a larger audience. But yes, it would be nice to have standalone reprints of Handbooks and handbook-like publications.

That being said, it's not always hard to track down stray issues of the recent Handbooks and Handbook-related titles. Taking your MOST WANTED example, for instance, a more or less cover-price copy can be found at...

http://www.mycomicshop.com/megastore/search?pcat=Comics%2DAll&til=32800

That particular dealer tends to stock a lot of our stuff at mostly-reasonable prices.

You know, one other idea maybe to do smaller trades that put together Handbooks of a similar nature. One could do an X-Men Handbook trade that features both the 2004 & 2005 handbooks and the Age of Apocalypse trade. There can also be a trade the Avengers featuring the 2004 & 2005 handbooks and the Most Wanted. The Legacy handbooks could be placed in one trade. The current A-Z could be done in a trade or two. Of course there's then the question of what to do with Handbooks like Women in Marvel, Monsters, Book of the Dead, Golden Age, Outlaw Files, and the Nick Fury Secret Files.

I haven't heard of any plans along these lines yet, but I could definitely picture certain major topics -- such as Avengers, X-Men, Spidey or FF -- being able to support their own tpb-style Handbook compilations. We've covered plenty of characters from all those families of books over the past few years...

-Sean

[NightMage]

I actually liked this edition more than the others that came before and after. More extensive and biographical. I'm glad that Marvel re-released them in TPB form and wish they re-do that to the current editions.